# Reports on New Sites in Database



## Daedalas (Nov 12, 2009)

Good Morning all

I cannot post in the Update of Sites forum - so please would the Mods re-locate if I've chosen the wrong forum.

In my view the MHF campsite database is an excellent benefit for members: to know about sites others have visited and to be able to read honest MHF members' reports on what they have found is most advantageous. Normally in site books one has to wade through and interpret a plethora of promo-bull whereas MHF member reports are usually succinct and relevant to MHomers.

I wonder if others have noted that recently, there have been some sites added to the database which simply state that such and such a site exists - no report on a visit - no suggestion even that a MHF member has seen the site. 

It seems to me such additions to a permanent database are no more than blatant advertising. Does it strike others that way? What do others think?


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Can't comment on sites but I have added a few Aires in Spain which I had not visited. I did so having discussed it with the mods and we agreed that as they were so scarce that would be OK. I verified their existence and made it clear that I had not visited. I updated them when I did visit and asked others to do likewise.

In the circumstances above I think it is justifiable, Alan.


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Hi,

I think you're probably commenting about the multiple block entries that have been appearing recently by 'autosites'.

Its not advertising, Nukeadmin has set up a program so that all Caravan Club and Camping/Caravan Club sites and CL's/CS's not already in the database have had their basic details entered in an automated process to 'fill in the gaps' so to speak.
The theory being that members will add reviews over time to update and add to the basic information.

_"no suggestion even that a MHF member has seen the site"_

The 'visited by MHF member' box hasn't been ticked on these entries.

Hope that explains it.

Pete


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## blongs (Jan 12, 2009)

In my experience, when you submit to add a site, this has to go for approval. Once the site is added to the db you then have to go back around (maybe a few days later) to actually add the review of your stay.

I think this dual process is probably why the reviews are not added by people.

I had already done a review for UKCS anyway so I was able to cut and paste a few days later but otherwise it may have passed me by as well.

Ben


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Blongs, maybe it's a bit complicated and you are missing it but you can add your review when you first add the entry. Have you not seen the text box where you do that? Alan.


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## blongs (Jan 12, 2009)

erneboy said:


> Blongs, maybe it's a bit complicated and you are missing it but you can add your review when you first add the entry. Have you not seen the text box where you do that? Alan.


After I click on the location on the map it just returns back to the overall entry screen. No option for adding a review along the way.


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## Zebedee (Oct 3, 2007)

blongs said:


> After I click on the location on the map it just returns back to the overall entry screen. No option for adding a review along the way.


Hi Blongs

Why would you want to _*review *_your own entry - unless you had revisited the site at a later date and found something else to add.

The big text panel labelled "General Information" is where you can enter, well . . . . general information! :roll:

I think that's how it works, but have to confess (  ) it's a long time since I entered one.

Must try harder! 8O

Dave


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## spykal (May 9, 2005)

Hi

I will try to answer some of the queries raised as it is myself and Gaspode who initially check all of the entries, now totalling more than 8000 before they are added into the campsite database.
( so if it sometimes takes a while it prob means we are out in our vans with no internet :wink: )

We also look at all of the additional reviews that are entered by members who have visited the sites. We do need to look at them before they can be added to the database. This is not to edit the entries or even to protect any site from a bad review as we do need to know the good, the bad and the ugly :wink: ... we check the reviews mainly to prevent abuse and spam. ( advertising)

Re those recent new sites entered by member "Autosites":- 
These sites were painstakingly entered by employees engaged by Nukeadmin, he is the MHF forum owner. This took many days to complete as there were several thousand campsites to enter and each entry contains just the basic information about the site and the GPS location. They are all either Caravan Club Main Sites, C&CC Main Sites, CLs or CSs.

As Peejay has explained the sites were not entered as "visited" by a member.
Sites entered by a member who has visited the campsite will always show this icon









These newly added "Autosite" sites are simply there to make our database a more complete and comprehensive service for our members who may be using the database while planning a trip or touring the UK.

