# DVLA & widths



## 98452 (Apr 2, 2006)

Spoken to some knowledgeable trade sources (not sales persons) and been told the the DVLA at present are being terrible over the width issue.

Can anyone advise me if this is as bad as I have been advised if I stick to under 100 inches?

I also have a C1 + E licence so what can I get away weight wise driving?

Have you imported one recently?


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## pauwilson (May 24, 2005)

C1+E allows you to drive up to 7500kg GVW as a rigid or rigid + trailer to a combination weight of no more than 8250kg, 
just as an example, 7500kg vehicle with 750kg trailer or it could be a 5200kg rigid with a 3050kg trailer if you get what I mean.

Paul


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

There is no problem in width if you stick to 100.4" maximum, excluding JUST mirrors and lights.

But you need to be confident of meeting that.

Dave


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## MicknPat (Jul 18, 2005)

Hi John& Irina,

Welcome to the forum.   

Glad you followed my recommendation, you will soon see that it will be well worth paying the £10 to get unlimited postings and FULL access to the site.

In the mean time have a look at these to threads on the matter very close to BOTH our hearts:

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopic-14793.html

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopic-12670.html

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopic-14460.html


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## sprokit (May 1, 2005)

> C1+E allows you to drive up to 7500kg GVW as a rigid or rigid + trailer to a combination weight of no more than 8250kg,
> just as an example, 7500kg vehicle with 750kg trailer or it could be a 5200kg rigid with a 3050kg trailer if you get what I mean.


The above is true if you passed your test before 1 January 1997 and have a category restriction 107 in the Codes box. If you've taken a full C1+E driving test, then the maximum weight is 7,500 kg for the truck, and any trailer taking the train weight (truck + trailer) up to the maximum allowed for the drawing vehicle.
See http://www.dvla.gov.uk/drivers/vehicle_cat_desc.htm for more information on driving licences and categories.

Keith


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## 98452 (Apr 2, 2006)

Got this reply to an email :wink:



> Dear Mr Andrews
> 
> Your vehicle will be inspected by your local DVLA office before they will register it for use in Great Britain.
> The only part of the bodywork which is exempt from being within the 2.55m maximum width are the wing mirrors. All awnings, wheel arches, door handles etc are included in the calculation.
> ...


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

I've heard of courtesy but six kisses from a civil servant ....


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## des (Aug 13, 2005)

that's because civil servants are used to kissing a**e


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## 98452 (Apr 2, 2006)

DABurleigh said:


> I've heard of courtesy but six kisses from a civil servant ....


 :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## exmusso (Jun 18, 2006)

*Road Runner Question*

John,

Are you the 'roadrunner' on the Sorento UK forum?

I'm still a Sorento owner but swapped my Swift caravan for a Rimor Sailer motorhome in June.

Cheers,
Alan


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## 98452 (Apr 2, 2006)

*Re: Road Runner Question*



exmusso said:


> John,
> 
> Are you the 'roadrunner' on the Sorento UK forum?
> 
> ...


I sure am :wink: :wink: :wink: :wink:

How are you getting on with the swap over to MH?


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## exmusso (Jun 18, 2006)

*Motorhome Change-over*

Hi John,

Getting on fine. Been away for a few days at a time including a trip to Truma at Derby for boiler recall.

Decided against A-Frame and Smart car or similar meantime and have bought a car transporter trailer and having fun chasing around car dealers for something suitable.

When I was in Alaska last year, I rented a Winnebago Chalet motorhome- Ford V10 6.8 litre Triton based - 10 mpg. The rental company, Great Alaskan Holidays (they're on the web) sell off their motorhomes after one or two (short) seasons at really good prices. I could have had the one I rented for £18k plus shipping to UK - price here around £60k - Lexington similar.

Seems a good way to get a good test run in one to be sure it suits and the rental companies usually take off the rental price if you buy.

