# 26 Rules.



## Delores

So this weekend we find ourselves on a campsite with a very pleasant view. Nicely tucked away and right on the banks of the river. However when we arrived we were issued with a photocopied list of 26 rules which must be adhered to at all times and which are strictly enforced by the owners who are clearly more inspired by Chairman Mau than Billy Butlin.

As relative newbies I'm assuming this is common practice on privately owned sites but it got me pondering your experiences:

1. What's the longest list of rules you've been issued with?
2. What's the oddest rule you've seen? (one of ours tells us not to empty our toilet onto the grass...)
3. If you owned a site what rules would you have? 

Just off to check if 'using an iPhone inside you van before noon' is on the list...


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## Fatalhud

Delores said:


> 3. If you owned a site what rules would you have?
> .


NO KIDS, :twisted: :twisted:

Alan H


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## Delores

Fatalhud said:


> Delores said:
> 
> 
> 
> 3. If you owned a site what rules would you have?
> .
> 
> 
> 
> NO KIDS, :twisted: :twisted:
> 
> Alan H
Click to expand...

They have that one!


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## DTPCHEMICALS

I generaly don`t read them.

Dave p


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## raynipper

No cigarettes.....!!!

I'm fed up with picking up dog ends.

Ray.


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## b16duv

The only rule is.........

ignore the rules, but act reasonably :lol: 

David


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## iconnor

No cigarettes is a bit harsh! I always carry an ashtray and smoke outside my van, and if out and about walking I extinguish and put the butt in a waste bin.


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## 1302

A site near the Three Counties Showground had a real odd sign/rule along the lines of "No opening tins of food such as ham to use as fishing bait" It was so specific it did make me laugh...

The place was riddled with rules to the ectent we didnt really enjoy our stay. As we were only astaying one night we had to go in the car park hardstanding (despte arriving at 3.00 pm) and despite the place being virtually empty. We also got told off for leaving ten minutes late (which I admit I did on purpose)


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## SpeedyDux

There isn't any point in having Rules if the campsite owners or wardens aren't doing anything to enforce them. 

Anyhow, my current pet peeve is the negligent parents who allow their kids to use the toilet / shower block as a playground, and also allow them to ride their bicycles across other pitches even after dark. :evil: 


SD


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## JackieP

Sheesh. The UK has just got to be the most over-regulated country in Europe! 26 rules? Sheesh.

We saw these while in France and Spain. Made us laugh.


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## HeatherChloe

I don't like the rule which some campsites have which says that your dog cannot walk with you to the toilet block and go into your cubicle with you while you use the toilet. 

As I travel alone, if I leave my dog tied up at the van while I use the toilet block, she barks and gets distraught, thereby disturbing everyone on the campsite.

But she loves to walk nicely with me on a lead, into my cubicle with me, while she sits nicely until we leave.

I can't see what possible harm that can do - after all, it's a campsite toilet, which has people walk into it with their muddy feet, and do their toilet business in the toilet cubicle with their drips and whatnot - it's hardly as if she can do any health and safety harm - she is probably cleaner than a lot of people! And indeed better behaved. 

And it's not as if the campsites which have those rules provide a hook for tying your dog to right outside the toilet block anyway, so it really does mean that you have to leave your dog unaccompanied at your van when you go to everyone's detriment and also the security risk of someone stealing her.


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## CaGreg

HeatherChloe said:


> I don't like the rule which some campsites have which says that your dog cannot walk with you to the toilet block and go into your cubicle with you while you use the toilet.
> 
> As I travel alone, if I leave my dog tied up at the van while I use the toilet block, she barks and gets distraught, thereby disturbing everyone on the campsite.
> 
> But she loves to walk nicely with me on a lead, into my cubicle with me, while she sits nicely until we leave.
> 
> I can't see what possible harm that can do - after all, it's a campsite toilet, which has people walk into it with their muddy feet, and do their toilet business in the toilet cubicle with their drips and whatnot - it's hardly as if she can do any health and safety harm - she is probably cleaner than a lot of people! And indeed better behaved.
> 
> And it's not as if the campsites which have those rules provide a hook for tying your dog to right outside the toilet block anyway, so it really does mean that you have to leave your dog unaccompanied at your van when you go to everyone's detriment and also the security risk of someone stealing her.


Actually, I tend to agree with that rule, not because I doubt you and your dog, but I don't trust all of humanity and the reason a person would have for bringing a dog into a loo. If I saw somebody coming out of a loo with a dog on a lead, I would not be very happy, there must surely be somewhere a dog could be tethered for a couple of minutes, and I wondered what do you do when you are using the shower,, actually don't answer that.

BTW I adore dogs! I owned two together for many years.

Ca


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## 1302

CaGreg said:


> Actually, I tend to agree with that rule, .
> 
> Ca


Most rules have to exist because there are some people too dumb to know how to behave...

Im sure ^her^ dog is a well behaved wee thing - but some arse would eventually bring a barking bull mastiff into the peace and quiet of the loo and upset everyone..


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## Rapide561

*Rules*

Maybe I am miserable, but some of the best stays on sites I have had have been on sites with many rules...

No ball games
No kites
No frisbees
No awnings other than wind out canapies
No vehicle movement after 11pm

To see some sites with pitches all over the place, units with an awning and a pup tent, pitches with two cars alongside etc.....this just creates a bad "look" in my view

Russell


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## dovtrams

At Killin in Perthshire, there is free fishing in the river running alongside the camp site. A very large signs says 'free fishing, but you are not allowed to catch salmon'. I tied a sign on my hook saying 'no salmon' but they obviously cannot read! Very tasty.

dave


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## HeatherChloe

J99Dub said:


> Most rules have to exist because there are some people too dumb to know how to behave...
> 
> Im sure ^her^ dog is a well behaved wee thing - but some arse would eventually bring a barking bull mastiff into the peace and quiet of the loo and upset everyone..


But then, some children are noisy and disruptive in toilet blocks, so children should be banned too?

And some people are noisy and dirty in toilet blocks, so people should be banned too?

Of course, leaving the dog behind results in barking and taking the dog in results in no barking.


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## DABurleigh

Err, I ignore the dog-on-a-lead-at-all-times rule.

And come the revolution, my rule would be "dog-under-control-at-all-times"

And I don't like rules that tell me door-pitch-orientation or unit-positioning-against-peg.

Dave


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## overthemoon

Brill, made me laugh :lol:


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## nicholsong

Dave 

I am relative Newbie and don't use sites much. Please, what is 'door-pitch-orientation?

