# Arto novices - probs with hot water



## Lynn13

We have recently (September) bought our first motorhome, an Arto 69GL and are loving it - but - last couple of outings we have had problems with getting hot water. The Truma boiler heats the 'van beautifully but we can't seem to get it to heat the water. Is there anything we may not be doing properly or any known problems, or should we take it to be fixed professionally??

Thanks in advance!


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## Grizzly

Possibly worth giving Truma UK a ring- very helpful firm to deal with and they'll talk you through what might be happening.

http://www.trumauk.com/contact.asp

G

Jus noticed you're new on here - you're very welcome and hope you enjoy the site. Beware ! It's addictive.


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## Zebedee

Gaspode has an Arto.

He'll be on later and is technically quite expert so I'm certain he will have the answer.  

Dave


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## b16duv

Hi Lynn

I have an Arto 64, welcome to the club!

I assume you have tried the following.

1. Is the boiler drain valve closed? This is situated next to the boiler and has a red plunger on the top. This should be pulled up to stop water draining out of boiler.

2. Have you filled boiler with water after closing drain valve? To do this, open all the taps and shower valve with the mixer in the hot position. Wait until there is a steady stream of water at each tap. This will take a couple of minutes and fills boiler with water and purges the air from the system.

3. Set the truma control to the hot water position (60 degrees) Does a yellow and green light appear in the centre of the dial? If yes, does the yellow light go out after about 40 minutes? If yes, there should be hot water at the taps.

4. The truma dial has 5 positions - off at 3 oclock, 2 oclock water heating 40 deg, 1 oclock water at 60 deg. 4 oclock central heating only, 5 oclock heating and hot water. The centre of the dial is to control temperature of the central (blown air) heating and goes from 1 (cool) to 9 (hot). It does not affect water temperature.

5. Do you get cold water at all the taps? if not, could be a pump issue. Check tap switch is on on the main control panel. Is there plenty water in the cold water storage tank?

If none of these work, and you have cold water at the taps, it may be a boiler issue - is it a truma C6002?

Hope this helps

david


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## Lynn13

Hu guys

thanks for all the replies -nice to 'belong' to something like this. I have spoken to the other half and it goes like this:

'yes' to all the points that David asks - Himself assures me that he has done all of that. We get cold water okay(ish) but it's a bit spasmodic. When we put the taps to the hot side, all we get is a lot of spitting and gurgling. On our first outing, back in September it seemed okay, not brilliant though, but has gradually deteriorated. The bolier gets hot, the blown air heating is lovely and toasty but it doesn't want us to have hot water! Roger (Himself) has cleaned the pump filter and tested it, pump seems to be okay. It is a Truma C3402 and the dial is not as David describes - more of a set of horizontal switches.

thanks again,

Lynn


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## Bubblehead

Hi

It sound as if you have an air lock in the system. Drain the whole system down and then open all the taps as you fill the system up again allowing the air to escape. If you have mixer taps slowly turn them from hot to cold and back until all the spluttering has stopped. The main culprit is usually the shower in our van.

If this doesnt help then Id say the system is sucking air in at some point.

Andy


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## gaspode

Hi Lynn

If you have water in the boiler and the warm air heating is working then you must be heating any water that is in the boiler as the water jacket surrounds the flame that supplies the warm air heating. The conclusion then is that there is insufficient (or no) water in the boiler.

First thing to check is the auto-drain valve. Make sure that it is closed and remains closed. It will open automatically in the current weather if the boiler is turned off and drain the boiler to prevent frost damage so you must reset it and refill the boiler every time you turn on the boiler if you want hot water.

Secondly, if the hot tap is spluttering, this indicates that the boiler isn't full. start the boiler, reset the auto drain and then run the hot water tap until all spluttering stops and an even flow is obtained. This means your boiler is now full. It may take several minutes to fill. You should now start to heat the water.

One other possibility is that someone has replaced the water pump on your Arto or that the non-return valve has failed due to lack of use or hard water furring. If you lift the floor panel to access the freshwater tank and unscrew the lid you should be able to access the submersible pump. The original pumps fitted were Reich pumps with a built-in non-return valve. If someone has replaced the pump using a Whale or other pump it won't have that valve fitted and will allow all your water from the boiler to flow back into the cold water tank. If you fill the boiler as instructed earlier, then lift the pump out of the tank slightly you should be able to see the water flowing back through the pump into the cold water tank if the non-return valve is at fault (or missing).

If this is happening you should either fit a new non-return valve in the pump hose (above the pump) or fit a new pump of the correct type. <<THIS>> is the pump that should be fitted.

Not all Artos were fitted with this system, depends on the year. If you have a different pump, please come back and we'll think of another explanation. They also have a rather strange system of drain valves in the garage behind the tanks, the working of which is something of a mystery to me, but they are also a possible source of problems because one of them drains the tap feed lines and can cause similar symptoms.


