# what do the members think... tyre conundrum



## bigles (May 26, 2008)

I've been looking around at tyre types and prices for our MH, and there seems to be a jump in price since autumn last year. I have Michelin Camping XC on there at present (original fitment) and they seem OK, however I have noticed other people seem to like the more expensive (and newer) Agalis and Conti Vanco Camper (have also found Pirelli Citynet Camper). 

The tyres we already have have loads of tread but the sidewalls are cracking and they are over 5 years old so need replacing. I doubt the new set will get to minimum tread before replacing so can't see the point in spending too much on new tyres (blame my Scottish mother for that).

One tyre company I have spoken with has some Michelin Camping XC and although they are new, and have been stored in the warehouse, are marked as 2006 manufacture. Would these be any good or should I not go near them? Price is very good at £76 each.

Any other good deals out there at present?


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## EJB (Aug 25, 2007)

I would only ever use the latest Michelins which are the Agilis Campers (replacing the Camper XCs).

3 year old tyres will need to be replaced in 2 years time.


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## Mick757 (Nov 16, 2009)

Can i just ask whereabouts the date-stamp is on these tyres? Is it on all tyres?

Mick.


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

Mick757 said:


> Can i just ask whereabouts the date-stamp is on these tyres? Is it on all tyres?
> 
> Mick.


see the link below. It is the DOT number week 25 / 2003

Link <<

_Mod Note: Very long link that was causing a view problem edited using the







link button_ :wink:


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

all about tyres here


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## brillopad (Mar 4, 2008)

just gone through all this, pricing up tyres, ended up buying the same ones i had, (conti vanco's ) 4 £450 fitted the best price, and only around the corner from me. dennis


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## SaddleTramp (Feb 15, 2007)

They are Ok to buy and use if that is what you want, The "wearing/ageing" problem on tyres only happens after inflation and then fitted on a Unit or when in sun for periods of time.

I used to raise my caravan off floor to keep load off tyres and had the same set for 9 years, I covered them up when not in use.

On my new unit which has electric leveling I will again lift the wheels off the floor when stored and again cover the wheels when stored.


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Tyres*

Bigles,

Ditch the Idea of Michelin XC's

What size are your tyres?

TM


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## bigles (May 26, 2008)

Mine are 225/75 x 16


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## bigles (May 26, 2008)

SaddleTramp said:


> They are Ok to buy and use if that is what you want, The "wearing/ageing" problem on tyres only happens after inflation and then fitted on a Unit or when in sun for periods of time.
> 
> I used to raise my caravan off floor to keep load off tyres and had the same set for 9 years, I covered them up when not in use.
> 
> On my new unit which has electric leveling I will again lift the wheels off the floor when stored and again cover the wheels when stored.


This was what I was wondering the tyre supplier said they are OK as they have been stored in the warehouse and often car tyres are a couple of years after manufacture date before they are fitted.


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Tyres*



bigles said:


> Mine are 225/75 x 16


BIG Tyres

Michelin New Agilis Camping come in around £165 each. If you could get to Costco you would possibly get them Cheaper.

However, for around £95 each I would go for the Matador MPS 320 MAXILLA (Matador is owned and operated by Continental). These are Rated M+S the same as Michelin and the Tread Pattern will help you on wet grass.

The Old XC Campers I would avoid unless someone is giving them to you.

TM


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## bigles (May 26, 2008)

The strange thing is that the original fitment are 225/75x16, however the Fiat Ducato handbook that came with the vehicle states the recommended size as 215/75x16 - which is correct?


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Fit*



bigles said:


> The strange thing is that the original fitment are 225/75x16, however the Fiat Ducato handbook that came with the vehicle states the recommended size as 215/75x16 - which is correct?


Most Likely the Original Fit. Assuming they were supplied factory fitted.

What does the Plate on the Vehicle Say?

TM


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Tyres*

If you fit 215/75/16's instead of the 225's you have on. You will be going slower than your Speedo reads So if you were doing an accurate 70mph (Speedos tend to read 10%over) then with 215's fitted you would realy only be doing around 68 mph. In addition you will be using more engine revs but getting a slighlty higher hill climbing power to your drive wheels.

It is usually more common to fit narrower winter tyres (they drive through snow easier).

This gets a bit tricky with 75 series tyres, but can be done

To get narrower tyres you would need to fit 205/80/R16C winters, this would be -1.28% circumference (a negligible difference). Around £75 Each.

I think I would stick with what the plate in the Van suggests and fit M+S All-Season. £95 each

TM


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## SpeedyDux (Jul 13, 2007)

I just wanted to say that the Continental Vancos I had fitted provide absolutely no grip at all on ice given the slightest slope and I even found myself sliding backwards with the handbrake on. 8O Plenty of tread on them. Fine in summer but I wouldn't trust them in winter.

