# What is it?



## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

I've got an electrical box under a seat and I'm not entirely sure what it does.
It's marked up with Logic 1 Ltd. and the model is a CD 200 A.
I've tried Googling but the company doesn't appear to exist anymore.
Anyway, it's got a switch on it which only illuminates when hooked up to the mains. Is it some sort of transformer jobbie that converts 240v AC to 12v DC to power all the 12v bits from the EHU instead of draining the leisure battery?
I've read on here about batteries being charged automatically when on EHU and wondered if it was a charger but I've dropped a meter on both batteries with the thing switched on and off and there doesn't appear to be any difference in voltage.


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## chapter (May 1, 2005)

how is it wired ?
chapter


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## CliveMott (Mar 10, 2008)

Its a bug!


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## gnscloz (Oct 4, 2008)

a bomb 8O 8O


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## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

CliveMott said:


> Its a bug!


Nah, only four legs.


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## Glandwr (Jun 12, 2006)

brassmonkey001 said:


> It's marked up with Logic


Should be obvious if you think about it.

Dick


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## Glandwr (Jun 12, 2006)

Second thoughts. You didn't import it did you?

http://logic-one.net/

Dick


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## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

Some pics of the offending item:


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## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

chapter said:


> how is it wired ?
> chapter


Dunno. I'm reasonably OK with simple vehicle electrics but 240v AC is something of a black art to me. This thing mixes the two so it's pure witchcraft AFAIAC.

TBH the wiring under the bonnet looks a bit of a dog's dinner with inline fuses and bits of different coloured wire joined together all over the place. I must sort it once I suss out what it's all for.


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## mgacoupe (May 5, 2010)

Its an inverter


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## mgacoupe (May 5, 2010)

No it isnt stupid , its the opposite way round a rectifier


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

I think its a simple float charger ie just puts out a fixed voltage not 3/4 stages.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

It looks like an inverter to me too. Is it missing an output socket or was it via a wire coming through the gromet above the illuminated switch. I would trace the wiring back and see if it goes to the leisure battery, Alan.


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

erneboy said:


> It looks like an inverter to me too. Is it missing an output socket or was it via a wire coming through the gromet above the illuminated switch. I would trace the wiring back and see if it goes to the leisure battery, Alan.


It can't be an inverter Alan look at the photo its input is 240Vac its output is 12Vdc


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## chapter (May 1, 2005)

i think its a battery charger try plugging in the ehu and turning of the trips one at a time 
chapter


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## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

chapter said:


> i think its a battery charger try plugging in the ehu and turning of the trips one at a time
> chapter


What am I looking at to see a change when I flick the trips?

As mentioned earlier there is no apparent change to the battery voltage when the EHU is connected/disconnected.


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

brassmonkey001 said:


> chapter said:
> 
> 
> > i think its a battery charger try plugging in the ehu and turning of the trips one at a time
> ...


There will be no change in battery voltage because the unit only gives out 12volts. If it was a true battery charger it would supply a minimum of 13.8v. and you would see the difference when it was switched off.

As sallytraffic said it is a float battery charger. It appears to also be able to supply 5amps without the battery in circuit.


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## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

rayc said:


> brassmonkey001 said:
> 
> 
> > chapter said:
> ...


So I was kind of right in my supposition that it converts 240v AC to 12v DC to power all the 12v bits & bobs? 
Will it charge the battery if it drops below 12v then?
Or should I change it for a better charger?
Or perhaps add in another charger? I did wonder whether to install a charger under the bonnet that I could connect to either battery before I found out that most motorhomes have a charger built in.


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

Q. So I was kind of right in my supposition that it converts 240v AC to 12v DC to power all the 12v bits & bobs? 

A.YES

Q.Will it charge the battery if it drops below 12v then? 

A. NO and it's not actually charging the battery now in the real sense of the word.

Q. Or should I change it for a better charger? 

A. YES

Q. Or perhaps add in another charger? I did wonder whether to install a charger under the bonnet that I could connect to either battery before I found out that most motorhomes have a charger built in. 

A.Waste of time having this and another charger. A decent 3 stage CTEK charger wired via a Battery Master so that both the leisure and vehicle batteries are charged is a relatively cheap option.


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## chapter (May 1, 2005)

what type of control panel do you have ?
chapter


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## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

chapter said:


> what type of control panel do you have ?
> chapter


A Logic One.


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## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

rayc said:


> Q. So I was kind of right in my supposition that it converts 240v AC to 12v DC to power all the 12v bits & bobs?
> 
> A.YES
> 
> ...


Erm...

What's a Battery Master?


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## grenwelly (Aug 7, 2007)

It will be a charger for your leisure battery etc
Invertors work the other way 12v to 240v
A volt meter on the output will let you know if it works


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## grenwelly (Aug 7, 2007)

Sorry folks did not notice the second page of replys before posting


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## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

rayc said:


> Q. So I was kind of right in my supposition that it converts 240v AC to 12v DC to power all the 12v bits & bobs?
> 
> A.YES
> 
> ...


