# My E530 and The Sale of Goods Act



## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

Item deleted by author for personal reasons.


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## wilse (Aug 10, 2007)

hi greysand...

I feel sorry for you, angry as well, you've been treated pi55 poor!

I googled Sale of Goods Act, and at number 1 came this link from the DTI

http://www.dti.gov.uk/consumers/buying-selling/sale-supply/sale-of-good-act/page8600.html

Unless this is wrong it states "If consumers discover that products do not meet these requirements they can reject them and ask for their money back providing they do so quickly. Alternatively, they can request a repair or replacement or claim compensation."

This is either incorrect or leads me to think you have the decision?

Surely the sale of goods act is just that... regardless of wether it's a toaster or motorhome?

I presume you have had your free 1/2 hour or legal advice? if so I'd go somewhere else and have another.

right... off my soap box now.

wilse


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

*Bessacarr E530*

Hello Greysand

I am sorry that you are so upset with your vehicle and how we are dealing with your problem.

It is possible for us to cancel the engineer visit and return your motorhome to our factory for rectification. It was not our intention to put obstacles in your way.

We can have your motorhome back at your earliest convenience, after the Bank Holiday, if this suits you.

Gary will give you a call this afternoon to discuss this with you.

Kath


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## javea (Jun 8, 2007)

Hi Greysand. Last year my son bought a new Volkswagen R32. He had an ongoing problem with the seats for which he had paid about £1200 extra. They creaked all the time. It went back on a number of occasions but the VW dealer, and Recaro were not able to rectify the problem. After a number of discussions with the dealer and Volkswagen, and threat of legal action (which did not have to be taken) they agreed to buy the vehicle back from him at a very reasonable figure. I think that by the time it went back it was then around 8 months old. So it appears that there is a case for a dealer/manufacturer taking the vehicle back as if they did not have a leg to stand on I am sure that the matter would not have been resolved as it was. After all, the article has to be 'fit for purpose' and in your case clearly isn't.

Hope you manage to resolve the problem without too much further agro. I think it is about time the UK manufacturers looked to the Germans for quality control, that is why I only buy Hymers and in my family we have in all 5 German cars. If they don't take some action they will be in the same situation that the old British car manufacturers were in. I would love to buy British but daren't because of quality concerns.


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## Mikemoss (Sep 5, 2005)

I, too, hope Greysand soon gets all those problems sorted soonest, and it's heartening to see the way that Swift are stepping into these discussions with offers of help (and so they should, I hear the cry!).

Just a comment to Javea03730: don't write off all things British and confine yourself to German stuff. My Merc estate might drive beautifully, but it's breaking out in premature rust and I know from taking part in a number of MB web forums that many, many, many others have suffered untold electrical and other problems with recent C, E and - particularly - M class models. Mrs M's VW hasn't exactly been a paragon of reliability either...

By contrast, we've a great British toaster, a super British house, some beautiful bits of British furniture, and our British motorhome (excluding the foreign underpinnings) continues to be trouble-free after more than nine years and 73,000 miles.

None of which is any excuse at all for the troubles that Greysands and others have experienced. But if a foreign MH had shown so many faults, I wonder whether the foreign MD and customer service team would have been so proactive as Swift now seem to be?


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## taildj (Jun 4, 2006)

I think you have grounds to reject the vehicle as it is clearly unfit. In your position I would have lost all confidence in the manufacturer and would wish to consider a different one. After all we are talking of a new vehicle the cost of which is a substantial financial commitment forf anyone, and probably, excepting a house purchase, the biggest anyone makes. Irrispective of Swifts response it appears quite obvious that the quality of the vehicle is inadequate. At the point of sale it should have been thoroughly checked and without any significant problems. Given all I have seen and heard about Swift I am surprised that anyone considerring a new purchase pursues this make.

I sincerely hope it is resolved to your satifaction rather than the dealer's or the manufacturer's. 