Geoff


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## DABurleigh

The quick answer is some sites require you to have your van door opening to a particular side of the pitch.

The more entertaining answer is to ask sersol (Gary) ....

Dave


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## Delores

SpeedyDux said:


> There isn't any point in having Rules if the campsite owners or wardens aren't doing anything to enforce them.
> 
> SD


They did enforce them. Oh yes! 4 or 5 times per day they would drive up and down the entire pitch peering into each unit... :roll:


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## Rapide561

*Rules*

Go on, list the 26 rules.

Russell


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## tonyt

HeatherChloe said:


> I don't like the rule which some campsites have which says that your dog cannot walk with you to the toilet block and go into your cubicle with you while you use the toilet.
> 
> As I travel alone, if I leave my dog tied up at the van while I use the toilet block, she barks and gets distraught, thereby disturbing everyone on the campsite.
> 
> But she loves to walk nicely with me on a lead, into my cubicle with me, while she sits nicely until we leave.
> 
> I can't see what possible harm that can do - after all, it's a campsite toilet, which has people walk into it with their muddy feet, and do their toilet business in the toilet cubicle with their drips and whatnot - it's hardly as if she can do any health and safety harm - she is probably cleaner than a lot of people! And indeed better behaved.
> 
> And it's not as if the campsites which have those rules provide a hook for tying your dog to right outside the toilet block anyway, so it really does mean that you have to leave your dog unaccompanied at your van when you go to everyone's detriment and also the security risk of someone stealing her.


Sounds to me a bit like you're saying:

"Either you let me, and everyone else, bring our dogs into the ablution blocks or I'll tie it up and it'll bark and annoy other campers".

Your dog may well be well behaved but others not so.

You seem to be happy to impose your probelm situation on others and even expect campsites to provide dog tying up facilities

I would not have a dog in my bathroom at home so would not be happy to share the space on a campsite.


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## Delores

*Re: Rules*



Rapide561 said:


> Go on, list the 26 rules.
> 
> Russell


OK - and I just noticed there's 27 as there's an 11 and an 11a :wink:

1. 5MPH speed limit at all times
2. Only on car per pitch all others to be parked on top car park.
3. Caravans/ Motorhomes must be pitched away from static bank and vehicles kept inside their pitch at all times.
4. No washing of vehicles, Motorhomes or caravans on site.
5. No parking on the tourers access road at any time.
6. Tourers vehicles are not allowed to park by the toilet block or in static parking area. 
7. Strictly no parking on double yellow lines at any time.
8. Tourers are responsible for the behaviour of their visitors.
9. All visitors to park on top car park.
10. Visitors vehicles are not allowed on touring field.
11. No children under the age of ten allowed.
11a. No small children allowed near the river bank without an adult.
12. No small children allowed at toilet block without an adult.
13. No ball games.
14. Chemical toilets/ buckets must be emptied at the Chemical Disposal point and not in the toilet block, waste water to be emptied down the drain and not on the grass.
15. No washing of cutlery, pots, pans, plates in toilet block.
16. All rubbish must be bagged before placing in bin/ skip.
17. No washing lines allowed.
18. Dogs must be kept on a lead at all times and exercised off site.
19. Dogs are not allowed to be exercised on the river bank or the static area.
20. Any dog fouling on the site must be removed immediately or the owners will be asked to leave the site and no refund given.
21. Dogs are not allowed in toiled block.
22. The toiled block is a no smoking area.
23. An person not registered and stopping overnigh must book in at reception and pay the overnight tariff.
24. Charges for day visitors are £2 per adult/ £1 per child per day and must book in at reception.
25. Caravan arrivals from 12 noon.
26. All departures by 12 noon.

I find some a little odd and none of them wildly unreasonable - I just think it's treating us all like kids to a have to spell it out - and certainly not welcoming to have it thrust into your hand as soon as you arrive. Oh and if you don't read it it's posted in the toilet blocks along with a few other dos and don'ts... There's no 'pleases' or 'thank yous' anywhere. The tone of it and the manner in which it's enforced did NOT make for a relaxing stay...

As I said, as a relative newbie I'm sure this sort of thing is common, but I was rather taken aback by it, it's lack of politeness and assumption that we're all idiots... Or maybe it's just me!  :lol:


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## Rapide561

*Rules*

Here is my interpretation in capitals.

1. 5MPH speed limit at all times - AGREED
2. Only on car per pitch all others to be parked on top car park. TOTALLY AGREE
3. Caravans/ Motorhomes must be pitched away from static bank and vehicles kept inside their pitch at all times. WHAT IS STATIC BANK? YES, VEHICLES INSIDE PITCH. (AH STATIC BANK RELATES TO AREA WHERE STATIC CARAVANS ARE???)
4. No washing of vehicles, Motorhomes or caravans on site. AGREED. 
5. No parking on the tourers access road at any time. AGREED
6. Tourers vehicles are not allowed to park by the toilet block or in static parking area. AGREED
7. Strictly no parking on double yellow lines at any time. AGREED
8. Tourers are responsible for the behaviour of their visitors. AGREED
9. All visitors to park on top car park. AGREED
10. Visitors vehicles are not allowed on touring field. GOOD IDEA. 
11. No children under the age of ten allowed. GREAT
11a. No small children allowed near the river bank without an adult. SENSIBLE 
12. No small children allowed at toilet block without an adult. GOOD IDEA. 
13. No ball games. HORRAY. WHY SHOULD SOMEONE BE BANGING BALLS ABOUT ETC - IT IS NOT A PLAYGROUND
14. Chemical toilets/ buckets must be emptied at the Chemical Disposal point and not in the toilet block, waste water to be emptied down the drain and not on the grass. YES
15. No washing of cutlery, pots, pans, plates in toilet block. AGREED
16. All rubbish must be bagged before placing in bin/ skip. AGREED
17. No washing lines allowed. NOT LIKING THIS - I USE MY AIRER
18. Dogs must be kept on a lead at all times and exercised off site. AGREED
19. Dogs are not allowed to be exercised on the river bank or the static area. OK
20. Any dog fouling on the site must be removed immediately or the owners will be asked to leave the site and no refund given. GOOD FOR THE SITE OWNERS. 
21. Dogs are not allowed in toiled block. AGREED. 
22. The toiled block is a no smoking area. OK
23. An person not registered and stopping overnigh must book in at reception and pay the overnight tariff. GOOD FOR THE SITE STAFF. SORT EM OUT. 
24. Charges for day visitors are £2 per adult/ £1 per child per day and must book in at reception. GREAT - MEANS THERE IS ROOM ON SITE FOR SITE RESIDENTS AND NOT DAY TRIPPERS
25. Caravan arrivals from 12 noon. NO PROBS
26. All departures by 12 noon. NO PROBS

Where do I go to book?

