# LEDs mmmmmmmm changed back to halogens



## millepeed (Sep 17, 2007)

hi all i know there has been much discusion about LEDs but this is my opinion only.
i changed all my inside lights to LEDs and at first i thought they were very good as i use my motorhome for wild mmmm non EHU camping for sometimes 3/4 days at a time so yes saw a better state of the battery but know most of the LEDs have gone down to 2/3 lights out of the 4 present on each unit and they were not the cheap ones you can buy these were bought from a well known lightning company, so have now returned back to my halogens and added another battery to my circuit now no probs wish i had done this in the first place , and the halogens give off a better light.
has anyone had a similar problem.
cheers
vince


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## hilldweller (Mar 8, 2008)

millepeed said:


> has anyone had a similar problem. cheers
> vince


Not at all. Bought expensive LEDs, no failures at all.

On the brightness side - one downlighter was replaced by 4 LEDs - so one-for-one does not always work but even so a massive current saving.

http://ultraleds.co.uk/


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## ICDSUN (Oct 10, 2006)

Vince

We have been using ones from UltraLeds for over 18 mths and 2 of them for a further 12 months in a caravan and have not seen any change in output, have you spoke with your supplier as they should not drop by that much
I have the cool effect as the warm gives a lower level which when we tried did not come close to the halogens, but the cool did exceed the halogens we had.

We did try some from a lighting specialist at one of the shows and found them less effective, despite a hefty lift in price 

In a moment of Sadness I tested with a lightmeter from my camera kit and output on warm type was nearly 50% down on halogens and our LEDs in the van

Chris


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## framptoncottrell (Jan 6, 2006)

Very surprising. One of the first thing I did was to replace all the halogens with LEDs, including the awning light, and I have been very pleased with them. No failures at all or even dimming with use.

Which is more than can be said for energy saving bulbs in the house, but that is a different gripe.

Dr (musical, not medical) Roy


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## StAubyns (Jun 4, 2006)

I changed 2 halogens for LED's over the settee. 

For normal use they did not look all that different until we tried sitting under them to read   

It was not possible to read a book under them so we have reverted to the halogens.


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## Patrick_Phillips (Aug 17, 2006)

Like you, we changed all lights to LEDs.
Mostly, we used the coils of LEDs bought from http://www.ultraleds.co.uk/water-proof-warm-white-strips-metre-triple-brigh-p-1964.html and these have been fine for over 6 months of fulltime use.
In a few places we used replacement bulbs from motorhome accessory shops (very expensive). None of these have lasted more than a month or two.
The answer seems to be that there are LEDs and there are LEDs, which, having some understanding of the physics behind them, puzzles me a lot! :?


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## tude (Feb 9, 2008)

*led*

hi there your buying the wrong led .s try leisurepower warrington just google them.i picked the warm white they are superb and give off as much light as halogens tude


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## GerryD (Sep 20, 2007)

StAubyns said:


> I changed 2 halogens for LED's over the settee.
> 
> For normal use they did not look all that different until we tried sitting under them to read
> 
> It was not possible to read a book under them so we have reverted to the halogens.


I am of the same opinion. LEDs emit light, they do not transmit light. If you look at an LED they are incredibly bright. Get a few feet away and there is no illumination available. I use them for reading where the reading lights are directly over the shoulder, but could not use them for general illumination.
Their other issue is also one of cost. Still too expensive to justify.
Gerry


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## Rislar (Aug 16, 2008)

I would say I've had a few over the years in different motors and find I prefer halogen lights, not that LEDs are not any good!!


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## Rapide561 (Oct 1, 2005)

*LED*

Hi

I removed a couple of LED's in the motorhome over the kitchen worktop area as I felt that the LED's were not bright enough to use over a food prep area and whilst cooking etc

Russell


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## kazzzy (Apr 9, 2006)

changed to LED's 12 months ago and bought good quality ones, no problems at all and lighting as good as the halogens, much better battery life as a result as we mainly camp away from EHU.


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## Telbell (May 1, 2005)

WE couldn't get on with LED's- not enough light (good quality-ultraled's)- so sold them on.

Personal taste I suppose


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## Boff (May 10, 2005)

Hi,

been there, got the t-shirt:

I have also had 3 LED replacement lamps (disc-shaped, 7 LED elements, G4 socket). But they turned out to be significantly dimmer than 10 W halogens. So out they went again.

