# Another scooter thread



## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

Due to ageing joints, I'm in the process of selling my motorbikes and changing over to scooter transport. 

I already have my main scoot sorted but I want a smaller one that I can put on the rack on the back of the van. Can't be doing with the hassle of a trailer.

I've been researching 125s but they are mostly too heavy. However I have just discovered the Piaggio Liberty 125 which weighs in at 95kg (official figures!).

Trouble is, the nearest one I can find to look at is in Bristol, a 200 mile round trip, so I wondered if anyone here has any experience of that model that I could ask a few basic questions before I make the trek up the M5.

'Twould be much appreciated if anyone can help.


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## VJP (Dec 8, 2010)

These types of questions come up time and time again re weight of scooters then go off on a tangent about axle weights and down forces on tow bars etc.
Therefore, there must be a market for a true 125cc or larger scooter that is stripped down, capable of taking two 'adult' sized people and is sub 100kgs.
I have not ridden one, but I have sat on a Liberty. I need two of them, one for each buttock, but then I am 16st and 6'4".


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

VJP said:


> I have not ridden one, but I have sat on a Liberty. I need two of them, one for each buttock, but then I am 16st and 6'4".


I'm 16stone too, but I fancy you are somewhat better proportioned! :lol:

I really want a 4stroke, hate all that noise and smoke and oiled up plugs, but modern scoots are so lardy and burdened with bodywork and stupid names. I sat on a Peugeot Tweet today (whoever came up with that name?) but my helmet wouldn't fit under the seat. It weighs 106kgs dry which I think is as near to 100 as I'm going to find in a 4stroke.

I guess I'll just have to budget for an open face hat to go with it. Will also have to budget for some tape to cover up the name! :roll:


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## TheNomad (Aug 12, 2013)

Option.......Honda innova. 125cc. Just 103kgs. four stroke. four speed gearbox. Totally bulletproof. big wheels so stable. carries us two any distance at 50mph plus. 
But with any scooter do check the max weight it carry.


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

The Innova seems a great bike, but I'm looking for a step-thru type. I'm done with togging up in all the boots and stuff plus I'm trying to future-proof myself for joints getting worse. As the larger scoot will have CVT, I might as well complete my geriatric downfall and have CVT on the littl'un too. :roll: Thanks for the input though, really appreciated.


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

Wise decision on Tuggy

We also considered that following a longish drive the knees tend to seize a bit so easier to just step through to get off

We are looking at the narrow transverse trailer as we definatelely don't feel with our overhang carrying a scooter would be an option although the back axle is plated at 2240,with rear suspension and enhanced tyres still a question of balance though and we need the garage for you know who :lol: 

Happy hunting Tuggy

sandra


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

Thank you, babe, 'tis all good fun! :lol:


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## alexblack13 (Feb 10, 2013)

Hi Folks, 

My little classic Douglas Vespa Sportique (1965) goes everywhere with us and when I 'strip it' for transport. Seat and spare wheel / luggage rack removed and carried inside the van. The scoot weighs in at approx 70 kgs.. Sticking it onto the rack lowers the back of the van by about 5 mm....

Happy days..

It is a great talking point too and if we happen on any classic shows we always get an invite to join in.. Great fun..

We are thinking of something more modern as the wee bike is anything but quick. 50 is it's max and hills are great fun.... So we too are busy looking at something lightweight but powerful (comparitively) speaking.

I'm a real stickler for weight and spend lots of time trying hard to get rid of it... Add lightness (a La Lotus) is my moto...

Al' ....


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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)