As time goes on the volunteer campsite admins will continue to add details and correct any errors ( we will won't we guys :wink: ). So far all of the sites entered by "Autosites" are in the UK and Ireland and as they are all Club sites ( CC or C&CC) the basic requirements for a motorhome should be met.

All the sites in Europe have been entered by a member who has visited the site.

If any member visits one of these previously un-visited sites ( the ones entered by "autosites" ) we do hope that they will add a personal review of the site adding as much useful info as they can.

Re Entering a site, Blong's question:-
Entering a campsite is quite time consuming and involves entering a fair amount of detail. While entering the site you should fill in the "General Information" box with your personal findings and comments about the site... you do not need to do a review of one of your own entered sites unless maybe if you forgot to add any important details... if you do an additional review to one of your own entries we admins will often add that to the original entry for you.

Re any mistakes, errors or duplicates that may be found:- 
If a member finds anything that needs to be corrected in the database the easiest way to tell us is to enter a review of the campsite concerned and state in the review just what you think is wrong or alternatively contact any Mod by PM and they will pass it on to the admins.

Mike


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

I noticed an entry that said visited by' site officer in 2010' which puzzled me and then that it had been entered by 'autosites' who is not a member but has entered *3490* sites ie about half of them.

A search revealed this thread.

Well I hadn't realised this had gone on I think it devalues the database.

You might as well auto enter the 37,000 other sites in Europe.

When I started with the database we were all very dismissive of site entries that had been put in without a visit, typed in only to get access to the database.

I feel very let down.

'Never mind the quality feel the width'


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## spykal (May 9, 2005)

Hi Frank

At first I thought the same but only for a few moments...then I realised that these "autosite" entries were "identified" they did not claim to be an entry from a member and were there merly to make the database into a more complete and useable reference for anyone using it while touring the UK and hoping to find a pitch for the night.

I realised that if I was out on the road and using iCampsites via USB on my netbook I would rather have the ability to see that there is a CL or CS a few miles away...even if it had been added by "autosites"... than have to get out the club handbooks and find it the old way. ( or as often happened not find it ! )

I do however think that there should be a clear explanation to the user of the database that the "autosites" sites are entries that have been "gleaned" from the club handbooks not entered by a member who has visited the site.


Mike


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## Bubblehead (Mar 5, 2007)

Hi

I dont mind the autosites entries in the DB as it helps to provide you with all available sites not just those visited by members, how many members take the time to enter sites?

What does drive me mad is the process of getting site details, I like to click on the map and get the 20 mile ring showing all the sites, I then click on a site and it takes me to the site details, so far so good.

If I then wish to check another site there is no back button other than going back to the whole map and starting again, cant this be changed so that you have the option to take you back to the map area you were looking at?

There is also no means of updating site details, other than by review for things such as an increase in price or a new toilet block. Can we have a 'site details update' option?

Other problems are the inability to enlarge the pictures to any usable size and no option to search for sites with hardstanding (or details of).

I'm sorry if this seems negative, but just my comments on access to what is an excellent source of information.

Andy


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

Bubblehead said:


> Hi
> 
> I dont mind the autosites entries in the DB as it helps to provide you with all available sites not just those visited by members,..clipped


Except that it doesn't  most of the added sites are the certificated campsites of CC or C&CC you have to be a member to use a CL or CS.

and

What about this statement


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## bb46 (Oct 26, 2008)

Hi bubblehead
I agree its a pain having no 'back' button but to compensate for this, hold down the 'Ctrl' key and click on the site button. It will then load in a separate window.

Barbara


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## spykal (May 9, 2005)

Bubblehead said:


> snipped :- I'm sorry if this seems negative, but just my comments on access to what is an excellent source of information.
> 
> Andy


Hi Andy

Don't worry about telling us what you like and don't like... I don't see your remarks as at all negative.