Now there are LEDs and there are LEDs, I know that. I also know that white LEDs exceeding halogen lamps regarding luminous efficacy are meanwhile on the market. But it seems that all these retrofit "LED bulbs" only use the second, if not third last generation LEDs, and are botched together in Asian sweat shops.

So if shopping for LED replacement:
Replace the whole fixture, not only the lamp
Only buy top brand LEDs like e.g. Cree, Seul Semiconductor or Luxeon.
Only buy them if the supplier guarantees a luminous efficacy of at least 35 lm/W (lumen per watts).

Regarding the wattage needed: Halogens have about 25 lm/W. So divide this by the luminous efficacy specified for the LED, and multiply with the power of the halogen lamp that you want to replace. The result gives you the minimum wattage that the LED must have to be as bright as the halogen.

Best Regards,
Gerhard


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## CliveMott (Mar 10, 2008)

New vans designed with LED lighting from the outset work well (Latest Autotrails for example) where many LEDs are used in continuous strips or big clusters. However just replacing hallogens with LEDs will be disappointing if you expect similar levels of illumination.
C.


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## JockandRita (Jun 1, 2005)

Hi all,

We went for >>These<< and >>These<< (11 warm white in total), and are very pleased with them. 
With them all on, there is hardly a movement from the needle on the voltmeter, but switch on one 8 watt fluorescent tube instead, and there is a definite movement of the same needle.

Jock.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

We bought leds to fit all the existing fittings in our last van over two years ago, changed van 12 months ago and moved the leds with us. We also bought additional leds to replace all the bulbs in the new van. We find the quality and amount of light similar to the old bulbs and have had no failures at all. Peculiar how experiences differ, Regards, Alan.


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## GOVER (May 1, 2005)

I have had the same problem but only with the LED bullet shaped replacement bulbs which were expensive and from a reputable supplier often mentioned in this forum. 

3 of the 4 bulbs went after less than 20 hours use. Now 8 moths after purchase I do not expect any replacements will be forthcoming.

Gover


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## carol (May 9, 2005)

I have been considering these and whilst at Shepton this month was talking to this guy: http://www.jmgoods.co.uk/acatalog/index.html - I find this whole subject difficult to sort out - some say good, some say bad, is it to do with the actual type of light we buy to exchange our halogen bulb, or is it because we expect too much.

This guy told me that at the end of this month he expected to have some new ones in, they were very tiny, but a lot brighter and a newer sort, I got the impression they were Labcraft but not certain.

Can someone please, in simple language, tell which are in their opinions, the better ones to use to REPLACE existing halogens in a new Rapido

Thanks for any help/advice.

Carol


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## Telbell (May 1, 2005)

You're right carol-it's confusing- and everybody's eyesight differs, so requirements are different.

I suppose if any are bought and not bright enough they can be sent back "not fit for purpose"

It's the hassle factor though

[/quote] in their opinions


> ...and that's the problem-as we've seen already on this thread opinions differ.


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## Vennwood (Feb 4, 2007)

Hi Carol,

Here's my two pennywoth. Look at it like you would at home when switching to energy saving bulbs. Overall they are a but dimmer, particularly when first switched on. However they get better after a few minutes - right? and you get used to it after a while.

I understood that you need to get the LED's with the built in regulators if you want reliability. We switched over to LED's over two years ago and not had a single failure. True they don't give as bright a light but if you mix and match with warm and cool you can get the best of both world. We use warm LED's for all the lounge and general lighting and use cool LED's in the bathroom, kitchen and reading lights. The real benefit to us (and the main reason for buying them) is the battery saving as we wild camp a lot. We also think the warm lights add a sort of warm glow subdued effect to the camper at night .


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## carol (May 9, 2005)

Thanks Telbell and Vennwood, we tried energy saving bulbs in 2002 - and found them wanting and have never gone back to them, we found they were dangerous in halls/landings as they were just to dim when switched on, and at the time we lived in a 3 storey house, so a quick switch on and dash up/down the stairs was really dangerous...

So maybe I should wait awhile. Actually I think the lighting in the Rapido is a tad poor - sit in the right hand seat and there is no light for reading at all, so something we need to address at some stage, and the lights for reading sitting in what is the driving seat on ours, (left) is not a lot better....

