# Advice on what to take on winter longstay trips to Spain.



## chrisgog (May 17, 2005)

Hi
We are preparing for our first winter trip to Spain and realise that there are some things which would be beneficial to take. 

As we are on electric all the time then examples are that we have bought a single electric hotplate in order to save on gas. 

We have also bought a 10 metre aerial lead too.

What other tips can anyone recommend as we are usually summer, off grid campers

Thanks
Chris


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## MikeCo (Jan 26, 2008)

It is a good idea to take a hotplate but if you are on a metered supply then gas could be cheaper.
It also will be cold at night so if you use gas for heating then it would be a good idea to get a Spanish bottle as a refill is less than 15 euro's.
We have 2 bottles which we will take but if you ask around when you are there you should be able to pick one up cheaply. You can buy them from the local Ferretiers ( Probably spelt wrong ), as new but they will charge a deposit of perhaps 40 euro's.
Apart from the usual documents you can buy most things there. We shop at ALDI as we do at home.
You may need a dish for the cable though.

Mike


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

We took- and used as the nights got very cold and we wanted to save gas sometimes- 2 hot water bottles. I also carry 2 of those fleecy slanket thingies with arms. Not elegant but they are worth their weight in gold on chilly evenings when you don't want to turn up the heating, as well as for use on the bed when it is cold.

I also take the slow cooker on winter trips; low on current consumption and lovely to come back to after a day out ( tip: if you leave the heating off when you are out then cover the lid of the slow cooker with a folded tea towel or similar to prevent too much heat loss that will stop it cooking )

G


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## tonka (Apr 24, 2006)

Above all good points.. Dont underestimate how cold it can be at night, so have some decent bedding...
Metered electric can work out more than buying Spanish gas.. Once you are here you can easily pick up a Spanish bottle and all the bits you need to connect it...
Brit food items that you like ie tea bags, sauces, chocolate etc will save you a few bob as you will pay a premium. Apart from that anything else you can get easy enough....


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## chrisgog (May 17, 2005)

Mike
Thanks. We have 2 11kg gaslow refillable bottles. Hopefully they will last or we will just fill up in a garage. I believe LPG is available around Benidorm/Valencia.

Grizzly. Hi
Hot water bottles sounds good and sounds like my husband might get a onesie for xmas? Think a good flleesy throw would suite him better though. What do you cook with the slow cooker? I have a remoska which is low energy. My slow cooker is massive.


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## chrisgog (May 17, 2005)

Thanks Tonka
Sounds like it is cold at night. Hubby is a freezer so we have a 15tog quilt and it sounds like I need the carpets in the van to keep it insulated too. Think a good warm dressing gown would help by the sound of it and warm slippers.
Some good tips. Thanks
Chris


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## TerryL (Feb 19, 2009)

chrisgog said:


> Mike
> Thanks. We have 2 11kg gaslow refillable bottles. Hopefully they will last or we will just fill up in a garage. I believe LPG is available around Benidorm/Valencia.


With that capacity you shouldn't have a problem. We have 2 6kg bottles and we only topped up 3/4 times in 2 months. LPG in Spain is`not as plentiful as other countries but it is getting better. We just planned to include a known GPL refilling garage on our travels.


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

chrisgog said:


> . What do you cook with the slow cooker? I have a remoska which is low energy. My slow cooker is massive.


We have a remoska as well, and wouldn't be without it. The advantage of the slow cooker is that you can put something in it before you go out and it will be producing great smells and have a meal ready when you come back, tired, after a day out.

I have a small, 2 person, Argos/Cookworks for the van. I was not sure we'd use it so bought a cheap, small one and have been very pleased. It has 3 settings ( high, low and keep warm), a glass lid and a nice, clean white pot. it's quite compact too in a cube shaped box.

I don't usually pre-brown or cook things first but put all the ingredients- chicken pieces, cubed beef, sausages etc- in with liquid and some veg. Chicken cooks well in apple juice with sliced apple, mushrooms, onion, carrots, leeks etc. It's also good with a sachet of coconut milk and some curry spices but that is better for cooking in a frying pan first.

