# Intermittent Power Loss / 3 ltr Fiat Comfortmatic gearbox



## naunty

Hope someone out there can help. We have a 2008 Autotrail on a Fiat Ducato X250, 3 litre with Comfortmatic gearbox. Total mileage 8200. We have had it for 18 months during which time we have had an irritating intermittent fault which has showed itself about 8 times over about 6000 miles. Having said that, in actual fact there have been 2 faults which I am presuming are linked in some way. 
The first relates to a message appearing on the dashboard saying "CHECK TRANSMISSION" and at the same time a warning beep sounds. This happened when travelling along a dual carriageway at about 55mph in 6th gear. The first 2 occasions, there was no loss of power but on the 3rd occasion (today), I was travelling down a slip road, entering a motorway, in 3rd gear when the same happened but this time it lost power for about 5 seconds before resuming and picking up as normal.
The other fault which I am presuming is in some way linked to the previous one, has occurred when pulling up at a junction. As the throttle pedal is depressed, to pull away, there is no response whatsoever for about 3 or 4 seconds. Then, all of a sudden, things are back to normal. Not a great problem unless you are stationary on an incline, because you then roll back.
I've been back to the local Fiat agent on a couple of occasions and although they have had it connected up to their magical box of tricks which is supposed to diagnose all problems, their "computer say no" and they tell me that errors and fault codes are not recorded and therefore can not be retrieved. Their only hope is that when they take it for a test drive the fault shows up otherwise they haven't got a clue.
I have to say that the reason why we opted for the 3 litre + Comfortmatic in the first place was because of all the superb write-ups and reports on the unit. I still feel its a superb combination and I'm hoping these problems are mere hiccups and that someone out there can come up with some ideas.
Thanks in anticipation.


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## Hymie

*Throttle Body*

Hi Naunty,

I do not know if this is what your problem is but:

It seems that quite a few people with 3.0 ltr X250's have had to have the engine Throttle Body replaced.

The problem is well known by Fiat apparently - but of course most vehicles with the problem are out of warranty.
The fix is a modified throttle body and a new section of wiring harness.

My own van has started to disolay similar symptoms to yours but the problem so far has manifested itself for only a couple of brief moments - but i know its not right.

I have been in touch today with a company who re-manufacture loads of different throttle bodies - but as of now they do not yet cover the Fiat 3.0 - but are considering it.
If mine fails i will be contacting them again.

Happy Travels.

Dave


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## Sonesta

Hi Naunty,

We too have a motorhome with the Comfortmatic gear-box; in fact our vehicle is 1 year old today and strangely enough, like yourself, we have clocked up approx 8000 miles too. (Makes you wonder if 8000 miles is of some significance?)

Up until now the Comfortmatic gear box has performed faultlessly and my husband has been well impressed with everything about it. However, 5 days ago; whilst on holiday in Northumberland; our auto gear box suddenly dropped out of auto mode, a gear box problem symbol appeared on the dashboard, along with the warning beep that you also speak of. My husband could not manually change the gear from the 2nd gear that it was stuck in and we had to travel in 2nd gear until we found a safe place to pull up. We turned off the engine and restarted it and this appeared to correct the fault and we continued on our way, believing it to be a one off electrical blip! However, the next day whilst driving along at approx 50mph, the problem happened again, we pulled off the road into a very conveniently located car park but this time we could not clear the fault despite several attempts to do so. We called Fiat Camper Assist and they arranged a breakdown recovery vehicle to come out to us and there we sat for two and a half hours! When he arrived, we attempted to restart the vehicle and once again, like the first time this fault occurred, it had had now managed to correct itself again and everything seemed back to normal! The breakdown driver suggested we follow him to the garage and then, if during the journey, we should break down en route, at least he would be on hand to assist us! So with the recovery truck in front, off we set to The North East Truck & Van Company in Blaydon near Newcastle, who are authorised Fiat specialists. 

The journey to Newcastle was a total nightmare and several times whilst on the busy motorway and roundabouts during rush hour, our gear box dropped out of auto mode and stalled as we needed to slow down! If this wasn’t bad enough, to add to our stress, we also had to endure the impatient and angry honks and hoots from the drivers held up by our predicament! 

We arrived at North East Truck & Van around 5.30pm and despite running a 24 hour shift, there was no Fiat trained staff on duty until the following morning. However, a lovely young man; who claimed to know a little bit about Fiats, just happened to pop back into work for something he had left behind and he agreed to take a quick look at our van. He connected the electrics to his ‘magic box’ (but I don’t honestly think it told him that much) and then he asked if we would take it for a quick drive whilst he sat in the passenger seat with the electrics still connected up to the ‘magic box!’ During the journey it repeated the fault several times and he could clearly see what the problem was that we were experiencing. He said he was glad he had seen it for himself and he would now pass all this information on to his colleague in the morning because his colleague was far more knowledgeable about Fiats than he was. 

We stayed on their yard overnight. which was directly underneath a noisy flyover with the addition of a busy and equally as noisy dual carriageway running immediately alongside it too and we spent a very restless night, longing for the morning to come! 

The next morning at 8am we drove our MH around to their workshop as requested and the Fiat 'expert’ gave it a quick once over! Once again it was connected up to their 'magic diagnostics box’ and he went off saying the data would now be sent via computer to Fiat for analysis and he would return with a run down of what was required as soon as Fiat had got back to him. Several hours later, (bearing in mind that all this time we had been sat in our MH inside their noisy and smelly workshop) he returned to say he hadn’t forgotten about us but he was still waiting for Fiat to call them back and sadly, Fiat were notorious for their slow response! A few hours later, the workshop manager knocked on our MH door (we were still sat in our motorhome in their truck workshop) and said they were having problems with their IT and they were experiencing problems sending the necessary data through to Fiat! He said their computer or some website had crashed! He then explained that there was no way it would be sorted out today (Friday) so we would have to spend yet another night on their yard! We expressed our concerns about tomorrow being the start of the weekend - but he assured us that once Fiat got back to them, they could still get any parts required, even on a Saturday! 

To cut a long story short - NOTHING happened all day Saturday and all we were told was that they were having another computer sent up from another depot and that Fiat still had not got back to them and neither had any of the data been downloaded and sent to Fiat either! We spent another disturbed night attempting to sleep in their yard and as you can probably appreciate, by this time, we were both ready to pull our hair out. 

Sunday morning the manager came across to us and asked us to bring our vehicle around to the workshop. He said he had nothing new to report but he decided to once again plug our MH into the ‘magic box’ so that he could see for himself what it came up with, he knew nothing much about Fiats and confessed that nobody at his depot had ever seen a Fiat Comfortmatic Auto gear box before but he knew all about IVECO gear boxes - so maybe he would recognise something? He also admitted that the Fiat testing equipment they used was outdated and unlike the IVECO diagnostic equipment, it was all very basic and they would not be getting the latest FIAT software and equipment for a further 6 months!!!! Anyway .... his findings were, that as far as he could see, the fault had mysteriously cleared itself, so he advised us to take a chance and drive the 150 mile journey home. We were so desperate to get home by this time, that we put our faith in what he said and we set off for home within minutes of him giving us the green light! We managed approx 74 miles before the auto gear box decided to play up again and it dropped out of auto mode and woudn't come out of 6th gear! However, because we were on the A1M motorway, on a quiet Sunday, with no hold ups, we decided to keep going until we reached the next service station; which a signpost showed as being approx 20 miles on at Wetherby Services. Our engine stalled just as we slowed down to take the exit on to the services - but thankfully after a couple of attempts to restart the engine, it went into neutral and we drove into the lorry park stuck in 2nd gear!

We decided we wouldn’t ring Fiat Camper Assist this time as we hadn’t been very impressed with their service during the first call out and thankfully, we are also covered for our MH and our 2 cars with the RAC too, so this time we called the RAC instead. We explained we wanted to be recovered to Camper UK in Lincoln, as they are our motorhome dealer and they are also Fiat approved and because we know this family run business look after their customers, we trust Camper UK to sort the problem out. However, it was 3pm Sunday afternoon by now, Camper UK close at 4 and we were still 2 hours away! We decided it was best to book a RAC call out for 8am in the morning and spend the night on the lorry park of Wetherby Services instead. 

Another noisy night was spent trying to get some much needed sleep sandwiched in between noisy refrigerated lorries that come and go every 20 mins and we awoke the next morning, keen to just get our vehicle into the safe and trusted hands of Camper UK!

The RAC driver, albeit a nice enough chap, was no help whatsover though and he was about as much use as a chocolate bl**dy fireguard! The fault had once again cleared itself by the time he arrived on the scene and despite my husband and I emphasising that this was par for the course with our auto gear box problem, he seemed reluctant to request a large flat bed transporter be sent to transport our MH the 80 mile journey to Camper UK in Lincoln. He insisted, that in his opinion, our vehicle was driveable and so he suggested we stop every so often, to let the vehicle cool down and then commence on with our journey! My husband emphasised how concerned he was about slowing down or approaching roundabouts etc as experienjce had demonstrated, that it was was when the auto gearbox needed to change up or down a gear, that the problem usually occurred! The RAC guy, seemd unperterbed by our concerns and once again instructed us to plan our journey a little more vigilantly and to stop just before we knew we were going to have to make such a manouvere in order to rest the engine!!!!! With hindsight we should have put our foot down and insisted this was not acceptable - but stupidly, we took his advice and decided to give it a go, hoping that we could get as far as Lincoln before it started it’s tricks again. My husband had asked the RAC guy to escort us out of the service station and onto to the slip road that took us back onto the motorway and thank god he did because we broke down actually on the slip road and this time it would not go back into neutral no matter what we tried! The RAC guy jumped into our drivers seat but he too could not get it to shift gear either and so with a red face and a worried expression, he called someone up on his mobile for urgent assistance, as by now we were ‘parked’ in a very dangerous and unsafe spot! Eventually my hubby got our MH to go into reverse gear and we reversed into a safer spot - but there was no way we could reverse back far enough to get off the motorway.

To cut a long story short (and trust me it got far worse) a flatbed recovery truck eventually arrived 2 hours later PLUS the RAC arranged for us to have a hire car delivered onto the hard shoulder in order for my husband to drive us and our 2 dogs home and our MH is now waiting to be looked at, at Camper UK!

Like you, I hope this problem is a one off, easily rectified fault, as like yourself, we too opted for the Comfortmatic gearbox due to all the awards it won and the glowing reviews it received - but if the Fiat approved garage mechanics have no experience of working with these new automatic gear-boxes or their diagnostic equipment is not sophisticated enough to diagnose any electrical problems etc then where does that leave customers like you and I?

Apologies for my lengthy post - but I thought others who have Comfortmatic gear boxes or who are thinking of buying a motorhome and opting for the Comfortmatic might find it useful to read and hopefully if anyone is ever unfortunate enough to end up in a situation like us and they need Fiat Camper Assist, The RAC or any other breakdown recovery service - they will learn by our mistakes! 