I recall being on a site last year and a frisbee landed on my can roof. The owner of the frisbee asked if he could go up my ladder to collect it. I refused. He fetched the site staff who then stated the frisbee should not have been in use anyway. The frisbee stayed there and fell off on the M5. Now, had the frisbee damaged the satellite dish....etc etc. Would the owner of a 99p frisbee have been willing to repair a satellite dish? Not likely.

It is all well and good having rules, but as demonstrated above, if the rules are broken, then they become futile.

Russell


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## ChrisandJohn

It looks like a lot of these rules are fairly standard, but could have been communicated a lot better: 'no smoking' signs at the toilet block for instance rather than listing it as a rule. Basically, they haven't paid a lot of attention to drafting their 'rules', just added bits on when it occurred to them. I bet if you go back next year they'll be 35 rules. or 36 if you include 11b.

I agree with Russell though that most of it is reasonable, just not very welcoming in the way it is presented and policed.


Chris


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## 1302

*Re: Rules*



Rapide561 said:


> Here is my interpretation in capitals.
> 
> 1. 5MPH speed limit at all times - AGREED
> 
> Russell


I was going to do this but your beat me to it 

So here's version 2 

1. 5MPH speed limit at all times - *AGREED*
2. Only on car per pitch all others to be parked on top car park. *TOTALLY AGREE*
3. Caravans/ Motorhomes must be pitched away from static bank and vehicles kept inside their pitch at all times. *WHAT IS STATIC BANK? YES, VEHICLES INSIDE PITCH. (AH STATIC BANK RELATES TO AREA WHERE STATIC CARAVANS ARE???)*
4. No washing of vehicles, Motorhomes or caravans on site. AGREED. WHY its not the crime of the century and if done sensibly doesnt use much water ;)
5. No parking on the tourers access road at any time. *AGREED*
6. Tourers vehicles are not allowed to park by the toilet block or in static parking area. *AGREED* but would a double yellow line as described below not cover that ??
7. Strictly no parking on double yellow lines at any time. *AGREED*
8. Tourers are responsible for the behaviour of their visitors. *AGREED*
9. All visitors to park on top car park.Covered above
10. Visitors vehicles are not allowed on touring field. *GOOD IDEA. * but covered above
11. No children under the age of ten allowed. *GREAT* but harsh
11a. No small children allowed near the river bank without an adult. *SENSIBLE * but with no under tens no one will be 'small'
12. No small children allowed at toilet block without an adult. *GOOD IDEA. * see above
13. No ball games. *HORRAY. WHY SHOULD SOMEONE BE BANGING BALLS ABOUT ETC - IT IS NOT A PLAYGROUND*
14. Chemical toilets/ buckets must be emptied at the Chemical Disposal point and not in the toilet block, waste water to be emptied down the drain and not on the grass. *YES*
15. No washing of cutlery, pots, pans, plates in toilet block. *AGREED*16. All rubbish must be bagged before placing in bin/ skip. *AGREED*
17. No washing lines allowed. *AGREED!! ITS NOT A CHINESE LAUND|RY *
18. Dogs must be kept on a lead at all times and exercised off site. *AGREED*
19. Dogs are not allowed to be exercised on the river bank or the static area. [B]SEE ABOVE[/B]
20. Any dog fouling on the site must be removed immediately or the owners will be asked to leave the site and no refund given. GOOD FOR THE SITE OWNERS. 
21. Dogs are not allowed in toiled block. *AGREED. *
22. The toiled block is a no smoking area.* OK*
23. An person not registered and stopping overnigh must book in at reception and pay the overnight tariff. *GOOD FOR THE SITE STAFF. SORT EM OUT. *24. Charges for day visitors are £2 per adult/ £1 per child per day and must book in at reception. *GREAT - MEANS THERE IS ROOM ON SITE FOR SITE RESIDENTS AND NOT DAY TRIPPERS*
25. Caravan arrivals from 12 noon. *NO PROBS*
26. All departures by 12 noon. *NO PROBS*



The above could easily be 17 rules


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## locovan

Quote I recall being on a site last year and a frisbee landed on my roof. 
Russell

The other thing is Kites as they have done a lot of damage as they crash on a roof.

On the whole the rules quoted are the normal. They just seem to be covering all eventualities.


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## majo

A site in Cornwall that is renouned for its relaxed atmosphere and lack of signs was reminded by the local authorities of this omission. 
Its response was to errect a small sign near the reception (owners kitchen) stating
"THIS SIGN MAY HAVE SHARP EDGES"

Incidently Russell as an ex coach driver you should be aware that it is your responsibility for the security of anything and everything on your vehicle. A motorcyclist being hit on the M5 by your flying frisbee at 70mph may just assume you're not following the rules.


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## bowlty

hi 
i was at the invercauld site at the weekend and they was a little lad learning to ride his bike and throwing gravel right beside my mh and some other very exspensive mh,s who parents did nothing to stop him i know he was only 4 or 5 but if he hit a mh with his bike or some gravel it could cost a forture to repair i know parents need eyes in the back of they heads with small kids but who would pay for the damage ?


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## SpeedyDux

Delores,

I agree that it seems a bit OTT to hand a printed list of rules out on arrival. On the whole I agree with Russell that they are mainly sensible. 

One major omission is the prohibition of noise between 11 pm and 7 am. When you have driven 400 miles and just want to get some sleep there is nothing worse than the outfit on the pitch next door partying until the small hours with their tipsy mates, talking loudly punctuated by random shrieks of laughter and singing. Some campers seem to think this is acceptable as long as their music is not too loud. 

The worst / wildest campsite I have ever stayed on was at the Le Mans circuit during the 2007 24 hour sports car race. The few rules were widely ignored and warning signs even set on fire by campers along with other equipment. Just for a laugh, obviously. The crazy behaviour of some fellow campers was so reckless it was actually very dangerous. Fireworks landing on occupied tents. A Porsche 911 speeding along the muddy track between pitches in the dark until it crashed. Very drunk British driver. One young man died in an accident involving a scooter. 

I understand that the sportscar fans are well behaved by comparison with the bikers. How bad can that possibly get? :roll: :roll: 

Maybe I am turning into a boring old f&rt. I am even thinking elf n' safety on campsites might be a GOOD thing.

