# Hobby/Dometic Fridge Problem



## gaspode

Following a failure of the Dometic fridge (RM7651L) over the weekend in our 2005 Hobby T600FC I have discovered, with the assistance of another MHF member, that there appears to be a wiring error in these M/Hs (and possibly in others using this fridge). The fault shows itself as a full or partial failure of the fridge after a period of working OK. It appears to be due to the permanent 12v supply negative wire being wired to the D+ terminal at the bottom rear of the fridge instead of being wired to the -ve terminal. The fridge does work for a time as it picks up a negative feed through the control module. For some reason this feed deteriorates with time and the fridge starts to play up. If anyone needs further details, please PM me.


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## 97180

After reading your posting I checked the RM7651L fridge wiring on my own 2005 Hobby T-600 FC and it was as follows:

2 wires enter the permanent DC-connection terminal block at the bottom-left of the fridge's rear. One is RED and is connected to the +ve terminal (referred to as "D = Plus electronics" in the Dometic Manual). The 2nd wire is GREY and is connected to the D+ terminal ("D+ = alternator signal") that is only relevant for RM76x5 fridges with AES. No wire is connected to the -ve terminal (referred to in the Manual as "C = Ground electronics").

2 wires leave the permanent DC-connection terminal block. One is VIOLET and is connected to the +ve terminal and the other is BLACK and is connected to the -ve terminal. No outgoing wire is connected to the D+ terminal. (This '2-wires-out' arrangement is exactly what one would expect based on the RM76x1L wiring diagram).

I'm pretty sure the above is the same cabling set-up as on your fridge.

On the face of it the input side of the terminal block wiring is strange, but I'm not 100% certain it's wrong. There are several reasons for this doubt. The first is simply that, if I were wiring up a fridge and saw a terminal block with "+", "-" and "D+" on it, I'd expect to connect wires to the first two terminals in strong preference to the D+ one. The second is that the wiring arrangement immediately looks peculiar, with one input wire stopping at the D+ terminal and with no input wire to the -ve terminal. This suggests deliberation to me rather than cack-handedness. 

I'm also concerned that the wire connected to the D+ terminal is GREY - if it were an earth cable I would expect it to be BLACK. I note that the CBE PC-100 electrical system Hobby uses is 'AES-fridge ready' and one might therefore anticipate a D+ cable-feed for an AES fridge to be within the wiring-loom even though the feed would be redundant when a non-AES fridge were installed (when the feed cable would presumably carry no D+ signal). Basically, what I'm asking myself is whether the GREY cable is actually intended as an earth or is just a 'dead' spare D+ wire. 

My motorhome's fridge has shown no unusual symptoms (so far) and I'm reluctant to alter the wiring unless it's genuinely wrong. I need to ask you how much of your explanation is theory. Are you basing your diagnosis on your own fridge problem alone or do you know of other people in the same boat? Frankly, I'm surprised that the fridge would work at all without a proper feed-to-earth being present at the -ve terminal of the permanent DC-connection block on fridge's top service. I hear what you say about an 'accidental' earth being obtained via the control module - have you proved this happens, please, or are you assuming it has got to? (Presumably, with your fridge not working, you moved the GREY wire from D+ terminal to -ve terminal and the cure was immediate?)

Final question - have you taken this up with Hobby, or whoever sold you the vehicle? If there is an inherent fault in the way that these motorhomes' fridges are being wired then the factory needs to be made aware of it as the RM76x1 model is probably the most common in the Hobby range. 

Regards,

Frank Gordon


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## gaspode

Hi Frank
You are absolutely correct in your assumption that your wiring is exactly the same as mine was. I am also surprised that Hobby should make such a fundamental error in the wiring but I think that I am correct. I was aware of a problem on these fridges before I bought the van in September. Another member on this forum had warned me in advance. He bought a T600 when they first came out and shortly afterwards suffered a fridge failure whilst in Spain. On returning to UK he called out Dometic under warranty and it was their engineer who spotted the wiring fault. The fridge worked OK after the Dometic engineer re-wired it properly but other problems persisted (mainly with the control module and control knobs) but that is another matter. Dometic have eventually supplied him with an AES upgrade FOC.
When my fridge began to play up last weekend (after 3 months trouble free use) I of course contacted this other member and he instructed me on the details of the re-wire needed. My fridge works perfectly again after switching the grey wire to the -ve terminal. Before switching the wire I did two things:
1) Tested across the purple and black wires for voltage compared to the voltage across the purple and grey wires. The voltage across the purple and black wires was slightly lower indicating to me that there was some resistance in the -ve supply at the black wire (ie. neutral being picked up via another circuit.
2) Checked the status of the grey wire with the engine running. The running engine had no effect whatsoever on the status of the grey wire, thus indicating to me that there was no switching voltage (for AES) being generated.