Sue


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## emmbeedee

Wow, Sonesta, what a terrible time you had! 8O Par for the course with Fiat Customer Service though, I'm afraid.
I guess this is one in the eye for all those who said the answer to the Fiat gearbox problems was to buy the automatic. Let's hope for your sake it is a one-off & gets sorted out soon.
For my part, I'm glad I bought a Ford! No problems so far, fingers crossed! :wink:


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## Sonesta

Hi emmbeedee,

Yes - it has been a nightmare few days and we are glad to be home at the moment as you can imagine. We got back last night and my goodness it was great to turn the key in our front door!  

Well this is our 3rd Fiat based motorhome and up to now we have had no complaints or experienced any problems with the Fiat side whatsoever - so we are praying it is a one off problem that once rectified, will be the end of the matter! We have scoured the internet to see if there are any reports of problems with the new Comfortmatic and apart from one report relating to a clutch failure we cannot find any other reports relating to any problems with the Fiat Comfortmatic gear box. It does seem to be highly approved of by the industry and even the recovery guy who came out to us on the Thursday said he has been called out to recover many motorhomes during his job but he had never seen a Comfortmatic gear box before! 

I suppose all makes and brands will suffer problems and failures from time to time - so at this moment, we are trying to stay optimist and are keeping our fingers crossed that despite what's happened to us - the Comfortmatic will still live up to it's reputation? It had better do - or else we'll be in the market for a new MH that's for sure!  

Glad you are happy with your choice and we have a Ford S Max car with an automatic gearbox and we can vouch for the Ford engine also! 

Sue


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## javea

Jaunty,

I don't believe what you were told about fault codes not being stored. I had a problem with the engine management light illuminating yellow in Northern Spain last year. Stuart at Camper UK advised me that it was probably a glitch caused by the third fan not coming on when it should.
Advised me to continue carefully unless light turned red. Good advice,
Fiat in Denia turned the light out, took van into Camper UK last week, they were able to retrieve the fault which was stored in the ECU, it was the fan, electronic glitch.

Sue, Sorry to hear of your nightmare scenario, your vehicle is certainly now in the right place to get the problem sorted. Hope it doesn't take long.

Mike


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## naunty

*Intermittent Power Loss*

Hi Sonesta,
I thought I had a problem - what a nightmare. I Hope yours gets sorted quick, and I would love to hear the outcome - you will have to keep us updated. We also travel with 2 dogs, so my wife would have been to take away, although we always keep a couple of bottles of wine to hand for such emergencies!!
Well, the latest update on our problems would tend to suggest that our problem may be on its way to being sorted.
I took it into Springfield Fiat, Washington, Tyne and Wear yesterday and they have been out in it a few times with the 'magic box' connected and lo and behold it happened - they experienced the fault. 
Forgive me if I don't get the technical terms right, but they have tracked down the fault to a faulty/rogue brake sensor. They have said that the engine and gearbox are absolutely fine which is why no fault codes were initially recorded. (Incidentally - the only time fault codes are recorded, is if there is a problem which puts the engine management light on the dashboard). The reason why there was a loss of engine power was because there is a built in safety system which, on sensing a problem, puts the engine/gearbox into 'safe mode', in order to prevent any potential damage occuringto the engine or gearbox. This certainly makes sense because once the temporary fault on the brake sensor resets itself, the engine then picks up to operate as normal. I'm keeping my fingers crossed. I will post the final result.
I'm just wondering if the explanation given to me can apply in any way to your problem. :?: Thanks again.


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## naunty

Hi Javea,
Sorry - our messages seem to have just crossed in the ether. 
As I mentioned, in my last post, and as you correctly say, fault codes will be stored providing the engine management light illuminates, and the problem relates to the engine. The problem arises when the fault is not directly linked to the engine.

Thanks again


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## Sonesta

Hi Naunty, 

So glad to hear you might be on the road to recovery and I will keep my fingers and toes crossed for you. 

Thankfully, we had a few bottles of wine in the motorhome (great minds think alike :wink: ) and of course we had to drink a few glasses to help knock us out due to all the traffic noise (well that's our excuse anyway!) :lol: 

I am not at all technical and so any info I post comes directly from my hubby - but he informs me that all the mechanics who have looked at our problem so far, say that in their opinion, there is nothing at all mechanically wrong with the gearbox/engine/cluctch etc and it is basically an electronic fault somewhere in the system. 

My better half says he has noticed that our particular fault usually occurs under acceleration or going up an incline - so basically, when the engine is having to work a bit harder!

I will keep you updated and you too keep us all informed of your situation too and let's hope we are both back up and running again soon!

All the best.  

Sue


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## TickTok

*Re: Intermittent Power Loss*



naunty said:


> Hope someone out there can help. We have a 2008 Autotrail on a Fiat Ducato X250, 3 litre with Comfortmatic gearbox. Total mileage 8200. We have had it for 18 months during which time we have had an irritating intermittent fault which has showed itself about 8 times over about 6000 miles. Having said that, in actual fact there have been 2 faults which I am presuming are linked in some way.
> The first relates to a message appearing on the dashboard saying "CHECK TRANSMISSION" and at the same time a warning beep sounds. This happened when travelling along a dual carriageway at about 55mph in 6th gear. The first 2 occasions, there was no loss of power but on the 3rd occasion (today), I was travelling down a slip road, entering a motorway, in 3rd gear when the same happened but this time it lost power for about 5 seconds before resuming and picking up as normal.
> The other fault which I am presuming is in some way linked to the previous one, has occurred when pulling up at a junction. As the throttle pedal is depressed, to pull away, there is no response whatsoever for about 3 or 4 seconds. Then, all of a sudden, things are back to normal. Not a great problem unless you are stationary on an incline, because you then roll back.
> I've been back to the local Fiat agent on a couple of occasions and although they have had it connected up to their magical box of tricks which is supposed to diagnose all problems, their "computer say no" and they tell me that errors and fault codes are not recorded and therefore can not be retrieved. Their only hope is that when they take it for a test drive the fault shows up otherwise they haven't got a clue.
> I have to say that the reason why we opted for the 3 litre + Comfortmatic in the first place was because of all the superb write-ups and reports on the unit. I still feel its a superb combination and I'm hoping these problems are mere hiccups and that someone out there can come up with some ideas.
> Thanks in anticipation.


Hi

I have had the same symptoms on a Ducato 2.8, and true the fault wasn't stored on the computer, but the fitter had come accros this before and fitted a accelerator pedal sender unit and fingers crossed it seem to have cured it.

Funny thing, the same thing has happened three times on the wifes Ford Focus and that fault was stored but didn't say if it was the sender or receiver, but if I spread enough money on it it may go away!!


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## Jezport

I found a guy who is amazing with auto transmissions. I had a new transmission and torque converter in my cougar and he really know his stuff. He does a lot of manufacturers work that the main agents cant do. Four years on my transmission is still great.

He is called Martin Lowe, and it may be worth calling him. Tell him Jeremy with the Cougar in Leeds recommended him. http://www.autotransmissions.co.uk/


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## naunty

Jezport said:


> I found a guy who is amazing with auto transmissions. I had a new transmission and torque converter in my cougar and he really know his stuff. He does a lot of manufacturers work that the main agents cant do. Four years on my transmission is still great.
> 
> He is called Martin Lowe, and it may be worth calling him. Tell him Jeremy with the Cougar in Leeds recommended him. http://www.autotransmissions.co.uk/


Thanks for that Jezport, I will certainly keep his details handy, but I have to let Springfield do their stuff because I'm still under warranty. I think Sonesta may also make a note of his details.

Thanks again


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## Sonesta

Yes indeed, thank you Jezport for that info and as with Naunty; our van is still under warranty but it's always useful to know of respected tradesmen for future reference. I bet there will be many people who read this post, who will make a note of this guys tel number. 

Thanks again and we hope to see you and your family at one of this years MHF meets or rallies. 

Sue


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## Jezport

If you need to speak to someone about auto transmissions Martin is always pleased to advise over the phone.


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## Sonesta

LATEST UPDATE: 

We have just had a telephone call from Fiat's Customer Care department and a very nice gentleman wanted to know exactly what had happened and was very concerned to learn that we had been left stranded in the North East Van & Truck near Gateshead for almost 4 days! He was also very shocked to learn that we had been actively encouraged by both the North East Van & Truck Company and the RAC to drive a vehicle along a busy motorway when our vehicle was clearly experiencing problems. This obviously put us, our vehicle and our safety in enormous jeopardy and he seemed genuinely worried by how our case had been handled. I explained that our vehicle was now in the safe and capable hands of Camper UK in Lincoln. I explained that Camper UK were quite busy with new vehicles going out this week but as soon as they had a spare slot, they were going to look at it. The gentleman from Fiat said he would make further investigations and get back to me asap.

Within half an hour of us speaking to this gentleman from Fiat, Karen at Camper UK called me to say that Fiat themselves had just rung them to say they were actually going over to Camper UK on Friday to inspect our vehicle for themselves! Karen was quite excited about this as she said nobody from Fiat had ever been out to them before and a personal approach such as this was quite unusual.

I will keep you all informed of what transpires but at the moment we are feeling a lot happier and we are impressed by Fiat's Customer Care response.

Sue


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## RichardandMary

Hi Sue

We had a similar response from Fiat Customer Care. We had been repeatedly taking our Motorhome to the Fiat main agents from new (18 months) because the engine omitted copious amounts of black smoke under acceleration only to be told that nothing was showing on their diagnostic tools so therefore there was nothing wrong & that X250s had a tendency to smoke.   We eventually contacted Fiat Customer Care who said they were disgusted by this response & promised to send one of their technicians to the garage to check it out, 2 days later he arrived spent the day working on it couldn’t find anything wrong but agreed that the smoke was excessive so ordered a new full engine fitted   total cost to Fiat of £5,200, this engine was ordered, arrived & fitted within 10 days problem is now solved wish I had contacted them earlier.
Hope that your problem is quickly resolved.

Regards

R/M


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## Sonesta

RichardandMary said:


> Hi Sue
> 
> We had a similar response from Fiat Customer Care. We had been repeatedly taking our Motorhome to the Fiat main agents from new (18 months) because the engine omitted copious amounts of black smoke under acceleration only to be told that nothing was showing on their diagnostic tools so therefore there was nothing wrong & that X250s had a tendency to smoke.   We eventually contacted Fiat Customer Care who said they were disgusted by this response & promised to send one of their technicians to the garage to check it out, 2 days later he arrived spent the day working on it couldn't find anything wrong but agreed that the smoke was excessive so ordered a new full engine fitted   total cost to Fiat of £5,200, this engine was ordered, arrived & fitted within 10 days problem is now solved wish I had contacted them earlier.
> Hope that your problem is quickly resolved.
> 
> Regards
> 
> R/M


Hi R/M,

Thank you for that information and it was very encouraging to read how delighted you were with Fiat Customer Care and even more encouraging to learn how far they went in order to resolve your problem to your satisfaction.