Liberty 125 ? We have one , bought it primarily as our other little scooter has only 10" wheels which I considered a bit dangerous . The Liberty has a 16" front and a 14" rear which does make it handle very well, like a motorbike. I would dispute the 95kilos, feels heavier. The seat height is quite high . Brakes and suspension are v good, as are the lights. Enough power , will hold 60mph on a flat road and overall a smooth ride. The flip out passenger footrests are great.It has an immobiliser. Lovely looking scooter.
Here's what I don't like. This is the biggest drawback, if you need to take the rear wheel off you have to remove the exhaust but this is one piece all the way to the manifold, even with the scooter lying on it's side one of the manifold nuts is nearly impossible to access.
The scooter is quite long, with the rack on when you pull it back onto the stand in the MH you still have to jiggle it forward a bit to get the MH door closed. The back box has no cutaway for the passengers back which means they sit forward more which leaves you sitting on the narrow front part of the seat in a crunched up position. 
Because of the 14" rear wheel there is not much room under the seat, you cannot get a full face helmet or even a big open face one in there. The engine , not the exhaust, makes an annoying whinning sound. Like most recent things the quality is not as good as the pre 2000 stuff, too many flimsy plastic bits clip together. The front mudguard is mounted above the yoke so the wheel throws all the crud up in there to rust the frame, same lack of road protection elsewhere underneath. The stand is narrow with small footprint, no good on soft ground.
Ours is a 2007 cream model brown seat with about 2000miles on it - for sale £650 if anyone wants it
So overall we prefer our 1996 Piaggio Sfera , quality build, shorter lower, lighter, much more room, easy to load secure and unload, great center stand with steadies out both sides but the small wheels , poor brakes and dim lights are it's drawbacks.
Perhaps one of the newer Hondas with 12 " wheels would be a good compromise.


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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)

p.s. - we are small people , if you are big people two of you will not fit on a Liberty.


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## Snunkie (Mar 21, 2011)

We have a honda vision 125 with a kerb weight of 102kgs. Lovely to ride, does about 60mph tops. Was £1800 brand new in 2012. We like it :wink:


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## OrdinaryJoe (Apr 25, 2014)

*Piaggio B125*

Hi

We have a 2004 Piaggio B125 that sits on the rack behind the Hymer B644. The big wheels make it it an easy ride and goes well with two up. Only thing to watch for it the extra overhang issues, but I cant fault the scooter. Just wish I could carry the ZZR1100 lol ;-)

pic here
http://s1048.photobucket.com/user/jfdi1/media/IMG_5232_zpsc9d2d4c9.jpg.html?sort=3&o=33


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

tugboat said:


> my helmet wouldn't fit under the seat. It weighs 106kgs dry


Do you get a to a lot of race meeting then  

Big Ed.


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

alexblack13 said:


> Hi Folks,
> 
> My little classic Douglas Vespa Sportique (1965) goes everywhere with us
> Al' ....


Hi Al.

Vespa Sportique? Blimey, that brings back memories. I had a 150 Sportique back in 1966 as my first 2 wheeler. Looking at the modern Vespas, they still look the same.....footbrake, gearchange on the left grip. You'd never know there was an FI 4-stroke underneath. Ah, nostalgia!


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

@ Gretchibald.

Thanks so much for all that info, that's just the sort of feedback I was looking for. A dealer woulddn't tell you they started with the back wheel and then built the rest of the machine around it!

P.S. I am big people, but on my own, so can spread myself out a bit! :lol:


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

Hi Joe,

The B125 weighs in at a whopping 149kg dry, according to the specs, so that's out for me I'm afraid. I like the Bevs though, I'm getting the 350 version for my main scoot.


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

Snunkie said:


> We have a honda vision 125 with a kerb weight of 102kgs. Lovely to ride, does about 60mph tops. Was £1800 brand new in 2012. We like it :wink:


Hi Snunkie,

Thanks for that. I'm assuming your scoot is 110cc rather than 125?

Can you tell me what the storage space is like under the seat please. Can you fit any helmet under there, full or open face?

I'm guessing that being a Honda the build quality is OK?


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## Zebedee (Oct 3, 2007)

> tugboat said:- . . . my helmet wouldn't fit under the seat. It weighs 106kgs . . .


Sorry - I must get my sense of humour seen to!!!! 8O

I suddenly had an image of you looking a bit like this bloke . . .

http://www.dandare.org/dan/aliens/mekon/mekon.htm

. . . though not necessarily in that rather fetching Brussels sprout colour! :roll:

Dave


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

Haha, you and Kev should get together. If you see him, give him a smack for me willya? :lol:


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## Zebedee (Oct 3, 2007)

Hadn't seen Kev's post.

Either great minds thinking alike, or a right pair of eejits!! 8O 

Dave :wink:


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## TheNomad (Aug 12, 2013)

Just checking that the OP is aware the Honda Inoova 125cc is a stepthrough style "scooter", it isn't a "motorbike" style machine, so there's no problems with dismounting if a bit stiff after a run. 

Also as it's semi automatic there's no hand clutch to worry about, but it has the fuel efficiency of 4 distinct gears rather than the energy-sapping CVT style transmission.

