# Using Mobile phone while driving



## JanHank (Mar 29, 2015)

BBC World news,
From Wednesday of this week, if caught using a mobile phone whilst driving the points are rising from 3 to 6 on the licence.
It said not a lot of people know about that, so now you do. :grin2:
Jan


----------



## iandsm (May 18, 2007)

Good.


----------



## cabby (May 14, 2005)

are there still idiots that do this,the price of hands free is cheap enough.


----------



## barryd (May 9, 2008)

cabby said:


> are there still idiots that do this,the price of hands free is cheap enough.


But still as dangerous.


----------



## GMJ (Jun 24, 2014)

iandsm said:


> Good.


I agree!

Graham :serious:


----------



## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

Not sure that I agree that hands free is as dangerous as holding phone, but certainly it still carries an increased risk c/w turning the blasted thing off......

To me, unless you have a passenger who is free, mobile phones should be turned OFF. There are no exceptions. Use the Aircraft setting or whatever but turn it off is better.

Using it as a SatNav is as dangerous as using it to make calls, if you attempt to touch a button or change a setting/destination etc. your attention is away from the road where it should be without distraction.

The fact that many people ignore the laws does not make it safe, it just shows a lot of people need to be made aware as to why it is so dangerous.....






Shows how easily it happens, the driver was jailed.

Dave


----------



## iandsm (May 18, 2007)

barryd said:


> But still as dangerous.


Depends on what set up you have. Some are a distraction and need to be managed but I just press a button on the steering wheel, say "phone ****" and the number is dialed for me, I hear the other person through the radio speakers and I speak as normal., Its no different to having a conversation with a passenger. I don't have to do to anything else or touch anything else and when the call is completed it just ends, thats it.


----------



## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

Penquin said:


> Not sure that I agree that hands free is as dangerous as holding phone, but certainly it still carries an increased risk c/w turning the blasted thing off......
> 
> To me, unless you have a passenger who is free, mobile phones should be turned OFF. There are no exceptions. Use the Aircraft setting or whatever but turn it off is better.
> 
> ...


Dave

I have posted similar to this before.

I think your views about not using other equipment, whether just voice or pressing buttons, is too general.

My reasoning is that there are a lot of drivers of various vehicles who are competent, and even tested, to do so. I would just name Single-crew Police patrol cars, Ambulance drivers where the other paramedic is attending a patient in the rear of the vehicle, Pilots who have to undergo their initial Commercial licence test as if they were, and may continue to be, single crew.

I drove a fleet of minibuses all over UK, which were all fitted with hands-free and an incoming call from operations was automatically put through the radio speakers. If we wished to call operations we had only to press a couple of buttons, at eye-level, which I would say is no more distraction than looking away from the road to check one's speed or rear-view mirror.

It is amazing how the human brain can scan the road, traffic, road signs, pedestrians etc. In fact tests on pilots have produced scan-rates of 6 instruments per second during high levels of concentration. And there are millions of pilots, and not many are supermen.

My main point being that, whilst I accept that there are people who can be distracted, and I do not condone anything like texting that takes one's eyes of the driving scene for long periods, I feel that having a general rule that condems ever activity and every person is not the right approach. For example, can a person trained and tested in the jobs I have mentioned be accused of unsafe practices if he/she does the same ting in a prvate vehicle?

I hope this does not encourage those who are not so competent to risk others', and their own, lives. However, ther are different competencies and blanket condemnation should be avoided.

I personally would be very agrieved if a Policeman were empowered to pull me over/charge me for doing in a car what I had been trained and tested for. As I think Ambulance, and other Police drivers would be.

Geoff


----------



## mistycat (Jan 28, 2014)

Should be a ban me thinks, i also think vehicles should have some system that jams them, but hey thats me,
pretty sure some of the police and ambulance drivers would agree 
Misty


----------



## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

nicholsong said:


> Dave
> 
> I have posted similar to this before.
> 
> ...


Geoff, I have read your comments, now and before and generally agree with you, perhaps the key point is what I have emboldened in your quote above..... *training and testing*....

Maybe the driver training needs to include such things as operating in-car electronics?

I know exactly what you mean and would not disagree about people that ARE competent, where their competence has *BEEN ASSESSED*

Sadly, AFAIK, that does not apply to the vast majority of drivers on the road....

Maybe it is time to change the training and assessment of all drivers to ensure such competency? OK it could never be 100% complete, but may show that there are areas where ongoing training is required?

The Police have an unenviable task and my suggestions would probably not be feasible to enforce, I wonder whether currently it is "driving without due care"?

Public education and revulsion at such activities as texting and using a mobile phone for calls can only be the way forward, only a change in public attitude will bring about an end to such use..... coupled perhaps with severe penalties for those convicted of such offences....

