# Do You Turn the Gas Cylinder Off



## Enodreven (Aug 29, 2005)

Hi, 

Just a question ?, do you normally turn the gas cylinder/bottle off before traveling, and if you do Why ?

I have just fitted a Gaslow refillable cylinder with an external filling point and have been wondering whether i should turn the cylinder off before i move. the reason i am asking is that for those who actually run on LPG they obviously don't/can't turn the cylinder off, so why do I ?

Any help or advice would be welcome

Brian


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## BERTHA (May 21, 2005)

We light the gas cooker and then switch off at the bottle therefore burning off most of what is in the pipes between the bottle and the appliance

H


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## Scotjimland (May 23, 2005)

We have a bulk LPG tank and it is never turned off as our fridge runs only on gas while travelling.


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

Yes, I turn it off purely because it minimises the chance of a significant gas escape in a shunt etc., and because it is no hassle, as I can reach it from the same point as locking the fridge door and turning it to 12V.

Dave


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

Always.
It's one of the things on our To Do check-list before moving off.

G


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## Enodreven (Aug 29, 2005)

Hi, 

Does anyone know if its a insurance requirement ? and if it is how do those that are powered by LPG get over it ??


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## Scotjimland (May 23, 2005)

The French authorities addressed these concerns by designing a regulator that would sense a sudden loss of pressure on the LP side and automatically close the regulator outlet making it fail safe in the event of a pipe rupture.


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## smifee (May 17, 2005)

hi enodreven

no i never switch it off when travelling except when using the channel tunnel.

in the usa they have the fridge running on gas when they fill up with petrol. do the filling stations keep blowing up?

mike


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi Smiffee

Watch out for the Storm of protest, everytime I mention not switching the gas off there are screams of protest about it being dangerous, regardless of the fact that all the facts/evidence and Physics say exactly the opposite.

Endroven

If you were to ask the insurance companies, can and worms comes to mind. 

And no its not ilegal to drive with the gas on, the times people pop up saying its ilegal its ridiculous.


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## Scotjimland (May 23, 2005)

smifee said:


> in the usa they have the fridge running on gas when they fill up with petrol. do the filling stations keep blowing up?


No, they don't, however, on the filling cap of our RV there is a clear warning to turn off ALL gas appliances BEFORE refuelling. 
Pehaps they follow this instruction .. ? JAT


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## Snelly (Aug 20, 2005)

Im naughty... and very lazy... apart from when I want to change the bottle, I never turn it off.


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi

I have always refueled with the fridge on, 

1. it was diesel 
2. the rule is a nonsense, just like the mobile phone rule

It takes such a ludicrous amount of stupidity to cause a problem that even a complete idiot would be hard pushed to cause a problem (as evidenced by the lack of forecourt incidents)


Next you will be insisting that Peirre puts out his ciggy while filling the petrol can


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## trevorf (May 16, 2005)

I keep my electric hook up cable in the gas compartment so the routine is - park on pitch, open gas locker, gas on, hook up to electric. 
The reverse happens on leaving and the gas is always turned off.
Can't think of a particular reason why, maybe I am just playing safe  

Trevor


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi Trevor

No electrical equipment may be installed in a compartment intended for the storage of gas cylinders.

If one were to interpret the regs using *installed* to mean *to give a place to.....*

For amusement only, not a dig or literal interpretation.


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## eddied (May 9, 2005)

:? 
Well, as a general rule I always turn my gas off before travelling, simply because all the various blurbs/experts have always advised you should. I also sometimes forget whether or not I have turned it off, and then stop to check at the next opportunity! Maybe I shouldn't worry about it?
saluti, eddied


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## thefman (May 1, 2005)

i leave it on except when on the ferry, i also think the fridge keeps cooler traveling on gas rather than battery.


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

The instructions that go with my webasto diesel powered heating system include a sticker for the fuel inlet which says :

Switch off auxiliary heating before refueling 

or if you prefer

Standheizung vor dem Tanken abschalten!

Why it has an exclamation mark in German but not in English or any of the other languages beats me.

I don't turn off my gas at the bottle when travelling as it is a pain to get to but it only goes to my cooker. I think I would if it was easy but have no justification for it either way.


