# French aires do & dont's.



## Curtisden

Looking at trying the French aires in our next trip in may.

Can someone advise me on the etiquette where parking spaces are concerned? 

If you are staying for a day or 2 and need to move off site to a service poing is it ok to leave a pitch occupied board on the pitch while you dump and refill?

Can you move off site and retain the pitch or do you loose it? 

Any other advice?

Thanks

Peter


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## Bill_OR

Peter,
Us Brits would of course respect such a 'pitch occupied' sign but don't expect any of our continental neighbours to do so!!!
Bill
P.S. I should say that we have stayed on many aires and have never had any problem at all - with anything!


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## WiltonShagpile

Hi 

From my experience you leave a table and 2 chairs. that seems to hold occupancy.

Every Aire's a new learning experience. Best is when the Italians and Germans are asking you how this aire works. It's great fun.

One thing I have found....... don't leave it to late in the afternoon or all the parking's gone. try to be there mid afternoon.

All the best Wilt.


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## philoaks

Hopefully in May it won't be too busy so moving off to the fill up etc shouldn't be an issue. Even on a busy aire if you fill up in the morning (when lots of people are moving on) then getting a space when you return should be ok.

On rare occasions I have left the wife sat in a chair on the pitch whilst I do the water etc. Never had a problem getting back on the pitch after!


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## rugbyken

generally you have no rights on aires first come first served not that this in any way stops people saving pitches, pinching electric points etc,
in most situations it all depends on how busy time of year etc in march april you will get away with almost anything at no charge on some aires you could stay a week and put your awning out etc come july august , you'll be told if you overstay or get tables out etc. and the local gendarme will be there 9 00 to collect the fee.
if a frenchman comes in late and he can get between 2 vans he will once had one parked 9" from our door so normally leave a good gap if not we have all been shuffled along to fit one more van in ,
if your planning a couple of days in one spot worth looking at the municipals works out £6/7 for well established plot and electric


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## jedi

Hi Peter,

I use aires extrensively. As these are not campsites you cannot really see yourself as possessing a pitch. I cannot recall ever seeing anybody leaving signs out or trying to preserve a parking space while they are away.

On the other hand, they are rarely full so finding a spot is not too difficult. Most people dump and/or replenish their water on arrival or departure. Remember that these facilities are kindly provided for short stays in a locality.

Have a great trip,

Jed


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## iandsm

*AIRES*

Better to get your co pilot to stand at your space when you fill up etc. Signs are not a good idea, neither is leaving chairs or other obstacles on the ground unless you are obviously filing up nearby many European motorhomers (me too) would simply move them out of the way assuming you might have gone shopping or out for the day and, of course, having no idea when you might return. Part of the joy of aires is that spaces are NOT reservable but it's a great system is used wth consideration for others.


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## Sandy_Saunders

Hi Peter

There isn't really a general etiquette, aires vary. If the aire is very busy/popular and space is short, then motorhomes will be parked up very close, say two metres apart. When it is less busy, more room will be available. Some aires have bays marked out, these vary from campsite pitch size to not much wider than a car park slot.

If you wish to visit the service point, mid-morning is the best time as people are leaving then, but not many will be arriving. So your spot is unlikely to be taken. You can try leaving a pitch marker, but I doubt if it will be understood. Basically, if you move off, your pitch is available for anybody else.

Wilt's advice on timing your arrival is good. Some very popular aires require a morning arrival, Ribeauville in Alsace for example. But that isn't normally the case.

However, most aires aren't that busy and you will not have any trouble. If you can give some idea of your destination you may get some recommendations of the best aires. 

Good luck.   

Sandy


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## ChrisandJohn

WiltonShagpile said:


> Hi
> 
> From my experience you leave a table and 2 chairs. that seems to hold occupancy.
> 
> Every Aire's a new learning experience. Best is when the Italians and Germans are asking you how this aire works. It's great fun.
> 
> One thing I have found....... don't leave it to late in the afternoon or all the parking's gone. try to be there mid afternoon.
> 
> All the best Wilt.


We're relatively new to using aires but I can certainly agree with the view that they are all different. Even the point made above, about not leaving it too late to arrive, isn't always the case. We stayed on two last year (Turenne and Martel) which functioned as a general car park during the day and there was more room for motorhomes after the day visitors had in the afternoon.

