# Newbie with questions



## 101125 (Sep 25, 2006)

Hi All 

Nice forum you have here, I read with interest the debate about overwidth.

Just bought a 2003 Damon Challenger Ford Chassis 6.8 V10 , fresh to these shores in January, the owner was too scared to drive it oh well my gain  

Questions 
Got problems with the battery disconnect, and the monitor panel, does anyone have a wiring diagram for the Challenger?
It needs converting to 240V is there any documentation/best practice of how this should be done?
Where do I get spares? the awning over the slideout has been ripped off and also the decals down the driversside need replacing.

Cheers
Pete


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## 101002 (Sep 16, 2006)

spill said:


> Hi All
> 
> Nice forum you have here, I read with interest the debate about overwidth.
> 
> ...


Hello pete, 
yoll have to bear with spelling

i am new too go here

www.abp-accessories.co.uk/contact.php

ive just veiwed it and ive dun it good

big frank

One other thing pete we have just had our RV converted to LPG its a V10 like yours. Gulfstream Independence. 2003

Cost £3,250 including vat. is doing 10 to the gallon we buy our gas at 37p a litre, but i beleive its going to 33p now.A big saving on fuel equal to 24 to the gallon.

The chap who did ours did not use two kits like everyone suggested they couldnt do it without. He programmed in two extra beats into the computer and it doesnt notice it so he says and it runs superbly.

Whatever you do go for the injection system.

Hope this helps. Little Willie.


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## pepe (May 9, 2005)

Hi Pete try Stateside Tuning for spares and info also Starspangled Spanner both extremely knowledgable, Linda & Duncan respectively. Good luck mate and welcome to site. Mick


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## LC1962 (Oct 6, 2005)

Hi Pete

With regards to your battery disconnect, before you try anything else make sure your leisure batteries are up to scratch - the disconnect won't function properly if your batteries dont and American RVs are notorious for coming over from the States with duff batteries.

With regards to your conversion....shop around for quotes as these vary drastically, also be very careful who you choose to convert your vehicle as some conversions we have encountered leave a lot to be desired. There is no "manual" as such as chassis vary as do manufacturers layouts so its a case of whatever is right for your particular van.

Feel free to contact us for advice should you need it.

You will probably see our banner at the top of the RV forum page with contact phone numbers.

Best of luck and welcome to MHF!


Regards
Linda


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## 101002 (Sep 16, 2006)

LC1962 said:


> Hi Pete
> 
> With regards to your battery disconnect, before you try anything else make sure your leisure batteries are up to scratch - the disconnect won't function properly if your batteries dont and American RVs are notorious for coming over from the States with duff batteries.
> 
> ...


Just one thing i ommitted to tell you pete about the gas conversion. the firm that i used, the owner of the firm is one of the top LPG people in the country . He lectures to a lot of the fitters on what to do. Just ask can they convert a V10 and how many kits they will use and can they introduce 2 extra beats into the software.

I will also say i have not got any connection with any (mates )to do the job or reccommending a mate, it is purely out of seeing you get good fair advice and a good job. Then after speaking to them all its make your mind up time

Little Willie


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## 88927 (May 10, 2005)

Hi Pete.
Welcome to MHF and the frustrating world of RV ownership :lol: :lol: :lol: 
You may find some useful info here http://www.damonrv.com/motorhomes/challenger/
They have downloads for brochures and also an owners page where folks have written up articles.....
Not sure where you live but there is a RV repair shop just outside Northampton and they are pretty knowledgeable and also do LPG conversions (I believe they do loads for Travelworld). The company is Logical Automotive Solutions 01604 861999 ask for John.
I have no connection with these guys except being an existing customer.

Good luck mate and get in touch with Linda at Stateside regarding your awning and stuff.

Keith


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## 101125 (Sep 25, 2006)

Thanks for the warm welcome 

Frank, Thanks for that, yes intend to get it converted, parents have a diesel Daybreak so the comparision between the two is huge. Price looks good I'd been told to budget £2.5 - £3K + VAT

Mick, cheers 

Linda, I'll give you a call, I presume your also Lindy-c on ebay.

Keith, Cheers I've tried emailing damon but no response so far, I'm in between Westcroft/Brownhills and travelworld so have plenty of talented people local just looking for recommendations, TBH don't fancy paying inflated prices,(and yes I know we all have to make profit but come on be realistic with $-£ @ 1.9 if you bought wisely :roll:  ) 

Thanks again
Pete


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## 101002 (Sep 16, 2006)

spill said:


> Thanks for the warm welcome
> 
> Frank, Thanks for that, yes intend to get it converted, parents have a diesel Daybreak so the comparision between the two is huge. Price looks good I'd been told to budget £2.5 - £3K + VAT
> 
> ...