Cheers,
Alan


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## Motorhomersimpson (May 9, 2005)

des said:


> that's because civil servants are used to kissing a**e


 :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

MHS...Rob


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## 98452 (Apr 2, 2006)

^^^^^MHS^^^^^^

Your giraffe is superb :wink: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Motorhomersimpson (May 9, 2005)

Careful John, praise tends to go to his head... :lol: 

Thanks, he can catch people out at times :lol: 

MHS...Rob


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## des (Aug 13, 2005)

have reliable (insider) information that this matter will be resolved within the next few weeks.


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

I knew it wouldn't take long for Tony Blair to see this issue as an opportunity for him to grip, take personal ownership and command of, show statesmanship, push through the necessary reforms, and actually DELIVER.

After all, that's what he did to the NHS.

Dave


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## des (Aug 13, 2005)

Well said Dave. 10/10


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## zaskar (Jun 6, 2005)

Having just received my copy of A.R.V.M, I see that on page 8, Travelworld are proudly boasting thier intention to supply UK legal RV's in future together with an accomanying letter from Monaco to the same affect.
Well that's lovely guys, there's just one problem with that, well 2 actually.
Look at the photo they've supplied!
Yes, it shows a roof top mounted awning to get the coach under width.........but it also shows a slideout awning on "our" offside, which will definately put the rig oversize! Not only that, but MOST forward RV slides are on our "near" side, which means 2 slideout awnings, which will put it WAAAAAAAY oversize! 8O 
Nice one guys, well thought out!
:roll: 
Doesn't matter how many recessed handles and rooftop sun awnings are on it if the bl**dy slide-out awnings stick out does it?

Oh, and now that you, along with all the other dealers have admitted that RV's are oversize, what are are you going to do about the poor sods that bought in good faith, trusting that dealers would sell a vehicle that is legal to use in the U.K? We can't all afford to go out and swap for a brand new Monaco with recessed handles!

Oh (part2!) and on page 26, Itchyfeet are STILL spouting that "coming soon" is the full story on how they've fought so hard with the DVLA on our behalf.
Could someone please tell me when "coming soon" actually is, because if I recall correctly, they've been spouting this for about 6 months now!


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## zaskar (Jun 6, 2005)

Further to the above, I sent a copy to a certain well known dealer in Wolverhampton, and also a copy to Mike Snell (Senior Vice President - Marketting, Monaco Corp USA).

First, the dealer got back to me and told me that they have a letter from Monaco specifically stating that the slide out awnings should NOT be removed because as good as the slide seals are these days, they wont cope on thier own with British weather.
Then, the dealer told me that the coach in the photo had had it's awnings removed prior to sale (wonder if the owner put them back on?)
He also told me that they are trying to work out a roof mounting system for slide awnings similar to that shown for the sun canopy.

Then I got a reply from Monaco stating that all new RV's supplied to the UK from now on will have no awnings at all fitted to the coach.
So, Monaco, after first saying the coach cant do without 'em, then go on to say they're gonna supply anyway.....without em!
Hmmmmm, nice for 100K + :? 

As a matter of interest for those of you, like me who already have an RV, I've been told by 3 different dealers that if the rig is already registered, it cannot by law be de-registered. Unfortunately, they've all said "DVLA have INDICATED......", nobody has actually pointed to written wording.


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## geraldandannie (Jun 4, 2006)

zaskar said:


> I've been told by 3 different dealers that if the rig is already registered, it cannot by law be de-registered.


I would think that was correct. It's an administrative issue, about how you class something. I can't think of an occasion where a change in the law has been able to be applied retrospectively to something already in existance. If it was a safety issue, they might be able to insist that all existing rigs comply with the new legislation, say, at MOT time.

Gerald


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

The point I would make about DVLA registration is that its documented purpose is to verify that the vehicle IS a motorhome. It certainly is NOT a certification that the vehicle is completely legal to drive on UK roads; that remains the joint responsibility of the dealer and owner.

Yes, I know the DVLA have recently been USING its registration process to check specifically on length and width, as their attention had been drawn to these constraints being ignored. But, for example, no-where have I found reference to it measuring % overhang, mirror projection per se, etc., etc.

Unfortunately, the only court test case that pitted owner against dealer over such an illegality, IMHO used the wrong legislation, so the owner lost. Anyone care to volunteer for a test case using the right legislation?