Regards Frank


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## Maverick (May 9, 2005)

I only tend to turn the gas off when the 'van is parked at the house and not in use. I did on occasion turn it off before travelling but you stop off for a cuppa and have to go out, sometimes in the rain, to turn it on. Therefore once we leave home the gas stays on (except for the ferries).


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## 89555 (May 28, 2005)

One of the items on my check list so is always switched off prior driving off


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

This is not the first time this question has come up so forgive me if I haven't read them all but some of you give me the shivers. Automatic cut off valve or not it, still gives me the shivers thinking what might happen if I bump into you! Things like this don't often cross my mind but travel through dimly lit, none too wide road tunnels and colliding with those of you who leave the gas on could result in horrific consequences. What is the point in having 12volt 
fridges and cab heaters if you are going to leave the gas switched on? 

peedee


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## Enodreven (Aug 29, 2005)

Hi, Thanks for all your replies, 

I do think that this subject could go on and on, the only questions i would pose to those that think/suggest the cylinder should be turned is

(1) What do they suggest those vehicles that are powered by LPG do ??

(2) And if its OK for them why isn't it OK for the rest of us ??

I would be interested in the answers


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## Scotjimland (May 23, 2005)

peedee said:


> What is the point in having 12volt
> fridges and cab heaters if you are going to leave the gas switched on


 Hi Peedee 
Some of us have no choice unless we go without a fridge, if it were so dangerous do you not think it would be illegal which it is not and is a tank of petrol less dangerous .. ? 
In the worst case scenario whether the gas is ON or Off will make little difference to the seriousness and survivability of an accident. An inferno will eventually explode petrol, diesel and LPG tanks, petrol would go up first followed by the diesel..


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## 88927 (May 10, 2005)

Turn off the tank???? Where is that then???? Maybe I havent used up the zillion litres of LPG yet....
I'll let you know when I find the knob :lol: :lol: :lol: 

Keith

Hope I haven't used any naughty words here 8O 8O 8O


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## solentviews (May 9, 2005)

I am sure when I enquired from Truma about a crash valve to allow me to have the gas heating on when travelling they informed me that it was only allowed in Germany and that gas bottles should be isolated in UK. Although I did understand that the subject was to be discussed in Brussels. Think I will contact truma again to see what the latest is.
Ian


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## 98098 (Mar 12, 2006)

Having read some of these posts regarding leaving gas appliances on whilst refueling at fuel stations leaves me amazed.

Believe me when I say these are dangerous places to have a naked flame or source of ignition.

Having worked in these places for nearly 20 years and having knowledge of all the health and safety practises required for them leaves me cold that you are willing to put other peoples lifes at risk for the sake of following the warning signs (this includes mobile phones).

There are plenty of incidents of fires on forecourts, a famous one of an ice cream van completely destroying a forecourt springs to mind, many minor incidents have occurred that have not escalleted into major ones due to the safety systems installed.

You only need to look back a few months to Buncefield to see how dangerous petroleum vapour is.

Please guys and girls turn the gas off and continue to enjoy your motorhomes


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## JockandRita (Jun 1, 2005)

Hi Ian,
We would also be interested to hear what Truma have to say.

The instructions (in english) for our Truma C + E heaters say that they are TUV approved for use whilst travelling. 

With such a large area to heat, especially during the recent cold spells the cab heater hasn't coped too well. However the Truma E heater has come into it's own and really makes a difference.

Anything that is TUV approved usually has a high safety standard.

J & R.


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## 98308 (Mar 24, 2006)

You might be interested to hear that as from this year it is illegal to travel with the gas turned on in UK. It has always been inadvisable due to the hazard in the event of an accident.

I am certain that your insurance company are aware of the new regulations so just bite the bullet and get used to turning the cylinder off, it could, just possibly, save your life one day.

Hubnut


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## 88792 (May 9, 2005)

Never, I have an American Rv, used to with the last one as the fridge vent was same side as petrol filler so would turn off when refilling. The present one they are on opposite sides & I don't turn off, not even when on ferry. Do you switch off your petrol tank at the tank?