Losing one's licence is preferable to someone losing their life or mobility as a consequence.....

Dave


----------



## barryd (May 9, 2008)

iandsm said:


> Depends on what set up you have. Some are a distraction and need to be managed but I just press a button on the steering wheel, say "phone ****" and the number is dialed for me, I hear the other person through the radio speakers and I speak as normal., Its no different to having a conversation with a passenger. I don't have to do to anything else or touch anything else and when the call is completed it just ends, thats it.


Its got nothing to do with how you make the call or end it its to do with making the call at all and having a conversation with someone outside of the vehicle. I could drive along the motorway just as easily holding a phone to my ear as I could using a hands free but the problem is I am not concentrating on what I am doing and the person on the other end is not aware of what is going on in the vehicle and will continue the conversation regardless of what is going on. Plenty of tests have been done that prove the theory that it is the actual conversation that is the distraction not how its made. Its completely different to a conversation with a passenger yet at the moment it seems its legal to use hands free sets. Really IMO they should just be banned full stop. Dont get me wrong ive done it myself, I used to talk on hands free for hundreds of miles when I was a busy chap. I lost count of the number of junctions I used to miss on the M1 etc as I was involved in a long intense conversation which was legal but downright dangerous.


----------



## JanHank (Mar 29, 2015)

Something else that in my opinion should be banned is music that is so loud the driver is unaware of the noises outside of the vehicle, i.e. sirens.
Is the person really concentrating on whats around them when they are gigging up and down to the music.?

I don´t like conversation or music when there is a lot of traffic about it interferes with concentration.
Jan


----------



## cabby (May 14, 2005)

Well according to the comments made by some of you, maybe when all vehicles are electric they will also be individual pods for passengers and drivers so they cannot distract each other.:grin2:

If the conversation is a long or technical one then save it until you can pull over then you are safe and able to think about the subject matter without distraction, rather than being an idiot and chatting whilst driving on Motorway/dual carriageway.

I agree with landsm post.


----------



## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

JanHank said:


> Something else that in my opinion should be banned is music that is so loud the driver is unaware of the noises outside of the vehicle, i.e. sirens.
> Is the person really concentrating on whats around them when they are gigging up and down to the music.?
> 
> I don´t like conversation or music when there is a lot of traffic about it interferes with concentration.
> Jan


I think that such thing IS NOW BANNED here in France.....

if the conversation can be heard outside the vehicle then the driver is committing an offence...

There is evidence that shows that attention IS shifted during a phone call or during a face to face conversation where the person's eye tracking has been moved/diverted away from the road ahead and that was shown as happening in all types of drivers, including professional ones such as emergency vehicle, bus and taxi as well as HGV..... depending upon the "intensity" of the call, the driver concerned had their eye tracking moved away from the road in simulations.....

Similar results have been found with children distracting drivers from the back seat....

so obviously we need to ensure that all vehicles will ONLY take one person, have no "entertainment" system, communicating device, navigation device, speed displaying device, or of course, passenger who may distract the driver - that means that taxis will be banned as they may wish to discuss the weather/cricket/football/politics etc. with their fare.....

Single seater vehicles may be the way forward with total isolation >

I think not (and hope not), but would that be the outcome of draconian practices -akin to locking the cockpit door to prevent unwanted distractions from the rear? But of course, no-one could have foreseen the terrible aftermath of the actions of Andreas Lubitz could they?

Dave :frown2::crying:


----------



## cabby (May 14, 2005)

NO TAXI'S, Dave how could you.I think I will have to lay down in a darkened room and count FX4/TX1/TX11 and TX4's.>>00


----------



## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

Taxis....I thought that might get a response....... :grin2:

hence my use of emoticons.......

as I said.......



Penquin said:


> *I think not* (and hope not), but would that be the outcome of draconian practices
> 
> Dave :frown2::crying:


Dave


----------



## iandsm (May 18, 2007)

barryd said:


> Its got nothing to do with how you make the call or end it its to do with making the call at all and having a conversation with someone outside of the vehicle. I could drive along the motorway just as easily holding a phone to my ear as I could using a hands free but the problem is I am not concentrating on what I am doing and the person on the other end is not aware of what is going on in the vehicle and will continue the conversation regardless of what is going on. Plenty of tests have been done that prove the theory that it is the actual conversation that is the distraction not how its made. Its completely different to a conversation with a passenger yet at the moment it seems its legal to use hands free sets. Really IMO they should just be banned full stop. Dont get me wrong ive done it myself, I used to talk on hands free for hundreds of miles when I was a busy chap. I lost count of the number of junctions I used to miss on the M1 etc as I was involved in a long intense conversation which was legal but downright dangerous.


You have point. Your ability to concentrate and hold intense conversations as you were driving was impaired, as you say, dangerous. The same could be true of having an intense lengthy conversation with someone on the car I expect.