Barbara's solution will help you when seaching the map, opening the details in another window leaves the original map ready to use again... you can also, after clicking on a mapped campsite, then do a right click on the full details link and the details of the site can be opened in a new "tab" ( that should work for all browsers).

Thanks too for your review that you recently added to the Ty Rhos Campsite <<<site ... this is exactly how we hoped members would help us to make the database better. This site was originally added by "Autosites" but your added review confirms to us all that the site is worthy of a visit. When your review came in I not only added it to the site entry but also added a picture and made sure that the location was exact ...so exact that the google street view shows the entrance to the field :lol: I have added it our list of sites to visit too :wink:

Mike

P.S. Frank I will get Nuke to alter the wording that you have highlighted. ( even though the guy who manually added all of the CC & CCC sites was a member, OK I know, really not a "proper" motorhome owning member, just a guy paid to do the adding of the data...it must have been a boring job and there may, dammit, even be some mistakes ... :lol: )


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

I too feel it devalues the database. At least if it was entered by a MHF member you had a pretty good idea that the site was or wasn't very suitable for a motorhome or its shortcomings were identified. 

Many CLs and CSs are unsuitable, prone to being muddy, too much of a slope to level up etc. I have read some CSs entries which state only suitable for tents! Have these been included?

peedee


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## spykal (May 9, 2005)

peedee said:


> I too feel it devalues the database. At least if it was entered by a MHF member you had a pretty good idea that the site was or wasn't very suitable for a motorhome or its shortcomings were identified.
> 
> Many CLs and CSs are unsuitable, prone to being muddy, too much of a slope to level up etc. I have read some CSs entries which state only suitable for tents! Have these been included?
> 
> peedee


Hi Peedee

I can see where you are coming from but for the life of me I cannot see how you would have known that sort of detail about a site, a CL or a CS just by reading either of the club handbooks. I do agree that a campsite entry added by a motorohoming member has to be the best sort of entry if you want the assurance that the site is suitable for you. If that is what you want then stick to just those entries made by a member who visited the site or telephone ahead to the campsite ...if you come across one in the database that is unsuitable just tell us.

Does no one like the fact that we now have all the CC and C&CClub sites listed and available to be mapped by google maps within our site and on the soon to be available iCampsites USB stick?

It took a lot of time, work and thought to get to this stage so If the answer is no then obviously we were complety wrong in thinking that the listing of them would be an asset and my time would be better spent out in the van :lol: .

Mike

P.S.

Another site added by "Autosites" was just reviewed after a visit by member Carol ..I have just added the review to the original entry:

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/modules.php?name=Campsites&op=display_results&csid=7670 <<<


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

This will be a Marmite debate but I think this is a fantastic addition. If all the CL and CS sites are in then brilliant. The CC and C&CC websites are rubbish for searching and this stuff is available off line as well! Well done!

You can always ring the CL or CS or whatever if there are no details. The point is when your looking for your next stop over you can just check out the map and at least find everything thats there. Your not missing sites because they haven't been entered.

Its up to us to fill in the gaps! One of the reasons I think I have been reluctant to give reviews is that you have to put GPS positions in and I don't always have them.

I just did a review for Harthill farm CL and a photo in the Forest of Dean. Took all of 60 seconds.

Nice one.


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

spykal said:


> Hi Peedee
> I can see where you are coming from but for the life of me I cannot see how you would have known that sort of detail about a site, a CL or a CS just by reading either of the club handbooks.


Mike,
Well the first thing I look for is has it got hard standings if not is it open all year. Both these usually mean you are pretty safe to visit. Whether the ground slopes or not is usually indicated as well. However you know nothing about access which can at times prove tricky. Sometimes I'll check the OS maps or google earth for this. I don't think the MHF database holds data about the degree of slope or hardstandings?

I have just had a look at some of the autosite entries and notice the positioning whilst adequate is not good either. I also think Swan Cottage in Letton near Hereford is a CL not a CS but it is over 10years since I was last there so I could be wrong.

