# letter in C&CC March Magazine



## bognormike (May 10, 2005)

There's a letter in the March edition of the CCC magazine (pages 12-13) from a motorhomer travelling with some "well travelled caravanners" friends to France. They went across and arrived in Calais at 6pm (in the dark), and decided to travel on and at 9pm started looking for an aire, :!:  , and eventually stopped at 10:30 on what sounded from his description to be a busy autoroute service area with noisy trucks parked up. 
Needless to say he wasn't happy, and was awoken by somebody breaking into his van (not gassed!!) and thankfully managed to chase them away. 

Now this is a pretty awful way of being initiated into aires, and to me goes against all the conventions on finding and stopping on PROPER aires - plan it so you can aim to stop before you're too tired, have an idea of where you want to get to, if at all possible, get off the autoroute & stop in a village, and if you are not happy about the location, don't stop there! 

I can't believe that their so called friends had "initiated" them so badly, it gives all the people who will see that letter more ammuntion to say that aires are not safe, and you should use sites (booked through the CCC as recommended in the magazine!)! Of course travelling with tuggers they couldn't have (officially) stopped at an aire for Camping Cars!

For goodnesss' sake why didn't they stop off at Calais in one of the various places recommended by MHF members, and then set off in the morning?( I suppose the caravanner friesnds couldn't have done that beacause the Calais Camp site would have been closed....) Then they would have the whole day to plan an area where they would be likely to get to next day, and head for that area and stop off at a sensible time and place? 

We are heading across the channel in a few weeks' time, and we count ourselves as fairly expereienced in travelling on the continent; we are going over in convoy with some novice motorhomers (ex tuggers), and our tunnel train is due in at about 6pm :wink: - we plan to stop off in Calais at either the beach aire or the Yacht basin parking, and go to a restaurant & have a nice meal beofre retiring and setting off next morning.........


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## clive1821 (Mar 27, 2010)

Sounds a good idea mike, the Marina was empty when I went out at the beginning of the month so stayed at the main aire.... The water was frozen up at that time.... Not going to comment on the article.... It's all to do with common sence.... always stay at the callias aire from the late ferries I catch.... Enjoy


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Aires*

The sad thing about it is that the Motorway Aires were partly built for people to rest on.

And it is a pity more of us don't use them. That way they may be that bit safer.

I am not that keen on calais Aires any more. There are Free ones that are far safer nearby.

TM


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## bognormike (May 10, 2005)

clive1821 said:


> .. It's all to do with common sence....


quite right, Clive - for some people common sense seems to go out of the window when they set off on a trip... :roll:


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## GerryD (Sep 20, 2007)

Problem is that if he was with caravanners that would have prevented the use of Camping Car aires. His only choice then would have been Autoroute Aires de Service or proper campsites.
Gerry


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## bognormike (May 10, 2005)

GerryD said:


> Problem is that if he was with caravanners that would have prevented the use of Camping Car aires. His only choice then would have been Autoroute Aires de Service or proper campsites.
> Gerry


exactly, Gerry, and I didn't pick up on that until reading it through again. And as I suggested the usual suspects :roll: (like another friend of mine who is a tugger - unconverted!- who reads stories like this and the stories about gassing that go with them) will use it to suggest that every aire is unsafe!


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Yeah the CC would be delighted to publish that one!

I have often considered writing a letter saying how we love Aires and wild camping just to see if they publish it. 

I would have thought if they had found a quiet Aire out of the way for just a night or a few hours they may have got the caravan on if they left it hitched.


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## mikebeaches (Oct 18, 2008)

Yes, I saw that letter in the Camping and Caravanning Club magazine.

After the letter - Donna Bloy, Product Operations Manager at Carefree, the Club's international travel service says: "The Club does not recommend spending the night at service areas or laybys on the Continent. Our advisors in Carefree are on the end of the phone to help find an 'en route' campsite if you need one."

Well, there's a surprise then.  

Hardly an unbiased response.


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## GerryD (Sep 20, 2007)

mikebeaches said:


> Yes, I saw that letter in the Camping and Caravanning Club magazine.
> 
> After the letter - Donna Bloy, Product Operations Manager at Carefree, the Club's international travel service says: "The Club does not recommend spending the night at service areas or laybys on the Continent. Our advisors in Carefree are on the end of the phone to help find an 'en route' campsite if you need one."
> 
> ...