As I said, the diagnosis came from a Dometic engineer, not myself and mine certainly isn't the only case. I understand that the Dometic guy contacted Hobby but am unaware of any feedback. I bought my van in Germany so haven't bothered to contact the dealer, if you Email Hobby in Germany they simply refer you to their UK agent who is great on caravans but doesn't seem too clued up on M/Hs. The other alternative is Brownhills - enough said!
You don't say how old your Hobby is, if recent then the fact that the fridge works OK initally would seem to fit in with the pattern and I don't think I would be inclined to meddle as long as it keeps working (although there is the outside possibility of causing damage to the control module PCB if a neutral is being drawn through it). If yours begins to play up after a few months then perhaps you need to look at changing the wiring also?

If you find out anthing more on the subject I would be very interested to hear about it.


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## Hagu

Interesting subject, I have a Hobby 2005 model. I will check this.


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## gaspode

Hi Hagu

Welcome to the Hobby T series section of MHF!!!!
How do you like your Hobby, and how does it perform in your cold climate?

If you send me an Email address I can send you a photo of the offending wiring terminal block if it will help.


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## Hagu

Hey Gaspode

Thank you, I have only seen photos of my Hobby, it is in Denmark (where I bought it) we will take it on a tour in Europe late May. In Iceland we just use our motorhomes in the summer, keep it indoor in the winter, but maybe that will change, it rarely snows here in the winter now  . I will send you my email.


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## 97180

Hi Gaspode,

My Hobby T-600 FC was also sourced from Germany (Ernst Caravan Center at Ettenheim) and I collected it in mid-July 2005.

You make a convincing case for a Hobby cock-up. What I find astonishing is that the Dometic connection methodology is likely to be identical for all their latest fridges, not just the RM76x1 models, (I haven't yet checked this via Dometic's on-line manuals, but it seems logical) so Hobby will probably be using the same (visually perverse) wiring method for every motorhome (and caravan?) they are manufacturing. I know that Hobby have funny ways of doing things, but this would be plain weird! 

I'll see if I can get some feedback from the German dealership on this.

Regards,

Frank


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## 97180

I've now taken a look at the on-line manual for Dometic's 97 litre RM7401LG, which is the alternative model of fridge that Hobby currently uses in their motorhomes. 

This fridge incorporates the A, B, C, D, D+ and S+ connections into a single terminal block, rather than the 2 blocks used for RM76x1 models. However, whether Hobby use a similar wiring method for this model could only be ascertained by inspection.

Frank


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## gaspode

Hi Frank

We also bought ours from Ernst at Ettenheim in September. We found them very helpful. I don't know how much you have used your M/H yet, the fault doesn't seem to crop up until the fridge has had some serious use. The first instance I'm aware of happened during a long trip to Spain where obviously the fridge was working overtime. Mine happened after I had left the fridge running for a couple of weeks by accident after parking it up on the drive and leaving the fridge running on 240v whilst hooked up. Just as an aside, have you had any problems with the rear shock absorbers? I understand that some of the earlier Transit conversions were fitted with the incorrect shockers on the rear and they have a tendency to fail after a few thousand Kms. A Ford dealer should be able to check them and replacement is FOC if yours are wrong. I asked specifically about this when buying and was assured by Ernst that mine were correct.


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## 97180

Hi Gaspode

There's coincidence!

When I contact Christian Ernst about the fridge wiring, are you happy for me to mention your name please? (Based on the Ernst e-mail Xmas card, I'm assuming you are the "Ken" with the "woodgate2a" address, but perhaps you would confirm this?)