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

Enodreven said:


> Hi, Thanks for all your replies,
> 
> (1) What do they suggest those vehicles that are powered by LPG do ??
> 
> ...


Its not ok for them for instance they are not allowed thro' the Chunnel and as far as I know thro' some of the major mountain tunnels on the continent. You also will not get through the Chunnel without a check being performed on your gas to establish it is turned off. This seems to indicate to me that LPG is far more dangerous than any other fuel Jim and from my own experience I believe this to be so.

peedee


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## smifee (May 17, 2005)

hi hubnut

do you have details of the act or regulation or is this just something you have heard?

mike


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## Enodreven (Aug 29, 2005)

Hubnut said:


> You might be interested to hear that as from this year it is illegal to travel with the gas turned on in UK. It has always been inadvisable due to the hazard in the event of an accident.
> 
> I am certain that your insurance company are aware of the new regulations so just bite the bullet and get used to turning the cylinder off, it could, just possibly, save your life one day.
> 
> Hubnut


Hi, Hubnut
Your comments appear to indicate that you know of some offical guidance on this subject ? if this is correct can you please let us know what and where it can be found as we would all be very interested


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## Motorhomersimpson (May 9, 2005)

Hi lorr and welcome to the site  , your post highlights the dangers, unfortunately, unless these incidents are in the media on a regular basis, people tend to think it will never happen.

As for me, I always turn off gas, I do turn off diesel heating before filling up, I suppose I’m cautious by nature, but it’s served me well up to now. :roll: 

MHS…Rob


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## 88785 (May 9, 2005)

I don't think that it hurts to be cautious and think it a very sensible thing to travel with the gas turned off.
In the event of a vehicle being involved in an accident i would think it far safer if the cylinders were turned off so that there was less chance of gas leaking where there was a danger of it igniting.
The rules for travelling through tunnels stipulate that gas be turned off before entering.


Chris


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## Scotjimland (May 23, 2005)

The original question was about leaving gas on while travelling, not about filling stations, tunnels, ferries or phones on forecourts. 

Hubnut, where did you hear about this new regulation, would it outlaw LPG vehicles or just the reckless RV owner with his fridge on gas :?:


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

ScotJimland said:


> The original question was about leaving gas on while travelling, not about filling stations, tunnels, ferries or phones on forecourts.


So does your motorhome fly then and run on air jim   
peedee


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

I to await hubnut's response but the idea that we can ignore filling stations presupposes that those travelling pull up a 100m before, jump out turn their fridges off etc, then get back in - you're having a laugh.

Regards Frank


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## 98098 (Mar 12, 2006)

Hi Motorhomersimpson

Thanks for the welcome, we have watched these forums for some time - reading this thread prompted me to warn of these dangerous.

Anyone who works in or around fuel stations have to pass some pretty tough health and safety exams.

Any source of ignition is potentialy able to ignite petroleum vapour, be it gas fridges or diesel heaters.

It does not matter if you are filling with diesel (this is also explosive in the right conditions) you need to remember that other people around you could be filling with petrol.

All the areas on fuel stations are zoned, the area around the actual pumps is the second most dangerous, only the inside of the pump and the fuel tanks are classed as more dangerous.

It does not matter what side your fridge vent is on your stiil inside this zone, in fact you could be in the aisle between two pump islands.


Sorry if I'm labouring the issue but everybody should realise how dangerous this practise is.


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## Motorhomersimpson (May 9, 2005)

Hi Jim, the last few posts had answered that question, but there's also no harm in expanding it a little.

Chris knowing what you do for a living I'm glad I do the same as you. :wink: 

Karate Kid after having a curry....gas on..gas off...gas on...gas off :lol: 

A bit like this thread.

MHS....Rob


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## Scotjimland (May 23, 2005)

peedee said:


> So does your motorhome fly then and run on air jim


I wish.. :lol: :lol:


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## Motorhomersimpson (May 9, 2005)

> *Sorry if I'm labouring the issue but everybody should realise how dangerous this practise is.*


Hi lorr, certainly no need to apologise here, we appreciate peoples opinions and views. We may not always agree. :wink:

I think most know the dangers but whether they take precautions is up to the individual.

I would hope that some would take on board what you have said.

