# Who can drive next year



## hireme (Sep 10, 2010)

Hi.
We are an ageing nation. If you passed your test before 1997 you have grandfather rights to a C1 on your licence. As every year goes by less people will be able to drive C1 vehicles unless they take a very expensive test. Does that mean Motorhomes that are over 3500KG will become virtually worthless.
I look forward to your comments.
Regards
Terry


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*prices*

Means we will have a good choice of worthless vans for some 10's of years.

Wether we can afford the Diesel is another matter!

TM


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## chrisgog (May 17, 2005)

Or, on the positive side, you could buy a large van at a cheaper price as people will not be able to afford the C1 licence so dealers will need to dump them.

Glass is always half full not half empty  

My daughter wants to get her C1 licence and it will cost about £1000. She needs to pay for a medical first before even applying for the provisional licence. 
Good article on the procedure in this months MMM

Chris


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## gromett (May 9, 2005)

Took My Test in 99. Took my C1 in 07  Cheaper 3500+ MH's welcome :lol: 

Karl


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## loddy (Feb 12, 2007)

Just spent 3 days driving in circles around Bristol in a LGV (over 7.5 tonnes ) 2 more days next week then a test for C licence. cost about £2000.

Loddy


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## Rosbotham (May 4, 2008)

Assuming the normal profile of taking your test at 18, most people who are 32 or older will have C1(107) entitlement. They won't lose that until they're 70. Few people can afford a motorhome until they're in their 40s anyway. I think you've got a good while to wait until this becomes an issue.


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## rosalan (Aug 24, 2009)

Loddy, with your new found entitlement to drive bigger trucks, you will now be able to re-coup your expenses and gain real experience driving small lorries.http://www.motorhomefacts.com/modules/Forums/images/smiles/smile.gif The really big trucks need a different licence but I wonder if the training costs more.http://www.motorhomefacts.com/modules/Forums/images/smiles/question.gif 
What a load of nonsense this all is, because my wife, who has never driven anything larger than a Citroen C1, got her licence years ago and can now jump into a 7.5 ton truck and aim it where she pleases. The is healthy and fit so when she gets to be 70, for £40 she can drive all but the very bigest Motorhomes. I will advertise a warning if this happens.http://www.motorhomefacts.com/modul...acts.com/modules/Forums/images/smiles/lol.gif 
p.s. don't tell her I wrote this because none of it is truehttp://www.motorhomefacts.com/modules/Forums/images/smiles/redface.gif


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## loddy (Feb 12, 2007)

No I can't earn a living being able to drive a 32 tonne rigid, until I take a CPC and tachograph training, but I can drive a 12 ton American RV but only tow a 750 kg trailer

Loddy


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*training*

Following on from the Benefrauds thread.

Can I retrain for over 7.5 Ton and get the Government to pay for it?

TM


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## reflogoff11 (Jun 8, 2008)

loddy said:


> No I can't earn a living being able to drive a 32 tonne rigid, until I take a CPC and tachograph training, but I can drive a 12 ton American RV but only tow a 750 kg trailer
> 
> Loddy


Hi here,
I think that I must be out of date with my transport knowledge as I am a much retired Transport Manager/ Fleet Engineer. My CPC, (Certificate of Professional Competence) was earned as a result of extensive course taking, with many years running heavy transport companies. 
This CPC was a requirement demanded by the Licencing Authority, which entitled me to be the signatory solely responsible for ensuring all the regulations, legislation and maintenance proceedures, were in place. Prison was a possibility if we failed.
Have they belittled this qualification now ? (sob!)
Barrie.


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## gramor (Oct 24, 2010)

[/quote]Have they belittled this qualification now ? (sob!)
Barrie.[/quote]

Not belittled, if you want to make a living driving vehicles over 7.5t, you have to log 35 hours training every 5 years.

As a CE holder, I now have to spend some of my spare time doing agency driving for very little return to get access to the training.