SD


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## Rapide561

*Washing*

Hi

Reference the vehicle washing - these are my thoughts.

1) I wash my van now and again and think I can do it with one bucket of warm water (15 litre bucket) and three spray guns of cold - (21 litres in total). This amount of water dropping onto a grass pitch is potentially enough to cause "issues" on soft ground, plus the chemical aspect. I can do it with less water if the van needs a spit and polish rather than a good fettle.

2) Cost of water - sites are likely to be metered.

3) The general impression, and other campers stating - oooh look at him, you'd think he comes on holiday to wash his van. (Only last Friday when I put my airer up, I was asked, or rather told, (oooh you've been here a long time then) when in fact I had arrived earlier that day.

I would however, on my campsite, have an area where washing could be done for a donation to the Guide Dog Box which would be on the counter.

When my van was really bad in the winter, I took it to a local coach firm and asked nicely.......it was a yes, but it was cold water!

Russell


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## camper69

SpeedyDux said:


> One major omission is the prohibition of noise between 11 pm and 7 am.


Why bother it is hardly ever enforced on the campsites we have been on.

Derek


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## Delores

majo said:


> A site in Cornwall that is renouned for its relaxed atmosphere and lack of signs was reminded by the local authorities of this omission.
> Its response was to errect a small sign near the reception (owners kitchen) stating
> "THIS SIGN MAY HAVE SHARP EDGES"


Any chance you could PM me the details for the site? Sounds like the sort of place we'd like to explore...

Thanks!


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## HeatherChloe

tonyt said:


> Sounds to me a bit like you're saying:
> 
> "Either you let me, and everyone else, bring our dogs into the ablution blocks or I'll tie it up and it'll bark and annoy other campers".
> 
> Your dog may well be well behaved but others not so.
> 
> You seem to be happy to impose your probelm situation on others and even expect campsites to provide dog tying up facilities
> 
> I would not have a dog in my bathroom at home so would not be happy to share the space on a campsite.


I don't know why you wouldn't let your dog go into your bathroom at home - mine can go into the bathroom if she likes. She quite likes to lie down on the cool tiles if she is feeling hot.

With respect to the dog going into toilets, I take my dog into the toilet block in the park on a regular basis. I take her into the toilets when we use the intercity trains - I wouldn't leave her alone at the seat. I take my dog into toilets when we go to the pub - I wouldn't leave her alone at my table. There's never any problem with this, so I wonder why it is campsites which seem to have this ban, rather than other places.

I'm not "imposing my problem" on someone - I'm just completely baffled as to what reason there could be to ban someone from taking their dog into the toilet with them.

Dogs feet are no more dirty than human beings feet - I don't see signs requiring me to remove my shoes at the door of the campsite toilets.

Dogs do not urinate inside - unlike humans, many of whom seem to get it to land on the seat or on the floor - anywhere but the bowl.

Obviously one would not expect dogs to run freely through the toilet block scaring people or barking. But a well behaved dog on a lead walking into the cubicle with its owner cannot possibly cause anyone any harm or inconvenience.


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## badger750

the main 1 i like is the 5 mph rule as most people cannot register that it is not a main road and speed every where most of the time when they are going to the toilet block as they can't be bothered to walk


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## djjsss

Mmmmmmm

The more I read about "proper sites" and some peoples attitude to dogs, the more I am convinced i am either, a wild camper at heart or, I have taken up the wrong hobby. I look at some sites I have visited and they may be well regulated but it is just like swapping a housing estate for a MH estate you have more privacy at Butlins.

Having still to get some decent use out of my beloved MH I am worried as all I want to do is relax (with my dogs) and have a bit of privacy, without annoying anyone else.

Anyone want to buy a hardly used Autotrail!!

Derek


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## ChrisandJohn

HeatherChloe said:


> tonyt said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sounds to me a bit like you're saying:
> 
> "Either you let me, and everyone else, bring our dogs into the ablution blocks or I'll tie it up and it'll bark and annoy other campers".
> 
> Your dog may well be well behaved but others not so.
> 
> You seem to be happy to impose your probelm situation on others and even expect campsites to provide dog tying up facilities
> 
> I would not have a dog in my bathroom at home so would not be happy to share the space on a campsite.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't know why you wouldn't let your dog go into your bathroom at home - mine can go into the bathroom if she likes. She quite likes to lie down on the cool tiles if she is feeling hot.
> 
> With respect to the dog going into toilets, I take my dog into the toilet block in the park on a regular basis. I take her into the toilets when we use the intercity trains - I wouldn't leave her alone at the seat. I take my dog into toilets when we go to the pub - I wouldn't leave her alone at my table. There's never any problem with this, so I wonder why it is campsites which seem to have this ban, rather than other places.
> 
> I'm not "imposing my problem" on someone - I'm just completely baffled as to what reason there could be to ban someone from taking their dog into the toilet with them.
> 
> Dogs feet are no more dirty than human beings feet - I don't see signs requiring me to remove my shoes at the door of the campsite toilets.
> 
> Dogs do not urinate inside - unlike humans, many of whom seem to get it to land on the seat or on the floor - anywhere but the bowl.
> 
> Obviously one would not expect dogs to run freely through the toilet block scaring people or barking. But a well behaved dog on a lead walking into the cubicle with its owner cannot possibly cause anyone any harm or inconvenience.
Click to expand...

Could it be that other people using the showers and toilets might not be keen to have dogs in there. If I came across a dog, with owner, in a pub loo I probably wouldn't be too concerned if it was well behaved. It's usually just a case of in and out. In a shower block though I wouldn't want to have dogs around. If dogs were allowed in the shower blocks it wouldn't just be a case of your well controlled dog.

At home our cats have free range of the house, including sleeping on our bed. If we have guests though I am careful to keep the cats out of their room as I know others could have a problem with them. What you are happy with at home shouldn't have to apply to everyone else on the camp site, who may not like dogs, or even be scared of them.

Chris


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## djjsss

Chris,

We have an easy answer to that.

People who are not comfortable around our animals are generally the people we don't want visiting us.

Apologies for off topic.

Regards

Derek


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## Rosbotham

On the original, I think most of those rules are sensible and to be honest would prefer to have them on a sheet of paper on arrival (we usually have a good laugh trying to guess what's happened in the past to make them introduce a given rule!) than the CC approach of signs everywhere telling you what not to do. It'd be nice to have no rules, but my experience on sites with that approach is that it's the pig ignorant who ruin things for everyone else.

