# Sterling Power Battery to Battery Charger



## 89043 (May 12, 2005)

Outfitting a VW transporter as RV. Researching secondary battery charging (ca 200 Ah deep cycle). Known facts on car alternator secondary batteries charge only up to ca 80%. Found on the web Sterling Power Products www.sterling-power.com sell what they call a battery to Battery charger, what allows complete charging of the 2nd battery from the car alternator.

Anyone who has experience with this gear?
Anyone who has an other solution to get the 2nd battery full on alternator?
Looking forward to hear from you


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Hi archimedes,

Not with Sterling but plenty of working knowledge with Adverc,

Fit an Adverc charging manager and a diode charging splitter.

With the Adverc system there is a direct measurement of the battery voltage so that the halve volt drop coursed by the diode splitter is compensated for and the management system takes the battery to a fully charged state and holds it there with is 20% more that your alternator will do on its own.

Maybe not the cheapest of solutions but in my mind the best arrangement.

Doug...


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## 93135 (May 1, 2005)

Some of the answers to FAQ,s on the Sterling web site are opinion and not fact and should be challenged. If you change your charging system to that offered on this web site then the amount of topping up required will increase. Also the battery voltage will rise above 14 volts during the final phases of charging. The experience of all vehicle manufacturers has combined to not take vehicle batteries above this critical gassing voltage for these reasons.
If the battery is disconnected from its use and charged and maintained seperately (like a milk float or fork lift truck battery) then different charging regimes are appropriate as well as automated topping up. But for a car or motorhome I am far from convinced its a good idea. conventional split charging with just one relay (second relay for the fridge) works very well if you use short THICK cables (including the chassis connection) and take the initial supply directly from the alternator B+ terminal.


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Hi Webwobin,

("The experience of all vehicle manufacturers has combined to not take vehicle batteries above this critical gassing voltage for these reasons.")

The gassing voltage is between 14.0 and 14.3, close observation of the Adverc charging system will show that the voltage does not go in this range but jumps above or below the gassing voltage, I believe that other manufacturers will do the same.

73 GW0UXX Doug...


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## 93135 (May 1, 2005)

Hi Doug,
The critical gassing voltage starts from about 2.35 V/Cell upwards, its not a band, its the initial voltage above which it starts to split down water into its component parts as well as causing a change to the lead paste.

Charging systems for deep cycle batteries like fitted to Fork Lift Trucks and milk floats fully charge the battery. These do cause the battery to gas and consequently they require regular topping up with de-ionised water. Today automated topping up systems are employed. The other problem with wanting to get the last 20% out of your vehicle battery is that the terminal voltage has to be allowed to rise well above 14 volts during the later charging phases, this is OK if the battery is not trying to run equipment at the same time, something that from time to time we do do in a motorhome. Some kit won't like it uppem
Hence I don,t consider the "Sterling" system appropriate for this application nor any other system that does similar to the terminal voltage.

Lastly I don,t know why its called the "Sterling" system as these techniques have been around for many years, there is even a DIN standard for them!

WW
G4 etc.


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi

All Charging causes Gassing, charging is a chemical reaction you cannot put charge into a battery without causing gassing. Ad forthe same amount of charge in they will always produce the same amount of GAS.

Try it, put a battery on 13.8 v and observe inside each cell you will see bubbles this is the gas forming as the sulphate from the plates recombines into the electrolyte.

The thing that the Ardverc tries to avoid is heating the battery up and causing vapour which is the distilled water floating away, this works because the battery is at high Voltage for short while then dropped low it does this in cycles, the up side is less vapour lost, downside is that it will take twice as long to charge a battery.

The Sterling doesnt drop down to keep from vapourising the distilled water, this means that you will have to top up the batteries with distilled water, but it also means that the battery gets charged over twice as quickly.

