# Italy Unfriendly to Campers



## jhelm (Feb 9, 2008)

It seems that Italy is becoming more and more unfriendly to campers especially in the North. This is partly due to an anti immigrant anti gypsy or Roma sentiment. Signs are appearing everywhere that prevent campers from even parking and many towns don't allow them within the central area. The price of campgrounds is one of the highest in Europe. 

It's not an impossible situation yet, but I think that if people traveling and camping in Italy find problems in a specific area it would be a good idea to start writing letters, even in English, to town councils voicing their concerns. Italy's economy is in the dumps and it needs tourists even those in campers.


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## eddied (May 9, 2005)

*Unfriendly Italy?*

 Ciao Jhelm,
beg to differ.  More and more municipalities are providing 'aree di sosta'.
Look up the Portolano pages of the magazine Plein Air, or 'Comuni belli e buoni' pages of the magazine 'Autocaravan - AC'. You will find every month at least 5/6 new 'aree' featured.
It is true that larger cities have parking problems, even for automobiles, and therefore their attitude is understandable. It is also true that some cities have illegal immigrant or Rom shanty town problems, and they too may have a point.
But on the whole I find Italy very motorhome orientated and friendly.
saluti,
eddied


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## jhelm (Feb 9, 2008)

I think they are making these aree as a way to get campers out of town. They put one in then mark all the parking lots no campers. For example at Allege they have one about 2k from the ski lift, a bit far to walk in ski boots, but there is at least a bus. At San Gimignano it's 5k from the center and that's just for day parking. At Palafavera we got a ticket for 38 euro as we didn't see the sign posted at the other end of the parking lot. We made a trip before ski season through Trento Alto Adage looking for places to park for skiing only managed to find one. Everywhere else one finds signs no campers. 

I know there are places for campers, if one looks hard enough, I'm just saying it's getting worse not better.


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## eddied (May 9, 2005)

*Campers in Italy*

 Ciao again,
this morning I got the January edition of AC magazine. One of its main features was 'Vacanze sulla neve' (holidays in the snow) which is probably what you're interested in up there in the frozen North. As far as I'm concerned, I can see snow on the mountains today, about 50 Kms. away, and that's near enough for me! Anyway, several solutions suggested for skiing etc. and generally mucking about in that horrible white wet stuff:
Val Gardena - sosta at Plan de Gralba, near the Ciampinol chairlift.
Chiusi - area attrezzata at Camping Gamp (www.camping-gamp.com)
Chiusi - area attrezzata at Colfosco (www.campingcolfosco.org)
Alpe di Siusi - camping www.camping-alpedisiusi.com

I have been myself to aree di sosta in Brixen, Sterzing, and Bruneck to name but a few, so it's not all doom and gloom up there really.
saluti,
eddied


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## eddied (May 9, 2005)

*soste in the snow*

 Ciao tutti,
just spotted another one:
Camperservice at Forni di Sopra, Carnia, province of Udine. At the cable car station going towards the Mauria pass.
If you like that sort of thing.
And another,
Area Attrezzata La Villa in Badia (BZ province)
Via Ninz 49,
La Villa in Badia, near the Gardenaccia ski lifts
www.odlina.it

saluti,
eddied


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

Ed...please can you recommend a good guide to sostas/ area attrezzata etc in Italy ? 

Which is the one that you can spend the night at ( ie area attrezata / sosta ? 

G


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Grizzly said:


> Ed...please can you recommend a good guide to sostas/ area attrezzata etc in Italy ?
> 
> Which is the one that you can spend the night at ( ie area attrezata / sosta ?
> 
> G


This might help Chris....

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopicp-250698.html#250698

As for books, we found the Guida Camper useful, a bit expensive but it doubles up as a map as well.

Pete


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

Thanks a lot peejay; that's exactly what I wanted. I missed that...!

I'm going quietly mad at the moment trying- for once in our lives- to plan a route and overnight stops. The worst of it is that we'll never stick to it. I doubt we'll even stay the first night at my planned destination....!

G


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## Don_Madge (May 1, 2005)

Hi G

I've gone through my favourites and you might find these sites useful.

http://www.turismoitinerante.com/php/sosta/italia/visu_reg.php?s_Regione=Sardegna&

http://www.campingcar-infos.com/Francais/affichaireE.php?Pays=ITALIE

http://www.camperclubitalia.it/Links+Utili/Aree+di+sosta/Sud/default.aspx#sardegna

http://www.camper.netsurf.it/ Click on "Sosta" then "AA Italia"

They are set up for Sardinia but you should be able to sort it out for other areas.

Safe travelling.

Don


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

Don Madge said:


> Hi G
> I've gone through my favourites and you might find these sites useful.
> Safe travelling.
> Don


Don..what a star you are ! Thank you very much.

