# Security problem and an answer!



## 89425 (May 23, 2005)

I've read many posts on improving security of their vans. Yet I have not seen anyone mention the most obvious and easy way to get in to 99.9% of motorhomes and caravans without causing any damage.

Quite often I read reports of stuff going missing from vans with no signs of forced entry! But how do they do it?

Now I've got your attention… How many of you make it even easier for people to gain access to the inside of your van? Quite a lot in fact! From a maintenance point of view, I always believe that if its not broke don't fix it, on this basis, if you never use it, remove it!

How many of you have got a ladder on the back of your van? Yep! Quite a few I bet, perhaps there's also quite a few of you who never use it, bit like all motorhomes seem to have bike racks, but no bikes. Perhaps you'll be all considering their worth after you've finished reading this. I seriously suggest if you do need access to your roof area, you get yourself a telescopic ladder from Ben & Lizzie (aka www.vangear.co.uk), (no I'm not on a back hander, but after this.. well you know.) and get shot of the ladder and 'climbing frame' from the back of your vehicles.

Right lets get down to the nuts and bolts. Whilst replacing the standard roof vent on the top of my van for an electric fan version it suddenly became so apparent how easy it was to gain access to the inside of a motor home or caravan. With only a standard screwdriver I was able to remove the plastic roof vent top by removing only four screws. Admittedly I'm too big to get through the hole (approx 400mm square), but with the aid of a litter picker type arm, I could quite easily reach in and lift things out quite easily. Then after the dastardly deed has been done, replace the roof vent so the owners are none the wiser! I'm very pleased the electric fan vent is fixed in position from the inside and is covered both sides with a grill to prevent fingers being chopped off.

Right, how to make it more difficult for 'people' taking advantage of this inherent weakness in van security. My roof vent was secured (if I can use such a word) in position with four Philips headed screws with a metric machine thread (stainless steel of course). I would think most are similar, though I expect some will only have self tapping screws holding the cover in place. Ideally you need to replace these fixings with something not so popular as a Phillips screw head. From www.screwfix.com you can obtain various security screws. Some you screw in, but can't get them out again. If at all possible you need to avoid that route. Below is a picture of a security screw.










To insert these screws you will need a special driver. I haven't been able to locate one on its own on the Screwfix site, but on this page is a multi driver kit which will have a suitable driver.









(from this location http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/pro.jsp?ts=19824&id=15297 )

Or









(from this location http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/pro.jsp?ts=19660&id=18983 )

There are two ways to make removing your new fixings more difficult. The first is to use a 'studlock glue' on the thread when inserting the screw which effectively locks the thread in place, but can be removed with effort. The second method is after fitting all the fixings and tightening them up suitably you mix up body filler or heavy duty glue like Araldite and fill in the head of the fixing screws to prevent drivers being used so readably. If you do need to remove them you'll need some special grips, or be prepared to replace the roof vent cover top.

Now for fixings, obviously there are many out there, but at the following link is many of the likely fixings you'll need. http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/cat.jsp?cId=100024&ts=19064

No doubt some people may have problems identifying their type of fixings which will either be a 'machine' tread like in the top photo, or a self taper thread, similar to a wood screw. The important thing with machine screws is not to fit screws which are too small of a diameter. Their sizes will be 4mm, 5mm, 6mm or even 8mm but unlikely. Simply remove one of your screws and measure it. Don't buy screws which are too short, as you can always hacksaw them to length. The sizes for machine screws will be listed something like M5x20 which is a thread diameter (not the head diameter, or securing tool diameter) x (by) the length of the fixing from under the head of the screw, to the end of the screw. Self taper sizes are the same as wood screws, which is gauge (diameter of screw) x length in inches.

I've given references to the Screwfix web site for ease of this article, but there are many other suppliers out there.

Safety issues. If you do use a loose unfixed ladder get someone to foot the ladder for you. When on the roof its best to use some blankets laid on the roof, then lay a plank on top to avoid marking the roof and spread your weight to avoid stressing the roof too much in small areas.

I'd like to think I have shown you a potential weakness in your security, but also a way of constructively addressing this weakness. in a way most people can cope with.