It's also got a fuel gauge, which is extermely useful, and which many scooters don't.

Oh, and spares, brake pads etc, and servicing costs are actually (surprisingly!) astonishingly cheap.


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

Oh Bwahahaha, what a laugh I've had!

Following Snunkie's mention of the Vision 110 and it's weight I decided it was worth a look 'cos one doesn't need a lot of power to do a bit of shopping or whatever.

I rang up a garage that had a few for sale and arranged to go over for a test ride. Well, what a hoot, the twist and go thing is addictive and so easy. The Vision is so small and light it's ridiculous, Gawd knows what a lump like me looks like sitting on it, but WTH it's fun.

I collect mine on Friday, and I think it will be known as The Filter Machine. I hared around the city passing all the gridlock and had a huge grin. It's 2 years old, 800 miles on the clock and is absolutely showroom mint, the alloy castings still have their shine. It is a lot lighter than the trailbike I currently carry on the back of the MH and will be a lot easier to keep clean.

Final bonus is, a large chap like me won't have to ride round on a scoot called TWEET!

Thanks all who responded to my OP.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

tugboat said:


> The Vision is so small and light it's ridiculous, Gawd knows what a lump like me looks like sitting on it, but WTH it's fun.


I'd hazard a guess if I may Tuggs.

Does it look like you ate it for breakfast yesterday, and it now just passing out.


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

I was riding along, looked down and I thought.....

I don't remember eating that! :lol:


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

Ignore them all my Tuggy

You will look great

Glad you got a scooter that pleases you

Enjoy

Aldra


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

I don't think it's that good    

If it is I'll have one.


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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)

For Alexblack13 . Apologies to O.P. and other non interested parties- it wouldn't let me send a link in the PMs.


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## alexblack13 (Feb 10, 2013)

Brill. TKS Bud..

I will PM you again regarding..

AB




Appologies to OP for this wee intrusion. ;-(


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## flyinghigh (Dec 10, 2012)

Just back from a trip to Devon and took our Vision110 down into porlock for a trip, with both my wife and me and wasn't sure if we could come back up the 1 in 4 hill out of porlock or use the gentler toll road instead,

Well it was a bit of a struggle but she kept moving so well impressed with the results, that was also carrying some shopping back to the MH,
A great little scooter IMHO


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

alexblack13 said:


> Brill. TKS Bud..
> 
> I will PM you again regarding..
> 
> ...


Thash kwite orwite. :lol:


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

Blimey, 2 people and shopping up the hill from Porlock? Amazing.


Just brought mine home on the back of the MH. Having a cuppa, then going out for a giggle. I may be gone some time.

In fact, I may just go out during rush hour purely to **** people off. :lol:


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

Tuggy don't let AB get away with it  

He should take a lead from me, me who never posts off topic 8O 

Why would you try to **** people off??

You can do that without trying :lol: 

Photo needed of you and ???? 

Have you named it 
The dream machine
Sandra


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

Oh hahaha, what a hoot. I went out on the scoot in rush hour for my first ride round my home town.

I think I did 2 circuits of the town and a bit of shopping, before the queues had moved a hundred yards. This place is a traffic nightmare in season, and 2 wheels is the only way to make progress.

I discovered a side benefit today. The underseat storage area gets warm, so my helmet will be lovely and warm to put on when I return with my shopping in the winter.

I reckon I'm going to become a real scooter hooligan. I felt I wanted to stick my legs out like Mary Poppins.:lol: No more sweaty nuts in the summer, no more cold nuts in the winter. Scooters are the way forward, people.


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

Far to much information :lol: 

Nuts should be stored in the fridge to preserve them

not Mary Berry

But nearly

I think your nuts may still get cold in the winter, but if you clench your knees who knows

I have no experience of maintaining the temp in nuts

I'll wait to be advised
:lol: 

What??, I'm interested in all things medical

Aldra


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

The sun is shining this morning and Hurricane Bertha is due tomorrow, so Ellie is going to be a scooter widow this morning while I go out to terrorise the local streets with some hooliganism. 

Shall I take a stick to poke in the wheels of cyclists? I could spear old ladies' shopping trolleys. I could do wheelies (yeah, right) in the supermarket carpark.