Sausages in a tin of chopped tomatoes with odd herbs, red or yellow peppers, onion, and beans of some kind. Beef with a good dollop of marmite dissolved in water, onion and mushrooms and so on. If you've got some Moroccan spices then beef or chicken or a veg mix do well with them and some stock. This year I'm taking a selection of the slow cooker seasoning mix packets with me to try and a jar or two of cook-in sauce. I'm also a fan of Campbell's condensed soups as a cooking liquid- tomato, chicken or mushroom. that's such a 70s thing but good !

G


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

chrisgog said:


> and sounds like my husband might get a onesie for xmas? Think a good flleesy throw would suite him better though. .


I'd draw the line at a onesie ! I might find myself traveling alone if I bought him one for Christmas....

I fold each fleecy thingy into an, (Ikea) oblong cushion cover during the day so no-one can see them. We've no storage for bedclothes so our pillows are also in cushion covers and sit along the back of the bench seats.

G


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

We winter in Spain. For the last number of years our van had diesel powered heating which was surprisingly economical. Recently we changed and this van has gas powered heating. We also carry a small 1.5Kw electric heater. Currently where we are electricity is metered and costs 35 cents a unit. Given that we need need to have the heating on for around 3 hours in the morning and from when the sun goes down till when we go to bed we are using it for around 7 to 8 hours a day to maintain a temperature of around 20 degrees. 

On electric that costs around 4 euros a day. We find gas a good deal cheaper and given that our gas heating is 5Kw it keeps us warm better and heats up a lot faster.

We are using a local gas bottle because the nearest LPG station is a 60 mile round trip so the cost of going for a top up means that using bottled gas is a considerable factor. It's also very convenient. We do have full LPG tanks so we are OK if we run out at night we can use those till we change the bottle.

I think you will find that even using only 2 or 3 Kw of gas heating, cooking and water heating will quickly use a cylinder. I wouldn't expect a full one to last much more than two weeks, Alan.


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## sideways (Jun 2, 2008)

we overwinter in Benidorm and our site gives you 4 units of electric a day free as do most sites, this will run your fridge (but not a tall fridge freezer) and your battery charger and thats all, gas is much cheaper in Spain a bottle that costs £25 here costs less than E15 there, Elche near Alicante is the nearest to refill your Gaslow. a local bottle as others have said is the answer and if you have a BBQ point its even easier just buy a local reg at the chinese shop or Ferreteria and plug into the BBQ point ,thats what i and countless others do, it can be cold at night and we have seen frost but it wont be anything like here and when the suns out its wonderful, Safe journey i,m off next week and am counting down the days.


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## bigtree (Feb 3, 2007)

About using the BBQ point and chinese reg idea,I found that you can get an adapter at the fereterria so that you can just swap bottles in the gas locker.The adapter has an on/off knob rather than being a reg,so fit that to your Spanish bottle and screw the hose on as normal.


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

Before you go, check the dimensions of Spanish gas bottles and whether they will go into your gas locker. We can't get one that will fit through the locker door so are stuck with a 6 kg Gaslow and a 6 kg UK Calor Lite. If we could enlarge the locker door then one would fit inside. We don't want to carry a loose one inside the van so the Spanish bottle route will not work for us.

G


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## Friant (Feb 10, 2008)

Agree with all the keeping warm tips, it is an issue when the sun disappears.
I take a selection of paperbacks to read and then swap at each campsite, there is usually a central point (often the laundry) where people just leave their finished books and it's nice to have something to put in place of the one you are taking.

Don't load yourself down with food, everything is available and you will probably enjoy searching out a local equivalent anyway.

Have a brilliant time


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

If you don't have them already consider carrying a spare gas regulator and habitation water pump.

They never break at convenient times and I have had both fail while abroad, its a relatively quick job to swop them.

They are probably available over there but might take time and inconvenience to source the correct part.

Pete


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## rosalan (Aug 24, 2009)

Two extra thoughts:-

The wind can get quite chilly and if you have a' Windblocker' it can enhance your outdoor pleasure.

