# autotrail cold weather



## dees46ex

hello everyone,
i will be taking delivery of my new arapho lat next week(as excited as a schoolboy on angelina jolie's knee) i wa wondering what members thought of this vehicle in cold weather,would anything need to be added for example fresh water or waste heating.what is your opinion on the general capabilities in below zero conditions?
bye the way,i previously asked about seatbelts.it turns out that this vehicle has 6 factory fitted.
kind regards
damien


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## spooky

last christmas in below 0 we were well warm in our apache, most impressed

malc


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## 100005

Two winters ago we were away for 3 days in our Scout, and it got as low as -6 at night, no problem at all - just keep the warm air blowing
You can get a factory fitted water tank heater though if you are really concerned or are aiming to go skiing etc.


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## trackerman

Hi Damien - we use our Tracker EKS throughout the year in the UK and have encountered no real problems in 5 years. The one difficulty you may encounter is the wase water freezing in the tank - this can be overcome by leaving the drain valve open and letting the waste empty directly into a bucket.

Stuart


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## Annsman

Damien, I don't know if you've done the factory visit, (but it is well worth going for anyone considering, or having bought an Autotrail). You would see that the tanks are insulated with polystyrene during construction so they will be well protected. As others have said you can get a tank heater fitted by Autotrail, or your dealer, but I get it done yet. Why not try your van first then if you do have a problem go and have one retro fitted.


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## ned

*autotrail*

HI Damien,
It rather depends how you define 'cold'. In general conditions in this country I didn't have too many problems with our AUTOTRAIL 660. If you intend to go on the continent during the winter then there are one or two things you can do. Get some good thermally insulated outside screens. Ideally for all the windows not just the cab. We found that making internal ones also helped considerably. We even went to the trouble of making them to go inside the Heike roof lights as well. We got three 1gallon water containers and drained off the water tank. I have got to say that everything else was perfect even though the van didn't have a double floor, just 35mm insulated plwood. We went down to -23 with no problems. A good van for skiing in but we were on a campsite. We now just use the skiing Aires but have invested in a different van A Hymer 524 which is even better.

Keep em waxed.............. Ned


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## Freddiebooks

Hi Damien,

I had similiar queries, so wrote to AT technical dept and got these replies. Hope they help.

Dear Sir,

All our models are tested to grade 2.

This means that the vehicle is put into a cold chamber and soaked at 0’c for at least 4hrs.

The heating appliance is then started and has to raise the inside temperature by 20’c.

These are the facts that we state. This is probably not the answer you were looking for but to be honest it is really hard to say. If you do not need to use your fresh water the exterior temperature could be lower and you would still be quite comfortable.

I hope this helps.

Hi Martin,

Yes the tanks are insulated so in theory the water inside them should not freeze at zero.

Unofficially when the tests have been carried out we have tried the water. It does still run but it would be hard to say how much further you could go down before it would stop. 

The only true way to stop a tank from freezing is to fit it inside the bed box. You will notice that this is what a lot of the European manufacturers do. We used to do this on some models but we found that the majority of our customers go to warmer climates rather than colder climates.

Regards

Steve Moverley

Development Manager


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## Sonesta

Hi Damien,

We own an Auto Trail Cheyenne 840S and last November we wild camped up Mount Everest in Sicily (well the car park actually) in sub zero temperatures, thick snow falling and howling gales and guess what we were that hot inside we had to open the windows to cool the van down. Admittedly, we soon shut them as it only took a few minutes for the icy chill to lower the temp but nevertheless we were snug as 2 little bugs in rugs! Our water tank was ok but I don't think it would have been if we had stayed another night though so Ned's advice is worth bearing in mind.

I hope this helps to answer your question.

Sue


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## HurricaneSmith

Ed Hilary and Tenzing Norgay must have been the first to climb Mount Etna then... 8O :wink:  

HurricaneSmith


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## peedee

Your probably ok down to minus 5C when parked up. My fresh water has frozen up at -7C, not in the tank I hasten to add but in the supply pipe, in the short section where it enters the van. If very cold weather is expected I keep a gallon container in the van overnight. Never had the waste freeze up yet though but I do drain down everything when travelling because of the extra chill factor when on the move.

peedee


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## Moonlight

peedee said:


> Your probably ok down to minus 5C when parked up. My fresh water has frozen up at -7C, not in the tank I hasten to add but in the supply pipe, in the short section where it enters the van.
> peedee


I'll 2nd that, we too found that it was the supply pipe that had frozen. Especially first thing in the morning and also water wouldn't drain out the sink. But again, only first off.


