# EHU cables and 'new' CC rules



## 1302 (Apr 4, 2006)

Been meaning to post this for a couple of weeks.

We stayed at the CC at Castleton over New Years - our friends were on a 'posh pitch' or whatever they call it and for some reason their EHU was a bit of a stretch away. Maurice (my mate) connected two sets of leads together - as I do regularily/both my leads are about 25m each - and he was toldby the site fella that under new rules and regs this was not allowed. He let him off this time and allowed the connection of two sets of properly made up IP rated leads but stressed that new rules meant that in future 'joints' were not allowed and a one peice long lead would be needed. 

This sounds daft to me as the proper plug and socket 'Gewiss' connectors I have are fully IP rated and never caused me any problems with wet or similar.


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## rogerblack (May 1, 2005)

Well if there are new rules banning joined hook-up cables they are not covered by the advice currently given on the CC website which simply says it is not recommended:

http://www.caravanclub.co.uk/media/1026258/hookinguptothemains.pdf

"Shorter cables may not reach
from the bollard to your van on some sites and
extra connector cables to add length are NOT
recommended. The Club cannot accept
responsibility for any damage or injury caused
by the use of extra connector cables. It is
recommended that the cable is coloured orange
for visibility in long grass."

The C&CC advice is more specific (and technically helpful in advising to raise the connection off the ground, since the IP rating for these connectors does not cover immersion):

http://www.campingandcaravanningclu...ower/electricity-for-campers-and-caravanners/

in particular, under "Your supply cable"

"The use of a second cable is not recommended, but if it is used it must be fitted with the same BS EN 60309-2 standard plug and connector. The connection between the two cables should be raised off the ground. Taped cable joints and ordinary 13A household plugs and sockets must not be used under any circumstances. The cable is normally coloured orange so that it's visible and avoids being damaged by grass cutting and other activities on site."


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## jedi (Nov 22, 2007)

Can't believe the CC have thought up another rule :lol:


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## listerdiesel (Aug 3, 2012)

Mine are Blue in colour, which indicates that they are 240V, Yellow for 110V, Orange is just 'outdoor' cable.

As 1302 says, a properly assembled extension and extra cable shouldn't be an issue, nobody is going to carry a 100m roll of cable on the off-chance.

Peter


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## drcotts (Feb 23, 2006)

If they are quoting "new regs" than they might like to read the latest reg concerning suppying power outlet on caravan sites which clearly state that outlets should be more more then 20m from the pitch.

I wonder how long the site has been going.

bs7671 2008 with latest amendment.
Of course this only applies to new builds so they are obvioulsy picking the relevant rule to suit themselves.

Half the time its the warden though and not the club and some of them just feel the need to assert their authority.


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

listerdiesel said:


> nobody is going to carry a 100m roll of cable on the off-chance. Peter


Sadly Peter, I'm that one. Mine adds up to 250m. ......... Ray.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

listerdiesel said:


> Mine are Blue in colour, which indicates that they are 240V, Yellow for 110V, Orange is just 'outdoor' cable.
> Peter


You learn something new every day, does White have any significance Peter, although It's just for internal use in the build in this case.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

raynipper said:


> listerdiesel said:
> 
> 
> > nobody is going to carry a 100m roll of cable on the off-chance. Peter
> ...


Nice one Ray, do you have a plug to fit lamp posts then..

If you get held up just point them to the cable it's worth more than the contents of the safe these days, it must weight a fair bit though, but you seem to have plenty of payload.


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Yes Kev, quite weighty. I only carry the lot to Le Mans and shed most of them for general use. 
We got used to having considerable lengths in the film game. Old habits die hard... :roll: 

Ray.


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## wakk44 (Jun 15, 2006)

listerdiesel said:


> ................................ nobody is going to carry a 100m roll of cable on the off-chance.
> 
> Peter


Unless you are French :roll:

I have seen a couple of motorhomers on aires in France roll out a large extension reel of thin cable(looked about 1.5mm)and then fit a coupler into someone else's electric supply. 

The CC rule makers would have a fit if they saw some of the electricity connections on the French Aires.The busy aire at Honfleur was particularly bad with thin extension cables and couplers everywhere,it looked like spaghetti junction. 8O


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

You do need a few extensions to power this lot in the middle of a field...... Ray.


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## dhutchy (Feb 7, 2010)

When working on building sites if we use cables joined together(110v) they lose power if you take them long distances.Just wondered does this apply to 240v and if this is anything to do with it.