We felt enormous relief as soon as we knew our motorhome was being recovered to Camper UK, as we knew that they would give us excellent after sales service and leave no stone unturned in trying to get us back on the road asap - but knowing we also have the support of the Fiat Customer Care team behind us too, has really helped to give us even greater confidence that our problem will be rectified as quickly as possible now.

I am glad you are all sorted and once again .... thank you. 

Sue


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## Spacerunner

I also have experienced Fiat Camper Assist and have to say I was very impressed. Guess we got the good guys first shot. Their help included a stay in a hotel and car hire.
I did get a humourous telling off by our German lady dealing with the case. One of the calls I made I pressed '1' instead of '3' for the Camper Assist. She reprimanded me and said '1' was for complaints but '3' was where we (Fiat) help and look after you.

Again Fiat sent their own technicians to solve a duff ECU, with which we have had no problems since, that was two years ago.

Hope you get a good fix asap, the Fiat techs seem to know their onions.


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## naunty

*LATEST UPDATE - SORTED (we hope)*

Just picked it up and now back home and, fingers crossed, touch wood etc etc, it seems OK. Springfield Fiat are confident that it was the Brake Sensor Switch (now that could just be the kiss of death).

Well only time will tell. We're heading off to Keswick on the 15th so it will get a 200 mile test drive and I'll tell you more then.

According to Fiat, this problem with the Brake Sensor Switch is known to them but for some unknown reason, they were unable to put 2 and 2 together on this occasion. (They'll definitely know next time :lol: )

For the information of everyone out there, this problem is apparently restricted to the 3 ltr version with Comfortmatic box.

Thanks to everyone who contributed.

Alan


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## Sonesta

Hi Alan,

Glad to hear you are all sorted and fingers crossed this is the end of your problem now? :thumbright:

I think we must all be the same whenever we experience a fault or a problem with a vehicle or any other appliance for that matter and it takes a while for most of us to feel 100% confident that the problem won't return! I know I am from that school of thought, so I must bf a bit of a pessimist re such things? 

Enjoy your trip. 

Sue



Spacerunner said:


> I also have experienced Fiat Camper Assist and have to say I was very impressed. Guess we got the good guys first shot. Their help included a stay in a hotel and car hire.
> I did get a humourous telling off by our German lady dealing with the case. One of the calls I made I pressed '1' instead of '3' for the Camper Assist. She reprimanded me and said '1' was for complaints but '3' was where we (Fiat) help and look after you.
> 
> Again Fiat sent their own technicians to solve a duff ECU, with which we have had no problems since, that was two years ago.
> 
> Hope you get a good fix asap, the Fiat techs seem to know their onions.


Thanks Spacerunner. I'm so happy to read of yet another satisfied Fiat customer and as this is our first ever problem re the Fiat side of any of our previous Fiat based motorhomes, it is very reassuring to hear such glowing reports.

Thanks again. 

Sue


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## trevd01

Sue

I've sent you the pdf of the Comfortmatic handbook supplement.


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## Mike48

As a Comfortmatic owner I'm interested in the outcome of Sue's problem. One point I have observed is that, while there is a 3 year warranty in place, the Comfortmatic box is only under warranty for 2 years.


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## teemyob

gelathae said:


> As a Comfortmatic owner I'm interested in the outcome of Sue's problem. One point I have observed is that, while there is a 3 year warranty in place, the Comfortmatic box is only under warranty for 2 years.


How cheeky is that!?


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## Sonesta

LATEST UPDATE!

On Friday of last week the Fiat Mechanic came over as promised to Camper UK in order to inspect our vehicle's Comfortmatic gearbox problem and he concluded that it was the gearbox sensor that had failed. A new sensor was ordered and this arrived to Camper UK first thing on Monday morning. We were impressed with how quickly Fiat had sent this part out, as we feared it may have to be ordered in from Italy! So, we started the week out feeling happy and quietly positive! 

The sensor has now been fitted but unfortunately, after taking our van out for an hours test run yesterday, the mechanic at Camper UK was still not happy with its performance and so it's now back to the drawing board to investigate the problem further! 

We have since spoken to David at Fiat Customer Care and we are now waiting for him get back to us regarding what happens and where we go from here!

We are NOT happy bunnies at the moment as you can probably all imagine? Especially, as on top of having our holiday around Northumberland ruined by the gearbox failure, it looks increasingly likely that this weekends trip away, which was to be our first ever and much look forward to motorhome trip away with our little grandson, plus we are also attending an important family members 40th birthday bash, will now have to be cancelled! If we have to stay in a hotel for the 3 nights (which I would prefer not to) it's going to cost us approx £240! Plus we cannot take our 2 dogs to a hotel, so they will have to go into kennels, which is another £60! Why should we have to fork out over £300, plus have all the clat and inconvenience of packing a suitcase etc, when we have purchased a £90,000 MH for such occasions? Aargh! I could scream! 

Anyway, that's it for now - but for those who are interested in following this thread; I'll keep coming back with further updates as and when I have anything new to report. 

Sue


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## Rapide561

*Fiat*

Sue

Thanks for a detailed report and I hope this gets sorted for you. Make sure you ask, no tell, Fiat that you want vouchers for free servicing etc.

ALL - breaking down with a dog on board can be a nightmare - note that the recovery firms are not obliged to carry dogs. When I broke down, the recovery firm contracted to the RAC did however agree to carry Jenny in the lorry.

Russell


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## Sonesta

Thanks Russell for that suggestion. :thumbright:

To be honest we hadn't really thought about anything like that but thinking about it, they really should make some offer of recompense I agree! 

Still love our MH though but there have been times during all this, that I could have quite easily sent her back to whence she came! I don't know if you remember the classic scene in Fawlty Towers; whereby John Cleese; in his tormented frustration, began whipping his broken down mini with a twig? Well if you do - then that is exactly what I felt like doing to our Elegance at the time! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Now I've calmed down, I miss her terribly and just want her home; fit and well and back to where she belongs!  I know it's pathetic to get so attached to an 'inanimate object' but I don't think I'm alone in my affections? Or AM I? :roll:

Sue


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## bognormike

I've edited the title of this to highlight the 3 litre comformatic problem, and moved it to the engine / gearbox forum so it's in the same place as the thread about the gearbox failure.


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## bognormike

and here's clipper's thread

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftoptitle-103153-gearbox-gone-3lt-auto-fiat.html


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## Sonesta

QUICK UPDATE:

The lovely Karen from Camper UK has just rang me and Fiat are sending out another of their own guys to take another look at our Comfortmatic gearbox tomorrow. 

I will update you as soon as I have more news to report!

Sue


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## Sonesta

TODAY'S UPDATE:

As you who have been following this topic are aware; the Fiat mechanic diagnosed a faulty gear sensor after his first inspection and this part was subsequently fitted earlier this week. Unfortunately, his diagnosis proved to be the wrong one and the issue was not resolved! 

Another visit was arranged by Fiat Customer Care and a Fiat mechanic has been out to Camper UK again today and his verdict is that the 3rd gear needs replacing! My husband was not happy with this diagnosis, as this did not tally with the problem we ourselves had experienced when we broke down and had to call out Fiat Camper Assist! Our problem was that it kept dropping out of auto mode and we could not manually get it to change gear and it stuck in either 2nd or 4th. We at no time had any problem with the 3rd gear, it was mainly 2nd and 4th, occasionally 6th and also neutral that we had problems getting the automatic gearbox to get out of or go into! Now with the fault clearing sometimes after turning off the ignition and restarting it again, my husband assumed it must be an electrical fault, especially as there was no corresponding noises or rattles that one would normally expect with any mechanical related failure! My husband has a little bit of maintenance know how about car engines and the like but his knowledge is only basic run of the mill stuff and he's certainly no expert by a long shot! His main concerns however, were that he could see this problem becoming an ongoing one and feared that this latest diagnosis by the Fiat mechanic was nothing more than trial and error guesswork! :?

We again spoke to David at Fiat Customer Care about today's outcome and my husband expressed his concerns regarding all the above and David promised to talk to the Fiat mechanic in question to get a better insight into what his findings were etc.

Karen at Camper UK called us just before they closed for the day to inform us that after speaking with Fiat, Fiat have now given them the go ahead to fit a complete new gearbox! This has had to be ordered in from Italy and should be delivered to Camper UK by Tuesday of next week. It's a big job apparently and Camper UK have promised to do their upmost to complete it as soon as possible for us but we appreciate they are a busy company and have other pre booked jobs to attend to besides ours. We just hope this resolves the problem once and for all for us and we truly hope that our problem turns out to be a one off rare occurrence! 

I will keep you all updated as to how it all goes but in the meantime I just want to say thank you to Camper UK and David at Fiat Customer Care for all their co-operation and genuine concerns. And despite our extreme disappointment at suffering such a serious problem on such a new vehicle, we could not have received or expected better service from either David or Camper UK! 

Sue


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## Jezport

If Fiat have any sense (debatable) they should put your old transnission into a test vehicle and work out exactly what is wrong. The fitting of a new transmission is definatly a good thing for you but it does not solve the issue of what is wrong with your old one, and if other owners suffer the same issues when their van is out of warranty a new transmission will be extremly expensive.


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## Sonesta

Hi Jezport,

Thanks for your sharing your thoughts and concerns. 

I presume Fiat will want to get to the bottom of the problem and pinpoint exactly what has gone wrong, as it is bound to be in their best interest to do so? The Comfortmatic gearbox has received glowing reports from the motorhome industry and has won several prestigious awards to date, so I daresay Fiat will be keen to uphold the Comfortmatics valued reputation in the market???

Like you say, it will be a very expensive repair if this problem occurs when a vehicle is out of warranty, so fingers crossed, Fiat will identify what caused it, so as to ensure any potential problems can be corrected by way of a recall if deemed necessary. 

We have yet to ascertain whether the new gearbox will benefit from a brand new warranty but we will not be happy if we discover that it doesn't! 

I will keep you updated.

Sue


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## Mike48

If its any consolation a hire fleet service manager over on the MMM board has several Fiat Comfortmatics with high mileages and he has nothing but praise for the gearbox. In fact it was his glowing comments that finally persuaded me to go down the Fiat route and buy the Comfortmatic as long as it was constructed post late 2009 after which a different clutch plate was used. 

I'm hopeful Sonesta's experience was isolated although I must admit that her problems sound electrical rather than the mechanical diagnosis but I presume the fiat experts know what they are doing. 

Keep us updated Sonesta as your experience might help others who might not have been able to get the level of high level assistance she has managed to receive.

Hope its sorted soon.


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## Sonesta

Thanks Gelathae,

Yes - it was all the glowing reviews that persuaded us to opt for the Comfortmatic too and up until our problem, we had no complaints whatsoever. It drove like a dream and we were impressed by it's performance. 

