# Refillable gas - the answer to our dreams?



## 92083 (May 1, 2005)

Has anyone used this? (see Link below). It purports to be a simple adaptor which enables you to refill an ordinary Propane Calor gas cylinder in the UK and abroad. When something sounds too good to be true, it usually is - or that's what my grandmother told me.

Link <<<

Sorry, don't know how to insert a link but assume a copy and paste will achieve the same result.

Mickben

Mod Note.... very long link edited ( please use the link button







to add links in a post)


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## 92083 (May 1, 2005)

What I thought was just an address has miraculously become a link!


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## 04HBG (Dec 9, 2007)

I have seen a simple adaptor used to re fill calor gas bottles whilst down in Portugal for a fraction of the cost of what Calor charge here in the UK. They will fill almost any make of bottle.
The main thing is to make sure the bottle is absolutely empty and no more than 80% back in but im sure Calor will do their utmost to stop the sale of this in the UK, 
MMMM I WONDER WHY !!!!!!!!!!


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Looks like an absolute recipe for disaster to me. How on earth can you be totally sure you're not overfilling the bottle?

pete


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## Scotjimland (May 23, 2005)

see previous comments;

Link to Thread <<


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## sweetie (Nov 28, 2005)

I certainly hope calor and anyone else with any sense do stop the sale of this dangerous and lethal piece of equipment. How many people do you think will try to put that little bit extra in that is why refillable bottles have a 80% shut off to allow for expansion. If any one is thinking of using one of these contraptions could you please notify the sensible ones amongst us where you will be going so that we will avoid that area. Surely if we can afford the vast sums we pay for motorhomes another £400 to £500 for proper refillable system (if required) is worth it for yours and everyone elses safety.
Steve


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## 101405 (Oct 15, 2006)

*refillable gas*

HEAR HEAR. some very commonsense resides on this topic? dont refill gas bottle full stop!!! unless its done for you at a supplier. many many years ago when I was doing my tanker training , a story was told about the dangers of overfilling. an LPG tanker was passing a camp site (In Spain) when the tank split ! (the gas being heavier than air drops to ground level) the Gas
was Ignited by people cooking on the site. over 30 people inc the tanker driver lost their lives, the tanker had been overfilled not leaving enough room for the liquid to expand BOOM**********. this is why there is a respect for the filling of gas bottles here. one 14kg bottle will clear a row of houses. be warned you have whats known as a duty of care under european law.


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## vicdicdoc (May 14, 2005)

When I was an operational firefighter I attended an incident involving a gas cylinder which was being refilled . . . if you imagine a bomb combined with a rocket - you'll get the picture . . and the shrapnel will take your head off. 
Please don't attempt filling a Calor gas type cylinder. Full stop !


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## maddie (Jan 4, 2006)

Hi Mickben read the link on ScotJimland's post and my own experience of owning and using one.Each to their own,but I find it no problem.Look at the link I give for lightweight gas clylinders at £60 for adaptor and bottle it is worth considering as you can see how much gas you have if you are unsure about using normal cly's.I personaly think there is more to go wrong with a refillable system than this very basic method--- what if your 80% valve or pipe goes wrong?---as in anything there is somthing to go wrong,indeed what went wrong with the tanker? how many weigh there exchange bottles to make sure they are not overfilled?or think they are lucky to have a bit more gas?I have never overfilled a bottle ,indeed if anything I underfill them.The bit on overfilling is what to do IF you overfill,which if used properly you will not do.I am not a tight-ass or anything like that but I am a practical bloke that if somthing works simplyfing things I will try it.I am not encourageing anyone to do what I do,You read the info and make your own mind up.This gaget has paid for itself twice over this year as I use it to fill my barbie and heater bots as well but I only use about 5/6 small bots of gas a year in the m/h so do not think it would pay me to get a refillable system for say £350-400 as I would not keep the van to get /save my monies back,--hence my diy sog,spoiler and van-(£85 buys a lot of blue stuff but thats another subject)
terry
terry


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## rogher (Dec 17, 2006)

Wish there were more facts here than opinion.

Why only 80% full? I suspect that you can't fill to the brim or there'd be nowhere for the liquid to evaporate into and form gas, which comes out.
You could probably get away with 90%. I think you only need enough surface area to enable gas to come off fast enough to supply the demand. What you don't want is for the liquid to splash over the outlet (eg whilst moving) to force liquid Propane into the regulator. That's probably where the over-large safety margin comes from.

If the tanker in the explosion story had been filled too full, how did they know? I assume that the contents (evidence) had long since gone. I can accept that over-filling could have been the cause, but only due to the excessive weight of the liquid that the tank had to contain. The pressure would have been the same as any other tank with gas in it. Or does someone know better?

I don't wish to suggest that such a device is safe but neither do I care for scaremongering.

Roger


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## sweetie (Nov 28, 2005)

Refillable bottles are often fitted as a convienence not just to save money but to save the lifting. No you may not get your money back if you fit them but you will not recoup cost on most extras you fit you might not even get back what you paid for motorhome when you sell it :twisted: :twisted:


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## jonnowycombe (Mar 2, 2007)

I have got one I use it - its GREAT.

Its no more dangerous than either A) Filling and LPG car

Or B) Filling your car tank with petrol.

Yes You can get more in to the bottle but you can an LPG car as well - so you just dont do it...

Also you could overfill and spill if you were equally as stupid your car tank and flood the floor but people dont do they. 

I mean this in a positive way, but why are you all looking at the possibility of disaster on things - a kitchen knife is a bloody dangerous thing, and so is a chainsaw but millions of people use them without disaster !!!

As with anything that can be misused it has risk - but used carefully and sensibly it has paid for itself in 4 refills and enables me with the other adapters to refill my bottles anywhere in europe. Bet you cant all do THAT !

