# Do I really need a HGV licence



## Spreadsheet (Jul 10, 2011)

Because a Motohome over 7.5 ton is not a Heavy *GOODS* Vehicle do I legally need to have a HGV licence.


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Yes.

Ray.


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

You say that Ray, bring back George Telford and listen. :lol: :lol: :lol: 

tony


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

I think even Princess Anne had to get one for her horse box.

Ray.


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## bognormike (May 10, 2005)

Spreadsheet said:


> Because a Motohome over 7.5 ton is not a Heavy *GOODS* Vehicle do I legally need to have a HGV licence.


what Swifts are over 7.5 tons? :?:


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## bigcats30 (Aug 13, 2012)

I don't think you understand the reasoning behind difference licencing........7.5 ton whether it be a bag of feathers is still 7.5 ton and kills whatever it hits no matter what speed.....

And seeing as quite a few people can't even handle a car for them to be able to drive something that weighs 7.5 ton would result in more deaths (and higher taxes to pay for them)


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## tonyt (May 25, 2005)

GEMMY said:


> You say that Ray, bring back George Telford and listen. :lol: :lol: :lol: tony


Now those debates really were interesting to follow (from the touchline).

George


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## Spreadsheet (Jul 10, 2011)

I have a dream of upgrading one day!

One of the reasons for asking is that last winter in Spain I met a couple with a very large American RV. During the summer they both worked on a CC or C&CC site (can't remember which one it was) as wardens, in the winter they drove their RV to Spain. They had done this for the last two years with no problems. He said he had never taken a HGV test, had told his insurance company (NFU) that his M/H did not carry GOODS and also told them about his non - HGV licence and they were happy with his situation!!


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## bigcats30 (Aug 13, 2012)

Spreadsheet said:


> I have a dream of upgrading one day!
> 
> One of the reasons for asking is that last winter in Spain I met a couple with a very large American RV. During the summer they both worked on a CC or C&CC site (can't remember which one it was) as wardens, in the winter they drove their RV to Spain. They had done this for the last two years with no problems. He said he had never taken a HGV test, had told his insurance company (NFU) that his M/H did not carry GOODS and also told them about his non - HGV licence and they were happy with his situation!!


The insurance company isn't the one that makes law.......or gives you a heavy fine or can take your MH off you or take your licence off you.


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

Spreadsheet said:


> I have a dream of upgrading one day!
> 
> One of the reasons for asking is that last winter in Spain I met a couple with a very large American RV. During the summer they both worked on a CC or C&CC site (can't remember which one it was) as wardens, in the winter they drove their RV to Spain. They had done this for the last two years with no problems. He said he had never taken a HGV test, had told his insurance company (NFU) that his M/H did not carry GOODS and also told them about his non - HGV licence and they were happy with his situation!!


I need as a minimum C1 to drive my 4250kg motor home and I do not carry GOODS for hire or reward in it. The PHGV classification for road duty has nothing to do with driving licence requirements.

If the RV was registered as a motor caravan then this is the law:

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/DriverLicensing/WhatCanYouDriveAndYourObligations/DG_10037875

http://www.goldrv.co.uk/i_drivinglicences.htm


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## Mrplodd (Mar 4, 2008)

*No*

The owner of the large RV was, if the RV was indeed over 7500Kg uninsured!!

If you check your insurance certificate it states that the person driving

"Holds, or has held and ls not disqualified from holding, a licence to drive that class of vehicle" (note the "has held" so if its an expired licence you would still be insured)

Many people are caught out by that one, especially younger drivers with GM's over 3500Kg.

There are NO exceptions No licence for that class of vehicle means NO INSURANCE. You may well have paid a premium to an insurance. Company but it is up to YOU to make sure you are legal and have a licence to drive that class of vehicle.

I had experience of exactly this situation a few ago. Chap borrowed a mates van thinking it was covered on the 'driving other vehicles bit of his insurance. Mates van was over 3500KG. Borrower didn't have the correct licence, and sadly pranged the van (on ice) Insurance company refused to pay out a penny as he didn't have the correct licence!!

Worse was to come, he waz prosecuted for no insurance AND the van owner was done for permitting his mate to drive HIS (written off) van whilst uninsured.


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

I agree with Mrplodd!