The Sterling is my choice because

1. You should be checking and topping up anyway
2. I would rather charge my batteries as fast as possible
3. The system costs a lot less

Certain companies told me I definately needed a pure sine wave invertor, when talking to Charles Sterling about an Invertor He said that what the other companies said was Bull**** and that I could buy a Quasi Sine wave from him and if it didnt power all the items on my list OK then he would give me the pure sine wave Invertor at same price, so being honest he talked the sale down from ( I have not time to look this up now but I think it was) £800 + for Pure Sine wave and he persuaded me to buy the Quasi at £350 

Now remember all the Other companies tried to sell me their Pure sine wave Invertor, So either the Sale came first and bugger what the customer actually needs or they just aint as smart as Charles when it comes to electronics.

The other point about running items with a charger attached applies equally to ardverc or sterling, both use voltages up to 15v depending on the battery type.

George

PS if the vehicle was going to be permenantly and heavily used in a hot country I would lean towards the Ardverc or the Digital Sterling with temp sensors.


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## 93135 (May 1, 2005)

Sorry George,,
I believe you are not quite correct in your detail but I accept I won't change your opinion. 
I also believe that the motor industry across the board are correct . The standard regime has stood the test of time and is the most appropriate for the appropriate for engine driven vehicle applications.

ww


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi WW

the standard regime is to put the tiny bit used by starting back into the battery and then supply the lights etc.

Its accepted the world over that a standard alternator will not recharge a battery much over 70%

Which is why the Advanced stuff came out, for normal vehicle use its a pointless addition, because as you say the present starter battery system as been proved by years of use. ie 

By the same token it as been known for years that to fully charge a battery needs a different Charging regime. For starter batteries it doesnt matter, for leisure batteries more AH is generally better. The biggest cause of online MH questions is the battery, a lot of people still believe that with a 110 AH leisure battery charged via a standard alternator would allow them to run 11 amps of gear for 10 hours,even the so called tech guys in magazines keep printing that same falacy over and over.

BTW to prove to yourself that gassing occurs below 14.1 Volts (2.35v per cell) take the caps of your battery and have a look in each cell even at tickover small bubbles will be forming and rising


BTW WW its not my opinion its solid scientific fact.


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## 89043 (May 12, 2005)

*grain of salt*

May I just add my grain of salt...
It is correct that the gassing potential is the voltage above which the splitting of water starts and not a band if you get over it even momentary you get gas.

It is correct that even if you stay well below the a voltage on the battery terminals you can get gas. Because it is a cell voltage that is important ... and even to some extend internal voltage distribution in the cell is important. To keep simple at one spot on a plate the tension can be well over the gassing potential and on another it will under. The higer the current you charge with the higer voltage diffference will be.

Standard automotive alternators are regulated devices. Innitally internally regulated to fixed voltage, now more and more microprocessors overtaking cars I would not be to sure about that as more also that alternator is externally microprocessor regulated.

That regulation is tuned to the electrical load of the vehicle and to the starter battery that is mounted. How far that battery will becharged is a tradeoff but be assured it is more than 70%. Would not be very healthy
for that battery to be in that state.

Starter batteries and deep cycle batteries are different. And need a different regime to get charged. No argument about that. And if moreover you want to charge at the same time by the same alternator two sets of batteries with different chracteristics there is no alternator regulation that will do good to both

Marcel


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi Marcel

Charging is a chemical process, to recombine the sulphuric acid with the distilled water causes gas to form, if the voltage does not create these gas bubbles no charging.

On the 70% being the experts opinion here is a quote from this site http://www.caravanandmotorhomebooks.com/books/motorhome_electrics_caravans_too.htm

Quote

As described in the previous chapter, an alternator's field is generated by a current flowing through internally rotating wire coils. The stronger that current, the stronger the field, and the greater the alternator's output.

The strength of that field, and hence the alternator's voltage output, is controlled by the voltage regulator. That regulator attempts to maintain the alternator's output at a constant 14.2 14.4 volts regardless of battery charge, or whether or not windscreen wipers, big audio systems, air-conditioning etc., are on or of.

The starter battery has an integral and vital role in this system of control. Whilst that battery does not normally supply current whilst the engine is running, the voltage across it reflects whatever is happening in the electrical system. If, for example, the rear window demister is turned on, the increased load causes battery voltage to fall.

