# Speed limits for vans (new one on me!)



## ActiveCampers (Jun 17, 2005)

Hmmmm

I always drove (and probably will continue to do so!) my Transit based panel van conversion at the same speed as my car.

However it has been brought to my attention that unbeknown to me, if the van has a max laden weight of >2 tonnes (e.g. almost if not all motorhomes) then a lower limit applies!

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTransport/Highwaycode/DG_070304

I thought it was over 3.5 tonnes but apparently not.....

ANyone else know this? Anyone stick to it? I know I've driven past loads of cameras and human speed traps at "car" limits and not "van" limits and been fine... (rather than been fined!)


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

If a vehicle is registered as a Motorhome then different rules apply. If the unladen weight is less than 3050kg then limits are the same as a car. If over 3050kg then the limit on normal roads is 50, on dual carriageways 60 and motorways 70. 

PS 3050 kg is not a misprint, 3500kg is not relavent for speed limits.


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## ActiveCampers (Jun 17, 2005)

OK - great. 
But any formal link for that at that isn't mentioned on the government website? Googling just shows other motorhome sites mentioning it rather than a government body?


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## locovan (Oct 17, 2007)

Does this link help http://www.ukmotorhomes.net/faqs.shtml#speed


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## locovan (Oct 17, 2007)

I would like to add we never go over 60 on a Motorway as this is the best speed for fuel consumption, anything over and the old fuel needle goes down fast. 8O


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## ActiveCampers (Jun 17, 2005)

Not really.

I found that one - but its a "personal opinion" site rather than autoritative government site... (no offence to owner, but never believe anything you read unless you can validate it! )

Best I can find is confirmation on http://microsites.lincolnshire.gov.uk/LRSP/section.asp?catId=12446 which is at least a government site.

But - aha!
Speed Limits for Vehicles of Certain Classes <<< Link

Confirmed - thanks!

Mod tip ...the very long URL that was messing up the viewing of this thread was replaced using the







button :wink:


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## locovan (Oct 17, 2007)

Why do they mention *An invalid carriage *surely they are not allowed on the Road???
I know some do drive them on the road but with no Tax and No lights I think they really do risk it. 8O


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## camper69 (Aug 30, 2007)

locovan said:


> Why do they mention *An invalid carriage *surely they are not allowed on the Road???
> I know some do drive them on the road but with no Tax and No lights I think they really do risk it. 8O


I assume that is a reference to the old blue 3 wheeled disabled cars that were around in the 60's and 70's. see pic

Derek


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## thePassants (Feb 9, 2009)

I know to my cost (& points) that the traffic cops in North Wales, particularly the A55 rigourously enforce the 60 limit for light commercials (White Vans).
I was doing 80, along with all the cars, and got lasered, followed and pulled in my Merc Vito.
He agreed that unladen, and with it's ABS, VDC, ESP etc. etc. The van is far less dangerous at that speed than many cars on the road; but "it's the law"!

I knew the 'light commercial' category didn't apply to MHs but didn't know of the other rules.

Does anyone know of any specific restrictions in European countries & Turkey?


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

ActiveCampers said:


> Hmmmm
> 
> I always drove (and probably will continue to do so!) my Transit based panel van conversion at the same speed as my car.
> 
> ...


Your highway code ref is specifically for car types that have a closed in van section instead of the normal side and rear windows.

The highway code is also not a complete list nor is it the law just an interpretation.

Edit Just seen your middle post (trying to identify which one was using the whole width of bmy 2084 pixel screen!). That is the correct list.

Please use URL compression either Tiny or the one provided on MHF EDit Mods have sorted it.


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## philoaks (Sep 2, 2008)

thePassants said:


> I know to my cost (& points) that the traffic cops in North Wales, particularly the A55 rigourously enforce the 60 limit for light commercials (White Vans).
> I was doing 80, along with all the cars, and got lasered, followed and pulled in my Merc Vito.
> He agreed that unladen, and with it's ABS, VDC, ESP etc. etc. The van is far less dangerous at that speed than many cars on the road; but "it's the law"


The legislation is all a bit of a minefield. I drive a Vauxhall Corsa van, which has no rear windows so effectively it is a "light commercial". However because it is "car derived" normal car speed limits apply!


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## lifestyle (Apr 27, 2008)

The speed limit classification for commercial vans has been 50 for a very long time on single / duel carriageways ,i believe because of the heavy loads that maybe carried.