Anyone aver tried phoning Carefree outside office hours? Oops, silly me, you can't.
Gerry


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

mikebeaches said:


> After the letter - Donna Bloy, Product Operations Manager at Carefree, the Club's international travel service says: "The Club does not recommend spending the night at service areas or laybys on the Continent.
> 
> Hardly an unbiased response.


In fairness I think you'll find, if you read other comments that both clubs make in response to situations like this, that they very often go on to mention that motorway service areas and aire de service camping -cars are not the same thing. While they- in common with many MHF members- don't recommend staying on motorway aires they often recommend village and town aires and many of their staff contributors use them and list them in their write-ups.

I know it's fashionable on here to knock the big clubs at every possible opportunity but lets at least try and keep to the facts.

G


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

The fundamental problem though is that the aires that we use are NOT (normally) available to caravans (although we have seen one in virtually every aire we have been to).

So the CC really CANNOT list the aires as good as for the majority of CC members they would not be allowed to use them.

We can all imagine the furore if the CC recommended their use without emphasising the no caravans ONLY FOR MH - there would be complaints immediately about favouring, bias, why does the CC promote such things which their members cannot use and so on.....

It's a non-starter really to expect the CC to publicise something which 85% (I think) of their members cannot *ever* use (legally).

We have stayed on MH service aires safely and in aires de repos in both caravans and MH but are careful about where we go - not near big cities, and if on a service aire not away from everyone else. Our thoughts are that away from cities the erks are much less likely to be present as it requires them to travel, perhaps even via the autoroute.

In the end each to their own, but to expect the CC to praise things that the majority of their members cannot use is not reasonable. *Few caravan owners would notice the "MH ONLY" notices in the CC literature and would complain vehemently afterwards*. 8O :? :lol:

Dave


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## robrace (Jun 30, 2005)

*Marina Aire*

We always stop there.Try the Le Detroit for a good meal.It,s opposite the Aire.Usually has a 18 euro Menu of the day which is pretty extensive.It's 3 courses but normally they give a "chefs compliments" dish which makes it 4 courses.Last time we were given prawns in garlic and tomato sauce.Won't be there till septmeber unfortunatly!!


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Penquin said:


> The fundamental problem though is that the aires that we use are NOT (normally) available to caravans (although we have seen one in virtually every aire we have been to).
> 
> So the CC really CANNOT list the aires as good as for the majority of CC members they would not be allowed to use them.
> 
> ...


Im not sure I agree Dave although I didnt realise that only 15% of members are motorhomers. They publish articles on Motorhomes and do reviews so they have a duty to provide information for motorhomers. Also a lot of tuggers graduate to motorhomes. They probably have no idea about Aires.

I dont see why tuggers would complain about caravans not being allowed. Its just the way it is. Not the CC's fault but that shouldnt stop them writing about it.

The magazine and website is geared more towards caravans and I suppose thats fair enough but I dont see why they couldnt write about Aires at all.


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

Penquin said:


> The fundamental problem though is that the aires that we use are NOT (normally) available to caravans (although we have seen one in virtually every aire we have been to).
> 
> Dave


It's surprising how many aires allow- or don't actively dis-allow- caravans. Many quite clearly state that they are allowed. It is fair enough that smaller ones or ones without a pull-through option are not the best place to make for with your caravan.

I think you'll also find that the main clubs are well aware of the needs of motorhomers and advertise the existence of village and town aires quite openly. They've come a long way from their tenting or caravanning only roots.

As with all stopping places and all travellers there will be some who consistently make use of motorway service areas, others, like us who use them when they are clearly designed for the purpose, and yet others who would, under no circumstances use them. Again, with the number of European travellers in caravans and motorhomes, it would be amazing if some were not robbed but that does not make it a given.

The clubs give advice on the understanding that a proportion of their members haven't got the sense they were born with and must be given quite explicit instructions !

