# Toll free route to Italy??



## Mrplodd

Starting to plan next years trip and Mrs Plodd has expressed an interest in "doing" Italy We will have 6 weeks, all of September and 2 weeks in October.

I have a 7.4m 4000Kg MH and tow a Smart car on a trailer, so I try to avoid toll roads as far as possible :wink: 

Does anyone have a suggested route to Italy which will avoid the (as I understand it) hefty tolls for a rig such as mine through Switzerland and Austria? (will probably go Dover-Calais or tunnel) Or does it actually work out cheaper to pay the tolls rather than go 'The long way round"? And avoid Austria/Switzerland

I recall looking at the Mont Blanc tunnel toll a few years ago and nearly passing out!!

I am sure someone has already worked it out!!

Also what's on the must not miss list? (lake garda and Venice are already essentials) We like the cultural side of things so another essential simply has to be Pompeii and Hurculaneum.

ANY advice help or personal experience gratefully (and eagerly) sought. Either on this post or via pm. (Does Italy have Aires or similar? Is wild camping allowed? Etc)

Thanks in advance

Andy


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## Wupert

Mrplodd said:


> Starting to plan next years trip and Mrs Plodd has expressed an interest in "doing" Italy We will have 6 weeks, all of September and 2 weeks in October.
> 
> I have a 7.4m 4000Kg MH and tow a Smart car on a trailer, so I try to avoid toll roads as far as possible :wink:
> 
> Does anyone have a suggested route to Italy which will avoid the (as I understand it) hefty tolls for a rig such as mine through Switzerland and Austria? (will probably go Dover-Calais or tunnel) Or does it actually work out cheaper to pay the tolls rather than go 'The long way round"? And avoid Austria/Switzerland
> 
> I recall looking at the Mont Blanc tunnel toll a few years ago and nearly passing out!!
> 
> I am sure someone has already worked it out!!
> 
> Also what's on the must not miss list? (lake garda and Venice are already essentials) We like the cultural side of things so another essential simply has to be Pompeii and Hurculaneum.
> 
> ANY advice help or personal experience gratefully (and eagerly) sought. Either on this post or via pm. (Does Italy have Aires or similar? Is wild camping allowed? Etc)
> 
> Thanks in advance
> 
> Andy


Calais - Achen - 61 south Ulm - south over the Fern pass into Austria

Stay on the Austrian N roads and go over the Brenneron the old road then stay on Italy's non motorway roads.

Also Have a look on Michelin Routes and tell it to keep off toll roads


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## eddied

Ciao Mr Plodd, a good plod through the Italy section of Continental Touring forum will answer many of your questions, as exhaustive details have been supplied to many people in the recent past.
The route many including myself recommend is
Calais - Lille - Mons - Namur - Arlon - Luxembourg - Strasbourg - Basel Here you will pay a toll to use Swiss motorways and St. Gotthard Tunnel - Luzern -St Gotthard Tunnel - Bellinzona - Chiasso, entering Italy and toll roads at Como.
Would not recommend trying to use too many non-toll roads with your sort of rig to get around Italy.
Wild camping is possible in many places as long as you are careful/discreet. The Italian equivalent of an'aire' is 'sosta' plural 'soste'. There are also pseudo-campsites specially for motorhomes (in Italy called 'campers') called 'area attrezzata' i.e. fully equipped site, meaning they usually have EHU, fresh water supply, black/grey waste dump facility, and often a simple toilet/shower block. N.B. that all large motorway service (>1500 squ.meters) areas must also supply fresh water/black/grey waste service area for motorhomes by law.
useful sites for info:
www.camping.it
www.turismoitinerante.it
www.camperonline.it

saluti,
eddied


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## Hydrocell

I agree with eddied

The none toll route will drain the life out of you and your MH and apart from that you will use a lot more diesel, pickup you Vignettes on eBay I do but you will need two one for your MH and one for the trailer.
If you need some places to stop PM me and I will send the ones I use. 
Regards
Ray


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## Grizzly

We often do the following:

Calais- Troyes- Chalons- Dijon- Bourg-en-Bresse- Chambery- Grenoble- Gap -Col de Larche -Cuneo- Savona and so on.

If you're feeling flush then this can become- Chambery- Frejus tunnel- Torino and so on. We've not done the pass as it has not been open due to weather conditions.

This is the old RAC route and is toll free all the way and with some lovely places to stop en route - which I can supply if you like.

G


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## jarcadia

Sometimes the "Thanks" button is not enough! So on this occasion I would like to thank Grizzly for all the PM'd info, and to say how much we appreciate the time and trouble you have gone to to put it all together for us.
Brian


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## FoweyBoy

Do a search for "Russel's Route" in Italy touring.


