# Pyrenees advice please



## powerplus (Oct 6, 2014)

hi


sorry about the spelling in the title but i cannot change it

we are going to make a slow return home from the algarve shortly traveling up through spain.

we need a bit of advice regarding the N roads over the around Pyrenees but not necessarily through andora

we need to end up some were in the dordogne as we have friends there and would like to pop in and see them

im a bit worried that the N roads are a bit rough for a m/home

also nice camp sites on route would be handy

advice please

barry


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Most of the roads through the Pyrenees are fine, especially the major routes. Ive been across most of them on the scooter!

Its a fantastic place if you fancy seeing a bit of the Haute Pyrenees national Park. There is a guide on my website https://sites.google.com/site/hanktestsite2/downloads


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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)

Bit confused here, you say you are coming from the Algarve (West) but want to miss Andorra ( East Pyrenees), which general direction are you planning to head , can offer some suggestions depending on the planned route.


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

barryd said:


> Most of the roads through the Pyrenees are fine, especially the major routes. Ive been across most of them on the scooter!
> 
> Its a fantastic place if you fancy seeing a bit of the Haute Pyrenees national Park. There is a guide on my website https://sites.google.com/site/hanktestsite2/downloads


Beautiful and spectacular area - don't miss it.

I can thoroughly endorse Barry's guide to the Pyrenees. We used a lot of it, but then I know that they and we like similar spots and styles of places.

Don't worry about the road surfaces, although some higher places are a bit twisty, but there was nowhere we got stuck - just needs a bit of care and manouevering, especially on some steep turns if you have a long overhang, but can be done with a bit of shuffling. Main roads no problem.

Geoff


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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)

nicholsong said:


> Beautiful and spectacular area - don't miss i
> 
> Geoff


Yes and you never know who you might bump into !


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## powerplus (Oct 6, 2014)

hi all

not sure which way we are going yet but may pop in to a friend just north of madrid we also want to go to a campsite south of barcelona as this was a place where a departed friend allways went

we just want to poodle back as the fancy takes us as on out way down to the algarve in october we had a call from our local hospital asking the wife to come in fore some more breast scans 

the result was we ended up going home 5 times over the winter and cancer removed and radio therapy all is clear now and time to take it easy

so in no hurry to get home

thanks all so far and will look at barrys guide shortly

would love to meet any members on there travels

barry


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Gretchibald said:


> Yes and you never know who you might bump into !


Captain Over looks all confused in that photo. Had you been giving him too many Leffes?


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

powerplus said:


> hi all
> 
> not sure which way we are going yet but may pop in to a friend just north of madrid we also want to go to a campsite south of barcelona as this was a place where a departed friend allways went
> 
> ...


Well your fastest route from Barcelona to the Dordogne (say Sarlat) would be straight up, Perpignon, Carcassone, Toulouse then up to the Dordogne. Bit boring and a few tolls. I would go over the top to to Bagneres de Luchon (French side) and the start of that tour I talked about in my guide, see a bit of the best of the Pyrenees then head north. I know for a fact that road is fine as its one ive been over on the bike. Stunning. Adds about 80 miles to the fastest route.


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## fatbuddha (Aug 7, 2006)

the only Pyrenees crossing I would be wary of is the Tunnel d'Aragnouet between Bielsa and St Lary if coming from Spain. the descent from the tunnel is very steep and very twisting and will test your brakes and mental resolve if it's wet. we've only done it once, but our brake pads were smoking from overheating by the time we got to the bottom!!


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## salomon (Apr 20, 2011)

There is lots of snow about at the moment. Down to 1000m.
It will be that way for a good few days yet, so may be plan accordingly ie lower and major routes. Unless you are dully equipped for winter weather.


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## powerplus (Oct 6, 2014)

hi salomon

we are looking at the end of the month 

taking about 2 weeks to get to the top of spain

i will keep an eye out for the weather for then

could i ask you about the weather nearer the end of the month

barry


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

barryd said:


> Captain Over looks all confused in that photo. Had you been giving him too many Leffes?


That's my 'relaxed/laid back' look.:laugh:

Why does Alan's Arto look whiter than ours and our grill looks crinkly? Maybe that is why I am confused.


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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)

fatbuddha said:


> the only Pyrenees crossing I would be wary of is the Tunnel d'Aragnouet between Bielsa and St Lary if coming from Spain. the descent from the tunnel is very steep and very twisting and will test your brakes and mental resolve if it's wet. we've only done it once, but our brake pads were smoking from overheating by the time we got to the bottom!!