My car fitted with new Michelin Primacy tyres all round was reassuringly sure-footed in the same conditions.  


SD


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Vancos*



SpeedyDux said:


> I just wanted to say that the Continental Vancos I had fitted provide absolutely no grip at all on ice given the slightest slope and I even found myself sliding backwards with the handbrake on. 8O Plenty of tread on them. Fine in summer but I wouldn't trust them in winter.
> 
> My car fitted with new Michelin Primacy tyres all round was reassuringly sure-footed in the same conditions.
> 
> SD


Are the Vancos Summer, Winter or All-Season?

What Car are the Primacy fitted to?

TM


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## jocie (Dec 24, 2006)

I had M+S tyres (Michelins) on a previous Hymer 544 but after sliding across a junction against red lights I changed them- although great in the dry they were bad in the wet.


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Slide*



jocie said:


> I had M+S tyres (Michelins) on a previous Hymer 544 but after sliding across a junction against red lights I changed them- although great in the dry they were bad in the wet.


Depends on the M+S Tyre Fitted What Brand & Model were your M+S?.

Cargo Vectors are marked M+S and are like Michelin XC Campers for Grip, Awful.

Oil on the road?

What did you change to?

TM


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## bigles (May 26, 2008)

*Re: Tyres*



teemyob said:


> If you fit 215/75/16's instead of the 225's you have on. You will be going slower than your Speedo reads So if you were doing an accurate 70mph (Speedos tend to read 10%over) then with 215's fitted you would realy only be doing around 68 mph. In addition you will be using more engine revs but getting a slighlty higher hill climbing power to your drive wheels.
> 
> It is usually more common to fit narrower winter tyres (they drive through snow easier).
> 
> ...


Surely the speedo was calibrated at the Fiat factory for their recommended 215/75x16? Maybe the motorhome manufacturer (Benimar) either changed to the wider tyre or had them upgraded by Fiat?

Would the details be on the plate by the habitation door?


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## SpeedyDux (Jul 13, 2007)

TM, the van has Conti Vanco summer tyres on the front but they couldn't get any traction at all on the ice despite the VW having EDL that mimics a diff lock on the front wheels by braking either front wheel if it slips. Almost full tread depth, but the rubber seems to be a very hard compound.

I have Conti Vanco 4 Season tyres on the back wheels, but they locked up with the handbrake on and the van slid backwards down an icy slope towards a brick wall ... ooer. Only regained grip when luckily they went onto a patch of bare asphalt. Phew. I was thinking of replacing the front tyres with Vanco 4 seasons next winter, but I'm not sure if that would do any good.

The Michelin Primacy tyres were fitted in 2009 on all 4 wheels of my Vectra. Traction and braking has been brilliant on the snow and ice, much to my surprise. What amazing tyres. (Driven carefully, of course.)

Both vehicles have auto gearboxes. I also used to compete in Production Car Trials so I know quite a lot about driving up slippery slopes!


SD


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Speedy*



SpeedyDux said:


> I was thinking of replacing the front tyres with Vanco 4 seasons next winter, but I'm not sure if that would do any good.
> 
> SD


Try them or Toyo H09's I think you will be impressed.

TM


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## jocie (Dec 24, 2006)

Teemyob, sorry I can't remember any tyre details as it was 3 motorhomes ago (around 1998). Thanks for your advice though, it is helpful for others including myself!


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## SorC (Oct 3, 2005)

I agree with what others have said - avoid any old tyres as they will need replacing within a few years and keep to the old adage 'buy cheap buy twice' there was a comparison in the MMM June 2008 between the old Michelin camping tyres and the new Agilis II on identically loaded vans freewheeling down a gentle slope the new Agilis rolled sgnificantly further than the old variety indicating a lower rolling resistance. They have a squarer footprint hence you have more rubber in contact with the tarmac. I fitted a set of the new Agilis to our Hymer in September last year £120 here in Guernsey and Michelin sent me £40 of M&S vouchers as a promotional offer in exchange for the original invoice. On a 350mile round trip through France in October our Hymer achieved an additional 2mpg compared to our long term average which I calculate using a simple spreadsheet each time we fill up. Over the life of the tyres that will prove a very significant fuel saving.
SorC


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## bigles (May 26, 2008)

I think I am leaning towards the Agilis Camping. Is there just one version to look for or are there Agilis I and II versions? Just need to shop around for the best price. 

Thanks for all the assistance.


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Agilis*



bigles said:


> I think I am leaning towards the Agilis Camping. Is there just one version to look for or are there Agilis I and II versions? Just need to shop around for the best price.
> 
> Thanks for all the assistance.


