# Niesmann & Bischoff Arto 69G 2003



## manxieliz

Hi - new to the forum and to motorhoming! My husband and I are considering purchasing an N & B Arto 69G ( June 2003) model.
9,000 miles on clock. 
We are keen to have a fixed bed, plenty of sleeping space, good quality furnishings & equipment and a garage.
Can anyone give us any advice, tips - negative and positive points of this make and model. Would be very grateful

Thanks a lot

Manxieliz


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## seaviews2

*Arto Motor Home*

We have a 2006 Arto having previously owned a Hymer 544 2005 model.

We are delighted with ours and it is so quiet, drives like a car. I have spoken to a few Arto oeners before we bought our. Everyone loves their van. We were put off initially with the one door, but haven't found it an issue.

Good luck with the purchase


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## seaviews2

*Arto Motor Home*

Hi again

If you look at the forum topics and scroll down to Motor Home Models - Hints and Tips - you will see that there is now a section specifically aimed at N and B owners.

I asked a few months ago exactly the same question as you before we bought ours - see the comments from other N and B owners (all good)

Regards


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## 96266

Hi Manxieliz 

We have the smaller Arto 59B (B for folding Bar version and no additional bed). IMHO it's faultless: perfect layout (for us), great build quality, superb drive and magnificent view from that huge windscreen. 

We were originally looking for a Hymer but the Arto stole our heart and I've never regretted our decision. 

Go for it, I'm sure you won't regret it


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## harley695

Ours is a 2004 model now with 23000 miles on it and still very happy.Bought it for much the same reasons as you and the rear bed (which we use all the time )and the garage have proved very useful.Have visited the factory(at Polsch,near Koblenz) on our travels and that is a state of the art facility.
I found it easy to drive but frankly undergeared ie difficult to get to 5th gear and stay there.After all the vehicle is set up at the factory to a van not a motorhome.
We spent about £350 to get the engine chipped.This takes only 20 minutes and driving is now a different experience.Well worth the money and we can cruise in fifth gear all day.We get 26 miles per gallon The insurance company were not interested so its not a problem.Good luck if you go ahead.Bob


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## kazzzy

I have a 2007 Arto with fixed rear bed and garage, it is fab I have also visited the factory and it is good to see the pride they take in building the motorhome it gives some confidence in the build quailty we have had other makes before the N&B and I have to say it is simply the best we have owned. I am sure you will be pleased if you go ahead with the purchase.


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## stevee4

*New Arto owner*

Hi just bought 2003 Arto 69GL from Southdowns MH. We did have an old Hymer 534. Moved up to the big guys!!
I noticed the gearing was very high in 5th even for +60mph. I am concerned at the MPG we are likely to achieve as we intend to do + 2000 miles in France in July.

What am I likely to get MPG wise cruising 90 - 100 *KPH*

Could some one explain about chipping and what it does Thanks


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## CliveMott

Nice vans.
Chiping is a way of changing the data in the engine management computer so that the engine is able to producer more power - speed and torque. Ofter refered to as "re-mapping" It achieves this by allowing more fuel in for a given amount of air . On vehicles where the waste gate is controlled electronically it will permit an increased boost pressure as well so you get more fuel and more air. It makes for more relaxed driving as you will require less gear changes.
BUT
It achieves this by eating into the margin between the emision requirements placed on the vehicle manufacturer by governments and that required to pass the MOT. IT WILL NOT BE SO GREEN.
Also it will place increased demands on the clutch, brakes and suspension.
If you use the additional performance you WILL use more fuel.
Anybody who says that they dont use more fuel has either wasted their cash on the mod or failed maths at school!

A leading company who produced and fitted "plug in" black boxes to do this were Van Aaken. They no longer trade.

You should also seek a viewpoint from your insurance company.

Its your money and your risk!

Good luck

Clive


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## gaspode

Hi stevee4

We average around 25mpg at those speeds but I do drive for economy rather than for speed. Higher speeds will be at the expense of fuel economy, you're driving something with the aerodynamics of a brick!

The fifth gear is indeed very high, changing up at less than 50mph isn't really an option is it? Best to stay in 4th unless on a fast road rather than make the engine labor.

