# Imperial to metric nonsense.



## Devonboy (Nov 19, 2009)

Today I needed some 11/2" x 8 wood screws. Looking at Toolstation online, all screws are listed by their metric sizes. Googling conversion charts I find that the metric equivalent is 4 x 40mm. So off to Toolstation I go & fill out the form, take it to the counter & the assistant duly fetches the box of shiny new screws. Now guess what is printed on the box (but not in the catalogue)? Yes printed on the box was 11/2" x 8...………..


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## peribro (Sep 6, 2009)

We should never have gone into the Common Market.


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## jiwawa (Jun 22, 2007)

We were buying some lino in 1973. Width was in ft, length was in yards and the price was per square metre.....


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## ChrisandJohn (Feb 3, 2008)

When we were buying a fluorescent light tube we gave the length in metric. Salesman claims not to understand that so we converted it to imperial for him and he goes off to the storeroom and comes back with the correct tube but with the measurement printed on the box in metric.


Chris


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

The metric/imperial confusion has existed not only in UK but Europe, America and Australia for generations.
At least the EU has standardised kitchens and plumbing.

Ray.


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## patp (Apr 30, 2007)

Then there’s the media who insist on using kilometres when reporting distance!


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

I was always very annoyed having to buy expensive carpets in metric to fit old imperial rooms. Had to waste £££££'s. Still have large carpet 'offcuts' in our sheds.

Ray.


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## dghr272 (Jun 14, 2012)

Yeah and what about all this decimal money.......... bring back LSD, oh and don't forget the Farthings ? :-D

Terry


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

patp said:


> Then there's the media who insist on using kilometres when reporting distance!


Oh if only they did Pat, but they use K's and for weight KGs which irks me no end as they are written abbreviations, not to be spoken, same with GBs, MBs all written, but they are never taught this for some reason, my TV has stopped listening to me as shout at it so often.

Another pet hate in the media is people who are talking about how expensive something is IE "oh I paid £100k for this car", wouldn't £100,000 or one hundred thousand pounds sound more expensive.


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Yeah Terry. I have kept about 25 tanners and a dozen half crowns, so can top up the bank.

Ray.


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## dghr272 (Jun 14, 2012)

raynipper said:


> Yeah Terry. I have kept about 25 tanners and a dozen half crowns, so can top up the bank.
> 
> Ray.


You can't kid me, I know you've a stash of sovereigns buried in the garden, that's why your good lady is always out there digging trying to find them.

Terry


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## Mrplodd (Mar 4, 2008)

At least we can still buy our beer in pints (but I have no idea for how much longer) 

Andy

I wonder what the metric equivalent of a Groat is??


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

4d in old money Andy, so roughly 1.5p

You only had to ask


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

In Poland one still gets change of 1/100 (Grosse) of a Zloty


= 1/5 of UK penny


= 1/4 of € cent


If one calculates back to British decimilisation in 1972(?) I reckon that is less than a farthing.


One condition of Poland's accession to the EU is a commitment to joining the Eurozone. I have been here 7 years and have seen no sign of it happening anytime soon.


Geoff


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

Don't worry after March 29th the Pound in your pocket will be worth the same - nothing......

You will be able to buy pints and pounds and all the other imperial units as the UK re-establishes it's Empire.... 

We know that the Aussies the Kiwis and the Yanks will be delighted (except the Yanks and gallons but then they are upstarts)

It will be a pound of sausages in future (if you are very rich) not 454g......

Progress is being made as we sit and read - already today we have been reliably informed that it will no longer be necessary to do things in those Napoleonic units and the UK can once again go back to the length of the forearm and the top joint of a thumb being all that is required for short measurement and n longer will you have to do a step and a little hop for those pesky metric units.

I am sure the new GCSE exams will reflect these changes next summer - or else......


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

Penquin said:


> It will be a pound of sausages in future (if you are very rich) not 454g......