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

the thing that I find surprising is that a CC site has a pitch that far away from the hook up bollard  
The only time I have joined cables together,was a long time ago in France. I joined three! I carried one long, one medium and one short equalling two full length cables.  
I can't see the point in rolling out a long cable if the bollard is right by your van and I cringe when I see cables still rolled and in use  
They can and do get hot, if rolled and running fan heaters


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## eddievanbitz (May 1, 2005)

Having had a run in with a moronic CC warden and the "rules" I would suggest that anyone staying on a club site carry their handbook in the van.

There are surprisingly few rules.

However, if you do complain about a warden you cannot expect to get anything in writing, nor for the club to move very quickly about a complaint.

We were quoted things like "You can only park your car on the grass if you have a caravan. If you have a car and a motorhome you have to leave your car in the car park" and the best one "When it gets dark, your expected to sit inside your unit"

Both these of course were challenged and after arguments ignored.

However, the wardens were quoting this nonsense as chapter and verse of the "rules"

When the complaint to head office finally got filtered down to an area manager, I asked if the wardens were either Incompetent, badly trained or liars he replied" it isn't that straightforward"

Yes it is, wardens do not make the rules, and they shouldn't hide behind them suggesting that "It's a new CC rule"

Eddie


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## Christine600 (Jan 20, 2011)

dhutchy said:


> When working on building sites if we use cables joined together(110v) they lose power if you take them long distances.Just wondered does this apply to 240v and if this is anything to do with it.


Yes they loose something like 10% on a 25m cable I belive. (I'm sure someone knows more correct values). So if you join several you can get a large not drop so that appliances stop working.

And the voltage may be too low for the fuses to operate correctly. Ie they may not go off when they should.


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## Techno100 (May 8, 2010)

The problem of continually extending cable is that it increases the earth loop impedance possibly to an extent that the circuit protective device will not disconnect fast enough in the event of a fault


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Techno100 said:


> The problem of continually extending cable is that it increases the earth loop impedance possibly to an extent that the circuit protective device will not disconnect fast enough in the event of a fault


Thats OK Techno,
I'm from the old school where we licked a finger and tested which one was 'live'.
ECLB, RCD are for wimps.!!!.. 8O

Ray.


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## Rosbotham (May 4, 2008)

Summat wrong here. I've stayed at 50+ CC sites, including Losehill/Castleton, and never had a pitch that wasn't within 25M of a bollard. So the issue should never arise. Suspect either his cable was short or he was using the wrong bollard....


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## Techno100 (May 8, 2010)

BS7671 page 192 says in simple terms that for a 16amp hook up a cable should be minimum 2.5mm and a maximum of 25 metres long.
For higher current ratings a cross sectional area must be chosen so that secure tripping of the overcurrent protective device is acheived at the lowest fault current calculated at the end of the cord extension set.

Thus 
If you use smaller and longer cables you will not meet the safety requirements.

It's no coincidence that off the shelf hook up cables meet those requirements


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## dovtrams (Aug 18, 2009)

Me thinks this is an 'over-zealous' warden. The words are in italics as that is the phrase used by the CC when I made my one and only complaint to them about an idiot I encountered at Culloden CC site. There were only three other units on the site and he came rushing up to tell me I should not be filling up my MH from the water point and should used the designated MH point. In the morning as we were leaving, he was hiding behind a caravan spying on us to see what we were doing and again complained when I used the convenient CDP rather than go all the around the site to the MH one. 

Strange person indeed, not like the vast majority of CC wardens who book you on, give you advice if you need it and say cheerio when you leave, all very relaxing as it should be.

Dave


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## Techno100 (May 8, 2010)

Bear in mind that the Electricity regulations are NOT LAW but are used as the reference point by the HSE in the event of an investigation that could lead to prison :lol:


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## Fatalhud (Mar 3, 2006)

The problem with most hook up lead, plugs / sockets are that they only have an IP rating of 44 (see chart)



IP 68 would be better if plug & socket where to be left sat on grass

Also there can also be problems with Volt drop over long runs, and the lower the voltage the higher the current required to run your appliances

240 volt running a load of 1000 watt is around 4.16 Amp
200 volt running a load of 1000 watt is around 5 Amp


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

Christine600 said:


> dhutchy said:
> 
> 
> > When working on building sites if we use cables joined together(110v) they lose power if you take them long distances.Just wondered does this apply to 240v and if this is anything to do with it.
> ...