Regarding the rear dampers, as Hobby batch build it's probable that those on our T600 are the same as on yours. Our 'van has only covered just over 5000km and, as far as I can tell, the shock absorbers are working fine. I wasn't aware of the potential problem you refer to - the only reference to rear suspension I've seen was in an early-2004 French report on a prototype Chausson Welcome 74 (built on the same chassis as the Hobby T-Series) that said suspension modifications would be made before the motorhome went into full production. I've noticed that all coachbuilt motorhomes based on the Transit FWD platform-cab chassis carry a Ford 'data-plate' on the cab door-pillar specifying a rear tyre pressure of 5.5bar. If buyers are adhering to this recommendation then the rear shockers (whether right or wrong type) are in for a very tough time. 

Incidentally, I found it impossible to remove a rear wheel using the standard jack and the methods given in the Ford Transit Owner's Guide. This is due to a combination of the particular spring design fitted to the chassis and lack of clearance within the wheel-arch itself. The only practical ploy seems to be to jack close to the rear-spring's front attachment-point and I would be very wary of doing this with a heavily loaded vehicle. It's just about possible to lower the spare wheel using Ford's recommended wheel-brace technique, but you'd never be able to wind it back up again as the extra width of the Hobby body is so obstructive. (I've made a crude extension tool to get round this.) It's not mentioned in the Owner's Guide, but the wheel-nut torque setting is 200Nm.

Our T600-FC has the following options - Ford Flex Pack (cab aircon, tinted glass, electric cab windows/mirrors, wheel-centre covers, audio-cassette system, uprated cab-heater), Truma C6002EH heater (instead of C3402), Remifront cab windscreen/windows blinds, rear mud flaps, and removable living-area carpets. At one stage Christian casually mentioned that, for an extra â‚¬95, one could opt for any of the interior décor schemes (except leather) available in the Hobby caravan range, but we were satisfied with the standard "Vienna" look.

Some observations on the conversion, working from front to back...

The concertina Remis cab-blinds are convenient to use but their poor insulation properties mean they are not much cop at preventing condensation forming on the window glass. (My wife will make up some removable curtains to go on the inside of the blinds in cold weather.) I've read several reports that the blind-material is mildew prone - ours are OK at the moment but I suspect this is inevitable. The material is also porous on the inside face, making marks from liquid (cooking splatters, fly spots, etc.) impossible to remove.

The driver's seat was always going to be too high for me so I've removed the swivel - this permits checking/maintenance of the vehicle-battery and I've also modified the battery hold-down 'bar' to allow access to all 6 of the removable cell-caps.

The thin plywood lids on the banquette bases are flimsy. I've reinforced the lids, halved them lengthways and added central hinges: this aids access to under-seat storage space. I've also moved the 'wall plate' behind the left banquette seat-back outwards a bit to prevent the seat-back jamming against the window-blind mechanism. This compromises making up the front-bed, but is anyone really going to exploit this feature on a T600?

I've inserted a spacer between the table-top and its pedestal and removed the 'squeeze-handle' that allows the table to be raised or lowered. The squeeze-handle is now screwed to the floor just in front of the foot of the pedestal on the cab side. These two modifications permit the table-top to have much increased 2-dimensional freedom.

We had difficulties with the 'travel lock' on the fridge door, having to lift the base of the door to allow the lock to be closed properly. (Apparently this problem is well known.) I got fed up eventually and ground off the edges of the little 'mushroom' on the lower part of the centre catch against which the freezer/fridge doors latch. I've heard a story of a redesigned locking mechanism but I'm not wholly convinced this was accurate - it's something I'll explore with Dometic at the February NEC show.

The tambour doors on the TV cabinet whizzed from side to side while the vehicle was being driven. The cabinet's design is lifted directly from a Hobby caravan where this wouldn't matter, but it drove me nuts. The ends of the doors have magnetic strips in them already and I've glued magnetic counterparts (taken from the door-seal of a scrapped freezer) to the divider against which the doors butt. It works a treat. I've also added a handle (a close match to the bathroom-door one) to the lower sliding door to allow it to be closed fully without trapping your fingers.

The WC cassette-locker was inexcusably open to the motorhome's living area via the bathroom cupboard (as our noses soon discovered on our first trip!). I've now sealed the locker properly from within it. (I believe Hobby is taking the easy option with 2006 models and fitting an exterior-venting kit.)

