# First real problem



## bazzeruk (Sep 11, 2010)

My fault! I was going on to some people we met whilst away about how good my Rapido was and has only had routine servicing and an exhaust as additional costs.

On the way back to the storage depot today, she started to misfire and engine warning light came on. Only a few miles from servicing garage, so limped there and have left her with them to sort.

Oh how I long for my apprentice mechanic days when if an engine had a spark, compression and petrol, it had to work! 

No real diesel cars in those days.

Now everything is electronic and costs several times more to repair. 

Bet this is an ECU or even worse, which will no doubt cost a fortune.

I even touched wood as I was waxing lyrical - obviously it wasn't real wood.


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## H1-GBV (Feb 28, 2006)

I sing the praises of my Rapido too, but about 3y it suddenly "seemed" to lose power. We cruised into the next carpark, stopped the engine, checked as much as I could, got back in and away it went: was it my imagination? (The boss thought so).

Then last year, just as we climbed off the M11 to join the M25, the power went again. The boss asked why I was driving so badly (why can't women "feel" engines?). We hobbled for a few miles before pulling into the services at South Mimms. Amazingly, nothing noticable and, after a toilet break, away we zoomed.

An internet search revealed this to be a common fault on Merc Sprinter (so not directly relevent to your Fiat) with a suspected "earthing" between the turbo feed and the radiator. I checked as much as I could but it hasn't happened again - I could spend a fortune on mechanics, but I'll get by in future by switching off and then switching back on.

Did you try yours after an off-on cycle?

Hope you have a cheap solution - Gordon


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## Mrplodd (Mar 4, 2008)

Gordon

I am having EXACTLY this problem on occasions with my Sprinter, can you provide more details or point me in the direction (or a link) to where the information is??

This is urgent as I am off to France tomorrow (Weds) night !!

Thanks.


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## locrep (Dec 5, 2011)

I would love to try helping you Guy's, would it be possible to put down the model & age of vehicle as this would make it much easier to attempt to diagnose the problem.


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## bazzeruk (Sep 11, 2010)

H1-GBV said:


> I sing the praises of my Rapido too, but about 3y it suddenly "seemed" to lose power. We cruised into the next carpark, stopped the engine, checked as much as I could, got back in and away it went: was it my imagination? (The boss thought so).
> 
> Then last year, just as we climbed off the M11 to join the M25, the power went again. The boss asked why I was driving so badly (why can't women "feel" engines?). We hobbled for a few miles before pulling into the services at South Mimms. Amazingly, nothing noticable and, after a toilet break, away we zoomed.
> 
> ...


I pulled into a layby and switched off. It started again straight away, missed for a bit, then cleared, but engine light stayed on. Misfire came back so didn't want to chance it. 2004 Rapido 924F with Ducato 2.8


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## Mrplodd (Mar 4, 2008)

Mine is a 2003 316 Sprintshift with 30K on the clock.

I had a similar problem in France last August, it just seemed to lose all power especially on hills, it would keep changing down!!! It would rev well but seemed to have no power on lighter throttle. Problem cured with new (MB) fuel filter, (which the French MB mechanic went straight to so I guess its a common problem!!) but after about 2.5K miles I "think" its starting to do it again. No faults showed up on the Star diagnostics machine in France.

I have a spare fuel filter now!! dead easy job to change as well.


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## emmbeedee (Oct 31, 2008)

It sounds as if your computer (ECU) is going into limp-home mode. If so switching the ignition off & on again should reset the computer.
You can do this whilst still driving but *DO NOT REMOVE THE KEY WHILST DRIVING OR YOU WILL LOCK THE STEERING.*
I had long experience of this on my Alhambra TDi as it took the dealer 15 months to finally identify & fix the problem. During this period the vehicle went into limp-home many hundreds of times so I became very adept at this switching off & back on again whilst driving. Sometimes this would then clear the problem for days or even weeks but other times it would only last a few hundred yards before activating limp-home again. Fortunately (for my wallet) this started happening a few weeks before the 3 year warranty ran out so all of this was covered. They still sent me a bill for the new turbo, which elicited a suitable response from me.:evil: 
Your ECU should have stored codes which show why the limp-home mode has been activated but in my case, despite many attempts, the dealer still could not identify the real fault, which was turbo seals leaking. My Alhambra was a 1999 vehicle, I don't know if they have improved the diesel code storing systems now. I was told at the time that whilst this ECU technology had been used for many years on petrol engines & thus had been refined over the years, it was fairly new on diesels & not as accurate at identifying the actual problem.
These ECU systems were developed & are mostly manufactured by Bosch & are used by most vehicle manufacturers nowadays. Extremely clever & brilliant when they work, but a right PITA when they don't.