I buy my tomato sausages from my butcher by the No. of links.:wink2:


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## 747 (Oct 2, 2009)

Penquin said:


> Don't worry after March 29th the Pound in your pocket will be worth the same - nothing......
> 
> You will be able to buy pints and pounds and all the other imperial units as the UK re-establishes it's Empire....
> 
> ...


That sounds like a Pound of sour grapes David. >


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Twas intelligently funny, where'd you get it from Dave?


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## nickoff (Oct 11, 2005)

Last year I ordered a dozen fence panels to replace the rotting ones that were already in place when we bought the house. The fence posts were still in good order so thought I'd use them. When I came to erect the panels the buggers wouldn't fit between the posts. Old panels 6ft, new panels 2 meters. :-(

Nick.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Pudsey_Bear said:


> Twas intelligently funny, where'd you get it from Dave?


Oooh caustic Kev.


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

Pudsey_Bear said:


> Twas intelligently funny, where'd you get it from Dave?


Entirely my own work it took me almost 5 minutes and then 10 to correct spelling and typo mistakes...

Based on how there is a portion of the UK that seems determined to turn the clock back in spite of coherent and wide-spread criticism.


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## peribro (Sep 6, 2009)

Penquin said:


> Based on how there is a portion of the UK that seems determined to turn the clock back in spite of coherent and wide-spread criticism.


Is that the majority portion who voted for Brexit?


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

Not at all - that is YOUR suggestion not mine. I said "a portion" but did not specify any more.

I suspect that there is a large portion that would NOT welcome a return to Imperial units since they have NEVER studied them.

Pounds ounces feet inches yards pints quarts gills firkins have not formed a part of the education system for more than 30 years.

I also suspect that those that would welcome the return to the use of Imperial units may come from BOTH sides of the Referendum debate and have no reason to suspect otherwise.

I also suspect that many of us (including me) use BOTH units e.g. height being measured as 6 feet rather than 1.81m or weights as Pounds stones and ounces rather than kilogrammes.... Admittedly I have to spout metric units at the Doctor or Hospital but 6 foot is how I would describe my size....


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## peribro (Sep 6, 2009)

Penquin said:


> Not at all - that is YOUR suggestion not mine. I said "a portion" but did not specify any more.


I simply asked if that was what you were suggesting because I wasn't clear what you meant by "portion". As you said, you hadn't specified it.


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

I dunno why we just didnt properly adopt the metric system decades ago. It just makes so much more sense and is far easier to work with.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

I'm sure Dave would not take it that way Alan, twas a jest only.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Penquin said:


> Not at all - that is YOUR suggestion not mine. I said "a portion" but did not specify any more.
> 
> I suspect that there is a large portion that would NOT welcome a return to Imperial units since they have NEVER studied them.
> 
> ...


I don't mind the nostalgic older measurements, I can switch between metric and imperial with no bother, lbs to kgs not so well, d to p more or less okay with, mmls to cc easy, exactly the same.


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

barryd said:


> I dunno why we just didnt properly adopt the metric system decades ago. It just makes so much more sense and is far easier to work with.


Cos we like having a foot on each shore. Not relinquishing the old system but not fully embracing the new system Bit like being half in and half out of Europe. We want our cake and eat it.

Ray.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

barryd said:


> I dunno why we just didnt properly adopt the metric system decades ago. It just makes so much more sense and is far easier to work with.


I get on with the metric system okay Barry, people your age have been brought up with it and it was the norm at school, but there are older people about who were taught a vastly different system, and are reluctant/incapable of completely accepting it, I'm okay with both up to a point as I already posted, but I still remember the farthing and ha'penny, even the little silver sixpences, these old measurements sort have some soul, they were based on things at the time as and when needed almost, and we still use some of them, in sport etc, they have a comfortable feel to them, Metric, is based on the number 10, how effing boring is that?

But I'll stick with it as it's easier to work with, maths for morons, do we have to get rid of the times table too, I only know the tune now anyway.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Pudsey_Bear said:


> I'm sure Dave would not take it that way Alan, twas a jest only.


So was mine Kev.

I think the old system was far better.