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## aldra

we travelled via Austria, toll free except for the tunnel but it might bring you in a bit far east for the lakes but perfect for Venice

we returned via the Della Madeleine and again may bring you a bit to far south in France, but it is a beautiful route

We did not find Sostas easily but I bow to Eddies superior knowledge

Many were on campsites and charged accordingly

Dont miss Assisi, was the highlight of my trip, I just loved it along with Rome and Venice

The campsite we used for Venice was expensive 33E but we had the dog so needed the shortest route and it was a lovely campsite the boat left two minutes away 16E for 2 return boat trips in 24 hours plus unlimited Vaperreto went evening of one day, morning the next

the campsite in Rome was ASCI, 16 E and a free shuttle to the station for the train into Rome 1.50E for 100 minutes travelling time on train,metro and buses

Have a fabulous time, we did and the weather was perfect

Aldra


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## uncleswede

Hydrocell said:


> I agree with eddied
> 
> The non toll route will drain the life out of you and your MH and apart from that you will use a lot more diesel, pickup you Vignettes on eBay I do but you will need two one for your MH and one for the trailer.
> If you need some places to stop PM me and I will send the ones I use.
> Regards
> Ray


Agree non-toll roads in Italy are cumbersome but, just to reiterate, if you can avoid AUSTRIAN toll roads as you pass through with your weighty rig that would be good - otherwise you'll need to buy a GO BOX for about 80 euros. We avoided Austrian toll routes successfully this year just by setting our satnav (Garmin Nuvi) to do just that.

Rgds
CD


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## Ozzyjohn

Hi,

You may also want to add Verona to your list - lovely place full of architectural joys. Mrs O and I have just spent a few days there (though not in the motorhome  ).

The twenty five minute walk from our hotel to the centre had us passing a very good, functional sosta which was probably no more than a fifteen minute walk to the centre of Verona - yet easily accessible from major roads. Details can be found here.

I can't wait to go back to Italy with the motorhome

Regards,
John


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## jonegood

If I was you I would go via Namur Luxembourg then go through Switzerland. The motorways are excellent and will save you a load of grief, as you are over 3.5 tonnes you can buy a 10 day pass at the border that you have 12 months to use for about £25, you just write the days on it that you travel on swiss roads.

Ive been through Frejus tunnel - never again!!! its soo expensive.

I would avoid buying a go box. You have 3 choices, 
1, avoid austria and go via italy.
2 if you are on 4 wheels you might get away with pretending to be 3.5 tonnes (we did) 
3, avoid the motorways and use the ordinary roads (these are free)

Mind you I would also leave the smart car behind, there are lots of sostas in Italy but many of them are single spaces. Also some of the lakeside campsites will be difficult with a trailer. can you not manage with a scooter or bikes?

We found camping car infos had the most uptodate sosta info.

http://campingcar-infos.com/index1.htm


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## 113016

The mention of Frejus tunnel has reminded me of a funny experience.
I used Frejus tunnel quite frequently during my trucking days and had flashing light escorts through as my truck carried petro chemicals.
Anyway back to the story.
After going through the tunnel, I usually stopped for a coffee at the small service area immediately as you come out of the tunnel on the Italian side.
I pulled up at the side of the road and tight to the piled up snow which was about 4 foot high. The snow was right up to my floor height of my cab and usually it would be solid ice.
I stepped out on to the snow and you have guessed it  I disappeared downwards into about a 4 foot hole of snow.
:lol: 
Completely covered in snow, embarrassing but I could,t help chuckling :lol: 
Memories oh memories  happy times


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## uncleswede

jonegood said:


> If I was you I would go via Namur Luxembourg then go through Switzerland. The motorways are excellent and will save you a load of grief, as you are over 3.5 tonnes you can buy a 10 day pass at the border that you have 12 months to use for about £25, you just write the days on it that you travel on swiss roads.


The Swiss hgv tax is paid per day in Switzerland whether on the road or not... :-(


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## jonegood

uncleswede said:


> jonegood said:
> 
> 
> 
> If I was you I would go via Namur Luxembourg then go through Switzerland. The motorways are excellent and will save you a load of grief, as you are over 3.5 tonnes you can buy a 10 day pass at the border that you have 12 months to use for about £25, you just write the days on it that you travel on swiss roads.
> 
> 
> 
> The Swiss hgv tax is paid per day in Switzerland whether on the road or not... :-(
Click to expand...

Yes but hes only passing through, I was trying to make the point that you can split the 10 days.