If you are able to travel a bit further south, the temperature is usually quite a bit warmer. Mazarron/ Cartagena being generally a little warmer or Conil if you are looking for the warmest place in Spain, or so I have been led to believe.

Alan


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## TheNomad (Aug 12, 2013)

Current price for exchanging a 12.5kg gas bottle (butane) here in Spain is €17.50

The price is regulated by the national Government and is reviewed by ther Energy Minister each 4 months (or it might be each 3 months?), so is the same across the country.
It is the same price whether you exchange a Repsol (orange) bottle or a CEPSA (silver aluminium, or newer type ultra-light gey-with-red-plastic-top) bottle......they all contain 12.5kgs of butane gas.

Incidentally, in case there are UK people who aren't aware -

Whilst you can get propane "propano" bottled gas here, it's very difficult to come by, and usually only available from either of the two gas Companies regional depots rather than delivered or at retail points. We, and every other motorhomer I know here, always use butane "butano" bottles.
They are a piece of cake to exchange anywhere across the country (and as in Portugal they use exactly the same design of push-on bottle-top gas regulator the orange Repsol ones can be exchanged anywhere across Portugal too - although the cost of exchange is much higher, perhaps €25)
This is because 99.9% of people in Spain use butane for their gas cookers, gas heaters and gas water boilers, and the ambient temperature, even outdoors, virtually never gets low enough for long enough to cause any problems with the butane flow.

If you haven't got a Spanish bottle when you get down to Spain and you want one, just go to any secondhand shop, or Rastro (car boot sale) and pick an empty one up for about 8 to 10 euros. 
Then just swop at a garage for a full one by paying the €17.50.
You can get a kit which contains a Spanish 30mbar push-on bottle-top regulator and length of orange flexible rubber gas hose and jubillee clips from any DIY shop/big hypermarket for maybe 10 euros.

http://www.repsol.com/sa/herramientas/listadopreciosbutanopropanoenvasado/precios.aspx


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

My Spanish bottle is outside the van alongside the gas locker, the pipe goes inside through a hole in the locker floor. I won't be taking it when we leave. I will return it and hopefully collect the deposit I paid on it, Alan.


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## MikeCo (Jan 26, 2008)

TheNomad said:


> Current price for exchanging a 12.5kg gas bottle (butane) here in Spain is €17.50
> 
> The price is regulated by the national Government and is reviewed by ther Energy Minister each 4 months (or it might be each 3 months?), so is the same across the country.
> It is the same price whether you exchange a Repsol (orange) bottle or a CEPSA (silver aluminium, or newer type ultra-light gey-with-red-plastic-top) bottle......they all contain 12.5kgs of butane gas.
> ...


Things must have changed since last April then as Propano was readily available on the site and cost less than 15 Euro's

Mike


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

Do the bigger campsites have gas for sale, like UK sites do ? Would they let you buy and then re-sell for a short period while you were on site ?

G


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## sideways (Jun 2, 2008)

If you have a propane pigtail in your locker it wont fit a Spanish adaptor you have to have a butane one and i,ve never seen anyone selling them in spain Repsol, Propane distinguisable by a black band round the bottle is available on sites and cepsa propane ni a grey steel bottle is available in the supermarkets at least in the benidorm area.


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## Garcia (Mar 5, 2010)

Does Repsol sell / provide a clip on tap..????..ie JUST a tap....NOT a regulator.
If the van has a built in regulator, the gas won't flow correctly if you add a second regulator.
'Bout time we got at least some European standardisation here...I get v. peed off carrying diff bottles , diff pipes and connectors for each European country when we're all Europeans now!
Garcia


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## rosalan (Aug 24, 2009)

It is at times like this that Gaslow is THE only practical gas supply.
After four years I still cannot fault its benefits.
Whichever country I visit, I have no bottles to lift, no problems with different colours of bottle, the gas even costs very much less.
Best tip is to search diligently for someone upgrading to larger bottles, or selling them off when changing vans. 
I have yet to hear anyone with Gaslow or other fitted bottles, having regrets.
When touring, even in Spain during the winter months, you will almost certainly use far more gas than during the summer months. 