G


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## bognormike (May 10, 2005)

*Re: Marina Aire*



robrace said:


> We always stop there.Try the Le Detroit for a good meal.It,s opposite the Aire.Usually has a 18 euro Menu of the day which is pretty extensive.It's 3 courses but normally they give a "chefs compliments" dish which makes it 4 courses.Last time we were given prawns in garlic and tomato sauce.Won't be there till septmeber unfortunatly!!


where, Rob? he didn't mention the location in the letter?? :?:


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## bognormike (May 10, 2005)

Grizzly said:


> The clubs give advice on the understanding that a proportion of their members haven't got the sense they were born with and must be given quite explicit instructions !
> 
> G


 :lol: and on how to use an Iron :!:


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## cypsygal (Dec 19, 2009)

I think he's referring to the Calais aire that is just by the yacht basin in the town. There are several restaurants opposite, including Le Detroit and Le Channel - which is very nice and swish.


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## bognormike (May 10, 2005)

and can I point out that the letter is in the Camping & Caravanning Club magazine, not the Caravan Club :idea: . The CCC are normally more relaxed about aires than the CC.


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

We stop in the Baie de Somme services and have never experienced anything untoward. We use the bay that has a caravan sign on it, are we doing an injustice to caravanners taking their spaces?

Baie de Somme


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## bognormike (May 10, 2005)

cypsygal said:


> I think he's referring to the Calais aire that is just by the yacht basin in the town. There are several restaurants opposite, including Le Detroit and Le Channel - which is very nice and swish.


Oh! it looked like he was referring to the service area with the problems... :roll:


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

bognormike said:


> Grizzly said:
> 
> 
> > The clubs give advice on the understanding that a proportion of their members haven't got the sense they were born with and must be given quite explicit instructions !
> ...


You might laugh, Mike, but how many are dropped and the fact not reported ? It's one thing when the irons are lent out from Reception: they can keep an eye on them and check they are OK after each loan. Some of the ones in continental campsites, where they are usually left in the laundry room, would, quite literally, make your hair curl if you used them !

G


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

See page 27 (Motorcaravanners-Overnight Stops) in the 2011 Caravan Club Europe 1.

_Increasingly towns and villages across Europe are providing dedicated overnight or short-stay areas specifically for motorcaravanners,....................These are known as "Aires de Services, Stellplatz or aree di sosta etc .............

For reasons of security the CC strongly advises against spending the night on petrol station service areas..... _

There is also an interesting bit that shows an understanding of the specific needs of MHers:

_Where known, information on the availablility of public transport within easy reach of a campsite is given in the site entries in this guide_

I rest my case!

G


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## cabby (May 14, 2005)

when we go over in April I am expecting to stop at Cite Europe, or if early carry on down to bolougne. we normaly use municipal sites.
last time we got to Rouen,pont-de L'arche is a pleasant site.

cabby


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## pneumatician (May 1, 2005)

Each to his own. We don't like Aires tried it twice and wild camped once and we would only repeat either in an emergency.

We much prefer a nice grass service pitch with a just sufficient hardstanding.
The neighbouring van at least 5m away, couple of Cherry trees on the pitch and bunny rabbits cavorting on the grass.
Short walk to the bar and perhaps resturant plus swimming pool of course.

Nah you can keep your car parks we will stick to camp sites.

Steve


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## locovan (Oct 17, 2007)

rayc said:


> We stop in the Baie de Somme services and have never experienced anything untoward. We use the bay that has a caravan sign on it, are we doing an injustice to caravanners taking their spaces?
> 
> Baie de Somme


My absolute Favorite Ray --where we can walk and cycle to.
We found it very safe even when we were the only Mototrhome there.
A wonderful Nature reserve.


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

pneumatician said:


> Each to his own. We don't like Aires tried it twice and wild camped once and we would only repeat either in an emergency.
> 
> We much prefer a nice grass service pitch with a just sufficient hardstanding.
> The neighbouring van at least 5m away, couple of Cherry trees on the pitch and bunny rabbits cavorting on the grass.
> ...


I would agree but on the other hand for a night stop an Aire is fine.

peedee


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## CourtJester (Aug 26, 2009)

We toured France for 3 weeks last July. One campsite stay for 2 nights. Gandspette near Calais. A very good site.
The rest of our stay was in town Aires. None were threatening, some better than others.
The really good: Broglie, Sanguinet, Bouchmaine, Pleneuf Val Andre, Mailleraye sur Seine, Mortagne sur Gironde, Le Crotoy.

