# From Bilbao - go west or east in January?



## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

Hi friends. I'm new here. We're also new to motorhoming. My wife and I want to get some better weather and maybe some sun after Christmas in our Hymer B584. We plan to head to Bilbao as a starting point. I've checked average weather stats, & although north Spain & southwest France seems a bit warmer, it also seems a lot wetter than here in Newcastle for that month! We're all familiar with statistics :roll: but what about the reality :?: It seems that half the UK heads for France or Spain in winter, so why :?: Do you all make the long drive to southern Spain? What's it really like within striking distance of Bilbao, and would you suggest heading for Biarritz or Oviedo (east or west) for 2 weeks?

Thanks. Bless you all.


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## 96088 (Aug 22, 2005)

The trouble with these areas is the presence of Les Picos de Europe and the dramatic affect they have on the weather in cunjunction with the Atlantic ocean/Bay of Biscay. It is not called the Costa verde for no reason.

Biarritz has a similar problem with the pyrenees.

Hows about drifting over to Valencia and getting on the med side of the mountains.


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*Costa verde*

That's helpful, Pete. Thanks. Actually, I've just been looking a the C&CC winter rallies near Valencia. What do you think .. 2 days to get there from Bilbao without thrashing (its 450-500 miles)?


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## JSR (Mar 3, 2006)

We've been to Valencia a couple of times and cross into Spain just North of Bilbao. Find that good half way point is Zaragoza, decent roads and pretty good scenery on the way. Next day easy drive down to Valencia. There are a couple of all-year sites just South of Zaragoza, in a place called Calatayud I seem to remember. Will try and find the sites and let you know.

Cheers,

Jack


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*Zaragoza stop off*

Thanks Jack. If you find that site it'd be very helpful, as this option is looking promising.


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## 96088 (Aug 22, 2005)

*Re: Costa verde*



Fireman said:


> That's helpful, Pete. Thanks. Actually, I've just been looking a the C&CC winter rallies near Valencia. What do you think .. 2 days to get there from Bilbao without thrashing (its 450-500 miles)?


I think I'm jealous, the most I have got to look forward to is a trip to the new forest 

If you're happy with 500 miles you could go via Madrid, 'the world is your oyster as they say'. Enjoy your trip :wink:


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## 99136 (May 9, 2006)

Fireman

We are heading for Bilbao in January and will be travelling down to the Algarve as we have done for the past 2 years. You can reach Evora in Portugal with a ten hour drive from Burgos, which is just south of Bilbao. That far south you will start to get some decent weather. You might get a bit of frost or fog around Salamanca. Evora is an ancient walled town, good campsite and friendly people. If your happy driving for two full days you could get down to the Algarve or Sevilla. There are new stretches of motorway from Bilbao down to Sevilla, which you could do in 2 days. If you travel on a Sunday you will miss the commercial heavies. But the service areas get a bit crowded with trucks having to stop over. 

Have fun

CornishMac


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*Bilbao ferry or drive thru France?*

Thanks to CornishMac for tips. The trip is firming up now around Vilanova ila Geltru and Camping Monmar (Moncofa), so Algarve, Sevilla and Portugal will have to wait!

Looking into ferry alternatives leaves me thinking that there's probably not much to choose between braving the waves of Biscay and the roads of France. Driving through from Calais might be a bit quicker (?) but means probably 3 days hard driving to Barca, and saves maybe £150 (I'm comparing Portsmouth-Bilbao at £540 with Dover-Calais at £120, give or take).

What do those of you with experience advise? What's your preferred route? Are you heading the same way after Christmas?


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## 89017 (May 11, 2005)

we're going Calais/Poitier (night halt) San Sabastian (night halt) via Burgos to Madrid (night halt) then Murcia on the Southern coast.
We've done it before and enjoy the adventure of the journey as well as the destination and find the scenery facinating.
I've costed it out and it's a hell of a lot cheaper to go via Calais than the Portsmouth-Bilbao route, but then you must take into account we have a 7.3 mtr van + car on a trailer.
If, as you say you are prepared to drive 500 miles then Southern Spain is within reach - It is the driest place in Europe during the winter months (and the rest of the year I expect)
Whatever you choose - bon voyage!


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## 89767 (May 1, 2005)

*Re: Bilbao ferry or drive thru France?*



Fireman said:


> Thanks to CornishMac for tips. The trip is firming up now around Vilanova ila Geltru and Camping Monmar (Moncofa), so Algarve, Sevilla and Portugal will have to wait!
> 
> Looking into ferry alternatives leaves me thinking that there's probably not much to choose between braving the waves of Biscay and the roads of France. Driving through from Calais might be a bit quicker (?) but means probably 3 days hard driving to Barca, and saves maybe £150 (I'm comparing Portsmouth-Bilbao at £540 with Dover-Calais at £120, give or take).
> 
> What do those of you with experience advise? What's your preferred route? Are you heading the same way after Christmas?