What's not to like in a system that apparently randomly uses base 12, base 20, base 3, base 14, base 16, base 8, base 36, base 1760 and I've no idea how many other bases? It's much cleverer that just having everything in base 10.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Never got to doing maths, I played truant on those days Alan, and sports, and geography, and RI, I missed both my 11+ & 13+ exams too, my one qualification is a driving licence, and I didn't bother with that til I was 35.


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Late developer then Kev...…….>:

Ray.


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## rayrecrok (Nov 21, 2008)

Metric.. 

Working a staircase rise and go in imperial was a nightmare, rise and go in metric took seconds with a calculator, far easier than a pencil and a scrap of wood to do the calc's on, same with spindle staircases working out the gaps between the spindles. Duo decimals piece of cake...Easy to convert from imperial to metric just x .3048 if I remember right or divide if going the other way... Working bricks into courses in imperial get your pencil out, metric you could do it in your head.... working amount of concrete for foundations a piece of cake in metric.. Yada yada yada.

ray.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

raynipper said:


> Late developer then Kev...…….>:
> 
> Ray.


Not finished growing yet either it seems  

Got cradle cap too.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

rayrecrok said:


> Metric..
> 
> Working a staircase rise and go in imperial was a nightmare, rise and go in metric took seconds with a calculator, far easier than a pencil and a scrap of wood to do the calc's on, same with spindle staircases working out the gaps between the spindles. Duo decimals piece of cake...Easy to convert from imperial to metric just x .3048 if I remember right or divide if going the other way... Working bricks into courses in imperial get your pencil out, metric you could do it in your head.... working amount of concrete for foundations a piece of cake in metric.. Yada yada yada.
> 
> ray.


No disrespect intended Ray, but could this be why now no one can do mental arithmetic, cos the metric system dumbed it all down, nowadays they can use a calculator in class, it's great that they are shown how they work, but they should also be taught (if they turn up) how it all works.

Like learning to write, mine were taught the kicking K and the curly C ffs, how dumb was that, My mother useless as she was at least taught me how to read and write, and with those two skills you should (me excepted) be able to figure most things out, my Dad an even bigger waste of space than my Mum was a very intelligent man for a paddy, (absolute Bstd too) he was a meteorological officer in the Royal Navy during the war, and afterwards worked his way up in civil engineering, I thought he would be able to help me with maths, but the ****** just asked stupid questions he knew I didn't have the skills to work out at the time, some simple to me now, like how many tuppence ha'pennies in a million pounds, and some involving trigonometry & algebra, I'd have been about 8 at the time, then to give me a hiding because I hadn't a clue, so you stop asking, once watching a TV program I asked him what a prostitute was, he told me in the most graphic terms.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

One of the girls who worked in our local pub part time was a primary school teacher. She was useless at mental arithmetic and relied on the till for the simplest calculation for which she got a lot of stick. Regulars frequently did the additions for her and told her much change they should get out of a fiver or a tenner. She said that she simply could not subtract without a pen and paper so people explained how to do it, the way we older people were taught to. Her answer was that our way of subtracting was wrong and she showed us how it was taught at he school using her pen and paper. She got the right answers but what a palaver it was for her to get there. I can't remember her method but that won't matter since I had no idea what she was doing. As I recall the idea of carrying ones was a mystery to her. Not much wonder youngsters can't do it their heads.

I promise this is true. I was at a Spanish filling station for some petrol for my car and to get a gas cylinder refill. I knew the cylinder was €13.50 so got that then put €16.50 worth of petrol in the car. I handed the attendant, he's not very young, €30 thanked him and went to get into the car. He stopped me and got his phone out to do the calculation. It was quite obvious that he had no idea that I'd given him the right money. This bloke works all day in the filling station and all evening in his bar next to it. I found it incredible.


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

Maybe his bar work had resulted in an excessive inhalation of the fumes of ethanol?

