# 'Posh' Gypsies Arrive in La Marina



## Melly (Jul 5, 2007)

Just had a friend send me this link
Posh Gypsies
This may be why some local authorities are restricting motorhomes.


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## BIGLAD (Oct 8, 2007)

*La Marina*

We went for walk on beach am and counted about 80 mh in small area.
Each to there own,but when locals arrive, as is ritual for breakfast on beach christmas day.!
We must remember they pay rates and tax in Spain,how would we feel if we couldn,t park for ''POSH GYPSEYS''.
To be fair only 2 of the vans were Brits.


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## pneumatician (May 1, 2005)

*Posh Gypsies*

To be amongst these upper class Pikies would be my idea of Hell.
When we are away we want to be surrounded by pleasant scenery with perhaps a few fellow campers in the vicinity.
I would not appreciate parking on Tarmac, near Sand and with other vans within 10M (minimum) of me.

We have British friends who are also fellow campers and resident in France they state that this type of behavior is ruining it for everybody and will bring in more and more legislation.

Steve


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## 104477 (May 13, 2007)

*Re: La Marina*



BIGLAD said:


> We went for walk on beach am and counted about 80 mh in small area.
> Each to there own,but when locals arrive, as is ritual for breakfast on beach christmas day.!
> We must remember they pay rates and tax in Spain,how would we feel if we couldn,t park for ''POSH GYPSEYS''.
> To be fair only 2 of the vans were Brits.


To be fair we cannot park outside our house in the uk in the summer due to people visiting for the day even though there is a car park 30 metres away that is rarely full. We pay rates ,road tax etc. and these people pay little if anything into the local economy. 
As they are not driving motorhomes or tugging caravans we cannot brand them as "posh gypsies"
Most motorhomers staying some where will buy locally and even pay a car park/aire fee to do so.

Last xmas we stayed in Port St Louis and were the only Brits on site the rest were French and Dutch but we all left the place tidy and had spent our money in the local bakery, bars and assorted other shops.
Why is it that a group of like minded people, planned or unplanned, is seen as a detriment to the equilibrium of a local population? 
Quizzical Rob.


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## 04HBG (Dec 9, 2007)

The thing that amazes me is that whenever you see camper vans parked up abroad, continental or British, then the first complaints coming in are never ever from the locals but usualy from Brits who have bought properties nearby.
The continentals consider it their right to PARK in their own countries and always seem to welcome us Brits alongside for a few days so to me its a case of live and let live.
If you prefer a campsite then so be it you pays your money and takes your choice.


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## Suenliam (Mar 22, 2006)

Not sure on my attitude to this. However, I was amused to see the complaint about mass invasion on the same page as the advert for cheap import rates for British goods :? :? :? 

Sue


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## krull (Jul 22, 2006)

The British abroad....don't they make you proud  

I note on that web site that Age Concern have been giving hampers to pensioners living it up over there. 8O 

Thats the last time they get a penny off me


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## Andysam (May 10, 2005)

No doubt the "locals" there have severed all links except family with the UK and have transferred private and government pensions there, along with NHS rights.

It must be nice to take and hold the moral high ground :wink:


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## ingram (May 12, 2005)

Well, I must say. it is not an 'amount' of campervans it is a 'number', so the writer cannot be British otherwise such an appalling grammatical error would not have been made :roll:


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## putties (May 18, 2005)

I would have thought it better having MH.s rather than gypsies, What do they do in the summer when the holiday makers come. If yhats all they got to moan about move back home in the cold, wet and miserable


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## 38Rover (Nov 9, 2006)

I live in Spain and would not want that lot at the end of my road.
Have they ever heard of CAMP SITES they spend thousands on a Motorhome then hundreds on getting to Spain just so they can overnight for free load of tight wads.


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## Patsy (May 1, 2005)

If you want to wild camp take off into the hills and mountains and stop making life difficult for the majority who use campsites. Have a bit of decency ,put yourself in the position of a local and maybe you will act more responsible When abroad I cringe when I see mh parked along the sea front like the old wagon trains in westerns As I get closer I cringe even more when I see the pioners sitting outside with their tables and chairs bragging how much they have saved by not going on a site They have been well named posh gypsies or maybe just motorhomers who are too mean to pay a campsite fee


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## rayrecrok (Nov 21, 2008)

Patsy said:


> If you want to wild camp take off into the hills and mountains and stop making life difficult for the majority who use campsites. Have a bit of decency ,put yourself in the position of a local and maybe you will act more responsible When abroad I cringe when I see mh parked along the sea front like the old wagon trains in westerns As I get closer I cringe even more when I see the pioners sitting outside with their tables and chairs bragging how much they have saved by not going on a site They have been well named posh gypsies or maybe just motorhomers who are too mean to pay a campsite fee


Posh gypsies I cant see one vandalised car or tarmac van anywhere on the photo :lol:


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## Autoquest (May 16, 2007)

The joys of living in a free democracy i'm afraid  

at least until the eu gets involved :? :? :?