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## H1-GBV (Feb 28, 2006)

Mrplodd said:


> Gordon
> 
> I am having EXACTLY this problem on occasions with my Sprinter, can you provide more details or point me in the direction (or a link) to where the information is??
> 
> ...


http://forums.mercedesclub.org.uk/showthread.php?t=24000

Good luck - Gordon


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## glenm (May 1, 2005)

*first real problem*

Hi i had the same or similar problem with my sprintshift last year in wales would'nt change gear felt like it was losing power on hills, the when it eventually made it to the top it picked up speed.
Merc dealer did it in an hour vacuam pump total cost £170, never had problem again
Cheers
James


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## bazzeruk (Sep 11, 2010)

emmbeedee said:


> It sounds as if your computer (ECU) is going into limp-home mode. If so switching the ignition off & on again should reset the computer.
> You can do this whilst still driving but *DO NOT REMOVE THE KEY WHILST DRIVING OR YOU WILL LOCK THE STEERING.*
> I had long experience of this on my Alhambra TDi as it took the dealer 15 months to finally identify & fix the problem. During this period the vehicle went into limp-home many hundreds of times so I became very adept at this switching off & back on again whilst driving. Sometimes this would then clear the problem for days or even weeks but other times it would only last a few hundred yards before activating limp-home again. Fortunately (for my wallet) this started happening a few weeks before the 3 year warranty ran out so all of this was covered. They still sent me a bill for the new turbo, which elicited a suitable response from me.:evil:
> Your ECU should have stored codes which show why the limp-home mode has been activated but in my case, despite many attempts, the dealer still could not identify the real fault, which was turbo seals leaking. My Alhambra was a 1999 vehicle, I don't know if they have improved the diesel code storing systems now. I was told at the time that whilst this ECU technology had been used for many years on petrol engines & thus had been refined over the years, it was fairly new on diesels & not as accurate at identifying the actual problem.
> These ECU systems were developed & are mostly manufactured by Bosch & are used by most vehicle manufacturers nowadays. Extremely clever & brilliant when they work, but a right PITA when they don't.


Thanks, but switching off and back on again didn't sort the problem.


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## eddied (May 9, 2005)

When I owned a 2.8 JTD powered m/home, this fault turned out to be quite simply a punctured turbo manifold and a loose jubilee fitting. Fixed DIY in about 5 mins. Have you had a look at your tubes?
saluti,
eddied


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Had the same symptoms in 2 different Audis, 80 & A4, turning key off and back on while driving cured it for days, it turned out to be the same problem on both, the EGR valve was buggered, same symptom/fault on a dual fuel vauxhall combo van I had.

The only MH lack of power so far has been when the air delivery pipe from the intercooler came of, but that was very noisy and self diagnosed as soon as you lifted the lid.


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## Mrplodd (Mar 4, 2008)

I dont think mine go's into limp mode, it just seems to lack power when applying just a bit of throttle, as on a long incline which on other days I can sail up in 6th!!, it drops down a gear and carries on. Sometimes it drops down a couple or even three. Stop for 5 mins all is OK sometimes for 5 miles sometimes 500! To be fair I am always running at or near MGVW. It also seems to happen a bit more when the air temp is high ?????

Trouble is these modern engine management systems are just so bloody complicated, great when working 100% but when they start playing up a bit its a (expensive) nightmare

No fault codes of course. I will now try moving all of the cables around as per the advice on Gordons link


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Mrplodd said:


> To be fair I am always running at or near MGVW. It also seems to happen a bit more when the air temp is high ?????


I think you might be near the mark there, my last sprinter was bit like that when running fully loaded, I fitted an extra fan as the temp gauge was always high, it cured the problem, maybe yours is similar.

Maybe a used fan from a scrapyard could be fitted to see if it made a difference, minimal expense if it does/doesn't work, and if not a step in the fault diagnosis.


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## bazzeruk (Sep 11, 2010)

eddied said:


> When I owned a 2.8 JTD powered m/home, this fault turned out to be quite simply a punctured turbo manifold and a loose jubilee fitting. Fixed DIY in about 5 mins. Have you had a look at your tubes?
> saluti,
> eddied


I know naff all about diesel engines - Leaving it the experts!


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## locrep (Dec 5, 2011)

The Ducato would have stored a code, most two likely faults could be crank shaft sensor or fuel pressure loss, code reader will pin point more accurately the fault.

Sprinter problem likely to be turbo boost solenoid which is located below air filter housing, should show a code of over boost pressure.


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## bazzeruk (Sep 11, 2010)

locrep said:


> The Ducato would have stored a code, most two likely faults could be crank shaft sensor or fuel pressure loss, code reader will pin point more accurately the fault.
> 
> Sprinter problem likely to be turbo boost solenoid which is located below air filter housing, should show a code of over boost pressure.


Apparently my little darling won't talk to the computer - even the latest model. Is it possible that Fiat have put something in the means only Fiat dealers can access the information?

Still not fixed


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## locrep (Dec 5, 2011)

Did they Check for power on the 16 pin DLC connector?


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## bazzeruk (Sep 11, 2010)

locrep said:


> Did they Check for power on the 16 pin DLC connector?


I have no idea - is that something to do with the diagnostic computer?


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## bazzeruk (Sep 11, 2010)

locrep said:


> The Ducato would have stored a code, most two likely faults could be crank shaft sensor or fuel pressure loss, code reader will pin point more accurately the fault.
> 
> Sprinter problem likely to be turbo boost solenoid which is located below air filter housing, should show a code of over boost pressure.


Motorhome still in garage. No fault codes stored. The problem is that the fault is intermittent (misfire with engine light on). They have fitted proper Fiat filter - no good. Cleaned? camshaft sensor, ran ok for 5 miles, back with the fault. Now going to check crankshaft sensor, apparently.

Should I suggest getting it uplifted to main Fiat dealer? Know this will be expensive, but really need this fixed.


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