The regulator continuously monitors this voltage, either across the battery or from within the alternator (whilst battery and alternator are connected directly by heavy cable there can be a voltage difference between the two due to losses along that connecting cable).

Knowing. that the system should operate at 14.2.14.4 volts, the regulator adjusts the alternator's output voltage by switching its field on and off at very high speed (Fig. 4.1). Smoothed by the battery, this output appears to the system as a constant voltage.

As noted in Chapter 2, 14.2.14.4 volts output is a compromise. It's high enough to spin the starter motor, but also low enough to prevent overcharging unless the vehicle is driven non-stop for days on end. But that 14.2.14.4 volts output is too low to charge any conventional lead-acid battery beyond 70.75% in any practicable length of time.

Experts in this field are increasingly quoting 65% as a more realistic norm.

End Quote

George


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Oh No, I thought, not another heated discussion about batteries etc, bound to end in tears.  

Well, i'm pleasantly surprised on this one and all the replies seem to be balanced and more importantly having respect for other posters views. 

Well done lads, keep up the good work.  

pete.


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Hi Webwobin,


("The critical gassing voltage starts from about 2.35 V/Cell upwards, its not a band,)"

Gassing starts as soon as charging does, its part of the chemical process, however the voltages between 14.0 and 14.3 produce a particuly heavy gassing, 

On a boat its often that the engine runs for much longest periods than that of a M/H try 8 days to cross the Bay of Biscay, so I have had plenty of time to observe the voltages during a long charge having crossed the Bay many times. although my boat is a sailing boat we tend to motor/sail on long crossings

With the Adverc system after the battery has been cycled up to its full charge the voltage drops back to 13.8 and a charge of 4 amps, (my monitoring allows me to monitor volts plus amps going in and amps going out).

After the long run I check the battery levels and top them up, but the amount needed is very small and at a guess would go another 8 days be for the level got down to the top of the plates.

Using this system my batteries that where the cheapest I could find (36 euros each) are still going after 4 years of near constant live aboard use, The proof of the pudding as it were.

Oh! By the way, if you are a licensed Ham, why don’t you give your full call sign?

Doug... GW0UXX


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi

It does not matter whethor you charge at 14v or 15v both will produce exactly the same amount of gas molecules per ah of charge put into the battery.

The difference is that at the higher voltage you will cause the distilled water to vapourise (steam off) this is what causes the extra top ups.

With the long running (days on end) that Doug Mentions the Ardverc would probably be my choice too, both would fully charge the leisure battery, but the Ardverc would require less topping up. For the normal motorhome Use with more smaller/shorter journies the Sterling would be my choice as I want as Much charge as poss from the shorter journies and as fast as poss.

There is definately no Band, check with a chemist they will tell you for the same ah going in will produce the same amount of gas regardless of what voltage, the voltage only effects the speed that the battery can Draw the ampage. The main point is that for 1 AH charge put into battery there is and exact number of gas molecules produced and for that1 ah it will remain the same regardles of voltage.

George


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## 93135 (May 1, 2005)

Hi Doug and George, 
Well, if I gave my callsign you would be straight on QRZ.com and my cover would be blown. But another clue is that I have worked as an elecrical / electronic designer for 42 years in the battery electric driven vehicle industry. Hence have a little experience in the evolution of batteries, especially lead acid and the pro,s and con,s of the various charging and topping up systems that have evolved over those years. 

George did say that batteries gas uniformly per ampere hours put in, but also said in another thread that the reason more water gets lost in the later phases of charge (i.e the last 20%) was because they get hot. Well, if the electrical energy is causing heating then its not all causing a change of the state of the lead paste is it?. 

Full charging systems do require much more frequent topping up and that is why Autofil and other systems are now common place in the battery electric vehicle market. 

Simple is best for our MH environment. FAT cables, connect directly to the B+ terminal so starter and leisure batteries have an equal chance of achieving the same charging potential and do your calculations based on 80% and you won,ta go far wrong. KEEP IT SIMPLE

I believe the techniques used for fast charging were initially IUIi but more recently pulse charging with forced air agitation is used for very fast charging. All have Autofil
DIN specs, well they were in my filing cabinet at work but as I have now retired (another clue) I don,t have them to hand. 