Good luck!

Alan


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## MikeCo (Jan 26, 2008)

Garcia said:


> Does Repsol sell / provide a clip on tap..????..ie JUST a tap....NOT a regulator.
> If the van has a built in regulator, the gas won't flow correctly if you add a second regulator.
> 'Bout time we got at least some European standardisation here...I get v. peed off carrying diff bottles , diff pipes and connectors for each European country when we're all Europeans now!
> Garcia


Yes you can by the Jumbo on/off valve anywhere in Spain, you can also buy them here from Leisuresupplies or similar and other places.
I've just bought a Spanish regulator from Socal as I will be using a bottle freestanding in the awning.

Mike


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

rosalan said:


> It is at times like this that Gaslow is THE only practical gas supply.
> After four years I still cannot fault its benefits.
> Whichever country I visit, I have no bottles to lift, no problems with different colours of bottle, the gas even costs very much less.
> Best tip is to search diligently for someone upgrading to larger bottles, or selling them off when changing vans.
> ...


I agree, mainly. We have a big tank. We are in Spain but due to the long journey to the nearest PG station and more particularly the cost of the fuel we would use going for a top up I am using a Spanish bottle. Those are the only circumstances where I would do that though, Alan.


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## jiwawa (Jun 22, 2007)

We're just about to cross into Spain on the east side, and I would recommend you take your thermals!!

There's a huge wind that's been blowing for days, and boy, it's cold!! But with the right gear you you can still get out there under the (now) blue sky and enjoy!


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## TheNomad (Aug 12, 2013)

Garcia said:


> Does Repsol sell / provide a clip on tap..????..ie JUST a tap....NOT a regulator.
> If the van has a built in regulator, the gas won't flow correctly if you add a second regulator.
> 'Bout time we got at least some European standardisation here...I get v. peed off carrying diff bottles , diff pipes and connectors for each European country when we're all Europeans now!
> Garcia


Garcia - yes, you can get "straight-though" versions Spanish style push on taps, but I've never seen them in Spain, as we all use the tap-with-integral-regulator.

I'm sure I remember seeing them advertised in the UK.....possibly some motorhome accessory shops, and/or ebay?

The only issue I'd flag up with the idea of using one of them, with rubber flexi hose which leads to your existing UK pipe and thence to your UK bulkhead regulator; is that you'd then have a length of flexi pipe holding unregulated (ie very high pressure) gas.
Probably no issue at all in normal use, but a lot more scary if it got punctured/split..........


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## MikeCo (Jan 26, 2008)

TheNomad said:


> Garcia said:
> 
> 
> > Does Repsol sell / provide a clip on tap..????..ie JUST a tap....NOT a regulator.
> ...


I don't know which part of Spain you are in but the Jumbo on/off valve is readily available in all Ferratiers, china Bazaars and most supermarkets. And you do not use them with flexable hose, you can buy a pigtail that goes onto your bulkhead regulator.

Mike


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## chrisgog (May 17, 2005)

Wow, all these comments about being cold are a bit offputting. We have gaslow bottles so will have to fill up between camps. We will stay 3 weeks on each camp so between each one we will make sure to fill up or a day trip if run out early. I have details of LPG in the vicarious aires book so will have to take a day out to buy them. The first two sites allow 5kw per day before paying extra. Our last site is not limited so relief there.
Booked everything this morning so no change of plans now. Sounds like we will not be as warm as we thought.
Chris


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## wug (May 19, 2011)

I read the same sort of comments about "cold" before our first trip in winter, and even some friends who have a house in Murcia warned about the cold. Maybe it is for soft southerners, if you're just sitting about all day, but for us northerners who like to get on with it, it was fine. Never felt cold, even at a site above 1000m when everything froze overnight it was no worse than a Scottish winter, because during the day it was sunny. This was in the region of Murcia. Don't worry about it, get out and about and enjoy.


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## TheNomad (Aug 12, 2013)

MikeCo said:


> TheNomad said:
> 
> 
> > Garcia said:
> ...