Yes we followed a 40footer down that winding hill at about 3 mph , it was obvious that his brakes had failed as as soon as he got to a suitable place on the flat he jumped out phone in hand, however that area aroung Aragnouet was one of the nicest places we have been to ie the mountain road up to all the lakes and mountain walks culminating at Lac de Cap de Long and the Piau Engaly ski centre - plenty of MH parking . Apart from that I think Barry D's blog just about covers it except maybe for the Lac Du Tech in the next valley over from Lac Estaing , a liitle motorhome park there too.


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

Gretchibald said:


> Yes* we followed a 40footer down that winding hill at about 3 mph ,* it was obvious that his brakes had failed as as soon as he got to a suitable place on the flat he jumped out phone in hand, however that area aroung Aragnouet was one of the nicest places we have been to ie the mountain road up to all the lakes and mountain walks culminating at Lac de Cap de Long and the Piau Engaly ski centre - plenty of MH parking . Apart from that I think Barry D's blog just about covers it except maybe for the Lac Du Tech in the next valley over from Lac Estaing , a liitle motorhome park there too.


You wonder whether he had dropped down to second gear, or even first gear? Why ride the brakes? Just realised you might have meant an Artic with a 40' container on its trailer.

I know some people are nervous about jamming into a lower gear on the clutch, and have not learnt the technique of double-de-clutching. I once drove from Wetherby to St. Albans with no clutch.

On another tack - social:

I am starting to think there is a 'Coterie' of some members on this and other forums who enjoy the mountains - Alan and Jayne, Barry and Michelle, Basia and myself, Sarah and Robbie, for starters, and probably many others. Maybe we should form a little sub-forum. If so, a little sub-meet on an Aire up in the clear air and blue skies with raptors wheeling overhead - might be just the antedote to listening to people moaning about wardens>

Geoff


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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)

Yes Geoff , although I would be unable to mountain climb or even mountain walk much now , just looking at that unspoilt majestic scene does it for me, but with you on the way down and BarryD and me on the way up, best chance for a liittle impromtu meet on a hill would probably be in the volcanic region just SW of Clermont eg Puy Mary- will keep in touch.

Apologies to the OP for hijacking a bit.


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Sounds like a good idea. I still struggle with brakes on big long drags even when using the gears. The Col de La Bonette was the worst (Roof of Europe) it goes on for ever and despite just using first and second gear when we hit the first village heading south the rear brakes were pretty much on fire. 

Its an exceptional hill that one though. Downhill all the way to the Med 60 miles south. 

The old scooter was the scariest though as the brakes would start to go on that and it was an automatic and being a two stroke no engine braking. Easier to fling into a hedge than the van though.


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## salomon (Apr 20, 2011)

Yep. We worry about brakes too. We wanted to fit...forgive the English please, I think it is called ...electromagnetic retarder ? We know others that have it. But we cannot find any examples in Andorra and whether it will pass the ITV if we do it abroad. Fine sustem though.

But we usually " do " mountains in winter. Oh, and we live in them too &#55357;&#56898;


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Can you get ceramic brakes for Motorhomes? 

Its one thing coming down in 1st or 2nd but it can get a bit laborious. You get gassed in our van as well. There seems to be some kind of blow back of diesel or exhaust fumes that end up in the cab on a long drag downhill without the throttle being used followed by a huge wall of smoke from the exhaust when you finally give it the beans on the flat or up the next hill. Its always been like that. Just had it all overhauled so it might not do it now.


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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)

....mind you, for some, all the mountain scenery paled into insignificance when the " Baby Donkeys! " apeared .

( near lac D'Payolle)


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## powerplus (Oct 6, 2014)

hi
just after a update on the weather in the Pyrenees

and also advice on the roads 

i was thinking of the n230 or the n20 and just was a bit worried on taking my 7.5m m/home on them

and was seeking some resurgence from you hardened m/homers as to whether the roads are fine
as i have not ventured up there before

barry


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## HermanHymer (Dec 5, 2008)

I personally haven't ever taken my moho to the Pyrenees, but have done a few trips there by car. Fave spot - Lac de Gaube in the National Park near Cauteret. Also Gavarnie - lovely spot to go walking. 

Mind-blowing experience (best avoided!) travelling in the proximity of the Tour route in the week before the mountain stages. You won't believe there can be so many motorhomes, and a (not necessarily) flat space un-parked on. They must take it in turns opening the doors. Unbelievable!! Scary!!


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## GMJ (Jun 24, 2014)

We prefer mountains too generally.









Gutted I couldn't take the MH over the Stelvio 2 years as the road was closed but the other route via Livigno was very special anyhow.