Now we come to the heating... Even with the Truma C3402 unit that was standard for 2005 T-T600 FC motorhomes the design of the heating layout is uninspiring, with 2 shortish air ducts feeding the bathroom and bedside areas, and a long convoluted duct wriggling its way through the floor to the 2 outlets in the base of the left banquette. This is not a recipe for balanced warm-air distribution. Things get worse if you specify a C6002 appliance as Hobby just add another short air duct for a 2nd bedside outlet, making 75% of the heat go to the rear of the living-area. To add insult to injury, the through-floor duct on our particular T600 was badly squashed part way along its journey to the front banquette, so hardly any warm air was emerging into the dining area even when the heater was on full power. I've now completely revised the ducting so that one of the heater's 4 'outputs' feeds the front air-outlet in the bedside panel, a 2nd output feeds the other bedside outlet plus the bathroom outlet, while the remaining 2 heater outputs each have an above-floor duct that feeds to its own air-outlet in the front banquette. Warm air is now delivered roughly equally to front and rear, which is what any reasonable person would naturally expect to happen.

Other 'improvements' include constructing removable plywood 'shells' that fit in the under-bed and left banquette storage lockers. These provide protection for the fresh-water tank and warm-air ducting and, having rubber-lined floors, stop stored items from skidding about. I've lifted all the soft white rubbery seals where they join at the bottom-centre of the entrance-, gas- and storage locker-doors, squirted clear silicone sealant into the U-profile and pushed the seals back in place (wiping off excess sealant). I had found that water collecting at the base of the door-surround mouldings (do they really have to have a lip on the outside?) could work its way through the central join and into the interior. I've also junked the German on-bottle gas regulator, replacing it with a Truma bulkhead-mounted regulator with pressure gauge. (If you ever choose to do work on your Hobby's gas system, be aware that the pipework material is HARD!) 

Future projects may include fitting a SOG WC ventilator, a roof-ventilator or (more probably) a roof-light in the bathroom and an electric entrance-step. Knowing that 2006 T-Series would have a standard electric-step (which they really need) I was keen to have one factory-fitted. Christian Ernst gave me a salesman's explanation that this was impossible at the time I placed the order as Omnistor's then-current step design prevented it. I knew full well this was BS as I'd already discussed the matter with Omnistor. In fact there's a label on the step's outer surface that strongly suggests these manual units are made specially for Hobby, presumably to keep the price down. Irritatingly, Omnistor had also told me it is genuinely impossible to electrify the manual step, which is why I wanted an electric one to begin with.

A complete shot in the dark, but you don't by any chance know what brand of sealant Hobby use for the shower compartment joints? I need to remake two joints and Brownhills can only offer me generic translucent 'sanitary' silicone sealant that I can get anywhere. For cosmetic reasons I'd far rather use the bluish-white opaque stuff Hobby employ. I've recently asked Christian Ernst if he can find out for me but I've yet to get a response. 

I think that's more than enough chatter.

Regards,

Frank


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## gaspode

Hi Frank

A lengthy post - much useful information, should deserve a long reply but this is only a brief one!
No problems mentioning my name to Christian, yes that was us on the Xmas list.

Rear dampers - hopefully we won't have problems, the member who had the problem had an early example - but worth knowing just in case.

Interesting to hear you wheel changing experiences, looks awkward.

We had the flex pack but not the cab blinds, when I looked at them I wasn't at all impressed with the practicalities, they look good but no substance. We just use silver screens.

The drivers seat is high but I'm coping OK so far, suspect it depends on your physical build. Our batteries are both gel-cells so shouldn't need to get at them for maintenance. I have been pleasantly surprised at their performance, three nights out in freezing conditions with heating running continuously and still plenty left in 85a/h battery - that's good by my reckoning.

No problem yet with the seat bases, if you think the Hobby bases are flimsy you should have seen those on our previuos M/H.

That's a very interesting comment on the table, I shall look at your suggestions, I've still not got my head round the table possibilities, whoever designed it must have had a twisted sense of humour.

Agree about the fridge doors - poor design and typical of Dometic.

Same as you on the tambour doors, I fitted magnetic catches.