Hi Fireman

We have done it twice (trip to Spain/Portugal via Calais that is), but this time looked at Bilbao. Ok, it looked like same costs (in an RV) until the price of petrol dropped & now we are back going via Calais early January. Some friends returned via Bilbao & commented that it was a boring voyage mostly only sea to see.
Last year we went to Conil which is near Cadiz, not too far from Gib. This year we fancy La Manga on Costa del Sol, the average rainfall is supposed to be lower than further East.

I hope you have a good trip & hope we may see you in the sunshine.

Keith H


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*The rain in Spain ...*

Hi BiggerMac and Keith

For the benefit of others who may be interested in the stats on rain in Spain, check Weather2travel

Murcia's driest, followed very closely by the east coast Valencia etc.. Surprising how dry Barcelona is January, too. La Manga is on our shortlist for this trip, as is the Cadiz area (my wife tells me its a lovely city - she wen tthere without me)


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## 89017 (May 11, 2005)

Hi Fireman & Keith,
I can certainly testify to the climate around Christmas time. We had our Christmas dinner outside (approx 22-25C) whilst staying at La Manga.
We're going for Xmas again this year. May see you both there????
Bob


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*France autoroute tolls*

All this is making me reconsider the original plan to go via the Bilbao ferry. Can anyone tell me wher to find the cost of driving through from Calais to the border near Barcelona? Or maybe BiggerMac you've chosen your route to avoid tolls?


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## 89017 (May 11, 2005)

Hi Fireman,
The last time we did it, we drove on motorways all the way. This time we may mix and match depending on how well we're getting on for that particular day. Would prefer to travel off motorway but it's so damn convenient sometimes when you need to make up the miles.
I base our decision on ferry price, mpg, total mileage, night halt charges and allow a bit for tolls. I don't consider whole vehicle running costs - that's far too complicated. Then I do the same but cost in portsmouth/Bilbao. 
Like I say, we enjoy the adventure of the journey and even if they were comparative I would still choose to go the long way round. 
Do you set yourself a budget?
bob


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## devonidiot (Mar 10, 2006)

Hello Fireman.

If I may suggest, spend a few pounds and invest in a copy of Microsoft Autoroute. You can plan your route, work out your costs, plan night stops, download Points of Interest (including campsites), plan to avoid toll roads if required.It is one of the best investments I've ever made.


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## 101516 (Oct 23, 2006)

Having read Devon's reply to this post.........................

We are planning our first trip to Europe, leaving mid January. We've never owned a MH before and never travelled in Europe (other than by air).

We've been thinking of buying Autoroute with GPS (79.99 at PC World) as well as the Maps we'll have on board.

Do you think this is money well spent? We're taking a laptop with us so felt we didn't want to buy a dedicated SatNav system and we also are rather old fashioned in preferring maps.

All comments welcomed....................... 

Thanks

Tess


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## devonidiot (Mar 10, 2006)

Autoroute with GPS is a sound investment.

I use a PDA with TOMTOM whilst driving, however I use autoroute connected to my GPS receiver on my laptop as a map for planning trips whilst out and about, also for finding alternative routes, or plainly as a town map to find stores, filling stations etc..

TOMTOM is great, however for general information use Autoroute gives a far broader picture. I've never used it whilst driving for directions, this can be done by the person in the passenger seat, it gives them something to do, also they can't blame you for wrong turnings.


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## 89767 (May 1, 2005)

Tessa said:


> Having read Devon's reply to this post.........................
> 
> We are planning our first trip to Europe, leaving mid January. We've never owned a MH before and never travelled in Europe (other than by air).
> 
> ...


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*route planning*

Hi Devon[notan]idiot! thanks for the tip. Personally I find Autoroute confusing, but after lots of searching and doing everything the long way around :!: I've found Via Michelin, which does the same thing - tolls and fuel costs all calculated for me!

BiggerMac, we're not so much on a budget as just working things through for the first time. It looks increasingly like we may be heading towards La Manga too. More news tomorrow.


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*Night halt France A71?*

Progress of a sort ... Now planning to drive through France from Amsterdam, but finding it difficult to identify stopovers enroute. The selections from both CC & the C&CC are all closed in January (where they offer any sites, that is). So, assuming I can find a site near Paris for stop one (330 Miles), the question is where can I break the journey next night en route to Barcelona? The number of phone calls I've made today to closed French sites :roll:

Does anyone know of a site near the A71/ A75, preferably near Clermont-Ferrand?