Happy New Year


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## jonnowycombe (Mar 2, 2007)

rogher said:


> Wish there were more facts here than opinion.
> 
> Why only 80% full? I suspect that you can't fill to the brim or there'd be nowhere for the liquid to evaporate into and form gas, which comes out.
> You could probably get away with 90%.
> Roger


Its 80% full to allow space for the liquid to expand with temperature in the case of a very hot day - LPG liquid expands a lot more than water does (for example) with an increase in liquid.

Ive seen bottle explode as well, Ive seen cars burned out from petrol tank fires, I have seen houses burend down and familied killed from a stray cigarette.... I have not heard a story yet of a Hiroshima scale explosion on a forecourt caused by either a car or and LPG bottle being refilled and thousands are done every day. Please stop scaremongering and rely on facts and not your personal opinions !


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## maddie (Jan 4, 2006)

Hi again, I must agree with jonnowycombe,
here are the facts as I see them
it is not ilegal to fill gas bottles
Calor states you must not fill their bottles-buy your own?
this is the metod to fill the small 3.9 kg bottle,
make sure it is empty by opening screw valve
fit "gadget" to empty bottle
go to filling station and fit filler to bottle/gadget
fill with 7 ltr fuel--2ltr = 1kg---(3.9 kg=7.8 ltr)
turn off screw valve
remove filling nossel
pay for fuel 45p per ltr= £3.15
go on your way
remove your filling gadget
fit your newly filled bottle to your m/h as you need it, ie when your other bottle runs out.-empty
this eliminates any chance of overfilling and you are not weighing part full bottles or anything daft.
remember to fill your empty bottle again for spare :lol: 

the other way is 
pay calor £25 deposit on their bottle and about £13.50 for gas 
empty bottle and exchange it for a full one-£13.50
change the bottle as you need it
I DO NOT KNOW ANYONE WHO HAS GOT THERE £25 DEPOSIT ON CALORS BOTTLE AFTER 12 MTHS---if anyone knows where you can get the £25 back from let me know as I can get loads from our local tip and will then be able to get a proper refillable system that has a filler and gas pipes plus spring operated shut of vave-ALL OF WHICH CAN GO WRONG 
:lol: TERRY
EDIT if you can find a filling staion that will sell you gas for heating this is only 26p per ltr :lol:


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## aultymer (Jun 20, 2006)

jonnowycombe, Maddie, I have no doubt you know exactly what you are doing BUT read through some of the questions asked on here and then decide if everyone should have acess to these filling gadgets. I have seen people stupid enough to smoke on garage forecourts, should they be allowed to buy these gadgets? 

Most safety laws are designed to protect the sensible from the idiots. 

BTW I am pretty certain that it is illegal to use these gadgets under the Gas regulations since the cylinders you use are not designed to be filled other than in designated areas by trained staff unlike fixed tank systems which have a simplified and almost idiot proof connection system. 
(My next door neighbour is set up to refill bottles under a franchise system and must undergo training and inspection of premises to be able to do so )


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## maddie (Jan 4, 2006)

Hi Aultymer,read -here- if memory sevres me right,if not read all the links on post etc,it is no more dangerous than filling the lpg car.
terry


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## aultymer (Jun 20, 2006)

Sorry Maddie, but what a cylinder supplier says and what is true do not have to be the same thing. 
It is more dangerous than filling a car because these cylinders are not designed to be filled by people who spend thousands on a van but are not prepared to spend a bit more on a proper refillable system and who may not be as competent as you. 
We are not talking about the abilities of careful people but the ability of everyone to follow your careful plan. Do you not know anyone you would not trust to get this right? I know several - the Glasgow Airport bombers lived a couple of streets from here and look at the mess they made of things - and some of them were doctors. Thank goodness they were so incompetent or there could have been a gas fuelled disaster. 
We could be talking rocket science after all.


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## jonnowycombe (Mar 2, 2007)

aultymer said:


> Sorry Maddie, but what a cylinder supplier says and what is true do not have to be the same thing.
> quote]
> 
> Callor want you to think its dangerous so we keep paying the high prices - of course they wont say "yes its fine to fill them from elsewhere"... Ive done lots of courses that taught me nothing at all but made someone some cash. Really it is no more dangerous than filling your car up and you dont need a course for that ! Bottles are not pressure or crack tested as a rule when refilling, they operate miles inside the pressure capability and they do include a high pressure blow off so if they are in a fire they should not explode - any fireman will tell you half of those dont work as they are so old and knackered so that proves that the gas people are not actually that concerned about safety - LPG is relatively safe as it happens its why they allow us general public loose with it. Ive been filling fork trucks with LPG for years.
> ...


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## drcotts (Feb 23, 2006)

peejay said:


> Looks like an absolute recipe for disaster to me. How on earth can you be totally sure you're not overfilling the bottle?
> 
> pete


I absolutely agree pete. My mate had his standard bottle filled by one of these some time ago. The twerp who filled it overfilled the bottle and gas was seeping out of his bottle for an hour afterwards and he had to have the gas locker door open to let the gas escape.

The other problem is that appliances really dont like the liquid LPG in the gubbins so anyone who overfills using these make risk a *BOOM*

If anyone does buy this can they display a sticker so we can park away from them.

serioulsy if you want a refillable system get one properly fitted and certified. don't risk the life of your loved ones to save a few quid let alone your expensive van

Phill


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## jonnowycombe (Mar 2, 2007)

Get some adventure.... Oh dear you wait till I tell you all about my home made 30 litre LPG tanks !!!

IM JOKING !


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## maddie (Jan 4, 2006)

Hi jonnowycombe 
That was my original plan to make a tank from a cylinder untill I saw this :lol: 
terry


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