I agree though - mental arithmetic used to be a major part of our learning in primary school and I remember it well 'cos it was great fun...

although quite why it was necessary to calculate how long it took to fill a 25 gallon bath with water from a tap that gave 1 1/4 gallons per minute but when the plug had been left out and the drain took out 3/4 of a gallon every minute.......

Mind you that was from before anyone thought about water meters.....

I'll leave you to work it out (mentally of course)..........

Have fun !


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Our village boulangerie sells baguettes and croixants all day. But every single sale of two or three items results in their using a calculator.??

Ray.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

We watch the Adult version of countdown, and sometimes I can do the numbers one, but the letters kill, but, I can often get the conundrum at each break (usually smutty so no surprise there then) but the celebs are worse them me at maths, I can usually get within ten or so, oftentimes the celebs just sit and doodle.

I only watch it for Rachel Riley anyway, gorra love a woman that's way more intelligent than me, her being gorgeous is just a bonus.

Remembered the name, 8 out of 10 cats does countdown, it's a very funny show, but their command of swear words may put some old farts off.

Here's a sample, bear in mind the above.


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

Try being a 'settler' in a betting shop in the 60/70's then you need mental arithmetic


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

I had a GF who did that. Are you too a Capricorn Tony? never met one who wasn't red hot with numbers.


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

Pudsey_Bear said:


> I had a GF who did that. Are you too a Capricorn Tony? never met one who wasn't red hot with numbers.


Guilty, so's the wife:wink2:


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Mrs D is a Capricorn. She was an accountant before she became a lady of leisure. (She will kill me for saying that)

Why the hell I never married another reckless Aquarian is beyond me!


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

I find Capricorns very special, 4 of my previous GFs were Capricorns, fascinatingly imaginative and VERY creative in certain areas, but a total pain in the rear elsewhere as they have to be right all the time, which is why they are all Exes.


You found another van yet Barfs?


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

GEMMY said:


> Guilty, so's the wife:wink2:


Oh yes, hmm interesting, do you spend your spare time doing maths? or do you just get creative together


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Pudsey_Bear said:


> I find Capricorns very special, 4 of my previous GFs were Capricorns, fascinatingly imaginative and VERY creative in certain areas, but a total pain in the rear elsewhere as they have to be right all the time, which is why they are all Exes.
> 
> You found another van yet Barfs?


Nah, I gave up ages ago. It doesnt exist.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

You have to wonder how they managed to build a van with your payload and that they can't now.


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## dghr272 (Jun 14, 2012)

Pudsey_Bear said:


> No disrespect intended Ray, but could this be why now no one can do mental arithmetic, cos the metric system dumbed it all down, nowadays they can use a calculator in class, it's great that they are shown how they work, but they should also be taught (if they turn up) how it all works.
> 
> Like learning to write, mine were taught the kicking K and the curly C ffs, how dumb was that, My mother useless as she was at least taught me how to read and write, and with those two skills you should (me excepted) be able to figure most things out, my Dad an even bigger waste of space than my Mum was a very intelligent man for a paddy, (absolute Bstd too) he was a meteorological officer in the Royal Navy during the war, and afterwards worked his way up in civil engineering, I thought he would be able to help me with maths, but the ****** just asked stupid questions he knew I didn't have the skills to work out at the time, some simple to me now, like how many tuppence ha'pennies in a million pounds, and some involving trigonometry & algebra, I'd have been about 8 at the time, then to give me a hiding because I hadn't a clue, so you stop asking, once watching a TV program I asked him what a prostitute was, he told me in the most graphic terms.


Nice one Kev I'm sure the Paddy's among us are delighted with your slight and not a smilie in site. :surprise:

But there again being half Paddy yourself perhaps explains your thoughts on us. :grin2:

Terry


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## 747 (Oct 2, 2009)

Pudsey_Bear said:


> You have to wonder how they managed to build a van with your payload and that they can't now.


Because they could not transpose feet and inches into metricals?