I truly hope the problem is resolved by the fitting of the new gearbox but I must confess we are slightly dubious that the diagnosis fits the problem we experienced but as you say, one would expect the Fiat experts to know their stuff? 

Watch this space and I'll report back as and when.

Sue


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## Jezport

As a driver of a conventional automatic (torque converter type) I was always told that they are twice more likely to fail than a manual and 3 times more expensive to fix.

I have had one repair on a 110000mile GM transmission £30 and one complete replacement on a Ford 72000mile transmission £1400. But never had an issue with any manuals.

I dont know if comfortmatic is any better. They have used robotised transmissions in the Ferrari for years without major issues.


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## coppo

Jezport said:


> As a driver of a conventional automatic (torque converter type) I was always told that they are twice more likely to fail than a manual and 3 times more expensive to fix.
> 
> I have had one repair on a 110000mile GM transmission £30 and one complete replacement on a Ford 72000mile transmission £1400. But never had an issue with any manuals.
> 
> I dont know if comfortmatic is any better. They have used robotised transmissions in the Ferrari for years without major issues.


Yes thats exactly what we were told by numerous people so we specifically sourced a manual.

Although there's obviously no guarantee that it will not go wrong, just less chance.

Paul.


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## Sonesta

LATEST UPDATE:

Well Karen from Camper UK called me on Tuesday to let me know that the replacement Comfortmatic gearbox had arrived to them from Italy as promised! Karen explained that Stewart; one of their mechanics, would commence work on it asap. It was a big job but our motorhome was already up on the ramp and Karen promised she would keep us updated of any work in progress.

True to her word - the very next day Karen rang again to give us that days run down and she was delighted to be able to report that despite their busy timetable, Stewart had managed a good few hours working on our MH that day and the job was progressing satisfactorily.

Today Karen rang at the end of the day and I could immediatelty tell from the sound of her voice that something wasn't right! She said "Mrs Gill, it's Karen at Camper UK, Stewart's completed the job on your vehicle and has just taken it for a test drive and it's NOT good news I'm afraid and it's still doing exactly what it did before Stewart fitted the brand new gearbox!" She commented how disappointed Stewart was, especially as he had spent the last 3 days painstakingly working on our van and fitting the replacement gearbox! 

Obviously, we do not hold Stewart or anyone else at Camper UK responsible for any of this, as they have only been working on the instructions and guidance from Fiat themselves and to be fair, Camper UK have been excellent throughout this whole ordeal! So - as peed off as we both are at being off the road now for nearly a month, we cannot direct our frustrations at anyone at Camper UK! No - it's Fiat themselves that our concerns are aimed towards, especially as one of their 'experts' has now been out twice to Camper UK to inspect our vehicle and on BOTH occasions the diagnosis and subsequent 'fix' has turned out to be completely wrong! It seems to us that even Fiat themselves do NOT appear to have a clue what the particular problem is with our gearbox and that really worries us greatly, especially as this problem could go on and on whilst Fiat slowly discover the source of the problem through a continuation of these process of elimination fixes! :roll:

Like I say, we have been off the road now for nearly a month and during this time we have had our holiday around Northumberland cut short, a weekend trip away to a family celebration spoilt, the chance of an impromptu few days away joining our best friends with their motorhome and next week, we were planning a trip away with our 21 month old grandson, which clearly is NOT going to happen now! 

Like my brother pointed out to us today, it is not like our vehicle is off the road due to it being involved in a road traffic accident or something similar is it? And like he said, the reason our vehicle is unroadworthy, is due to a major gearbox failure which has occurred during our vehicles first year and whilst still under warranty! Therefore, as my brother quite rightly suggested, there is no acceptable excuse for us having to be inconvenienced like we are being doing and it is simply NOT good enough that Fiat are playing some kind of guessing game and that their own in house tehnicians/mechanics are unable to pinpoint and rectify in a reasonable amount of time, EXACTLY what the problem is!

I don't know what will happen or where we go from here but Karen said they will contact Fiat again tomorrow and so once again, we are right back where we started! 

All I know is that we want to be able to use and enjoy our motorhome like we expected to and be free to go off at a moments notice as and when the opportunity arises! We are NOT happy that this is being denied to us right now and our patience and tolerance has definitely been tested to it's limit! What would others do in our situation and what would you expect, want or think Fiat should do about it?

Cheers. 

Sue


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## wakk44

Oh dear Sue,what a nightmare  

It really is unacceptable to be inconvenienced as you and Gilbert have been for the last few weeks.Notwithstanding the fact that yours is an expensive vehicle,only a year old and still well within the warranty period.

Fiat seem to be incompetent and are changing parts on a trial and error basis to try and solve the problem.It can't be long before the ''not fit for purpose'' law comes into play and a replacement vehicle would be appropriate.

I think that the least Camper UK can do is provide you with an equivalent motorhome on loan until yours is repaired satisfactorily.They do sound like a good company from your concise reports so perhaps an approach to the MD would be advisable.


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## Mike48

Sonesta. This is a shocker. Everyone is trying their best to no avail.

From the details provided the problem seems to be electrical and I wouldn't mind betting that its something incredibly minor such as a snagged wire in a loom or something equally small. The problem is finding it. 

CamperUK are in an awkward position here because they receive zilch from Fiat for diagnostic work so its vital you keep them motivated. In this regard I wonder whether borrowing a van might place your's on the back burner. 

It's a difficult situation and I haven't a clue what I would do in your position other than the action you are taking by keeping in touch with Camper UK and Fiat.

A useful contact for you in Fiat UK might be Barry Paxton at Fiat House 240 Bath Road Slough S4 4DX who is the UK Warranty Manager. He helped sort out a problem caused by either my manufacturer and or my dealer in getting the details of my vehicle completely wrong on my Registration documents and seemed a helpful kind of chap.

I suggest you contact him if you feel Fiat are running out of ideas and start fobbing you off. At the moment they seem motivated but you never know what might happen in the future.


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## Sonesta

Thanks Steve & Gelthae,

We are at a loss as to what to do for the best but we certainly feel that some kind of action must be taken on our part now as otherwise, this could go on and on indefinitely! 

We really do not want to be loaned a courtesy vehicle to be honest, as apart from all the clat of having to transfer all of our personal items from our own vehicle into the loan one, we also have so many extras added to our own van that enhance our motorhome's versatility and comfort and we really don't relish the idea of setting off on our travels with a vehicle fitted with only the factory fitted basics! 

We are hoping to hear some news from Fiat today as to what they intend to do next but unless it's something that finally puts us back on the road in our own vehicle once and for all then we won't be at all satisfied! 

Could we really go down the route of "not fit for the purpose" and what exactly does that mean in real terms? Would whoever is deemed responsible fit or transfer all the extras we've added such as gaslow, solar panel, on board genny, awning, Oyster twin LNB, towball, tracker, strikeback alarm etc free of charge or would we be expected to cough up for those again?

Oh it is so frustrating and we both feel thoroughly cheesed off with it all! 

Thanks for listening to me rattle on!

Sue


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## erneboy

I don't think you can reject it as not fit for purpose without first giving them time to fix it. As to how long that should be I think it's flexible but more or less as long as they are trying or are willing to try.

I am very sorry to see this problem, it just further reduces my confidence in Fiat and their products. It seems to me that there may be lots of very expensive problems being stored up for 3 litre owners as our vehicles get older, Alan.


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## javea

Hi Sue,

So sorry to hear that your problem has not been solved.

I am no mechanic but looking at the problem in a logical manner it seems to me that the transmission is comprised of two parts; the gearbox itself and the electronic components which control it.

The gearbox has been changed so unless the replacement is faulty which is very unlikely, then the problem must be with the electronic part. Surely the obvious course of action is for Fiat to supply a complete replacement for this part of the transmission, to rip out all the original electronics and replace them with new.

As they are the specialists, and the ones who created the problem in the first place perhaps they should send their specialists to Camper UK to do the work themselves, no criticism of that company implied or intended, I have total confidence in them myself, but why shouldn't Fiat sort it out with their 'specialists'.

I do hope it will be sorted in the very near future as it must be a constant worry for you both.

Mike


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## Burneyinn

Hi Sue,

We can appreciate your frustration. We had a lot of warranty issues with our van which meant that we kept going backwards and forwards to Camper UK. Fortunately these were all rectified and our van is now A1, but they pale into insignificance with your problems.

I hope they find a solution for you soon. The only consolation is that you are in the hands of the best dealer.

J&A


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## ched999uk

As others have said Camper UK have been very good at trying to fit you in around their other work. The real issue is Fiat and their inability to identify the problem.
The other snag is that I believe that your 'contract' is with the company you purchased the vehicle off!! So on a 'fit for purpose' basis its the seller that takes the loss. OK so they will get compensated by Fiat but not on their profit. Plus you have had lots of time, expense and effort getting the vehicle as you want.

I realise it is so frustrating but at the moment they are still trying to fix the vehicle. This as I understand it means that you can't claim it's not 'fit for purpose'. Unfortunately you are in a bit of a sticky situation. I would have a chat to your local Trading Standards officer. They are very helpful and will give you some good advice on what you can and cannot expect. The advice may help if Fiat/Camper UK start fobbing you off. So even though you may not need the advice, forearmed is forewarned!!!!

The problem, as I see it is that these vehicles are now so complex they can't actually diagnose problems correctly as the ECU just stores a fault number, if any, and then it's judgement that 'guesses' what caused the fault code to be generated. That could be a faulty sensor or a cable or even something not related!!

I hope you get your MH fixed, you receive compensation and it all happens fast.

Good Luck


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## Sonesta

javea said:


> Hi Sue,
> 
> So sorry to hear that your problem has not been solved.
> 
> I am no mechanic but looking at the problem in a logical manner it seems to me that the transmission is comprised of two parts; the gearbox itself and the electronic components which control it.
> 
> The gearbox has been changed so unless the replacement is faulty which is very unlikely, then the problem must be with the electronic part. Surely the obvious course of action is for Fiat to supply a complete replacement for this part of the transmission, to rip out all the original electronics and replace them with new.
> 
> As they are the specialists, and the ones who created the problem in the first place perhaps they should send their specialists to Camper UK to do the work themselves, no criticism of that company implied or intended, I have total confidence in them myself, but why shouldn't Fiat sort it out with their 'specialists'.
> 
> I do hope it will be sorted in the very near future as it must be a constant worry for you both.
> 
> Mike


Thanks Mike and I must say that my husband agrees wholeheartedly with your suggestion that Fiat should replace all of the electronic components relating to the gearbox as otherwise he foresees these fault finding exercises could go on for weeks and weeks! 8O

As for Fiat sending their own specialists over to Camper UK to fit it, again that would be a good idea, as obviously Camper UK have other work booked in and there's only so much time and manpower that a small, family run business can allocate to unexpected jobs such as ours!