Filling up and dumping when arriving or leaving sounds a good idea.

Chris


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## Morphology

Universal continental etiquette is that, when arriving to find a huge aire with only one van on it (mine), ignore the vast empty spaces and see how close you can park to the one who's already there :roll: :lol:


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## sheringham

All good advice above.....remember that if your Mh is RHD if you park up like everbody else your door will open onto your neighbours. Consideration is the rule of the Aire/Stellplatz.

Enjoy


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## Grizzly

We've seen two blatant examples of pitch-pinching - one at Breisach and the other at Charmes. In the first case the French van in front of us left step, mats, bikes and other oddments and went off to service the van. Seconds later a German van arrived, the passenger leapt out, threw all the French van's stuff onto the verge and drove into the space. They were a bigger van than the French one and their luton quite literally overhung our bonnet they were so close. They then let their dogs out to do their business on the verge !

We were hoping for at least some sign of protest when the French van got back but they shrugged, loaded their stuff and disappeared ( across the Rhine back to France ?)

These are the only times we've seen it happen but I'd certainly sit in a chair in the parking slot if the aire was busy and anyone coming in would have to drive over me to park !

G


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## erneboy

You don't have possession of a space on an aire unless you have paid for it but if you need to fill or empty to why not service on your way in and leave it till you are going to dump. That way there won't be a problem.

You can't expect to go for a day trip and come back to your space, it may have been taken and if it's a pay aire the new occupant may have paid for it.

Having said that very few aires are so busy that the question would arise even in the height of the season anyway.

Common sense would go a long way. If it's busy stay in your space if you want to keep it. If you are in danger of loosing your space it's obviously a popular spot and maybe it's time you made room for someone else anyway.

For guarantees go to a camp site, Alan.


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## Grizzly

erneboy said:


> You don't have possession of a space on an aire unless you have paid


Breisach stellplatz is a pay one (5 euros per day for max of 3 days). It's also a very big one and, even in spring and autumn we've known it full. Clearly the safest thing is to stay put and fill and empty via a bucket or watering can but it is a long way to walk from some parts to the borne. However, if you do have to move and you do leave your pitch well marked then I think it reasonable that you should expect to have you things left alone. It was pretty clear from the example I've given that the van had only gone away to service and was not away for the day.

It would be sensible to get a pitch first however and then pay rather than vice versa.

G


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## mandyandandy

Fill up with fresh, empty black and grey as often as you can. Don't worry about travelling with full tank of water you will be thankful sometimes as you cannot always guarantee that the Borne will be working. 

Would never dare save a spot as we have seen the attitude of some of the Dutch and French when others have tried it, not saying they are wrong just braver than us.  

More Aires full last year than other years, maybe we picked more popular ones and it was Easter and end of school summer holls over here. 

Back again for more this Easter with similar trip, getting excited now.   

Mandy


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## dipper17

Hi

One of the funniest things I saw was on the Aire in the centre of Avignon in October. We arrived mid-morning and parked up for a days visit. When we returned mid-afternoon we had a cup of tea and as we were moving on started to get ready to move. At least 5 vans saw we were moving and their pilots took their position in driver's seat. We moved and as we looked backed and saw two vans moving off for our space - we did not stay to see what happened but it looked fun! I don't think a pitch marker would have had any effect.

Cheers


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## andyandsue

*the biggest of all in aire or stellplatz?*

the biggest question is what nationality to park next to!

Old dutch pensioners seem to always get loudly drunk in the evening( best of luck to em) and spanish start cooking dinner at 10pm. Italians turn up with 4 kids , 6 bikes on the back ,grandma, a couple of cats and the local priest sometimes it seems. Germans are usually a safe bet.... respectful of personal space and quiet( and the shade of a huge hymer is useful in summer)..
Conversely most continental vans never choose to park next to a UK van.....but that's a question for a foreign MHF forum


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## tonyt

You should be fine in May.

Don't underestimate the continental driver's determination to find a slot in a full aire  

I drive a small van conversion that doesn't really look like your "usual" motorhome. I was once parked in one of the designated slots on a full aire, a French MH pulled into the aire and the driver "looked daggers" at me for some time and then went off and parked close by. 15 minutes later a municipal police van arrived, the officers came straight across to my van, very friendly, we had a chat, they looked briefly at my van and then drove off with smiles and waves. The other motorhome lurking nearby quietly slipped away.

