# Diesel/Water fueled engines



## Moledrain (Sep 20, 2006)

Hi all,

Just came across this site here which expounds the benefits of running your vehicle engine on a mix of your usual fuel and hydrogen.

They say, it only costs a few hundred dollars, competent mechanics can obtain and fit the parts themselves and fuel economy can in some cases be doubled.

In view of the current fuel price and supply problems I would have thought it was the sort of thing the motoring clubs etc, would be advocating?

I am very sceptical as it seems too good to be true and possibly a scam but does anybody know if there's anything in it?

Moley


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## davesport (Nov 12, 2006)

I can't access the site through your link. But this has been around on several forums before now. 

It's snake oil, pure & simple. The power used to crack the bond between the hydrogen & oxygen is exceeds by a large margin the energy released from the combustion of hydrogen produced. 

Good one for gullible investors :lol: 

No free lunch etc.

D.


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## Boff (May 10, 2005)

Hi Moley,

it is either a hoax, or superstition, or fraud.

See this my postings here and here and the followup to understand why.

Best Regards,
Gerhard


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## 110319 (Mar 2, 2008)

there are several studies out there regarding hydrogen generators, and they are available (all in the USA) its all been done before and its finding the right balance of use of energy to produce hydrogen against the energy produced adding the hydrogen to the combustion process!

A hydrogen generator is a very simple device but an effiecent one on the other hand would need some time and effort to perfect :roll: 

i've considered water injection a few times but thats usually for power gains (it increases the compression ration and reduces piston temperature). lots of turbo charged rally cars used primitive water injetion years ago.


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## Boff (May 10, 2005)

Hi!



jeepmadmike said:


> ...its finding the right balance of use of energy to produce hydrogen against the energy produced adding the hydrogen to the combustion process!


No whatsoever balance can outweigh the law of energy conservation: And this law requires that you invest at least as much energy into producing the hydrogen/oxygen mix, as you will get out later by combusting it.

Neither can it outweigh the second law of thermodynamics, which means that each of these conversion steps will go along with heat losses. The most heat losses in this scenario occur in the internal combustion engine, which has an efficiency of only between 20 and 30%. So for every Joule of energy that you gain from hydrogen/oxygen, you have to invest at least 3-5 Joule to produce it.

The only reason why contraptions as described in the link do not seriously _decrease MPG_, is that they produce such pathetic amounts of hydrogen/oxygen that their effect is totally insignificant.

In other words: *Snake oil, extra strong!* :wink:

Best Regards,
Gerhard


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## Zebedee (Oct 3, 2007)

Oh please no!!

Not this again. Aaaaarrrrrggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! 8O 8O 8O


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## b16duv (Feb 14, 2006)

Better to put some magnets round the fuel pipe, or an electronic device that lines up the ions in the fuel for better combustion!

send me a cheque fr £25.00 and I'll tell you how! Guaranteed results!

David


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## hilldweller (Mar 8, 2008)

Zebedee said:


> Oh please no!!
> 
> Not this again. Aaaaarrrrrggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! 8O 8O 8O


TOO LATE.

This is the MHF equivalent of Survivors 

All we can do now is see who is unlucky enough to survive.


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## b16duv (Feb 14, 2006)

No takers then?


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## duxdeluxe (Sep 2, 2007)

In fact pure snake oil would be better - assuming it burnt, that is. decent quality snake oil is great biofuel and we should all use it.

Or is that going to spark yet another repeat debate on the subject of biofuels?......all of which has been posted to death.

Anyhow, thanks to the OP who raised this in very good faith. Only a superhuman would do a comprehensive search of this forum and the internerd to make sure that the post was not duplicated....

Cheers - it brightened up a dull afternoon a bit (vision of Zeb tearing hair out whilst running around in circles)


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## trevorf (May 16, 2005)

> No takers then?


Sure mate, I will make out the cheque to Mr W Indup, where do I send it :lol:


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## b16duv (Feb 14, 2006)

trevorf said:


> > No takers then?
> 
> 
> Sure mate, I will make out the cheque to Mr W Indup, where do I send it :lol:


Best to wait til monday then the vat's only 15%.


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