# Italian Lakes Best bits



## barryd

We are off on Saturday. Mosel Valley, Switzerland then maybe Italy and the lakes. We have only been to Maggiore before in early July 2009. Its likely if we do head that way that it will be early July like last time. 

I have been researching through the database and the camping infos website and it seems the sostas and sites are cramped and expensive. Now bearing in mind we have a scooter we would like to discover the best bits of the lakes but leave the van somewhere quiet and cheap! 

Everyone seems to flock to Garda it seems but then everyone flocks to Windermere in our lake disrict and its by far my least favourite lake. We prefer the wilder and quieter north lakes. so does the same apply in Italy? Are there any quieter places to see and stay at? I have found a few sostas that sound ok and dont appear too expensive on the web and on here so far but they seem thin on the ground. Have found no reference to wild spots whatsoever.

Any ideas?

Thanks
Barry


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## Zebedee

Hi Barry

Without wishing to offend anyone, the Italians seem to behave like a flock of lazy sheep at times. :roll:

They all follow each other to the nearest and easiest campsite - possibly because each one thinks the others "_know something_"!

We haven't been to Italy much recently, but we always used to find out which was the popular side of the lake and go round the other side. 8)

It seemed to work well. Half the price, half the crowding, and with your scooter it shouldn't be a problem to pop round to the "good side" and enjoy it during the day.

Eddied will be the one to ask I guess, since he lives there.

You are quite right about the popularity of Garda and a few other "big name" lakes. The little ones further north are just as nice in our opinion, not that we have been to many of them.

Dave


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## Rapide561

*Garda*

Barry

Garda is popular - but....from my recent visit a few weeks ago, I noted that the sites at Peschiera del Garda were packed and jammed - it was awful. The sites at Manerba del Garda were a lot quieter - and still only about 10 miles to Desenzano from where you can get the train to Venice, Verona or Milan.

I really liked Camping Baia Verde - we returned there three times - swimming pool. spa pool, bar, decent restaurant etc all for 15 euro with ACSI.

For me, in future, I will stay only at the south end when I need to get a train, otherwise it is Manerba. I have also stayed many times at Moniga in the past - again quite quiet

Russell


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## ardgour

Try lake Orta - the most beautiful place in northern Italy. I seem to remember someone recommending a place on lake Iseo not too long ago, possibly in the database. July and August are hell on earth around the campsites of the Italian lakes, all the Italians, Germans and Dutch have the same idea and you can't move for vans.
good luck

Chris


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## barryd

Thanks.

IT is a worry that it will be too busy. I suppose its a quick dash through the Mont Blanc tunnel to France though!


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## Zebedee

barryd said:


> Thanks.
> 
> IT is a worry that it will be too busy. I suppose its a quick dash through the Mont Blanc tunnel to France though!


An expensive dash Barry!!! 8O

Check the cost before you get too enthusiastic.

Dave


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## DaveJM

We have stayed at Manerba del Garda - pitches are relatively small but on terraces so you get a wonderful view of the lake, particulary at night with a glass in hand.

A short walk from the site, 10 mins or so along the lake, there is a pleasant and reasonable restaurant right on the waters edge.

Enjoy your trip,


David


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## barryd

ardgour said:


> Try lake Orta - the most beautiful place in northern Italy. I seem to remember someone recommending a place on lake Iseo not too long ago, possibly in the database. July and August are hell on earth around the campsites of the Italian lakes, all the Italians, Germans and Dutch have the same idea and you can't move for vans.
> good luck
> 
> Chris


Thanks. I have missed Orta until now. Found it and 2 free sostas with dodgy roads into them (dont care about that) and a campsite. It sounds and looks right up our street.


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## ardgour

barryd said:


> ardgour said:
> 
> 
> 
> Try lake Orta - the most beautiful place in northern Italy. I seem to remember someone recommending a place on lake Iseo not too long ago, possibly in the database. July and August are hell on earth around the campsites of the Italian lakes, all the Italians, Germans and Dutch have the same idea and you can't move for vans.
> good luck
> 
> Chris
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. I have missed Orta until now. Found it and 2 free sostas with dodgy roads into them (dont care about that) and a campsite. It sounds and looks right up our street.
Click to expand...