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## 97201 (Jan 7, 2006)

This from Camperian, at present staying at Camping Marjal just down the coast about 3k from La Marina. I have never seen so much twaddle posted on a thread before by people who like to spout without having the facts. Having seen the article, I took a drive over there yesterday and had a look.

There were more than eighty when I gave up counting and two more arrived while I was there.

80% yes 80%, are German. The rest in decending order are Begian, French and then 4 Brits. There is only one public toilet there for them to empty their waste.

They have filled up the car parks for the beach front cafe and the beach. 

On boxing day each year the cafe is closed and the owners allow a local jazz band to use the exterior to set up and play. The Spanish locals pack picnics and sit on the beach for the free concert. This has been going on for some years now and is becoming very popular with people from ALL aspects of the comunity. Unless these motorhomes are moved on, there will be no place to park. 

The place yesterday was an eyesore and I think the reason for more wild campers is the munincipal campsite that the authorities closed down and levelled last year. 

So stop knocking the Brits, whether property owners or campers, this time it's the European fraternity that is causing the problem.

As a correlation to this, I was having a conversation with the owner of the campsite restaurant and asked why they had employed an English chef and provide English dishes.

The answer is quite simple she told me, only the British have ever used the restaurant. Last week, they provided a free lunch as a thank you for those of us that are wintering out here.

You've guessed it! Out came the freeloaders that we normally wouldn't see, our European cousins.

Camperian


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Posh Gypsies*

Well, the authorities could if they like, make facilities available to the posh gypsies. In Cavaliere southern France for example, a place I have mentioned a few times on this forum. There is an Aire on the coast road a few feet from the beach. This Aire costs €15 per 24 hours. Its sits in a bay shared along side hundereds of very desirable residences.
Shame the climate is not so warm this time of year as I am sure but for the lack of daytime heat, most of the owners camper vans at "La Marina" would be there rather than Spain.

I can only see that people travel so far for the sun, after all why on earth anyone would want to stay there for such extended periods of time is beyond me. But hey ho, each to is or her own.

Another thing, what is the difference between a car parking near the beach over a motorhome?.

I guess the motorhomer(s) will stay longer and in-turn spend more in the local shops.

Well this reminds me of a post I replied to earlier today regarding the Arch Bishop. So if you are wealthy enough to be able to own a property in Spain, maybe in addition to one in your mother country and possibly even a motorhome for luxury transport. Then thats fine. However, should you only be afluent enough to afford a posh caravan then you are not welcome at La Marina?.

With a little luck the local council/Mayor or whoever is responsible will have these thespians removed. With some more luck they will land somewhere more welcoming. More room for the real thugs and crooks to move in, of which they are a plenty in Spain. And before anyone begins to suggest they are all of North African or Eastern European origin, I for one can vouch they are not.

Christmas Spirit - only available to beach day trippers!

Vote with your feet or in this case your wheels, move on.

Trev.


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## 97201 (Jan 7, 2006)

Well teemyob, how very interesting. €400 a month for a cramped aire? Which is no more of a generalisation than your coment about villians in Spain. Of course we all know that France is crime free that's why lots of us park on motorway services on the way south. I don't think so!

Hey ho, here we go again - people are different, so some like to keep to themselves, some like to travel and some of us enjoy meeting up each year with old friends, Spanish and British in my case.

The beaches are empty, but the car parks in question are full with long washing lines strung out, tables, chairs, washing machines and with children's toys scattered about. I saw it yesterday. It makes it almost impossible for me to park near the cafe (in a car) as I can't walk very far. This also is an area of oustanding natural beauty (except for this eyesore) being part of a National Park.

There are only a handful of tuggers, the rest being motorhome which can't leave their 'pitch' as a new arrival would have nicked it.

To put it in perspective, we're not talking 6 or even 12 vans here but 80+.

Camperian


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## krull (Jul 22, 2006)

One thing that crosses my mind is 'who can blame them?'

I suspect in 20 years time, if I do actually manage to retire, my pension will probably be worth bugger all. 