My last reason I repeat is so that I don,t shove more than 14 volts up any of my leaisure equipment, flourescent lights, Radio's, inverters. etc

Enjoy easter
73


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Hi Webwobin

Check your callsign, if you have not put it on the QRZ.com for a while it wont be listed, mine isn't, but I'm not active on key or mic, only data so maybe thats why.

Doug...


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## 93135 (May 1, 2005)

Hi Doug,
Yes. It is there, I just checked. 190 lookups! So perhaps your first guess was wrong?


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## 88724 (May 9, 2005)

Hi WW

Quote from WW post

George did say that batteries gas uniformly per ampere hours put in, but also said in another thread that the reason more water gets lost in the later phases of charge (i.e the last 20%) was because they get hot. Well, if the electrical energy is causing heating then its not all causing a change of the state of the lead paste is it?. 

End quote

When I say amp Hours put in, thats what I mean, the actual received charge, not the Ampere hour required to achieve it, there is a subtle but important distinction.

I didnt actually say that about later stages of charge and heat, the Ardverc avoids some of the heat and subsequent vapour loss by resting the battery, between higher charging periods, The Sterling Just goes full tilt for faster charge. So I suppose it amounts to the same thing.

George


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## 89043 (May 12, 2005)

*posted on board on Georges demand*

I initially replied personal, as I am new on the list I meant this was the right response to Petes comment, but as I see that some of my comments would benefit more generally it is wiser to post

here my initial mail

George I am replying off-list as Pete (whoever he is) put a warning this discussion might run into a "flame".

As you referred to a chemist, here a chemical view simplified to keep it in this frame. 
In a lead-acid battery there is more than one "electrochemical" reaction going on. in the chemical jargon, it is about "pairs" "half reactions" "overvoltage" "electrochemical series" and in former days about "polarization voltage" . 
Let keep it practical those "pairs" are each a couple of "ions" that fit in a half-reaction, 
to keep it simple and close to lead-acid battery we discuss the two pairs 
that are important are : 
the lead/ lead oxide that is the one who works for us storing electricity 
and the water/ hydrogen that is the parasite making the bubbles.

electrochemistry lists those "pairs" in electrochemical series, where every former pair just needs a bit less potential (tension) to be transformed one into another. Actual there are two of such series one positive and one negative.

Where the Hydrogen and the lead sit, they are quite a bit apart. That means that it is perfectly possible to charge a "perfect" lead-acid battery without any gas generation, if you keep the charging potential low enough so that inside the cells you limit the overvoltage so that the lead/leadoxide conversion goes forward, the water hydrogen conversion not yet. IN practice there will be always a bit of gassing also at lower charging potentials, because of inhomogeneity in the battery.

The tension over the terminals a given battery will start gassing is dependent on the temperature and the electrolytes composition, and of course also on the internal pressure, that is why closed batteries work, needs more than plug the holes however.

The tension is also dependant on the plate composition, that is why some batteries gas sooner than others. Therefore batteries gas "between" 14.1 and 14.4 V

You are right however the gassing potential is a barrier value, not a band, once over the gas potential for that given battery, it will not stop gassing when you go up the voltage ladder, it will even not stop gassing if you lower the voltage to below were it started.

Go to far and to long into the gassing region and if the battery does not explode the plates will.

Recharge a battery once to often remaining under the gassing region and another half reaction plays havoc the sulfuric acid /lead sulphate pair will go to lead sulphate every time you do so, and kill the battery.

So I do not believe starter batteries are driven permanently under 70% of charge they would not be very longlived that way. I am confident most "house batteries" in RV are never charged from alternator beyond that point so need continuous additional charge from the grid to keep them healthy. No generator I know of has an adequate regulation system to charge batteries as due. So many RV house batteries die prematurely I fear.