Since they are all now entered, there is no point in removing them unless they are identified as not being suitable for motorhomes and after all some information is better than nothing!

peedee


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

barryd said:


> One of the reasons I think I have been reluctant to give reviews is that you have to put GPS positions in and I don't always have them.


If you have been there you shouldn't need it! I have never recorded it for any of the sites I have entered. You should know where it is from the lie of the land so change the map view to satellite and zoom in to locate the site and click on the spot. I usually click on the entrance to the site if I can see it.

peedee


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## spykal (May 9, 2005)

peedee said:


> I have just had a look at some of the autosite entries and notice the positioning whilst adequate is not good either. I also think Swan Cottage in Letton near Hereford is a CL not a CS but it is over 10years since I was last there so I could be wrong.
> 
> Since they are all now entered, there is no point in removing them unless they are identified as not being suitable for motorhomes and after all some information is better than nothing!
> 
> peedee


Hi Peedee

The positioning has been taken from the GPS information given in the club handbooks, sometimes I do wonder where they get the info :roll: I am sure that they ask the site owners but failing that I think that they use a post code convertor which can mean that the location is not pin point accurate.

As members review sites any details can be altered and info added that could be useful to a visiting member.

As he says above Barryd has just done a review of a campsite and he noted that the GPS was a bit out...I have just added his review and altered the location to the farm gate :wink: ( I hope it is right) , check it out, thanks Barry :

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/modules.php?name=Campsites&op=display_results&csid=8325 <<<<


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

Mike,

Sorry could not immediately come back to you but I had to go out. Swan Cottage at Letton outside Hereford on the A438 towards Hay on Wye is indeed a CL not a CS. It appears in the CC database but not in the C&CC one. What is also slightly worry is that the Swan Inn which is listed as a CS and is next door to Swan Cottage does not appear in the C&CC database either. It was certainly closed a long time ago because I tried to use it round about 2005 in preference to Swan Cottage which used to be difficult when wet. >deletion<

peedee

An after thought ..... just checked on the CC web site and the Swan Inn is also listed as a CL so it has re-opened. It used to have hard standings and electrics. It looks like both these sites have been entered as CS rather than CL. the correct positions are

Swan Inn 52 06' 40.27"N 2 58' 01.31"W about 50 yds further along the road towards Hay is Swan Cottage at 52 06' 40.98"N 2 58' 02.31"W


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## spykal (May 9, 2005)

peedee said:


> Mike,
> 
> Sorry could not immediately come back to you but I had to go out. Swan Cottage at Letton outside Hereford on the A438 towards Hay on Wye is indeed a CL not a CS. It appears in the CC database but not in the C&CC one. What is also slightly worry is that the Swan Inn which is listed as a CS and is next door to Swan Cottage does not appear in the C&CC database either. It was certainly closed a long time ago because I tried to use it round about 2005 in preference to Swan Cottage which used to be difficult when wet. >deletion<
> 
> ...


Hi Peedee

This is more complicated than it looks at first glance !

It seems as you say that the Swan Cottage entry was entered as a C&CC CS when in fact it is a CC CL. So that one was easy to fix. ( during the enter routine it is extremely easy to make a mistake and to roll the type of campsite over from one type to another in the drop down ...so maybe we will let autosites off on that one :wink: ( but good to get it right)

The Swan Inn or rather the Swan "Inns" is where the difficulty occurs as there does seem to be two Swan Inns. :wink:

The first is site ID 6630 a C&CC CS, The Swan Inn at Letton :

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/modules.php?name=Campsites&op=display_results&csid=6630

and although it does appear in the C&CC listing in the new 2011-2012 Big Sites book (on page 379) I cannot locate it on the C&CC own website using the search .... our database entry also shows "Big Sites Book Reference: 148/014 This site was last visited by a Site Officer in 2010"

So AFAIK that Swan Inn is correct

Then we have this one The Swan Inn at Kington Site ID 8601:

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/modules.php?name=Campsites&op=display_results&csid=8601

This one is a also a CC CL but our listing which has the correct address etc showed it as a CS so another one where "autosites" had finger problems. I have corrected this one too.