The sosta on Sacro Monte at Orta is lovely but don't go at the weekend, it gets very busy. I think I did put in the review that if there are 2 of you the passenger should jump out and check the coast is clear then drive in through the exit and straight along to the sosta parking. Otherwise it is a difficult twisty road in and you will end up shuffling to get round the corner.
In Orta the Cafe Albino does wonderful polenta with grilled local cheese and vegetables

Chris


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## barryd

ardgour said:


> barryd said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ardgour said:
> 
> 
> 
> Try lake Orta - the most beautiful place in northern Italy. I seem to remember someone recommending a place on lake Iseo not too long ago, possibly in the database. July and August are hell on earth around the campsites of the Italian lakes, all the Italians, Germans and Dutch have the same idea and you can't move for vans.
> good luck
> 
> Chris
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks. I have missed Orta until now. Found it and 2 free sostas with dodgy roads into them (dont care about that) and a campsite. It sounds and looks right up our street.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> The sosta on Sacro Monte at Orta is lovely but don't go at the weekend, it gets very busy. I think I did put in the review that if there are 2 of you the passenger should jump out and check the coast is clear then drive in through the exit and straight along to the sosta parking. Otherwise it is a difficult twisty road in and you will end up shuffling to get round the corner.
> In Orta the Cafe Albino does wonderful polenta with grilled local cheese and vegetables
> 
> Chris
Click to expand...

Sounds great. I feel a plan coming on. Through the tunnel to Cannobio on Maggiore, 3 nights on the Sosta then a trip over to Orta (during the week). Take it from there. What are the roads like on the other side of Orta where the other sosta is. Also. How come they appear to be free over there?

Im beginning to sound like a tight Yorkshireman but I just cant bring myself to part with £40+ for a campsite!


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## ardgour

As far as I remember there is a small charge for Cannobio sosta. The one on sacro monte at Orta was free last time I was there (few months back) but the one at the bottom of the hill has a charge. If the other one you are talking about is up the hill west of the lake, the roads are narrow but very little traffic. There is a good agritourismo not far south of there, (amarant it is in the database) that is part of the fattore amico scheme but if you check their website I think all are welcome. If you do go across into France from there use the road past Turin and over the pass - it is pretty and free. Plenty of aires just over the border in France

Chris


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## barryd

ardgour said:


> As far as I remember there is a small charge for Cannobio sosta. The one on sacro monte at Orta was free last time I was there (few months back) but the one at the bottom of the hill has a charge. If the other one you are talking about is up the hill west of the lake, the roads are narrow but very little traffic. There is a good agritourismo not far south of there, (amarant it is in the database) that is part of the fattore amico scheme but if you check their website I think all are welcome. If you do go across into France from there use the road past Turin and over the pass - it is pretty and free. Plenty of aires just over the border in France
> 
> Chris


Yes thats the one, on the other side of the lake up the hill (near a church?) its in the database and on camping infos. Ive also been to the Cannobio one before I think it was 12 euros.

Im not too clued up on Italy can you tell me what a Agritourismo is and what the Fattore Amico scheme is? Im guessing its like France Passion?

When we go back into France we want to go to Chamonix and up Mont Blanc (in the cable car not the van) so I was just going to go through the tunnel. I know it costs about 40 euros. Are the motorways expensive?

sorry too many questions!

Thanks


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## Lesleykh

We found the southern end of Garda over-developed when we were there in March. The massive campsites were largely closed then though we could tell they wouldn't be to our taste.

We much preferred Lake Iseo. We stayed on the small campsite - Punts D'oro - at Iseo. Camping Punta D'oro

It was a lovely site, just a short stroll into the very pretty town, where there are lots of cafes/restaurants and ferries around the lake. Very friendly. Good facilities. They speak good English and will take bookings.

