# European Campsite Guides



## 90740 (May 1, 2005)

I just got back after about five months touring around France and Spain. I'm heading back in a couple of weeks with plans to spend the winter months in a warmish area.
I used a lot of Aires in France and camp sites in Spain. Before I left I bought the two Caravan Club Campsite books for Europe. I found them very useful and I must admit I found some good places. Whilst I was in Spain a neighbour there was using a guide to campsites in Spain, if not Europe. The book was excellent. Apparently the author of the book had visited all the sites so there was a fairly good relative comparison of the sites available. I have previously seen the name of the book on the web but annoyingly I can't remember where ! The guide title is the basically the authors name. I think his name is also the name of a camping holiday organisation. Anyone like to offer any ideas as to the guide I am desperate to find?? 
Thanks jonh


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## dusty (May 27, 2005)

*Touring Spain*

Hi Jonh
Sorry I hav'nt got an answer to your camp site guide question but I am interested to know how you got on for bottled gas in Spain. I'm going down for a couple of months from 1st November and was considering starting with a 13kg propane bottle in my Hymer and buying a local bottle to use while I'm there using the 13kg as a fallback. Trouble is my locker will only take up to about another 7kg bottle. Would this be available and if so where from.
regards


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## 88838 (May 9, 2005)

jonh said:


> The guide title is the basically the authors name. I think his name is also the name of a camping holiday organisation. Anyone like to offer any ideas as to the guide I am desperate to find??
> Thanks jonh


?? Alan Rogers ??
http://www.alanrogers.com/New/homenew.html

8)


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## 90740 (May 1, 2005)

Twooks,
That's the name of the book !! Thanks, thanks, thanks. I lost some sleep last night trying to think of the name.

Gas in Spain.

We left the UK with a 7kg propane bottle and an empty adjacent space for another gas bottle as and when the need would arise. After having crossed over from Dover to Boulogne we set off for the Somme area. Stayed in a lovely little campsite just below Hawthorn crater. From there all the main sites were ''walkable'' - Newfoundland Park, The Sunken Road and so on. Anyway the gas ran out one morning as my wife was showering - she prefers the privacy of her own washrooom! That day we went to the Supermarket in Albert and after much debate we decided that the grey square looking cylinder on display at the petrol station would probably fit in to the space. 
The attendant took me inside the Supermarket and there I spoke with the Gas Lady. I signed a contract , handed over a few Euros and we were soon the proud owners of Le Cube and a combined regulator come valve isolation unit. Including the debate the whole process was quick and relatively easy. All we had to do afterwards was stop for diesel anywhere les cubes were sold which was nearly everywhere.