----------



## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Yes or unruly kids, girl in bikini crossing the road (Diet coke advert road worker for the ladies  ). I did actually ride a motorbike into the back of a car at a crossing once doing exactly that many years ago, thankfully at about 4mph.

I suspect hands free kits have come on a bit but I never had a good one despite spending a fortune on them. You spend too much time trying to hear what the person is saying and shouting back trying to get your gob nearer the mic. I just dont bother anymore. I think half the problem for me was I might be having a really long technical conversation, sometimes up to an hour and your really not concentrating on what you should be doing. Just because it was legal didnt make it right really. I guess a quick conversation about something trivial is completely different and probably safe (ish). 

Up here the biggest problem we have is tractor drivers bombing along with their mobiles glued to their ears. They are a law unto themselves. The Tractors have got huge over the years and much faster than they used to be.


----------



## H1-GBV (Feb 28, 2006)

JanHank said:


> Something else that in my opinion should be banned is music that is so loud the driver is unaware of the noises outside of the vehicle, i.e. sirens.
> 
> Jan


Once upon a time I would have agreed with you, and I used to be terribly critical of cyclists with earphones, since they would probably come off worst in any accident. :crying:

Then someone pointed out that we don't ban deaf people from riding bikes.>
(Nor driving cars.)

Gordon


----------



## JanHank (Mar 29, 2015)

Then they have full concentration on the road ahead and behind, sorry that doesn´t wash.


----------



## H1-GBV (Feb 28, 2006)

I offer a suggestion which might, within a couple of months, eradicate driving whilst using a phone :smile2:

*Immediately impound the vehicle* [for 48h? 7days??] and make the driver PERSONALLY responsible for getting any passengers to their destination, any goods delivered (or compensation for failing to deliver on time/ loss of perishable goods) and for transport and storage costs [say £150 per day?]. >
Points on the licence could also act as an additional deterrent.

Obviously, drivers in dangerous situations, eg motorways would need to be escorted to a safe place eg service area first.

I believe that a few high-profile news items of folk being made penniless and even homeless as a consequence of their actions would draw to other's attention how lightly they had got off compared to a prison sentence for causing death. It should also encourage the thought of "I'd better make sure that doesn't happen to me".

Apart from the unlikelihood of a few corrupt officers perverting the course of justice, this is a situation in which photographic evidence would be used to instantly bring the miscreant to heel.

Gordon


----------



## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Perhaps this is the way it will go. http://www.independent.co.uk/life-s...-vehicles-government-technology-a7483871.html

Its maybe a step too far as it will restrict all use of mobile devices for passengers on any vehicle as well as the driver but you could argue the less distractions the better, even on Trains most people would I suspect relish the thought of not having to listen to people ringing up and shouting "whats for dinner" or "Im on the fecking Train!!" 

I dunno about banning loud rock music Jan. I get there faster if I am listening to Punk or Metal on full volume.


----------



## JanHank (Mar 29, 2015)

barryd said:


> I dunno about banning loud rock music Jan. I get there faster if I am listening to Punk or Metal on full volume.


Yer, but the roads you drive on are just full of cow & sheep wotsits, no vehicles. >


----------



## barryd (May 9, 2008)

JanHank said:


> Yer, but the roads you drive on are just full of cow & sheep wotsits, no vehicles. >


Yeah but they dont half do some damage if you hit one.  Oh and keeping an eye out for Farmer Palmer coming around the corner at breakneck speed in twenty tons of tractor the size of a house whilst arguing with is wife on a twenty year old Nokia focuses the concentration. I am making a joke of it but you would be surprised at the number of bumps around here because people think they have the roads to themselves and throw caution to the wind. Carving up tourists who seem to like to trundle through the Dales at 20mph is good sport though.


----------



## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

Farmers are the same here, although the tractors are bigger IMO, I wonder how it is that so many farmers have so many large items of farm machinery, there is a farm near here with more than a dozen tractors - all large all look newish, nothing looks old and grotty.

When they drive the Combine Harvester down the lanes with the blades still on the front that makes life "interesting" as you try to squeeze a quart into a demi-litre spot.....

But it is the farmers that killed the breathalyser law here as they could not find anywhere to put the things (although there were lots of suggestions relating to M. Sarkozy and "where the sun don't shine"). So the whole law was not enabled as a direct consequence of the lobbying of the farming community - so they do have some uses....

Dave


----------



## charlieivan (Apr 25, 2006)

Are CB radios still allowed? I've never had or wanted one but used to see many people driving along with the mic in their hand chatting away to whoever was listening.


----------



## barryd (May 9, 2008)

charlieivan said:


> Are CB radios still allowed? I've never had or wanted one but used to see many people driving along with the mic in their hand chatting away to whoever was listening.