Thanks everyone for your words of advice and it's reassuring to hear what others think and although it doesn't change our current situation, it sure helps to get it off our chests and listen to sensible suggestions.

We really do not want to go down the "not fit for purpose route" so even though it sounds quite a complicated process, I don't think even if it were an easy route, it would be the solution we would strive for, especially as we have no axe to grind with Camper UK! All we want is just to get our MH fixed and back on the road again asap!

Thanks again. 

Sue


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## Sonesta

UPDATE:

No news to report at the moment other than Fiat rang Camper UK late on Friday to inform them that they will be sending a Fiat specialist to have another look at it next Wednesday!  To be honest we are NOT happy about this as by the time he has looked at it again, made his diagnosis and then ordered whatever part/parts he considers are required, plus obviously getting it/them fitted, we will then be into our SECOND month without a motorhome! What if like with the previous attempts to fix our gearbox their new diagnosis doesn't correct the problem - what happens then? :roll: 

Dean who is Camper UK's sales director telephoned us on Saturday morning to express his concerns over all the problems we are having getting our vehicle repaired by Fiat and he advised us that although it was a Fiat related fault, we were also a Camper UK customer who had purchased a Burstner motorhome from them and so he was going to contact Burstner on our behalf to inform them of our situation and to ask for their advice as to where we go from here. I am so happy that at least we have a good dealer on our side as it must be doubly stressful if you have a dealer who does not offer good after sales care!

Unfortunately, we have now missed out on yet another weekend away in our motorhome and with the weather being so nice at the moment, we feel even more cheesed off and fed up. It doesn't help that my best friend Nette (Briarose as she is known as on the forum) is away at the moment in her motorhome and on Saturday morning she sent us a photo on her mobile, along with a text saying "This is the life Sue" and the photograph was of them all sat outside in the sunshine enjoying a full english and to cap it all, it was that sunny she was wearing her sunglasses! Talk about rubbing salt in the wounds. :roll: 

I will give the next update when I have more news to report.

Sue

EDIT: We rang Fiat Customer Care several times last week to ask someone to call us back urgently - but as yet we have not heard a word - so I sent an email asking them to contact us, which as yet, hasn't been replied to either!


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## SaddleTramp

Sue, We are so sorry as both Chris and I know how much you loved your MH, I was pleased to hear from you today but when you told me the grim news it sort of put a cloud over it, I do hope everything works out OK and I know from our conversation today that CamperUK is doing everything possible for you, It is a good job you bought from such a good company, it is a pity all the companies you bought from are not as helpful 8O.
If I can do anything at all to help in ANY way please don't hesitate to ask.

I am so looking forward to seeing you soon and under better circumstances, We will empty a glass or two and it will make things appear better even if only for a short while.


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## Perseus

Saddletramp, I have sent you a PM


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## Sonesta

LATEST UPDATE:

Hi,

I will post a full report tomorrow as it's the early hours and I'm absolutely shattered and ready for some much needed sleep! So this is just a quick update:

We collected our 'repaired by a Fiat specialist' vehicle from Camper UK on Friday then drove approx 20 miles to Newark to attend the Newark motorhome show for the weekend and everything seemed to be working as it should. We enjoyed a great weekend and left Newark for home on Monday around midday. After approx 50 miles; suddenly to our horror our MH started revving and dropped into neutral, displaying EXACTLY the same gearbox problem as it did originally! It has now been recovered back to Camper UK again! 

Like I say - I will go into more details tomorrow but what I must say is that Camper UK have been absolutely fantastic but I will tell you more about their fabulous customer service and the latest Comfortmatic breakdown saga when I can keep my eyes open long enough to write it. 

Sue


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## Sonesta

Hi,

As promised here is my full report:

As those who have been following my thread already know, a brand new gearbox (value £2,500) was fitted following the advice of the Fiat Specialist who was sent over to Camper UK for the 2nd time and as you all know this second fix did NOT correct the problem either! 

The Fiat technician came out again last Wednesday to Camper UK and he decided that following the fitting of the new gearbox, some kind of resetting on the biting point of the clutch was all that was required! This was done and after a long test drive, the problem was declared as finally being resolved! Karen from Camper UK rang us and was delighted to inform us that our vehicle was fit and well again! 

We collected our MH on Friday and as I mentioned in my previous post, we decided to head off to the Newark Motorhome Show for the weekend. Our vehicle performed faultlessly during the 20 mile journey to Newark, so we arrived at the showground 2 very happy bunnies indeed!  Hooray we thought, we are back on the road again and free to do what we love doing!  We really had a fun weekend and we stayed on until Monday and met up on Sunday evening for a few drinks with some MHF friends. 

We headed off for home on Monday around midday and as we had driven to collect our MH from Camper UK in our car on the Friday, I went on ahead in the car and Gilbert drove home in the MH.  As soon as I got into the house the home phone was ringing. It was Gilbert ringing from a roadside cafe in the Wolds saying the MH had broken down again and he was in an area which had no signal on his mobile, so he'd had to ask a local cafe owner if he could use her telephone! He sounded really stressed out and of course he needed me to do all the ringing around to Fiat Assist and Camper UK etc as where he was he could do absolutely zilch without a phone signal.

From what I could gather he had been driving along at approx 50 mph when suddenly the engine started revving and the gearbox dropped into neutral. He took his foot off the accelerator and just had to let it coast along to a little lay-by a few yards further on but the MH rear end was sticking out precariously into the road, so it really wasn't a safe spot to stay. He turned off the ignition and restarted the engine and just like before, the fault had now cleared, so he drove a further few hundred yards to where he found a large carpark in front of a cafe! 

As our MH was unsafe to drive due to not knowing when it could suddenly drop out of auto mode again, it needed to be recovered back to Camper UK on a flatbed recovery truck as there was absolutely NO way my husband was going to risk driving it any further but unfortunately, the RAC; who Fiat Assist had arranged to recover us, were having problems locating a garage with a big enough truck for the job! It was getting on and soon Camper UK would be closing for the day, so we decided to stop in our van overnight and a truck was arranged to come out to us at 8.30 the following morning! I drove to where Gilbert was marooned and we proceeded to put into the car all the items we did not wish to leave in the MH.

The truck arrived the next morning as arranged and we arrived at Camper UK around 10.30am and immediately we were greeted with a welcome cup of coffee and lots of heartfelt remarks of disbelief and genuine concern and I truly believe that the Camper UK crew were as equally as gutted as we were about this latest breakdown.

We have lost all confidence in our MH now and we have no faith in Fiat's ability to fix our van in a timely manner! Basically our vehicle is dangerous to drive as it is at the moment as you just never know when it is going to drop out of gear and when it does, you could be in the fast lane on a motorway, a busy roundabout or in some other potentially hazardous position and you are not only putting yourselves in danger but fellow road users too! We would be reluctant to plan an extended trip to Europe as we feel we would always be waiting for this to happen again and we are absolutely devastated that this problem has spoilt our enjoyment of our dream motorhome!

Dean at Camper UK has bent over backwards to resolve things for us and our MH is now being returned to Germany and Camper UK are providing us with a replacement van! In the meantime he is allowing us full use of a Burstner Iexo 726G! We really could not have received any better service and we appreciate greatly their willingness to help.

I'm sure you will all agree that Camper UK have gone above and beyond anyones expectations in this matter and their customer service is absolutely exemplary. Personally, myself and Gilbert cannot thank Camper UK enough for all their support and care and in a materialistic world, where many businesses are only interested in selling and have very little regard for decent after sales and caring customer relations, businesses like Camper UK are indeed a breath of fresh air!

I apologise to those who were hoping to learn what the exact problem has been with our  gearbox but it obviously was NOT a mechanical gearbox problem and in ours and Camper UK's opinion, it looks increasingly like it must be an electrical one! I hope I can report back to you one day in the near future exactly what the problem was but if it's any consolation to those who have been considering the Comfortmatic gearbox themselves - my husband is still a fan and says he is more than happy to own another one! 

Sue


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## wakk44

Thanks for the update Sue,I hope you get satisfaction after this sorry episode.

It must be terribly frustrating watching the Fiat reps trying and failing to solve this problem,an intermittent fault is the very worst type 
:x 

Interesting that Gilbert still has faith in the comfortmatic gearbox,I wouldn't be surprised if this incident gives you both an aversion to all things Fiat.

Camper UK always get good reports on here and they have covered themselves in glory again after your report,at least you have the use of a motorhome again.


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## Sonesta

wakk44 said:


> Thanks for the update Sue,I hope you get satisfaction after this sorry episode.
> 
> It must be terribly frustrating watching the Fiat reps trying and failing to solve this problem,an intermittent fault is the very worst type
> :x
> 
> Interesting that Gilbert still has faith in the comfortmatic gearbox,I wouldn't be surprised if this incident gives you both an aversion to all things Fiat.
> 
> Camper UK always get good reports on here and they have covered themselves in glory again after your report,at least you have the use of a motorhome again.


Hi Steve,

I must confess, that after our ordeals, I am not so supportive of the Fiat badge myself and at this precise moment in time, I think I personally will take quite a bit of convincing that our problem was a rare occurrence! However, Gilbert is more from the school of thought that our problem is unlikely to occur again and that by and large, the Comfortmatic is still an excellent gearbox! I think he is more disillusioned (as I am) by Fiats inability to fix the fault, rather than the actual gearbox itself and had it been rectified properly in the first instance then I daresay, we would have simply put it down to just being one of those unfortunate things!

I really do hope Gilbert's right though! :roll:

All the best

Sue


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## peribro

Sonesta said:


> I think I personally will take quite a bit of convincing that our problem was a rare occurrence!


Sue, look at at this way - if it wasn't a rare occurrence then presumably they would have known what it was and wouldn't have faffed about changing the gearbox and now shipping it back to Germany. I suspect that Fiat are as baffled by it as your dealer is - and I'm sure they would be banging the table if they knew that it was a known problem as its costing them money as well as Fiat.

Hope you don't have too long to wait until it's properly sorted. Best of luck.

Peter


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## Briarose

As Sue's Best Friend.......I can only add that time and again on the telephone, she has told me how good Camper Uk have been to both of them, and I do believe that the back up and service they have both had from Camper UK has been the one thing that has kept Sue and Gilbert going in all of this. 

As many of you know we also bought our motorhome from Camper UK.....and for us personally I don't think now I would ever consider dealing with anyone else. Back in early December when the snow suddenly arrived and the roads were really bad, our motorhome was booked in for a couple of niggles......we had stayed the night on the Camper UK caravan site and the roads were so bad that Dean's Dad from Camper UK escorted us with his 4x4 down the ice/snowy lanes to make sure we got to the depot Ok......where else would you get that kind of service ?

So if Camper UK do read these forums many thanks from me for looking after our Best Friends so well, and of course us too.