The good: Oradour sur Glane, Norte sur Erdre, Pont de Saint Jacques.

Sanguinet was very pleasant indeed but we left after two nights due to the din from a 'starred' campsite about half a mile away.

Plenuef Val Andre was very pleasant. The nearby campsite was rough though. Overcrowded with pitches too close to each other.

Bayeux was a car park, but ideal for touring the town, and visiting the Tapestry.
We were disappointed with the aire in Biarritz, the dearest and the worst.

No, for us it's the town aires. Each to their own.


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

We have stopped south of sangate on the side road opposite I think cap griz blanc. Fantastic views out to sea.

As far as aires all being car parks. Don't make me laugh! Didn't you see any of my posts last summer? There are some wonderful grassy and scenic aires, plenty of space and often free. Some even have free ehu!

I'm sure there are some great campsites but equally there are some fabulous aires if you do your homework


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## CourtJester (Aug 26, 2009)

Another really good: Mailleraye sur Seine. 
Watch the boats go by... must return.


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## Traveller_HA5_3DOM (May 9, 2005)

I am sure if either of the two clubs were to endorse the use of aires there would be one of their officials appearing, like the shopkeeper from Mr.Ben, as soon as you pull up to say with that long drawn out intake of breath "Have you booked" another even longer intake of breath and turning to their partner with that immortal phrase "They haven't booked"


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## CourtJester (Aug 26, 2009)

I am a dozy bu883r, done Mailleraye s. Seine twice.


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## emmbeedee (Oct 31, 2008)

*Re: Marina Aire*



bognormike said:


> robrace said:
> 
> 
> > We always stop there.Try the Le Detroit for a good meal.It,s opposite the Aire.Usually has a 18 euro Menu of the day which is pretty extensive.It's 3 courses but normally they give a "chefs compliments" dish which makes it 4 courses.Last time we were given prawns in garlic and tomato sauce.Won't be there till septmeber unfortunatly!!
> ...


Look at the title in his post, Mike. "Marina Aire".
(Not the topic title, just the title to his post.)


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## mikebeaches (Oct 18, 2008)

Grizzly said:


> mikebeaches said:
> 
> 
> > After the letter - Donna Bloy, Product Operations Manager at Carefree, the Club's international travel service says: "The Club does not recommend spending the night at service areas or laybys on the Continent.
> ...


I do take your point Grizzly, and as you say, it does on occasions appear 'fashionable' to knock the large clubs. However, I took mild exception to your comment 'keep to the facts', because that is precisely what I did, by stating the exact wording of the CCC response to the letter in the magazine. :wink:


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## Spacerunner (Mar 18, 2006)

pneumatician said:


> Each to his own. We don't like Aires tried it twice and wild camped once and we would only repeat either in an emergency.
> 
> We much prefer a nice grass service pitch with a just sufficient hardstanding.
> The neighbouring van at least 5m away, couple of Cherry trees on the pitch and bunny rabbits cavorting on the grass.
> ...


That just illustrates your inexperience of aires.

Yes some are carparks, but all the carpark aires that I have stayed on have been very acceptable *and* very convenient for the shops.
Other aires we have stayed on would put, all but the most luxurious, campsites to shame. Some have had fresh water, waste water and EHU, on each hedged pitch, FOC. Some have had outstanding views, others enable you to meet the locals in a bar or cafe.
The trouble with campsites is that they tend to be isolated in the countryside and very difficult to tell the difference from one country to another.


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

mikebeaches said:


> I do take your point Grizzly, and as you say, it does on occasions appear 'fashionable' to knock the large clubs. However, I took mild exception to your comment 'keep to the facts', because that is precisely what I did, by stating the exact wording of the CCC response to the letter in the magazine. :wink:


Mike; I'm sorry, I wasn't really getting at you but only at the generally negative attitude that people have towards the big clubs on here, which I find so irritating. I bet that 90% of the people who have a go at them at every opportunity are members, and have never voiced their concerns to the club concerned in an e-mail or phone call.



Traveller_HA5_3DOM said:


> I am sure if either of the two clubs were to endorse the use of aires ....


There's no IF about it ! They DO endorse the use of aires etc. See the quote from CC1 which I put up earlier. They don't just _endorse;_ they_ recommend_ them as overnight or short stay places.