We recently had a very pleasant drive up from the south coast of France towards Grenoble spending some time in the Haute Alpes...very nice too :smile2:

Graham :smile2:


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## HermanHymer (Dec 5, 2008)

GMJ said:


> We prefer mountains too generally.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My grand-daughter had her first skiing holiday in Livigno over Christmas. I saw in the pics there was a big moho park there. Thank goodness for snow cannons, there was minimal natural snow, but it meant the weather wasn't too hectic for a tropical lass.


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## GMJ (Jun 24, 2014)

It was 'MoHo central' when we went through. I think there were at least 3 massive MH sites there. We commented at the time that we had never seen so many in one place and it wasn't even full!

Aside from that though it looked like a nice Alpine town.

I think the price of fuel probably helped as its a tax free area and diesel was around 75cents a litre or so!

Gutted as I had done the sensible thing and filled up prior to tackling the mountains!

Graham :smile2:


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

HermanHymer said:


> I personally haven't ever taken my moho to the Pyrenees, but have done a few trips there by car. Fave spot - Lac de Gaube in the National Park near Cauteret. Also Gavarnie - lovely spot to go walking.
> 
> Mind-blowing experience (best avoided!) travelling in the proximity of the Tour route in the week before the mountain stages. You won't believe there can be so many motorhomes, and a (not necessarily) flat space un-parked on. They must take it in turns opening the doors. Unbelievable!! Scary!!


Viv

Pyrenees is not difficult and Barry, Alan (Gretchibald) and we have all been to Gavarnie and similar.[Alan and Jayne and we met there by accident] We all have similar-sized MHs, bigger than your teeny-weeny one.:wink2:. Once you get into te mountains drivers seem to be more considerate as they know the criteria.

Just do it - some remarkable views to wake up to.

Pyrenees was one of my big motivations for a MH after many years in yachting.

Geoff


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

powerplus said:


> hi
> just after a update on the weather in the Pyrenees
> 
> and also advice on the roads
> ...


Barry, you have nothing to worry about on those roads. If I were you I would start having a look at streetview to put yourself at ease. Here is the N230 going up towards France.

https://goo.gl/maps/kbBgcoxPPsy

It only gets windy when you turn off towards Bagneres du Luchon in France onto the N141 and go over the top but we have done it on a scooter and there are HGVs and coaches on most of them. Remember as well Google Streetview often makes these roads look smaller than they are but as you can see they are pretty much highways. Good quality roads, plenty of room

N141 over to Bagneres

https://goo.gl/maps/sFMyw4RmeyB2

The M20 I think is in France. It joins the E9, not sure if I have been over it but it looks fine.

https://goo.gl/maps/CPpD5bbnZ1k

All these roads are perfectly fine for motorhomes, if you pick any of the main routes through you should not have any issues. Going up is easy and the most enjoyable, just remember coming down to use the gears rather than the brakes as much as possible. Generally the descents are seldom above 10%. There are much steeper hills in the UK but the length of the descents is why you need to use your gears. Just stick it in Second and take your time. Enjoy the ride, its some of the best scenery in Europe!


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## salomon (Apr 20, 2011)

But there is snow forecast.
No, I am not joking.

1500m is the snow level. It will ( should ) not stay so no need for worries, just so you are aware.

Major storms and lots of wind. Expect a rocky night of you intend staying. And it will not be warm.

Safe travels


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## GMJ (Jun 24, 2014)

Barry, Geoff et al

How do you think we would fare in our 8.7m long MH?

Graham :smile2:


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

GMJ said:


> Barry, Geoff et al
> 
> How do you think we would fare in our 8.7m long MH?
> 
> Graham :smile2:


No problem, certainly on those types of roads. I assume your van width will be the same as all the others and ours. If you ever get around to reading the guide I did, the only time we got caught out was towards the end of the trip where I took my eye of the ball and was a bit flippant with the next days route as we drove down out of the Pyrenees towards the coast. Ended up on about 20 miles of single track road which wasnt even on the road map with a 2000 ft drop on one side and no barrier. Met a French block coming the other way who refused to reverse 20 yards to a passing place which proved interesting.  That was my fault though and again length wasnt the problem.

The roads in the Pyrenees are excellent and of course most of the Aires and wild spots are huge spaces so no problem parking a big van at the likes of Gavarnie, Lac de Payole, Cirque de Troumouse etc.


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

GMJ said:


> Barry, Geoff et al
> 
> How do you think we would fare in our 8.7m long MH?
> 
> Graham :smile2:


Before we answer it would be helpful if you say how long your rear overhang is from the rear wheels.