Haven't noticed a "pong" problem yet, we haven't used the van in hot weather yet though!

We have found the heating system excellent using the standard heater. The only fault was a hose not properly connected at the boiler but once I pushed this on properly it's been great - and we have used the van in some very cold conditions. Very thrifty on gas too.

Agree about the door seal lips, I'll probably do the same as you once we get some good weather. The gas pipework seems to me to be very stiff and awkward to modify but I do knoe someone who has fitted an oven under the sink, modifying the manifold position in the bargain. He said he had no problem at all re-shaping the pipework by hand. I have fitted a Gaslow twin bottle set-up, seems to work well.

I don't really see the point of an electric step, just something else to go wrong especially where it is situated - right in the path of all the mud and water thrown up off the road. In fact I wish I hadn't had the electric windows, It annoys me whenever I have to put the ignition key in to open a cab window when on site.

As afr as the sealant is concerned, I would think it is a Dow-Corning sealant, they make it in all manner of colours. B&Q used to sell it in various shades, if they don't have it try a search on the web.

Here's a question for you - any idea how to remove the rear fixings on the cab roof lining? I want to get it out to modify the cab lighting but can't figure out how they fastened it in!


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## Magnor

Hi All,
I am the person Ken refers to as having the problems with fridge and rear shockers.
Re Fridge. I sent a picture to Hobby of the problem connection (same one as I sent Ken) asking for conformation of the Dometic engineers change. Guess what ! I have had no reply despite sending 3 reminders over 6 months. My fridge is still working fine since change, this includes 5 weeks in Spain during September. I am now fitting the AES upgrade and need to get a D+ signal to fire the auto selection. Seems the easiest way is to take a fused signal for the main 12V element supply as this is already switched only when engine is running via control unit. 

Fridge locks.
The problem with fridge locks is common. I contacted Dometic UK who sent a pack of spacers to adjust door to correct height and a new set of locks. Door now locks fine.

Re Rear shockers.
The problem was not that the shock absorbers failed, it was that Ford had fitted the wrong ones. They were too long. When MH was just part loaded the shockers had only 10mm of travel left before bottoming. As a consequence the smallest bump in the road resulted in a large bang from the rear. Ford has issued a recall on Hobby motorhomes to have a retrofit. Hobby claimed they knew nothing of the recall. No surprise there.
BE WARNED - FORD WARRANTY IN EUROPE IS NOT WORTH THE PAPER IT IS WRITTEN ON. I won't bore you with the details, but I was unable to convince any of the four Ford dealers in France or Spain to help. It took just 10 mins for my local Ford dealer to establish the problem and an hour to fit new shockers. I was told by Ford rescue hot line in France that as I was not a French citizen or living in France they could not help. They just transferred me to the AA ! 
In Spain the story was much the same. One dealer walking away and just offering me one local phone call - useful that.
On my return I wrote to Ford head office in the UK to complain. They to do not want to know. They stated that Ford UK is nothing to do with Ford France or Ford Spain and how they run their warranty is their business. European warranty means nothing to Ford. The only help I got whist in Europe was from Safeguard insurance who was just fine.

If you need more info please PM me. I will be glad to send pics / copies of letters etc.
Hope the above helps.
Clive


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## gaspode

Hi Clive

I was wondering when you were going to join in the merry little discussion and put the info from the "horses mouth" so to speak.
It seems we are getting a nice pool of knowledge together here, just what this site is best at. Pity about the attitudes of M/H and vehicle manufacturers isn't it. Just like the UK dealers really, once they take your money they move on to the next punter they can take some money from. It will be interesting to hear what response Frank gets from Ernst.

Anyway, thanks a lot for all the help and good advice you have given to me - and have a good trip to Spain.


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## 97180

Hi both - thanks for the information.

Gaspode:

I've searched the web for coloured silicone sealant. Yes it's available (though not necessarily via UK outlets), but the question still remains as to the exact colour Hobby has chosen and that's best solved by getting the same product the factory uses.