The Adverc system actually cycles in and out the gassing region and will in my view if sensing the house battery voltage charge that almost as due, killing the starter battery in the process...maybe not to fast. If it senses the starter battery voltage it will charge that almost as due, but will not do much good to get the house battery full.

Discussing with outlets of several vans we considered in this project it is rather clear to me that none of the major car manufacturers uses still in their newer makes the classical constant voltage regulator concept for their alternators. Most coin that their alternators are "microprocessor driven, are positive you should not tamper with the regulation of the alternator and one even flatly refused to sell us their van if we would put anything else than the 74 Ah secondary battery they carry as an option.

The stirling approach is in sofar less disturbing for a microprocessor regulated alternator (if controlled in feedback) that it will be looked into as an additional consumer appliance linked to the starter battery. In principle that will pull the tension at the terminals of the starter battery down to between 13 and 14V, or even below 13 V but Stirling himself cites 13 V at the inlet as a reference. At the outlet a microprocessor based charger what essentially the B to B C is can apply the right charging curve as programmed independently of the input tension. 
As the alternator senses the the starter battery that is delivering in a heavy load its regulator (if feedback regulated) will open the throttle fully 
trying to get the starter battery full again, what will not work as long as the stirling is "stealing" power.

Kind regards 
Marcel

just corrected a few typos, 
here goes Georges reply
Hi Marcel

Yep I get the chemical side but for the Charge to move into plates gas is formed, at a voltage low enough not to cause the gas bubbles no charge occurs.

I would say post on board, I don't like all this lets mail in background, if someone os going to be abusive they should be dealt with by mods.

Regards

George

And a response...

I do not see why transfer of charges from outside to inside would need higher applied voltages. I have in my ham days charged lead-acid with an home made wind generator, without noticeable gassing an yet got enough juice into it to drive the dynamotor of the set.

But agreed if you go for fast charge high voltage High amp you will have plenty of gas even with less than 14 V on the battery terminals. That because of unequal charge distribution along the plates. If you for lab measurement you will see noticeable potential differences not only from top to bottom of a plate but even on spots at the same height of a plate. The golden rules about not raising the charge current above a given % of the rating of the batteries is not under discussion.

The pro's and the cons of living with partially filled batteries is. And there definitely I doubt if for longevity to content with only 70 % of charge for longer period is wise.


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## 89043 (May 12, 2005)

*to webbobin*

A bit astonished by what you quote about connecting starter and house batteries together tot the B+ of the alternator. 
What about draining the starter battery. 
What about what i was always told not to parallel batteries of different makes or even of the same make but different ages? In sofar that i I live with the conviction that it is less error prone to get higher capacity by connecting high capacity low voltage batteries in series than connecting low capacity batteries of the right potential in parallel.

Did I get it all wrong?


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Hi Marcel, 

My post in this thread you are referring to was not a warning but actually an observation on how well everyone has conducted themselves so far. There have been a few occasions in the past where discussions involving electrics, invertors, batteries etc have got a bit personal and dare I say 'out of hand' and not in keeping with the friendly manner of the site and unfortunately have had to be moderated. I think quite a few members will know what i'm talking about here.. 
As George said, there is absolutely no need to mail each other in the background, the forum is designed for healthy exchanges of views in public and as long as the exchange is conducted in a friendly and respectful manner it will (and does) thrive. 
It must be difficult to keep a calm head when so many experts get together, have differing opinions and proffesional pride sometimes clouds the issue, you guys have conducted yourselves in an exemplary fashion and i congratulate you for that. 

Even if i haven't the foggiest idea what you're talking about.... :roll: 

pete.


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## 89043 (May 12, 2005)

*OK Pete*

Hi Pete, although new on this list, I have been around on the web for long, so noticed, in this discussion, the little spikes, that can lead to a "flame" but as you said it all remained well within bounds as it should, if there was not difference of opinions we would not need discussion boards, nor the internet, maybe not even RV's as we could all stay at home, as all would be equal and the same everywhere.
Kind Regards
Marcel


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## Road_Runner_644 (May 9, 2005)

Hi All

I've been watching this with interest as I have a setup which will need an answer to the problem of replacing or matching battery use in a non hookup situation.