The volts drop in the cable will depend upon the amps drawn, as per ohms law. 
There are possibly many tens of metres of cable between the site distribution and the pitch bollard so adding an 'extra' 25m may or may not have any effect, it depend upon the load i.e watts that you are placing on it.


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## Fatalhud (Mar 3, 2006)

rayc said:


> Christine600 said:
> 
> 
> > dhutchy said:
> ...


Voltage drop is also effected by cable size
The cables feeding the hook up posts will be 6mm/sq or bigger
normal hook up cables are either 1.5mm/sq or 2.5mm/sq
if you think you will join several leads together then 2.5mm/sq cable gives less volt drop per metre than 1.5mm/sq

you should also consider making sure your leads are made up from Artic grade cable which is rated for lower temps

Alan H


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

When I ran the three leads (two full leads in total length) in France it was on a Municipal site at Confolens. I doubt it was 16 amp and everything worked as we wanted.  
As I said earlier, it is strange that a CC site has a bollard so far away!


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

Fatalhud said:


> The problem with most hook up lead, plugs / sockets are that they only have an IP rating of 44 (see chart)
> 
> IP 68 would be better if plug & socket where to be left sat on grass
> 
> ...


If we assume there is 5 amp being drawn and a 40 volt drop through the cable then the resistance of the cable is 8 ohms. 
How many hook up cables would have to be joined together to give a volts drop of 40v whilst attempting to supply 1000w? 
How much is the voltage drop through two 25m cables compared to one at the 1000w load?

I believe the cable will have a resistance of 0.02 ohms/m so if my maths are correct that is 400 metres for a total of 8 ohms.

Having worked in Saudi Arabia at hospitals under construction by Korean companies, I have often seen 2.5mm extensions of over 100m being used to power tools etc. It is very interesting when there is a fault and the cable catches fire because the fuse is rated so high that the cable is in effect protecting it rather than the other way round. The fuse may also have been replaced by a nail due to previous blowing.


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

All these rules, regulations and requirements, are we any safer?

The old saying about the Titanic was built to be 'unsinkable' because it was built to regs.

As soon as you introduce the 'Human Element' (pun intended) to electricity, we are all doomed.!!

One nicked strand, one too tight terminal, one poor contact, etc. A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link.!!

Ray.


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## listerdiesel (Aug 3, 2012)

Fatalhud said:


> Also there can also be problems with Volt drop over long runs, and the lower the voltage the higher the current required to run your appliances
> 
> 240 volt running a load of 1000 watt is around 4.16 Amp
> 200 volt running a load of 1000 watt is around 5 Amp


It doesn't work out quite like that.

If you take the resistance of the appliance at 240V, it will give you 4.16A or whatever, but at the lower voltage the resistance of the load hasn't changed, so as the supply voltage goes down, the current drawn will also reduce, along the lines of Ohm's Law.

The only possible exceptions would be reactive loads such as flourescent lights, transformers and motors which have a different resistance and reactance according to frequency, and some auto-ranging switch-mode supplies that would operate at the lower voltage but take more current automatically to maintain their output.

Peter


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## jedi (Nov 22, 2007)

Hmmmmmm :? 

I'm lost. I think I'll stick to my solar panel :lol: 

Jed


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## andyandsue (Sep 7, 2008)

*mmmmmmm*

Having paid a fortune to stay at a posh CC ,C&CC site id expect hot shaving water delivered to the van AM let alone a bollard at least 25M away,

PS Tech is spot on about the length of leads .....any longer than 25m and you run the risk of the fuses etc not working correctly if you have an accident or misuse your electrical equipment

Regs are a boring fact of life but they are there ,usually out of site, silently keeping people safe ( esp those who cant be bothered , or are complacent )

The difficult bit is introducing them sensibly ;letting the person see the sensible side ....this is often the stumbling block for large organisations


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## listerdiesel (Aug 3, 2012)

raynipper said:


> All these rules, regulations and requirements, are we any safer? Ray.


Generally, yes we are.

I can remember as a child in the early 1950's getting a shock from a mains socket that was unshuttered, 15A 3-pin round probably, not to mention the metal lampholders and switches, the plugs that allowed you to run an appliance off the lighting socket, fabric/rubber covered cables, unshielded ring connections on electric cookers and so on

I'd say that we are definitely safer, but in making us safer the regulations have made us stupid as well, in that we accept everything as written and don't question it any more.

The quality of UK-produced electrical goods is second to none, it's just a shame that the EU allows so much rubbish to be imported from China without more scrutiny or proper testing.