G


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## eddied (May 9, 2005)

*Aree di sosta in Italy*

 Buon giorno Grizzly,
I see you already have a good list of sites to explore from our good friend Don.
Personally, I find the most comprehensive site is
www.camperonline.it
this gives you practically every possible spot throughout the country where you could stop, park, or overnight with a motorhome. However, please note that the English language version is a Google translation, so a bit hilarious.
Another one I like is 
www.camperweb.it
also very comprehensive
I also like
www.caravanecamper.it
not quite so comprehensive as the others, but pretty pictures.
Also available in book form (I believe Vicarious books have it) is:
www.guidacamper.com

There are lots more, but I think you'll get around OK with most of what you now have.
For campsites I just use
www.camping.it
plus the magazines I buy.
To answer your other question
'area attrezzata' is usually privately owned/operated - can be a pseudo campsite set up specifically for motorhomes, or attached to a hotel or restaurant, or part of an agriturismo.
Usually hard standing, with EHU, and at least basic toilet/shower facilties.
Usually cost between 10/15 Euros per night.
A good example is the 'area attrezzata' in the database at Orvieto.

'area di sosta' is anywhere you can park up and are authorized to stop overnight. These are usually set up by the local council (municipio) like the 'aires' in France. Can vary greatly in location, or facilities. Most will have at least a fresh water tap. Most also have a grey/black waste dump.
A few now have the 'bourne' facility, espcially on motorway service areas.
A few, but not many, have EHU. Most are free, some are metered with a parking ticket. In this case overnight would be anything from 5 to 10 Euro.
A really good example, at the moment completely free, and with EHU, is San Gemini area di sosta, also in the database.

'Sosta' or 'Parcheggio' is simply somewhere to park up whilst you visit a location, as in a simple car park. Sometimes used in the context of free camping, but this is very thin ice. You could take on the Italian legal system, which states in Article 85 of the New Highway Code that local councils cannot legally discriminate between cars/small vans and 'campers' that do not exceed 3500 Kgs fully laden! Many do - as per the original poster Jhelm.
I can no longer be bothered, I just ignore them.
saluti,
eddied


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## Grizzly (May 9, 2005)

That is great eddied, thanks for taking the time to do that. 

My Italian is feeble- though I do have NVQ certificates to prove that I can book a train ticket from Milan to Rome and ask for a cup of coffee when I get there ! I'm hoping to upgrade it a bit before Easter but I have problems remembering English words these days so don't hold out much hope. Our local tech does not include how to argue the toss with local officials or policemen in the syllabus so we won't take the risk !

Thanks again

G


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## Don_Madge (May 1, 2005)

Thaks Ed great post.

Now I've just got to find time to do a tour of Italy.  

Don


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## JacSprat (May 26, 2006)

*Hello from Ostuni in Puglia*

Hello all - been in Italy almost two weeks now and certainly find myself alternating between 'I'm in love' to 'get me to Greece, quick!'. I did a Don and parked up in a quiet spot on the port in Trani. All was well until about 3am when I was practically rocked out of my bed as some drunk youths thought it would be hilarious to try and push my van over. Heart hammering, I jumped out of my van screaming like a banshee and armed with my softball bat. They started rolling around with laughter, waved good night and stumbled down the street. I decided to move.
I've had quite a few problems connecting with Three so often couldn't find an appropriate night stop. A hard copy of a guide is indispensible if you're just rambling like me. There are few clear signs indicating facilities for campers (and anyway, you'd have to pick it out from the dozens of advertising signs on a single post!). I found some amazing 'wild' sites though (Boisena Lake, west side) but haven't been as 'chilled' about wilding since my Trani experience. I too am finding anything to do with campers here on the pricey side, especially considering it's the off season, ie; 20 euro to park in a designated Camper parking lot between two motorways in Siena. Sheesh. I moved as well. 
But all said, I am utterly amazed at the diversity here and am smitten. The extreme off season poses challenges for the budget MHer like me, but it IS the time to see real-life Italy without the stampede of tourists. I almost had the Campo in Siena to myself. Priceless. 
The rubbish strewn EVERYWHERE is driving me to despair for humankind, but it's certainly not limited to Italy (though it is disgusting here in the south). The charm of the people helps to disguise it.
Ti amo Italia!

Ciao for now,
Jacquie and Murph


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## jhelm (Feb 9, 2008)

"I can no longer be bothered, I just ignore them.'' Not sure what you mean here, do you park over night in spite of a sign?

I'm sticking to my original post, It's so bad in some areas that last year the minister of transport wrote a letter to all the communes in Trentino reminding them of art. 85 which as far as I know they just ignored.

I appreciate the notes regarding sources of information, many which I already knew about some I didn't. Our goal for the most part is to know where we can park overnight for a night or two and not have to pay anyone. In the Winter we want to park at a ski area, go skiing, come back and take it easy for the night and ski again the next day. Even if we take up a parking space for two days I don't see the problem as we are paying to ski and reducing the number of road trips which is an environmentally good thing. I think the objections come from hotel owners and camp owners who feel they are missing out on some potential income.