MHS....Rob


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Where does all this rubbish come from?

*It is not ilegal to drive with gas on and its not about to become ilegal either.*

Come on use your heads

Phones on forecourts is an urban legend that as become yet another dumb forecourt/H&S rule. If they ever stop to think H&S could do some good at the moment they are a waste of space. A weird science program tried to get mobile phones to ignite a fuel vapour they had loadsa phones in a caravan the fuel they used was far more flammable than petrol, with loadsa phones some opened up on ring vibrate the lot, nothing happened they then used the static from a pair of tracksuit bottoms to ignite it. Moral leave your phone on, but remove tracky bottoms, tights, stockings etc

Fridges on forecourts again it would take a complete idiot to cause any problem Just having the fridge on gas is NOT going to cause the slightest problem, a car exhaust is more likely (ever seen a cokey one in the dark)

Many vehicles have sparks flying from faulty spark plug leads why doesnt this cause a problem?, ever seen the insides of an alternator in the dark?understand the Physics and you would see that its a silly totally pointless rule.

Do they have to push LPG vehicles onto the forcourt then?

Deisel explosive ? yes if an explosive composition consisting of an oxidizing agent such as ammonium nitrate and a fuel material that may include a fuel oil and which also comprises a solid fuel such as rubber particles or polystyrene.

Biggest danger from a deisel spill is slipping over onto ya butt

Sorry If I am labouring the issue, but there's no danger at all


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

GeorgeTelford said:


> Fridges on forecourts again it would take a complete idiot to cause any problem


George...I have to ask. What would a complete idiot have to do, in your opinion, to cause a problem and what type of problem is it possible for them to cause ?

Surely there are complete idiots around - and some of us who are only partially idiotic normally but get distracted occasionally and go the whole hog. Isn't this what H&S Exectutive and others try to foresee ?

G


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## Scotjimland (May 23, 2005)

*Petrol station mobile risk 'myth'*
BBC News 
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/kent/4366337.stm


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Thank's Jim your a star, great link

Grizzly the complete idiot would pretty much have to put the nozzle by the bottom vent and squirt petrol in and if they are that stupid switching the fridge off wont help natural selection will get them one way or the other.


H&S are beyond dumb, Knee jerk reaction's, making rules to forestall non existant problems. Making rules without understanding or even trying to research whethor its even possible.


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## 88785 (May 9, 2005)

George,

do you practice or does it just come naturally.

Chris


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi Chris

If you want to insult me do it by PM.

Do you have a point? or do you work for H&S?


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## autostratus (May 9, 2005)

Chris. George. Cool it!


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

GeorgeTelford said:


> ....H&S are beyond dumb, Knee jerk reaction's, making rules to forestall non existant problems. Making rules without understanding or even trying to research whethor its even possible.


George you go far too far I'm afraid. Some of the H&S legislation may be a rule too far or indeed questionable, but it is questioned, thoroughly and some of it is amended in light of new evidence Knee jerk reactions are what politicians do not H&S practictioners.

Frank


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi Gillian

When I am on the recieving end of uncalled for personal Jibe, how come you ask me to cool it?


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## spykal (May 9, 2005)

Turn the other cheek George.......

By the way I am with you on the H&S front......good in principle ...bad in practice...like so much else in this nanny state.


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## 88785 (May 9, 2005)

How have I insulted you, I merely asked the question
"do you practice or does it come naturally".

in your own words I believe

"if the cap fits"

What did mobile phones have to do with the thread in the first place - and be it "urban legend" or not, which selfish person would walk to the middle of a busy petrol forecourt and use their mobile phone just to find out.

I have found today (rainy one) that reading through all the various threads on this site that the majority of the ones that you have had any part in usually degenerate into a free for all and slanging match.

Do you actually have any interest in motorhoming or do you just thrive on causing mayhem wherever you go, you must get some perverse satisfaction from it.


I apologise now to all the other members for my outburst, I just feel it needed to be said.

Chris


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## Enodreven (Aug 29, 2005)

Hi, I think George is right on this one ?? as far as i can see he hasn't said anything out of place just made very constructive comments


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi Frank

I speak as I find, most Health and Safety legislation is ill thought out and most could be disproved by a third rate Physics student, except they never bother to research or even think it through. The simplist checks would show that most is absolute rubbish.