AAAhhh Lindy c on ebay all is explained

Big frank


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## LC1962 (Oct 6, 2005)

BIGFRANK said:


> AAAhhh Lindy c on ebay all is explained
> 
> Big frank


Is it :?:


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## 101002 (Sep 16, 2006)

LC1962 said:


> BIGFRANK said:
> 
> 
> > AAAhhh Lindy c on ebay all is explained
> ...


Sorry Limda i do not mean this remark offencely or any thing i just realized yout a dealer.

Being a businessman i like to make money, but i hate giving money to anyonr else having had am extremly deprived upbringing, hence i bought my Gulfstream Independany 2003 as new it is of a private seeller.

I did rob it for 25,000 and looked at the dealers who i realize again being a business man have to make monet but the less i can give away the moree i have to reinvest

Best wishes Linda and good luck in busines BIg Frank xx


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## LC1962 (Oct 6, 2005)

BIGFRANK said:


> Sorry Limda i do not mean this remark offencely or any thing i just realized yout a dealer.


No offence taken Frank although one of your comments to me in an earlier thread indicated you knew that already (you may remember which one :wink: )

Yes we do deal in RVs and accessories (I think I can say that now we officially advertise on MHF)......there are only a few companies that sell parts and accessories over here...us, Damondunc and another you have mentioned, plus one or two others (aside the big dealers that is).

We do not have the same overheads as the big boys so can be fairer on price. Please don't tar all dealers with the same brush...the smaller companies are often friendlier, more approachable and cheaper...it pays to shop around.

Enjoy your Gulfstream.......nice vehicle!

Cheers
Linda


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## 101002 (Sep 16, 2006)

LC1962 said:


> BIGFRANK said:
> 
> 
> > Sorry Limda i do not mean this remark offencely or any thing i just realized yout a dealer.
> ...


big frank

as usual its gone all wromg my meessagt is in here some were expand it if yiu can linda sorry


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## LC1962 (Oct 6, 2005)

Hi Frank

Managed to find it :lol: :lol: 

Our banner appears (usually) at the top of this forum,,,if you click on it you can read all about us - the homepage is not RV orientated as our roots lie in VW/Porsche motorsport (not as glamorous as it sounds). Our RV shop can be accessed by clicking on the link at the top right hand side of the homepage.

We are based in Moreton in Marsh (Cotswolds).

Cheers
Linda


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## olley (May 1, 2005)

hi bigfrank their are two types of gas conversions: Gas carb and sequential multipoint, both have fours and against.

S.M. is the lastest and should give slightly better fuel economy, but your intake manifold needs to be removed so it can be drilled for the injectors, do you trust them to do this properly? and will they do it or just drill in situ and let the swarf go into the engine?

I decided after spending a lot of money on the RV that I wasn't going to let anybody play with the engine, especially as most aren't engine fitters. 

A gas carb is much simpler to fit, you only need training by autogas to make a good job.

Olley


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## 101002 (Sep 16, 2006)

olley said:


> hi bigfrank their are two types of gas conversions: Gas carb and sequential multipoint, both have fours and against.
> 
> S.M. is the lastest and should give slightly better fuel economy, but your intake manifold needs to be removed so it can be drilled for the injectors, do you trust them to do this properly? and will they do it or just drill in situ and let the swarf go into the engine?
> 
> ...


well olley they drilled mine the insurance company insisted on a proper fitters cert othewide id hav dun it mysekf

bif frank


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## olley (May 1, 2005)

hi bigfrank the certificate is to say that he has completed an approved gas con. course. not that he is competent to work on your engine.

The course would have only covered the basics of european engines as there a so many variations, and would not have touched on an american V8 or V10.

Anybody can do this course, I believe the cost is less than £1000 in the same way anybody can do a CORGI course you don't have to be a plumber, just shell out £3000 and two weeks of your time and your deemed competent to fit and service domestic gas boilers. 

The question is, are you confident that he knows how to remove that manifold and put it back correctly? remember the old ford V4? the inlet manifolds were always giving trouble if not fitted absolutely right. and we are talking here of a V8 or V10. 

Your bloke may be OK. but their are some guys out there wearing stetsons, but if they don't touch your engine they can't damage it. I hope. :lol: 

Olley


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## G2EWS (May 1, 2006)

Hi Pete,

Welcome to the site and the great choice of advice now available to you.

First things, Linda at Stateside is great. Do get in contact about any bits you need.

With regards to the conversion this is a straightforward job that, as Linda has stated can, and often is, messed up.