I was just about to respond to SorC's post!

I am not convinced by Agilis Camping, unless you can get a good deal like SroC.

There are several models of Agilis. Agilis 51's 81's 81Snowice and so on. But there is only one "Agilis Camping".

I just think Agilis Camping Tyres are overpriced and you can get many Top Brand Japanese and European Branded tyres for a lot less.

As I said further Back

"BIG Tyres

Michelin New Agilis Camping come in around £165 each. If you could get to Costco you would possibly get them Cheaper.

However, for around £95 each I would go for the Matador MPS 320 MAXILLA (Matador is owned and operated by Continental). These are Rated M+S the same as Michelin and the Tread Pattern will help you on wet grass."

Now that works out at £70 a tyre cheaper £280 less per set of four. Four Agilis will cost you £660!. If you are set on Michelins, have a good ring and trawl around for the best price. Costco often have 20-25% off deals for a set of four. Ring dare I say it Kwik Fit, see if they can order them in and do a deal.


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Mpg*



SorC said:


> On a 350mile round trip through France in October our Hymer achieved an additional 2mpg compared to our long term average which I calculate using a simple spreadsheet each time we fill up. Over the life of the tyres that will prove a very significant fuel saving.
> SorC


MPG Increase can be partially attributed to the fact that your New Tyres, despite being the same size will be bigger than your old ones! = Less RPM

In addition, as the tread does not fully bed-in for at least 250'ish miles, they will have a lower rolling resistance.

TM


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## Hovis (Mar 28, 2007)

> If you could get to Costco you would possibly get them Cheaper
> 
> 
> > Where do you get them fitted and does the fitting cost outweigh the lower purchase price?


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## bigles (May 26, 2008)

*Re: Agilis*



> I am not convinced by Agilis Camping, unless you can get a good deal like SroC.
> 
> There are several models of Agilis. Agilis 51's 81's 81Snowice and so on. But there is only one "Agilis Camping".
> 
> I just think Agilis Camping Tyres are overpriced and you can get many Top Brand Japanese and European Branded tyres for a lot less.


I have been quoted £112 each inc VAT and fitting from a local tyre dealer. I did question him that they were the Camping version and he confirmed they were - that's part of the reason why I am inclined to go for them.

Regarding the Toyo's I can't find anyone in the UK who has stock.


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## Spooky_b329 (Jan 24, 2009)

I don't really see the point of 'camping' tyres, surely just a way of extracting a bit more of your hard earned cash. A decent set of bog standard Mud and Snow tyres, of which there is plenty of choice, is the sensible option.

I bought some Toyo H09's in the summer, like teemyob I've found them to be fantastic. Not got stuck in any fields yet whilst towing the horsebox, and in the recent snow and ice, I was the only vehicle one morning to get up a steep snow covered road on a local housing estate. Earlier on I'd nursed our little Punto and managed to get halfway before running out of momentum, I returned in the van and just cruised to the top, straight over all the hard packed snow where all the cars had been getting stuck. Was slightly disappointed, I like a challenge  Couple of months ago I drove up a steep lane, the wet road suddenly dried out, then the back of the van stepped out slightly as I booted the accelerator for the steepest bit...it wasn't dry, it was frost. After waiting for some friends I was meeting, they all turned up exclaiming how they'd struggled to get their cars up the hill as there was no grip 

Edit: If you can hold on for a month til the end of the cold snap, you might have more luck finding M&S tyres. I bought my H09's from Camskill but they are saying no stock til October 2010??!!


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## RichardnGill (Aug 31, 2006)

MPG Increase can be partially attributed to the fact that your New Tyres, despite being the same size will be bigger than your old ones! = Less RPM

In addition, as the tread does not fully bed-in for at least 250'ish miles, they will have a lower rolling resistance


> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> When you fit new tyres they are far less fuel efficient than say a half worn tyre. You tyres will be at there most fuel efficient when the are ready to be removed at RTD 2mm.
> 
> So if you got a better fuel return from new tyre this should improve even more as they get worn.
> ...


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Camping*

Toyo H09's are available from mytyres.co.uk. Stock will be sent from UK or the Continent via DPD and you can get them fitted here in the UK in any one of thousands of Independent Depots. You can pre-pay this or choose your own.

Richard,

Are you confusing Fuel efficiency with lack of grip?

TM


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## RichardnGill (Aug 31, 2006)

Are you confusing Fuel efficiency with lack of grip?

TM


> Trev, believe me tyre,s have less rolling resistance as they get more worn. I carry out Fuel trials on mainly Large vehicles but we some times do smaller van stuff on 16" tyres and the results are always the same. Once half worn tyres start to be very efficient.
> 
> Richard...


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