On the dogs in the showerblock, I'm pretty surprised that there's even a debate on this. I wouldn't dream of taking our dog in there. It's one thing to have them in the bathroom at home, and even in pub/train toilets (where to be honest you kinda expect things to be a bit gross), but no matter how well washed out afterwards, as a dog-lover I'd be unimpressed at having to follow into a cubicle just used by someone & their dog. If I didn't have a dog I think I'd be positively outraged. Now I know why I always keep my crocs on in the showers...

Paul


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## HurricaneSmith

Rosbotham said:


> ....... it's the pig ignorant who ruin things for everyone else.


I agree Paul



Rosbotham said:


> On the dogs in the showerblock, I'm pretty surprised that there's even a debate on this. .


Agreed again



Rosbotham said:


> I wouldn't dream of taking our dog in there..... as a dog-lover I'd be unimpressed at having to follow into a cubicle just used by someone & their dog. If I didn't have a dog I think I'd be positively outraged.


We are dog owners, and the thought of taking little 'mugwump' into the shower block would never cross our minds.

Perhaps we too have respect for others.


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## 1302

*Re: Washing*



Rapide561 said:


> Hi
> 
> Reference the vehicle washing - these are my thoughts.
> 
> I would however, on my campsite, have an area where washing could be done for a donation to the Guide Dog Box which would be on the counter.
> 
> Russell


Spain - a few years ago had awashing area - free with hosepipe for washing carsand small vans


----------



## 1302

djjsss said:


> Chris,
> 
> We have an easy answer to that.
> 
> People who are not comfortable around dog faeces are generally the people we don't want visiting us.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Derek


Thats more like it


----------



## ChrisandJohn

djjsss said:


> Chris,
> 
> We have an easy answer to that.
> 
> People who are not comfortable around our animals are generally the people we don't want visiting us.
> 
> Apologies for off topic.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Derek


Oh that wouldn't be an easy answer for me. We have lots of family and friends that come to stay and one or two of them are either allergic to cats or are quite happy to stroke them but wouldn't want them on their bed. I can understand that.

I'm quite happy to try and make their stay more comfortable. The cats have plenty of places to go.

Chris


----------



## clemmo

So all sites have different rules..in different numbers. Wherever we go in society there are "rules"

But should we really be stressed by them?..No

Everyone does everything slightly differently...we should really live and let live.

Rules never bother me..I choose where to stay..if I didnt like the rules I wouldnt stay there.

Im happy to flex to suit where I am...It makes for a relaxed stay.

Clemmo


----------



## thieawin

On the I take my dog everywhere front I am afraid to say I don't want dogs in showers or loos or in pubs or on trains 

If the dog barks when you leave it for a few minutes it is ( and possibly you are ) clearly suffering from separation anxiety and you and your dog need retraining. Then you wouldn't need to take it to the loo 

Am I the only one who finds the idea of a dog watching me pee or squat slightly disturbing and who would definitely not be happy going into a cubicle out of which a dg had emerged.

Take your dog camping, put it in a portable crate when travelling on the train, surely, exercise is for the outdoors not the loo or premises where food and drink are served. I am surprised you can still take a dog into a pub or onto a train (other than crated)

NB we have three jack russels and at home they run riot and loose in house or garden or beach (winter only according to the by laws) but they are always on a lead when we are away and I wold not tie them up outside a shop or a loo block. Thats cruel.


----------



## machilly

No Dogs that Bark because the owner is too lazy to train them

No Kids and/or adults that play football in and around pitches

No Noisy Aquarolls or Wastemaster on Gravel paths

If you have to chatter with fellow campers in the early hours of the morning, then whisper

If you have to leave the site early next morning, be ready to go the night before, and do not keep slamming your car/Caravan/Motorhome doors.

When you pitch your van, check you are not looking directly into another Van, after all we are not Goldfish, and I am not a preety sight in the morning

No matter what the site owner or Steward tells you, do not park so F*&^%&g close

I could go on, but you might think me a Grumpy Old Man  

Regards and Happy Camping (Bah Humbug)


----------



## Alfa_Scud

Ey Alex, where did you crib my rules from?? :lol:


----------



## HeatherChloe

HurricaneSmith said:


> Rosbotham said:
> 
> 
> 
> On the dogs in the showerblock, I'm pretty surprised that there's even a debate on this. .
> 
> 
> 
> Agreed again
> 
> 
> 
> Rosbotham said:
> 
> 
> 
> I wouldn't dream of taking our dog in there..... as a dog-lover I'd be unimpressed at having to follow into a cubicle just used by someone & their dog. If I didn't have a dog I think I'd be positively outraged.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> We are dog owners, and the thought of taking little 'mugwump' into the shower block would never cross our minds.
> 
> Perhaps we too have respect for others.
Click to expand...

Why are you unimpressed at using a cubicle that a clean well behaved dog had just been into? What do you think the dog has done to the cubicle which has negatively impacted on you?

I can see from the responses that some people do think that dogs should not go into the toilet block - fair enough, because everyone is entitled to their views, but I haven't heard anyone said WHY that is - I have never seen a campsite requiring campers to take their shoes off when using the toilet block, and my dog is cleaner than most people's shoes.

It's not right to suggest that taking the dog in implies a lack of "respect for others", as I can't see that the dog does any damage, causes any mess, or anything, I don't see it as disrespectful. If my view about taking the dog into the shower block is different from your own, this doesn't mean that I don't have respect for others. We just have different views, and I am trying to understand the views of those who don't like it, but no reasons have yet been given.

I wonder whether it is because those of you replying are clearly in couples or camping with family or friends, and are perhaps not in the mindset of understanding what it is like to travel alone. Where you have a family member, they can watch the dog and ensure it is safe while you use the toilet block. I assume that motorhoming is not solely the preserve of those in couples or families, but that singles are welcome too?

When you travel alone, if you can't take the dog to the toilet block, it really means that you need to close all the van windows, lock the van up with the dog inside. Then, come back from using the facilities, and open it all up again and then put the dog back outside on her lead.

This is a complete pain, time consuming, and annoying - and seems quite out of proportion of effort, just because some people might not like the dog in the toilet block, but for no actual valid reason, except perhaps a general prejudice against dogs?

Obviously we have to compare what some people don't like with what others don't like in making rules - but it would be good if "not liking" something had a basis in something real, like an actual health and safety issue.