Introduced throughout the EU to improve driving standards, I hope they extend it for all other class of licences, might just remove some of the really awful drivers I see on the roads.

Not required if you drive MH's unless you are getting paid for it.


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## Tissy (Jul 10, 2010)

As a commercial gas engineer we have to be tested every 5 years. 
The standard of some drivers is appalling and in the interest of safety i think that some sort of refresher/awareness course should be compulsory for what ever we drive. 
i never thought i would hear myself say this but more and more we personally accountable for our actions.
Tissy


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## Richard_M (Dec 17, 2010)

Rosbotham said:


> Assuming the normal profile of taking your test at 18, most people who are 32 or older will have C1(107) entitlement. They won't lose that until they're 70. Few people can afford a motorhome until they're in their 40s anyway. I think you've got a good while to wait until this becomes an issue.


Yes but if you are buying a new 3.5t+ MH now, by the time it is 10 years old many of the core second hand buyers will be unable to drive it.

I reckon that second hand 3.5t+ MH prices will drop quite a bit in time.


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## locovan (Oct 17, 2007)

My Son is a trainer and tester of HGV drivers and you wouldn't believe the stories he tells.
The times he stops a test and gets out--the standard of driving is appalling.
But then we dont need to be told that as we know as we travel so many Motorways and see it first hand 8O 

We never realised that they automatically take the C1 off when they reissue the licence at 70 it wasnt until I read it on here and Ray looked that we found out.


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## kenthepub (Nov 6, 2010)

*CPC*

Hi Barrie the CPC you earned is different from the the Drivers CPC that Loddy writes about. You still have the entitlement that you worked so hard to gain. Ken


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## johnthompson (Jul 29, 2010)

reflogoff11 said:


> loddy said:
> 
> 
> > No I can't earn a living being able to drive a 32 tonne rigid, until I take a CPC and tachograph training, but I can drive a 12 ton American RV but only tow a 750 kg trailer
> ...


As well as an operators CPC they are now introducing a drivers CPC for HGVs and PCVs in both cases UK and continental versions.

Our local small bus company is run by a couple who are nearing retirement age they also employ a very high proportion of part time drivers that are either retired or getting on that way. They have decided that when this becomes compulsory they will just close the business. My friend is one of those drivers. He used to drive for me when we were younger.

They also own the garage where my motorhome is serviced and MOTd so I presume that will also go the same way.

They warned us about this early last year.

John


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## johnthompson (Jul 29, 2010)

reflogoff11 said:


> loddy said:
> 
> 
> > No I can't earn a living being able to drive a 32 tonne rigid, until I take a CPC and tachograph training, but I can drive a 12 ton American RV but only tow a 750 kg trailer
> ...


As well as an operators CPC they are now introducing a drivers CPC for HGVs and PCVs in both cases UK and continental versions.

Our local small bus company is run by a couple who are nearing retirement age they also employ a very high proportion of part time drivers that are either retired or getting on that way. They have decided that when this becomes compulsory they will just close the business. My friend is one of those drivers. He used to drive for me when we were younger.

They also own the garage where my motorhome is serviced and MOTd so I presume that will also go the same way.

They warned us about this early last year.

John


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## CourtJester (Aug 26, 2009)

I'm OK. The fire service trained me to drive fire appliances during my 15 years as a retaiined firefighter. I have a class C licence and a PSV licence, but I'd have to pass the medical.


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## Rosbotham (May 4, 2008)

Richard_M said:


> Yes but if you are buying a new 3.5t+ MH now, by the time it is 10 years old many of the core second hand buyers will be unable to drive it.
> 
> I reckon that second hand 3.5t+ MH prices will drop quite a bit in time.


Sorry, but I disagree. Well I agree about the "in time" bit, but not your prediction of the timescale.