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## WildThingsKev

I'd also recommend coming through Switzerland but just check you don't have to pay for the van and the trailer (ie 2 x CHF32.50). One mistake at a junction in Austria could be expensive but we have been twice and avoided toll roads.

The toll roads in Italy seem quite cheap, we've driven for 4-5 hours and it has cost under €20. It can be a very long drive avoiding them and not always pleasant as we found out in the north.

We've just been detouring around southern Tuscanny as there are several damaged bridges south of Grosseto due to the floods.

Kev


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## aldra

We went through Austria

One tunnel 10E, no trouble avoiding the toll roads, but of course it depends where you are heading

agree with Kev, its worth planning some toll roads in Italy, cheap compared to France and the alternatives can be a bit grim

But loved Italy

Aldra


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## barryd

Not sure about routes. I just tend to put in "avoid tolls" on the sat nav and hope for the best. It also depends where you want to enter Italy.

You mention lake garda. I love the Italian lakes but for me Garda is bottom of
The list of the best. Much prefer Orta, maggiore and como but some of the lakes and mountains up on the Dolomites are even better. That however is my preference.

Quite a bit of info and pics on this year and previous blogs on our website www.hankthetank.co.uk

If you do
Go Austria way via the fern pass you have the option of fussen on the border (chitty chitty bang bang castle) and if you want to enter Italy further east some of
The Austrian lakes which are simply stunning.

The only source we use for aires / sostas etc is camping car infos and we found loads of
Great places in the alps. Often free and ehu.


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## hmh

*Toll free route to Italy?*

Have to agree, unless you have plenty of time to meander slowly, Italy's toll roads are well worth the money.

Helen


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## Mrplodd

I have just returned to this post and would like to say a big thank you to everyone who has taken the time and effort to post all sorts of information to assist me. 

I WILL be PM,ing those who have offered further advice/information. 

So just to clarify matters am I right in thinking

1. Smart car and trailer might be a hindrance due to camp site and sosta sizes.
2. The Swiss vignettes are available for short term use (10 days in any 12 months) if so where can they be obtained from? Can I do it at the border?
3. Austrian tolls are expensive (especially if over 3500Kg) so its worth planning a route that avoids Austria altogether (or is it just Austrian motorways I would have to pay for?)
4. Italy is a good place to visit in a motorhome.


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## tattytony

Mrplodd said:


> I have just returned to this post and would like to say a big thank you to everyone who has taken the time and effort to post all sorts of information to assist me.
> 
> I WILL be PM,ing those who have offered further advice/information.
> 
> So just to clarify matters am I right in thinking
> 
> 1. Smart car and trailer might be a hindrance due to camp site and sosta sizes.
> 2. The Swiss vignettes are available for short term use (10 days in any 12 months) if so where can they be obtained from? Can I do it at the border?
> 3. Austrian tolls are expensive (especially if over 3500Kg) so its worth planning a route that avoids Austria altogether (or is it just Austrian motorways I would have to pay for?)
> 4. Italy is a good place to visit in a motorhome.


I have a 5000kg MH towing a Peugeot 207 and we went to Lake Garda.
We used Russells (Rapide561) route via Switzerland the car cost about 25 euro for 12 months and the MH 35 euro with a 10 day over 12 month usage, bought at the border checkpoint Basel. (logbook required)
We used without hesitation Italian motorways and the cost was little compared to any other country with tolls.
Austria which we visited this Oct gone was so bl**dy expensive we stuck to the toll free main roads but hard work.

Hope this helps :wink:


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## jonegood

Mrplodd said:


> I have just returned to this post and would like to say a big thank you to everyone who has taken the time and effort to post all sorts of information to assist me.
> 
> I WILL be PM,ing those who have offered further advice/information.
> 
> So just to clarify matters am I right in thinking
> 
> 1. Smart car and trailer might be a hindrance due to camp site and sosta sizes. *yes*
> 2. The Swiss vignettes are available for short term use (10 days in any 12 months) if so where can they be obtained from? Can I do it at the border? *yes*
> 3. Austrian tolls are expensive (especially if over 3500Kg) so its worth planning a route that avoids Austria altogether (or is it just Austrian motorways I would have to pay for?)*yes*
> 4. Italy is a good place to visit in a motorhome.


 *fabulous*

The answers to all questions is Yes with the possible addition of a ' fabulous to Italy.

Austria is nice as well, but you really need to stick to A roads.