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## javea

Hi Sue,

So glad to hear that it looks as though things are being sorted for you. I echo your comments about Camper UK, obviously I have not been unfortunate enough to suffer the level of problems that you have had, but they have sorted my minor difficulties without any dramas at all, even from on top of the Pyrenees! Just a good job that it wasn't purchased from a few miles down the road :wink:

I think Gilbert is brave going for another Comfortmatic, I was considering changing my current Hymer for another, mainly to get the automatic, your experiences have diverted me from this course, I am going to stick with a manual box, at least if that goes wrong it can be fixed relatively quickly.

Good luck with your next one and hope that it is perfect in every respect.

Mike


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## SaddleTramp

Sue, Your both Diamonds in a box of glass.

Hard to find.


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## Sonesta

Briarose said:


> As Sue's Best Friend.......I can only add that time and again on the telephone, she has told me how good Camper Uk have been to both of them, and I do believe that the back up and service they have both had from Camper UK has been the one thing that has kept Sue and Gilbert going in all of this.
> 
> As many of you know we also bought our motorhome from Camper UK.....and for us personally I don't think now I would ever consider dealing with anyone else. Back in early December when the snow suddenly arrived and the roads were really bad, our motorhome was booked in for a couple of niggles......we had stayed the night on the Camper UK caravan site and the roads were so bad that Dean's Dad from Camper UK escorted us with his 4x4 down the ice/snowy lanes to make sure we got to the depot Ok......where else would you get that kind of service ?
> 
> So if Camper UK do read these forums many thanks from me for looking after our Best Friends so well, and of course us too.


Hi Nette,

How right you are and we truly really cannot ever praise Camper UK enough!

Not only are they replacing our Burstner Elegance with a BRAND NEW identical 2011 model, which is due to leave the Burstner factory in June but in the meantime, so that we are not without a vehicle to enjoy, they are loaning us a new Burstner iexo MH and swapping over our Oyster, our tv's, our solar panel, our inverter and fitting an awning, an alarm and a tracker so as not to inconvenience us in any way!

In our opinion they have gone way, way beyond our expectations in how they have dealt with us and they truly are a credit to the motorhome industry! :thumbright:

They certainly look after their customers excellently and if you buy a vehicle from Camper UK, you can rest assured that they will make sure you are looked after from day one! They have certainly turned what was a nightmare situation for us, into a very acceptable resolution and come June, when we get our brand new replacement Elegance, both myself and Gilbert will be sooooo excited and we certainly consider ourselves to be very satisfied and extremely fortunate Camper UK customers! 

I know I am probably going on now and some may be thinking "For gawd's sake flipping shurrup woman!" - but wouldn't you, if you had received such wonderful after sales service and such a fabulous outcome? 

Sue


----------



## Sonesta

SaddleTramp said:


> Sue, Your both Diamonds in a box of glass.
> 
> Hard to find.


Aw Les,

Well so are you my darling and we often talk about you.

Me and Gilbert cannot thank MHF enough for introducing us to you and Chris and I'm so glad we bought your Gasperini off you, cos by doing so we met 2 great people!

Can't wait to see your new van in May and I know it will be a palace on wheels!

Love & hugs.

Sue xx


----------



## Burneyinn

What a result!!

Well done Burstner & Camper UK.


----------



## erneboy

What an excellent result. I am delighted for you Sue and Gilbert. How refreshing it is to hear of a dealer doing that! I hope they get endless good publicity from it.

I will certainly try this company when it comes to changing my van and I am sure many others will too.

I hope other dealers see this thread and take note, Alan.


----------



## zulurita

What a Fantastic outcome for you and Gilbert. Well done Camper UK for resolving this for you and well done Burstner for replacing the MH.

At least you can carry on enjoying the mh life whilst waiting for your new mh.

Not sure that I would want Comformatic gear box though even if it turns out to be the electrics. But then Fiat are noted for bad electrics! Aren't they.


----------



## Mike48

As a Comfortmatic owner I have been following this thread with interest.

How refreshing it is to hear of a dealer doing that. They have seized control of the problem and released Sonesta from the hassle and any uncertainty that has arisen. Most people would lose confidence in a problematic vehicle and even if repaired I for one would be reluctant to use it as intended. 

Of course Camper UK will gain in the long term as they now have a customer for life and I guess there are a few others who might consider buying from them as a result of this thread.

This episode has made me think about what would have happened had the motorhome been purchased from a dealer which only did habitation servicing. A scenario could be envisaged where a Fiat servicing agent could very quickly become fed up with this problem as Fiat do not reimburse for diagnostic work. They would probably start blaming the habitation manufacturer and the whole situation has the potential to become very messy. As Camper UK do both there is less scope for argument.

My bet is that there is a pinched wire somewhere or something equally minor that will not be cured until all the wiring looms and engine management systems have been ripped out. I recall on my old automatic Transit that the gearbox stopped working when a wire became disconnected on my towbar; it takes something as simple as this to upset these gearboxes.

Well done Camper UK.


----------



## trevd01

As someone that has also had problems with a Comfortmatic, which were fixed very easily and quickly, I am interested in people's reactions "Must avoid Comfortmatic"

I don't know how many Comfortmatic owners on here have had no problems, but I think there are only four who have had problems.

How many people have had problems with manual X250 gearboxes and clutches - hundreds at least?

Every forum suffers from 'negative bias' ie mainly people having problems post about their experience (I did), but the silent majority who are not having problems rarely do.

Our Comfortmatic has had two problems

1. Same symptoms as Sonesta's pretty much.

Once delaying delivery from Murvi for a week - apparently fixed by supplying Fiat dealer in Plymouth "trapped wire".

Recurred again, not fatally, in Belgium - I reset the gearbox using the instruction in the manual (like rebooting a pc, I suspect!). No problems for as the next year.

But Northern Commercials (Fiat Truck dealer in Brighouse) diagnosed it instantly when it went in with massive clutch failure. Trapped wire again (a different one?).

Both of these were base vehicle (factory) faults, not conversion problem, it seems.

2. Massive clutch failure. Lot of inconvenience, holiday ruined, but clutch replaced quickly (it's the same clutch as on a manual).

So, yes, we have had problems, but I just think I have been unlucky. Thousands of other Comfortmatic owners are quietly enjoying the relaxed drive this gearbox provides. And yes, all things being equal, I would much rather have a full torque converter autobox as fitted to a Mercedes Sprinter.

But given the price difference and the massive reduction in usable space in a Sprinter (PVC, under 6m), we made our choice to go with the Comfortmatic Fiat. A choice I would make again.

Story of our Comfortmatic clutch failure (with gruesome pictures!) here:

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopict-90563-.html


----------



## Sonesta

Hi Trevor,

Well despite all our problems my husband is quite happy to drive another Comfortmatic and the replacement van will definitely have the Comfortmatic gearbox - so I guess that says it all really doesn't it? My husband really loved driving the Comfortmatic and he seems confident that history will not repeat itself but me .... well I need time to get my confidence back I think but I'm hoping that in time, my faith will be restored and I will stop fretting that it could happen again!

We are keen to find out what on earth the problem was though - so I hope we evetually get to find that out but one thing we do know, it certainly wasn't the gearbox! 

I think when our vehicle is sent back to Germany, Burstner are getting it thoroughly checked out by the Fiat factory over there and I hope that our vehicle is a problem that has got all the top Fiat guys in Germany rubbing their heads and keen to get to the bottom of? Let's hope that their investigations end up benefitting all Comfortmatic owners and fingers crossed, if this problem ever occurs again in another vehicle, Fiat will have a better insight into what the problem is and how to fix it?

Glad you are happy with yours and glad to hear that all your problems have now been rectified.

Sue


----------



## Briarose

Well we have just got back from Camper UK as our motorhome is in for a service.........I saw Sue's motorhome sitting sad and lonely in the yard.

As usual we had a quick peek around (as you do) but I am glad to report that right now we didn't see any other motorhome that we liked better than the one we have got.

Karen showed us the motorhome that they are giving you to use Sue and it is lovely.......so at least you know that you are safe in the knowledge that you will still be able to enjoy motorhoming until everything is sorted out.

I was telling Karen that we were at Burton Constable last week and we saw an nearly identical van to the one you are going to be using Sue. I got talking to the lady as the plates on it said Camper UK (not sure if she is a member here) and this lady also was singing the praises of Camper UK as she had had problems with a previous Swift motorhome supplied by Brownhills........and she also said that the only dealer for her now was Camper UK, as Brownhills let them down with the customer service side, and in the end they had to deal directly with Swift.

I am so glad to know that Camper UK not only want to sell you a motorhome, but look after you once you have it, if all dealers were like this wouldn't it be lovely.

I think we should have a MHF meet on Camper UKs camp site.....


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## Sonesta

Hi Nette,

Aw - it makes me feel sad thinking of our MH being sat sad and lonely in the yard! 


I know it's a lovely MH that Camper UK are loaning us Nette and I gather the Burstner Ixeo was the Which Motorhome's overall winner of the 2011 Motorhome of the Year award. The layout we are being loaned is not identical to the winner, as ours is the Ixeo 726G Plus and the model we will be using has the 2 single beds layout. 

We are looking forward to collecting our loan vehicle next week and as we have never used a smaller MH before, we are looking forward to the experience very much and it will interesting to see how we get on with a smaller vehicle.

So glad you didn't see a MH you liked better as there's nothing worse than buying something and then seeing something you think would suit you better! However, you obviously made the right choice and your MH is really lovely. 

What a great idea to hold a MHF meet/rally on the Camper UK's new caravan site. I don't know if they have got their shower/toilet block ready yet as last time I enquired about it, they were still working on it but it's a lovely site and the fishing lake in the middle is a lovely feature plus I gather it's well stocked and loved by the angler. When this campsite is finished it will be absolutely fabulous and I know in the future they have plans to build an on site restaurant etc.

Maybe if whoever organises the MHF rallies and meets in the Lincolnshire area were to enquire about holding a rally/meet there we could all meet up?

Sue


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## clianthus

Sonesta said:


> What a great idea to hold a MHF meet/rally on the Camper UK's new caravan site. I don't know if they have got their shower/toilet block ready yet as last time I enquired about it, they were still working on it but it's a lovely site and the fishing lake in the middle is a lovely feature plus I gather it's well stocked and loved by the angler. When this campsite is finished it will be absolutely fabulous and I know in the future they have plans to build an on site restaurant etc.
> 
> Maybe if whoever organises the MHF rallies and meets in the Lincolnshire area were to enquire about holding a rally/meet there we could all meet up?
> 
> Sue


Hi Sue

So pleased with the outcome for you, how fantastic to get another brand new motorhome  

If you think Camper UK's campsite would be a good place to hold a rally, why don't you contact the Regional Rally Co-ordinators for that area? They are the first 3 on the list, all of them cover the East Region:

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/modules.php?name=Rallies


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## Sonesta

clianthus said:


> Hi Sue
> 
> So pleased with the outcome for you, how fantastic to get another brand new motorhome
> 
> If you think Camper UK's campsite would be a good place to hold a rally, why don't you contact the Regional Rally Co-ordinators for that area? They are the first 3 on the list, all of them cover the East Region:
> 
> http://www.motorhomefacts.com/modules.php?name=Rallies


Thanks for that information - I will put this idea to the co-ordinators. 