On a slightly different tack, I have a mate who is an ex tanker driver who is 78 years of age and retired when he was 50.
As we all know, when a person reaches 70 years of age, you loose the over 3500kg entitlement if you do not have the LGV medical and re apply for the over 3500kg driving licence. 
He did not do this and has since been driving a 3850 kg gross weight M/H. I told him this was wrong and he asked DVLA and VOSA if he was OK to drive his M/H and was told that as long as the vehicle was always under 3500kg, he would be OK. I know he asked as he went to DVLA with me when I changed my registration plate.
Anyway, I kept telling him that I thought that both DVLA and VOSA gave him incorrect information.
The bottom line is that he has now passed the medical and applied for a his full HGV 1 licence and has received it back with full entitlement as he had during his working life.
He has not driven an artic since he was 50 years of age and his HGV expired 8 years ago. I was surprised he got it back without the need for a retest. Although he is a vg driver and quite capable to drive his M/H, but I would not wish to pass judgement on his ability to drive large artics.


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## tonka (Apr 24, 2006)

Grath said:


> he asked DVLA and VOSA if he was OK to drive his M/H and was told that as long as the vehicle was always under 3500kg, he would be OK. I know he asked as he went to DVLA with me when I changed my registration plate.
> Anyway, I kept telling him that I thought that both DVLA and VOSA gave him incorrect information.
> 
> I was surprised he got it back without the need for a retest. Although he is a vg driver and quite capable to drive his M/H, but I would not wish to pass judgement on his ability to drive large artics.


I also think the info given was wrong. Maybe if he had downplated it and had the roadtax changed to PLG then certainly. Dont think He would not have a leg to stand on it he was stopped and checked.

Ref the license re-newal, I missed the appointment for my medical, was to busy at work and when I realised I thought I had lost entitlement. However 2 years later I called and asked where I stood, Take the medical, send the form and fees.. Bingo License re-instated,,,


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

tonka said:


> Grath said:
> 
> 
> > he asked DVLA and VOSA if he was OK to drive his M/H and was told that as long as the vehicle was always under 3500kg, he would be OK. I know he asked as he went to DVLA with me when I changed my registration plate.
> ...


We had some quite heated arguments/debates about this subject as I did not want him to fall foul of the law if ever he had an accident or even the French police parking his vehicle up after a road side check.
I had advised him to downrate to 3500kg gross, but he did not want to do this as sometimes his son would borrow the van and with a family and all the tackle, it would have been running at over 3500kg
What surprised me, was that even after 8 years of not having the HGV entitlement, he got it back without a retest.


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## Dougaitken (Aug 14, 2009)

*Categorie C*

Hi

Referencing Licencing.

Did I dream it or have I read somewhere that there is an EU proposal for the introduction by December 2014 of a C type category licence for Leisure purposes only. This would avoid the need for the driving test to include the Heavy Goods part like Tachographs etc.

Part of the reason given for introduction of this is Motorhomes and the lengths todays new drivers would have to go to to be able to drive over 3500KG vehicles.

Doug


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

*Re: Categorie C*



Dougaitken said:


> Hi
> 
> Referencing Licencing.
> 
> ...


Yes there is a new category of driving licence coming in and the powers that be have been given until late next year to sort the format out.
There will still be a test, but it will not include the specific to goods vehicle parts.
Also, I understand that recently introduced drivers CPC will not be required for leisure drivers.


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

*Re: Categorie C*



Dougaitken said:


> Hi
> 
> Referencing Licencing.
> 
> ...


http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopict-129905-.html


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## Dougaitken (Aug 14, 2009)

*C1 Licence*

Hi

Thank you both very much.

I wasn't dreaming.

I will have to think of something else to dream about. Maybe I can dream about buying a MH over 23 feet long. There must be one about.


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## dolcefarniente (Jan 2, 2012)

If the older guy had taken a medical every year he would have kept his licence active so what's the difference with letting it lapse and then taking a medical to revive it. Yoy never lose any of your entitlements if you're fit to drive in that category.


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## Mrplodd (Mar 4, 2008)

Grath

Your pal would have been OK (insurance wise anyway) as he HAD held a licence for that class of vehicle (even if it was many years ago). He would still have been driving without a licence though!!

You can have an HGV licence if you have your own horse box etc and only use it for your own personal use without having to undergo continuing CPC training.

CPC is ONLY required if you are paid to drive , or if you use an HGV?PCV as part of youir own business. Personal leisure use does not require it.

The forthcoming "leisure" category for 3500-7500Kg vehicles is an excellent (and long overdue) improvement.


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

Mrplodd said:


> Grath
> 
> Your pal would have been OK (insurance wise anyway) as he HAD held a licence for that class of vehicle (even if it was many years ago). He would still have been driving without a licence though!!
> 
> ...


