# Hymer B614SL (Fiat) Droopy Front Suspension



## DonOne

Hi, I have recently bought a 2nd hand 2007 Hymer B614SL with approx. 30k miles on the clock. The motorhome is standard with no extras fitted, post delivery. However, the front of the motorhome is considerably lower than the rear and the ride at the front is very harsh over uneven surfaces. Surface joints on motorways are met with repetitious thumping! Not nice...

The 'van is plated at 4000kg, the front axle at 2100kg and the rear 2400kg. 

With a tank full of water, the fuel tank 3/4's full and driver on-board the weighbridge weights are 1840(F) and 1760(R) = 3600 Total. 
The tyres are Michelin XC's. I have inflated the front tyres to 52psi. and the standard response 80psi for the rear, after talking to Michelin. I have, however, set the rear pressures appropriately lower. The ride was slightly better but still as I described above. 

I have seen pictures of other B614SL's with the droopy front but that doesn't make me feel any better!

Any suggestions/comments on whether this is usual, what options are open to me etc.

Thanks Don


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## brandywine

I think an awful lot of Hymers are nose down at the front, ours is, it seems its the way they are built.

As to the knocking noise, I would get it checked out.

Regards


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## Baron1

Hi Don,
Are you sure that you have the correct pressure in the front tyres?
On my B584 the recommended pressure is (if I remember correctly) 5 bar which is around 70PSI.
I must admit I normally run on about 65PSI all round as 70 is a bit harsh sometimes. Try upping your front tyre pressure to 65PSI and see if that feels any better as 52 does seem a bit low.
I normally travel with the water tank half full rather than full and that improves the ride also.
As you have been advised most Hymers do stand with a nose down attitude mine included, try looking at another Hymer when you're on site and measure from the ground to the top of the wheelarch and compare it to your own.

Hope you get it sorted 
Mel.


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## Markt500

Our 584 is nose down too - I think its fine. I did see one recently that had been 'levelled' and it actually looked a bit odd. I think nose down will increase the aerodynamics and speed :roll: Kinda like a 60's american muscle car.....


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## javea

Hi Don,

I have a 2007 Hymer B544SL with 26,000 miles on the clock. Same symptoms as your vehicle - I have compared it with other new Hymers and it is about 7 cms lower at the front wing.

It has been suggested to me that the earlier of the X250 models were fitted with front springs which were not man enough for the job and that Hymer started fitting stronger springs, although I cannot ascertain when. Apparently it is very likely that when fully loaded my vehicle is hitting the bump stops and that is why the suspension is harsh on occasion, running over those rumble strips before French and Spanish toll booths is murder!

On Wednesday it is going in to have new reinforced springs fitted, I will let you know how I feel about the difference when I get back.

Mike


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## harveystc

*droopy front hymer*

Hi,just a quick point on the tyres, after talking to the boss of a courier company that run fiat and mercedes vans loaded to the top, and travelling all over europe,he advised me that they recommed tyres to be 55 front and 70 rear,and they get the best milage and ride out of them,you can at great cost fit different shockers,which will improve it a little but air suspension is the only awswer again at great cost,we all feel the bumps,but tyre pressure is important.regards happypre65 :lol:


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## MyGalSal

We have a B694SL which is also slightly nose down (as was our previous B654). It is 4.5t and has the stronger front springs fitted (by manufacturer during build). Model is 2011. Don't know whether this first year they have fitted the stronger springs. Our B654 was 2008 and it didn't have them.
Sal


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## erneboy

I had a similar problem, much improved now: http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopic-66812.html

Alan.


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## BillCreer

Hi,
My B584 is nose down but I find that to be an advantage as most places I stay at are slightly up hill or down hill. I have the option of going in forward or backwards to keep level.


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## DonOne

*Droopy Front Suspension*

Thank you to everyone who has responded and offered advice and comments. I will see how it goes on our first 'big' trip to France in September.

Thanks to Ernieboy for the links and photos.

Javea - I am really interested in your thoughts and views about your front suspension upgrade. Would you mind providing some detail about the upgrade.

E.g What springs/manufacturer, was there a choice, if so why did you choose the ones you did. Who fitted the new springs, how long did it take, was it done well. What would I need to budget if I followed your upgrade. Photos would be nice as well. 

I know I am asking a lot but you advice would help me decide whether it would be worth doing on my 'van. If you think I'm being too nosey then tell me to mind my own business. 

Hope it all turned out good for you and look forward to hearing your news.