In order to turn this company around Swift need to fully accept their responsibility and recognise that, for you, they have lost credability. Further the more reports posted about such circumstances will lead others to form similar opinions and, in the longer term the consequences for them will become more and more substantial as inevitably propective purchasers will look elsewhere

Best wishes


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## C7KEN (May 27, 2005)

I have been reading every post regarding Swift and the new Fiat problems and although I dont have either I have to say I am impressed by Swift openly offering to sort out these problems and not ducking and diving, I really hope that this makes the workforce at Swift pull up their socks and at the end of the day it will surely benefit Swift because they will have a good reputation in an industry far from perfect , they do seem to have a nice range of vans and now is the time to tighten control as I expect Bailey will shortly enter the MH market so I wish all good luck to Swift and hope they get on top of these problems, I would like to think my next van could be a Swift bought because of design and good build quality, if I had a Swift with a few problems I would give Swift every oportunity to put them right before taking legal action, as they are apparently willing to do


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## carolgavin (May 9, 2005)

So sorry to hear of your problems, we are experiencing the dreaded water ingress problem so can sympathise. However there are 2 other ways in which to reject your vehicle other than the 'not fit for purpose' one. These are 
1. Not of satisfactory quality.
2. Not free from defects- this one is the biggy!!!!
You can also claim consequential damages if you have expenses which are *directly* attributed to the problems you have experienced. So if you have to pay for phone calls, postage for complaint letters, diesel to take van for inspection, loss of deposit for site etc etc then you should keep a careful note and receipts etc.
For 2. you have the right of repair at the dealers expense, if they cannot fix then you have the right to replacement (same value) or refund if they do not want to replace. You have to dictate timescale not them. So you write (to dealer) giving them a reasonable time (14 calender days is considered reasonable) to effect repairs. If they cannot you send a letter before action giving them 14 days or you will effectively reject vehicle for full refund.
You can also claim from (dealer) not manufacturer for an independant inspection of the vehicle.
You maybe know all this anyway but may be useful to those who don't.
Hope you get somewhere soon.


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

Deleted by author.


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## taildj (Jun 4, 2006)

My remaining hope is that however it is resolved I hope it is resolved to your satisfaction. Best wishes


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

Deleted by author.


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## Rapide561 (Oct 1, 2005)

*Swift*

Hi

Various things to discuss in the above threads.

Re the Swift engineer - one of their guys visited me and looked at the van. He did appeared "very impartial" and did not "take sides".

Carol - a very informative post. In the case of my "out of pocket expenses" - fuel and the repairs undertaken in Italy for the water pump thing etc - then full marks to Cleveland for refunding me without quibble.

British - I just love the style of the Swift product. It outstrips the counterparts - British and German by miles in terms of "trend" - well that's my opinion.

Repairs - Swift did offer to take my van for repair and I declined, allowing the dealer to do the work. There were other things amiss and hence the Swift assessor came along. Again, Swift offered to take the van back to the factory for repair, but I declined purely as the new van was on order and due to work etc and looking after dogs, I did not have a convenient day to get to the factory.

Russell


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## carolgavin (May 9, 2005)

Greysand said:


> carolgavin said:
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> > So sorry to hear of your problems, we are experiencing the dreaded water ingress problem so can sympathise. However there are 2 other ways in which to reject your vehicle other than the 'not fit for purpose' one. These are
> ...


Excellent, you are giving them every opportunity which if it ever did go anywhere near a judge is a major tick in your favour  
My lovely lawyer friend advised me of the above and I have used it in a small scale to much success. The key apparently is to set your own 'reasonable' timescale to show you mean business and you know what you are talking about, as many of them just make it up when you phone ie make sure you use the term 'consequantial damages'etc.


> Carol - a very informative post


Why thank you Russell kind sir.


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

Item deleted by author.


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## Rapide561 (Oct 1, 2005)

*Letter*



Greysand said:


> A special thanks to all for your support, especially CarolGavin. It has seemed at times like David against Goliath.
> 
> However, I am determined not to be cowed, and having become totally frustrated by Swift Customer Services, I returned the motorhome to Chelston yesterday 24/08/07, for them to manage the problems.
> 
> ...


Did you get a receipt for the letter?

Russell


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

*Re: Letter*

Item deleted by author.


