# Our soldiers are freight!



## 94055 (May 1, 2005)

What are your views?

Dear all,

The bodies of the soldiers Murdered in Northern Ireland were flown home without ceremony. This has angered members of HM Forces: "British troops have spoken of their anger following the disclosure that the bodies of the two soldiers murdered by dissident republicans were shipped back to the UK as freight."

"We have been told that the soldiers were not allowed to have a ramp service because of political reasons. We were told the Government didn't want anything that would look like the Troubles had restarted.

"As far as we are concerned these soldiers were shot dead in uniform by terrorists and they should be treated in exactly the same way as if they were killed in Afghanistan. To send their bodies back to the UK as freight is outrageous."

When a person joins any branch of HM Forces they are effectively on duty 24 / 7 / 365.

The Government are asked to review the crass rules that allowed this to happen.

The Government are further requested to amend the rules on Ramp Ceremonies.

Please sign up to the petition and distribute as widely as possible.

http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/Soldiers-on-Duty/


----------



## JockandRita (Jun 1, 2005)

Hi Steve,

Despite the need maintain peace in Northern Ireland, I feel that the Government's decision re the transportation of the soldiers bodies, is absolutely disgraceful.

Petition duly signed.

Jock.


----------



## Chascass (May 10, 2007)

Another example of politician not having the guts to stand up for what is right, if the decision was not theirs and was made by the Army this would be even worse.

Charlie


----------



## ChesterfieldHooligan (Oct 26, 2008)

Hi everyone what a sad state of affairs the UK is getting into  
Duly singed
Brian and Marion


----------



## 108777 (Dec 17, 2007)

I am starting to run out of expressions of disgust regarding this government !
Duly signed

Mike


----------



## Spacerunner (Mar 18, 2006)

When a government allow terrorists and thugs to hold high office there is no depths to which they cannot sink.

It doesn't matter from which theatre of war they are being returned from, KIA or alive, they still rightly deserve the fullest honour and respect that this country can give them.


----------



## Pusser (May 9, 2005)

There is only one important thing with this government and that is the Labour government.

There is only one important thing with the Conservative Party and that is the Conservative Party.

Each time we vote them in with optimism and each time we realise that we are merely giving those we elected a golden opportunity to feather their nests and live a worry free future.

It is never going to change until we, the voters, can come up with a better idea.

Every MP knows what other MPs are doing so why does it always take a national newspaper to uncover fraud when it should be mp's for all parties putting a stop to it and not jump up and down with rage about something they were quite happy to live with for donkeys years.

Our servicemen are not looked after properly, not respected by those that endanger their lives with out any regard at all for their lives which in fairness is the same view politicians have for the voters so the armed forces are not being picked on.


----------



## KeiththeBigUn (Oct 3, 2007)

I am saddened by this. As a serving member of the Armed Forces it does not surprise me though.  Petition signed and forwarded to as many Army colleagues as I can. :wink: 

Thanks for bringing this petition to my attention. 

Keith


----------



## PAT4NEIL (Jul 21, 2007)

Has a mother of a serving soldier, I think that it is disgusting and just a sign of how our soldiers are respected and honoured, so many have lost their lives.

I pray to keep him safe, although he hasnt yet seen any action in afghanistan or Iraq, that tour was just cancelled, so I think my prayers have been answered.


Pat


----------



## 94055 (May 1, 2005)

I wonder why someone voted no?

Everyone is entitled to an opinion it would just like to have that persons point of view.


----------



## greenasthegrass (Oct 27, 2007)

What's a ramp service? is it some sort of carry on with flag on coffin kinda thing?


----------



## locovan (Oct 17, 2007)

Here just for you Greenie

The ceremony is known as a ramp service because Union Jack-covered coffins are carried up the ramp transport aircraft while prayers are said by comrades of the dead soldiers.

The coffins of the dead soldiers were placed in two hermetically-sealed steel containers, covered with bubble-wrap and place in the hold of a civilian aircraft along the with passengers’ luggage on Friday evening, this newspaper has learned.

The refusal by the MoD to allow a ramp service caused a wave of resentment among many of the troops and civilian staff at the barracks, in Antrim.

Instead of the service, troops at the base were forced hastily to organise an ad hoc and private ceremony for the families of the dead soldiers last Thursday.

A source inside the base last night said: “There was a point when we were told that there would not be any service at all and there was nearly a mutiny. It’s an absolute disgrace.

“We have been told that the soldiers were not allowed to have a ramp service because of political reasons. We were told the Government didn’t want anything that would look like the Troubles had restarted.

“As far as we are concerned these soldiers were shot dead in uniform by terrorists and they should be treated in exactly the same way as if they were killed in Afghanistan. To send their bodies back to the UK as freight is outrageous.”

Patrick Mercer, the Tory MP and former infantry commanding officer, said: “The soldiers killed at Masseerene Barracks have fallen for their country just as surely as their colleagues did in Iraq and Afghanistan, and they must be given the same honours of war. The MoD are being so clumsy if they can’t see how this rubs salt into already open wounds.”

The soldiers inside the base had hoped that the two coffins would be carried onto an RAF Hercules aircraft in a ceremony similar to those which now take place when troops are killed in Iraq and Afghanistan.


----------



## greenasthegrass (Oct 27, 2007)

Thanks Mave

Aw that's lovely - when can we get brown out?


----------



## locovan (Oct 17, 2007)

greenasthegrass said:


> Thanks Mave
> 
> Aw that's lovely - when can we get brown out?