An 18 year old taking their test in 1997 would have been born in 1979. So anyone born after that (+ anyone who took their test later in life) will be restricted to class B. In 10 years' time, the breakpoint we're talking about will be whether people are younger or older than 42. I'm 42 at present, and can tell you that it's a rarety for me to see anyone with a motorhome younger than me...I know quite a few people of my age who'd like one, but they can't afford it (they joys of not having kids).

If you were talking about 20 years time, I might agree.

Personally, I'd turn it on its head. My prediction is that at somepoint, something will happen that will cause VOSA to start being far more enthusiastic about weight checks. Then suddenly a lot of people will realise that they're driving their sub-3500kg motorhomes illegally and can't practicably get the weight down to drive it legally. I think at that point there'll be sufficient a backlash that something will be done about the breakpoint, because with our ballooning need for luxuries, ballooning waistlines (I mean, how many of us actually achieve the 75kg that's generally allowed for?)and weight of safety requirements on base vehicles, it'll be increasingly difficult to achieve the current metric.

Paul


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## Richard_M (Dec 17, 2010)

Rosbotham said:


> Sorry, but I disagree. Well I agree about the "in time" bit, but not your prediction of the timescale.


Yes but no but.....

With the ever increasing cost of fuel I think that will also pull down the cost of large MHs (and large caravans too). OK, it might take more than 10 years but it is going to happen.

People will take their C1 if they are going to drive a really big MH but I doubt it for a MH just over the 3.5t mark

I think MHs, like cars, are generally too complex, too complicated, too heavy and too expensive. Look at the modern mini and then compare it to the classic mini.

I like my 21 year old MH, in the same way I like my 20 year old Range Rover and 15 year old Jeep.

Modern stuff, blugh! you can keep it


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Cars*

Have they belittled this qualification now ? (sob!)
Barrie.[/quote]

Not belittled, if you want to make a living driving vehicles over 7.5t, you have to log 35 hours training every 5 years.

As a CE holder, I now have to spend some of my spare time doing agency driving for very little return to get access to the training.

Introduced throughout the EU to improve driving standards, I hope they extend it for all other class of licences, might just remove some of the really awful drivers I see on the roads.

Not required if you drive MH's unless you are getting paid for it.[/quote]

" might just remove some of the really awful drivers I see on the roads"

But the vast majority of those drive Cars!

TM


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## johnthompson (Jul 29, 2010)

reflogoff11 said:


> loddy said:
> 
> 
> > No I can't earn a living being able to drive a 32 tonne rigid, until I take a CPC and tachograph training, but I can drive a 12 ton American RV but only tow a 750 kg trailer
> ...


As well as an operators CPC they are now introducing a drivers CPC for HGVs and PCVs in both cases UK and continental versions.

Our local small bus company is run by a couple who are nearing retirement age they also employ a very high proportion of part time drivers that are either retired or getting on that way. They have decided that when this becomes compulsory they will just close the business. My friend is one of those drivers. He used to drive for me when we were younger.

They also own the garage where my motorhome is serviced and MOTd so I presume that will also go the same way.

They warned us about this early last year.

John


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## kaacee (Nov 29, 2008)

I am also a retired CPC holder, gained when I was a Transport Manager with one of the major oil companies. 

To earn the certificate involved lots of study and if I remember 85% was the required pass rate mark, I remember passing my exam in Ashford Kent, a large papermill if I recall. 

So if the standards required lead to better drivers, I'm all for it. 

I have and still do hold clean car , motorcycle, PCV, HGV 1 and even a group H (trolleybus) licences which were all obtained by taking the relevant test, not by grandfather rights as were so many. 

I think driving this variety of vehicles has stood me in good stead to appreciate and allow each ones characteristics to be appreciated.

My MH is 4.25t and I hope to be still be driving it 15-20 years hence, so buyers will not be an issue to me.