So do I stop in overcrowded petty minded uk at some overpriced rainy army barracks (cc club site). Or do I head or the sun for the winter and try to live cheaply to offset the travel costs. 

A bit of a no brainer really.


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## eddied (May 9, 2005)

*Free camping, or gipsy sites?*

 Buon giorno tutti,
interesting to note that the online newspaper's article didn't have any readers comments attached to it.
Saw a similar scene myself at the end of November in Torre del Mar, in a 
carpark just near the entrance to a proper campsite. Most were 'D' reg, a few 'B' and one 'GB'. About 20 of them, with the campsite entrance not 50 metres away!
I think we have to accept that motorhomers are generally beginning to get a bad name throughout Europe for this sort of 'parking'.
It's one thing to free camp in an isolated spot out in the country somewhere, out of sight; or along some wild deserted and beautiful stretch of coastline; and another to become a gaggle and an eyesore anywhere.
After all, even in the winter, there are plenty of campsites or aires available the lenghth and breadth of Europe. Of course, if we all insist on 'free camping' then the aires/campsites won't stay open will they? 
saluti,
eddied


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## pippin (Nov 15, 2007)

I agree wholeheartedly with teemyyob/Trev, but how do you know that they are all actors? 
You wrote: _these thespians removed._

It seems to me that very often there is a big gap in provision.

There are campsites which are very expensive and provide facilities that are not required by motorhomers.

There are aires at €15 per night which is expensive for a patch of tarmac.

There is wild-camping in unsuitable places without facilities that is free but attracts a lot of motorhomers.

These latter ones (as in La Marina) are obviously giving all motorhomers a bad name.

If suitable aires with basic facilities are made available at a more realistic cost of, say, €5 per night then the situation could be improved.
80 vans would bring in an income of €12,00 per month.
That is a staggering €144,000 per year.
For that sort of money the local authorities could maintain facilities, provide landscaping/screening and still have something left over for the local pot.


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## 97201 (Jan 7, 2006)

Pippin, d'ya know you are absolutely right. The munincipal campsite they flattened which was half a kilometer away further down the beach was ideal for that. They even put up earth mounds to stop vans using the area for wild camping. Probably due to some property scam going on at the town hall.

Ian


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*My Post*

Hello all,

Pippin, life is one great big act. I used the term thespian so people could relate to pecking order.

Yes €15 is a lot camperian. However, that is high season. My guess is that in low season you may well pay an awful lot less, if anything at all.

I know France is not crime free, so maybe we could blame the eastern Europeans for crime there (I am being Jovial now). Paris, wow now there is a place for criminals.

Anyway, back to Spain.... It seems to me that when Franco was around and even for a while after his death. Spain welcomed tourists, could not get enough of our Pounds, Francs, DM's Gilders, whatever. Now they have quite a few other industries besides tourism (Car & Truck Factories Banking and the mention of a few dodgy property deals with the Americans, being amongst some of the major ones). The majority of us tourists are unwelcome. Well I for one am quite happy to head to more welcoming European countries.

Trev.


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## 95196 (May 1, 2005)

*posh gypsies*

This surely is nothing new and has been an increasing problem for years..we have wild camped in many places sometimes with no one else near sometimes with many.it is being stopped in more and more places by local councils and police mainly due to peoples stupidity and selfishness and its all nations who are guilty. 
The beaches are there for all to share and if we have arrived and seen too many vans we move on.we always tidy after ourselves and often after other people. 
If people continue to park inconsiderately the Spanish/Portugese etc will of course stop it completely. 
We all just need to use common sense. 
And if thats true about age concern it really needs to be made public..is there evidence of that happening??


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## WSandME (May 16, 2007)

I sat down to think about this problem, because at first I thought: "What a load of selfish fools, creating a ghetto of campers to the local's dismay - I wouldn't think about joining them".

But then I thought: "What is so acceptable about having the locals come to the place mob handed for their own pleasure and denying tourists the ability to enjoy the area?"

It boils down, I suppose, to "give and take". Nevertheless, when the commodity to be "given and taken" is in short supply, who actually has first claim to it?

In this particular example, I suppose the local authority will have the right to call the shots (unless the beach is something like a National Park) and visitors will have to abide by the ruling. If this means that it's not worth visiting the place, how much will the locals care that tourism drops to nil?

Later, I noted eddied's comment:

_I think we have to accept that motorhomers are generally beginning to get a bad name throughout Europe for this sort of 'parking'. _

and that reminded me of the Ramblers - they had a "bad name" (at least with the landowners). If I remember correctly, they got together to press their own case for "unfetterred access" and won. If the motorhoming community organised itself, and pressed their claim that availability of overnighting places (a la French "Aire") should be available as of right, perhaps we could get as many breaks as ramblers, or travellers, or any other group that pushes hard enough.