Spain
Well this is where it got a bit complicated. 
We spent a lot of time traversing the Pyrenees so found ourselves in France one day and Spain the next day. Whilst on the Spanish side our battery charger decided no longer to work on the mains side but was ok on the 12v side. As we have two batteries this wasn't a significant problem nevertheless we decided to get it replaced. We went to a dealer in France, three of them in fact, and they couldn't help. They suggested we go to Spain ! Yep, I was a bit stunned too ! We found a dealer in the Costa Brava area who was very helpful. He replaced the unit the day we arrived. (So back to the gas). The gas was low at this stage so we asked the chap who owned the garage how best to deal with the gas in Spain. He said that the problem in Spain, in order to get a cylinder, is that you need to make an application to Repsol or Cepra and wait weeks if not months for that application to be authorised. After that you can buy a cylinder and replace it as you need. (He also mentioned the need to have an address in Spain). My wife and I are both fluent Spanish speakers, my wife being part Spanish, so there was no doubting his words. BUT he said he would give us one of his own cylinders and all we needed to buy was the isolation unit which fits on top of the bottle. This we did and he fitted the cylinder isolation unit and our Dethleffs supplied regulator to the van. The same regulator we used in the UK also fits the Spanish units. I assume the Dethleffs supplied regulator is the same as that fitted to the Hymer?
So with our new 12/13 or 14 kg cylinder we set off back to Spain. I can never remember the weights of the cylinder other than it was about twice le cube and twice the UK one we left with. It fitted in very neatly alongside le cube (le cube being the same weight and very nearly the same size as the uk bottle) as the circumference is much the same. The difference is in the height and again no problem there. The cylinder was a Repsol unit and painted a nice orange. After a few days we were back in France just over the border. After a morning in one of the supermarkets, can't remember the name, we filled up with diesel. I noticed that they were selling large 12/13 or 14kg large orange Repsol cylinders just like the one we came by in Spain. At first I was surprised to see Spanish gas cylinders on sale in France but after a few kms. I noticed a lot of garages in France selling the same bottles. I assume the purchase of such a bottle would be as easy as buying le cube in Albert ? I concluded that that was the easy way to get round the Spanish red tape was to buy your Repsol unit in a French supermarket just over the border.
Well after a few weeks the orange Repsol cylinder was low. At a petrol station in Salamanca I met the Cepra man storing new cylinders in their various cages. I asked him if I could exchange our Repsol cylinder for a similar sized Cepra unit which was painted silver! He said no problem. It used exactly the same fittings. Anyway we exchanged the bottle and I signed a form stating that I was the purchaser and gave my address in the UK. It was easy. The bit that confused me was the chap then said I could keep the empty bottle ! I asked if that wasn't part of the bargain of getting a full cylinder to which he said no ! Maybe the process of exchanging, or at least getting a full bottle in Spain, was easy because the Attendant knew I had a Spanish cylinder in the first place. Thereagain I got the feeling that I could have just bought the Cepra unit from the petrol station as easy as it was to buy the petrol. Maybe it's the cylinder isolation unit which is controlled rather than the bottle?
I found no consistency in Spain when it came to rules and regulations. Most people have their own interpretation of what is right. 
So I'm not sure if I have answered your question. All I can say is that one person's opinion and experience of processes in Spain may not be that shared by another.
In conclusion buy your Spanish cylinder in border France. If that's not possible leave the UK with as much gas as you can. If that's not possible go to a large French supermarket in Spain( LeClerc or Carrefour) which sells Cepra bottles. A few campsites in Spain sell gas cylinders so they may be able to help in that Spanish way.
Sorry to have been a bit confusing in the matter but I can only relate how we managed to get ourselves on to the Spanish gas ladder and I suspect that there are as many different ways as there are buyers !!!!!!
ps i have Spanish friend in Spain at the moment and I will ask him to ask his local petrol station. B einteresting to hear the answer I suppose.


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## dusty (May 27, 2005)

*Spanish Gas*

Hello Jonh
Thanks for the reply and excellent info. The Spanish system does seem to be a bit haphazard and confused. I think that I will almost certainly try and by the Repsol or Cepra bottle in France as from what you say the system seems less restrictive and my French is a lot better than my Spanish which really is confined to the phrase book.
One problem I still have is that my gas locker will not take 2 12/13kg bottles and I would prefer to start of with a full 13kg from the UK. You mentioned that when you tried to exchange the Repsol for a Cepra bottle that the garage man was putting the Cepsa bottles "in their various cages." Does this imply that various sizes were available in the French supermarket and the Spanish garage and if so were they selling something around the 7kg size?
Sorry to bug you again but depending on your answer I will be able to decide to leave with a large or small UK bottle.
regards


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## 90740 (May 1, 2005)

Dusty,
Apparently the silver Cepra bottle I bought, or exchanged, in Spain is 7kg. Physically it looks the same external size as the 13ish kg Repsol bottle. I got the impression that the external dimensions of the two bottles are the same but the actual pressure holding volume of the 13kg Repsol cylinder is greater than the 7kg Cepra bottle I now have. It looks as if the diameters of the pressure part of the cylinder is the same but the actual length of the pressure part of the cylinder is greater for the 13kg bottle compared to the 7 kg bottle which makes sense. Nevertheless to look at both bottles side by side there is no significant dimensional difference, other than more internal empty space within the 7kg bottle 
In my gas locker I can fit a 7kg UK bottle with either a 7 or 13 kg Spanish bottle. I can also fit a 7kg cube with any of the above. Each bottle takes up 50% of the compartment. If I wanted to I could fit two 13kg Spanish bottles. I have never used a 13 kg UK bottle. If the 13 kg UK bottle has a significantly greater diameter than the 7kg UK bottle, which is about the same size as the cube, I would have difficulty fitting a Spanish 7 or 13 kg bottle!

The 7kg bottle I bought cost about 7 to 8 euros.

I note that you are leaving on the 1st of Nov. We should be back in Spain on the 30th. I could e mail you with the dimensions then. Our van is presently in Spain. Are you spending winter in Spain??