Come on, you closet tearaways, give me some anarchic ideas. Where's Barry when I need him? :roll: :lol:


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## dalspa (Jul 1, 2008)

Watch out for squirrels with all those nuts about. Best to hide them in the underseat storage and have roasted nuts :lol: 

DavidL


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

Blimey, who'da'thoughtit? Gotta watch out for squirrels! Never had this problem when riding big bikes. :lol:


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

You prob just squashed them

You wildlife murderer :lol: 

The squirrels not your nuts :lol: idiot 

I can see your mind working 8O 

Sandra


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

The silly buggers are supposed to be in trees, not on the road. Serve 'em right for trespassing. Vroom vroom! :lol:


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Good choice my little hooligan friend! Great! Now at the next Fruitcakes meet we can have scooter races between beers. 

Glad you didn’t go for the Liberty as I think the newer ones were 120KG! Dunno where you got 95kg.

I came within a hairs breadth of buying a vision off a member before we came away but (and this is going to sound daft) I couldn’t bear to part with the “Pig” our little 100cc Peugeot Speedfight on which we have done over 11000 miles across 10 countries over the past 6 years. The way things are going on this trip I might live to regret that decision.

I did a lot of research and the vision seemed to be the way to go. You did will to get a used one with only 800 miles they are like hens teeth.

You can actually pull a wheelie on a Scooter Tuggers. It should be extra easy for you. All you need to do is put your backside towards the rear rack and your feet on the back pegs, accelerate and lift the front end. You should have no bother at all! 

Of course I assume now as your bezzie mate I will now be getting a 650 Transalp for next to nothing on my return. 

You will need to sort out a doggie carrier for Ellie. No I’m not joking. I have seen them in Europe. Just like a top box.

Have Fun!


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

Woop woop, Barry.

Good to hear from you, buddy, and sorry about your exhaust woes. Hope you manage to get it fixed without it costing too many Leffe tokens!

I'm dead chuft with the little Vision and can see me turning into an ageing scooter hooligan, weaving in and out of the stalled traffic queues and generally p...ing off the drivers with my amazing dexterity and flamboyance. The scoot is so light and narrow, and the CofG is so low, such a difference from even my lightest bikes.

The Vision is great on the flat but will struggle I think on the Devon hills so I wouldn't want to go far. Not a problem as I'm trading one of the bikes for a Beverly 350 which will be more practical for the open road. The Vision is mainly to go on the back of the van, and to do the shopping here at home.

I've got someone coming to look at the Serows this afternoon so hoping at least one of them will be sold today. I badly need the space. I have a total of 18 wheels at home atm! :roll: :lol: 

Ah, the next Fruitcakes meet........scoot races and duelling banjos, it's gonna be major fun! You can teach me wheelies then.

Take care, matey.


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

You might be surprised when it comes to the hills.

I think the Vision 110cc is a similar output to our Speedfight. About 8 point something KW or HP Sauce, sumfink like that.

We have done two tours of Devon and Cornwall and back when I was a right FB! Heavier than you and two up and it got up just about anything.

Ok it wont screem up at 50mph but when they drop down to the lower gears they will pull up most stuff at around 20 mph. It wont just grind to a hault.

The best one we did was 7500ft up to the Snow line in the Pyrenees where the road became a ski slope. The little engine was screaming and was so hot at the top it was melting the snow around it.

You should have no problem on your own anywhere really.


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## Geriatricbackpacker (Aug 21, 2012)

After having a Vespa 200ccc sport when I was 17 and having the damn thing try a kill me on numerous occasions couldn't wait to get rid of it. The large lump of an engine hanging off one side of the thing made it really unstable. I couldn't wait to get rid of it (seeing the price of them now I wish I had kept it) and swore I would never ride one again.
Fast forward hundreds of years and we now have a little Honda Activa that we hire for three months each year when we go to India. We travel miles on the poor little thing, two up with a rucksack attached over the front faring the rear carrier laden down and the under seat locker. It grinds along and has actually reached 60kph...downhill with a favorable wind. I keep saying that I will get one for the back of the van but we would struggle with the additional weight and I don't fancy towing a trailer. 

I can see the advantage of having a bike, Barry will probably end up towing Hank with his if he keeps on persisting with his systematic demolition of the poor van.

Have fun Tuggers and keep it on the black stuff!


Terry


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

I had to take the MH in for some work about 10 miles away this morning, so put the wee Honda on the back to ride home.