G
:roll:


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

Grizzly said:


> ...... I bet that 90% of the people who have a go at them at every opportunity are members, and have never voiced their concerns to the club concerned in an e-mail or phone call.
> G :roll:


As one who has knocked the CC and has complained direct about their booking system and received a very superficial response it is nice to be in the 10%...... :lol: :roll:

Dave


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

Penquin said:


> Grizzly said:
> 
> 
> > ...... I bet that 90% of the people who have a go at them at every opportunity are members, and have never voiced their concerns to the club concerned in an e-mail or phone call.
> ...


Well, at least I didn't generalise - another of my beefs on here !

Are you a member of their panel ? I joined last year and find it it quite cathartic at times.

G


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

Thankfully not, my deaings with the CC go back to 1984 when we joined, we used to get good service from them but have become increasingly disillusioned by the inability to book sites.

BUT that is an {offtopic} whinge and I do not want to detract from the thread about the C&CC letter (we are members of that too! :lol: ) but have never had the same problems with them, although they are of course smaller with fewer facilities to use..........

Dave


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

bognormike said:


> For goodnesss' sake why didn't they stop off at Calais in one of the various places recommended by MHF members, and then set off in the morning?


There are an awful lot of people who, because they have a limited holiday period, travel huge distances in one day. They don't have time or inclination to make the journey part of the holiday, as those of us retirees are lucky enough to be be able to do. We don't know whether the group concerned were in this category.

Whether they were or not it doesn't seem to me to be an excuse for club-bashing as they thread developed !

I suspect most people reading the letter would think along the lines of: "not a bright move to keep travelling so late until there is no real choice of a stopping place" and - possibly- " what bad luck to be robbed; it is a rare happening considering the number of vans on the road" and then get back to their perusal of the aires books so as to have a few possibles noted for their next journey.



Penquin said:


> Thankfully not, my deaings with the CC go back to 1984 when we joined, we used to get good service from them but have become increasingly disillusioned by the inability to book sites.


We go back a long way with them both as well: we'd be able to claim free membership of C&CC if we'd not had a few years off in the 70s, but really have had no problems booking with either club, though we usually do it by phone to the site concerned. Try the panel- it's all online !

G


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

It would appear to be just as dangerous parking up in Dorset as it is in France judging by this article. 
http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/9566798.Lorry_driver_robbed_as_he_sleeps_in_cab/


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

rayc said:


> It would appear to be just as dangerous parking up in Dorset as it is in France judging by this article.
> http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/9566798.Lorry_driver_robbed_as_he_sleeps_in_cab/


You can count the layby at the junction of the A34 and M40 in Oxfordshire as another place where this sort of thing happens. The police have it well supplied with warning notices- at one point they had a lorry, with warnings plastered on the side, parked permanently. Trouble is that it is a good place for drivers to rest as they come off a long journey from the north en route to Portsmouth and Southampton ferries.

G


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

In the early 1800s travellers into Rome were robbed frequently by banditti. The Papal authorities cut down trees close to the road to remove cover. They also had a portable guillotine and would capture these robbers, dismember them and nail their body parts onto tree stumps every mile or so. It worked very well apparently !

Now that is what I call a deterrent ! 

G :wink:


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## eddied (May 9, 2005)

Grizzly said:


> In the early 1800s travellers into Rome were robbed frequently by banditti. The Papal authorities cut down trees close to the road to remove cover. They also had a portable guillotine and would capture these robbers, dismember them and nail their body parts onto tree stumps every mile or so. It worked very well apparently !
> 
> Now that is what I call a deterrent !
> 
> G :wink:


  Typical over-reaction by the Vatican!


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Grizzly said:


> In the early 1800s travellers into Rome were robbed frequently by banditti. The Papal authorities cut down trees close to the road to remove cover. They also had a portable guillotine and would capture these robbers, dismember them and nail their body parts onto tree stumps every mile or so. It worked very well apparently !
> 
> Now that is what I call a deterrent ! G :wink:


YEAH...!!!!!!!
I like that...!!!

Ray.


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

eddied said:


> Typical over-reaction by the Vatican!


Ed! See your Italian history !! ( Vatican State=1929) This was pre -Risorgimento Italy.

( :wink: Whoops ! I'll get into trouble with some for being a pedant- again.)

G


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