I'm surprised that the vehicle and leisure batteries of your T600 are both gel type. Did you particularly specify this, as my understanding is that the normal Ford-installed battery would be lead/acid (like the one in our 'van)? It makes perfect sense to fit gel batteries in inaccessible locations such as beneath rotating seats, but, given motorhome converters' inclination to keep costs down, I'm startled that Hobby has apparently chosen to replace a cheap battery with a dearer one. Perhaps Ford began to fit a gel vehicle battery between the time 'our' chassis rolled off the production line and when your chassis was built. Or perhaps your Hobby's electrical system differs in specification from ours as the leisure battery on our T600 is 80Ah rather than 85Ah. 

Not sure exactly which part of the cab-roof you are referring to but, whatever the case, I suspect if you can't deduce the fixing method I shan't be able to do so either. There's an irritating noise coming from somewhere up above the left cab-door on our 'van. It showed up on the drive back from Germany, sounds like 2 pieces of hard plastic rubbing squeakily together and occurs when the vehicle is driven on rough roads. I've yet to identify its exact location but, when I've been investigating its likely hiding-places, I've also noticed there are parts of the cab roof construction where the fixings are not apparent. If you are referring to where the Ford grey plastic moulding stops and the wooden 'shelf' that runs beneath the 6 locker-doors begins, then the fixing methods there are a mystery to me too. Sometimes motorhome converters use construction techniques (like gluing) that can't be reversed without leaving unsightly fooprints.

Before I e-mail Christian Ernst I'll send to your "woodgate" address a copy of what I propose to say so you can vet it. I'm not confident of getting any joy over this as I've also tried to get information via e-mail from the Hobby factory in the past and never had any response (not even an acknowledgement).

A few more T-600 titbits that might be useful to somebody...

The drain-hose on the waste-water tank was difficult to detach from its clips. This was a sufficient nuisance for me to consider fitting a 2nd drain-tap (with no attached hose) in the female-threaded moulding at the tank's opposite end. However, judiciously filing the ends of the innermost clip meant that the centre part of the hose can now be pulled downwards easily and then the end of the hose can be slid sideways from its place in the outermost clip. Returning the hose to its original position is equally straightforward - poke the end sideways into the outermost clip and push the centre of the hose vertically up into the innermost clip. (Obviously, if one has blacksmith's hands this modification will be totally unnecessary.)

The vehicle exhaust (presumably designed for narrower Transit panel-vans) was chucking out soot over the motorhome's nearby apron. I've extended the exhaust's length by 18cm using a piece of stainless-steel tubing and a stainless agricultural irrigation-hose clip. Looks really snazzy! I had also noticed that the section of exhaust that crosses from right to left had a tendency to knock against the chassis. Mostly this used to happen when I stalled the motor (which was often, before I removed the seat-swivel). On the left side of the vehicle there's not a lot of clearance between the top of the exhaust pipe and the underside of the chassis floor-pan. I found it helped to loosen off the exhaust-clamp on the vehicle's right-hand side, swing the exhaust down slightly, retighten the clamp and reattach the rubber 'hanger' near the exhaust's end. Essentially, the strap now has a degree of tension, rather than just providing a support role, and the tendency for the exhaust pipe to move upwards is reduced.

In my previous posting I inadvertently linked the Remifront cab blinds to cooking splatters, which was not my intention. We do not cook in the cab! What I meant to say was that T-Series owners should be aware of the porosity of Remis blind-material generally, which includes the blinds on living-area windows as well as those of the cab. When I bought the 'van the living-area blinds all worked, but not all of them moved easily. When fitting these 'open bottom' blind-units, care is needed to ensure the sides are parallel with each other and at 90° to the top. This ideal situation can be attained retrospectively fairly easily, provided that the person who fitted the blind originally hasn't botched up the wall behind the blind-frame too much. There have been reports that the concertina blinds on larger Remis roof-lights can sometimes be beggars to retract, and that this difficulty may be weather-conditions related. This is true for the front roof-light concertina blind on our Hobby. If left in the extended position for some time (say 24 hours or more) the blind-material appears to 'set', occasionally making full retraction of the blind extremely tricky. Forewarned is forearmed.