Regards Don


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## javea

*Re: Droopy Front Suspension*



DonOne said:


> Thank you to everyone who has responded and offered advice and comments. I will see how it goes on our first 'big' trip to France in September.
> 
> Thanks to Ernieboy for the links and photos.
> 
> Javea - I am really interested in your thoughts and views about your front suspension upgrade. Would you mind providing some detail about the upgrade.
> 
> E.g What springs/manufacturer, was there a choice, if so why did you choose the ones you did. Who fitted the new springs, how long did it take, was it done well. What would I need to budget if I followed your upgrade. Photos would be nice as well.
> 
> I know I am asking a lot but you advice would help me decide whether it would be worth doing on my 'van. If you think I'm being too nosey then tell me to mind my own business.
> 
> Hope it all turned out good for you and look forward to hearing your news.
> 
> Regards Don


Hi Don,

Pleased to say the reason for being a subscriber on this forum is all the help you get from fellow motorhomers, and the advice you can sometimes give to others. 

I decided to bite the financial bullet and go for Goldschmitt springs in the belief that they were the best which were available, and I also understand that they do development work with Hymer.

They are not cheap, the bill was 515 euros including carriage. If you decided to fit them speak with Ramon Mobious who is their technical guy on 00 49 62 83 22 29 32 or [email protected], his English is very good. I made a mistake initially in speaking to their sales team who sent me the wrong springs, to be fair they sent the replacements FOC and paid to have the originals returned to them. You need to be specific about the chassis on your vehicle, ie. 35 Light,35 heavy, 40 heavy.

They were fitted by Essanjay in Poole, I stopped overnight outside their premises hooked up to their electric supply and that was fine. Went into Poole for most of the day whilst they replaced the springs and left around 5.00pm. I will pm you regarding costs as they underestimated the time that the job would take and I don't want to embarrass them by quoting a figure here that they may not wish to honour in future. With an A class it is a fairly major operation because of difficulties in accessing the nut that holds the suspension strut at the top.

I have tried to attach some before and after photos but I have a new Canon Ixus camera and it won't let me load them onto Picasa and I can't get them from the Canon program onto my pictures to attach. Will keep trying! Before the modification the front wing was 7 centimetres lower than the rear, there is now slightly less than 2cm difference. The vehicle no longer has a pronounced 'nose down' attitude but it doesn't look out of place as someone else has remarked upon. The measurements were both taken in an unladen condition, no water etc on board.

Individual feelings on ride quality can be subjective, I certainly feel that the front of the vehicle does not transmit road vibrations as much as before when going over ruts in the road, hatchings etc. When going down dips in the road it is certainly much more compliant, even though the springs are of a stronger nature. Bit difficult to describe really, Goldschmitt claim a 20% increase in ride comfort, I wouldn't go that far but it is certainly better and if asked 'Would you do it again' the answer would be yes. It will be interesting to try it out when fully loaded, Hymer told me that the suspension experience on their vehicles was always better when loaded up.

If you need any more info just shout.


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## lgbzone

Hi Javea

Many thanks for the information, i'm really interested in this myself and any information is a big help.

Do you know how to determine the chassis (35 light, etc)? it's the first i've heard of it.

Can i also ask; did goldschmitt give you a choice of springs, do you have any idea of the poundage etc.

Looking forwards to the photos.

Thanks
Lee


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## javea

OK, think I may have sussed how to get the photos on here.

First one is before changing, second afterwards.


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## MyGalSal

The stronger springs that I mentioned on our B694 are also Goldschmitt. We found the manual concerning them in our Hymer 'pack' when we picked up our van - but its all in German! so can't give you any stats - other than to say they are better than the regular.

Sal


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## javea

lgbzone said:


> Hi Javea
> 
> Many thanks for the information, i'm really interested in this myself and any information is a big help.
> 
> Do you know how to determine the chassis (35 light, etc)? it's the first i've heard of it.
> 
> Can i also ask; did goldschmitt give you a choice of springs, do you have any idea of the poundage etc.
> 
> Looking forwards to the photos.
> 
> Thanks
> Lee


Hi Lee,

I knew that my motorhome was on a 35 Light chassis when I bought it. Think Fiat can tell you from the chassis number.

Goldschmitt didn't give me a choice of springs, the confusion arose from when the sales lady asked me what weights the vehicle ran at, I gave her those but when the box arrived I noticed it said '35/40 Heavy'.

Queried it and they put me on to Ramon and he asked if I had an actual front axle weight when loaded, and which chassis I was running on. On receipt of both pieces of information he advised that the springs they had supplied would be too stiff for my chassis so they changed them for the lighter ones.

Mike


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## lgbzone

Hi Mike

Many thanks, i'll look into it.