If your thinking of passing this post around the various newsgroups, please use this link
http://www.motorhomefacts.com/postp4166.html#4166

© Steve - A very wild..wild camper
____________________________________________________
*Steve 
aka A very wild....wild camper*
.
Click here for my van website!
.









_I do like a bit of feed back to my posts please_
____________________________________________________


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## 89425 (May 23, 2005)

I've copied the post below from another forum, as it highlights exactly what I'm warning about above.

I'd like to thank Voxy of Stratford upon Avon for her/his post

Posted: Mon Apr 26, 2004 2:38 am Post subject: security 
A thought provoking posting.
To add to it, how many of us have secured our windows and doors when leaving the 'van on hot days, but left the roof vents open for ventilation.
Personally, I don't like walking on, or loading on, our roof, and declined the dealers offer of an 'optional extra' rear ladder.
Another cautionary tale;
About 4 years ago, a family on one of our rallies managed to lock themselves out of their caravan.
It was a three second job to 'pop' the old type spring tensioned roof vent, and reach in with a broom stick to nudge the door lock.
Voxy.
____________________________________________________
*Steve 
aka A very wild....wild camper*
.
Click here for my van website!
.









_I do like a bit of feed back to my posts please_
____________________________________________________


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## 93795 (May 1, 2005)

Very interesting points you make especially unlocking the door through a roof vent with a broom handle. Certainly food for thought. You said also that you were fitting an electric fan into the vent. I think it's a brilliant idea and would like to do the same to one of my vents. Where can you buy a suitable fan, is it a kit or something ready made to fit a standard vent opening?
Phil.


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

In the current issue of the CCC mag someone got locked out of their M/H, and resolved the problem by using a key from another make of M/H unlocking a side small locker door then a small person gained access and opened the main door.

How’s that for security.

Ken S.


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## 89425 (May 23, 2005)

Phil905 said:


> You said also that you were fitting an electric fan into the vent. I think it's a brilliant idea and would like to do the same to one of my vents. Where can you buy a suitable fan, is it a kit or something ready made to fit a standard vent opening?
> Phil.


I was fitting an Omni-Vent roof fan (Translucent, 12v, with blind, 40 x 40 cm. 3 speed, forward and reverse) which I got brand new off eBay for about £50. I have seen the same one in caravan/motorhome accessory shops for well over £100. But check out the various retailers associated with this site and others as they are available for under the £100.

The nice thing about the Omni-Vent is that its not complicated to fit. I had installed cables to the vent holes when installing the roof insulation and lining, so they were there all ready. The tools I used consisted of Screwdriver, Non setting mastic an gun for seating the vent, and wire connection tools.

____________________________________________________
*Steve 
aka A very wild....wild camper*
.
Click here for my van website!
.









_I do like a bit of feed back to my posts please_
____________________________________________________


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## 93795 (May 1, 2005)

Thanks very much Steve I'll look around and see if I can get one. The table top fan was never much good when it gets really hot when we're down South. This sounds like the answer, I never knew they existed.
Phil. 8)


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Fiamma make a vent with an integral fan. It blows air in and it also extracts air. And you can set it so that it blows cool air in when the inside temperature reaches a predetermined heat.

How do I know this? Why, there's one built into my van!

:lol:


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## Raine (May 10, 2005)

*hmm*

deadlocks on the doors, bolt over side door, and side cupboards, 
what happens if you lose your keys, or you lock yourself out, and youve taken precautions on the roof,

hmmm now what was the answer?

have (wow its piddlin down here now!) two sets of keys, hmm there was something else as well, but it has gone into the sweet bye and bye, i will be BACK when it is!


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

*Re: hmm*



RAINE said:


> deadlocks on the doors, bolt over side door, and side cupboards,
> what happens if you lose your keys, or you lock yourself out, and youve taken precautions on the roof,
> 
> hmmm now what was the answer?
> ...


 :? :? :? :? :? :? :? :?


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## 90473 (May 1, 2005)

Perhaps the thin line has already been crossed :lol: :lol: :lol: 

(Must admit I've been thinking long and hard about the original post as well, but best not to go there)


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## VanManWomanTwins (May 12, 2005)

*Ladder Giveaways?*

Anyone looking to donate their ladder on the cheap give me a shout :!:

Cheers
HighwayManWomanTwins :!:


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