I doubt you'll find many occasions when you want to spend more than one night on the same aire - if you do, then, as others have suggested, fill/empty before you park up.

After using a few aires you'll wonder why you worried.


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## brockley

Agree with most of the above. Sometimes Aires are more busy than others because of what there is to see what there is to see near the Aire.

For example, the Aire at Arromanches is popular and packed like sardines. This is what it was like in April!


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## brockley

But then close by there is lots to see


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## teemyob

*Aires*

We have seen some right squabbles on french Aires.

One in the South of France saw two grown men having a real fist fight, blood and all. That was before we got a motorhome!.

But mostly everything goes okay.

Many ignore all rules.
Few stick by every rule.
Expect any table and chair markers to be moved in your absence.
Aires vary from the vast, the busy, the unused and the ones where you fight for a place.

Good Luck.

TM


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## Curtisden

*Do's and dont's*

Many thanks for all the replies.
All common sense and helpful.
Like most of you we have all seen odd behaviour on some locations.
I had a Caravan for many years & I never understood the intense need some had for a view at the expense of a quiet life. After all most vans either stand empty throughout the day or everyone asleep.
Thanks again.

Peter

Off to SW France May.


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## SpeedyDux

The French have a proverb that explains why you can't expect them to respect your attempt to reserve a space on an Aire:

_"Qui va a la chasse, perd sa place."_

Which means - if you go hunting, you lose your space.

_Vive la difference!_

SD


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## Grizzly

mandyandandy said:


> Fill up with fresh, empty black and grey as often as you can.


Sound advice. The snag is that many arrive at an aire, hoping to fill and service and spend the night. The aire is busy and there is a long queue for the borne. Rather than join the queue they find a spot and settle. When the queue has gone, they then decide to move- and get caught by a later arrival taking their spot.

We don't get stuck this way but, next morning, when the queue is equally long, we're impatient to get on the road so set off, low on water and high on waste and have to spend time looking for an en route aire or service area.

G


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## AfterTime

Surprised no one has mentioned, 
.......carry a plastic watering can (10 lt) and possibly a small collapsible trolly, if the cassette is really full. (just in case)

We never used to, but hey ho, go with the flow.

It can be fun watching faces waiting for a space.


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## Grizzly

AfterTime said:


> Surprised no one has mentioned,
> .......carry a plastic watering can (10 lt) and possibly a small collapsible trolly, if the cassette is really full. (just in case)


I suspect that is probably because most of us do...?

G


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## Ian_n_Suzy

Hi,

I admit that most of the time I would stay put and refill & empty with a Water Hog & Waste Hog.

But I have not personally witnessed anyone having there pitch nicked when leaving Tables & Chairs in situ, and I have done this myself and never thought for one second I would be jeopardising my space.

(We did once witness a great "kick off" between the French, though I think that was regarding speeding onto the Aire on a Scooter).


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## Grizzly

There are also critical times when the municipality comes round to cut the grass ! At Charmes you are warned the night before that you must vacate your pitch to allow them to do the whole canal-side area. Afterwards of course it's every van for themselves !

G


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## barryd

*Re: the biggest of all in aire or stellplatz?*



andyandsue said:


> the biggest question is what nationality to park next to!
> 
> Old dutch pensioners seem to always get loudly drunk in the evening( best of luck to em) and spanish start cooking dinner at 10pm. Italians turn up with 4 kids , 6 bikes on the back ,grandma, a couple of cats and the local priest sometimes it seems. Germans are usually a safe bet.... respectful of personal space and quiet( and the shade of a huge hymer is useful in summer)..
> Conversely most continental vans never choose to park next to a UK van.....but that's a question for a foreign MHF forum


Without a doubt, the French. We have never had any bother with the French. Im sure someone will now argue the opposite but statistically over many many months of stopping on French Aires our hassle factor with the French next to us is has been zero. Germans, Belgians, Dutch and Brits however not so. Never had a jot of trouble out of the Italians incidentally. We were warned that Italian Sostas would be hell on earth but not so for us although our time spent in Italy is small compared to France.