Peter


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## Gazzer (May 1, 2005)

raynipper said:


> listerdiesel said:
> 
> 
> > nobody is going to carry a 100m roll of cable on the off-chance. Peter
> ...


As they say. There's always one........ :lol:


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## KeithChesterfield (Mar 12, 2010)

You should see the length of mine .......


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## papaken (Nov 21, 2010)

Sh**  
I have just recently cut my cable into 3 managable lengths of 20,15 and15 metres with the correct connectors as i was sick of having to coil the full length when i had just a short run out. :lol:


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## listerdiesel (Aug 3, 2012)

We have two, about 12m long, one has the Euro outdoor connector to 16A BS4343, the other is a straight 16A extension.

We only use EHU at Nuenen, and this year we probably won't even use that, although it is useful to run the Carver Cascade II water heater element to speed up the shower in the morning.

The little genny would run the heater if we needed it to, but it's purely for convenience, the gas side does it in about 20 minutes from cold.

Peter


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## pippin (Nov 15, 2007)

_You should see the length of mine ......._

Oooh er missus


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

The more I read about site 'rules', whether made by the site owner/club or their employees, the less I am encouraged to use them.

I am quite self-sufficient and safe in my MH.

It might also be instructive for those residents in certain areas, e.g. Scarborough, who argue that Mhs should use campsites, to look at the rules to see why owners might prefer to wild-camp. Some of those 'whingers' would probably whinge at campsite rules if they had to comply with them.:roll: 

Geoff


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## 1302 (Apr 4, 2006)

Rosbotham said:


> Summat wrong here. I've stayed at 50+ CC sites, including Losehill/Castleton, and never had a pitch that wasn't within 25M of a bollard. .


A number of pitches were water-logged. My mate wasnt necessarily connected to the one usually associated with its own pitch and hence need to join.

The issue was water ingress at the connection , not volt drop (which in 25m of cable in minimal) Despite the rule they agreed to let him off just this once.


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## rayrecrok (Nov 21, 2008)

KeithChesterfield said:


> You should see the length of mine .......


Huh! I bet it isn't much longer than 6 inches on a warm day.. :wink: :lol: :lol: :lol:

And no, I for one don't want to see how long it is. 

ray.


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## rogerblack (May 1, 2005)

papaken said:


> Sh**
> I have just recently cut my cable into 3 managable lengths of 20,15 and15 metres with the correct connectors as i was sick of having to coil the full length when i had just a short run out. :lol:


Similarly, I cut our 25m into two, one of 10m and one of 15m so I can use the minimum necessary to reach the supply - 10m being the most used.

When I use both, I ensure the IP44 connection point is off the ground, either clipped on a hedge or fence, or on top of an upturned plastic basin or bucket. I did come back once to find someone had turned the basin over and placed the connections inside! :? 
Thankfully, it hadn't rained . . . :roll:


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## Techno100 (May 8, 2010)

Hook points must NOT be more than 20 metres from the point at which it will be connected to a caravan on its pitch.
page 191


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## 1302 (Apr 4, 2006)

Whilst we were touring France we saw a few people using a cover which went over the joint of the plug and socket to protect it. I never built up enough courage to ask where they had bought such a thing 

Some of the extension lead set ups in Europe were very tatty indeed. Bog standard extension reels connecting to a short length of 'proper' socket seemed to be commonplace.

In Italy we ended up being connected to our next door neighbour who in turn was connecxted to the guy next door who eventually connected to the supply. No tripping or blowing of fuses so it all worked fine. :lol:


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## rayrecrok (Nov 21, 2008)

Hi..

Sometimes needs must.

I have a 5 ltr plastic bait container from fishing, I have drilled two holes in for cable in and cable out, then cut a single cut with the Stanley knife joining the top where the lid goes down to the holes so I can slide down the cable into the holes so the plug and socket is inside the container. I just the put the top back on so everything is encased.

Turn it upside down so the lid is on the bottom, put a stone on top to stop it blowing about.

ray.


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

I bought one of these last week from Stax Tradecentres

http://www.brennenstuhl.com/content...hop/produkte.php&hauptrubrik=232&details=2832

tony


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

GEMMY said:


> I bought one of these last week from Stax Tradecentres
> 
> http://www.brennenstuhl.com/content...hop/produkte.php&hauptrubrik=232&details=2832
> 
> tony


They look good Tony  trouble is it's something else to carry around  
I must be a cheapskate as I would use a plastic bag, but making sure that should any water come into the bag, it would drain out and not form a pool :lol:


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## listerdiesel (Aug 3, 2012)

Bit of black or brown rain gutter downpipe.