Although in the case of a Kontiki, it was probably measured in fathoms, rods, chains and perches. >


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## patp (Apr 30, 2007)

I blame a teacher at my Primary School for my lack of understanding of maths. I was a fanatical reader of books and would smuggle a book into the maths lesson. One kid or another would split on me but he would dismiss their complaint and let me carry on reading! I might have caught up if I had not had the misfortune to put my heel into my dad's moped wheel as we went to see Princess Margaret sail down the Thames on the Royal Yacht. This meant a spell off school giving me lots of time to read more books! Numbers are still a foreign language to me 
Like you, Kev, my mum was a waste of space at child rearing and she just allowed it all to happen. 

Fascinating about Capricorns! Has anyone ever tested goats I wonder?


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

When we decided to have a new kitchen installed in this holiday home (at that time 1995). I measured up and did extensive drawings in Imperial. 
Took them to Magnet & Southern UK to order the cabinets, worktops and appliances to be made and brought over. When I saw they were working in metric I said sorry but all my measurements were in Imperial. Thats OK said the designer, we are used to converting and working in both.

When the fitter brought everything over and went to install, he found we were one cupboard short in the run. M&S had cocked up and sent it later. But by then it was too late and we still have that space today.

Ray.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

dghr272 said:


> Nice one Kev I'm sure the Paddy's among us are delighted with your slight and not a smilie in site. :surprise:
> 
> But there again being half Paddy yourself perhaps explains your thoughts on us. :grin2:
> 
> Terry


I have found the Irish people to be both charming and intelligent since then Terry, no real slight was intended, it was supposed to put a little humour into what for me was an awful childhood, we cope with things in different ways, but I shouldn't have said it, my apologies.


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## dghr272 (Jun 14, 2012)

Thank you Kev it just took me by surprise, when emotions run high we can all get carried away, but hey as I've said before "the man that never makes a mistake makes nothing" we've all been there.

No harm done, onwards and upwards, and no I ain't suddenly become a Brexiteer :-D

Terry


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Pudsey_Bear said:


> You have to wonder how they managed to build a van with your payload and that they can't now.


Because they got Lardy. how can the 4250KG Kontiki that looks the same shape and layout as mine have less payload than the 1996 3500kg version?

They have filled them full of heavy and shiny stuff and doors that weigh a ton to attract people who like heavy shiny things without thinking of what people want to put in them for long term travelling or more importantly hang off the back of them.


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Several RVs we had were very close to the base chassis limits. So when the manufacturers put in more 'heavy & shiny' stuff on the new models they halved the tank capacities. Grrrrr.

Ray.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

barryd said:


> Because they got Lardy. how can the 4250KG Kontiki that looks the same shape and layout as mine have less payload than the 1996 3500kg version?
> 
> They have filled them full of heavy and shiny stuff and doors that weigh a ton to attract people who like heavy shiny things without thinking of what people want to put in them for long term travelling or more importantly hang off the back of them.


I've looked in vain for the spec sheet on yours Barry, did you ever find it in print?


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Aha found it, have you had an upgrade to your suspension, this has you at 3,200kg not 3,400kg as you have it on the hank website, payload 612kg, you and Michelle being generous will be around 100kg, water 1kg per litre, plus fuel at 0.865kg per litre, Gas bottles, and contents, then food clothing bikes, kayak etc you must be very close to being overweight, have you ever had it weighed empty and loaded for travelling?

https://www.gocaravanning.com/motorhome-specifications/model/swift-kontiki-640_1057.html


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Pudsey_Bear said:


> Aha found it, have you had an upgrade to your suspension, this has you at 3,200kg not 3,400kg as you have it on the hank website, payload 612kg, you and Michelle being generous will be around 100kg, water 1kg per litre, plus fuel at 0.865kg per litre, Gas bottles, and contents, then food clothing bikes, kayak etc you must be very close to being overweight, have you ever had it weighed empty and loaded for travelling?
> 
> https://www.gocaravanning.com/motorhome-specifications/model/swift-kontiki-640_1057.html