Have a look on their website and our blog.

Have a great trip.

Lesley


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## danielf

*Italian Lakes,*

Thanks Barry & All,

Useful Info !

You saved me a posting! we are of that way in a couple of weeks, planning on spending a few days in Switzerland, a week around Lake Maggiore area, then a few days drifting back to Dunkerque...

If anyone is that way look out for English Registered old Pilote.....

Daniel.


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## Zebedee

barryd said:


> I was just going to go through the tunnel. I know it costs about 40 euros. Are the motorways expensive?


Have you ever been over the top Barry?

If not, forget the tunnel and choose one of the smaller alpine passes where it has not been ultra modernised into a motorway with sweeping gentle curves and no character!! :roll:

It will be a much slower transit, but one you will never forget, especially the night spent at the top in perfect isolation overlooking a high Alpine lake.

Priceless!!! 

Dave


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## ardgour

It's Ok Barry, better to ask the questions now. The Italian motorways are very good and much cheaper than the french ones. In that north west corner they are not too busy and many of the service areas have very good water and grey/ black waste disposal areas. The normal roads are so narrow and twisty that it takes ages and is quite stressful in a large vehicle.
If you are heading down the A26 to pick up the A4 across towards Aosta and Mont Blanc watch out for the field of zebras on your right - I thought I was seeing things first time we went past  
At the junction of A26/ A4 there is the Vicolungo outlet village (well signposted). Its an experience even if you don 't like shopping. Lots of Italian designer outlets and a couple of LIndt chocolate shops where they have a sort of coffee bar that serves chocolate drinks. Worth trying just for the experience but the chocoate is no cheaper than the supermarket. Plenty of parking for a large van if you avoid Sundays.
Aosta has a sosta (sounds like a bad limerick) closed Tuesday morning for the market. The cable car at Aosta gives good views across monte rosa, mont blanc and the matterhorn from the top. Large car park suitable for MH at cable car station and large supermarket next door.
Agritourismos are farms that take visitors, usually a restaurant and possibly bed and breakfast or camping area and many have other activities.
Fattore Amico is the Italian version of france passion. It started in the Milan area so a higher concentration of places in the north but it is growing. We haven't joined this year because we won't have the van out there but last year there were about 350 places in the book. Unlike france passion they give exact coordinates to find the places.
Finally, if you are into such things the community at Damanhur is in a valley just north of Turin. Contact them through their website if you want to visit the underground temples. It is not cheap but is an experience. They have a sosta (in the Guida Camper) and I think it was 6 euros/ night last year inc EHU.
Hope that helps, any more questions just ask 

Chris


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## barryd

Great info thanks

Chris. Do you want to be our tour Guide?

so it looks like Maggiore, Orta, Maybe a bit of Como an Iseo. Might give Garda a miss.

Dont know Dave if I wil go over the top. I would love to do it and have no fear of stuff like that but our aging Kontiki might. On the Simplon pass last time the brakes started to fade going down which wasnt pleasant. Will see how I feel at the time. The Idea of staying the night on the top definately appeals!

Smashing!

2 days to go.


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## Zebedee

barryd said:


> On the Simplon pass last time the brakes started to fade going down which wasnt pleasant.


Last time we went OTT we found so many unmissable stopping places the brakes had plenty of time to cool. _(Mrs Zeb's camera sounded like a machine gun!! :roll: )_

Have a good trip, whatever you decide.

Dave


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## ardgour

Zebedee said:


> barryd said:
> 
> 
> 
> I was just going to go through the tunnel. I know it costs about 40 euros. Are the motorways expensive?
> 
> 
> 
> Have you ever been over the top Barry?
> 
> If not, forget the tunnel and choose one of the smaller alpine passes where it has not been ultra modernised into a motorway with sweeping gentle curves and no character!! :roll:
> 
> It will be a much slower transit, but one you will never forget, especially the night spent at the top in perfect isolation overlooking a high Alpine lake.
> 
> Priceless!!!
> 
> Dave
Click to expand...