Peter


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

GEMMY said:


> I bought one of these last week from Stax Tradecentres
> 
> http://www.brennenstuhl.com/content...hop/produkte.php&hauptrubrik=232&details=2832
> 
> tony


But has it been tested, approved and stamped by the 'CC Wardens Co-operative'?  :lol: :lol: :lol:

Geoff


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

nicholsong said:


> GEMMY said:
> 
> 
> > I bought one of these last week from Stax Tradecentres
> ...


Doesn't make any difference really, as all hook up bollards should be within the 25 metre hook up lead zone. :wink:


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## rogerblack (May 1, 2005)

GEMMY said:


> I bought one of these last week from Stax Tradecentres
> 
> http://www.brennenstuhl.com/content...hop/produkte.php&hauptrubrik=232&details=2832
> 
> tony


Thanks for the 'lead'!

Note however that this only seems to be rated at IP44 so is still not suitable for standing water hence doesn't improve on the weather rating of the standard blue connectors . . .


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## Chudders (Jul 5, 2008)

listerdiesel said:


> Fatalhud said:
> 
> 
> > Also there can also be problems with Volt drop over long runs, and the lower the voltage the higher the current required to run your appliances
> ...


As stated above resistive loads still have the same resistance at a lower voltage. A kettle at a lower voltage for instance will just take longer to boil. The regs do indeed state that a hook up bollard max distance should be no more than 20mtrs and that the hook up cable should be 25 M max. They also state that there should be only one RCD per hook up, not one RCD protecting two or more hook ups as is often the case in loder installations. Its not the volt drop that is so much of a problem but the Earth Fault Loop Impedance and therefore the "disconnection time" of the protective device which under some circumstances may or may not operate.
The regs as stated are not law but will certainly be used in any prosecution by H&SE etc. The reason why some sites have greater distances is that the regs are not retrospective. New installations since the latest regs must comply and be tested as such.
The cheap plug in testers that many carry only show if an earth connection is present. It gives no indication as to the integrity and effectiveness of the earth. (More expensive ones do show a little more information)
It,s a bit of a nightmare for those of us involved in Electrical Inspection and Testing.


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

IP 44

http://www.lightingillusions.com.au/service/definition.php?definition_id=19

tony


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

Grath, the only time I've needed to join 2 cables has been at the Aire at Tier,

However to get to the bottom of my garden I've needed 75 metres which entails 2 leads, so, I've got a use for home and away.  

tony


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Picked up one of these at a boot sale last year for €1. Bloke had a box full, maybe should have bought more?..................... Ray.


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## grizzlyj (Oct 14, 2008)

I seem to remember the connector rain proof boxes being quite common in French DIY shops, a few quid only. One on Ebay item no. 220939338587 Linky

Since some CC sites are owned by them, and most are of course not, then would that effect how the rules are implemented? If it was your site then you could still insist on certain things using the CC rules as guidelines?


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

rogerblack said:


> GEMMY said:
> 
> 
> > I bought one of these last week from Stax Tradecentres
> ...


Roger, Roger

Surely you must know that if you wrap a PROBLEM inside a CONUNDRUM inside an EGNIGMA, put it in a PLASTIC BOX and wrap it in DUCK TAPE it can solve any problem? :wink:

Geoff


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## pippin (Nov 15, 2007)

I don't want to add to the debate about whether one should or should not use extension cables.

BUT - if you do, there is a simple solution and that is to use IP67 rated blue connectors.

All the stuff that has been mentioned so far has been to IP44 which gives virtually NO protection from rain and dew.
(chocolate teapot comes to mind)

http://cpc.farnell.com/pro-power/pew1663svb/plug-240v-2p-e-ip67/dp/PL08986?Ntt=pl08986

and

http://cpc.farnell.com/pro-power/pew1663pvb/coupler-16a-240v/dp/PL08988?Ntt=pl08988

are not that much more expensive than IP44 types.

They are what I use.


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## grizzlyj (Oct 14, 2008)

pippin said:


> I don't want to add to the debate about whether one should or should not use extension cables.
> 
> BUT - if you do, there is a simple solution and that is to use IP67 rated blue connectors.
> 
> ...