I hesitate to say this, but I assume all Hobby T-Series owners (or potential owners) know that the pretty blue 'paintwork' (and some of the silver) is not paint at all, merely a self-adhesive plastic skin. This material can be polished but you need to be VERY careful. There was an oblong dull patch on the blue part of our Hobby's entrance door (possibly due to paint over-spray) that, fortunately, polished out. A small air-bubble had also appeared beneath the door's blue skin (prior to the polishing exercise I should add) - pricking with a needle and smoothing the bubble down removed it and it has not reappeared. (While accepting that a flashy exterior colour scheme has always been a signature of Hobby motorhomes, I wish there were much less sticky-backed decoration on these T-Series vehicles. Personally, I'd prefer a virgin white finish with no self-adhesive plastic at all. It's not that I dislike the distinctive look - in fact I've grown quite fond of it - it's simply that I'm wary of the plastic material's long-term durability and of what might be entailed repairing damage to it.)

Regards,

Frank


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## eddieo

Hope this is not regarded of topic – thinking of getting Ford based Hobby Transit T 650 FSC . Was interested in this model at NEC but salesman said lounge did not convert to bed which I found ridiculous and it put me off. I have two teenagers so belts for 4 ok but 3 separate beds are a requirement. I now learn from looking at Ernst website (thanks guys!) that this model has 3 double beds – maybe different spec for UK? 
Do any of you have this ford based T model and are you happy with it. Does the heating work on electric as well as gas? I like this and the Detlheff Fortero as well(although a bit flash but very nice with dark wood interior). The Detlheff is aluminium walled (lighter then GRP) does any one now what the Hobby wall is. Also is the transit available in auto LHD?


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## gaspode

Hi eddieo

I can't comment on the T650, ours is a T600 but can tell you thet the walls are GRP and that the finish is one of the best I've seen on GRP. I don't think that weight is much of an issue, the performance on ours is excellent for the engine size, as is economy. I can't remember the exact payload but it's good - in the region of 500kg if I remember correctly.Overall we've been quite happy with ours so far, the finish and standard of the interior are one of the best we've seen - particularly for a M/H in this price range. There are niggles of course but if you don't buy until you find the perfect M/H you'll end up either building your own or never getting one!
The heating in ours is gas only but I seem to remember that you can specify electric as an optional extra. Don't know about the availability of an auto gearbox on LHD but suggest you phone Christian Ernst, they speak good English and are very helpful. If you're seriously considering a Ford based Hobby, come back and I'll try to sort a full list of the things to look out for when you buy.


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## eddieo

Thanks gaspode, I have a few questions if you wouldn't mind maybe we could have a chat at your convenience? My email is [email protected] if you forward me your telephone number and best time to call, best wishes Eddie

P.S. If you would rather not don't worry I will just post a long list of questions!


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## Hagu

Hi gaspode

Could you post this list here, for others(me :wink: ) to look at.

Thank you
Hagu


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## 97180

Sorry Ken, but all current Hobby motorhomes have aluminium-clad side and rear body panels - that's why the finish is so smooth.

The flat part of the roof on Transit-based T-Series models is alloy-clad while the overcab section is a GRP moulding. I think the whole of the roof is aluminium-skinned on Fiat-based Alkoven designs. Fiat-based Hobby low profiles have a complete GRP roof.

For electric heating the Truma C6002EH unit needs to be specified. This provides up to 6kW output on gas and/or 900W or 1800W on 230V. It's a pricey upgrade, particularly as, for 2006 models, the basic heater is now the 4kW (gas-only) C4002.

An automatic gearbox is not available on any current FWD Transit (RHD or LHD), so you can't buy an auto T-Series. However, there's a fair likelihood an auto-box will be offered on the revised Transit that's now imminent (plus new motors, 6-speed gearboxes, dashboard-mounted gear-lever, etc.)

As far as T-Series interior layouts are concerned, except for the cab area, there are no differences between LHD and RHD models.


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## gaspode

Hi Frank

Yes - must have been having a bad-hair day when I posted that one (or more likely a senior moment). For some reason, someone had said to me what a good finish it was for GRP - and somehow the thought stuck in my mind.
Just as a follow up to the fridge problem, I have now run a seperate neutral feed to the fridge terminal and all seems well so far. Apologies for not gatting around to writing a "things to look out for" list, I just don't seem to have the time, must be getting out too much in the M/H eh?


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## 97180

A modification to my last posting... 

