# E H I C Refusal



## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/ne...rm=05-Mar-13&utm_campaign=news&utm_content=43

tony :?


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## Glandwr (Jun 12, 2006)

Should we expect to be treated differently to the locals? As austerity is imposed on them and they are required to privatise all why should we be treated differently? We need extra health insurance and can't rely on state funding. Surely that's a good thing Tony? 

Wouldn't be long under Hunt before we need it here too 

Dick :lol:


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## oldun (Nov 10, 2005)

Glandwr said:


> Should we expect to be treated differently to the locals? As austerity is imposed on them and they are required to privatise all why should we be treated differently? We need extra health insurance and can't rely on state funding. Surely that's a good thing Tony?
> 
> Wouldn't be long under Hunt before we need it here too
> 
> Dick :lol:


I agree we are going down the pan fast - but that's what always happens when countries grossly overspends, as we have done up to now.

We have no money left to spend on anything, except mp's salaries and expenses.

If we continue to borrow at the rate we are at the moment then in a few years we will be like Greece, now that's unthinkable surely!"


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

What's that to do with the posted topic :?: :?: :?: 

tony


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## peribro (Sep 6, 2009)

Glandwr said:


> Wouldn't be long under Hunt before we need it here too


That won't be a bad thing if it makes people think twice before they self harm through obesity, smoking, alcohol abuse etc. I know several people who place large demands on the NHS because of their chosen lifestyles. In my view they should be paying for themselves so that the available funding can be used to treat those who have fallen ill through no fault of their own.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Do you drive a car Peter, or play a sport, cross the road etc. etc.

If so you may get hurt while engaging in any of these dangerous activities and as you did those things voluntarily then .............., Alan.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

peribro said:


> Glandwr said:
> 
> 
> > Wouldn't be long under Hunt before we need it here too
> ...


You need to remove self harming from that list, that is a mental health issue, and different to the rest.


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## sweetie (Nov 28, 2005)

GEMMY said:


> What's that to do with the posted topic :?: :?: :?:
> 
> tony


Most of his posts are off topic :!:

Steve


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## rosalan (Aug 24, 2009)

If Juan visits this country, he will expect to be treated for nothing. If John visits Spain, this should be reciprocal. Simples?!?

I do understand that some hospitals in Spain are privately run and as in this land, fees will arise.

The problem seems to be that we, the travellers, may not be aware of what medical centre we use; private or public. We may furthermore be presented with a consent form in Spanish that is also a recognition of our agreement to pay.

The onus is on us to understand the situation, which may be equally difficult for a non-English speaker in the UK.

Alan


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

Surely the key point is to check before you ask for treatment what the EHIC card covers and if it is acceptable?

If Juan turns up at an English hospital and is NOT registered as being able to use the NHS system they will get emergency treatment (life saving and stabilising) but not a lot more....... they will also be asked to pay for some items which are not covered by those considerations......

Many hospitals now have prominent signs stating that free treatment is available ONLY for UK residents, others may be asked for proof of suitable cover i.e. the version of the EHIC card issued by their country of residence.

Since many medical units in EU countries are privately run, why should they accept the EHIC card? This is an inter-governmental arrangement and a private unit could not reclaim the expenditure - hence why they request private health insurance......

If as an NHS patient you turned up at a Nuffield type hospital, would you expect them to accept you and treat you without adequate means of payment - either an insurance policy or a large bank balance to cover the costs..... ?

We do not choose to go to privately run units in the UK unless we have that cover, we have therefore made the same choice that we should make in France, Greece, Spain or any other country that offers reciprocal health cover under the EHIC scheme. 

This question has been raised before when people have reported being suddenly in need of care in Spain and where you go dictates the outcome - you may have to travel a lot further to a unit that is NOT privately run - hence the need to check before going......

Dave


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## oldun (Nov 10, 2005)

GEMMY said:


> What's that to do with the posted topic :?: :?: :?:
> 
> tony


Gemmy (or Tony!). Perhaps you are new to forums but you will soon find that about 85% of all posts are off topic (quite a few of them here). Many postare just puerile attempts at schoolboy humour but most are idle chit chat, so you should not be too surprised when you find a post that you feel is unhelpful and off topic.