We carry a 25 litre water carrier so if its a mad dash to get the last spot I will miss filling the van and just do a couple of trips with the carrier. It even goes between my knees on the scooter if its a long way off (so does the loo which always raises a few eyebrows).

I think the reserving of pitches with markers or chairs is bad form for any amount of time.


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## brockley

My understanding was that we are not really supposed to set out tables and chairs. Of course we never do...... :roll: 

I've witnessed a Frenchman becoming very irate and tell someone to move their furniture over to make room for his park, it was in Saint-Valery-en-Caux which is hardly surprising as it does get full and people don't seem to mind bunching up tight there.


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## rayc

The problem with discussing 'Aires' is that making generalisations is difficult because there are so many different types.
At pay aires such as Narbonne Plage, where people stay for a up to a week or more, it is part of daily life for MH's to go to the service point leaving their chattels, plus their wife, daughters and dog on their pitch. I say daughters, as sons for some reason, always go with their Dad to carry out this manly work. It would be unthinkable for another motorhome to try to get onto the 'vacant' pitch. Town aires where one night are the norm may be a different kettle of fish but on the numerous ones I have used politeness and cooperration has been the general rule.

It is similar to the old chestnut about not putting chairs etc out. Town aires maybe not but rural and pay aires it is the norm to do so.
An 'aire' and an 'aire' may be two different things. A great free one we stayed at in the High Alps was the old municipal campsite being left to revert to nature and it was just like being at a campsite with chairs,tables and awnings being used as if it was one. When we stayed at the old Bios aire alongside the Loire we just had room to open our door between us and the Italian MH next door.


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## Ian_n_Suzy

I would say on all the Aires we have stayed on in the Summer months, it would be the absolute norm to see every single Van with Tables & Chairs out. I am talking about Aires in "resorts" that you will pay up to €15 per night on (though usually about €6).


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## brockley

The 'old chestnut' about not putting chairs etc out could be more than just that. I believe the rule is "no camping activities", which includes anything outside the van. 

We all know what goes on in reality, but I suspect if the French gentleman I saw telling someone to move his table and chairs had been ignored and involved the police, I think I know what the outcome would have been.


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## Spacerunner

The point about putting out chairs and tables etc is that they could be blocking another motorhome's place to park. Common sense is needed.

If the aire is quiet, rural and space available then outside furniture is, imo, quite acceptable.
In a lot of town centre aires sitting outside would just not be realistic.
Its really just a case of looking at what is going on around you and acting accordingly.
As its been said before, good manners, friendly approach and a smile will make your stay much more pleasant.
However in a popular, crowded aire then presumable there just wont be room for setting out chairs etc. Quite often though, there will be park-style bench and table sets sited to be used for picnics and barbies.


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## brockley

I think most of us put out chairs and tables, even the odd BBQ where appropriate  

What I am saying is I wouldn't argue if challenged about it because I know that strictly speaking we shouldn't be engaged in any 'camping activities'


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## barryd

A picture says a thousand words.

Chairs? No problem










Chairs? I think not! A proper mash out as Mrs D calls them!


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## ChrisandJohn

This thread has reminded me of a question I wanted to ask about water on aires. 

We don't drink the water from our fresh water tank but carry some large plastic bottles which we refill. Last year at an aire where there was a €6 charge for staying the water was free. We filled our tank and water bottles when we left. At the next there was no charge to stay but a charge for a given quantity of water. I can't remember how much but the sort of quantity to fill a tank. We wouldn't have minded topping up the tank a bit and we would have liked to fill our water bottles but we weren't desperate so we didn't bother. Fortunately the next aire was free to stay and free water.


My questions: How is water delivered when you pay. Can you control the flow and how much you take? Is it ever timed, rather than paying for volume? How would you use these bornes if filling with a watering can, or various containers?


Chris


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## Ian_n_Suzy

Hi,

Is that first image at la Marche Sur Saone ?


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## rayc

ChrisandJohn said:


> My questions: How is water delivered when you pay. Can you control the flow and how much you take? Is it ever timed, rather than paying for volume? How would you use these bornes if filling with a watering can, or various containers?
> Chris


You normally get 100ltrs for your payment, though I have seen some timed rather that quantity. I presume though they know how long 100ltrs would take to dispense and set the timer to that.
If not using a hose to directly fill the MH and the aire is busy you will soon become very unpopular if monopolising the service point to fill a 10ltr container and returning to dispense it in between fillings. It is likely someone will just connect their hose and use 'your' water whilst you are away.