Mike - not sure if you've grasped the specific point. 
All of the normal clip on-off bottle-top valves that you refer to as being for sale all over the place in Spain (and indeed they are), CONTAIN a 30mbar REGULATOR.
Here's an example:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Spanish-p...ervan_Caravan_Accessories&hash=item41797c8833

(Incidentally, beware of buying very old ones from Rastros etc here, as they used to be 28mbar....checj that it says 30mbar on it!)

But that is NOT what the guy was asking for. 
Because he's already got a 30mbar regulator bolted to his gas cupboard wall, he wants a straight-through (ie NON-regulated bottle-top valve)......so that there's no problems with "double-constriction" of the gas flow from the bottle.

On other forums I've heard mixed reports on this. Some people have said they've not had a problem with double-regulation. Others have said that any pressure-sensitive items of kit wouldn't work when two regulators were used in line.

An alternative to having to try to obtain such a non-regulated Spanish bottle-top valve would be to do what I've seen lots of Brit vans here have: a "T" has been fitted to the gas pipework DOWNSTREAM of the bulkhead regulator, and an extra pipe with on-off valve has been added there. 
Thus you can turn off your "British gas" and instead attach, via a length of Spanish orange rubber flexi pipe, a Spanish bottle to that alternative point, via a normal on-bottle-regulated Spanish valve.

I know that many Spanish motorhome/caravan places will do this really simple gas pipe mod for you while you wait...certainly Caravanas Ferero in Alicante will, as a Brit mate of mine had it done there.


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## chrisgog (May 17, 2005)

Is it worth taking a camping bottle to Spain? Reason I ask is we could use an old bottle for outside cooking as we dont want to mess with our gaslow piping.
Chris


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

MikeCo said:


> I don't know which part of Spain you are in but the Jumbo on/off valve is readily available in all Ferratiers, china Bazaars and most supermarkets. And you do not use them with flexable hose, you can buy a pigtail that goes onto your bulkhead regulator.
> 
> Mike


Yes, I have seen the jumbo adaptor without a built in regulator for sale in Spain too.

If you rely on the All the Aires book for finding LPG you will miss lots of places and may end up travelling much further than you need to for a refill. This site has many more LPG stations than the book: http://www.mylpg.eu

Alan.


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## TheNomad (Aug 12, 2013)

Spanish gas Bottle-top connectors without regulators must be very very rare in Spain......because that's not how the system ever works for any gas appliances here. 
No appliances have regulators built in. They always depend upon the gas coming down the pipe to them being regulated the instant it leaves the bottle, by the bottle-top connector with inbuilt pressure regulator.
Thus the pressure in all flexible pipes is always "low" (it used to be 28/37mbar depending on whether butano or propano was being used, but about a decade or so ago that got changed to a standard 30mbar pressure regardless of which of the two gases you choose to use for any appliance.

I cannot remember ever seeing a single one WITHOUT an inbuilt regulator in any DIY shop or Fereteria (hardware store) or Chinese shop in the dozen years I've lived here full time. 
But I've seen literally millions of connectors with integral regulator inside in all of them.

A few straight-through bottle-top valves are on sale however in the UK, so that you can fit them to a UK high-pressure pigtail setup when visiting Spain or Portugal.
Here's one example:
http://www.leisureshopdirect.com/ca...tor_for_spanish_and_portuguese_cylinders.aspx


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## subfiver (Oct 15, 2011)

I've had confirmation from Gaslow that their part no 01-4500 for connecting external cylinders to the Gaslow filler point is designed to be high-pressure, ie, it does not need a regulator. The 'jumbo adapter' for Spanish bottles is just that, it isn't a regulator.

I think I've gone off the whole idea of an external bottle ....