Keith


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## reflogoff11 (Jun 8, 2008)

Hi,
Pleased to hear that the status of the Operators Licence CPC is still classed as a professional qualification. Why they chose to use the same CPC designation, and not, maybe ,CDC ( certificate of driving competence ) baffles me. :? 
It is quite right though to aim for a higher standard of driving, as some of the heavy lorry drivers of today do behave very badly. I do feel that the old `KNIGHT`S OF THE ROAD` have long gone.  So long as the improvements sought, apply to european visitors as well I am all for introducing training schemes. 
Anyway, I`m sure all active ,experienced, Motorhomers will pass the tests they face in later years quite comfortably. :roll: :roll: 
Barrie.


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## gramor (Oct 24, 2010)

*Re: Cars*

[quote="teemyobr it.[/quote]But the vast majority of those drive Cars!TM[/quote]

A CE class holder driving his own car would know not to steal the braking space of a loaded STGO 3, or to undertake a rear wheel steer unit on a roundabout.

I and others I have spoken with who drive professionally accept the rules as they apply to us, but see no good reason for not introducing a similar regular assesment of all vehicle drivers roadcraft skills, and throw in a medical and eyetest as well..........would create some jobs for sure. :wink:


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

I also hold the Transport Managers CPC, both the UK and the International versions. These two qualifications were paid for by myself and cost quite a lot of money, showing my commitment to the transport industry.
I have driven trucks extensively over the European mainland, however I have very mixed feelings about the Drivers CPC.
New Drivers have to sit the test prior to gaining their licence which is good, but existing drivers only have to attend a 35 or 37 hour attendance course with no examination required to gain the certificate. They could do the same module for 5 days and still get the certificate, although I do believe that they will be doing different modules.
Although it was to help road safety, I do think there will be an issue of passing the buck from the Transport office to the Driver who is already under too much pressure with timed deliveries and specially timed multi drop deliveries.
My digital tackograph is now due for renewal and I doubt that I will renew it as no tacko is required to drive my M/H.
Also it is strange that existing drivers with many years experience and who also hold the much higher Transport Managers CPC qualification still are required to gain this new drivers CPC although as previously mentioned it is an attendance course and not an examination for experienced Drivers.
Maybe moneymaking!


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## gramor (Oct 24, 2010)

Grath said:


> Maybe moneymaking!


Nail+hammer+Head.


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## PhilK (Jul 1, 2005)

*C1, one more twist*

There are many reasons for which your doctor will ask you to stop driving. They include an unexplained fit, a suspect or real heart attack, difficult to control eye problem, stroke, certain blood pressure issues,.......many more but without referring to the dvla i cant list them all.

My point is this, if you give up driving for a period, during which time you surrender your licence, when they give it you back, it will be for one year at a time for three years followed by your life licence. Whereas historically you would get your full entitlements, now Swansea have included an additional ryder which says that you must be ten years without medication for the issue for which you gave up your licence to get your full entitlements. Your licence start date will be issue date so you loose C1 and motorcycle entitlements etc.

I have been through this twice, once in 1990 I got my full licence but following a relapse, my present full life licence has no C1 entitlement with no recourse because I will always be on medication.

As we all age, many health issues will apply to us all and illness such as certain cancers may include for a driving break followed by no C1 entitlement.

Sorry this is long, but a ray of sunshine. For some reason, the powers that be believe it to be safer to drive a 3.5 tonne motor home pulling a 2 tonne trailer than drive a stand alone 4 tonne motor home. 3.5 tonnes are not going to get cheaper, trailers are going to sell well.

Phil k


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## loddy (Feb 12, 2007)

Talking of idiots on the road, I was going round in circles again in Bristol today and was seriously cut up by a Artic, my instructor said did you see what was written on the front of that lorry?, no said I ( ---------- name removed by Loddy )" driver of the year"

Loddy 8O


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## loddy (Feb 12, 2007)

interesting point , if you haven't passed a test for a particular vehicle you can't sit next to a learner, in other words if you have grandad rights to drive C class you can't sit next to a learner if you haven't passed C class yourself

Loddy


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