Hi Mrplodd.
Thanks for the confirmation, I am reasonably on the ball with these matters as I was in the Transport Industry and I do hold both UK and International CPC, The Transport Management qualification. I do not and have any intention of holding the drivers CPC. 
Loosely, for people who don't know, any company operating large vehicles for hire and reward need someone who holds the Transport Management CPC to be responsible for the legalities of the company vehicles and their drivers. A similar, but different version is also required for coach companies.
The Drivers CPC is a new qualification which requires all HGV drivers who carry goods for hire and reward to possess.


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## Rosbotham (May 4, 2008)

Mrplodd said:


> Grath
> 
> Your pal would have been OK (insurance wise anyway) as he HAD held a licence for that class of vehicle (even if it was many years ago). He would still have been driving without a licence though!!


He would have if the certificate had the wording you gave earlier. Mine doesn't. It says "The Policyholder must also be driving in accordance with the terms of a valid licence and must not be disqualified from driving." Nothing about what licence they may have had in the past.

Interestingly that wording is only there with relation to my driving a 3rd party's vehicle. There's nothing on the certificate about being properly licensed when driving my own car...


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## Mrplodd (Mar 4, 2008)

So maybe they have tightened things up a bit now!!

_"The Policyholder must also be driving in accordance with the terms of a valid licence and must not be disqualified from driving."_

The important thing is VALID licence. If it doesnt cover that class of vehicle it aint valid. (Interesting that there is no mention of "or has held" any more. I have checked mine with Aviva and that caveat is still present.


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## LaMB (Oct 20, 2011)

*Re: Categorie C*



Grath said:


> Dougaitken said:
> 
> 
> > Hi
> ...


The proposals are for category C1 3.5 to 7.5 tonnes, and not Category C over 7.5 tonnes.

As an LGV/PCV instructor for the last 7 years, I can state that the current C1 practical test hardly covers anything to do with goods vehicles, these are covered in the Driver Certificate of Professional Competence (DCPC), which is only required if you wish to drive commercially for 'hire or reward'.

There is an element of the C1 test which is the 'tell me show me' type questions, some of which could be construed as LGV specific, such as :-

CD2 Air Show
Show me how you would check for air leaks on this vehicle.

CD10 Air Show
Show me how you would check for the correct air pressure on this vehicle.

CD18 Tachograph Show
Show me how you would replace the tachograph disc on this vehicle.

CD19 Tail lift etc. Tell
Tell me how you would operate the loading mechanism on this vehicle

CD24 First Aid Show
Show me where the first aid equipment is kept on this vehicle.

As these are not fitted on some goods vehicles, the examiners do not ask the questions anyway, so they wouldn't ask them of a motorhome.

One reason that a possible, in my opinion, minor change may come about, is for Motorhomes to be accepted as meeting the test vehicle specification. At present one of the requirements is that the vehicle should have a closed box, really so that you cannot see through the vehicle and have to use wing mirrors only for rear observations.

I cannot see that the actual on the road driving test will change in any way, after all the examiner is only looking for an overall safe and comfortable standard of driving at present.


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## dolcefarniente (Jan 2, 2012)

Re CPC etc, what on earth did all those old timers (lots of whom are still driving and will have to go through this nonsense) do throughout the sixties,seventies,eighties,nineties and noughties 8O .I'm exempt thank god but I'm wondering how I ever managed to get a truck and it's load across Europe and back without being told how to.


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

dolcefarniente said:


> Re CPC etc, what on earth did all those old timers (lots of whom are still driving and will have to go through this nonsense) do throughout the sixties,seventies,eighties,nineties and noughties 8O .I'm exempt thank god but I'm wondering how I ever managed to get a truck and it's load across Europe and back without being told how to.


Personally, I think some operators will use this drivers CPC as a way of passing the buck from the transport office to the driver.
Many drivers are professional, but there are a few numpties and these are the ones we usually hear about.
The drivers CPC is just an attendance course for existing drivers but new drivers have to sit an examination.
Regarding getting across Europe.In my day we were given the address, and on a groupage load it could be many and we went on our merry way with nothing more than a map.
No sat nav or even a route planed by the office. You just used your own initiative.


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## dolcefarniente (Jan 2, 2012)

Takes me back Grath  I did groupage in the old customs yard days and regularly got pinned down at Milan for days on end. Never got properly lost though and it's why I still only use Sat nav when in extreme need.


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

dolcefarniente said:


> Takes me back Grath  I did groupage in the old customs yard days and regularly got pinned down at Milan for days on end. Never got properly lost though and it's why I still only use Sat nav when in extreme need.


Those were the best days 8O before the custom borders disappeared 8O 
The camaraderie, but it's all gone now


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