Oh I cant wait for the General Election :evil: :evil: :evil:


----------



## tombo5609 (Dec 29, 2007)

I would imagine that the reason the shipping home of the soldiers remains was done quietly was to try and keep a low profile and not reinstate the 80yrs of misery that has been the lot of the irish people.
The response of this forum should answer the question and the reason.
I am an ex serviceman.


----------



## locovan (Oct 17, 2007)

Then was it because they didnt die in action but were Murdered is that the reason.
Is that why 3 people have voted No 
I disagree because they are our Soldiers and should have come home in a very dignified way the Flag over them and the last Post being played.


----------



## Tucano (Jun 9, 2006)

Brown is the colour of this government,
disgraceful,
Norman


----------



## 1happy (Jun 15, 2005)

*Ramp Service For our Soldiers*

How sad that four people have voted no 8O 
How telling that they don't post and say why :roll: 
Speaking as the mother of a soldier it constantly amazes me that such people enjoy the freedom that brave men & women have won for us at great cost (For the avoidance of doubt I mean lives!) and yet don't have respect for the afore mentioned.
It matters not that they weren't 'fighting' at the time.
What matters is that they died and they are entitled to better than this!
So obviously I voted yes and I only wish that the parents take some comfort in the fact that there are people who care.
My thoughts are with them and not the mindless idiots like those demonstrators in London & those who would deny our brave boys & girls what they have earned. 
Catherine


----------



## tombo5609 (Dec 29, 2007)

I am one of those few hat voted no on this forum for this reason.
This government has done something that no other party of power has done and that is to bring to an end the horror of Northern Ireland. This in itself is an achievment that should be applauded but it is recent and the wounds are still raw. There are people of all persuation out there who be only to happy for it all to start again.
The grieving for these unfortunate men should be done privately by thier familys and not in the pomp of militia for all to use as it fits there ends.
Of course I and any thinking person believes it is a tragedy but I am also as sure that there are many mothers and familys in Northern Ireland who have had to count the cost of this conflict and we have had to watch in disgust as their bodys were paraded purely to ignite retribution from the IRA. 
Surely quietly and with dignity and compassion for the berieved is a better option than public breast beating. You only have to see what happened to the unfortunate Jane Goody to see what can happen.
We have a corrupt media who will use anyone or anything to boost their circulation and I would be more disgusted to see the DM or some other rag squeezing every ounce of publicity they can out of it, not because they believed in what they say but purely to feed there own agenda.


----------



## locovan (Oct 17, 2007)

tombo5609 said:


> I am one of those few hat voted no on this forum for this reason.
> This government has done something that no other party of power has done and that is to bring to an end the horror of Northern Ireland. This in itself is an achievment that should be applauded but it is recent and the wounds are still raw. There are people of all persuation out there who be only to happy for it all to start again.
> The grieving for these unfortunate men should be done privately by thier familys and not in the pomp of militia for all to use as it fits there ends.
> Of course I and any thinking person believes it is a tragedy but I am also as sure that there are many mothers and familys in Northern Ireland who have had to count the cost of this conflict and we have had to watch in disgust as their bodys were paraded purely to ignite retribution from the IRA.
> ...


Thank you for explaining that and I agree 100% with your views but to bring them home in a Cargo hold of a passenger plane, cant be right.
Couldn't they have bought them home in a Military Plane and Landed them at Brize Norton, or some other Military airfield with a Union Jack over them in a more dignified way. 
They would then go on to have Private Funerals with each of their families.


----------



## Pusser (May 9, 2005)

SandJ said:


> I wonder why someone voted no?
> 
> Everyone is entitled to an opinion it would just like to have that persons point of view.


5 voted no. Maybe their opinion is based on the possible incitement of further problems in NI just as we thought things were on the up. For those that know the situation in NI this may well be a valid vote. I voted on sentiment and not with that knowledge if indeed that is reason.


----------



## locovan (Oct 17, 2007)

Pusser you have missed tombo5609 valid point and yes we have all voted with our hearts and I do agree with tombo5609 and yourself.
A very emotional subject.


----------



## billyfreda (Dec 1, 2008)

*Petition*

Duly signed and sent to 20 others.
billyfreda


----------



## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

*Re: Ramp Service For our Soldiers*



1happy said:


> How sad that four people have voted no 8O How telling that they don't post and say why :roll:


It will undoubtedly seem harsh if - like you - you have a family member who is a member of the armed forces. However, voting No doesn't necessarily mean you hate the British armed forces (although it might). Maybe the people voting No agree with the Government's reason to deal with the situation in the way they did, i.e. politically.

And for the record, I haven't voted.

*Footnote* Just read Pusser's reply above (I hadn't before posting ) so am really repeating what he already said.

Dougie.


----------



## Pusser (May 9, 2005)

I was just thinking that when kids join up while they may be aware that they may have to lay down their lives for their country, I wonder if they should also be made aware that for political reasons, if you are killed you could be sent home Parcel Force. And even worse, you may not even need a signature.


----------



## asabrush (Mar 3, 2008)

I'm a no vote on this,tombo5609 words are very wise I think.

The situation in NI is hugely complicated and very fragile, more so since the murder of these soldiers and the policeman just after them.

I knew and understood very little of the "troubles" until I moved to Ireland(the republic) People are worried across the whole Island of Ireland,as much as I beleive in giving servicepeople the greatest respect for givivng their lives I think this was the correct "political" decision.


----------