In that regard, my dog and I had lunch today at the excellent Spaniard's Inn in Hampstead, where in their beer garden they actually have a Dog's Shower Room for your dog to have their own shower after running on the Heath. Does anyone know of any camping sites which have this?


----------



## HeatherChloe

thieawin said:


> Take your dog camping, put it in a portable crate when travelling on the train, surely, exercise is for the outdoors not the loo or premises where food and drink are served. I am surprised you can still take a dog into a pub or onto a train (other than crated)


EU law prohibits dogs from being in a kitchen where food and drink are being prepared.

But there is no law against taking your dog into somewhere where food and drink are served, and rightly so, as the mere presence of a dog under the table in a pub does not affect anyone adversely, and to create a law to prevent this would simply be unacceptable legislation.

Dogs are permitted on all buses, tubes and trains in the UK, except the Eurostar (because they do not have the dog scanners necessary for passport reasons).

Dogs are a joy in life and travelling back on the tube today, it is a delight to see otherwise miserable commuters smile and talk when they see the dog and come over to fuss her and say how beautiful she is.

A dog in a public house makes the public house what it originally was - a shared home for people to come to drink and eat.

Sadly the public house next to the campsite I was on this weekend, the only place within walking distance, did not allow dogs inside (which is always at management discretion, there being no law against it), and so, it being rather cold on the weekend, I had to spend the evening sat in the van, rather in the pub. Still, it's them that lost the business and the money I would otherwise have spent with them.


----------



## 1302

In responce to the two posters above...

I dont like dogs in my house or van - therefore i would prefer them not to be in my pub/toilet/shower.

I cannot ever agree that anyones dogs is clean, indeeed cleaner than a person :roll: 

Dogs often (and I grant you not always) stink, shed hair, they roll around in cr&p and suffer from less than ideal post toilet conditions about their body. For that reason - leave it in your van/outside. If its awkward for you to leave it alone then please dont turn it into a disadvantage for me.

I have no problem with dogs per se - cant see the fuss some folk will make over them - I'm easy going about most stuff too.


----------



## Patrick_Phillips

Delores said:


> As relative newbies I'm assuming this is common practice on privately owned sites but it got me pondering your experiences


Well, having read all the posts here, I am thinking I have been living in an alternative universe for the last two years of fulltiming. 8O 
We have come across the rule-maniacs, of course. In fact the site we chose to call "home" is littered with silly notices including one that tells you not to leave faeces in the bowl! :twisted: 
But noone takes offence - it is just a thing the owner likes to do. Everyone needs a hobby :roll: 
We have found all the hundreds of sites we have stayed at friendly, helpful and sensible about the way people behave. We love to have kids and animals to watch. Yet to come across a dog that wasn't well behaved on a campsite, though a few off sites :x 
Delores, I reckon you could get a very bad impression from some of the posts on this thread. Most people are much easier than this thread would have you believe.  
Patrick


----------



## ChrisandJohn

I am aware that it must be more difficult for a person on their own to leave their dog safely while they use the shower block. This thread however is about campsite rules. If you are allowed in with your dog any person staying on the campsite would be expected to want to take their dog in, and they may not be as clean, well behaved, and controlled as you say yours is.

In my experience dogs tend to try to be 'friendly' when they come across another person. i don't mind this and will stroke when appropriate and fend off when that's appropriate too. I wouldn't want to be confronted with this behaviour though in a shower block. After a shower I often use the 'privacy cubicles to get dry, get dressed, clean my teeth etc. These often have curtains rather than doors. I would not want a dog barging in.

I could imagine people who are wary or scared of dogs being quite freaked to be faced with a boisterous one in the confined space of a shower block, especially if they weren't dressed.


Chris


----------



## HeatherChloe

ChrisandJohn said:


> After a shower I often use the 'privacy cubicles to get dry, get dressed, clean my teeth etc. These often have curtains rather than doors. I would not want a dog barging in.
> 
> I could imagine people who are wary or scared of dogs being quite freaked to be faced with a boisterous one in the confined space of a shower block, especially if they weren't dressed.
> Chris


I agree with you Chris - dogs should not be allowed to barge in through a showercurtain, hence a dog should be kept on the lead and close to the owner fully supervised.

I also agree with you that a dog should not be boisterous and scare people, especially those who may have an irrational fear of dogs to start with.

But I don't think that is the same as a blanket ban against dogs in a toilet block.

A better rule could be that dogs are allowed in if they are controlled on a lead and do not bother or approach any people. That would address all of these points.


----------



## HeatherChloe

J99Dub said:


> Dogs often (and I grant you not always) stink, shed hair, they roll around in cr&p and suffer from less than ideal post toilet conditions about their body. For that reason - leave it in your van/outside. If its awkward for you to leave it alone then please dont turn it into a disadvantage for me.


I agree - I would not want a smelly dog who has rolled in something horrible or has hangers on around me.

But that is not the same as a blanket ban on dogs. Perhaps the rule should be no smelly or dirty dogs allowed inside.

My dog is beautifully clean, she cleans her teeth every night (well she sits quietly while I clean them with her own toothbrush!), she is brushed daily, bathed weekly, groomed at the groomers every six weeks, she smells and looks lovely, has never shown any aggression to anyone and she sleeps on my bed with me everynight. She would be no disadvantage to you whatsoever.

You can be sure that I have stood next to much more smelly people on the tube in the rush hour that frankly I wouldn't want to use the toilet after. But there is no blanket ban on people as a result of a few smelly ones.


----------



## 1302

HeatherC
I am sure that your dogs Grooming CV renders it the cleanest dog here  Other than bathing weekly  (I bathe daily :lol: )

There are those who struggle your pooches bathing routine = they wouldnt cross my threshold either


----------



## Rosbotham

HeatherChloe said:


> In that regard, my dog and I had lunch today at the excellent Spaniard's Inn in Hampstead, where in their beer garden they actually have a Dog's Shower Room for your dog to have their own shower after running on the Heath. Does anyone know of any camping sites which have this?


C&CC Windermere.

The thing is, you appear to be alone in thinking dogs should be allowed in the showerblocks, even amongst dog owners. Given the majority don't want it allowed, it seems reasonable that there be a rule against. That's democracy.

Paul


----------



## billym

HeatherChloe

You should sort your dog out so it can be left.

Don't take your or your dog's problems out on others. To take a dog into a campsite toilet and showers is nutty in the extreme.


----------



## HeatherChloe

Rosbotham said:


> The thing is, you appear to be alone in thinking dogs should be allowed in the showerblocks, even amongst dog owners. Given the majority don't want it allowed, it seems reasonable that there be a rule against. That's democracy.
> Paul


Indeed - the tyranny of the majority. There is no good reason, but prejudice.