My Itasca was badly converted but was simple for me to rectify. In my opinion it is not worth trying to convert to 240V but leave all the sockets at 110V. You may, like me, have all the accessories from kettle to microwave which are 110v so there is no need to try and change these. What you need is an additional socket or two that has a separate RCD with 240v out. If you are a keen DIYer you will probably be able to sort this yourself.

In terms of gas conversions I am puzzled by this one having looked at it in the past for a 4 litre Jeep Grand Cherokee. The pay back is a lot of miles and most of us don't use the MH for that many. I just get the feeling that it seems a bit of a waste of money that could go towards a party or two! But I guess you have done your calculations. 

For what it is worth I have gone into my spreadsheet and changed the settings so we have the following results:

Average 500 miles per month
Petrol cost 99p per litre
LPG costs 37p per litre
MPG is 20 so LPG (MPG) is 18 (10% less)
Cost of install £3,000
Pay back is 45.6 months

So if you think it is worth waiting for nearly 4 years and you are going to keep the MH for that time, go for it!

Regards

Chris


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## 101125 (Sep 25, 2006)

Hi Chris

Yes spoken to Linda so almost sorted, also had a service manual emailed to me by Damon  so I'm getting there

TBH with the gas conversion thing I'm still undecided haven't done enough miles to work out the MPG but the guy I bought it from claims he was looking at 8-10mpg  so I'll perhaps have to do a few more miles and then see.

500 miles a month I'll be lucky only done 680 miles in my other pride and joy since november










anyways thanks also for the advice on the power and look forward to contributing more once I know what I'm talking about :?


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## 88927 (May 10, 2005)

Hi all
I think the point that Chris was trying to make about MPG is that you will get about 8 - 10 MPG from petrol at 99p per litre and about 7 - 9 MPG from LPG at 37p per litre (which equates to about 20MPG cost wise).
You will not get more MPG with a gas conversion, in fact slightly less because LPG has a lower calorific value so you will burn more, but the price differential is substantial at the moment and could be worth considering, in my opinion only if you intend to cover many miles though.
I would think it would be cheaper to replace the motor with a diesel :lol: :lol: :lol: but that is not really a viable option here.....
Glad to hear that Damon sent the service manual, it will be a big help I would think, and also that you are getting everything else sorted out, keep us posted on progress matey :lol: :lol: :lol:
I would strongly advise becoming a subscriber of MHF because your free postings will run out shortly and you will not then be able to post questions to us all :wink: :wink: 

Keith


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## G2EWS (May 1, 2006)

Hi Chaps,

Think I was being optimistic about the fuel consumption!

Here are the figures worked out a little more accurately:

Average 500 miles per month 
Petrol cost 99p per litre 
LPG costs 37p per litre 
MPG is 12 so LPG (MPG) is 10.8 (10% less) 
Cost of install £3,000 
Pay back is 29.4 months 

More realistically with mileage:

Average 250 miles per month 
Petrol cost 99p per litre 
LPG costs 37p per litre 
MPG is 12 so LPG (MPG) is 10.8 (10% less) 
Cost of install £3,000 
Pay back is 58.8 months 

Basically a lot of months to get pay back whatever way you look at it.

If anyone wants to save messing around creating the spread sheet and they have Excel, pm me with your email address and I will email it on. You can then spend hours trying to find a way to justify having an lpg conversion carried out!

Regards

Chris


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## 101125 (Sep 25, 2006)

kands said:


> I would strongly advise becoming a subscriber of MHF because your free postings will run out shortly and you will not then be able to post questions to us all :wink: :wink:


Yeah just noticed my posts left was going rapidly :roll:


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## G2EWS (May 1, 2006)

Hi again,

Well Olley has pointed out that I have made two fundamental errors. Firstly the 10% loss in fuel consumption was based on figures of about 6 years ago. It seems that approximately 20% loss between petrol and lpg is now the accepted norm.

Secondly lpg is about 40p per litre. So in the interests of making sure you have the correct information here is the two tables altered once again:

Average 500 miles per month 
Petrol cost 99p per litre 
LPG costs 40p per litre 
MPG is 12 so LPG (MPG) is 9.6 (20% less) 
Cost of install £3,000 
Pay back is 35.2 months 

More realistically with mileage: 

Average 250 miles per month 
Petrol cost 99p per litre 
LPG costs 40p per litre 
MPG is 12 so LPG (MPG) is 9.6 (30% less) 
Cost of install £3,000 
Pay back is 70.4 months

Makes for even worse reading if you are looking at converting!

It would suprise me if any of us kept the MH for more than three years let alone six. I guess we all like to change on a regular basis and that will likely be in the 2 to 3 year time scale.

Regards

Chris


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