Like Barry we had problems with the brakes going over the Semplon pass last autumn so are wary of the passes but we will be taking the van out there late August to pack up the appartment and leave Italy for the final time so it would be nice to end in style by going 'over the top' into France. Do you have a recommendation for a route over the top avoiding the Mont Blanc tunnel? (with that picturesque overnight stop of course).

For those who chicken out and use the tunnel there is a really nice Aire just the other side next to a railway station in a small village - sorry can't remember the name but I might even have been clever and put it in the database!

Chris

sorry can't find it in the database but I think it was St Gervais le Bains


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## barryd

ardgour said:


> Zebedee said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> barryd said:
> 
> 
> 
> I was just going to go through the tunnel. I know it costs about 40 euros. Are the motorways expensive?
> 
> 
> 
> Have you ever been over the top Barry?
> 
> If not, forget the tunnel and choose one of the smaller alpine passes where it has not been ultra modernised into a motorway with sweeping gentle curves and no character!! :roll:
> 
> It will be a much slower transit, but one you will never forget, especially the night spent at the top in perfect isolation overlooking a high Alpine lake.
> 
> Priceless!!!
> 
> Dave
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Like Barry we had problems with the brakes going over the Semplon pass last autumn so are wary of the passes but we will be taking the van out there late August to pack up the appartment and leave Italy for the final time so it would be nice to end in style by going 'over the top' into France. Do you have a recommendation for a route over the top avoiding the Mont Blanc tunnel? (with that picturesque overnight stop of course).
> 
> For those who chicken out and use the tunnel there is a really nice Aire just the other side next to a railway station in a small village - sorry can't remember the name but I might even have been clever and put it in the database!
> 
> Chris
Click to expand...

Oh I wish you hadnt used the word "Chicken Out" 

Is that the Aire on the Chamonix side?


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## Zebedee

ardgour said:


> Do you have a recommendation for a route over the top avoiding the Mont Blanc tunnel? (with that picturesque overnight stop of course).


Just off to fit a new window in my friend's caravan.

Will reply later.

Dave


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## markpark

*yes I agree*

The italians are lazy


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## TheHewsonFamily

We also stayed at Peschiera del Garda campsite about a month ago and it was packed with kids and not very peaceful. The town is okay; it has a small, historic centre but nothing to go out of your way to see.

We much preferred a little lake that we found near Trento called Lago di Caldonazzo. Very beautiful and has a really nice campsite called Punta Indiana ( http://www.campingpuntaindiani.it/main.php?lingua=gb ). There is a train line that runs close by (it seems that we managed to find all the campsites with train lines nearby) so park away from the reception for a quieter night.


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## Zebedee

Hi Barry and Ardgour

I'm a big disappointment I'm afraid - can't remember which pass it was where we had such a wonderful overnight by a massive lake. :roll:  

It might have been the Grand St Bernard, but I'm not at all sure.

Best thing is to have a look on Google Maps so you can easily switch between map and satellite. Then you should be able to find somewhere that looks good.

There are usually plenty of places to pull off the road, except in the rockiest sections. Near the lakes there is always somewhere.

Have fun.

Dave


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## ardgour

Ah that elusive stopping place that we can never find again - we all have one of those hiding somewhere


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## barryd

No worries. Im sure we will find all sorts of wonderful new places.

Cheers
BD


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## Zebedee

ardgour said:


> Ah that elusive stopping place that we can never find again - we all have one of those hiding somewhere


There was a large and very friendly family of Italians there and they invited us over for after-dinner nibbles (_quaint but very enjoyable idea_!) and coffee with grappa.

Correction - it was grappa with coffee :roll: and I had to shove Mrs Zeb up the steps of the van afterwards, and she fell into bed with half her clothes still on. 