----------



## HeatherChloe

billym said:


> You should sort your dog out so it can be left. Don't take your or your dog's problems out on others. To take a dog into a campsite toilet and showers is nutty in the extreme.


It's not nutty at all. That's just your view.

I'm not taking out my "problems" on others - taking the dog in the toilet block doesn't affect anyone at all. Locking up my van everytime I use the toilet block, so that my dog is not stolen, affects me not because I have a problem but because everyone else has a problem - prejudice against dogs.

Frankly, I think it is nutty that people have a problem with this, but there you go, obviously there are a lot of anti-dog people out there.


----------



## SpeedyDux

I would say I'm a dog lover, having had my own lovely dogs. I would never have dreamed of taking them into a shower / toilet block. That is seriously eccentric dog owner behaviour and it can't be the case that everyone else but you is prejudiced against dogs. I never had a problem leaving the dogs alone in the van or car for a short while, as long as they had enough fresh air and were not at risk of overheating. They just had a snooze until I returned. 

SD


----------



## sallytrafic

I fail to see the problem in taking a well behaved dog into the toilet block, Its not what we do but we have the luxury of there being two of us.

I would be worried however that they might pick up some of the detritus left by humans around the place.

The problem with rules (indeed also with laws) is that often the rule isn't well thought out. It also only takes one rule to be a nonsense for people to ignore all of them. Also many people think rules are for other people. 

Take the 5mph rule, can you judge 5mph/does your speedo even indicate at 5mph? Wouldn't it be better to say please drive your vehicle at a slow walking pace on the roads and grassy areas?


----------



## locovan

I to love dogs but I cant believe that this is serious.
I would never take my Louis into the shower block and Im sure there must be a rule that you cant.
I would be appalled if I walked in and found a group of dogs there.
Can you imagine if we all took our dogs to the shower :roll:


----------



## thieawin

Natinal Train rules fortunately allow another passenger to object to the presence of a dog and in that case dog owner and dog must move to another carriage or the luggage van.


----------



## CaGreg

Since I think that I was the first person on here to say that I wouldn't like dogs to be allowed into the toilet, I need to once again, reiterate that I am far from a dog-hater.

I have owned dogs for most of my married life, and indeed we always had dogs when I was a child. I think dogs are great.

The objection that it would be necessary to lock the van to prevent the dog from being stolen, seems a bit far-fetched. Doesn't everybody lock their van when they are leaving it to spend time at the loo, washing up area, etc? Any well-behaved dog, as we are led to believe this dog is, surely can be expected to stay alone and behaved for ten or fifteen minutes. I know our dogs could have managed that and more. Does this dog go to work, church, cinema etc etc.

I get annoyed when I hear of people saying, 'oh my dog is too delicate, sensitive , highly strung, important, (take your pick) to be left alone for a few moments. A dog is a dog, after all. They should behave the way the owner wants it to ; 'sit down, wait for me and be quiet.'

That was how our dogs were treated, and I still maintain that dogs should not be allowed in the toilet blocks. 

Ca


----------



## thieawin

CaGreg the voice of sanity


----------



## sallytrafic

thieawin said:


> Natinal Train rules fortunately allow another passenger to object to the presence of a dog and in that case dog owner and dog must move to another carriage or the luggage van.


Luggage van? When were you last on a train? My wife is a felon twice over when she travels by train to see her daughter she uses the loos at the station and takes the dog(s) with her.

If you travel on your own there is little other option.

Try walking in someone else's shoes first.


----------



## locovan

Frank I can understand there are circumstances that arise when travelling with dogs on Public Transport but we are really talking about Camp sites where you have your M/Home with you. so there is a home for your dog and you have somewhere to put your dogs when you go to the shower block.
I can not see the necessity to take the dog with you and I'm sure there must be a no dog sign anyway.


----------



## 1302

Right then - thats the dog rule done to death... 

Shal we spend the next 7 pages on the 'washing your van' rule  :lol:


----------



## Rapide561

*Dogs*

Some dogs have chronic separation anxiety that cannot be treated - Oscar (RIP, now at Rainbow Bridge) had this condition. As a result, when we were in Italy for four months, we went every where together, and no one batted an eyelid. It had been known in the past for him to jump in the bath at home when I was in it!

Both Oscar and Jenny slept on my bed, even in it.

Jenny never barked or caused a commotion, unlike the brats, yes brats, running about on site at the moment whilst their parents are oblivious.

Oscar did visit the shower block in the UK too on various sites, waiting for me, and I'll tell you something, even if he had had a shower in there, it would have been left cleaner than some of these half term campers leave things.

Only last week on my friend's campsite, kids knocked tops off flowers and broke a fence.

Each to their own, but I'd rather be on a site with 50 dogs than 50 kids. I don't mind the kids, but why don't they play near their parent's caravan/trailer tent? Oh no, why should they, when they can make a noise near mine!

Russell


----------



## nicholsong

I have only been on sites in off-season and never bothered with the facilities - got my own shower next to the bedroom.

But from this thread it sounds like The Lords of Misrule

Think I will try to give them a miss.

Geoff


----------



## HeatherChloe

thieawin said:


> Natinal Train rules fortunately allow another passenger to object to the presence of a dog and in that case dog owner and dog must move to another carriage or the luggage van.


No that is incorrect. If you don't like to travel in a train carriage where there is a dog, then that is your problem, and you have to move, not the dog owner.


----------



## HeatherChloe

This thread was about a large number of inappropriate rules.

What is clear is that lots of people have said "oh no, dogs should not got in the toilet block" but despite asking them "why not?" no one has come up with any answers to that question

In fact, some have said - I'd be scared my dog would pick up something from the dirty humans that have been there before them.

Others have said - why shouldn't you take the time and effort to lock up your most valuable possesion - ie your dog - when you go. I can easily take my bag with my purse and my mobile phone with me (there are no rules against taking your bag to the toilet with you) but it does take time and effort to protect against the stealing of the valuable love of my life.

I would do that, if I were to visit the kitchen preperation area in the luxury restaurant locally to the campsite, but it still seems out of proporition to do so, just to take a pee, when there is no actual reason, other than that various people, for no logical reason, say "ooo noo missus, no dogs in the public campsite loo block"..... 

I can only think that there are no good reasons, having asked posters to supply them, but only having received comments like "ooo nooo missuss, I don't like it". 

Still waiting for good reasons on this stupid rule.


