# Leisure battery charge



## timotei (May 4, 2007)

!!!

Don't know what else to say at the moment!!!

"Patch", our new home from home is home!! (think that makes sense!)

We've already posted how pleased we are with Richard Baldwin Halifax, and will no doubt report regularly on our first adventures over the next few days, weeks and months!

For now,  between smiles  , one question.

We have 2 x 100amph leisure batteries fitted - having driven 100 miles home (    ) they are only 1/3 charged, 

If they were discharged before collection (with a brief charge when on mains for the handover) would this be about right?

Will check with Paul @ RB tomorrow, but worried about our new addition to the family, so seeking some reassurance advice in the meantime!

thanks in advance for your help.

Timotei + J9.


----------



## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

timotei said:


> !!!
> 
> Don't know what else to say at the moment!!!
> 
> ...


My first question is how do you know they are only a third charged? SG of the electrolyte is the only sure way terminal voltage is very inaccurate so unsophisticated control panels aren't really very accurate. A machine that measures charge in and out is available but for really serious money.

Also bear in mind that a simple split charging system only gets the battery up to about 85% anyway.

Last point is that the recommended charge rate for a 200 Ahr battery would be 20A (on a constant charge - not necessarily ideal or even what in practice would happen) so if your 100 mile journey took 2hrs then it would be about 1/5th charged 3hrs 3/10 charged (note for the electrically minded I know that I have made gross simplifications using C3/10  ) so perhaps 1/3rd charged is not too far out.

Regards Frank


----------



## spykal (May 9, 2005)

Hi timotei

All I can add to Franks reply is that you should get the batteries on charge as soon as possible, damage may occur if they are left in a discharged state for longer than a day or two ( sulphation of the plates). Connect the hook up at home if you can. 

Mike


----------



## richard863 (May 1, 2005)

I too am suffering a similar experience. It doesn't matter whether if its on the road or on hook up, the on board ammeter athough not accurate shows a 5 to 7 amp charge continually. 

At the Newbury show I mentioned this to Moore Power, and they kindly lent me a very expensive battery tester. After disconnecting the leisure batteries I found one of them recorded unserviceable & 23% efficient compared with the other. I gave the meter back to Moore Power, they recomended get them both changed ASAP ( they are not a battery supplier).Hymer UK is going to change them as they are still within warranty. 
Great stuff you can buy a lot of Plymouth gin for that money.


----------



## richard863 (May 1, 2005)

I forgot to mention on my last input. My leisures are Gel. And was told they are not as efficient as lead acid. I would appreciate any information regarding as to what to get if these go belly up after my warranty expires? 
My charging unit is switchable. 

Kind regards


----------



## gromett (May 9, 2005)

According to the Victron Docs the charge max rate is 20% of capacity so 40Amps on 200AH. This is what I charge my battery bank at.

I have spent many weeks researching batteries before I bought this set. 4 x 250Ah (or 220Ah) almost a £1000 worth. Based on what I have read I have gone for AGM's again. These seem to be the best for MH'ing for full timers.

When you do replace your batteries I would recommend looking at AGM's

Cheers
Karl


----------



## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

gromett said:


> According to the Victron Docs the charge max rate is 20% of capacity so 40Amps on 200AH. This is what I charge my battery bank at.
> 
> I have spent many weeks researching batteries before I bought this set. 4 x 250Ah (or 220Ah) almost a £1000 worth. Based on what I have read I have gone for AGM's again. These seem to be the best for MH'ing for full timers.
> 
> ...


Yes TBH 10% of the three hour rate is conservative but for long life on a conventional lead acid its quite good however they need a burst at 14.4V to finish them off. I am not a fan of constant current charging anyway.

Timotei

One other thing if they had been left in a discharged state for any length of time they are probably already scrap! Lead acids just don't like being left discharged as Spykal has said.

regards Frank


----------



## timotei (May 4, 2007)

*thanks.*

thankyou all for your thoughts.

Will get the mains hooked up later today and then keep an eye on things!

cheers,

Timotei + J9.


----------



## badger (May 9, 2005)

I assume you are aware that you may have to switch on the charger unit and switch the selector to "van" or "habitation" in order to get a charge to the leisure batteries.

(Thats what I have to do on mine although.......what do I know.......  

.............I'll get me coat......


----------



## richard863 (May 1, 2005)

To give a answer to the original thread.

Finally got the problem sorted. At the Stratford show, Hymer turned up with one battery. After disconnecting each battery in turn the test and printouts showed the first to have 0% charge & 0% efficiency, the second 100% charge & 2% efficiency. So they fitted the one cell and we ran overnight on 1. On the Saturday they robbed a new cell from the new on show Flair and fitted it to my van. I had to run the 2KW honda for some 3 hours to pump them up, for the first 10 minutes the poor genny was hunting like hell, the load was so large, it then settled down. We then went on a trip around Wales. Now at home the solar panels keep them all topped up and is not online all the time. Fantastic.
I am now wondering if the original batteries were robbed for some one else whilst the PDI was being done. My reasons for thinking this is, since day one, I can never remember ever having to go a day without the hook up using a avarage of 2 to 3 amps all the time.
Best wishes to all


----------



## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

Just ensure the two batteries you now have are MATCHED, otherwise your early battery experience will already be looming over the horizon again :-(

Dave


----------



## Chascass (May 10, 2007)

How do you check if the battery's are matched ?
Is the only way to be sure, to buy new ones, and the same make?
Why I ask is, I have 2 battery's of the same make and size (not as yet fitted to van) 1 approx. 1 year old, the other at least 2 years old (age of this battery un known) both hold their charge.
Is there any way the check the match.


----------



## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

In practice, the way is indeed to buy two identical ones from the same source, and even ask if they are likely to be from the same batch supplied to the outlet.

When I used to do radio controlled model car racing (just for my sons, you appreciate ...), nicad packs were matched by charging and discharging each cell connected in series in the battery (so an identical current over time) and measuring the voltage difference of each CELL over time, before downloading the results to a computer to check the match of the cells, eg. each cell absorbed simililar capacities and reached similar terminal voltages.

Bit trickier with 2 lead acid 12 V batteries in parallel ...... :-(

Dave


----------



## Chascass (May 10, 2007)

That reminds me of a amusing story I heard about a friend of mine, who also did model car racing (also for his son, you appreciate) trouble was he could never beat his son at it.
The story go's that he put lead weight's in his son's car to beat him, when he was challenged with this he denies it very sheepishly. :lol:

Chas


----------



## richard863 (May 1, 2005)

DABurleigh said:


> Just ensure the two batteries you now have are MATCHED, otherwise your early battery experience will already be looming over the horizon again :-(
> 
> Dave


Hi Dave

Yes the 2 replacement Exides were 85Ah the serial numbers were a couple apart, so I am hoping for a better performance than my last 2. 
Kind regards


----------



## BMW (Apr 25, 2011)

One thing you do need to consider is the capacity of the starter battery and how it is charged.On my Swift Bolero the starter battery is 88Ah,and the leisure battery is 110Ah ,because of the split charge relay on the Nord NE184 unit the leisure battery will only ever reach the capacity of the starter battery .The starter battery loses its capacity with age so this makes the matter worse.
Don't ask me why this happens I have not been able to find the physics ,and lead acid battery theory is quite complex.I just have to accept the fact.
My Bolero is still under warranty and has had three replacements of the Nord. 12 volt electronics. I am considering changing the way the leisure battery is charged when the warranty runs out, so the two batteries in the vehicle are charged independently from the alternator with the engine running. 

Barry Wilkins


----------

