# Should we buy a 2008 Bessacarr E435?



## Benwilkes (Jan 11, 2016)

Hi everyone,

I'm new to this. 

My wife and I (along with two boys, 4 and 6) are looking to get into motorhoming and have a budget of up to 25k.

We have seen a Bessacarr E435 that looks great and now it's getting close to doing the deal, I'm getting nervous. We will be seeing it at the weekend and my list to check is:

1. Spongy floor / damp - is the undecided covered in black plastic (worrying sign) or black painted (probably treated)
2. Gearbox / Juddering whilst reversing issues. I understand Fiat have had some issues with this but am not sure if this is all / a few / which model etc?

Any help would be greatly appreciated, I'm keen to become a MH-er but don't want to start wrong. 

Thanks 

Ben


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

Benwilkes said:


> 2. Gearbox / Juddering whilst reversing issues. I understand Fiat have had some issues with this but am not sure if this is all / a few / which model etc?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Ben


If it has got through 8 years of life then I doubt that will be much of a problem. At least it is simple to check on a test drive. It applied to all models with the manual gearbox to a greater or lesser or no extent. Fiat did eventually modify the 2.3 models if their owners complained. A quick google of 'Fiat ducato X250 gearbox judder's should either frighten you or satisfy you but remember since it was introduced in 2007 thousands have given and continue to give great service.
Check that it had a cam belt change at 5 years and check the DOT code of the tyres, as if they are original will be a bit long in the tooth now.


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## cabby (May 14, 2005)

Also ask for a current, no older than 2 months , damp test print out.Can you get the previous owner and check with them about faults. 

cabby


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## Benwilkes (Jan 11, 2016)

Thank you so much for your comments, this is so incredibly helpful. A little update: 

It's a private sale (through a motorhomedepot broker) and we have agreed a price in principle. 

- the broker has checked with the vendors paperwork and the payload is 525kg. Is that OK for a family of 4? (Boys 4 and 6 but growing) 

- The vehicle has just had a new MOT and they will do a full hab check and carry out any work before we take ownership (if we do). The last one in Oct 2014 was fine. 

- it is a 2008 but very low mileage - less than 7,000 so I think the original tyres maybe on there. I will check but what is the dot code? (Sorry to be uneducated)

We are due to view it at the weekend where I will do a full check of the floor to make sure it doesn't have the plastic lining to the wood that seems to be the key to the soggy bottoms that were reported in earlier ones. 

We will also test drive and if we can find a hill, I'll reverse on it and see. There was no report of a problem but the seller is the daughter of the elderly owner so not the main user. 

It was feeling like its a minefield we couldn't navigate but I am reassured somewhat by your feedback. If I could ask one more favour, 

- would you consider the payload of 525kg appropriate? 
- is there anything else I should pay particular attention to? 

In short, if its dry and reverses I think I'd like to buy it. Is there any reason why not???? 

Thanks in advance - I might be part of the gang soon!


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## philoaks (Sep 2, 2008)

Hi Ben.

Buying a MH is always a scary time, particularly when it's your first.:surprise:

You've clearly done a lot of research and identified some of the potential issues. As far as the payload is concerned then that can be another potential minefield. Even nowadays there seems to be no standard approach and different manufacturers seem to quote payload in different ways.

In honesty, if you feel that this is the van for you then the best way to confirm your payload is to take the van to a weighbridge. The van would presumably be empty so if you weighed the van with you and the family in it then that would give you a starting point.

Under the bonnet will be a weight plate which will give you the figures for the van i.e. the maximum permitted weight (typically 3500kg but may different). From this figure subtract your weighbridge figure and that will give you your payload. The plate will also give you maximum weights for the front and rear axle, neither of which should be exceeded.

From your payload figure you will need to subtract the weight of essential items like gas bottles (if none are fitted), a tank full of diesel and fresh water if you intend travelling with some water in the van. Whatever remains will be what you can carry in the way of accessories, food, clothes, etc. etc. You would also need to factor in a growing family.

It may be worth seeing if there is a weighbridge somewhere in the area of the test drive. Any reputable seller should have no issue with you doing this prior to purchase.

Good luck with the search!

Phil


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

Benwilkes said:


> - it is a 2008 but very low mileage - less than 7,000 so I think the original tyres maybe on there. I will check but what is the dot code? (Sorry to be uneducated)
> 
> We will also test drive and if we can find a hill, I'll reverse on it and see.
> 
> ...