Pippin can they still be used everywhere the more "normal" ones are? The female version you link to seems to be too bulky to fit on my MH inlet? So if I used the IP67 ones that would only be for joining two cables? I've not seen them in the flesh so to speak


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## listerdiesel (Aug 3, 2012)

I think that the flap on the IP67 trailing socket isn't going to fit into the standard AC inlet box that most of us have, but would be happy to be proven wrong.

I think ours is pretty tight with the standard IP44 socket and flap, the Farnell ones seem to be larger on the flap size. The rest of it is standard BS4343/CEE17 standard.

I'll have a look at ours tonight and measure the room for the sealing flap.

Peter


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

A IP 44 blue joint encased in a IP44 box is surely rated at IP88 8) :lol: 

tony


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

OR

Maybe if any site does not provide EHU near enough to the pitch (presumably to save money) the site should provide the cable and connectors - which the 'customer' can then check as being in conformity ('rules') with whatever rules/recommendations the customer wishes to quote. :wink:    

Geoff


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## aultymer (Jun 20, 2006)

After my cable got damaged (nibbled by mice!!) I used an IP67 plug and socket to join the 2 bits. 
The IP67 socket will NOT fit into the van inlet. The IP67 plug fits all supply posts (so far). This just means that the same bit of cable has to be used to connect to the van whether the extension bit is needed or not.


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## Jamsieboy (Jan 14, 2011)

Simples - ask helpful CC Warden to move you to a pitch closer to hook-up point and continue to use the one cable!


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## pippin (Nov 15, 2007)

That is correct.

The IP67 free *socket* will *not* fit into the fixed IP44 *plug* on the side of the MH.

However, the IP67 *plug* should fit into the IP44 *socket* on the EHU bollard unless it is recessed.

Thus you will need one cable with IP44 socket for the MH connection to an IP67 plug. You will normally use that lead.

Your extension cable should have an IP67 socket on one end (for the join) and an IP44 or IP67 plug at the other end to go into the EHU bollard.

Even the most eagle-eyed/officious warden should accept the inherent safety of two IP67 connectors mated together.


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## 1302 (Apr 4, 2006)

grizzlyj said:


> female ...
> inlet...
> flesh...


Oooooh Matron - what are we on about now?! :lol:


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## pippin (Nov 15, 2007)

All this talk of the gender of connectors is getting me confused with the thread concurrently running regarding the bid for the "Gay Games".

In this PC world (small "w") are we allowed to use the terms male and female to describe connectors?

I would not want to be held responsible for a homosexual, transgender, cross-dresser or whatever killing himself/herself/itself by being unable to relate to the standard anatomical references used to describe plugs and sockets.

Tongue in cheek!


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

'Tongue in cheek!

Which cheek?


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## grizzlyj (Oct 14, 2008)

listerdiesel said:


> I'll have a look at ours tonight and measure the room for the sealing flap.
> 
> Peter


I was going to comment on Mr Lister's quiet night in but didn't want to embarrass the poor lad.

Then in jumps 1302 totally misquoting me in a deeply disturbing way 8O 

Anyhow, surely the sexual orientation of a connector must be straight forward?  What can I possibly have said to upset an IP67 thingy? 8O :lol:


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## Techno100 (May 8, 2010)

If only people were as straight forward as connectors :lol:


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## pippin (Nov 15, 2007)

Actually I think I spoke too soon.

The Shuko mains plug is a bit of a hermaphrodite.


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## IanA (Oct 30, 2010)

My local council is considering banning the use of Mr or Mrs as it may cause anxiety to a Trans-gender person if they have to make a choice.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...tect-citys-transgender-community-offence.html

and to maintain a balanced view:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/oct/26/brighton-council-gender-neutral-transgender


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

[Deleted - off topic]


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## 747 (Oct 2, 2009)

IanA said:


> My local council is considering banning the use of Mr or Mrs as it may cause anxiety to a Trans-gender person if they have to make a choice.
> 
> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...tect-citys-transgender-community-offence.html
> 
> ...


So, according to the Guardian article, if I was a transgender (Mx) who was also a cyclist, could I have the title BMX in front of my name? :?


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## Sprinta (Sep 15, 2010)

papaken said:


> Sh**
> I have just recently cut my cable into 3 managable lengths of 20,15 and15 metres with the correct connectors as i was sick of having to coil the full length when i had just a short run out. :lol:


mine are 25,15 & 10 for the same reason

but I love an argument with someone full of rules :twisted:


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## Zebedee (Oct 3, 2007)

IanA said:


> My local council is considering banning the use of Mr or Mrs as it may cause anxiety to a Trans-gender person if they have to make a choice.