Lee


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## DonOne

*Droopy front end - Resolved*

Hi - I thought it would be good to provide some feedback on how we have resolved our suspension problem. 
We opted to have Goldschmitt uprated springs fitted to the front suspension following various internet searches and excellent feedback and advice from 'Javea' Mike.

Was it worth it? Absolutely.

I would say the ride has now been restored to what it was/should have been when new. As we only had it after it was five years old I cannot judge any better than that. The ride is now pleasant and there are no more harsh thumps and crashes and the front ride height has been restored. This has improved the handling, and braking, especially when travelling down hill, turning and braking.

The added bonus was that the overall load carrying capacity has been uprated from 4,000kg. Previously, we were 2,100kg (F) and 2,400kg (R) and very tight on payload.

Now we are 2,250kg (F) and 2,400kg (R) with the overall load carrying capacity up to 4,500kg. So now we can make even more purchases at the hypermarket.

We opted to go to Germany to have the suspension fitted by Goldschmitt direct. We incorporated the visit en-route as part of our first major tour of Italy. Everything was organised via email and we turned up the evening before our agreed fitting day. Goldschmitt have all the usual hook-up and disposal facilities you would find at a good campsite. 08:00 the following morning the van was allocated to one of their numerous fitting bays and 3 hours later, as stated, the new suspension was fitted and we were ready to roll.

Truly excellent service, wonderful facilities and the price was less than we had been quoted to have the springs fitted in the UK.

Finally, thanks to all my fellow motor-homers who provided feedback and advice. We are now very happy with our Hymer and after 4,500 miles touring Italy we are already planning our next trip for 2014.

Regards Don


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## wakk44

Thanks for the update Don,I'm sure other Hymer owners would consider a front suspension upgrade after your report,can you tell us how much it cost?You can send a pm if you prefer.


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## dalspa

Don,
Thanks for the update. Had been following this thread last year, so your update is of great interest.

Looking at the your original spec of 2100(F) and 2400(R) I assume that your chassis is the 40H, the same as mine, on 2007 B654SL. I am about to look into getting my MGW uprated - at the moment it's 4000kg. I was, initially, just going to SvTech and see what extra I could go up to without having any modifications done. However, having read through your post I might well go down the same route as you. I had been thinking that I might be able to uprate to 4150kg or so that way, but to be able to get up to 4500kg by changing the springs is definately worth considering. As with yours, the van is nose down and if I hit a pothole there's nothing left in the springs to absorb the impact. Did SvTech do the re-plating for you, or was it all part of the service with having the springs fitted?

If you don't mind, you could PM me with your contact details so that we could speak on the matter.

Thanks in anticipation.
DavidL


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## DonOne

*Hymer Droopy Front End - Fixed and the cost was...*

For those who are interested the cost for uprating the front suspension was as follows. (I have added the VAT to each component for an approx. complete price)

Parts (Upgraded front springs for Fiat X250 35/40 Heavy) *€469* (approx. £375)

Labour (for the above) *€220* (approx. £176)

The TÜV certification and plate* (needed for DVLA authorisation) *€81* (approx.£65)

So the all in total =*€770* (approx. £616) or without the TÜV certificate *€689* (approx. £551)

_* Not needed if you do not want to upgrade the load carrying capacity_.

Fitting time=3 hours. am or pm fitting slots available each day.

I used the fitting centre in Walldurn Germany http://www.goldschmitt.de/

I just hope I get commission from Goldschmitt. Do mention me when you contact them. (hehe)

Don


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## hogan

Brilliant thanks for the update.
Another topic book marked for future use.

If only everyone would post updates re there problems !


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## DonOne

*Hymer Droopy Front End - And there's more...*

Hi - in response to 'dalspa' David I did not use SvTech. My understanding is that they effectively assess your original construction details and provide you with a certificate for a slightly higher load carrying capacity that DVLA will accept . That is why they can do this without actually seeing your motorhome.

In my case the actual front springs were replaced with heavier duty ones and hence I can carry a greater front axle load. This in turn has led to an overall increase in load carrying capacity. I suspect the Hymer B614 is front axle load limited - and this affects the overall load carrying capacity. This would also appear to explain how the front end has become overwhelmed and has gone all droopy!

I have yet to send the change of the load carrying capacity to the DVLA. I have been checking whether there was any negative point to doing this and I have found none, so I will be doing this shortly. 
My understanding is that all I need to do is amend the V5C (logbook), return it to the DVLA with the German TÜV certificate and they will accept this (somewhat like the SvTech certificate) and change the vehicle details. I also understand there is no charge from the DVLA for this. I will update this blog when I get the results.