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## carolgavin (May 9, 2005)

*Re: Letter*



Greysand said:


> Rapide561 said:
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Hi Graham, gee thanks for the namecheck twas a pleasure to try and help out in any way. With regards to your letter all you have to do is give them another copy with ' hand delivered to ensure receipt' at the very top of it then do another with a bit on the bottom for them to sign. Just make sure you get the bit signed by (hopefully) the person you addressed it to. However any managerial type would do. Obviously this would mean going back, but sometimes it's beneficial as they see your face and know you mean business, I would however send special delivery and not recorded if you are too far away to go back, a bit dearer (well £4 as opposed to £1 odd) but will get there next day-your 21 days start from receipt which you can prove as it's signed for  
Good luck with this and anytime you need a friend, shoulder or just to say aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrgggggggghhhhhhhhhh or woooooooooohooooooooooooooooooo you know where we are.
Regards Carol


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

*Re: Letter*



Greysand said:


> Rapide561 said:
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I am sorry you are not getting a clear response I thought Kath or Lynsey had organised with you the return and you were happy for it to be returned?Please ensure you send to Swift your fault list and the motorhome will be dealt with straight away and returned within a few days.Any out of pocket expenses will be covered.I can only apologise to you and I amsure you have read on the other threads the problems we have had and how we are reacting to them.You may also know I have taken up the water entering the engine compartment directly with Fiat. Regards Peter.


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

*Re: Letter*

Deleted by author.


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## C7KEN (May 27, 2005)

I must have missed something here as it seems you have taken the van back to Chelston over 200 miles away rather than Swift 50 miles away, are you expecting Chelston to take it to Swift, If it was my van I would definately accept Swifts offer to get the van in to them and have it fixed and returned promptly, if this does not happen as Swift have promised then they will heve lost all credibility but give them a chance after all I see no other manufacturers queing up to offer direct factory help on this forum, I can understand you are very frustrated but there is a positive offer to sort your problems here


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

*Re: Letter*

Deleted by author.


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

*Re: Letter*



Greysand said:


> carolgavin said:
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Why have you taken it back to Chelston if you are only 50miles from Swift? Anyway when it is returned to us we will do the jobs and you can collect and ensure you are happy or we will deliver to you?Peter.


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

Deleted by author.


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

*Re: Letter*



Greysand said:


> SwiftGroup said:
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Graham,I have sent you a PM I think!Peter.


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

*Re: Letter*

Deleted by author.


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

*Re: Letter*



SwiftGroup said:


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I haven't received your PM Peter, and I have just noticed that my PMs to your user name are still sat in my outbox, so there could well be a problem!


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

*Re: Letter*



Greysand said:


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Ok Graham.I will try again if it doesnt come again I will ask Kath to make contact for me.I will be back in the office from Thursday.Regards Peter


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

*Re: Letter*



SwiftGroup said:


> Greysand said:
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Thanks Peter,

You will notice I have closed debate on this issue, as it has served it's purpose.

I will be posting a registered letter to you tomorrow, 28th August 2007,explaining my position.

I believe that the motorhome will arrive at Swift later this week, and I have requested a meeting with the Repair Center Manager to discuss my areas of concern.

sincerely, Graham Beasley


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

*Re: Letter*



Greysand said:


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Ok Graham,you will be meeting more than the repair centre manager! Please keep me informed and I will discuss with Kath tomorrow also.Hope to see you soon.Peter.


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

*Re: Letter*



SwiftGroup said:


> Greysand said:
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Peter,

I understand that the Motorhome has been collected from Chelston today, 30/08/07.

I have emailed your Customer Service Dept. ([email protected]) and copied '[email protected]', asking for an appointment with your Repair Centre Manager as soon as possible after receipt of the vehicle.

rgds, Graham Beasley


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

*Re: Letter*



Greysand said:


> SwiftGroup said:
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Peter,

I understand that the Motorhome has been collected from Chelston today, 30/08/07.