Would a CTEK XS7000 be suitable to provide 12v power to all the 12v gubbins and charge the battery at the same time, or is it only really a battery charger and I'd need the XS25000 for what I want?


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

You don't say what "bits and bobs" you are trying to power for how long, nor your battery capacity, whether you run it right down or stay above 50% to maximise life, and whether you wish it to recharge overnight.

How long is a piece of string?

Dave


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

I love your third picture Brassmoney001.
The handle of a metal claw hammer beside the 'charger' says it all.

Ray.


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## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

DABurleigh said:


> You don't say what "bits and bobs" you are trying to power for how long, nor your battery capacity, whether you run it right down or stay above 50% to maximise life, and whether you wish it to recharge overnight.
> 
> How long is a piece of string?
> 
> Dave


No heavy drains, just the usual - 
a few lights for a couple of hours, 
maybe the TV for an hour or two, 
microwave for ten minutes perhaps (but I assume that is off the 240v supply and not an issue), 
3 way fridge on the gas so not much electricity used there I assume, 
heater is gas fired so just the electricity needed to run it's fan and only used for 1/2 hour or so when it's cold I suppose,
laptop for a couple of hours perhaps but again I expect that runs off the 240v,
phone charger when required.

Leisure battery is 85ah and I would prefer to keep it in tip top condition wherever possible.

Oh, and twice the length from the middle to the end BTW. :wink:


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## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

raynipper said:


> I love your third picture Brassmoney001.
> The handle of a metal claw hammer beside the 'charger' says it all.
> 
> Ray.


I keep it there in case it needs fixing. :wink:


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

I would imagine that the 7000 will cope with what you have described. Would I therefore consider it a wise purchase? No. You risk spoiling the future ship for a ha'porth of tar and would be more undergunned in the charger stakes than any current production motorhome. That's why on your other thread I suggested the 25000.

You pays yer money and takes yer choice.

Dave


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## safariboy (May 1, 2005)

The 12V could well be "Nominal" I would expect it to slightly increase the battery voltage even if it was only a one stage charger. Could a fuse be blown somewhere? If it has been switched on with a dead battery a 20A in line fuse could well be US.


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## Euramobilly (Apr 3, 2010)

It says 'input voltage 240' so it can't be an inverter. I think it's a charger for the leisure battery when you are on a hook up as BM says. You might not notice much difference with the meter if it's already fully charged. As a check, switch it off and see if you are sitting in the dark after a few days! :lol:


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## Euramobilly (Apr 3, 2010)

Sorry! I missed a few pages too!


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## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

DABurleigh said:


> I would imagine that the 7000 will cope with what you have described. Would I therefore consider it a wise purchase? No. You risk spoiling the future ship for a ha'porth of tar and would be more undergunned in the charger stakes than any current production motorhome. That's why on your other thread I suggested the 25000.
> 
> You pays yer money and takes yer choice.
> 
> Dave


OK. What does the 25000 do that the 7000 doesn't? I've looked at the info for both but frankly it doesn't mean a great deal to me. I see the 25000 is fully waterproof compared to the 7000 being only splashproof. That much I am clear on. 
Bulk charge rate is 25A vs 14A. What does that mean?
Minimum battery current rating is 50Ah vs 14Ah. Does that mean the 25000 is not suitable for small batteries like motorcycle batteries, whereas the 7000 is better suited for such?
Also maximum battery current rating is 500Ah/500Ah vs 150Ah/225Ah. Does that mean that if I had two 110Ah batteries then the 7000 wouldn't cope (110+110=220 against the 7000's charging upper limit of 150Ah)?

The bones of it is, what exactly is it that justifies more than twice the expenditure?


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

3.5 times the charging current at *under* double the price. You misread the 14 - that's minimum Ah; the A is 7.

Did you read all the links I posted? You said you were OK with vehicle electrics but not with mains.

If you want to understand more detail about the relationship of maximum charging current to battery capacity then a good rule is charge rate is no higher than capacity divided by 5. The reference, should you wish to challenge, is here:
http://www.victronenergy.com/upload/documents/ElectricityonBoard_rev8_july2004.pdf

Dave


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## brassmonkey001 (Jul 25, 2010)

DABurleigh said:


> 3.5 times the charging current at *under* double the price. You misread the 14 - that's minimum Ah; the A is 7.
> 
> Did you read all the links I posted? You said you were OK with vehicle electrics but not with mains.
> 
> ...


Thanks Dave. I think I said I was OK with simple vehicle electrics i.e. not great and less so when it gets complex.

I'm not out to challenge anyone, I just want to understand what it is I need, why I need it and why I should choose a particular product over another.


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