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Here is one like those I have seen, it's described as ADAPTADOR DE SALIDA LIBRE Mod: RSL and can be found on this web site: http://combutec2010.com/productos/reguladores-monfa-butano-propano/

It has an unregulated out put and could be used to link into your van's fixed regulator using a suitable pig tail. That's pretty much the arrangement I have using a Gaslow fitting connected to the bottle top connector and entering the gas system on my van before the regulator, Alan.

http://www.grupoimebur.com/productos/adaptador-salida-libre-jumbo.html

http://www.ferrehogar.es/Blog/Adapt...aravaning-camping-y-actividades-al-aire-libre

http://www.optimgas.com/es/reguladores/55-adaptador-jumbo-saida-libre.html

The photograph here: http://www.micasaconruedas.com/Instalador_bcn_ES/instalador_barcelona_es shows a Jumbo connector with a regulator attached to it. Obviously if you have a bulkhead regulator you connect direct from the Jumbo adaptor to that using a suitable pig tail.


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

Good heavens  

We spent 2 months in Spain without all this

Just go

Aldra


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## MikeCo (Jan 26, 2008)

Mike - not sure if you've grasped the specific point. 
All of the normal clip on-off bottle-top valves that you refer to as being for sale all over the place in Spain (and indeed they are), CONTAIN a 30mbar REGULATOR.
Here's an example:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Spanish-p...ervan_Caravan_Accessories&hash=item41797c8833

(Incidentally, beware of buying very old ones from Rastros etc here, as they used to be 28mbar....checj that it says 30mbar on it!)

But that is NOT what the guy was asking for. 
Because he's already got a 30mbar regulator bolted to his gas cupboard wall, he wants a straight-through (ie NON-regulated bottle-top valve)......so that there's no problems with "double-constriction" of the gas flow from the bottle.

On other forums I've heard mixed reports on this. Some people have said they've not had a problem with double-regulation. Others have said that any pressure-sensitive items of kit wouldn't work when two regulators were used in line.

An alternative to having to try to obtain such a non-regulated Spanish bottle-top valve would be to do what I've seen lots of Brit vans here have: a "T" has been fitted to the gas pipework DOWNSTREAM of the bulkhead regulator, and an extra pipe with on-off valve has been added there. 
Thus you can turn off your "British gas" and instead attach, via a length of Spanish orange rubber flexi pipe, a Spanish bottle to that alternative point, via a normal on-bottle-regulated Spanish valve.

I know that many Spanish motorhome/caravan places will do this really simple gas pipe mod for you while you wait...certainly Caravanas Ferero in Alicante will, as a Brit mate of mine had it done there.[/quote]

I can assure you that I know exactly what I am talking about having bought two of the Jumbo valves which are not regulators in Spain whilst there with the caravan in previous years. The reason being because of the bulkhead fitted regulater in the caravan. The end.

Mike


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Go to google.es and search for Jumbo adaptador and see how many results you get for adaptors which are not regulators (salida libre), Alan.


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## shirleydeputy (Jul 31, 2009)

Hi Chrisgog
Don't be too put off by the comments about the cold. It's all relative, and depends a bit where you go. 
We have spent January and February in the south Costa Blanca for the last few years and on average the temperature was approximately10 degrees warmer than our home in Southern England. It doesn't sound much but the difference is noticeable. Sunbathing during the main part of the day is very possible. Wind blockers are recommended! 
For us the biggest difference is that it is generally much drier so easier to wrap up if you are off to the local bar in the evening!  You can have a lie in in the morning and the sun will be beginning to warm up nicely by 10am! Enjoy the middle of the day outside but be prepared to wrap up a bit more by around 4pm. You will need t shirts etc but have lots of other options for layering as the day progresses. Fleecy tops are particularly good as they keep out the wind and are easy to launder. 
Go for it! We love it. Family ill health will prevent us being there in 2014 but we fully intend to return for the following winter.
Shirley


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## chrisgog (May 17, 2005)

Thanks everyone. Preparation all underhand. Insurance , travel and sites all booked. Tom tom to be updated and used with lovely new maps. Got a singler ring cooker and fitted up some outside cooking. All we want is a good TRIP down and some nice weather when we get there.

Thanks for all your help. Can't wait
Chris


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## Scattycat (Mar 29, 2011)

One thing I wish we had taken on our first winter trip south was a gas blow torch.
We were surprised how many water taps on aires were frozen. We over came the prolem most times by pouring hot water over the taps but a blow torch would have been easier


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