Does this trans-gender person have a name? :lol: :lol:

I'm not really joking either. What would really hiss me off (if I would let it) is the way Councils and others in authority are so willing to move the whole of society a yard to the left . . . just in case a tiny miniscule minority *might be* upset!

The vast majority are expected to fit in with the odd one here and there. _(Use of the term "*odd*" was not accidental.)_

Shouldn't the odd half dozen be expected to fit in with the several hundred thousand!!

Dave 

P.S. What has this to do with hooking up?? :lol: :lol:


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## pippin (Nov 15, 2007)

Quite simple really - most forms include the option of "Dr" for doctor (of medicine or philosophy).

Fairly gender neutral.


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## 747 (Oct 2, 2009)

This has a lot to do with hooking up Dave.

You need to know if you are hooking up with a transgender or not. 8O 

Of course I am not aware of what your preferences are. :lol:


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## pippin (Nov 15, 2007)

I must add an apology for taking the thread off topic (I hope humerously).

The point I was trying to make is that so many people get confused about *plugs* and *sockets*.

Because something is on the end of a piece of wire many people automatically call it a *plug*.

Similarly anything fixed to the wall is regarded as a *socket*.

But it ain't necessarily so.

I hope I clarified the situation in my earlier post that used *bold print* to highlight various aspects of the situation.

So, the thing on a bollard is, quite obviously, a *socket*, into which you quite obviously *plug* a ......... *plug*.

The confusion comes at the other end of the wire because that is fitted to a (cable) *socket* which plugs into the (chassis) *socket* fixed on the van.

Are you all listening at the back of the class?!

I have actually seen wired with 2.5mm T&E cable into a 13A plug top as a power *outlet*.
Lethal.

So, it is not just over sexuality that humans can be confused by gender!


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Can't see nuffink wrong with that Pippin.
Dun it all the time before some git poked is finger innit.

Ray.


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## Techno100 (May 8, 2010)

That on the side of the van is a recessed plug Bruce :lol: (power inlet)
It cannot be a socket or the LIVE going into it would have to be a plug with pins that you might touch 8O


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## pippin (Nov 15, 2007)

Oh boIIox!

If I can get it wrong then what hope is there for the rest of the world?!!!

Can't edit the original post so will copy it here corrected.

I must add an apology for taking the thread off topic (I hope humerously).

The point I was trying to make is that so many people get confused about plugs and sockets.

Because something is on the end of a piece of wire many people automatically call it a plug.

Similarly anything fixed to the wall is regarded as a socket.

But it ain't necessarily so.

I hope I clarified the situation in my earlier post that used bold print to highlight various aspects of the situation.

So, the thing on a bollard is, quite obviously, a* socket*, into which you quite obviously plug a ......... *plug*.

The confusion comes at the other end of the wire because that is fitted to a (cable) *socket* which plugs into the (chassis) *plug* fixed on the van.

Are you all listening at the back of the class?!

I have actually seen wired with 2.5mm T&E cable into a 13A plug top as a power outlet. 
Lethal.

So, it is not just over sexuality that humans can be confused by gender!


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## Don_Madge (May 1, 2005)

1302 said:


> Been meaning to post this for a couple of weeks.
> 
> We stayed at the CC at Castleton over New Years - our friends were on a 'posh pitch' or whatever they call it and for some reason their EHU was a bit of a stretch away. Maurice (my mate) connected two sets of leads together - as I do regularily/both my leads are about 25m each - and he was toldby the site fella that under new rules and regs this was not allowed. He let him off this time and allowed the connection of two sets of properly made up IP rated leads but stressed that new rules meant that in future 'joints' were not allowed and a one peice long lead would be needed.
> 
> This sounds daft to me as the proper plug and socket 'Gewiss' connectors I have are fully IP rated and never caused me any problems with wet or similar.


I'm not sure what the CC would think of this hook up



















I'm not sure where I got the pics from.

Don


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

What you need is a proper electrician


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## oldun (Nov 10, 2005)

1302 said:


> Been meaning to post this for a couple of weeks.
> 
> We stayed at the CC at Castleton over New Years - our friends were on a 'posh pitch' or whatever they call it and for some reason their EHU was a bit of a stretch away. Maurice (my mate) connected two sets of leads together - as I do regularily/both my leads are about 25m each - and he was toldby the site fella that under new rules and regs this was not allowed. He let him off this time and allowed the connection of two sets of properly made up IP rated leads but stressed that new rules meant that in future 'joints' were not allowed and a one peice long lead would be needed.
> 
> This sounds daft to me as the proper plug and socket 'Gewiss' connectors I have are fully IP rated and never caused me any problems with wet or similar.