I have emailed your Customer Service Dept. ([email protected]) and copied '[email protected]', asking for an appointment with your Repair Centre Manager as soon as possible after receipt of the vehicle.

rgds, Graham Beasley[/quote:c0c5c0c882]Yes we are expecting it I have got your list on my desk and I will inspect it personally.PETER.


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

*Re: Letter*



SwiftGroup said:


> Greysand said:
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> > SwiftGroup said:
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Peter,

I understand that the Motorhome has been collected from Chelston today, 30/08/07.

I have emailed your Customer Service Dept. ([email protected]) and copied '[email protected]', asking for an appointment with your Repair Centre Manager as soon as possible after receipt of the vehicle.

rgds, Graham Beasley[/quote:c3007b1abb]Yes we are expecting it I have got your list on my desk and I will inspect it personally.PETER.[/quote:c3007b1abb]

Thanks for that Peter, but I am still completely in the dark. All my written correspondence to Chelston remains unanswered and my 2 emails and letter to Swift Customer Care remain unanswered.

All I am asking is to be advised on the implications of the removal of overhead lockers and other fixtures to replace the ceiling board.

I am confronted with silence!

Yes, by all means look at the motorhome, and the sub standard workmanship which is indicated in my faults list, but I believe I should be involved in this.

Furthermore, I am not happy at having to communicate all this in public!!

rgds, Graham Beasley


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

*PM*

Graham

I have sent you a personal message

Regards
Kath


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

*Re: Letter*



Greysand said:


> SwiftGroup said:
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Peter,

I understand that the Motorhome has been collected from Chelston today, 30/08/07.

I have emailed your Customer Service Dept. ([email protected]) and copied '[email protected]', asking for an appointment with your Repair Centre Manager as soon as possible after receipt of the vehicle.

rgds, Graham Beasley[/quote:56bb7d4eaf]Yes we are expecting it I have got your list on my desk and I will inspect it personally.PETER.[/quote:56bb7d4eaf]

Thanks for that Peter, but I am still completely in the dark. All my written correspondence to Chelston remains unanswered and my 2 emails and letter to Swift Customer Care remain unanswered.

All I am asking is to be advised on the implications of the removal of overhead lockers and other fixtures to replace the ceiling board.

I am confronted with silence!

Yes, by all means look at the motorhome, and the sub standard workmanship which is indicated in my faults list, but I believe I should be involved in this.

Furthermore, I am not happy at having to communicate all this in public!!

rgds, Graham Beasley[/quote:56bb7d4eaf]Graham,I have sent you a pm.Peter.


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## eddievanbitz (May 1, 2005)

> Furthermore, I am not happy at having to communicate all this in public!!


Why are you then? To be fair to Swift you have posted on a public forum, (where they have as much right to be heard as you), and they have replied!

It would also seem that they have PM'd you on several occasions so they appear to be trying to keep it private.


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## carolgavin (May 9, 2005)

eddievanbitz said:


> > Furthermore, I am not happy at having to communicate all this in public!!
> 
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> Why are you then? To be fair to Swift you have posted on a public forum, (where they have as much right to be heard as you), and they have replied!
> ...


Think it's because if it's on here they respond :!: if he e-mails or writes or calls they don't bother :!: Seems to me the PMs only came after Graham mentioned having to put things on a public forum to get an answer. Swift have noted his post and in an effort to accomodate grahams request to keep things private have PM'd him


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## 105858 (Jul 15, 2007)

eddievanbitz said:


> > Furthermore, I am not happy at having to communicate all this in public!!
> 
> 
> Why are you then? To be fair to Swift you have posted on a public forum, (where they have as much right to be heard as you), and they have replied!
> ...


My previous PMs to Swift went unanswered, and a PM sent to me by Swift didn't arrive, so there appeared to be a problem with PMs between us.

However, I have received 2 PMs from Swift and in future this matter will not be for public discussion.

Furthermore, I am very grateful to Swift for their assistance and intervention, as the dealer Chelston just don't care.


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

carolgavin said:


> eddievanbitz said:
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We do our best to respond and have been open and honest with everyone and in this instant have respected Grahams request for privacy.What other manufacturer or Dealer will respond on a Sunday?Peter.


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