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## dusty (May 27, 2005)

*Spanish Gas*

Hello Jonh,
Thanks again for the prompt reply.
Yes, we are intending to spend about 6/7 weeks in Spain then motor to Germany to spend Christmas & New Year with my eldest daughter who lives just outside Munich. Then home for a couple of weeks and perhaps if we have enjoyed it back to South of France/Spain/Portugal for February & March, then home for the golf season. Your suggestion about e-mail is very kind but I will have left home 2/3 days before 30th to see my youngest daughter in Shepperton before we leave and my decisions about gas will probably have to have been tahen by then.
My hymer locker is designed for 2 German 11kg bottles. It will just take the depth of a UK 13kg bottle(which is approx 40" circumference) but not 2. I can comfortably get a UK 7kg in alongside the 13kg. 
For preference I would like to leave with a full 13kg bottle if I can get something around the dimensions of a 7kg UK bottle in Spain. If this is not possible I will have to do as you did and start of with a 7KG bottle which I feel gives less leeway for emergencies.
regards


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## 90740 (May 1, 2005)

Not standing next to my gas locker but my view is that if you have room for a UK 7kg you have room for the French cube of the same size. That being the case I can fit a Spanish 7 or 13 alongside a cube or UK 7. Each cylinder, regardless of 7, 13, UK, French or Spanish occupies very nearly the same space, in my case each occupies half the gas locker. So if you have room for a UK 7 comfortably my gut feel is that you probably will have room for a 7 or 13 of any nationality. 
We're making our way towards the south od Spain after having crossed the country over that last two or three months. If you enjoy golf you may be a fisherman too. We spent a lot of time trout fishing in the Pyrenees which is a wonderful way to see the stunning countryside of that area. I preferred the Catalonia area for crossing over in to Spain because of the rich history and attractive medieval towns. You can also take advantage of the Aires on the French side on the way down which is a benefit too !
Hope you enjoy your time there.
As for the gas regardless of which cylinder you take you will always have gas available in your motorhome. What we have works for us but I'm sure there are other solutions for other situations and requests,
Jonh


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## dusty (May 27, 2005)

*spanish gas*

I think as a result of your info that I will set off with a UK 7kg. I intend to take 2/3 days to get down to the border when from what you say I should be able to pick up a Spanish 7 or 13kg and then just exchange on from there as necessary.
I intend to enter Spain on the Atlantic side by Biarritz and San Sebastian as I want to go to Compostella and have alook around Galicia. Although I'm not an angler I do enjoy seafood and I gather the quality and availability is good over there.I would think we will return through Barcelona on our way up to Germany. 
Thanks again for your assistance 
Bon Journee
Dusty


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## 93158 (May 1, 2005)

*Alan Rogers guides*

I inspect sites for this guide and beleive me the reports are accurate warts and all.

Watch out for the new central Europe guide due out in January 2005. Lots of new sites in Poland, Austria and the Baltic States. great to visit in the summer!


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## 92914 (May 1, 2005)

We used the Alan Rogers guide to travel through Belgium, Holland, Germany and Austria last year and YES the comments are very accurate. We also use Camping Cheques (connected to Alan Rogers) and work with both of these books.
The only problem we encountered in 4 months was in a site we used which was not listed in either of these, NEVER AGAIN, so now we only work from these. The sites in Austria are fantastic - and are covered by Camping Cheques. These are a great way of touring. Let me know if you need any info on any of the sites or travels we had
Frankie


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## 88847 (May 9, 2005)

Re gas cylinders

is there a limit to the amount of bottles you can carry abroad

ie i have 2x7kg bottles in my gas locker, could i carry 1 or 2 13 kg bottles in the storage space at the back

Paul


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## 91929 (May 1, 2005)

*Campsite europe*

We tend to use the Camping Cheque sites.
Then you also pick up 'new' sites & DONT GO sites from other campers

Sometimes the info in a book recommended site is written by the proprietor

Prefer the up to date recommendations by campers if we can get it

Avoid Olaho Nr Faro they have some v Nasty caterpillers


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## 93158 (May 1, 2005)

*Campsite Guides*

Believe me the entries in the Alan Rogers series of guides are not written by the proprieters!

This year I have visited 150 sites in 9 contries. And the reports that will be printed are my views not the owners.


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## 92914 (May 1, 2005)

keep up the good work mikea!. We live our motorhome life with camping cheques and the Alan Rogers Guides (France, Spain and the Europe one). We have been to about 28 of these and have NEVER had a probelm. The only time we had a problem was in germany in a site which was not in any of the Alan Roger's guides. (We stopped here because of the distance between sites)All the others were true to their word. I envy you your job but it must be a lot of work. We buy the up to date AR guides every year. and NO we don't work for AR nor are we any of the proprieters (worse luck).
Frankie


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