Well, it chucked it down on the way back and there were big puddles everywhere. We are blighted by poorly maintained roadside drains round here.

Anyway, I was a bit wary of how Little Whizz would cope with the wet as she only has wee 14" wheels, but there were no problems. Cornering and braking were all fine. Dead chuft with my little scoot.

Less than a week now till I can take Big Bev out for a first ride, can't wait.

Incidentally, I'm finding the Vision so handy for loading on the back of the van. Much lighter than the bike I used to carry, and the CofG is much lower, so very much easier to secure. Doesn't need half as many straps as the bike did.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Can't have too many straps.


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## dgg (Aug 21, 2013)

Hi folks. 

We bought a Vision 110 this time last year to go in the garage of our newly acquired s/hand Hymer. It fits a treat with the mirrors and topbox removed. And it's so light I can lift it in (carefully) without a ramp on my own. A doddle with two of us.

It's taken us all over the place here and abroad, up hill and down dale, without missing a beat. We're about 23 stone in old money between us. I had thought of carrying one of our trail bikes on a towbar mount but glad I didn't go that route now. I did just manage to get a trailie in the garage once I'd removed the front wheel and bent the mudguard slightly but all in all it was too much of a faff.


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## Bovisand (Jan 16, 2008)

Our Vision 110 on an Easylifter trailer.
Takes our combinded 23 stone up easily - hills no problem.
Absolutely love it.
Only draw back, very poor under seat storage - won't even take a helmet - but no big deal really, just hang the helmets from the seat and close it over the straps.
-
Been to Croatia and Greece with it.
The trailer always draws an audience - as you can see.


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

That's strange, my medium full face helmet fits under my seat. It's snug, mind you.


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## dgg (Aug 21, 2013)

My open face fits easily under the seat.


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

Open face every time, can't smoke my cigar with a full face helmet on :lol: 

tony


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

> *GEMMY wrote: *Open face every time, can't smoke my cigar with a full face helmet on :lol:
> 
> tony


Yeah I agree. I just wish they would fit a a can holder on the front for me beer!

Thrashed the living daylights out of our Peugeot yesterday all the way up to the Pont de Espagne in the Pyrenees from the bottom of the Col de Troumelet. Loved it. Just got to watch the brakes on long descents and they do sometimes fade. Just out of interest. Whats the procedure for stopping once you totally loose the brakes on an automatic scooter? 8O


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## VJP (Dec 8, 2010)

Find a soft hedge. 8O


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## VJP (Dec 8, 2010)

Duplicate post


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## VJP (Dec 8, 2010)

Duplicate post


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## 96299 (Sep 15, 2005)

barryd said:


> > *GEMMY wrote: *Open face every time, can't smoke my cigar with a full face helmet on :lol:
> >
> > tony
> 
> ...


Barry, the engine braking on my PCX is phenomenal, I use it all the time to save me brakes. I do just pull the rear brake lever a couple of times just to let any traffic behind know that I'm slowing or stopping. 

Steve


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

Barry,


"Yeah I agree. I just wish they would fit a can holder on the front for me beer! "


You mean you haven't fitted one yet 8O 

tony


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## dgg (Aug 21, 2013)

VJP said:


> Find a soft hedge. 8O


Took the words right out of my mouth!

If that doesn't appeal then engine braking is probably the only way but first lose some weight by throwing the wife off the back as it'll be more effective


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## tugboat (Sep 14, 2013)

barryd said:


> > *GEMMY wrote: *Open face every time, can't smoke my cigar with a full face helmet on :lol:
> >
> > tony
> 
> ...


You get Michelle to lean over and jam her flipflops in the back wheel. Deffo not the front one or you'll go over the bars, and we wouldn't want you trying to sing with no teeth.


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## fatbuddha (Aug 7, 2006)

I have had to use the "find a soft hedge" principle of braking once - on my mountain bike in Thailand when the hydraulic disk brakes faded to zero on a very steep descent. 

it hurt..... :evil:


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

How can you use engine braking on an automatic scooter hub? Or are you taking the pish?

You have to remember there are some pretty long and steep hills here. I'm at Gavarnie, Lourdes is 35 miles away and its all downhill, you could freewheel it!


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## prof20 (Jan 11, 2007)

Get one of these and your problems with traffic congestion will be over!










R  ger


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## bigcats30 (Aug 13, 2012)

That barrel is actually rifled.....far more accurate!!


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