Bob/ Keith: we can't get in at La Manga - it's full  Looks like Kiku or Monmar


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## 89017 (May 11, 2005)

Fireman,
As you can see from our original note we are staying at Poitier, this is a camping cheque site we have previously used. The one at San Sabastian is also camping cheque, and again we have stayed here before. For our first night, it will be a short drive from Calais to Le Treport on the coast(a large Aire). It's open all year and in the summer it cost 6 Euros, which includes hook-up.
It's a shame La Manga is booked. We are only staying for a few days and then moving down the coast a little to a much smaller site. It's got no frills, except a little shop, Bar restaurant, toilet block and waste facilities, internet connection. And it's right next to the beach! It takes camping cheques. I'll PM the details if you want it?
Bob


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## 94431 (May 1, 2005)

Hi Fireman, my wife and I are using P&O Portsmouth Bilbao on Feb 4th for our first winter Spanish trip in our Autotrail Scout and thinking of driving across to the Med near Valencia! I did a costing exercise taking into consideration the Dover / Calais ferry, fuel, tolls, overnight sites etc and the P&O option doesn't work out TOO much more expensive. Also, you get a 2 nights mini-cruise each way (if crossing Biscay in mid winter can be called a "cruise"! 
We shall be spending a month in Spain and like you, keen to receive any advice on routes, campsites etc from all MHF friends out there! We were originally going in convoy with another couple of friends but they have had to drop out. Naturally we are a little apprehensive about being alone in a strange Country although after enjoying a great month in France in September, are looking forward to the adventure greatly!! 
We'll be watching this thread with great interest - all the best to you.... 
Shiner


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*Bilbao booted*

Hi Shiner.

We've given Bilbao the boot. The route didn't suit. As we wanted to get to Barcelona, the route from Bilbao was taking us (so it seemed, remembering we haven't been there before) uncomfortably close to the Pyrenees, and with few winter-opening sites available to choose from (through the Clubs, at least). As you say, the 'cruise' across Biscay (in the winter, to a surfing centre!) was always questionable. I hope the sailing is good for you.

We've chosen to cross from Newcastle to IJmuiden with DFDS, and drive through France on the Autoroute du Soleil (A1/A75). Suitable sites for stop-offs haven't been at all easy to find, but I've now got it sorted. We're still undecided whether to stay at Monmar (C&CC Rally) or Kiko Park, but should make that decision today.

Unlike you we only have three weeks in total to spare.

Got to fly. More news on sites later if anyone wants to talk about them.


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## 101405 (Oct 15, 2006)

Hi Fireman. Northern spain is not a place to be jan or feb, in fact you might be lucky to even get away from it if it snows, but it is a most beautiful part of spain, the best climate in europe is east of malaga, ie, from malaga to nerja and beyond, jan/ feb will be mostly sun, but you will be lucky to get on a site ! lots are full now, if you want a pleasant stay over winter try Camping laguna playa at Torre del mar , Its a good Spanish town and its safe, if you make for Burgos from bilbao( good camp sites there) visit the cathedral its a must! Madrid /Granada /Velez malaga and Torre del mar, lots of fellow Brits and Dutch ,German and 4 km Prom , and its cheap, long term say 3 months 60quid a week, I live a little inland from here so it my local seaside town, when you travel make copies of all your docs, passport. c cards/ health cards/drivers licence.everything, and dont carry the real ones on you unless you need them.Use your photo Id licence as your Id with your bank card. not a passport, In spain it looks like an Id card! DONT STOP FOR ANYONE NOT IN A UNIFORM, BECAUSE IN SPAIN YOU DONT GET STOPPED BY COPS IN CIVVIES, and always in two's. GO FOR IT AND ENJOY Terry


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*Settled!*

Well, that's the journey planned, folks, and with many thanks to the huge help from everyone! With all I've discovered through suggestions and stuff here on MHF and elsewhere, I'll be a lot better prepared next time around!

Meanwhile, it's Newcastle-IJmuiden and through France. Stop-offs at Peronne (north of Paris), Orcet (S of Clermont-Ferrand), and Narbonne, then on into Spain and stays at Vilanova Park, the C&CC's Monmar Rally (Moncofa), Kiko Park at Oliva, then back again. You wonderfully-blessed people who can have three months or more on the road!!