That might be why I can't remember where it was!! 8O 8O

Dave


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## barryd

Zebedee said:


> ardgour said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ah that elusive stopping place that we can never find again - we all have one of those hiding somewhere
> 
> 
> 
> There was a large and very friendly family of Italians there and they invited us over for after-dinner nibbles (_quaint but very enjoyable idea_!) and coffee with grappa.
> 
> Correction - it was grappa with coffee :roll: and I had to shove Mrs Zeb up the steps of the van afterwards, and she fell into bed with half her clothes still on.
> 
> That might be why I can't remember where it was!! 8O 8O
> 
> Dave
Click to expand...

Those kind of moments are magical. I was once lost on a motorbike in the Greek Islands and a really old Greek chap came wondering out of his house, discovered I was English and invited me into his Garden where his equally doddery wife served us Tea, Cakes and Ouzo! The old guy spoke English and had been to England as his Daughter married an English man (very Unusual).

Turned out he had been a member of the resitance in the war!

His directions were crap though as I ended up even more lost an hour later!


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## spatz1

out of interest,
bar a bit of nice schenery, what does guarda in particular have to offer someone in a motorhome ? From my experience its the playground for the wealthy and many of its facilities in that respect will never be used or even glimpsed upon ! I did manage to wildcamp it on the east side under a tree by a rocky "beach" but having dropped across from the other lake and the 3 chimney mountains from austria ,it was my least enjoyable bit of the trip.......went on to cross the alps via colle de la bonnet which is 3882 meters high (12000ft) and camped at top which can only be described as sureal and should be on everones bucket list !.


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## eddied

*Lago di Viverone & Mt. Cenis pass*

 Ciao tutti, over in the N.W. corner of Italy (Piemonte) there is a less well known lake. Not been there myself but reccomended by a member here; and by the Italian equivalent of MHF
www.camperonline.it

Lago di Viverone, in the Province of Biella.
There are three campsites around the lake.

As for the elusive OTT stopping place by a lake.

That could be the Mont Cenis pass, which goes fom Italy into France via the SS 25 route. I used to go this way before the A32 motorway leading to the Frejus road tunnel was opened. Very spectacular, and parking places aound the lake. However, this was with very small vans. Camperonline users report that the pass is still viable for larger motorhomes. Remember before the road tunnel it was used by HGVs as well. Haven't been over myself in years.
saluti,
eddied


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## Zebedee

*Re: Lago di Viverone & Mt. Cenis pass*



eddied said:


> As for the elusive OTT stopping place by a lake.
> That could be the Mont Cenis pass, which goes fom Italy into France via the SS 25 route.


You are little short of a genius Eddie . . . it was indeed the Mont Cenis! :wink: 

What a wonderful experience it was too - except for a couple of heart stopping moments when we met one of those HGVs, in the middle of the road. (There will be very few of those now though - they was some construction work going on near the top when we went over!!)



eddied said:


> Lago di Viverone, in the Province of Biella.
> There are three campsites around the lake.


Yep - we've been to that one and very pleasant it was too.

Stayed at Camping Haway ( 45.40579, 8.03193 ) which was a bit scruffy round the edges but perfectly OK and had a very friendly and welcoming bar/restaurant overlooking the lake. It had a lot of permanent vans and their sheds were a bit "rustic", but it was a very homely and we wouldn't hesitate to go there again.

Hope this helps Barry . . . I'm glad Eddie managed to jog my ancient memory. :roll:

You really should try the Mont Cenis while you still can. I don't expect it will be maintained very well for much longer.