I/We have a hymer with 2 x 110v leisure batteries, a 100W solar panel with a Fox regulator that charges the leisure setup then changes to the vehicle battery. There is a 2000w invertor, that happily runs a microwave, hair dryer, kettle, and anything else that needs 220/240v. The problem comes when running the hungrier appliances like the microwave or kettle, especially in the evening if the batteries have taken a hammering during the day, and the solar panel hasn't kept up. The setup is handled by a relay that switches from hook up power to invertor power, defaulting to hook up power if it is sensed.

I like the idea of putting a good chunk of power back into the batteries with the alternator, even if it means a regular check of the electrolyte level, as every time I check it at the moment, no top up is ever needed.

We are doing rock concerts this summer for the kids sake and not our own, but there will be hair dryers used every day, microwave used every day as well as the low wattage pull of LCD TV, phone chargers, mp3 players, etc.

We have a Honda 1K genny, which runs quietly and will supply enough power to run the built in battery charger (10amp), and enough in reserve to keep the need for normal use of lights , TV and the other small stuff, but when it comes to the high wattage items the genny gets pulled, and trips out.

I have noticed that the max power I get from the alternator to the leisure battery setup is about 15 amps. So even if I start the engine when running the 800w microwave (drawing 1200w) the alternator even though capable of making this amount of power, delivers a shortfall because of the way the charge to the leisure batteries is regulated. 

I think the sterling setup would be the best for me, delivering more charge at the expense of a little more checking of the batteries. In fact, with the price of a 110ah leisure battery being as low as £26 at some shows, the prospect of replacing them every 2 years isn't really a problem. 

I take on board the comments about overcharging and electrolyte loss, my batteries are properly vented, and I am willing to change them on a regular basis (every 2 years) to keep up with my needs.

I'm no expert, I understand VIH, and I'm G0UHI for the radio guys on this thread, and want to pull 20 amps from the vehicle battery in the evenings to talk to anyone on 80m when I'm away.

Please comment, I think i have made up my mind, and can't see any problems.

Dave


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## 89043 (May 12, 2005)

Hi Dave, 
Even if I am a new kid on the block, not that more a kid in general and with some expertise in electricity and electronics... as the experts remains silent for the moment, let me give you what i learned sofar...
In the classic setup with nothing between the separator relay and the house bank to regulate the charge you get from alternator alone and while the starter battery is in control you get at best up to 80 % but maybe only 70 % of charge in the batteries. Advanced alternator tuning will you give little more as long as the starter battery remains on the charge circuit (should not advice you to disconnect it). I actually found two appliances on the market (webbobin wrote there were many but I have neither confirmation or detail) that apply different charging regimes to the starter and the house batteries when supplied from an alternator.
One is US from Balmar Digital Duo charge. As far as I see that one puts the house battery in command, what might be fine in marine application where the starter battery is only used for the starting motor. Not so however in automotive applications.
The second one is the Sterling Battery to Battery charger, connected between the separator outlet and the house bank that would (mind I have only read about it, never seen one, and got sofar no user reports from one who had one) apply independently of the input voltage a well defined charge regime (selectable after the type of batteries used) to the house batteries. Good thing is also that the setup would draw current from the starter battery thus forcing the alternator to regulate up and run at full capacity. The will mean that will have to go to an overrated alternator to be sure it supplies the required supplementary output over extended period of time. 
The explanation Stirling gives on its site seems sound to me. Looks as if the unit is failsafe, I would yet put adequate fuses on both sides. And do not forget to rate the wires to adequate gauge. Make sure also that the common ground between both battery banks is an adequate conductive path. (I know this an ham operator you know about as much as me - by the way I have spent in a former life nights on the 80 , 20 and 10 meter, let go my licence years ago, might return to it now that i get more "leisure", more not much). 
You note that the batteries are adequately vented and that should be so, as well charged a battery has to go at the end of cycle into the gassing region, to keep it health, so that than men need a pushup or two once in a while to keep the pump primed.
THat is one reason no to live with batteries not charged up to the mark for more than a day or two. Without regular full charge from the grid, house batteries only supplied to 80% or under by the alternator will soon become senile.