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## spykal (May 9, 2005)

yes George but they do not need telling in such a fashion.....

Please try my advice George ...it will work I promise you.

Mike


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## Scotjimland (May 23, 2005)

I cannot see why George is being attacked either.. he has put forward his opinion in a constructive manner.. he hasn't been rude or insulting..


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## RobinHood (May 19, 2005)

I'm just glad I wasn't driving past Buncefield in my RV with the fridge on gas, talking on my mobile 'phone (hands free of course), when........

:wink:


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

I have tried to get to the bottom of the current and imminent legislation regarding LPG supply, but I've had enough, for now at least.

For those who wish to look through the most relevant links I've found, be my guest. Much is directed at LPG heaters, and a distinction made between those designed for static use and those in motion. You will see reference to the need for LPG cylinders for the former to be shut off, and for the latter to have remotely operated automatic shut-off valves .

http://www.caravan-sitefinder.co.uk/features/touring/legal.php
http://europa.eu.int/comm/enterpris...ngs/meeting108/heating_systems_annex_viii.pdf
http://www.vca.gov.uk/vehicletype/motor-caravans.asp
http://www.vca.gov.uk/additional/files/legislation/information-notices/infolat.pdf
http://europa.eu.int/eur-lex/lex/LexUriServ/site/en/oj/2004/l_231/l_23120040630en00690074.pdf

Dave


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## Motorhomersimpson (May 9, 2005)

I thought the topic was “do you turn off your gas when travelling” George. Most people answered yes/no.

A new member took the time and made the effort to give his views only to met with an outburst of “Where does all this rubbish come from? Not a nice introduction George.

Followed by “It is not ilegal to drive with gas on and its not about to become ilegal either.”
who is saying it is illegal George, what I was saying and many others is what the topic question asked, simple as that.

George your reading too much into posts of late, I have always been amazed by your knowledge, and impressed by your quest for answers, but please don’t let it cloud your mind totally to the extent that no other opinion is valid.

MHS…Rob


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## jiffyman (May 11, 2005)

TheOggies said:


> What did mobile phones have to do with the thread in the first place - and be it "urban legend" or not, which selfish person would walk to the middle of a busy petrol forecourt and use their mobile phone just to find out.


Did you realise that MOST of the forecourts have there computers 'sometimes' affected by moblies, and thats all?? Just thought I'd let you know that!

Oh, and I turn my gas off at the bottle once I'm home from my break.


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## 88785 (May 9, 2005)

Motorhomersimpson said:


> I thought the topic was "do you turn off your gas when travelling" George. Most people answered yes/no.
> 
> A new member took the time and made the effort to give his views only to met with an outburst of "Where does all this rubbish come from? Not a nice introduction George.
> 
> ...


HERE HERE


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## 88781 (May 9, 2005)

I make a point of turning it off when driving, or when the 'van is parked up and not in use, my reason for doing so is because Mandy has an unfortunate habit of catching the oven control knobs when cleaning/stocking shelves above the oven, and on three occasions have lost considerable amounts of gas from the storage bottles before it's been noticed!


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Gas Fridge*



ScotJimland said:


> We have a bulk LPG tank and it is never turned off as our fridge runs only on gas while travelling.


Hello,

Does the draft from movement not blow the flame out Jim?

Trev


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Fridge And Gas*

Hello,

I always switch it off. I do'nt fancy getting side swiped by another vehicle, the obvious would happen and like someone else said on here, "its no hassle".

With regard to mobile phone rule how many people do you see on the continent filling up or on the forecourt Smoking?!"!£"£$!"^%£%"&^£

Trev


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## Motorhomersimpson (May 9, 2005)

> With regard to mobile phone rule how many people do you see on the continent filling up or on the forecourt Smoking?!"!£"£$!"^%£%"&^£


Hi Trev, is that after they have pulled into a garage with their fridge on gas using their mobile and their diesel heater on….when the garage is on fire :lol: :lol: :lol:

Sorry couldn't resist. :wink:

MHS…Rob


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi Chris 

Is this a thread about gas? or just for you to rabble rouse. But I am really not getting into a flame war with you, so take it to PM 

or will the Mods sort? That's at least three posts that are pointless, goading, personal, insulting and off topic posts in this thread so far.