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## Freddiebooks

Is it common practice to keep the water heater on the lowest setting over night to prevent freezing ?

Freddiebooks


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## DJP

hi damien

Hope you enjoy the new van. We took delivery of ours 3 weeks ago and have been away the last 2 weekends. We had some sub zero nights on both weekends. No problem keeping warm when the van is parked up, _however_ when on the move it is a totally different story. The cab is freezing when travelling at motorway speeds. It's OK around town and slowish A roads but on the motorway, the heater is fighting a loosing battle. There are no draughts from the doors or anywhere. It's just cold.
I have today, fixed a curtain to seperate the cab area from the habitation area for use when travelling. It goes from floor to ceiling just behind the front seats. We are off again this weekend so I hope it works!


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## bobandjane

DJP said:


> hi damien
> 
> Hope you enjoy the new van. We took delivery of ours 3 weeks ago and have been away the last 2 weekends. We had some sub zero nights on both weekends. No problem keeping warm when the van is parked up, _however_ when on the move it is a totally different story. The cab is freezing when travelling at motorway speeds. It's OK around town and slowish A roads but on the motorway, the heater is fighting a loosing battle. There are no draughts from the doors or anywhere. It's just cold.
> I have today, fixed a curtain to seperate the cab area from the habitation area for use when travelling. It goes from floor to ceiling just behind the front seats. We are off again this weekend so I hope it works!


Hi Damien, Jane made a curtain for our Kontiki, and our cab gets really hot now, and you don't hear the oven or any other noises. The biggest problem we had was the draught coming from where the seat belts bolt on the door pillows, just removed the covers and put gaffer tape behind them, now it gets that hot we have to open the windows . :lol: Bob.


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## Moonlight

The curtain really does work. We did this on a previous MH. It also serves well if you should park up and leave the MH. Blinds down and curtain shut, no-one can see whats lying about inside.


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## Freddiebooks

I know what you mean about people not being able to see in.

Personally thou, i leave all the blinds open so people can see that "I have now't". So fingers crossed they have no reason to break in .


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## dees46ex

*arapaho in cold weather*

Hello everyone
i posted this thread in sept,and i see it has made a comeback.Thanks to all who replied .We are really enjoying our weekend trips.Have not been away last two weeks due to work commitments.Sadly i have had to put my lads on a 3-day week,which means i have to be there 7 days.With luck it will be better by March.The van is cold when travelling.Pocoloco has been parked up on hookup at work,but yesterday i disconnected hookuo and started the engine.As i understand it many motorhomes run with the gas heating in the hab on.So i tried putting the gas heating on with engine running,seems to work.Is there any reason why this should not be done?
I just wish the government had raised the threshold for small businesses to pay vat,instead of the ill-considered reduction.I just thank god that i was lucky in the housing market and dont owe money on my mh.But plans to invade europe this summer are no longer possible,still,with the demise of sterlings value,it's probably better for family and country economics to holiday in the UK.
Once again thanks to all ,especially posters.
kind regards
damien purcell


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## cool runnings

*Dave vaughan*

Having read the above posts on suitability of Autotrail vans in winter it is quite shocking that people seem happy to have the water freeze up at -7 ish. We have run a site in winter conditions for many years and I have to say Autotrails with or without tank heaters are one of the worst makes for freezing up. Yes the occupants may be warm, but simple good design would also address the fresh and waste water problems. Come on Autotrail, drop the fancy brolly and multiple tv`s and concentrate on what you should be doing. Two new Autotrails here are currently frozen up at -7 which simply isn`t good enough.


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## randonneur

cool runnings said:


> Having read the above posts on suitability of Autotrail vans in winter it is quite shocking that people seem happy to have the water freeze up at -7 ish. We have run a site in winter conditions for many years and I have to say Autotrails with or without tank heaters are one of the worst makes for freezing up. Yes the occupants may be warm, but simple good design would also address the fresh and waste water problems. Come on Autotrail, drop the fancy brolly and multiple tv`s and concentrate on what you should be doing. Two new Autotrails here are currently frozen up at -7 which simply isn`t good enough.


I would have thought it would have been easier to open a new post on this matter than to resurrect an 8 yr old post.


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## cabby

No not really, the idea of old posts is the info in them that may help someone.