Rapido need to get someone in to redesign certain aspects of their van's - the switches for truma, mains and sensomatic are in such a position in the back right corner of my l-shaped kitchen that we can't read them, and to read the dial on the truma - we have to get a torch and I have to climb onto the dinette part of the seat and peer over to see it.... I did notice on a couple of the new models at Shepton that this had been addressed, but still not on our model.

Carol


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## blondy (Aug 23, 2007)

we have 3 lights over our hob with glass covers, i changed 2 bulbs first with warm white LEDs, i cant count, on switching them on it was almost impossible to see the difference in the light, obviously if you looked up you could see the 4 LEDs through the glass, we are very pleased 
with the results.
cheers.


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## Waleem (Nov 1, 2006)

We tried LEDS and found them just not bright enough. Rather than replace the standard 20W halogens, we instead bought lower wattage ones-5 and 10 to use in most of our lights, which does reduce the power used somewhat, whilst still giving plenty of light. Lower wattage halogen bulbs are cheap and easily available at any Ikea store!


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## JockandRita (Jun 1, 2005)

carol said:


> Can someone please, in simple language, tell which are in their opinions, the better ones to use to REPLACE existing halogens in a new Rapido


Hi Carol,

Any of the ones from Ultraleds, highlighted by others, in my previous post above. They have built in regulators, and were used to replace our 10 watt halogens. They are of equivalent light output and create a lot less heat in the light units. We replaced the two 5 watt halogens in the awning light, with two LEDs which gives us a brighter sweep of light outside the door.

HTH,

Jock.

P.S. Start off with a couple of the "warm white" to see for yourself.


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## Telbell (May 1, 2005)

> Any of the ones from Ultraleds, highlighted by others, in my previous post above.


Jokh

That's the point I was trying to make: I tried a number of different ones from them-cool, warm, different number of led's etc . The company was very patient with me and exchanged a few but in the end, we found them just not bright enough.

They may work for carol & it may be a starting point but didn't suit us.

Waleem's solution may be another option.


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## gaspode (May 9, 2005)

Telbell said:


> that's the problem-as we've seen already on this thread opinions differ.


It was just the same when the world changed from candles to gaslight, and yet again when changing from gas to electrickery, people said it would never catch on. :wink:

I was listening to some idiot on the radio the other day telling the presenter that he'd bought cases of tungsten light bulbs because they're going to be banned soon and he couldn't live with low energy bulbs because they took a few seconds to get to full brilliance.

Have no fear, LED lights (or similar technology) will take over from all other types of lighting in the not too distant future, we simply can't afford to ignore the energy efficiency. Best get used to them now. 8)


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## blondy (Aug 23, 2007)

Gaspode.
I couldnt agree more, I have proven and am prepaired to show anyone at peterborough show that, get the right bulbs, absoloutly no problem,

I have white and grey burstner A class with gold and brown eagle on the back and dome on top.


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## Telbell (May 1, 2005)

> people said it would never catch on. Wink


I'm sure I didn't say that Gaspode....provide the appropriate quote if I did :wink:

Just that, for me they need to develop a bit more brightness (at least for reading) before I'd replace the existing halogen.

iIn respect of their efficacy, as I said before "opinions differ"


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## gaspode (May 9, 2005)

Telbell said:


> I'm sure I didn't say that Gaspode....provide the appropriate quote if I did :wink:


This was where my quote came from:
http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopicp-561940.html#561940
:wink:

It wasn't anything personal, I was just looking for something to quote to get my point across. :lol: :lol: :lol:

We changed to LEDs last year and it's true that they're a different sort of light than halogens - more diffused for instance - but once you get used to them they're fine. We also retained a flourescent fitting over the kitchen work area purely because that's where you really need intense lighting so can sacrifice some energy to make a safe working environment.

Horses for courses as they say. 8)


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## Telbell (May 1, 2005)

> but once you get used to them they're fine.


At risk of being a "Dougie Clone" ( :lol: ) I think what you probably meant was "Once I got used to them I found them to be fine"?

as I mentioned, we tried them out for quite a while. My eyesight (and associated medical condition) dictates that none of the various types I tried were sufficiently bright for reading purposes. Others seem to feel the same.

You may be right that in time led's will "take over" but not for me till they come up with some thing a tad brighter


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