Yes. https://www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q659.htm

I think thats why the Top Gear lot use them, it gets round the mobile phone law.


----------



## Matchlock (Jun 26, 2010)

This reminds me of when I worked for my last company, we had mobile phones since their inception, built in car phones then to digital.

My MD called me one day driving down the M1 back to the office in Newport Pagnell, as we where talking I could hear a siren in the background, asked him is there a problem.
No he said but then the police pulled him over and charged him with" not being in charge of a vehicle" which he got done for, this was before the present mobile phone laws came into being.
I had asked him prior to this to install hands free units into all the company cars which he poo pooed but not surprisingly agreed to after his conviction!


----------



## JanHank (Mar 29, 2015)

The Navajo navigator won´t allow even the passenger to make any alterations whilst in motion, you have to stop and turn off the engine before altering it.
Jan


----------



## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Matchlock said:


> This reminds me of when I worked for my last company, we had mobile phones since their inception, built in car phones then to digital.
> 
> My MD called me one day driving down the M1 back to the office in Newport Pagnell, as we where talking I could hear a siren in the background, asked him is there a problem.
> No he said but then the police pulled him over and charged him with" not being in charge of a vehicle" which he got done for, this was before the present mobile phone laws came into being.
> I had asked him prior to this to install hands free units into all the company cars which he poo pooed but not surprisingly agreed to after his conviction!


 Reminds me being a young upstart in 1989/90 I think driving down Regent Street in a Saab convertible with the top down and yabbering away on an early Motorola flip phone (both the companies not mine). Probably passed loads of coppers. I thought I was the bees knees. Bet I looked a right tit.


----------



## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

We used to have radios which allowed us to talk to Control when needed and even if moving, but generally that was an attendant's responsibility, NOT the driver's. We would ONLY use the radio if the patient in the back was in a very serious condition and either we had to stop for resus, so control was warned and if possible would divert another vehicle so there was more help on hand, or if we needed to alert the ED so that the Trauma team was waiting as we pulled in.... (unlike Casualty we NEVER used blues and twos in the vicinity of the hospital as that distressed others IN the hospital and we were wary of using blue lights with a conscious person in the back as their stress levels (and corresponding heart details) would shoot up....

It was there, but was VERY rarely used for safety reasons - frankly when driving a 3 - 4 tonne vehicle at speed through traffic on blue lights was more than enough without having to cope with a radio as well....
.....
We also had mobile phones in the cab (specific to the vehicle) with hands free operation that could be used if needed. But using such things still detracts from the road as you need to ensure that you are ringing the correct number, if you want to speak to the ED, there is no point ringing another ambulance for instance. Attention to the road was ALWAYS the highest concern for the driver, particularly as your colleague could well be standing, unrestrained in the back, trying to do cardiac massage (I broke one patient's ribs doing that when the vehicle turned a right hand bend at speed without warning - crack, crack, crack, oh hell! - he had a sore chest for a few weeks but was able to talk about over supper 3 months later :grin2: ).

I stand by wanting and advocating the absolute minimum extra tasks for the driver to have to do, or to want to do.....

Dave


----------



## GMJ (Jun 24, 2014)

barryd said:


> Reminds me being a young upstart in 1989/90 I think driving down Regent Street in a Saab convertible with the top down and yabbering away on an early Motorola flip phone (both the companies not mine). Probably passed loads of coppers. I thought I was the bees knees. Bet I looked a right tit.


Nice car though...

Graham:smile2:


----------



## cabby (May 14, 2005)

Reminds me being a young upstart in 1989/90 I think driving down Regent Street in a Saab convertible with the top down and yabbering away on an early Motorola flip phone (both the companies not mine). Probably passed loads of coppers. I thought I was the bees knees. Bet I looked a right tit. 

I am making no comment, but did you get the bird from any of those lovely cabbies.:grin2::grin2:


----------



## barryd (May 9, 2008)

cabby said:


> Reminds me being a young upstart in 1989/90 I think driving down Regent Street in a Saab convertible with the top down and yabbering away on an early Motorola flip phone (both the companies not mine). Probably passed loads of coppers. I thought I was the bees knees. Bet I looked a right tit.
> 
> I am making no comment, but did you get the bird from any of those lovely cabbies.:grin2::grin2:


Probably, Im sure they didnt like me very much but I did get a smile out of the good looking one out of Bananarama at the traffic lights once.


----------



## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

cabby said:


> are there still idiots that do this,the price of hands free is cheap enough.


Hard to text hands free though, or use the sat nav, or play games, this is what the new regs are trying to stop, you touch the phone for any reason now and they have you, calls have to be set to auto answer in some way, or maybe tap the bluetooth ear piece, but not the phone.


----------