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## uncleswede

Mrplodd said:


> I have just returned to this post and would like to say a big thank you to everyone who has taken the time and effort to post all sorts of information to assist me.
> 
> I WILL be PM,ing those who have offered further advice/information.
> 
> So just to clarify matters am I right in thinking
> 
> 1. Smart car and trailer might be a hindrance due to camp site and sosta sizes.
> 2. The Swiss vignettes are available for short term use (10 days in any 12 months) if so where can they be obtained from? Can I do it at the border?
> 3. Austrian tolls are expensive (especially if over 3500Kg) so its worth planning a route that avoids Austria altogether (or is it just Austrian motorways I would have to pay for?)
> 4. Italy is a good place to visit in a motorhome.


Mr. Plodd,

*Switzerland*
You can obtain and fill in the 10 day HGV tax declaration at the border but they much prefer that you have already filled it in with your personal and vehicle details your border crossing date. I have a PDF of the form somewhere which I will attach to this post... 
To be clear, you have to declare on that form every day that you spend in Switzerland, driving or not.

*Austria*
Tolls apply on all Austrian autoroutes and expressways. Here's a link to more information.

Rgds


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## jonegood

uncleswede said:


> Mrplodd said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have just returned to this post and would like to say a big thank you to everyone who has taken the time and effort to post all sorts of information to assist me.
> 
> I WILL be PM,ing those who have offered further advice/information.
> 
> So just to clarify matters am I right in thinking
> 
> 1. Smart car and trailer might be a hindrance due to camp site and sosta sizes.
> 2. The Swiss vignettes are available for short term use (10 days in any 12 months) if so where can they be obtained from? Can I do it at the border?
> 3. Austrian tolls are expensive (especially if over 3500Kg) so its worth planning a route that avoids Austria altogether (or is it just Austrian motorways I would have to pay for?)
> 4. Italy is a good place to visit in a motorhome.
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. Plodd,
> 
> *Switzerland*
> You can obtain and fill in the 10 day HGV tax declaration at the border but they much prefer that you have already filled it in with your personal and vehicle details your border crossing date. I have a PDF of the form somewhere which I will attach to this post...
> To be clear, you have to declare on that form every day that you spend in Switzerland, driving or not.
> 
> *Austria*
> Tolls apply on all Austrian autoroutes and expressways. Here's a link to more information.
> 
> Rgds
Click to expand...

I Know that you are suposed to declare every day you re in Switzerland - but why bother? - How are they going to check? You re never far from a border, If you ve been parked up for a couple of days are they really going to go to the border and check the cameras? At worst you might get a slapped wrist.


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## uncleswede

Jonegood,
True but for the equivalent £2.17p a day why risk the hassle...?


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## jonegood

uncleswede said:


> Jonegood,
> True but for the equivalent £2.17p a day why risk the hassle...?


Ordinarily uncleswede- I would agree with you - but on our Italy/Sardinia trip this year we had an overnight stop in Neuchatel on the way down- 2 days used. we then decided we wanted a few days in Switzerland on the way back so the days soon racked up- at which point you are looking at spending another £22 because you have to buy 10 days at a time and you have to go to a border to buy them.


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## peedee

Wupert said:


> Calais - Achen - 61 south Ulm - south over the Fern pass into Austria
> 
> Stay on the Austrian N roads and go over the Brenneron the old road then stay on Italy's non motorway roads.
> 
> Also Have a look on Michelin Routes and tell it to keep off toll roads


Thanks Wupert, I have been looking at a similar route trying to avoid buying the Austrian Go Box but using the toll route over the Brenner.
My understanding is that you can pay cash for the tolls from Innsbruck
Sud on the A13 into Italy so the only section I need to try and avoid
is between the Fern and Innsbruck and it looks like I can use the B174, B171 to Telfs to do this.
Any one done this route recently and is my assumption correct?
peedee


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## peedee

Ok no repsonse about a cash payment for using the Brenner, so has anyone used the old road up the Brenner, are HGVs banned from using it? If not any comment about its suitability?

peedee


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## jonegood

Hi Peedee

last time I did this was 3 years ago so was hanging back to see if anyone came up with anything more up to date - we did exactly that - came north over the new Brenner, left the motorway striaght after the toll booth and continued on A roads with no problems.

It is about time Austria and Hungary etc learned to differentiate between HGV s and MHs. maybe their agenda is to keep the Germans out?

Jon


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## barryd

Jon

You might have a point. We spent a good part of June / July in Austria. There were hardly any motorhomes. We stayed a week around Halstatt which is stunning and your allowed to park at the cable car station and for three nights we were the only van there.

Same on some of the sostas although campsites round Innsbruck were busy.


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## peedee

Its only the over 3.5 ton motorhomes that get penalised. Tolls were just about forced on Austria because the country was being used as a rat run to the south to avoid paying Swiss and French tolls. It is just a shame they have not gone the same route as Germany which has set or intends to set the tonnage much higher (12 tons) before tolls are due.

peedee


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