However you are missing the point I was trying to make and that is when times are extremely hard families and countries have to cut out all of the fat (and most of the meat) in order to survive and it's not surprising that Greece has decided to dump some of its commitments to outsiders.

This is meant to be a friendly forum. perhaps you should remember that in future. I try to but sometimes I am upset by the rudeness of the odd few posters.


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

ooooohhhh :roll: 

tony


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

Perhaps if you reread your post oldun you will see why it's relevance was raised........

We all know that most threads go off topic very frequently.......

that often leads to useful discoveries so is not always a bad thing.

BUT your original post, while expressing true points about the financial state of many, if not most European countries does not relate to the points about the refusal to accept EHIC cards in privately run medical establishments.....

*quote from "oldun"*
_I agree we are going down the pan fast - but that's what always happens when countries grossly overspends, as we have done up to now. 
We have no money left to spend on anything, except mp's salaries and expenses. 
If we continue to borrow at the rate we are at the moment then in a few years we will be like Greece, now that's unthinkable surely!"_

MP's salaries and expenses are nothing to do with this refusal,
Most countries have "grossly overspent" for the last few decades - but that is difficult and very painful to change in the long term and in the short term is proving impossible in many countries.....including Greece.. 

I do not think Greece HAS decided to "dump some of it's commitments to outsiders"...... what was reported was that PRIVATE establishments do not recognise the EHIC card system - WHY SHOULD THEY ?

Our (UK) Private hospitals do not give free treatment to overseas visitors (or even UK residents) - why should they?

The forum generally is a friendly place but at times posts may be questioned for content or relevance - that is the nature of open exchanges within the rules of the forum......

Gemmy has challenged me in the past, but I do not lose sleep over such things - it is good IMO to have one's contributions questoned - at least it shows someone has read them..... :lol:

Dave


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## pete4x4 (Dec 20, 2006)

An EHIC card only allows the holder to the same level of care as the locals, you still have to pay and hopefully claim it back when you get home.
In addition I think my travel insurance is based on me having an EHIC card, without it I don't think I'm covered. I'm with Insure & Go


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

I wouldn't travel without health insurance

in the general cost of travelling in a motorhome it's not a huge expenditure

no one would travel without van insurance and health is much more important

I'm not sure if I needEHIC as well but I assume we do and carry the card

have used it for dental treatment in France and did not attempt to reclaim as it was much the same cost as I would have paid in England on NHS 

aldra


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## listerdiesel (Aug 3, 2012)

We have worldwide multi-trip cover, and wouldn't dream of going anywhere without it.

We took our two step-granddaughters to the USA in 2009, and one required attention during the flight outbound and on arrival. The bill for the local treatment in California was $US 2400.00 which included the ambulance that met the aircraft at San Francisco.

You never know what is going to happen, accident, act of God, whatever, and we have the EHIC cards as well, but touch wood have never needed them.

I wouldn't expect private healthcare in European countries unless directed there by a local Doctor or Hospital that couldn't attend our injuries or medical condition. 

Greek hospitals aren't bad at all, I had cause to use one when in Greece working on a film in 1981, but they are desperately short of funding and if they need to restrict how they operate then that's fine by me. I can't see anyone losing treatment, just a more restricted choice of where to go.

Peter


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## 747 (Oct 2, 2009)

As far as I can gather (from similar posts on other forums) the problem seems to be that patients can be taken by Ambulance to a Private Hospital. They do not speak or read the language and just sign whatever forms are put in front of them.

It would not seem to be a matter of a direct refusal to treat ..... more a case of ignorance on their part. I have a suspicion that the Ambulance crews know a Private from a Public Hospital. :lol: 

As for our member 'oldun'. If you check his recent posts you will find they are not exactly friendly. 'Ye reap what ye sow' springs to mind. 8O


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## Patrick_Phillips (Aug 17, 2006)

It seems to me that there is an issue which we are not talking about:
The private sector in some countries is seeing the tourist as rich pickings if they can divert them from using their EH1C and some are being downright deceitful about their methods.
There will be tendency amongst those, even ambulance drivers, who see their hospitals and pharmacies short of drugs because the government can't afford them, to try and encourage "rich" Northern Europeans to use the private sector which their "luxury" health insurance will pay for rather than drain the public sector even more.
I suggest none of this has to do with local governments and their austerity policies.
Another case of salacious reporting...