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## JanHank

I have just read the whole thread and I am surprised how content the posters are with the Autotrail. Ours is a 2014 Navajo and we found lots of draughts, the cab area being the worst. I have lost count how many places Hans has insulated, taking up the floor, undoing bits to stuff padding in. We have a double thick curtain behind the cab for evening/night time comfort, also a cushion to stuff into the habitation door well where there's a lot of draught at night. The latest addition is another cover for the panorama window, this will keep the heat in - in cold weather and Sun out in hot weather.
As we never drink water from the fresh water tank, he has fixed up a 30 ltr water tank in the shower area for all year round drinking water with its own pump and tap, in cold weather we don't use the vans 'fresh Walter' tank. As we use a washing up bowl the waste water is thrown away outside. 
Jan


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## coppo

JanHank said:


> I have just read the whole thread and I am surprised how content the posters are with the Autotrail. Ours is a 2014 Navajo and we found lots of draughts, the cab area being the worst. I have lost count how many places Hans has insulated, taking up the floor, undoing bits to stuff padding in. We have a double thick curtain behind the cab for evening/night time comfort, also a cushion to stuff into the habitation door well where there's a lot of draught at night. The latest addition is another cover for the panorama window, this will keep the heat in - in cold weather and Sun out in hot weather.
> Jan


Should you really have to do this Jan with a 2 year old van?

Paul.


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## randonneur

We have an Auto-Trail Tracker and don't have a problem with draught in the cab or anywhere else. In our previous motorhomes - a Rapido, Laika, - we did have draught in the cab from the vents in the doors, both of these vans were coachbuilt, not 'A' class, our previous van was a Pilote and that was ok. We always use an external screen cover and recently bought a bonnet cover for the Tracker but not because of draughts, it was because of the rain running down from the over cab onto the scuttle and also to stop the pods from a sycamore tree from getting into the engine.


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## JanHank

coppo said:


> Should you really have to do this Jan with a 2 year old van?
> 
> Paul.


I think it depends on what your idea of comfortable is Paul. We have a temperature of 24 + in the house 24 hours a day. Hans finds cold spots in the van and they have to be eliminated to the best of his ability, that's my man :grin2:
Jan


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## peribro

There have been other threads about draughts in motorhomes and what can be done to eliminate them in the X250 cab in particular. However there are some intended ventilation inlets which certainly shouldn't be blocked up.


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## Spacerunner

peribro said:


> There have been other threads about draughts in motorhomes and what can be done to eliminate them in the X250 cab in particular. However there are some intended ventilation inlets which certainly shouldn't be blocked up.


Nominate and indicate!


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## peribro

Spacerunner said:


> Nominate and indicate!


Here's one but there are plenty more you can find if you use advanced search.

http://forums.motorhomefacts.com/149-fiat-ducato/66770-draught-cured-fiat-x250-model.html


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## JanHank

Ventilators are not part of the plan.:grin2:


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## barryd

You need drafts in a British Motorhome Jan. Its done on purpose so we never lose that proper "Camping feeling". These Hymer and Nippon & Bitchcraft softy owners dont know what its like to experience the joys of the lovely (freezing) Alpine air blowing around your nether regions in the night. 

Our van is lovely and warm (in the back). The drafts are mainly at the front where Mrs D sleeps. I keep telling her its good for her.


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## GMJ

I agree with Jan.:smile2:

Our AT Comanche is draughty in the cab area. We have a heavy 'throw' which I drape over the cab area in winter. It stops the draughts and hides the cab area as well making it more cosy and appealing. 

We also find that the Truma blown air heating isnt 'man' enough to heat the front lounge area very well either. I think the length of the run the pipes have is probably too long for it as the heater is at the back of the MH under the bed. The rear is quite warm due to the heater being there and having more vents. When on site in winter we tend to leave the blown air heating on all day on full to keep the temperature nice; turning it down at night. My wife does feel the cold and we do spend a great deal of time in the MH due to her illness.

We have a 1.5Kw oil filled radiator if we need greater heat.

When on gas the heating is excellent. 

I also had 'en route' heating fitted so we can have the gas heating on when driving so its nice and warm when we stop for coffee/lunch or when we get to site.

Saying this, we love our Comanche as the layout suits us perfectly.

Graham :smile2:


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## JanHank

Its cold and dark now, but tomorrow I will take a photo of how our curtain is fixed Graham, its easy to put up and take down.

I wonder why poor Mrs D has to sleep at the front all on her own, bet Barry snores , or else he´s always tinkling on his geetar>
Jan


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