I use a hose to directly fill the MH and carry a watering can to use if the opportunity arises. I think in my last month long trip last Summer I paid approx 5 times. The rest of the time I was in paid aires where the water was in with the nightly fee and unmetered.


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## Grizzly

ChrisandJohn said:


> My questions: How is water delivered when you pay. Can you control the flow and how much you take? Is it ever timed, rather than paying for volume? How would you use these bornes if filling with a watering can, or various containers?
> 
> Chris


Depends on the borne. We've met ones where there is a press button so that you start the timer and then, for x minutes , can control the flow rate.

We've also had ones - Lac du Der springs to mind- where you put in your money and get 200 litres delivered with the force of a fire hose and with no chance to stop it or pause. The reason that one sticks in my mind was that it was a bitterly cold day and I got quite literally soaked to the skin. I had no time to transfer the water to the van in a bucket and the hose we'd attached blew off immediately and could not be re-attached. I reckon we probably got about 2 litres of usable water that time. Thankfully it was one of the few times we made pratts of ourselves when no-one was watching !

G


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## barryd

Ian_n_Suzy said:


> Hi,
> 
> Is that first image at la Marche Sur Saone ?


That sounds right. East of Dijon? We only stopped one night on route to the Black Forest. It was boiling hot but the river was nice.

The other one is Erquy Aire in Northern Brittany. We didnt stop there!


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## ChrisandJohn

So, on these aires if you just want to fill a couple of water bottles for drinking, you'd waste tens of litres of water that was surplus to requirements?


Chris


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## rayc

ChrisandJohn said:


> So, on these aires if you just want to fill a couple of water bottles for drinking, you'd waste tens of litres of water that was surplus to requirements?
> Chris


I have no distrust of French water and have no reservations regarding drinking it but aire service points are often not the most hygenic of environments. Half a dozen ltr bottles of water can cost less than 1€ in a supermarket so why not keep some on board for drinking?


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## tonyt

rayc said:


> I have no distrust of French water and have no reservations regarding drinking it but aire service points are often not the most hygenic of environments. Half a dozen ltr bottles of water can cost less than 1€ in a supermarket so why not keep some on board for drinking?


Hear hear. Personally, I drink very little water when in France so using bottled is not expensive.


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## barryd

ChrisandJohn said:


> So, on these aires if you just want to fill a couple of water bottles for drinking, you'd waste tens of litres of water that was surplus to requirements?
> 
> Chris


No not generally. You put your money in and take what you want until either the time runs out or you reach 80 or 100 litres. It doesn't keep flowing all over the Aire until it uses your allowance.

Many don't have any limit and just have a tap or a button you press until your done.

For some reason every now and then though you come across one of these stupid taps with no thread on and a bend straight after the tap so there is no easy way to get a hose on. You then inevitably find that you have to keep the button pressed in as well.

I carry a rubber one size fits all sheath thingy to go over my hose and the tap for these occasions but it always ends up going everywhere. I have no idea why occasionally you come across these stupid taps as they are just not practical for motorhomes and hosepipes.


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## Waves

I think its called LAMARCHE SUR SAÔNE


Street of Marchotte 
21760 LAMARCHE ON SAÔNE

Latitude (North) Decimal 47.27282 ° or 47 ° 16 '22'' Longitude: (East) Decimal 5.38658 ° or 5 ° 23 '11'' Price: 2009 Parking Services: 3 € Token with credit card payment terminal type : FLOW BLUE Services: Channel Bike-road: 15 km of secure channel. Other information: Reserved Slots Pleasant and quiet along the Saône. 

Lifted from CAMPINGCAR INFOS

John


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## barryd

Waves said:


> I think its called LAMARCHE SUR SAÔNE
> 
> Street of Marchotte
> 21760 LAMARCHE ON SAÔNE
> 
> Latitude (North) Decimal 47.27282 ° or 47 ° 16 '22'' Longitude: (East) Decimal 5.38658 ° or 5 ° 23 '11'' Price: 2009 Parking Services: 3 € Token with credit card payment terminal type : FLOW BLUE Services: Channel Bike-road: 15 km of secure channel. Other information: Reserved Slots Pleasant and quiet along the Saône.
> 
> Lifted from CAMPINGCAR INFOS
> 
> John


Yes thats definately it. Dont think we paid though.