Patrick


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## bigcats30 (Aug 13, 2012)

They can charge me all they want....I have nothing to give them when it comes to paying, so it's pointless pushing me into the private healthcare side.


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## 747 (Oct 2, 2009)

What I found rather strange on another Motorhome forum was that a member, who works in the travel industry recommended that private medical insurance should always be taken out when motorhoming abroad. His reasoning was that it gave much more comprehensive cover.

The anger and vitriol that he got from motorhomers for saying it was unbelievable. I just could not believe it. 8O


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## Patrick_Phillips (Aug 17, 2006)

747 said:


> What I found rather strange on another Motorhome forum was that a member, who works in the travel industry recommended that private medical insurance should always be taken out when motorhoming abroad. His reasoning was that it gave much more comprehensive cover.
> 
> The anger and vitriol that he got from motorhomers for saying it was unbelievable. I just could not believe it. 8O


I think people are sick & tired of the private health insurance making it seem essential to buy their products when it patently isn't.
The other factor is that for full-timers it isn't on offer so anything that weakens the EHIC agreements will be seen as a threat.

Personally, we don't carry travel insurance because we travel too much for the companies to consider and, when you look at what the private sector can cover, they are just cherry-picking the easy stuff. You still need a state sector for anything serious.

What we do have is an emergency fund which other members of the family can get at with enough money to get us home if we need it. Is that what they call self-insured?

These things can get people rather emotional!

Patrick


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## oldun (Nov 10, 2005)

Penquin said:


> Perhaps if you reread your post oldun you will see why it's relevance was raised........
> 
> We all know that most threads go off topic very frequently.......
> 
> ...


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

No comment :?: or from me :lol: 

tony


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## sweetie (Nov 28, 2005)

GEMMY said:


> No comment :?: or from me :lol:
> 
> tony


He,s behind you :lol: :lol:

Steve


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## MyGalSal (Dec 8, 2008)

Last year I took ill in Spain. I visited a walk-in clinic, saw a doctor who referred me immediately to the 'Urgencies' (A&E)dept at the nearest hospital for tests and treatment. The walk-in clinic accepted my EHIC, the hospital did not - and it was a state hospital. I offered my EHIC at the hospital and they took it off me but then asked if I had insurance. I replied honestly that I had travel insurance. They then handed me back my EHIC and said they would not accept it and I must use my insurance.

Then ensued an argument between the hospital, me and my insurance company. We had a 3-way telephone conversation. I insisted that hospital and insurance must speak with each other to sort the ridiculous situation out. It didn't work! Hospital's position was that because I had insurance they would not accept the EHIC. Insurance company's position was that state hospitals in Spain MUST accept the EHIC. The insurance company told me my insurance was not for private treatement. I assured them I was not seeking private treatment but that I was in a state hospital. The insurance company told me I should have denied having insurance! Can you believe that? When I asked them what was I paying for - the cost of the annual multi-trip plus the extra costs for medical conditions I had declared, they said the the insurance was not for medical costs but for repatriation, accommodation costs for spouse etc. (Although on the policy it stated something in the region of £100,000 for hospital costs etc. I forget now the amount but it was the usual type of stuff).

In the end I paid the hospital and after a struggle the insurance company reimbursed me but were quite adamant that if I had any further problems I must deny having insurance and use my EHIC.

I am sure you all remember that song, by Harry Belafonte I think, 'There's a hole in the bucket, dear Lisa, dear Lisa'..........

Anyway bottom line is that for the first time I have come to Spain without insurance. What is the point? I refuse to lie and deny having insurance if I have it, and what is the point in paying for insurance - plus the extra for declared medical conditions , which by the way had nothing to do with my illness last year, if they won't cover you for emergency medical treatment?

And FYI my annual multi-trip travel insurance was with the C&CC.

Sal


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