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## jhelm (Feb 9, 2008)

*Re: Hello from Ostuni in Puglia*



JacSprat said:


> Hello all - been in Italy almost two weeks now and certainly find myself alternating between 'I'm in love' to 'get me to Greece, quick!'. I did a Don and parked up in a quiet spot on the port in Trani. All was well until about 3am when I was practically rocked out of my bed as some drunk youths thought it would be hilarious to try and push my van over. Heart hammering, I jumped out of my van screaming like a banshee and armed with my softball bat. They started rolling around with laughter, waved good night and stumbled down the street. I decided to move.
> I've had quite a few problems connecting with Three so often couldn't find an appropriate night stop. A hard copy of a guide is indispensible if you're just rambling like me. There are few clear signs indicating facilities for campers (and anyway, you'd have to pick it out from the dozens of advertising signs on a single post!). I found some amazing 'wild' sites though (Boisena Lake, west side) but haven't been as 'chilled' about wilding since my Trani experience. I too am finding anything to do with campers here on the pricey side, especially considering it's the off season, ie; 20 euro to park in a designated Camper parking lot between two motorways in Siena. Sheesh. I moved as well.
> But all said, I am utterly amazed at the diversity here and am smitten. The extreme off season poses challenges for the budget MHer like me, but it IS the time to see real-life Italy without the stampede of tourists. I almost had the Campo in Siena to myself. Priceless.
> The rubbish strewn EVERYWHERE is driving me to despair for humankind, but it's certainly not limited to Italy (though it is disgusting here in the south). The charm of the people helps to disguise it.
> ...


A realistic post. I would just say that as far as I've seen Italians and Italian youth are not violent so while they were acting in a very bad way I doubt they really intended to push your van over or hurt anyone. We have done almost all our camping in Italy so far on the Wild side and not had a, knock on wood, problem.


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## eddied (May 9, 2005)

*Unfriendly Italy*

 Ciao Jhelm,
:roll: no, what I mean is, if they don't want me, I don't want to stop there and give them my money in the form of shopping/eating /visiting etc.
You are quite right about the letter from the Ministry to town councils re parking. I wrote a fairly long post about this some time ago - will be somewhere in the depths of these forums.
Young and fit and full of your mental capacities as you are, you may want to challenge any parking tickets you get. I've spent most of my life challenging the authorities about something, so now I just get on with it.

To explain things to our GB freinds, basically a town council cannot discriminate between ordinary automobiles and campers no heavier than 3500 Kgs fully laden. To so discriminate they would need to prove overriding and impelling motives of public health/safety/order. They would also need to use appropriately registered and approved signage. This last bit is where they often slip up, since any sign has to carry on its reverse side a ministry approval indelible stamp. So next time you meet a 'no campers' parking sign, have a look on the back to see if it's legal or not. This also applies in France by the way.
On this point, the municipio of Massa Carrara, where a motorhome show is being held this week, has revoked its own order of 2007, and removed all height barriers/parking signs that discriminate against campers. I shall be happy to visit Massa Carrara this coming week, and spend my money there.
Off for my lunch now, so 'buon appetito' everyone.
saluti,
eddied


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## JacSprat (May 26, 2006)

*Re: Hello from Ostuni in Puglia*



jhelm said:


> JacSprat said:
> 
> 
> > Hello all - been in Italy almost two weeks now and certainly find myself alternating between 'I'm in love' to 'get me to Greece, quick!'. I did a Don and parked up in a quiet spot on the port in Trani. All was well until about 3am when I was practically rocked out of my bed as some drunk youths thought it would be hilarious to try and push my van over. Heart hammering, I jumped out of my van screaming like a banshee and armed with my softball bat. They started rolling around with laughter, waved good night and stumbled down the street. I decided to move.
> ...


Just using a little dramatic license jhelm. I was trying to evoke how I over-reacted to a little southern 'exhuberance'. Mind you, it was a hell of a wake up call and I was in a dead sleep. When I came out of the van door, I could barely work out what country I was in. Of course they weren't trying to push the van over, just give it a good rocking. That said, I have had a few bad nights with intentional horn honking, yelling and tyre spinning in a couple of overnight parking areas for campers. I put this down to Friday nights and me being the only vehicle in the lot. I would recommend to anyone proper attretzattas (sp? 8O )on Fris and Sats if you can find one. I may be a little more sensitive to these things being on my own, of course!

J


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## jhelm (Feb 9, 2008)

''no, what I mean is, if they don't want me, I don't want to stop there and give them my money in the form of shopping/eating /visiting etc. '' Only problem is that Trentino AD is our ski area, kind of hard not to got there. I am going to have a look at the back of those signs.


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