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## thePassants (Feb 9, 2009)

The point I meant to make, is that the Welsh Police are particularly vigilant on this stretch of dual carriageway (the A55 into N Wales); since it is a continuation of a Motorway, it is particularly easy to 'forget' the different limit.

A neighbour of mine was also pulled there recently, but for driving her car whilst holding a cup! She got a fine & points. Seemed a little harsh, as (she told me) she was just 'cruising' along the dual carriageway.

At risk of starting a 'mass debate', I wish they'd ban smoking whilst driving; the distraction of fiddling with *** packets, trying to light-up, then flicking the ash / butts out of the window must constitute a distraction, surely?
And, as a non- smoker; I know for a fact that injesting nicotine has a considerable effect on my disposition: Just because I am practiced and tolerant to alcohol, doesn't make it OK for me to drink & drive!


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

I agree, it is dificult to roll a cigarette while driving although I can do it if I steer with my knees and take my spectacles off so I can focus on the close up work. We are lacking silly, pointless laws, let´s have a few more, Alan.


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## DTPCHEMICALS (Jul 24, 2006)

My V5C only shows a Revenue weight not an unladen weight.
Revenue weight I take to be the max gross weight.


What a scenario we have here. 8O 
Dave P


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

locovan said:


> Does this link help http://www.ukmotorhomes.net/faqs.shtml#speed


Thanks for that link Mavis, as I know, you know your stuff, hopefully there is no amendment to the "Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 (c. 27)"

Kev.


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

DTPCHEMICALS said:


> My V5C only shows a Revenue weight not an unladen weight.
> Revenue weight I take to be the max gross weight.
> 
> What a scenario we have here. 8O
> Dave P


The V5 is not relavent, or the plated weights, as neither of them give a specification VOSA's definition of 'unladen weight' :

'The weight of a vehicle inclusive of the body and all parts which are ordinarily used with the vehicle when working on a road. Unladen weight does not include the weight of water or fuel used for the propulsion of the vehicle, or of loose tools and loose equipment.'

We take that to mean, in the case of motorhomes, the weight of the bare vehicle, without any posessions, portable equipment, water, gas, etc. Many motorhomes with a GVW of 3500kg or less will have an unladen weight of less than 3050kg, *but if you are in doubt about the unladen weight of your motorhome you should get the figures from the motorhome manufacturer. *


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## thePassants (Feb 9, 2009)

erneboy said:


> I agree, it is dificult to roll a cigarette while driving although I can do it if I steer with my knees and take my spectacles off so I can focus on the close up work. We are lacking silly, pointless laws, let´s have a few more, Alan.


You're right of course Alan:

The inhabitants of our country are all sensible and considerate enough to behave responsibly at all times anyway; without the need for a threat of fines or punishment if they don't.

Steve.


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

philoaks said:


> The legislation is all a bit of a minefield


It isn't - it's actually quite clear if you take a few minutes to absorb it.



philoaks said:


> I drive a Vauxhall Corsa van, which has no rear windows so effectively it is a "light commercial"


It's not - as you've also said, it's a Car-derived Van (a goods vehicle which is constructed or adapted as a derivative of a passenger vehicle and which has a maximum laden weight not exceeding 2 tonnes). The definition is quite clear.

For a more detailed display of speed limits, see http://www.devon-cornwall.police.uk/v3/roadsafe/speed/index.htm# (scroll down to the bottom of the page).

Dougie.


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## EJB (Aug 25, 2007)

If you speed......you get points and a fine!
If you eat and drink whilst driving......you get points and a fine!
If the traffic in general is speeding and you blindly follow....you are a sheep.....and that is far worse!!

What's the problem? :wink:


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## gromett (May 9, 2005)

I did my HGV (C1) training and test and the instructor covered the 3.05T rule and the speed limits.

I follow these speed limits absolutely. The big bonus I have found is that I now get a much higher MPG out of my new 4.5T van than I did out of my old 3.5T Hymer which I nailed everywhere including 130KPH in France >.<

The downside is I can get some quite long tail backs behind me and this forces me to pull over regularly on long trips cross country. Simple rule more than 5 cars for 5 minutes I am obliged to pull over at the earliest opportunity. Less than 5 cars I make a judgement call on.

I was driving back from coningsby the other day and I couldn't' believe it when a tag axle with trailer pulled out in front of me while I had a queue behind then proceeded to go at way above 60 on a single carriageway.
I had to slam the anchors on and almost made a mess in my trousers.
I pulled over at the next layby and let everyone past he should have waited....