It was a little unusual having two pubs in the same area both called the Swan... it had me foxed for a while.

Entering all of these thousands of Club Sites, Cls and CSs was a massive task so I do hope that we manage to find any errors like this and that we can improve the database by adding member reviews and photographs to as many sites as possible

Thanks.

Mike


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

Thanks, you have got me wondering if The Swan Inn at Letton

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/modules.php?name=Campsites&op=display_results&csid=6630

is in fact still closed? I place more reliance on the web site info than the books as I believe it comes straight from the official records whereas the printed word can be out of date. It is not the end of the world I know, but it probably requires someone living/visiting in the area to clear this one up.

I periodically download fresh POIs from the club sites for my mapping rather than trying to keep up with all the magazine items regarding new sites and closures

peedee


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## spykal (May 9, 2005)

peedee said:


> Thanks, you have got me wondering if The Swan Inn at Letton
> 
> http://www.motorhomefacts.com/modules.php?name=Campsites&op=display_results&csid=6630
> 
> ...


Hi

Has it ever been closed, seems not recently anyway ...lookss to be a thriving pub with an active facebook page:

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=10523140987#!/group.php?gid=10523140987&v=wall

and the same family are running another pub at The Mortimers Cross " we are doing the same as the Swan, still family run"

Mike


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

I updated about 5 CL sites in Devon yesterday. Nearly all of them had incorrect Lat and Long (GPS). This is nothing to do with MHF but because the Caravan Club as previously mentioned must be using a post code converter rather than bothering to get proper GPS points from owners / visitors.

A few things to point out. The sites I have amended are now more accurate than the CC site as I have put in the right GPS points. I use a lot of CL sites and this happens all the time. The problem is most of the CL sites are in rural areas and postcodes are not always accurate. If we can get them all updated on here we will then have a more accurate database than the CC.

There is a link on each CL or CS site to the actual page on the club site so if you want more information if somebody hasn't filled it in just click the link and you will find out if it has hard standing, EHU, open all year etc.

What I did find a joy was the ease of finding the sites and edititing them. Locating on the map on here is so easy, whereas using the club sites search and map facility is a joke. From now on when Im looking I will look here first and if there is no information click to the link to the club site. 

Of course another big advantage is that it shows both CC and C&CC at the same time. You don't have to jump from one to the other. 

This fits my needs for the way I book and search CL sites perfectly.

cheers
BD


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## tonyt (May 25, 2005)

barryd said:


> I updated about 5 CL sites in Devon yesterday. Nearly all of them had incorrect Lat and Long (GPS). This is nothing to do with MHF but because the Caravan Club as previously mentioned must be using a post code converter rather than bothering to get proper GPS points from owners / visitors.
> 
> A few things to point out. The sites I have amended are now more accurate than the CC site as I have put in the right GPS points. I use a lot of CL sites and this happens all the time. The problem is most of the CL sites are in rural areas and postcodes are not always accurate. If we can get them all updated on here we will then have a more accurate database than the CC.
> 
> ...


And of course, in a couple of weeks time you'll have it all on a usb stick :wink:


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

I'm confused now. I found a CL that wasnt in the database but is still on the CC website. We used it last September. Did anyone do a count as to how many are on compared to how many the CC say should be on?

Hillside Farm 
MR L P GUNN
Hillside Farm
Feock
Truro
TR3 6RA
England

I went to enter it as a new campsite entry which took some considerable time. On the last screen I entered the GPS points (the right ones this time) and then it just went back to the search facility. I have no idea if this entry has gone in. Do I need to start again?

As regards the USB stick. Will it have the search by Map facility the same as on the site?


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