Sue


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## carol

Sonesta having been away, I have just been reading your thread and naunty's - and am so delighted your own problem has been resolved in such a brilliant way, how many dealers would do this, I suspect not very many.

We have the comformatic gearbox, having ordered ours at Dusseldorf in 2007 and had to wait for them to build then, which wasn't until end Jan February before they went to the motorhome manufacturers. 

We actually picked ours up on April 17th and it is going in for its first MOT on 13th down in Plymouth (nearest Fiat that can the vehicle) as it is the Maxi version and the weight was too much for Exeter.

We have done around 25tkms - but as vehicle is not here I can't recall exact figure and touching wood, no problems and we have been delighted with it as so many others.

But what an outcome, well done Camper UK....

Carol


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## Sonesta

Hi Carol,

Thanks for your good wishes.  I am delighted to hear that you have been delighted with the Comfortmatic 

Well despite all the, problems we've endured, my hubby is more than happy to have another Comfortmatic and try telling him to opt for anything other!  He has done loads of research re the Comfortmatic both before, during and since deciding upon the Comfortmatic Auto gearbox and during his research he has come across very few reported problems and those cases that have been reported, appear to have been quickly and efficiently resolved. Everyone gives glowing reviews about the Comfortmatic and my husband's description was and still is: "It drives like a dream!" He's a definite fan of the Comfortmatic gearbox and his confidence as the driver, helps me to feel a lot more confident and reassured about the next one too! 

He is of the opinion that whatever turns out to be wrong with ours, it's more than likely something electrical and not mechanical and he believes that when Fiat finally do source the actual problem, it will be something relatively simple to correct. Of course this will still not excuse Fiats inability to diagnose whatever the problem was/is in a timely manner and even my 'laid back' husband agrees that based on our experience, the expertise of the gearbox specialist sent out to Camper UK from Fiat certainly left a lot to be desired!

I guess there's bound to problems of one kind another with all makes and models etc and even a top of the range £500,000 sports car could break down and suffer problems too! I suppose you just have to put these sort of things into some kind of perspective, weigh up all the facts and ensure that you do NOT then tar each and every one manufactured from thereon in or the whole Entire brand or manufacturer with the exact same brush! 

Thanks again Carol.

Sue x


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## MaxandPaddy

That is brilliant Sue,I wish Peugeot and Richard Baldwin Motorhomes had treated us as well when we were having all that bother with our new Autotrail Starblazer.
It is nice to here about good service!

Val x


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## Sonesta

Thanks Val honey, 

Yes I remember all your bother! What a nightmare and I know we've been very, very lucky with Camper UK. We really do appreciate all they've done to look after us and I like to give praise where praise is due! 

How are you getting on with your beautiful new Hobby MH? I bet you are so delighted with it as the Hobby's are fantastic vans. 

Hope you are keeping well and we still havent met up yet have we? 

Love Sue x


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## MaxandPaddy

Hi Sue,
We must get together at some point!
Funny we saw a Burstner Elegance last weekend and I instantly thought of you and about how you were keeping.
You certainly have experienced quite an alarming problem and I bet Gilbert has had some hairy moments whilst driving your Motorhome.
But what a result! A new Motorhome,that is excellent.
I know that Motorhomes should be replaced when every effort has been made to do a lasting and effective repair but lets face it I have never heard of anyone getting a new Motorhome!
We love Helga the Hobby,she has been problem free and the German quality is fabulous.
Hope you get your new baby soon and everything goes well when she (is she going to be a girl? :lol: ) arrives.
Happy Motorhoming and take care.

Val  
xxx


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## Sonesta

Thanks Val,

OMG Yes .... there were some rather hairy moments during all this and it's a good job Gilbert is laid back and calm as otherwise there would have been 2 of us screaming hysterically and covering our eyes! :roll: :roll: :roll: 

We're getting over it all now and just waiting to collect the temp motorhome next week; so fingers crossed; we should be back up and running again soon.

Helga sounds an absolute dream and I know exactly what you mean by the German quality and Hobby especially are fabulous vehicles. We've always like the Hobby and found their attention to detail to be first class. I am delighted to hear you are so happy with Helga and that she has caused you no stress!  

Can't wait to get our new replacement Elegance, as we miss her already and it really is a lovely motorhome. Never mind, it will soon be June, so we will just have to be patient and thank ourselves very fortunate that we have received such an excellent resolution to our predicament.

Are you going to the Peterborough motorhome show? We are, so if you are too, then who knows, we may even get the chance to meet up at long last.  

Happy and safe travels.

Sue xxx


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## Sonesta

Hi there,

Well we picked up the temporary MH 3 weeks ago and since then we have hardly been at home. During this time we have enjoyed a long weekend away at the Peterborough show with the MHF crowd and from there we set off together with my brother, his partner and their little girl in their MH for a further 12 days to the Peak District and then onto the Lake District. We returned home for only a few days when we set off to Nottinghamshire where myself and our youngest daughter went to see Dancing On Ice at the Trent FM Arena and then this weekend, we stayed on a local campsite where we met up with Les (Saddletramp) and his wife Chris as they were over this way for a long weekend with their 2 friends. We are now planning a 4 week tour of Ireland in June and we are so pleased to be back on the road again and doing what we love.  

The temporary motorhome; a Burstner Iexo Plus IT 726G which has been kindly loaned to us by Camper UK; is a lovely compact van but as nice as it is, I find the space a little bit limiting for me personally and we really do prefer an A Class model to a coachbuilt. So as pleased and as appreciative as we both are to have the use of this lovely vehicle, we still prefer the space and the comfort of the Burstner Elegance and so we are counting the days now until our new Elegance arrives to us from Germany. 

One of the things we have found we particularly like about the temporary van though, is that at 7.4 metres long we can get almost anywhere in it and we don't worry about taking a wrong turn or ending up on narrow country lane like we sometimes do with the Elegance and this is the one and only reason we may consider downsizing to a smaller vehicle in the future. We love to wildcamp and whilst we were in the Lake District we were able to hide away in some lovely little spots with some absolutely breathtaking views and sadly, sometimes this isn't quite so easy in a larger vehicle. I must confess that being that bit more free about where we ventured certainly enehanced the enjoyment of our trip immensely and I know my husband was taken up by this fact. 

So watch this space and if we ever find a smaller van with the right kind of layout for us then we would certainly seriously consider changing but it would have to be an A Class and purchased through Camper UK. 

Sue


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## JohnFarrugia

*Contact details*

Hi Sue,

I have purchased a Fiat Ducato motorhome from a UK dealer on a buyback scheme for a 2 month holiday. I am currently travelling through mainland Europe.

I'm not sure if my motorhome has the same Comfortmatic gearbox but your story sounds incredibly similar to ours. We are playing Russian Roulette with it at the moment; and my heart skips a beat everytime I see that red light. Hopefully it'll make it back from Italy to the UK without too many dramas.

Are you able to give me the contact details of people I can speak with to get their advice? I also don't believe it's a mechanical problem, I think it's an electrical issue.

I appreciate your assistance.

Regards,

John


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## Sonesta

Hi John,

Sorry to hear of your problems as I know from our own experience just how stressful this can be.

As you will already know from reading all about our experience, we were very lucky and we bought our motorhome from a fabulous dealer who bent over backwards to help us and it was they who mainly communicated with Fiat re our vehicles problem! In the end our vehicle was sent back to Burstner in Germany who in turn had the number one Fiat dealer in Europe from Koblenz look at it and from what I understand they discovered some kind of electrical fault. 

What make and model vehicle do you have and who is your UK dealer? May I also ask what your dealer has advised or suggested you do as obviously it is still under the Fiat warranty. Also, when you broke down who did you call for assistance as Fiat Assist is the usual route and you should have been given their contact details with your new owners pack and manuals etc. I think when you call them you will need to give them your vehicles Chassis number but they will advise you on how best to obtain that if you don't already have a note of it. Fiat Assist have Fiat approved garages all over Europe and once you have reported a breakdown they should recover you to the nearest one. Once you contact Fiat Assist a record of your particular problem or problems will be logged onto their system for follow up and future records. 

Good luck and if it's any consolation to you my hubby was not put off the Comfortmatic by what happened to us and he had no hesitations in having another Fiat Comfortmatic auto gearbox! He was and still is very impressed by it and after 5 months of driving a manual motorhome around whilst we awaited our new arrival, he realised just how much he missed the pleasure of driving the Comfortmatic. What happened to us was just one of those unfortunate things which can happen to any vehicle and our ordeal was made all the less stressful by having the back up and support of a fabulous dealer who went above and beyond our expectations in order to get us back on the road again. We collected our brand new replacement Elegance just over a week ago and we are thrilled to bits with it! 

Hope you get sorted soon and I will keep my fingers crossed that whatever it is, it turns out to be a simple little fault! 

Sue


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## Sonesta

Hi John,

When I mentioned your post to my husband he said if your motorhome was built prior to 2007 and is the 2.8 litre, then it's more than likely NOT fitted with the Fiat Comfortmatic auto gearbox. The Fiat Comfortmatic gearbox (from what he understands) was only introduced to the motorhome market around 2007. However, my husband seems to think there was some kind of Fiat auto gearbox available for LHD vehicles ONLY before 2007 but unfortunately he knows nothing about them. 

I hope someone else can offer you a little more advice than we have been able to and once again good luck.

All the best.