Karl


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

erneboy said:


> I agree, it is dificult to roll a cigarette while driving although I can do it if I steer with my knees and take my spectacles off so I can focus on the close up work. We are lacking silly, pointless laws, let´s have a few more, Alan.


I beg to differ I've rolled cigs in every vehicle I've driven, it's no different to changing a CD, or look in all your mirrors, I agree it's not safe, but I could roll a cig in a pub while still holding a pint and having a conversation, it's all a matter of practise, I didn't need to look down at all, as it's all done by feel, like a few other things, you don't look for the gear lever or clutch pedal do, some people couldn't roll a cig if you offered them money, mind you some of them would struggle to walk upright, but that's another story, my point is it's not difficult to do most things while driving (I'm not suggesting it's a good idea BTW) we see people of the lady persuasion putting on make up, feeding and changing a baby on the Mway, looking at maps, eating a jacket potato with chilli.

Sorry I didn't mean to go on that long, I only meant to post this pic to save all the aggro of going to a different site when it could be on here.

Vehicle Speed Limits, Below

Kev.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

I agree Kev.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

That's rare. :lol: :lol: :lol: 

Kev.


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## 121576 (Mar 22, 2009)

camper69 said:


> locovan said:
> 
> 
> > Why do they mention *An invalid carriage *surely they are not allowed on the Road???
> ...


My word Derek,that photo takes me back,my father had a selection of carrages from the early 50s to the one you enclose i think this one was a tipping delta what a name,powered by a beautiful flat 4 stroke twin of german origin not a bmw.the second one he had was a greeves invacar open to the weather,with a 197cc villiers engine,the government in their wisdom supplied these with a kickstart for a man with one leg!!! my first driving foray was in this when my parents were on holiday i was 13 at the time father would have killed me had he known.He used to take me to the TT in the isle of man in the 50s sailing from fleetwood where they used to hoist him on board with a loading crane,what would health and safety said these days i hate to think.
Thank you again for the photo.
Peter Kean.
PS.the number plate on the invacar was PK 365,we thought it was just a coincidence wish i had the reg no now.


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## 106559 (Aug 19, 2007)

gromett said:


> I did my HGV (C1) training and test and the instructor covered the 3.05T rule and the speed limits.
> 
> The downside is I can get some quite long tail backs behind me and this forces me to pull over regularly on long trips cross country. Simple rule more than 5 cars for 5 minutes I am obliged to pull over at the earliest opportunity.
> 
> Karl


 I know of no obligation to pull over with a truck. Tractors yes, and rightly so,but not HGVs.
Our industry is caned enough as it is without any expensive 'courtesy' arrangements thrown in. Sorry Grommet but you'd be shown the door anywhere I've worked. :roll:


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## gromett (May 9, 2005)

derek, I am on about in my motorhome. I don't see why people returning from work should have to wait for me in my 'leisure' vehicle. I am being polite and considerate. It doesn't cost me anything except a fraction of an mpg and allows those in a rush back from/to work to progress. Basic common decency.

In a commercial vehicle then no I wouldn't pull over. However I regularly see HGV's doing more than 50 on single carriageways and even C+E vehicles doing more than 40Mph......

Karl


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## 106559 (Aug 19, 2007)

Fair enough. In the van I speed up so as not to hold up traffic then just back off when a passing opportunity arises. I think you may find that stopping regularly then having to regain the lost momentum will not be very cost effective though.


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## Fatalhud (Mar 3, 2006)

The biggest problem is how do you find out what your vehicle weighs unladen, and what is taken into account in a motorhome as unladen weight

Alan H


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## twinky (Aug 11, 2008)

Fatalhud said:


> The biggest problem is how do you find out what your vehicle weighs unladen, and what is taken into account in a motorhome as unladen weight
> 
> Alan H


From a spec leaflet of a major manufacturer in front of me the unladen weight is given as:

'The 'Mass in running order' according to norms 92/21 EG and EN 1646-2 includes the empty vehicle weight, the drivers weight at 75kg, a 90% fuel capacity, 100% water tank capacity, 2 X 11kg gas bottles (100% full) and a cable reel.'

I would need to revise the driver weight a bit for me :roll: :roll: .


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## Fatalhud (Mar 3, 2006)

twinky said:


> Fatalhud said:
> 
> 
> > The biggest problem is how do you find out what your vehicle weighs unladen, and what is taken into account in a motorhome as unladen weight
> ...


Thats my point, M.I.R.O is not the unladen weight
Alan H


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