Rob 

Where I responded about phones was when a "new" poster bought them into the mix. Strangely mentioning that forecourt workers having to pass stringent H&S exams (does that not set anyone elses common sense alarms off?) Just sit back close your eyes and imagine "Sharon" down at you local garage passing any kind of exam, in between Talking and Texting continously on her MOBILE she's usually doing her nails. If she as done the H&S Exam how come she ignores this Highley dangerous practice?

If you notice I was responding to a post saying it was about to become ilegal to travel with gas switched on, It isnt and will not become law that gas must be switched off.

Jiffyman

Thats another fallacy the telemetrics are not effected by mobile phones, See Sharon and her phone from section above, also I have discussed this with a fuel station/garage owner of many years standing.


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## xgx (Oct 14, 2005)

Once again a sensible thread has descended, in part, into off topic personal comments.

One member, in particular, seems to be regarded as 'fair game' when it comes to personal snipes. 

I would like to see the moderators adopting a more even handed approach and not, perhaps, succumbing to the 'give a dog a bad name' syndrome.

Perhaps a more pro-active response such as removing any offending post and pm'ing the 'offender' pointing out which part of the message is objected to and suggesting modifications. 

Fair play for all please. 

Oh! if you have a personal issue with a poster use the pm system, I for one am tired of other people's dirty washing littering this forum.


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## Scotjimland (May 23, 2005)

*Re: Gas Fridge*



teemyob said:


> Hello,Does the draft from movement not blow the flame out Jim?


Hi Trev 
No, it's designed to be used on the move, most RVs don't have a fridge that uses a 12v supply, probably because they are domestic sized fridge/freezer .. some however do have a 12v compressor fridge/freezer not requiring LPG. That would be my preference if I ever replaced it.


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## Pusser (May 9, 2005)

I don't turn it off. I only turn off the gas taps underneath the sink. I do turn if off for the tunnel and when Two Loos is idle like its owner.


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## 98098 (Mar 12, 2006)

GeorgeTelford said:


> Hi
> 
> I have always refueled with the fridge on,
> 
> ...


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## Enodreven (Aug 29, 2005)

Hi, Just to get back on track, this is the question I asked can we please stay with it or drop it completely, I don't mind either, but i do object to it being highjacked and then used to insult other members,

the logic behind my questions were if i have now installed a fixed re-fillable system ?? Gaslow, why can't it be treated as the same as those vehicles that use LPG for power ?? what is the difference ??

_Hi,

Just a question ?, do you normally turn the gas cylinder/bottle off before traveling, and if you do Why ?

I have just fitted a Gaslow refillable cylinder with an external filling point and have been wondering whether i should turn the cylinder off before i move. the reason i am asking is that for those who actually run on LPG they obviously don't/can't turn the cylinder off, so why do I ?

Any help or advice would be welcome

Brian_


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## spykal (May 9, 2005)

Hi Enodreven

Are there any differences? Other than the fact that once your gas leaves the cylinder it is a gas wheras LPG used to power a vehicle is taken off as a liquid.

I would do whatever suits you best. If you have a turn off point that is easy to reach and it makes you feel more secure while travelling then turn it off.

otherwise leave it on....as I and many other folk do....it is certainly more convenient to be able to fire up the stove for a cuppa or to turn on the fridge when you reach a stopping place for a long break from driving.

IMHO LPG is not as dangerous as some would make out...yes there have been accidents but they are few and far between considering how much of the stuff is bottling around on our roads :roll: 

Mike


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## xgx (Oct 14, 2005)

Enodreven said:


> do you normally turn the gas cylinder/bottle off before traveling, and if you do Why ?
> [/i]


Yes Brian, it's one less thing to worry about if it's off... just in case.

Whether any danger is real or imagined it just makes me feel better :wink:


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

Brian,

You ask the difference with LPG-fuelled vehicles. If you peruse the legal links I gave earlier, you will see that things are/will be getting tougher for LPG appliances, though there seems an emphasis on heaters for some reason, rather than any gas appliances including fridges, etc.