I have two leads which I occasionally connect together but I also have a "shower proof plastic box" to protect then when it rains.

Its dangerous to have simple push fit non waterproof connectors carrying 240V lying around on the ground.


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## oldun (Nov 10, 2005)

raynipper said:


> listerdiesel said:
> 
> 
> > nobody is going to carry a 100m roll of cable on the off-chance. Peter
> ...


Wow - what is the voltage drop at full capacity?


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## Patrick_Phillips (Aug 17, 2006)

pippin said:


> Similarly anything fixed to the wall is regarded as a socket.
> But it ain't necessarily so.
> I hope I clarified the situation in my earlier post that used bold print to highlight various aspects of the situation.
> So, the thing on a bollard is, quite obviously, a* socket*, into which you quite obviously plug a ......... *plug*.


But then I seem to remember when I was training to be a ships radio officer!!! we were told that the 3-pin plate on the wall is a *plug* and the thing on the end of the wire that plugs into it is a *plug top*!!!

And then later on I was told that an RS232 plug/socket the bit with the pins is female and the bit with lots of holes is male - because they have a shroud on the pins bit into which the bit with the holes is inserted. Even Farnels used to have that way round but they have chickened out in recent years...

Patrick


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## pippin (Nov 15, 2007)

Weird is it not!

My stock reply when someone is looking around for a wall socket and asks where is the plug is "If you don't know the difference between a plug and a socket you will get a helluva shock one day"!

Incidentally, I have fitted a proper switch/plug interlocked blue socket outside as EHU at home.

http://cpc.farnell.com/pro-power/sq1663ca/interlocked-switch-skt-240v/dp/PL09010?Ntt=pl09010

We tend to leave the lead plugged in to it when we go off for a couple of days wilding.

I have fitted a chassis mounted plug to the housing as a docking point for the end that normally goes into the MH.

http://cpc.farnell.com/mk-electric/k9701-blu/appliance-inlet-250v-16a/dp/PL12261?Ntt=pl12261

People take one look and say it is dangerous because it has exposed pins - then I explain it is not connected, it is just a dummy!


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## grizzlyj (Oct 14, 2008)

*Flip flops only required*

How to use flipflops to safely join two mains cables in a damp environment 8O


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## KeithChesterfield (Mar 12, 2010)

grizzlyj - How to use flipflops to safely join two mains cables in a damp environment.

One tsunami moment in that pool and the smiling guy will know the meaning of fried meatballs!

:wav: :wav: :wav:


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

KeithChesterfield said:


> grizzlyj - How to use flipflops to safely join two mains cables in a damp environment.
> 
> One tsunami moment in that pool and the smiling guy will know the meaning of fried meatballs!
> 
> :wav: :wav: :wav:


A couple of good farts and it could be curtains for all of them. :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## CliveMott (Mar 10, 2008)

I am afraid the cc are correct. The blue connectors are ip rated but not as waterproof, just splash proof if orientated in the correct attitudes. In-line connectors can end up laying in a puddle or caught up on a passing car or vans bits. What is inconsistent is that c& c and c&cc both lay out sites so you are never more than 25m from a hookup.
C.
Also just remembered leads up to 25m long use 1.5mm sq cable. Anything longer should use 2.5sqmm because of voltage drop. Ok ok i know that you are only running the battery charger but rools iz rools! C.


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## prof20 (Jan 11, 2007)

Apologies if already covered in this topic, would take too long to search, but these are very handy for this situation:-

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rc...3OsOhD3S9MXpc9w&bvm=bv.42553238,d.Yms&cad=rja

Roger


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

I'm confused

A membership campsite

Do they not have a responsibity to ensure shorter link ups

We carry 15 and 10 and a waterproof connection

Sometimes come unstuck in Europe as they carry vast cables, all rolled up and plugged in

Aldra


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

prof20 said:


> Apologies if already covered in this topic, would take too long to search, but these are very handy for this situation:-
> 
> http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rc...3OsOhD3S9MXpc9w&bvm=bv.42553238,d.Yms&cad=rja
> 
> Roger


I take some of it back Roger   :lol: :lol:


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Just bought two more of these for €0.50 at boot sale..... dunno why as I already have one.. :? Ray.


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