Thats wrong. Its 3400 on the plate and payload is 690kg or there abouts from memory. Yes Ive had it weighed loads of times. I went through all that malarkey to fit the scooter and rack and would weigh it before a trip. I suspect we have been over a bit now and again. I got weighed at the swiss border once as well on a random check. I dont think they believed a 7m van with a scooter on the back was sub 3500kg and I had just filled the luton with cheap German beer. We came in at 3460kg. Ive still got the print out the border guards gave me in 2009 in the glove box. Every time we got stopped at the Swiss border and questioned I just showed them the print out and they let me through. Must have been a purge that year as Ive never been stopped since. Must admit Ive not been down the weighbridge for a while now but nothing much has changed. New bike is heavier by about 7kg and we carry an extra folding mountain bike as well. Probably over a bit but not much.

I could uplate it and I wish I had now seeing as we seem to be keeping it. However if I sell it there is a good chance it would hit the price bracket of someone younger without a C1 licence.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Hmm, okay, I was more concerned with you getting a ticket than proving you wrong, as for a young peep buying it, they can (after it's emptied of all your gear) run it as a 3500kg anyway, seems it has a cracking payload  


Anyway, what you doing up this time on a Saturday morning, you wet the bed again?


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

barryd said:


> I could uplate it and I wish I had now seeing as we seem to be keeping it. However if I sell it there is a good chance it would hit the price bracket of someone younger without a C1 licence.


That should not be a problem for selling as all a buyer would have to do is to write to DVLA requesting it be returned to 3500kg. It is only when increasing weights that evidence is required.

Geoff


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## rayrecrok (Nov 21, 2008)

barryd said:


> Because they got Lardy. how can the 4250KG Kontiki that looks the same shape and layout as mine have less payload than the 1996 3500kg version?
> 
> They have filled them full of heavy and shiny stuff and doors that weigh a ton to attract people who like heavy shiny things without thinking of what people want to put in them for long term travelling or more importantly hang off the back of them.


Barry you know why the new van has heavy stuff thick doors and things, they have been reading your posts and thought maybe folk will not accept things stuck together with duct tape and Velcro.. I would bill them for your trouble saving them from bankruptcy.. Usual £99.99 plus vat?.:wink2:

ray.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Interesting point there Geoff, and obviously I don't know either way, or I'd not ask, but if you didn't have a C1, and you got pulled but were under 3500kg, would you have actually committed an a offence at all, as the V5 I thought was for the revenue weight.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Oh yes Kev. It's the plated weight that counts, not the actual weight.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Thanks Alan


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

nicholsong said:


> That should not be a problem for selling as all a buyer would have to do is to write to DVLA requesting it be returned to 3500kg. It is only when increasing weights that evidence is required.
> 
> Geoff


EDIT I think that a new owner may also need to get a new plate showing 3500kg with a date subsequent to the uprated plate over 3500kg, as I believe it is illegal to remove that or any plate. But armed with a new V5C showing 3500kg max weight getting that plate made should not be a problem.


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## bc109 (Sep 17, 2016)

Why are you folks all talking about payload in Kilos ?
I thought you were all Cwt and Lbs fanatics !
Bill


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

May as well while we still can Bill  

I hated the imperial system, but it did have character.


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

bc109 said:


> Why are you folks all talking about payload in Kilos ?
> I thought you were all Cwt and Lbs fanatics !
> Bill


And in those days vehicles with 'C' Licences in the windscreen had to show the 'Tare' weight and the Company Secretary's Address.

That information will cost you 100 Guineas, payable by cheque.


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

bc109 said:


> Why are you folks all talking about payload in Kilos ?
> I thought you were all Cwt and Lbs fanatics !
> Bill


Well internationally the length of a cricket pitch is still defined as a 'Chain', ie 1/10 of a Furlong, which itself is still used in Horse Racing, and Selling is still done in Guineas.

Compensation for passengers on airlines is still based on Avredupois ounces of Gold - the finesse of which deludes me, after a couple of glasses, but please come back to me.

The size of Ryanair baggage also deludes me, especially every 2 months when they change it - doubt whether Michael O'Leary could quote it on a live interview.

I will not go on.

Geoff


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