LPG fuelled vehicles have a liquid take off, rather than vapour as in leisure appliances. In any accident, this has greater danger as it immediately expands 200 times (from memory). Thus these vehicles must have, by law, automatically controlled valves, one at the tank and one in the engine compartment.

In leisure gas systems, there are the same risks, albeit at a far lesser level IMHO because of the vapour take-off. Nevertheless, although I cannot point directly to the legal documents, it does appear that for gas appliances (certainly heaters) designed for static operation, the cylinder must (or will be required to) be turned off, and for those appliances (certainly heaters) designed for use when mobile, a similar automatic valve or valves will be required, I'm guessing for new vehicles from 1 Jan 2007.

If I feel Google deprived later on today, I shall return to the hunt to be definitive.

Dave


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi Lorr

Quote Lorr

*Anyone who works in or around fuel stations *have to pass some pretty tough health and safety exams.

Anyone must include "Sharon" and its obviously an inaccurate statement, I asked (the sole operator at this service station) this morning whethor he had to pass any stringent H&S exam's? He had not. Further a search of the Health and Safety executive site on dispensing fuel does not mention any such exams, even for receiving a tanker is only an appointed and trained "competent person" Basically they have to show the boss that they can follow a few simple rules.

On the mobile phone issue, I initially mentioned in passing that they were both dumb pointless rules, the facts all bear me out on this.

Hi Brian

There is no law that requires you to turn it off, the *proposed* laws in linked to files are to are contradictory and unworkable in their present form, not much point worrying about a law that may not even make it through and could be changed many times before it that.


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## relay (May 9, 2005)

We turn ours off - more by habit than any real "reason" I think. Our first two vans had the bottles in cupboards inside the van and when on I could always smell gas (it wasn't leaking, I've just got one of those noses (yes big  that detects everything :roll so we got into the habit of turning it off at every available opportunity  even between cups of tea! We do leave it on overnight etc now but turn off before we leave a pitch - even tho we have to go outside to do it now it's still pretty easy. 

What we never do it turn it off at the isolating taps inside - what circs are they meant for???

l-H


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

I don't think there is anything more valid than that contained in the links I gave yesterday.

I think the point of the existing and upcoming EC-led changes is NOT that it will not force motorhome gas to be turned off while mobile, as the type approval technical changes are only relevant for new vehicles or installations.

Rather the point is that it clearly addresses specific safety issues of LPG in use while mobile, and the technical changes deemed necessary to mitigate these risks. Owners of EXISTING motorhome can then choose whether or not to turn off their LPG cylinder/ tank informed by these issues, which is what I thought this thread was about.

As I find pertinent links in threads get ignored, I will also copy the relevant words.

http://www.vca.gov.uk/additional/files/legislation/information-notices/infolat.pdf
suggests that 2004/78/EC (amending 2001/56/EC) should generally apply from 1/1/2007 and that EC Member States may refuse the registration, sale or entry into service of new vehicles that do not comply. Certificates of Conformity to existing regulations will become invalid on that date. It is already impossible, as from 1/1/2006, for such non-compliant vehicles to have EC Type-approval.

This reference is:
http://europa.eu.int/eur-lex/lex/LexUriServ/site/en/oj/2004/l_231/l_23120040630en00690074.pdf
and includes:

"If an LPG heating system in a motor vehicle can also be used when the vehicle is in motion, the LPG combustion heater and its supply system shall comply with the following requirements:
If the LPG is supplied in the gaseous phase from the permanently installed LPG container or separate portable LPG cylinder(s), appropriate provisions shall be taken to ensure that:
1.1.6.1. no liquid LPG can enter the pressure regulator or LPG combustion heater. A separator may be used and
1.1.6.2. no uncontrolled release due to an accident can occur. Means shall be provided to stop the flow of LPG by installing a device directly after a cylinder or container mounted regulator or if the regulator is mounted remote from the cylinder or container, a device shall be installed directly before the hose or pipe from the cylinder or container and an additional device shall be installed after the regulator."