If we don't, we'll suffer the same fate as off-roaders, who have been denied access to vast swathes of previously accessible areas because other "special interest" lobbies have prevailed


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Campers*

As I said earlier, what is the difference between car and motorhomes?. Fair enough, 80 motorhomes may take up more space than 80 cars, unless they are of the Audi Q7 Footprint.

When the beaches and towns are empty of tourists, maybe and just maybe the residents will be happy. Until of course the bakery, bar and butchers have shut down due to lack of trade.

If anyone camped on the aformentioned "La Marina" site is reading this, move on and enjoy your freedom.

Happy Christmas Everyone,
Trev.


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## ingram (May 12, 2005)

Perhaps a satisfactory solution to this particular place would be to permit motorhome overnight parking to one part of the car park leaving part of it free for day visitors..... or would that be too simple ...

H


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## rayrecrok (Nov 21, 2008)

*Re: My Post*



teemyob said:


> Hello all,
> 
> The majority of us tourists can go and F*** ourselves. Well I for one am quite happy to do that in other more welcoming European countries.
> 
> Trev.


Now I would pay good money to see that! :lol:


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## pippin (Nov 15, 2007)

You are a perv, that's called dogging - or so I am given to understand!


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## cavaqueen (Mar 27, 2006)

Hi there, 

Along with camperian, we are staying in a campsite near La Marina, so decided to drive down today and have a look at the 'posh gypsies', the weather is glorious, and this spot is well used by both locals and tourists, who enjoy walking along the beach all year round. 

There are three car parking areas by the beach, the motorhomers have completely taken over two car parks and about half of the third, there were several local cars parked, but there wasn't much room for them. We managed to park our car behind a row of motorhomes. 

To be honest I found this number of motorhomes parked up, with the occupants handing their washing and scattering their belongings about the place, rather intimidating, don't ask me why, but my husband said he felt the same way, I didn't feel as though I should be walking through the car park, so how the locals must feel I don't know. 

The ideal solution, in my opinion, would be to put a height barrier across two of the car parks, and let the motor homes park on the third car park (which will hold at least 20 vans), and then put a proper waste dumping facilities there, but only allow parking for 48 hours, as they do in some parts of France, everyone should be happy then, as the locals and tourists alike can park their cars and the wild campers can still visit for a couple of days. 

I do hope that they are moved on before christmas, as no-one should spoil the traditions of any locals, how would we feel if we lived at a seaside resort in the UK and 80 + foreigners parked and stopped us doing what we normally do, after all it is the locals in any country who pay for the facilities. 

Cavaqueen


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## WSandME (May 16, 2007)

> The ideal solution, in my opinion, would be to put a height barrier across two of the car parks, and let the motor homes park on the third car park (which will hold at least 20 vans), and then put a proper waste dumping facilities there, but only allow parking for 48 hours, as they do in some parts of France,


That seems to me to be an equitable compromise.
Even collecting a €3 - €5 per night fee wouldn't phase me.


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Re: Feck*



rayrecrok said:


> teemyob said:
> 
> 
> > Hello all,
> ...


I was annoyed at the time, post edited to a civil level.



Trev.


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## Patsy (May 1, 2005)

As I said earlier. Put yourself in the position of the locals then give your opinion as a local


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*Locals*



Patsy said:


> As I said earlier. Put yourself in the position of the locals then give your opinion as a local


Cavaliere Locals do not seem to have a problem with parking of motorhomes!
If I were a local, I would encourage tourism and if the tourists, shopped local even better, may save the village shops, bars and commerce. Something a lot of seasonal resorts are short of.

Maybe the locals should move out.

Trev.


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## C7KEN (May 27, 2005)