Sue


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## Sheeds

*Fiat Ducato gearboxes*

The experiences of Sue with the "automatic" brought tears to my eyes! 
In Australia,a mate of mine bought a Motorhome built on a Fiat 6 speed manual. He travelled around Australia and clocked up a tad over 22,000kilometres. After a few more short trips the clutch played up.Fiat dealer confirmed clutch plate manufacturing fault. Labour $cost covered by Warranty but Dealer recommended "clutch kit" be bought for around $600AUD. My mate browsed some European forums and fiat has had manual gearbox issues for years.Apparently these gearboxes are in the same family as Peugeots & Citroens etc. The motor writing critiques also say to stay away from the manual gearboxes and suggest the 3.0 litre automatic is "reasonable". Add this to the other Fiat problems - injectors in a box/valley where water can pool over them and a water repellant paste is needed to stop the injectors rusting up; water leaks onto the motor from that poor fitting plastic/rubber strip along/across the bottom of windscreen. Agree with the post "to buy a Ford". It's very informative to browse this website because Fiat says nothing about problems in Australia, but then again we're convicts aren;t we? I understand there's now an issue with the "mounting security" of the spare wheel winch under the vehicle?
Regards, Sheeds


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## lofty517

Hello All
I to have the same problems with this gearbox  Having purchased a lovely Burstner Elegance 821i 2011 and had it fitted out with all the good bits, sat system, TV's, full awning, tow bar and other bits and bobs, this vehicle has done nothing but let me down. Every trip we have been on the gearbox warning comes on "check transmission" and that horrible bleep that gets your blood boiling as soon as you hear it and then it's a panic to find somewhere to pull over safe before it goes in to neutral and leaves you stranded in the most dangerous of places as when this happens it is never the right time! but when is it, and the last time was Germany in the middle lane on the autobahn when it gave a warning and immediately went into neutral and I couldn’t get over as I was overtaking a convoy of slower moving lorries, needless to say my wife and I nearly died as cars were swerving to avoid this thing stopped in the middle of the road.
The van is just over one year old and the amount of money that I have spent on this vehicle, as everyone else has, I'm getting nowhere With Fiat or Burstner. All I’ve had is the original seller "Timberland motorhomes" which Burstner UK forwarded my problems to coming up with 3 options.
1. Sell it on my behalf (I lose loads)
2. PX for a new one (Oh I lose loads)
3. Get it fixed and Carrie on (Emm how many more times!!)
And ruin more holidays in the meantime (Oh and lose loads yet again)
Funny how Burstner/Fiat gains loads more money!!
I have now after umpteen times managed to get a reply from Burstner Germany! and this was with a reply from them within a couple of hours as I told them on my last email I was proceeding with legal action (funny that) they are saying they have no knowledge of the history of this vehicle as I had bought it second-hand, My reply was "you have to have a record as it has been on a back of a low loader so many times and you have sanctioned the work that has been carried out on it the last 4 trips!!!!" the reply I got "out of office" haha you got to laugh or you will cry.
The vehicle is yet again in Essenjay being worked on yet again and they are now fed up with all the problems with this Friday afternoon, quickly bang it together as its the weekend vehicle :evil: :evil: so I am stuck with something that I know will never be right and all the jokes of "lofty where you going to break down next haha" This is my third Burstner and tell you and please all take my advice!! DO NOT TOUCH ONE WITH A BARGEPOLE as I'm never going to again as no one cares that you lose all your savings on one and spend all your holidays on the back of a low loader grrr
Oh and check your coolant pipes that go over the top and down the back of the engine for the heat exchanger as mine had rubbed away and burst!! Must have been where they got the name Burst-ner haha just another fault to add to all the others.....


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## rayc

lofty517 said:


> Hello All
> I to have the same problems with this gearbox  Having purchased a lovely Burstner Elegance 821i 2011 and had it fitted out with all the good bits, sat system, TV's, full awning, tow bar and other bits and bobs, this vehicle has done nothing but let me down. Every trip we have been on the gearbox warning comes on "check transmission" and that horrible bleep that gets your blood boiling as soon as you hear it and then it's a panic to find somewhere to pull over safe before it goes in to neutral and leaves you stranded in the most dangerous of places as when this happens it is never the right time! but when is it, and the last time was Germany in the middle lane on the autobahn when it gave a warning and immediately went into neutral and I couldn't get over as I was overtaking a convoy of slower moving lorries, needless to say my wife and I nearly died as cars were swerving to avoid this thing stopped in the middle of the road.
> The van is just over one year old and the amount of money that I have spent on this vehicle, as everyone else has, I'm getting nowhere With Fiat or Burstner. All I've had is the original seller "Timberland motorhomes" which Burstner UK forwarded my problems to coming up with 3 options.
> 1. Sell it on my behalf (I lose loads)
> 2. PX for a new one (Oh I lose loads)
> 3. Get it fixed and Carrie on (Emm how many more times!!)
> And ruin more holidays in the meantime (Oh and lose loads yet again)
> Funny how Burstner/Fiat gains loads more money!!
> I have now after umpteen times managed to get a reply from Burstner Germany! and this was with a reply from them within a couple of hours as I told them on my last email I was proceeding with legal action (funny that) they are saying they have no knowledge of the history of this vehicle as I had bought it second-hand, My reply was "you have to have a record as it has been on a back of a low loader so many times and you have sanctioned the work that has been carried out on it the last 4 trips!!!!" the reply I got "out of office" haha you got to laugh or you will cry.
> The vehicle is yet again in Essenjay being worked on yet again and they are now fed up with all the problems with this Friday afternoon, quickly bang it together as its the weekend vehicle :evil: :evil: so I am stuck with something that I know will never be right and all the jokes of "lofty where you going to break down next haha" This is my third Burstner and tell you and please all take my advice!! DO NOT TOUCH ONE WITH A BARGEPOLE as I'm never going to again as no one cares that you lose all your savings on one and spend all your holidays on the back of a low loader grrr
> Oh and check your coolant pipes that go over the top and down the back of the engine for the heat exchanger as mine had rubbed away and burst!! Must have been where they got the name Burst-ner haha just another fault to add to all the others.....


A previous topic on the gearbox with links to previous ones.
http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftoptitle-122006-fiat-comfortmatic-auto-gearbox-problem.html


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## johnaerial

Hello Sonesta,

I have been reading your catalog of woe with this gearbox and it is a sorry tale. Unfortunately I have exactly the same symptoms with my motorhome. Our lovely 2012 Burstner is now somewhere in Scotland awaiting Fiat's second attempt in three days (along with all the attendant problems of waiting for RAC rescue services to turn up and B&Bs etc) at getting to grips with dropping out of gear into neutral and flashing up warning messages.

I hope you don’t mind but I have copied some of the more salient parts of your saga hopefully to prod Fiat in the right direction. Do you have any reference that Fiat might use to recognize your case by? Did you ever find out what the problem was?

I live down here on the south coast and face the prospect of returning to Scotland and driving the thing 500 odd miles back home. Do I feel confident they will have found the root cause of the problem? No. I can see myself limping from Fiat agent to Fiat agent as I journey south. My ideal would be to have the thing delivered to my excellent Fiat garage in Portsmouth so that when it breaks down again, I will not be 500 miles from home. But Fiat will not entertain this idea.

I was surprised that you have elected to go for another Comfortmatic. The sluggish change from 1st to 2nd gear and its inability to hold on hills is enough to put me off, let alone the suspect electronics! Previous to our latest motorhome, we had a lovely Elegance i690 left hand drive with one of the best auto gearboxes I have ever driven. It took Scotland, the Alps and the Pyrenees in its stride. It was only ever let down by Fiat’s wretched vapor sensors going faulty on two separate occasions and shutting the motor down even though there was nothing wrong with it.

Should you ever break down near Montpellier, DO NOT let yourselves be taken to the Montpellier Fiat agent. They took two days before they would even look at the problem and then two weeks to actually replace the sensor. Meantime, after hanging about for several days we flew home and then flew back when the work had been carried out. I was incredulous to find that the beer we left in the fridge had been drunk and the squashed cans left on the floor.

Is this modern motorhoming? 

I do hope the new Elegance does you proud and the Comfortmatic proves to be trouble free.

Very best wishes,

John.


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## 100127

johnaerial said:


> Hello Sonesta,
> 
> I have been reading your catalog of woe with this gearbox and it is a sorry tale. Unfortunately I have exactly the same symptoms with my motorhome. Our lovely 2012 Burstner is now somewhere in Scotland awaiting Fiat's second attempt in three days (along with all the attendant problems of waiting for RAC rescue services to turn up and B&Bs etc) at getting to grips with dropping out of gear into neutral and flashing up warning messages.
> 
> I hope you don't mind but I have copied some of the more salient parts of your saga hopefully to prod Fiat in the right direction. Do you have any reference that Fiat might use to recognize your case by? Did you ever find out what the problem was?
> 
> I live down here on the south coast and face the prospect of returning to Scotland and driving the thing 500 odd miles back home. Do I feel confident they will have found the root cause of the problem? No. I can see myself limping from Fiat agent to Fiat agent as I journey south. My ideal would be to have the thing delivered to my excellent Fiat garage in Portsmouth so that when it breaks down again, I will not be 500 miles from home. But Fiat will not entertain this idea.
> 
> I was surprised that you have elected to go for another Comfortmatic. The sluggish change from 1st to 2nd gear and its inability to hold on hills is enough to put me off, let alone the suspect electronics! Previous to our latest motorhome, we had a lovely Elegance i690 left hand drive with one of the best auto gearboxes I have ever driven. It took Scotland, the Alps and the Pyrenees in its stride. It was only ever let down by Fiat's wretched vapor sensors going faulty on two separate occasions and shutting the motor down even though there was nothing wrong with it.
> 
> Should you ever break down near Montpellier, DO NOT let yourselves be taken to the Montpellier Fiat agent. They took two days before they would even look at the problem and then two weeks to actually replace the sensor. Meantime, after hanging about for several days we flew home and then flew back when the work had been carried out. I was incredulous to find that the beer we left in the fridge had been drunk and the squashed cans left on the floor.
> 
> Is this modern motorhoming?
> 
> I do hope the new Elegance does you proud and the Comfortmatic proves to be trouble free.
> 
> Very best wishes,
> 
> John.


John, How many miles has your Burstner done?

Bob


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## johnaerial

Hello,

The vehicle is less than a year old and has done 3000 miles.


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## johnaerial

Hi Sue,

I have only just discovered your reply at the bottom of this thread. I'm not sure how this forum works!

We downsized from an Elegance which we loved to a 2012 Travel Van which has virtually the same layout - rear bed and useful garage but is only 22ft long but more importantly, is only three inches wider than the van on which is built, thus allowing the use of short-arm wing mirrors. So we now have a short, narrow van which works as well as the Elegance!

The gearbox problem is solved and it was nothing to do with the Comfortmatic gearbox after all. It seems that when the engine heats up, the wiring harness below and behind the dashboard, (above the bonnet hinge around the offside headlight) expands and shorts out against the wiper motor arm. It just happens that the affected wire is a link which disengages the gearbox. The garage only stumbled across it by pushing on the wiring harness and by doing so, selected neutral! Not something the computer can diagnose.

This occurred in the presence of a Fiat technical guy who claimed to have never encountered such a problem before. Which is unfortunate because a friend has experienced something similar which showed up as an engine misfire when the wiper motor was in action. And there are other similar instances on the Internet of wiper motors abrading the wiring harness. One would like to think that all of this must surely have been logged by Fiat on to some sort of database and made available to their technicians.

The wiring harness has now been re-routed to avoid any potential contact with things abrasive.

The garage has been exceptional. They have given the problem their absolute full and immediate attention. They have been in constant contact and even put me up in a local hotel when it broke down before the real problem was diagnosed. They ran me to the airport on the other side of Glasgow for my return flight home to the south coast.

It has been such an elusive problem, that to prove to themselves and myself that they had finally cured the problem, they insisted on delivering the motorhome back to me on the south coast, thus giving it a 450 mile test drive.

Should you breakdown in Scotland, make sure that you are recovered to Imperial Commercials Cumbernauld. I cannot praise them highly enough.


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