# Tyres for Grass/mud



## Stokewalker

Dear All, I'm dusting off the van ready to do some spring& summer touring. However as I reflect on my 2012 experiences..which were predominantly being towed out of every pitch I stopped on, I feel I need to change tyres..at least on the front (X250 Ducato).
I've currently got Continental Vanco 2 on the front (and Vanco Campers on the back) and although there's plenty of legal tread left, they're clearly just a road tyre and absolutely useless on wet grass or mud...
So been trying to follow the threads...seems M&S or winter is the way to go (current tyres are 215/70 R 15C - the Vanco Campers on the back are CP)..did I also see something to say that I could go for 225?
..and can I take the van to a normal tyre place (Kwik Fit or ATS)?
Thanks for any advice.
Stokes


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## TR5

I use Vredestein Comtrac Winter tyres, and have 225's on alloy wheels. I use these all year round, without problem.
They are very close on full lock in the wheel arch, so any slight difference in suspension might be a problem on some vehicles.

You MUST change all tyres though, you can't run on winter's on one axle and summer's on the other.


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## raynipper

TR5 said:


> You MUST change all tyres though, you can't run on winter's on one axle and summer's on the other.


Why? Oh OK the experts say so......................................
When in doubt, try it anyway, and learn from your mistakes!

Ray.


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## teemyob

*winters*

Go for the Comtrac Winters.

Simple

Get them online from www.mytyres.co.uk get them fitted locally

TM


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## satco

try to find a dealer for tiptyre tyres


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## Roadhogg

We have an Isuzu Trooper commercial jeep that we bought new in 2002
It came with on/off road tyres designed for better off road traction.
They were an absolute disaster when driving on a wet road, I would go as far as to say they were dangerous.
Even though we still use the jeep in some very rugged conditions we have never put anything only 100% road tyres on it since.
To give better traction off road the last 2 sets of tyres have been 20mm wider than the originals, still fit the same rims, handle perfectly on the road, have not caused any excessive component ware & each set has done over 40,000 miles.


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## bigtwin

Alternatively, buy some snow chains that you can fit 'in the event that you do find yourself lacking in traction'. 

Obviates the need to replace any tyres, never mind a full set!

Ian


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## 747

Michelin Agilis Camping tyres are M & S (mud and snow) and are pretty good on grass. In fact far superior to the earlier Michelin camping tyres. You will not have to change all 4 then (I think).

Last year *everyone* had to be towed off.


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## TR5

raynipper said:


> TR5 said:
> 
> 
> 
> You MUST change all tyres though, you can't run on winter's on one axle and summer's on the other.
> 
> 
> 
> Why? Oh OK the experts say so......................................
> When in doubt, try it anyway, and learn from your mistakes!
> 
> Ray.
Click to expand...

Ray, please don't use part of my 'signature' to promote what could be a major safety issue - read in context with the rest of it.

It may be your (and other's) opinion that it is ok to mix types of tyres on the same vehicle, but yes, the experts tell us we shouldn't, and who am I to encourage someone to ignore this.


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## tyreman1

Toyo HO 9 ,nice chunky m&s pattern but not noisy.


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## TeamRienza

Me too,

Toyo HO9s, bought from Oponeo, tyres only manufactured a couple of months before delivery.

So far, good grip, not noticably noisier, and will be replaced long before they wear out. No noticible increase either in fuel consumption.

Davy


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## bubble63

toyo H09 vote from me too

I have to park on grass at home, these mud and snow tires fit the bill perfectly.

got 215/15 70 for £100 each, looked on toyo web site and used the nearest dealer, 10 miles away

regds neill


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## commuter

try looking at http://www.asdatyres.co.uk/ they seem to have quite reasonable prices and will fit locally or at home

just checked bubble63' tyre sizes and they range from £62 and go up to £115


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## goldi

Morning all,

I fitted toyo ho9on the front drive axle( Adria twin pvc,) last november not used in any snow( I prefer to stay at home and watch other people struggle) Done about 4000 mile so far and satisfactory in all respects. I have more confidence on wet grass, thoI amm careful about that as well, usually walk the pitch first as I have alot of experience of going offroad with highway vehicles.


norm


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## teemyob

Roadhogg said:


> We have an Isuzu Trooper commercial jeep that we bought new in 2002
> It came with on/off road tyres designed for better off road traction.
> They were an absolute disaster when driving on a wet road, I would go as far as to say they were dangerous.
> Even though we still use the jeep in some very rugged conditions we have never put anything only 100% road tyres on it since.
> To give better traction off road the last 2 sets of tyres have been 20mm wider than the originals, still fit the same rims, handle perfectly on the road, have not caused any excessive component ware & each set has done over 40,000 miles.


Not uncommon for standard road tyres, winter, summer or All-season tyres to have dangerously poor grip, dry or wet.

2 from experience

Goodyear Cargo Vector M+S
Michelin XC Camper


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## Stokewalker

Dear All, thanks for suggestions...majority view seems to be
Vredestein Comtrac or Toyo Ho9...and on all 4.
Obviously want something I can keep on all year round.
Will look into it...

Thanks again
Stokes


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## rogerblack

Another vote for Toyo H09 - in my own experience over past 2-3 years, work well in snow/ice and wet grass/mud.