Webbobin made a very sensitive remark: if the housebattery is under charge, you cannot depend on it to keep your DC supply stable. If you run equipment sensible to overcharge you will have either to run that from a DC-DC or keep it off while the batteries are charging. Most 12 V equipment is rated to work as well under as above the standard supply voltage. I suppose in your actual there are no good old 807's anymore because their heaters did not like overvoltage to much.

Sofar my summary. If you go for a Stirling I would like to hear of hands on experience. The nearest dealer to my place is either in the Netherlands or in France an nice RV trip away so I will have to startup without. Maybe overcautious, but I do not trust "mail delivery" for hardware, want to see and feel the real stuff and if possible the guy (or gal) who will give me support if need be before I buy. 

Marcel


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## Road_Runner_644 (May 9, 2005)

Hi Marcel

Thanks for the reply. Yet again I was all up for spending a few days away this easter without hookup, because we hadn't booked anywhere, and expected to end up on a rally field somewhere. But yet again Mrs Roadrunner came up trumps and found us a hookup hours before we left on thursday, so I couldn't experiment with my battery setup :-(

The sterling battery to battery charger seems expensive compared with their advanced alternator regulator. There doesn't seem to be too much difference in the performance of the two. I have printed the spec sheets out for both and i'll have a bit more of a study, before i make my mind up.

Perhaps the battery to battery product is slightly easier to fit, and may save a trip to the auto electrician.

I'll let you know how i get on, i will certianly have something fitted within the next month or so.

As for the radio, i've still not fitted any ant's to this van, but really enjoyed last year in France, when i got on 40m and 80m mobile quite a bit. With just a outbacker mobile antenna on the roof of the old Granduca coachbuilt, i got talking to most of the UK and into Belgium, Germany and Holland during the day, as well as quite a few Foxtrots.

The only small mistake i made was not realising that the french motorway bridges were lower than ours (is it 6 or 10cms?) - anyway, i lost the top of the steel whip somewhere around Nantes :-(

Regards

Dave


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## 89043 (May 12, 2005)

*battery to battery vd advanced alternator regulation*

Hi Dave,
Two very different items, and two very different result:
the alternator regulator is meant to service one set of batteries, applying another charge program than the one provided by the car manufacturer... not wise without prior consent of that party.

The battery to battery charger is meant to leave the alternator take care of the starter battery charge program, yet apply a different programme to the second set of batteries. In principle that cannot intervene with the car electronics (mind however the higher voltages applied to the house electronics however or provide propper stabilisation between those and supply).

The price difference oroginates in the presence of a high power DC output stage in the battery charger: the alternator regulator is essentially only the low power programmed power supply that drives the output stage in the battery to battery charger.

Autoroute bridges can be tricky... try the "gorges du Tarn" for a change,
did those with a rented Granduca, Lucky to have distance sensors on top op the "alcove" so I did not loose the roof... yet became crazy of the beep-beep... was where we made the decision to go for a less voluminous solution... rented some of the smaller ones (Westfalia and some no-brand on a Citroen bases) decided after all that we will have to get something custom built to get what we want , that is where the actual transporter project started... so I passed the Easter WE (less the part with my grandchildren in the garden) over blueprints and accesory lists... will plan in a transceiver... have to find out if I can get my license back without having to pass the code exam over... my morse is a bit as my hair: most ot it is lost... as lost as the end of your whip antenna I fear.

Sleep wel
Marcel


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## Road_Runner_644 (May 9, 2005)

Hi Marcel

Yet again, I appreciate the comments.

On the radio side - we are code free over here now, and I pretty sure you are over there. So i would have thought your original exam would be more than enough to get you back with the full bandplan. I wouldn't like my morse code scrutinised too closely these days either.

We also got the 7.1 to 7.2 bit on 40 now as well.

Good luck with the project.

Dave


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## 89043 (May 12, 2005)

*Will give it a try,*

Thanks Dave for the info,
Will be on touch
Marcel


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