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## Lynn13

oooerrr - it's very complex being a motorhome owner isn't it??

Thank you SO much for all of these possible solutions. If it wasn't dark and wet and blowing a gale we would be checking it all out right now but a glass of wine is a bit more tempting at the moment. 

Will try it all and let you know. Thank you again VERY much

Lynn


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## nicholsong

Also welcome to MHF and to the N+B community.

I also am quite new to MH having bought my Arto 69GL (2003) in August.

You have not told us the year of yours, so it makes it more difficult to advise.

For info my 2003 model has the control panel as described by Davd (Rotatours). However that is not the panel described in my N+B Manual-have you got a N+B Manual?

I do also have a Truma manual, which covers the Trumatic C 3402 and C 6002 ( only difference seems to be that 6002 has one more heating element) 

You say that you have C 3402 but with the control box with the horizontal switches, i.e. as per my N+B Manual. I can only assume that, if yr 'van is about 2003, either Truma or N+B changed the contrl box about that time, because I belive David's Arto is later than mine.

This is all just to try to get everone understand the bits of kit we are all talking about.

When Gaspode comes along it will probably all be sorted.

Meanwhile, your description of both cold water being intermittent seems to point to water not getting into system.

Check tank contents - gauges not that accurate:
Check not on a slope: 
Open first segment of fresh water tank (N+B Water p 17, bottom rt diagram, labeled 'diag 4' ), unscrew 6" grey cover and check that the pump is fully submerged.
Check wiring to pump

Now i have run out of suggestions

Except - wait for Gaspode tocome along!

Good luck and remember there always is a solution

Geoff


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## nicholsong

Gaspode obviously thinks and types faster I !!!

Oh well!

Geoff


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## Zebedee

nicholsong said:


> Gaspode obviously thinks and types faster I !!!


That's my boy!!!

Dave :wink: :lol: :lol:


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## gaspode

nicholsong said:


> Gaspode obviously thinks and types faster I !!!


It's not that I think faster Geoff, it's just that I've had experience of a similar problem. :lol: :lol: :lol:

When we bought our (used) Arto, it had been standing for a few months and when the dealer did their PDI (yes - a PDI) they found the pump had seized so instead of fitting the correct replacement pump they just bunged on the nearest submersible pump they could get - a Whale. They didn't of course realise that the Arto needed a pump with a built-in non-return valve. Consequently we experienced a similar situation to the O/P and it took me some time to realise exactly what the problem was. I didn't have the benefit of knowing what the correct pump was as the old one had been replaced and dumped by the dealer. A bit of research came up with the Reich. I did a temporary repair by fitting a Whale N/R valve above the pump but the Whale N/R valves are nasty plastic things that don't seal very well and for some reason have a different diameter to the pump outlets so are very difficult to fit in the pipeline. Fitting a Reich pump has cured the problem.


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## Lynn13

sorry I didn't say before - ours is a 2002 model

Lynn


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## b16duv

nicholsong said:


> Gaspode obviously thinks and types faster I !!!
> 
> Oh well!
> 
> Geoff


Gaspode thinks faster than most of us!

D

PS Lynn, if its spitting and gurgling, the hot water tank really isn't full!


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## gaspode

Lynn13 said:


> sorry I didn't say before - ours is a 2002 model
> 
> Lynn


Hi Lynn

My observations are based on the model that followed yours so may not apply. The basic diagnosis will be correct though - you've no water in the boiler.


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## Lynn13

Hi again Gaspode

thank you for your help yesterday; we (Royal we) have checked the pump and it is the original Reich pump but it appears that you were quite right, the non-return valve is not working. Thought it might be worth checking to see if it (the valve) needs cleaning but it appears to be part of a sealed unit? Do you think it's worth checking? If not, we're going for the new pump as you suggested. 

By the way, Roger seems to think that our MH may have not been used for some time before we bought it, which may explain a few little teething problems?

Thanks again,

Lynn


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## gaspode

Hi Lynn

AFAIK, you can't get at the non-return valve to release it, it's integral with the pump.
The quick fix is to go and buy a Whale non-return valve and fit it in the delivery pipe just above the pump, they're very cheap if someone locally has one in stock. Permanent solution is a new Reich pump.


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## Lynn13

dear all

Just an update really; thanks agian for all your helpful posts. A new Reich pump has now been fitted (non-return valve on old one was dud, as Gaspode suspected) and all is hunkydory.

Thanks again and Merry Christmas

Lynn


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## davesport

You should have bought a HYMER :wink: they're miles better 

<Duck's & runs for cover>

Glad you're sorted 

PS. Mine's got the same pump


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