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## 101405 (Oct 15, 2006)

*winter travels*

Hi Folks . Its going to be your first time driving an MH and in Europe,Go For It!! Forget sat nav and Gadjets? Good maps and plan the route, wife as navigator/ if fact she be captain of the ship! mine always is, But why o why do you wont to do it when very few sites are open, best time to start a journey is about easter as more site are open, weather better, lighter nights, lots of french aires have water off over winter, Snow france, norther spain, down as far as granada and beyond, Jan Feb are classic times for Snow, last year we had snow on the Coast at Nerja!! but then it is in the mid 20c's of a day. but dark at 5-6 oclock.( c my advice to fireman) Travel well life is a journey, Tery


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*Oh to be in England, now that spring has sprung!*

Hi silversurfa. Lucky you to live in southern Spain! For us here, even though January's maybe not so good as post-Easter, it'll be a lot better than England! Post-Easter is pretty managable in UK too. Post your address, and when the rare winter snow falls on the Costas, we'll head for a house party with you :lol:


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## 94431 (May 1, 2005)

Wisely or rashly, wifey and I have taken the plunge and booked the Portsmouth / Bilbao crossing arriving in Spain on Feb. 6th for a 6 weeks stay! I have concerns re the weather although we intend driving over to the Med coast, probably near to Valencia or further South. Although we'd love to visit Barcelona, we are aware of high levels of tourist crime in that area!
:roll: 
Jack posted earlier in this thread the possibility of winter opening campsites near Zaragoza for overnighting but I cannot see any further details from him! Can anybody help with suggestions / links of any recommended stop-overs en route to the Med from Bilbao please? The CC Europe book shows no sites in that area! Also, for re-assurance - any info / advice on the motorway route across would be much appreciated please? You intrepid Spanish travellers are a veritable mine of information!!!!  

Best wishes to all,
Shiner


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*Winter sites from Bilbao*

I found it hard to identify winter sites on this route, Shiner. Before changing our plans we were going to stop first at Camping Portuondo (at Mundaka, near Bilbao port), but then an email from the site said it was closed due to promixity to Christmas (29 Dec). Maybe it'll open again in January. You could email, but the reply to me was in Spanish. Options were to drop down south on AP68 to stop overnight at Logrono (sites in Caravan Club's book Caravan Europe 1) or to go east then south on A15 to stop at Olite, just south of Pamplona. The site here seems to be used by both clubs.

I would have like to visit Zaragoza (because of the football team  ). the site that Jack wrote about in that region seems actually to be near 50 miles away, and well off route unless you plan to go direct to Valencia on the N234 and miss out Barcelona. However, I contacted the site and it _is_ open. We had an unshakeable desire to drive via Barca, and we're stopping well outside, at the highly-regarded Vilanova Park. Close enough to head in on a day trip.

For those who don't mind stopping on an aire, it may seem on obvious piece of advice, but check the locations here on the MHF site. I wish I'd done this earlier, but didn't find the page until it was too late.


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## 94431 (May 1, 2005)

Thanks for that Fireman, I'll explore sites you mention and am reconsidering visiting Barcelona after viewing the website of Vilanova Park! In all my reading up, there seems to be so much more in favour of spending a day or two sightseeing in Barca rather than Madrid. Have you had to book pitch there, if so did you do it online? Also, do you know if there is bus service or trains into Barcelona from site please? 
Best wishes, 
Shiner


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*Vilanova Park*

I booked through C&CC, but CC also have the site in their winter brochure. You could also book online direct to the site.

I haven't been there yet, but I understand that there is a bus service from the site gates to Barcelona. Maybe someone else can confirm this?


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## WingPete (Jan 29, 2006)

*Driving styles*

Fireman, if you drive like once upon a time did, in a Dennis or Merryweather ( those were the days, double de-clutching), take the direct and quicker but leisurely way on m/ways and relax a bit. Tolls can put price up overall, but the regular speed and fewer stops are likely to almost balance the costs. Less traffic and plenty of stopping places takes the strain away from trying to find overnighting places in rural areas.
I am heading towards SE France, perhaps going into Spain, to seek winter sun and warmth from Mid Dec to mid Jan. I am familiar with the locations, but not at that time of year. Will use the Dover Calais ferry, with quick access to decent French autoroutes very quickly, and head away from Paris towards Rouen. New m/way there, A 28, to pick up A 20 for Toulouse then head east for Narbonne, and coast roads N & S.
Easier than climbing a hook ladder ! Enjoy !


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## arty23 (May 20, 2005)

Bus stops regularly right outside the gate with ser vice into vilanova with a direct rail link to Barcelona.


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## ChrisWade (Jul 3, 2006)

*Dennis (or Merryweather) the Menace*

Sorry Pete, I'm not that sort of Fireman! :lol:

Merryweather the Menace doesn't sound quite right, does it?


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