The DOT code is the month and year of manufacture e.g. 10/08 is October 2008. The tyres are obviously ok as it has recently passed an MOT but it would be nice to know their manufacture date. Note that the code may be on the inside wall of the tyres so not readily visible.

Don't get hung up on the reverse judder. Most exhibited some just don't expect it to reverse up a grass slope without raising the revs to 1500 or so and slipping the clutch a bit.
A payload of 525kg is viable for 4 but you will have to be selective on what you carry. Remember the weight of your passengers will be part of the payload. 
Even if it has only done 7000 miles the timing belt should have been changed at 5 years. If there is no record of it having been done then knock them down £250 or so to allow you to get it done. Low mileage is not necessarily a good thing especially an average of 1000 per year.

Go to the web site below and check its MOT history.
https://www.check-mot.service.gov.uk/?_ga=1.2195504.1041569150.1439293160

If the price is right and you feel it is right MH for you then I guess you will take the plunge.

I am not very familiar with UK manufactured motorhomes. Is this the model you are looking at?


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## Benwilkes (Jan 11, 2016)

Hi, 
thanks for the tip on the MOT - all good apart from a windscreen wiper replacement. I'll investigate the cam belt and yes, it is the one you found in the video. Is it a 'lemon'?!
thank you again.
ben


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

Benwilkes said:


> Hi,
> thanks for the tip on the MOT - all good apart from a windscreen wiper replacement. I'll investigate the cam belt and yes, it is the one you found in the video. Is it a 'lemon'?!
> thank you again.
> ben


I doubt it is a lemon Still price and condition is everything. You said it was a private sale so is there any warranty on it at all?

I think you will find it hard to find a better MH with such a low mileage and with the service record that the blurb in the Motorhome depot advert states at the price. I noted that the advert says it has the 2.2 engine which I believe is fitted with the 5 speed gearbox. If this is correct then the reverse judder problem does not effect it. It effected the 2.3 and the 3L fitted with the 6 speed gearbox.


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## Benwilkes (Jan 11, 2016)

I don't believe, so. It is through a broker so I am enquiring as to their extended warranty option, no details yet.

It has just had an MOT and will get a hab check (and any new work) done before sale. I will ask this to be by an MCEA approved person.

The price is good comparing to other of the same vehicle around.


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

Benwilkes said:


> I don't believe, so. It is through a broker so I am enquiring as to their extended warranty option, no details yet.
> 
> It has just had an MOT and will get a hab check (and any new work) done before sale. I will ask this to be by an MCEA approved person.
> 
> The price is good comparing to other of the same vehicle around.


If you are offered an insurance backed warranty at your cost then be careful. They are notorious for their exemptions and they are a 'Breakdown' warranty. That is they do not cover things assessed as wear and tear which on an 8 year old motorhome will be nearly everything. If it were me I would put my money in my pocket to set against any repairs.


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## powerplus (Oct 6, 2014)

hi nice van

you have done your homework on the vans and there problems good

i have a later swift that is fine but all m/homes need looking after with the odd thing adjusting or tightening
also sealant around windows and joints including the roof need checking also checking regularly 

have you looked around as there seem to be several about from dealers that also advertise on ebay and will give you a feeling on the the price range for the vans you are looking at 

with a big fluctuation on the price range £34k does seem a bit high to me so if you are keen i would make them a 

offer a lot lower and negotiate from there

but don't just buy if you haven't looked at similar vans elsewhere to compere what prices that are being asked

i would recommend you become a full member as you only get 5 posts for free
i did join last year and renewed christmas

i know its £12.50 but you will get that back so quick with usefull information
and the the help from all the seasoned members


good luck and enjoy the serch

barry
in sunny portugal


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## weldted (May 1, 2005)

Buying through a broker should be cheaper than a dealers forecourt as the overheads are a lot less. Given the age of the van I would not think you would get much warranty. But on the plus side the money you should save on the purchase should offset any niggles. Just be carefull about checking for damp as that can be very expensive to rectify. My last four vans have Been bought new and although covered by warranties the hassle of trip back and forwards to the dealers and hours on the phone. By the time all niggles we sorted it was time to change, I have bumped into the owner of my last van, he hasn't had any problems what so ever!!!. So hopefully this will be the case for you. Given the age I would check if the brake fluid has been changed as especially when spending long periods parked up ( low miles) it will absorb moisture, the same might go for the fuel tank so factor in the cost of a service that includes changing the fuel filter.
And the hab check should include the flexible gas pipe from the bottle to the regulator it should have a date on it. Also the age and condition of the leisure battery. Other than that enjoy


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

I think the payload as quoted is low, consider subtracting the weight of all the people travelling in it, plus all the gear you take with you, plus a full tank of fuel and the fridge full of food etc, it will reduce quickly, assuming it is correct to begin with as it could be the manufacturer guide figure, awnings etc will also eat into it. 