Dave :wink:


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## barryd

*Re: Lago di Viverone & Mt. Cenis pass*



Zebedee said:


> eddied said:
> 
> 
> 
> As for the elusive OTT stopping place by a lake.
> That could be the Mont Cenis pass, which goes fom Italy into France via the SS 25 route.
> 
> 
> 
> You are little short of a genius Eddie . . . it was indeed the Mont Cenis! :wink:
> 
> What a wonderful experience it was too - except for a couple of heart stopping moments when we met one of those HGVs, in the middle of the road. (There will be very few of those now though - they was some construction work going on near the top when we went over!!)
> 
> 
> 
> eddied said:
> 
> 
> 
> Lago di Viverone, in the Province of Biella.
> There are three campsites around the lake.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Yep - we've been to that one and very pleasant it was too.
> 
> Stayed at Camping Haway ( 45.40579, 8.03193 ) which was a bit scruffy round the edges but perfectly OK and had a very friendly and welcoming bar/restaurant overlooking the lake. It had a lot of permanent vans and their sheds were a bit "rustic", but it was a very homely and we wouldn't hesitate to go there again.
> 
> Hope this helps Barry . . . I'm glad Eddie managed to jog my ancient memory. :roll:
> 
> You really should try the Mont Cenis while you still can. I don't expect it will be maintained very well for much longer.
> 
> Dave :wink:
Click to expand...

Thanks guys. Will put it on the list of possible trips.

24 hours to go and guess what? After being quiet for two weeks, Im suddenly in demand. Its almost like people know Im going away and leave it until the day before to call on my services. Currently knee deep in a virus removal on a network in Barnard Castle!

ARGGHHHH!


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## barryd

Update

can't thank you enough especially Chris for the lake Orta recommendation. We have done como, Lugano, maggiore and orta. Lake Orta is splendid very pretty and full of interesting places to see. We are at the top sosta on sacra monte Which is fine. Drove right round the lake on the bike including right up to the other sosta way up In th hills which was awsome.

Now in the next day or two we will head towards Mont Blanc and chamonix. two questions. Is this the really bad traffic weekend coming up and should wr wait until Monday? Is there ant quiet picturesque places to stay between here and Mont blanc? I know chris has already mentioned a few options.

I will update the blog soon (if Anyone is reading it with details of our fun time in Italy including holding up tv presidential motorcade on como.

We Have loved Italy and it seems a shame to leg it wes to France Any ideas of a ciouple of nice stops appreciated

cheers
bd


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## barryd

Sorry for the errors. I'm not p$seed it's this stupid iPhone and mobile mhf!


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## ardgour

Shame you are moving on this week Barry - there is a food festival around the Aosta/ Mont Blanc area next weekend (23rd/24th) I have a leaflet somewhere but can't remember the exact details.
I arrive at Lake Maggiore on Tuesday, flying in for the last time, I will wave as I fly over the top of you :lol: 
Glad you enjoyed Orta

Chris


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## barryd

Cheers chris

what's the sosta at aosta like?

I know you posted earlier About the cable car etc. 

Not in a hurry to leave. Would just like somewhere to chill for a night or two between here and France. Preferably not a campsite

thanks again


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## grenwelly

Molveno may be worth a stop over for a day or two
Nice camp site and also stopover van park
About 30 miles north of Lake Garda


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## barryd

Thanks grenwelly but we are heading west from Orta so it's the wrong direction if it's near Garda


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## eddied

*Suggestion*

 Have a tootle around Lake Viverone on the way to Aosta.
Watch out for heavy traffoc through the tunnel over weekends. You can get radio reports from Isoradio FM 103.3
Along the Valle d'Aosta plenty of soste, including
Fenis - just opposite the Hotel Conte di Challond
Cogne - 2 soste nearby in area of Lillaz
Aosta town centre N.45.7359 E.7.329983 (via Caduti del Lavoro)
Courmayeur - near cable car station for Val Veney

I can also reccomend the cable car ascent of M.Blanc/Aiguille de Midi from Courmayeur, better than from Chamonix.
saluti,
eddied


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## barryd

Eddied thanks

this is great thanks.

I'm struggling to get online here but that's good info. We were thinking of doing the cable car ride from chamonix. In fact that was the reason for going. If there is one from the italian side then that might be worth a go. I think the chamonix one is about 40 euros each, do you know how the aosta one compares price wise?

Will get the laptop out and start studying the sostas and autoroute.