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## Mark993

The problem with different tyres front and back is that the vehicle's handling will become unbalanced. Although practical reality is that MHs can't exactly corner at racing speeds anyway and the tyres are a long way from being the weakest link in the equation :lol:


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## drcotts

Carrry an inflator
if stuck let pressures out till approx half flat. then you can probally drive off the grass.

Winter and MandS tyres are usually softer rubber

Then reinflate as soon as you get off the grass. this usually works in Mud or snow but dont drive on the road with it. Just a last ditch method

Phill


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## Mark993

drcotts said:


> Carrry an inflator
> if stuck let pressures out till approx half flat. then you can probally drive off the grass....


This works very well with mountain bikes too - riding on snow, slipping all over the place, let the tyres down so they start to spread out across snow, load of grip. 8)


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## rogerblack

Mark993 said:


> The problem with different tyres front and back is that the vehicle's handling will become unbalanced. Although practical reality is that MHs can't exactly corner at racing speeds anyway and the tyres are a long way from being the weakest link in the equation :lol:


My primary purpose in fitting M&S tyres was to reduce the incidences of getting stuck on wet grass and/or mud, which was a major problem to the point where Mrs B got paranoid about going anywhere in the 'van when it was wet unless we could be guaranteed hard standing! Which somewhat reduced our UK motor-homing season . . . 

So I initially only fitted the front (driving) wheels with Toyo H09's, which made an enormous difference to grip on wet grass etc. However having been pointed to some very informative articles and videos via discussions on here about the potentially dangerous effect of mixing winter and non-winter on different axles in the snow and ice, as winter approached I ordered another pair so as to have them all round, particularly since we spend a lot of time in Scotland.

I had the slightly worn older pair swapped to the rear axle and the new ones fitted on the front. Of course, whether THAT is the correct thing to do is another argument! :roll:

In order to minimise sinking in on soft pitches, we do still use Monster Mats under the front wheels.


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## Wizzo

Another vote here for Toyo HO9s. Good grip on the road in wet or dry conditions. Went over the alps at Col de Larche last Sunday with some slush on the roads and it was snowing lightly. No problem at all with grip.

Yes you can change to 225s instead of 215s. I had to in order to uprate the back axle capacity. It makes a very slight difference to gearing (1.5% higher) and means that the speedo is now quite accurate.

JohnW


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## Mrplodd

Grip mats, bread crates, etc ??? 

Cheaper than buying 4 new tyres. either that or a ground anchor and a hand winch is STILL much cheaper !!


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## bigcats30

Have you ever deflated the tyre then tried to pull away so you have more contact area to the ground

You will obviously need to carry a pump with you (plugs into cig socket)

works for crosscountry drivers in 4x4s


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## gabbie12

*M&S tyres for better traction*

Does these tyres effect the mpg


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## Stanner

*Re: M&S tyres for better traction*



gabbie12 said:


> Does these tyres effect the mpg


No - why should they?


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## gabbie12

The ford dealer told me using winter tyres cuts down the mpg.
I wondered if anyone else experienced this


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## Stanner

gabbie12 said:


> The ford dealer told me using winter tyres cuts down the mpg.
> I wondered if anyone else experienced this


Typical level of knowledge from a Ford dealer then.

They are clearly still living in the age of winter tyres being huge knobbly treaded things that did affect mpg.

Modern winter tyres are much, much different - the main difference being the type of rubber used for the tread that doesn't go hard when the temperature drops.

People like that should learn to engage their brain (if they have one) before opening their mouth.

I now use winter tyres all year round on all my vehicles.


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## raynipper

Stanner said:


> gabbie12 said:
> 
> 
> 
> The ford dealer told me using winter tyres cuts down the mpg.
> I wondered if anyone else experienced this
> 
> 
> 
> Typical level of knowledge from a Ford dealer then.
> 
> They are clearly still living in the age of winter tyres being huge knobbly treaded things that did affect mpg.
> 
> Modern winter tyres are much, much different - the main difference being the type of rubber used for the tread that doesn't go hard when the temperature drops.
> 
> People like that should learn to engage their brain (if they have one) before opening their mouth.
> 
> I now use winter tyres all year round on all my vehicles.
Click to expand...

Agreed.!!!

Ray.


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## wug

At the risk of not engaging my brain and as a relative amateur if you look at the EU classification you'll find that some winter tyres are less fuel efficient than the same summer tyre. Something to do with rolling resistance.


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## gabbie12

I have bought toyo H09's for the front so I will give them a try.
Thanks for all the comments


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## Stanner

wug said:


> At the risk of not engaging my brain and as a relative amateur if you look at the EU classification you'll find that some winter tyres are less fuel efficient than the same summer tyre. Something to do with rolling resistance.


... and some summer tyres are less fuel efficient than some winter tyres and some other summer tyres as well.

Must be something to do with rolling resistance I guess.


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## grizzlyj

Hi

I think the idea of a worse mpg from "winter" tyres may come from 4x4 mud tyres, whose heavy lug tread in itself will be more heavily built with big lumps of rubber forming the widely spaced grip lugs, as well as a stronger carcass to protect from rocks etc. 

A halfway house tyre that most new showroom 4x4s come with will be much more road biased and more lightly built, so will require less energy to speed up and slow down giving better economy.

I suppose this would be true to some extent within any tyre size between types, my car winter tyres came with 9mm tread depth, the economy tyres originally fitted had considerably less, so less weight just from the rubber creating that depth  Maybe :?


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