_P.S. - The front end is raised approx. 60mm. Not a huge amount but I suspect we were effectively riding on the bump-stops at the front anyway. At least now we are not smashing the suspension to bits everytime we hit a pot-hole. _

Regards Don


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## Scolds

Thanks for all the posts Don


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## hogan

Thanks to donOne and the other posters above.Last Friday after prior arrangement I arrived at Goldschmit for the front springs to be upgraded.At 8 am I was told to drive to gate 5 and was seen onto a ramp.
At 10.40 I was told the van was ready. What a set up I wish more UK garages could be like this.Not only did they change the springs but also weighed the vehicle and gave me a print out of each wheel load,and fixed a fridge fault F.O.C.

Earlier in the week I was at Hymer factory/ showroom in Bad Waldsee and noticed that the Goldschmit upgraded front springs can be added as a comfort pack when ordering new.
Why don't they sort it at the factory.


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## DonOne

Hi Hogan
Glad you got it sorted and all went well. My experience was good, like yours. I agree with your sentiments regarding Hymer sorting this. BTW, what do you think of the ride. Is it an improvement or just more level?

Don
DonOne


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## hogan

Very much a better ride since new springs have not felt the bump stops hitting. Road bumps are a little smoother too.
More level in fact when we drove away I felt we were permanently going uphill  
More used to it now money well spent,and to get the fridge fault sorted F.O.C. to boot.


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## dalspa

Did you get your loading upgraded as a result of the new springs? What sort of lead in time from booking in to them fitting?

DavidL


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## hogan

dalspa said:


> Did you get your loading upgraded as a result of the new springs? What sort of lead in time from booking in to them fitting?
> 
> DavidL


Yes you can get your loading upgraded at the same time they have a TUV station next door but as mine is already 4.5 ton I didn't bother.

Lead in time for booking is aprox two weeks they do 8 am or 2 pm appointments no work on Saturdays. Ask for Tatyana


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## BillCreer

Hi,

I found a cheaper way to cure the drooping nose.

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopict-143472-.html


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## DonOne

*Hymer B614SL - Uprated load carrying*

Hi everyone,

I can finally complete the story of getting my Hymer fitted with new front springs and uprating my load carrying capacity.

My Hymer B614SL was rated at 4t before the fitting of the Goldschmitt springs.

Since returning from holiday I eventually got around to sending my V5C (logbook) back to the DVLA with a photocopy 
of the TUV certificate obtained from Goldschmitt. (No payment to DVLA required)

Several weeks later and a new V5C document has returned and the vehicle is now plated at *4.5t*.

Now, time to plan a serious trip to the Hypermarket!

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to campervaners everywhere.

Don (DonOne)


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## Hymie

*Goldschmitt*

We are travelling to BadWaldsee in march and we need to get the front springs replaced on our B544SL
Has anyone used the Goldschmitt facility at Leutkirch? it looks as though it is only around 30km from Hymer?

Happy Travels
Hymie


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## dalspa

Hymie,

Have been looking at the Goldshmitt details myself earlier today - according to their website they have 3 depots - Hopfingen, Polch, and Walldurn. The first one translates to a distribution centre and the other two as service centres. Is the one you refer to the first one but under a different name? - haven't looked it up on the map. 

I was initially thinking of going to Walldurn (Walduern) to get my springs done but Polch appears to be 130miles nearer to Calais, so now under consideration. I don't know, as yet, whether they provide the same facilities as at Walldurn, including being able to do the replating certificates etc.

Haven't been to Germany before so don't know whether I need to have an UMWELT sticker before I go, or get one from the TUV station where the replating certs. are issued? Planning to have a few days holiday, as well as getting the springs done. All in the early planning stages at the moment.

DavidL


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## DonOne

*Goldschmitt*

Hi guys, I used the Waldurn depot and found them to be excellent. I'm sure the other depots are just as good. Give them an email and see what's what. They will be able to provide TUV paperwork that will be acceptable to DVLC. That was my experience, anyway. Good luck and you will not regret it.
DonOne


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## hogan

I used the Waldurn depot in Nov.First class service ring up and speak to Tatyanna she will give you a price and make appointment. Mine took 2 1/2 hrs.They also fixed a fridge problem F.O.C.


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## Mike48

You can get raised front springs in the UK. The kits are made in Holland by VB. I had mine done in Tiverton last summer costing £620.

The link to VB is here:

http://www.vbairsuspension.co.uk/en/page/applications/motorhome.html

The more expensive Goldscmidt springs can be fitted in Poole by EssandJay but that will cost around £950.


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