Dave


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

DABurleigh said:


> The point I would make about DVLA registration is that its documented purpose is to verify that the vehicle IS a motorhome. It certainly is NOT a certification that the vehicle is completely legal to drive on UK roads; that remains the joint responsibility of the dealer and owner.
> 
> Yes, I know the DVLA have recently been USING its registration process to check specifically on length and width, as their attention had been drawn to these constraints being ignored. But, for example, no-where have I found reference to it measuring % overhang, mirror projection per se, etc., etc.
> 
> ...


Exactly. I have some sympathy for the over width or too large overhang RV owner do they keep quiet and risk retrospective deregistration or get out there and lobby for change. Difficult call.

Frank


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

I am reminded of the Master of the Rolls the then Lord Denning who said words to the effect that the law should be fair and that judgements should be understood by the 'man on the clapham omnibus'. I think that the principle that the fault, if fault there, be lies with the importers and sellers not with those who buy would be understood by the man on the bus. Unfortunately the one bit of case law that is referred to seems to the layman to say the opposite. However I agree with Dave the wrong law was applied by the claimants lawyers.


Regards Frank

Ps might have been Lord Bowen not Denning who concocted the original phrase in different legal point about the average man.



edited for spelling


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## zaskar (Jun 6, 2005)

[quote="sallytrafic.....I have some sympathy for the over width or too large overhang RV owner do they keep quiet and risk retrospective deregistration or get out there and lobby for change. Difficult call.
Frank[/quote]

Thank you for that. Sometimes, I can't but help think that the general attitude seems to be "TOUGH, serves you right for having such a big van!"
and to be honest this can be a bit upsetting.
In our case, we SPECIFICALLY asked the dealer in Tewksbury, "IS THIS RV UK LEGAL" and we were told, "yes, it's 100.39". What the dealer didn't say and I am certain, did realise, is that the measurement was sidewall to sidewall and SHOULD have included the awning.
They were, shall we say, economical with the truth!
Had I known, there is NO WAY I'd have bought it. 
Some people can happily bury thier heads in the sand and spout about the unlikelyhood of being pulled. Personally I cant, I like things in black & white.
Incidentally, the reason we have an RV is becuase we are full timers. Were it just for weekends or wintering in Spain, I'd happliy go back to my Autostratus........well, actaully I'm thinking of a Rapido A class for the future.


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

zaskar,

It can't hurt your cause, on a number of fronts, to write to the dealer, reminding him of the verbal exchange, and simply requesting he confirms this position in writing. Absolutely nothing more, nothing less, do not lead him, keep your cards close to your chest, keep it simple. Enclose a stamped sae.

One can infer all sorts of things depending on his subsequent wording or inaction, and can ponder lots of ways one can take this forward accordingly, but one step at a time 

Dave


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## olley (May 1, 2005)

Hi just had some info from reliable source:



> Have you heard the very latest gossip on oversize vehicles - apparently DVLA visited the ongoing Caravan show at the NEC a couple of days ago - measured several of the RV's on the Travelworld stand, declared them to be oversize and illegal - and put big red notices on each of the vehicles telling the 'punters' not to buy them!
> [Unquote]
> 
> Anybody know if theirs any truth in this?
> ...


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## LC1962 (Oct 6, 2005)

Not heard that one Olley....although having been "parked" opposite them at York and engaged in lengthy conversation....they were adamant their vehicles were all "legal" but were none too enthused about our suggestion that if we put a tape measure on them........well........whaddayou think :roll:


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## 99412 (May 25, 2006)

I find this hard to believe. Most Motorhomes had red or green stickers on them to indicate whether they were on the approved list or not. I cannot imagine that the DVLC or who ever would mess around like that.

Urban myth methinks.


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## 98452 (Apr 2, 2006)

I was there after your posting olley and no stickers.

Wished I had the bottle to get a tape measure out :evil: as the queues to get in and look around was constant


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## olley (May 1, 2005)

Hi guys, seems like my reliable? informant was anything but. My apologies for posting c**p.

Olley


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