I would not buy it before putting it on a weighbridge and seeing what it weighs as is then do some calculations on what you will add to that figure, for instance if you all weight 100kg the payload will be a minus figure once you add everything else, it's not the end of the world the payload can be increased, but it's usually not free, it may involve new larger wheels and or suspension upgrades, which may affect your ability to drive it.

Also my experiences with the Motorhome Depot have not been good, we viewed a lot of their vans and while some were okay, they were glaring errors in the descriptions, I could not get sensible answers out of the agents, and we discovered that the prices were inflated, as we did get he owners details of one van as the agent was stupid enough to leave them in the van when going to answer a phone call, they just added £2k to the sellers asking price, I'd not sue them but you must make your own judgement, decent vans are a bit rare at this time of the year, but come Easter there will be a lot more to buy and more private sales to look at.

Another point is it might pay to hire one with a similar layout, to see if it is for you before spending £25k, it could save you from a costly mistake.

Sorry for the negativity, but it can be a bit of a novice minefield, had I been a member on here, we would not have bough the van we did for our first one.


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## chilly (Apr 20, 2007)

powerplus said:


> hi nice van
> 
> with a big fluctuation on the price range £34k does seem a bit high to me so if you are keen i would make them a offer a lot lower and negotiate from there
> 
> ...


The van in Ray's video isn't the actual van Ben's interested in. His is with Motorhome Depot at around £25K (or so I believe)
Timberland do seem to take the p*ss somewhat on their pricing:surprise:


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

chilly said:


> The van in Ray's video isn't the actual van Ben's interested in. His is with Motorhome Depot at around £25K (or so I believe)
> Timberland do seem to take the p*ss somewhat on their pricing:surprise:


Build quality is a bit of a joke too on some (but not all) vans we looked at.


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## DavyS (Jan 10, 2009)

Habitation service and damp check does not usually include the floor. Even the painted floor of Swifts of this age can be damp so you will need a damp meter and press the prongs in all around the edges of the floor on the inside. Might not be able to do it from underneath cos the black paint might contain graphite which is conductive.


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## GMJ (Jun 24, 2014)

I'd give some serious thought to the payload as has been mentioned. Obviously we don't know how large you and your family are OP :wink2: but kids grow up quickly!

We had a Bess E795 which had a similar payload from memory and I used to do some quick calcs regularly to check everything was OK. 

Bear in mind that perhaps any 'bolt ons' are extra weight that need to be considered as well..a wind out canopy can be 30kg I believe! I put a cradle and spare wheel under mine and that weighed around 45kg. Does it have a towbar? If so will you use it? If not, whip it off...they weigh loads! (I did and flogged it for £100 :smile2

The only other thought I would have is that all the beds are down one end so if the nippers are up in the overcab and you and your partner don't go to bed at the same time, you will be right next to them. Perhaps a layout with a rear lounge/bed make up area might be worth a thought?

Good luck!

Graham :smile2:


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## Wise one (Jan 15, 2016)

I had a Bessacar E435 2008 model which I bought new for around £30k. It had bike rack, immobiliser and reversing camera for that price. I got rid of it last year because, despite habitation checks, a lot of the floor had gone and some of the wall had gone. I was quoted £9000 to have it put right. I was told by one dealer that the 2008 version was know for its damp floors.


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## suedew (May 10, 2005)

Only thing that bothers me is the low mileage, If it's not been used much is it because it has been sitting and not used for long periods? not good for any vehicle, make sure that van has a new cam belt kit, including tensioners. fitted came a cropper with an escort once. Ford that was.
We were within weights in a 6 berth carrying 3 grandchildren and 5 bikes.
Do not accept paper weights get it over a weighbridge as any extras like bike rack, solar panels, awning will not be on the original spec from manufacturer.
Having said that, what a great way to spend time as a family, we all love it, although mostly only 2 up we take sundry grandchildren, we have 7, and also go away with friends.
Sue


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