Now THE FACTS..
We are locals we live just 5 mins inland from Guadamar. I went down to La Marina myself last Friday with my MH and returned Sunday lunch time to see what its like. The beach cafe was closed, On these days there was enough room for cars to park if they wanted. The motorhomers did NOT leave a mess like pikeys. However they all get water and dump cassettes in the toilet block in the wood and that's where there is a bad problem. The sewage has blocked and they are still emptying cassettes down the loo even though they could go down to La Marina campsite and get everything cheaply down there. There is a Blue service point as seen in most French aires and its not even necessary to go into the site to use it. Most of the campers are German. I have been researching out all these things over the last couple of months and many foreigners will not pay even 6 euros for an aire preferring to wild camp. I will be posting the locations of the aires and wild camp spots before the year end. It is the Brits who pay to use campsites. The Spanish now have quite a few aires most are not by the beach and at this time of year empty. As an example the aire at Peniscola is 8e incl electric, WiFi link to the nearby hotel at cheap rates and 150 metres to the beach but still some prefer to park in a car park in the centre of town because its free. And can they afford 8e ? well one of them had a concorde MH . How much would that be worth?. Finally La Marina is not for me as its too crowded but equally it is simply stupid to park on a beach on the costas by oneself. I may list all the places NOT to park at when I do my report. Use the aires that the Spanish provide or maybe they will not bother to open any more


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## 95196 (May 1, 2005)

We have used the aire at Nerja 8 euros plus electric if you want it..its right on the beach with spotless loos and a hot shower (payable) i hope the spanish keep encouraging them


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## C7KEN (May 27, 2005)

Hi thechef
I know the one. at Nerja The Spanish are opening aires all the time now due i'm told by efforts made by Lapaca who the Spanish motorhomers willingly subscribe to. Unfortunately they are not right on the beach so no good for most of the campers at La Marina. I have gone out with my son this afternoon as he was fitting Sat TV at the LM urbanisation and I thought I would see what people thought about it. Unfortunately I was informed by real locals that they would not bother to go down to the beach at Christmas because they feel uncomfortable with the number of vans. So I think that there are just too many down there. Some are parked on hardstanding at 25E per week and are there permanently but as I said 80% are german and just want to wild camp


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## Codfinger (Jan 11, 2008)

*posh pikies*

Have just found this http://www.nerjatoday.com/nerjanews/2008/04/26/nerja-motor-home-parking-area-denounced/

it would seem all is not as it should be at Nerha?


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## eddied (May 9, 2005)

*Parada a Nerja*

 Ciao Codfinger,
wouldn't worry too much about this article against the parada. Normal local political infighting, goes on here in Italy too whenever anything new or unusual is promotoed/produced. The 'why didn 't we think of it' syndrome.
saluti,
eddied
Only wild camp very selectively;use aires, aree, stellplaetze, paradas, whatever you want to call them; if you don't approve of official campsites.


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## BIGLAD (Oct 8, 2007)

*La marina*

We were there on christmas day morning in the cold.In my last post on this subject i was concerned over the parking for locals,in the event there were no problems wild campers mingling with locals and all looked to be having good time.


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## Codfinger (Jan 11, 2008)

*posh pikies*

What happened to live and let live? life is far too short :? Anyway lets hope spanish officials dont end up taking the view like the Aldeburgh council walleys


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## skid (Nov 21, 2005)

*ooops*

Imgram will getcha for that one,LOL.


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## waddy (Apr 21, 2006)

*La marina*

Blah blah blah !
one :-Its human nature to complain
Two :- Its 80 percent germans we need scapegoats to make us feel better about ourselves .
Three :- Green eyed monsters always seem to appear when something like this happens .
Four :- If the Authorities move them where will they go NIMBY i suppose
Five :- Did anyone ask the local traders if they were pleased i bet they were especially Lidl and Aldi 80 -200 extra customers on there doorsteps
Six :- What harm are they doing if any, filling up car parking spaces blocking up toilets oh dear the end is nigh if the la marina authorities had any sense they would do a bit of lateral thinking and provide a parking area for motorhomes with 3 or 4 flot blue facilities to accomodate these important revenue providers 
Seven :- lets be realistic The Costas are going to suffer terribly in the next few years due to the recession lets not kid ourselves that its all going to be over in a years time it aint !
Eight :- Make the motorhomers welcome if you do not what will be the consequence i will tell you even less foriegn visitors coming to Spain in the winter less revenue less shops less bars able to keep thier heads above water less employement more businesses facing closure more crime need i go on !.
Take a look at Puerto de Mazarron where wild camping has been all but eliminated its lost the buzz and pazzaz it had two years ago there are no public toilets open all the taps on the beaches are turned off its daft who has gained , the wingers have . The sites here are full all four of them Las Torres , Delphines , Playa de Mazarron and Los madrilles sure this is a good thing but ! how much more local revenue would be generated if the wild campers were still here ? . Virtually all work on local new builds has stopped and in my opinion the local economy is at a standstill . so once again i say do not stop wild camping welcome it .
On a personal note i am staying on Los Torres its expensive but for the time being it suits me never the less i sympathise with free campers as before to long i will have to join them due to financial strictures Viva le difference .


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