Chipping can be done either by a plug-in chip or a full re-map. I can't comment on a re-map but have tried a plug-in chip. It did give slight improvement in fifth gear performance but probably not sufficient to justify the expense. These "A" class beasts are best driven in a "stately" manner I reckon. :wink:

Overall we're very pleased with the van.

PS: Is yours the one with the yellow interior that Southdowns had on the forecourt a while ago?


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## stevee4

*Newby*

Thanks guys really sorted that out for me. I think I will leave the engine alone. I do have 12 months warranty so I guess any messing around will give me a problem should I wish to make a claim.

The interior is in blue, I think the pictures are still on line at S/Downs MH.

Im now having problems sleeping chewing over the jobs I need to do to personalise the van .... 6 am and Im on here :evil:


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## JockandRita

*Re: Newby*



stevee4 said:


> Im now having problems sleeping chewing over the jobs I need to do to personalise the van .... 6 am and Im on here :evil:


That's half the fun and experience of owning a nice MH. :wink:

Jock.


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## thegreatpan

I have just put down a refunable deposit at Brownhills on a new (unregistered) 2007 N & B 74CGB, going to have a look to confirm tomorrow. 

They also have another unregistered 07 at about £53k. Both of these are UK specific models where the rear beds and garage are lost to make a rear lounge which converts to make an additional double. Loads of underneath storage but not for anythingfull height like a scooter


Brownhills have confirmed that they have just lost the N & B franchise and have a couple of paid for stock items they to clear. Warranty work will have to be carried out by the new franchise holders.


Harley was yours a remap or a new chip?


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## thegreatpan

We contacted Travel World about the warrany regarding the Brownhills vans, they stated they were not sure, I have emailed N & B but as yet no reply.

Whilst we were talking to Tavel World it would appear they would be able to get close to Brownhills price on the Arto 69 (now our preferred van), but theirs would be a new 08, and obviously no warranty issues.

Travel Worlds Arto 69 has the twin beds over garage, not the rear loung layout, there are pro's and cons for both.

In the end we went from Sussex to Preston last night and then visited Brownhills first thing today and then drove down to Peterborogh to look at them both, we are likely to going for the Travel World Arto 69, although £2k dearer than Brownhills, it seemed a much better condition van. 

Either way it will save me having to worry about my savings losing money in the bank  

I will post when I have done the deed. I now need a little drinky.....

Did I mention I have a 1992 B544 Timeline for sale........


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## gaspode

thegreatpan said:


> Both of these are UK specific models where the rear beds and garage are lost to make a rear lounge which converts to make an additional double


That would be the end of it for me then. We looked at those "Anglicised" Hymer UK models and in my opinion they screwed up completely a very nice van. Daft idea to have that rear lounge IMHO.

Hymer UK lost the N&B franchise some time ago, I believe Travelworld have the franchise now and I'd be surprised if they would honour the Hymer UK warranty on a van that is already 2 yrs old before registration. Not that you're likely to need a warranty too often with N&B. :wink:


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## tikki

thegreatpan said:


> Harley was yours a remap or a new chip?


Don't know if Harley is around at the moment but these are my experiences of fitting a plug in chip.

We spent £350 on a van-aaken (no longer trading) plug in box over 4 years ago and have been really impressed with the difference in performance & driveability, with much fewer gear changes.
As an example, we've a 3 lane hill not far from us that without the chip reach the top at 50mph in 3rd (In 4th speed drops away until we have to select 3rd). With the chip, we easily sail over the top in 4th at 60mph.
Couldn't tell you if top speed is improved - not interested in that - its just nice to be able to cruise effortlesly at 60 or 70 when needed.
Looking at fuel consumption, the first 2 to 3 thousand miles from new gave an average of around 20.5 without the chip and the 15000 we've done since has averaged just under 22mpg - this improvement is probably due to the engine loosening up.

The chip has been noted on our insurance but no extra premium was needed (unlike our car where a £35 supplement has been added)

Have to admit to removing the chip during warranty when it went for service but haven't bothered for the 2 mot's its been through

Chris


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## thegreatpan

TGP enters and announces "the deed is done."

A line from Macbeth... or deposit paid on the Arto 69EL from Travelworld :lol:


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## citroennut

thegreatpan said:


> Did I mention I have a 1992 B544 Timeline for sale........


i glad it's not just me :roll: best of luck

simon


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