Profile-design Ford-based T-Series have a front GRP moulding with the rear of the roof in aluminium, whereas T-Series Alkoven models definitely have totally aluminium-skinned roofs (front and top). I'm having doubts about Fiat-based Alkoven as Hobby's brochure says these have 'walk-on roofs'. As Fiat-based profile Hobby motorhomes also have walk-on roofs and these are made in GRP, then there's a good chance Fiat-based Alkoven do too. (Dunno - I expect the finish would make it apparent.)

All Hobby motorhomes employ body-panel sandwich construction using normal 'caravan type' wood framing. (As far as I'm aware, the only European motorhome manufacturer to use an alloy framework is Le Voyageur.)

On T-Series most of the curved body mouldings are in GRP except for the 'skirts' that run along the base of the body's side-panels. These are in thick, hard aluminium. The frames of service lockers/door surrounds and the entrance door frame/door surround are also aluminium. 

Some of the vehicle's silver paintwork is genuine paint while some is adhesive-backed plastic 'foil'. All of the blue or black decorative finish is sticky-backed plastic (not paint). Windows are made by "Polyplastic", while rooflights, interior window-blind and sliding door systems are "Remis"-sourced. The sealant Hobby use in the shower-compartment is Henkel Terostat MS-939 "Old White" (just in case anyone ever needs to know!) 

T-Series basic-specification changes for 2006 are:

1. Ford Flex-Packet option to include cab CD/radio instead of cassette/radio. 
2. Truma C4002 instead of C3402.
3. Electric slide-out entrance-step instead of manual version.
4. External ventilation (Thetford kit) for WC cassette.
5. Larger gas-locker (not for 550 models) - 2 x 11kg bottles instead of 1 x 11kg + 1 x 5kg.
6. Slightly smaller waste-water tank - 90 litres rather than 100 litres.

Ken: At the February NEC Show I spoke to Dometic's technical guru about the fridge-wiring thing and he told me he would contact his German counterpart who he anticipated would raise the matter with Hobby. No feedback to date I'm afraid, but I might progress it with Dometic(UK) when I'm in an enthusiastic mood.


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## gaspode

Thanks for that info Frank - useful stuff. I look forward to hearing some follow up from Dometic.


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## Magnor

Hi Ken / Frank

The info on T600's build is interesting.

Thought you may like an update on problems with my T600Fc. 
Still have not managed to get the bubbling paint problem fixed. Reported this to Hobby last July. Problem has now spread to all of the rear silver panels and the overcab GRP section - major respray required!
It appears paint blistering is a common problem on Hobby T class, as such Hobby seem to be 'dragging their heals' maybe in the hope it will go away. I have had numerous email correspondences with Hobby (as you can imaging after this period of time) Their last one informed me that they have no contractural responsibility or warranty obligation so please do not contact them again. Nice customer care! The only ones who seem interested in the problem is Brownhills, they have at least tried to resolve it. I am now waiting for a date when spray shop can take vehicle.

Fitted the AES upgrade to Fridge/ freezer. Has been working fine since Jan.

PS. Despite all the problems with T600FC. we love the vehicle, its design and driveability. Spent 7 weeks away in Spain / France during winter. It was fine - no problems.

Clive


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## gaspode

Hi Clive

How on earth can Hobby state they have no contractual or warranty obligations? Didn't they build the vehicle then? I've only mailed them once and they simply referred me to the UK importers so obviously they want to push all after sales onto their distributors but I doubt if this has any legal standing from the warranty standpoint. Good to hear that at least Brownhills are acting like gentlemen for a change, perhaps Hobby have told them to sort things to keep us off their backs? We'll all be interested to hear how you get on with them. Are they paying for the paint job then?


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## Magnor

Ken

I threatened to take legal action against Hobby under European regulations (I have legal insurance). Hobby sent fairly abusive emails and tried desperately to say there was nothing I could do. I then informed them I was quite happy to start the action - see you in court! It was then that the problem was taken away form Hobby UK and passed to Brownhills, who have progressed it to date. However Hobby still maintain their stance on the warranty. Interestingly they say Ford also have no responsibility - that is not what Ford say! MH going in this week to Ford dealer for a small warranty problem.
Why do motorhome manufactures offer such rubbish after sale service. The car manufactures would be slaughtered if they did the same.

I would suggest all Hobby T series owners check paint or signs of blisters.

Clive


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