The problem with going up on the cable Cars of course is the weather. Whilst it's been warm and often sunny we have seldom had a clear day and loads of thunder


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## ardgour

Found the leaflet about the Mont Blanc International food and wine festival 23rd/24th July. Website is www.lesgoutsdumontblanc.com
It is in french and italian but fairly straightforward

Chris

oops - just read back through the thread, the sosta in Aosta is no great shakes, just a car park where the weekly market is held on Tuesdays but if you wanted to be in the town it is useful. I would try one of the others mentioned by Eddied


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## barryd

Thanks chris

going to check out the lake edied mentioned. There is a sosta by lake and one a scooter ride away. Looks like the valle aosta might be quite interesting. Spent a good couple of hours marrying up the places and sostAs mentioned using the offline version of camping car infos and autoroute

looks like we have a bit of a plan.

Thanks again


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## barryd

Hi

after hours of driving and not gettig very far (none toll roads) we ende up at Hone not far up the Aosta valley. What. Cracking sosta it is to. 8 euros Including ehu and water on pitch.

Definately want to do the cable car but weather is iffy. Wednesday looks the best day. Does anyone know if you need to book or when we get a good day can we just turn up?

Looks like a few good places to explore and a few sostAs. May stay her though tomorrow if weather is bad


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## eddied

*Monte Bianco*

 Buon giorno e Buona Domenica.
no, you don't need to book. Departures every 20 minutes in July. You can do all the stages to Aiguille du Midi for €64 return. You can also do just intermediate stages if you wish. You can also do a complete round trip as far as Chamonix, returning to Courmayeur by coach through the tunnel, for €99.
You can find all you need to know about Mt.Blanc here :

www.montebianco.com

enjoy.
saluti,
eddied


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## barryd

Many thanks eddied again.

I think the weathers against us right now. It's like a wet bank holiday in the lake district back home!

Forecast is rubbish but possibly clear wednesday.

Is this normal? We seem to have had a lot of rain in July here.

Holed up in Hone watching telly in bed and watching the torrent flowing town the mountain behind us.


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## ardgour

Yep July can be pretty awful in that area - hot, humid, thundery and don't even mention the insect life! Hopefully you are far enough up to avoid the worst of it, which tends to be nearer the lakes. The flat we have been renting near Lake Maggiore has a lovely terrace and garden but you can't sit out in it at the moment because of the heat and insects - makes our lake district seem idyllic  

Chris


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## hmh

Somewhat off topic, but maybe the terrrasse is the problem.

We had friends with a house in France near us, they would turn up in the summer and hang troughs of geraniums from the balconies, and were soon surrounded by mosquitoes, who came for the water below the troughs, and the males, for the flowers.
We don't do this, and have hardly any mosquitoes . . .

Plenty of thunderstorms in July though, especially near a river or a lake.

Helen


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## barryd

Thanks

we were lucky in the Italian lakes as despite a lot of showers and thunder It was mainly warm and sunny. I've been bitten all over but michelle hasn't. Only difference was I seemed to spend most of my time on or In the water.

Going to move up to aosta town and courmayeur eventually tomorrow regardless of the weather. Looks like all the sostas are hard standing.

Just one more question. Are we best ambling along the none toll road rather than the motorway up to courmayeur or does it get a bit steep and narrow further up? Not bothered in normal weather but if it's pouring down?


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## ardgour

I agree that having lots of plants around encourages the insect life but around lake Maggiore it is difficult to get away from lush greenery - it is part of what makes the area so attractive.
The area around the lake has its own micro climate with very little wind to discourage the insect life for most of the year, add in the heat and humidity at this time of year and the population explodes. There are a number of world famous gardens close to the lake which no doubt benefit from all the insects but the human population and visitors suffer.
We have industrial quantities of skin so soft out there as protection

Barry - if you got bitten it must be because you were the most tasty thing around :lol: think of it as a compliment
I haven't tried the little roads up in the Aosta area, I have only been up there in winter when attempting them would have been an act of madness

Chris


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