For caravans:
"Permanent labels shall be attached on the compartment where the portable LPG cylinders are stored and in close proximity to the control device for the heating system, giving instructions that the LPG heater shall not be in operation and that the valve of the portable LPG cylinder shall be closed when the vehicle is in motion."

Dave


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## 88870 (May 10, 2005)

relay said:


> What we never do it turn it off at the isolating taps inside - what circs are they meant for???
> 
> l-H


Hi relay, we never used the isolating taps inside either until the fridge developed a gas leak! Now the fridge isolator is permanently off so we can still use the gas for the heater and cooker  Should be getting it fixed in a couple of weeks so the isolators will be obsolete again then!

Incidently we always turn the gas off when travelling. When someone hit the side of our van they actually scraped along the gas cupboard. Another couple of inches and they would have been inside it! I guess if they had pulled the hoses with their grill/bumper there might have been an almighty rush of gas - and we would have had to refill again .. costing us another £17 ... ha ha. That and the fact that the gas tanks are behind the passenger seat where I sit .. and I am partial to a ciggie when on the road!

Good enough reason as any I guess!


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## Enodreven (Aug 29, 2005)

Hi, I am going to open a poll just to count how many do and how many don't

Brian


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## spykal (May 9, 2005)

Hi

Please give at least three choices....yes , no, and It depends :lol: 

Mike


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## 2point (Jun 10, 2005)

I don't switch off if it's on or on if it's off.

The service centre told me that the MH is fitted with a valve that cuts out if there is a change in pressure, ie major leak. They said there is no problem using the gas whilst travelling, specifically to cool the fridge or heat the habitation area.

I have used the heating whilts travelling but don't see this as being a regular occurance, the Cab heater works pretty well, the exception being in the recent -5c spell.


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## Enodreven (Aug 29, 2005)

Thanks, everyone

just to update everyone regarding using the gas while traveling, or to put it another way leaving the gas on.

I have just spoken to Truma and they have informed me that they manufacture a device that allows you to do this and the item is to be found at the link below

http://www.truma.com/truma05/en/news/detail_en_72293.html

Brian


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## 88927 (May 10, 2005)

Hi
I would just like to say that with regard to the "personal attack" cry's, how difficult was it to find out my wifes name and then use it in a derogatory way?
Or maybe I am reading to deeply into this comment........

Keith


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## solentviews (May 9, 2005)

*Reply from Truma*

I have consulted with Alan Jones, Truma Service Manager, and respond to your query on his behalf.

Alan responds that the information on the regulator and hoses are available via our German website www.truma.com, the unit is called the Drive safe.

Alan also responds that you will need to read your handbook with reference to the possible need for flue and air intake extensions.

If you require any further assistance do not hesitate to contact us.

Kind Regards

PS. I can find no reference to Drive Safe on the German website!
Ian


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## Enodreven (Aug 29, 2005)

Hi, Ian

I gave the link on my post above, to the Truma German web site 

The item in Germany is called "SecuMotion" the link on my last post will take you directly to the item on the German web site.

And you have to know/workout the actual gas consumption of all of your appliances as there a 3 sizes of valve ? 

0.8kg.hr
1.2kg/hr
1.5kg/hr


Brian


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## solentviews (May 9, 2005)

Thankyou Enodreven. Now just need someone to tell me it can be achieved at reasonable cost. Will have to wait a little while though.
Ian


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

kands said:


> I would just like to say that with regard to the "personal attack" cry's, how difficult was it to find out my wifes name and then use it in a derogatory way?
> Or maybe I am reading to deeply into this comment........


Call me a genius, but from the above quote I am guessing your wifes name must be Sharon.

Keith if that is so, I was definately not refering to your wife in any way, I have just checked your profile and can see no reference to your wifes name, it literally was a name plucked from the Essex girl jokes just to give the notional forecourt attendant a name.

Honestly Keith that was way too deep and purely coincidental, no offence was intended.


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## 88927 (May 10, 2005)

Thanks for your reassurances George.

Keith


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

Keith, 

You want to start worrying when she IS from Essex, like Alison, and not just named with a stereotype Essex name ....

I'm sure she must have had furry dice in the windscreen of her Mini when I first went out with her.

Dave


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