There was EHU as well but the boats hogged that.

Ill try and do a street view link

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=47....oid=OTNkNxcfvwwiUz-bUpEkyg&cbp=12,144.14,,0,0


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## Spacerunner

ChrisandJohn said:


> So, on these aires if you just want to fill a couple of water bottles for drinking, you'd waste tens of litres of water that was surplus to requirements?
> 
> Chris


Or...do as some of the French do and take your water from the cassette rinsing water tap!

Its useful to carry some sterilising tissues to clean off water taps as some users are not too fussy what tap they use to rinse their cassettes.
I find that the French in particular have rather medieval standards of basic hygiene.


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## GROUNDHOG

Slight thread drift but I want to get a decent folding bucket, loads on ebay I know but anyone know of a good one that might last more than 5 minutes?

Think the aires question is about covered some are packed some are empty and it is just a question of using discretion. Parking the opposite way round is a good tip though when close up to a continental van.


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## Grizzly

GROUNDHOG said:


> ....anyone know of a good one that might last more than 5 minutes?


Our local garden centre has some good, strong-looking ones. Can't remember the make but they come in a variety of colours and 2 or 3 sizes. It's a Wyevale centre if that helps but it looks like they are standard garden centre stuff. I think they're about £6- £10 roughly.

G


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## Jagman

re. folding bucket, Stowaway are good and seem to be well constructed they should last well enough to make them worth just under fifteen quid. Ours isn't used much but sits with the folding spade in the things-we-might-need part of the external locker. I got it after following the famous uses-of-a-bucket thread a few years ago 

try:

www.nauticalia.com


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## Patty123

I've one of the Stowaway buckets, brilliant, paid £10 for it at a Garden Centre.

Patty


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## Grizzly

Patty123 said:


> I've one of the Stowaway buckets, brilliant, paid £10 for it at a Garden Centre.
> 
> Patty


That's the one they've got at our garden centre. The canvas etc seems well made and strong but, one question, is the handle up to carrying a full bucket of water ? That's the only bit we were concerned about.

G


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## Patty123

Yes its fine, we often fill and carry from water tap on site to top up water tank.

Patty


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## ChrisandJohn

Grizzly said:


> Patty123 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I've one of the Stowaway buckets, brilliant, paid £10 for it at a Garden Centre.
> 
> Patty
> 
> 
> 
> That's the one they've got at our garden centre. The canvas etc seems well made and strong but, one question, is the handle up to carrying a full bucket of water ? That's the only bit we were concerned about.
> 
> G
Click to expand...

I've often wondered that.


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## Jubilado999

Are there any issues with towing a motorcycle on a trailer whilst using aires. Advice welcome.

Ken


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## rayc

Jubilado999 said:


> Are there any issues with towing a motorcycle on a trailer whilst using aires. Advice welcome.
> 
> Ken


Generally no, but at some town aires where the 'pitch' is only 7m or so long it may be tight.


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## pneumatician

An aquaintance of ours left table and chairs.
You guessed it! upon return just the empty pitch.

Steve


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## grizzlyj

Hiya

I view any aire as a carpark for campers. If its more relaxed and less cut-throat than a busy Tescos then lovely, but otherwise you move you lose!!

Some we've stayed on for instance only had a few pitches that are level, so day two for anyone has them keeping a sharp eye out for when the flat pitch inhabitants look like moving!

I also have a selection of tap fittings, but have scratched my head a wee bit with the type of tap Barryd mentioned until I saw someone with no hose fitting at all! A bare hose end just pushed straight on worked well, maybe with a jubilee clip for a longer fill. 

An old bike inner tube cut into a long strip also works remarkably well to join two hoses or hose to tap even if they're just butted together. In Morocco that, maybe with a twist of tie wire as a permanant fixture, is almost universally used. If not that then a plastic bag wrapped round and round leaks but still works to some extent, since they wouldn't mostly know what to do with a hozelock fitting even if they had one.


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