Geoff


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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)

mmm suppose a lot depends on how cautious/confident a driver you are , me , well as an ex HGV1 driver probably confident but very cautious where I take the motorhome. Anyway as Barry said the main roads are in excellent condition, well maintained and regularly used by tour buses and HGV,s so easily negotiable with your MH however there are some narrow bits and very tight bends where you need to be wary of meeting those buses and HGVs. If you look at a map of the Pyrenees you will see that the mountains/valleys run mainly Nth/Sth and going with the flow that way is easy but I would avoid taking shortcuts east/West . For example if you wanted to visit from Cauterets to Lac Estaing to Lac Du Teh ( highly recommended) it would be better to go back to Argeles Gazost each time and then down the next valley than to take what looks like a short cut over the mountains . Acouple of exceptions to this east/west rule would be going from say Arreau to Luz Saint Sauveur over the Col de Tourmalet, just a couple of little tight turns but stunning open scenery and an absolute must if you are in the area. Again with the road between Arrens Marsous and Laruns , a few tight bends/tunnels but the rest is worth it. Some clips here but probably only representative of the 'bad ' bits.
Sometimes I will even sus a road out on the scooter before I take the MH on it , that's how I know that some of the 'shortcut' roads are unsuitable , well passable but not enjoyable.


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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)




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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)




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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)




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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)




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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)




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## GMJ (Jun 24, 2014)

nicholsong said:


> Before we answer it would be helpful if you say how long your rear overhang is from the rear wheels.
> 
> Geoff


Couldn't tell you off the top of my head Geoff. I'll have to wait and measure it when I'm next with the MH. Its not excessive and certainly not as much as many we have seen out and about.

Graham :smile2:


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

GMJ said:


> Couldn't tell you off the top of my head Geoff. I'll have to wait and measure it when I'm next with the MH. Its not excessive and certainly not as much as many we have seen out and about.
> 
> Graham :smile2:


As Barry and Alan have already said there is generally no problem with extra length. The only eason I asked about overhang is that gong up to some small Lacs we did encounter some steep hairpins where it would be possible to ground the back end, but generally OK if one swings on the outside of the curve, traffic permitting. The places where they might be should be obvious if one is looking up the slope from the valley and looking at map/satnav for any sharp bends at the steeper bits.

However they are rare.

Just go for it - the Pyrenees are well worthwhile.

Take plenty of provisions for higher levels as you might want to stay several days in the best places. Also if you use LPG there are only filling stations in the busier parts of the valleys, so make a note of them and be sure to fill if you are passing. We had to make a 18km diversion for LPG between valleys one time, but if you have two 11kg bottles you would be fine - our back-up is Calor so I am reluctant to touch it as cannot refill. Maybe I should dump it for a French one.

Geoff


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## GMJ (Jun 24, 2014)

Thanks Geoff

I don't think we'll be going over them for a while yet tbh due to other commitments but you never know :smile2:. Next years plans are fluid as we will be putting the house on the market at Easter-time and moving back to Wales so a f=great deal depends upon that.

We plan to start wintering in SE Spain from Jan 2019 so might be able to see some of the Pyrenees (snow/weather permitting) when we return at the end of March.

Gas-wise: I have managed to acquire a Spanish gas cylinder and adaptor for when we are in Spain so I reckon 2 11kg Propane plus that will do us for a 3 month trip. MH runs on diesel.

Graham :smile2:


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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)

Some are daredevils. I know that Geoff drove his MH up this road.


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## Gretchibald (Jul 22, 2011)

sorry, this road .


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

I agree with Gretch (Alan) it was the East to west route driving off the Pyrenees towards St Jean du Luz that caught us out. The north to south routes are all fine. If your going to cut across just try and either streetview it online first, scooter up it if you have one or just make sure its actually on the map.  Generally if you see a 3.5t limit avoid it. Unless your Nicholsong of course.


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## powerplus (Oct 6, 2014)

hi all

we we finally did it and crossed on some smaller roads just west of andora

we were so pleased that we drove over in that area and the roads were fine but quite steep and tight in places

my x250 2.2 coped fine and there was never a time when it struggled

from there we poodled up to our friends in the dordogne they are having a barn conversion and the builder did a runner half way through

so i spent a week tidying up the roof timbers and putting noggins in the floor joist stop them twisting and generally tidied up all the heavy timber roof tiles are laid ok but we arranged for a local roofer to re do the ridge tiles and finish the gable ends

i needed to do this as they were so disillusioned with the whole project but now they are keen again 

i allways fancied doing a barn conversion but glad i did not now as i could see what is involved

i should be popping back later this year to put up some stud walls so that the electrics and plumbing can get done

everything in france is completely different to the uk and seemed a little strange to me

but at least our friends can now tidy up now and go home for the summer feeling fairly positive


barry


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