----------



## SpeedyDux

OK, how about this as a good reason:

All dogs are by their nature predators. Genetically they are 99% wolf. That's a fact.

Humans are by nature averse to removing clothing and performing ablutions, answering the call of nature, etc. when there is a predator close by. It's a natural instinct in humans. It makes us feel vulnerable, deep down. In in a toilet or shower block we feel trapped. We feel the need to be ready to fight or flee. Psychologically, it's inhibiting and uncomfortable for us to have a strange dog nearby. 

When we are clothed and in an environment where we do not feel exposed or trapped, we can more easily tolerate the presence of dogs we don't know. Even make friends with them.

Good enough?

SD


----------



## tonyt

Heather Chloe

It's clear there are many campsite users who do not like dogs in the ablution blocks.

Some campsite owners recognise their customer's preferences and make their site rules accordingly.

When looking for a site we all have different requirements and choose sites to match our needs be they urban/rural/large/small/with or without pools etc/child free/dog free or with a "no dogs in the ablution block" rule.

Some campers will only use sites that are child free - they don't have to explain why they don't want children around them - it's their preference for their time and space. They can have no complaints if they choose a site that accepts children and then don't like having children running around. 

The fact that you don't understand the reason for other campers preferences is maybe something you must live with.

Perhaps the simplest solution to your problem would be for you to avoid checking into sites that have a "no dogs in the ablution block" rule.

Perhaps you could persuade Nuke to include it in the MHF Campsite Database entries.


----------



## locovan

HeatherChloe I have given you my reason too, as I cant imagine what it would be like if we all took our dog/s into the shower block.
I dont want that when I go to shower-- so that to me is a good enough reason.

If we all took our dogs in that would be very noisy as not all dogs are well trained. That is a good enough reason for me.


----------



## thieawin

HeatherChloe

I just suggest you go check again with National Rail terms of carriage



HeatherChloe said:


> thieawin said:
> 
> 
> 
> National Train rules fortunately allow another passenger to object to the presence of a dog and in that case dog owner and dog must move to another carriage or the luggage van.
> 
> 
> 
> No that is incorrect. If you don't like to travel in a train carriage where there is a dog, then that is your problem, and you have to move, not the dog owner.
Click to expand...


----------



## HeatherChloe

thieawin said:


> HeatherChloe
> I just suggest you go check again with National Rail terms of carriage


I have checked them, as I travel using public transport regularly.

The rules on dogs are at clause 14.3. They say that a dog can use public transport so long as it is not dangerous, and it is not to sit on the seats. It also says that dogs travel for free

On the two occasions when bus drivers tried to tell me that dogs were not allowed on, this resulted in my complaining against them, and they were disciplined, and I have letters from the bus companies confirming that dogs are allowed, that their bus drivers were wrong, and their apologies. I now carry these letters in case of any other ill informed drivers.

So, I'm completely aware of the rules for dogs on public transport, thanks very much.


----------



## HeatherChloe

locovan said:


> HeatherChloe I have given you my reason too, as I cant imagine what it would be like if we all took our dog/s into the shower block.
> I dont want that when I go to shower-- so that to me is a good enough reason.
> 
> If we all took our dogs in that would be very noisy as not all dogs are well trained. That is a good enough reason for me.


Okay, so no noisy dogs in the shower block - I agree with that. So dogs who make no noise are okay.

"Don't want" isn't a good reason.


----------



## HeatherChloe

tonyt said:


> Heather Chloe
> It's clear there are many campsite users who do not like dogs in the ablution blocks.
> 
> The fact that you don't understand the reason for other campers preferences is maybe something you must live with.


It's a discussion board and someone asked about the 26 rules and our views on them. One of the rules is no dogs in toilet blocks. We're having a discussion, thanks.

I am drying to understand the reason for this preference of other campers, and so far, the mosts quoted reason is "I just don't like it".

Fair enough, but it's a discussion board, and so I'm asking the questions "why don't you like it?"

I'm getting - maybe the dog is noisy? maybe the dog will run freely and poke behind the curtain? maybe the dog will run freely and scare someone? maybe the dog is smelly and dirty?

Which then means that if the dog is not smelly and dirty, not noisy, does not run freely and scare someone, it should be okay. That's logical.


----------



## locovan

No!! because when you allow one in then you have to let all in and that really is not practical.
So if there are 8 shower's then that could be eight dogs thats not practical either. :roll:


----------



## locovan

HeatherChloe said:


> locovan said:
> 
> 
> 
> HeatherChloe I have given you my reason too, as I cant imagine what it would be like if we all took our dog/s into the shower block.
> I dont want that when I go to shower-- so that to me is a good enough reason.
> 
> If we all took our dogs in that would be very noisy as not all dogs are well trained. That is a good enough reason for me.
> 
> 
> 
> Okay, so no noisy dogs in the shower block - I agree with that. So dogs who make no noise are okay.
> 
> "Don't want" isn't a good reason.
Click to expand...

Just seen this reply sorry.
When the rules say Dont want!!! ---surely thats fair enough.


----------



## Jede

I work on a very dog friendly site, dog walks,dog wash, waste bins. The rule here is no dogs in shower/toilets. I have worked on sites where dogs were allowed for a time.

Reasons not to allow dogs in facilities.
It's unhygienic. 
Other campers(dogs owners as well as non dog owners) have asked that dogs be excluded, they feel threatened in a closed area.
Not all dogs are well behaved ( one owner wanted to take the dog in because he was too aggressive to be left any where near people).
When they were allowed dogs fought in the relatively small space.
Not enough room for all dogs & people.
Dogs have messed in toilet blocks.
Dog hairs are hard to clean off wet surfaces.


----------



## thieawin

National Rail Bylaws allows the train company to refuse carriage or entry to any animal.

Apart from all the other parts of the relevant bylaw this is a fair summary

If a customer objects to the presence of an animal, the owner must move it to another part of the train or put it in a suitable container in the guard's van/luggage van where available



HeatherChloe said:


> thieawin said:
> 
> 
> 
> HeatherChloe
> I just suggest you go check again with National Rail terms of carriage
> 
> 
> 
> I have checked them, as I travel using public transport regularly.
> 
> The rules on dogs are at clause 14.3. They say that a dog can use public transport so long as it is not dangerous, and it is not to sit on the seats. It also says that dogs travel for free
> 
> On the two occasions when bus drivers tried to tell me that dogs were not allowed on, this resulted in my complaining against them, and they were disciplined, and I have letters from the bus companies confirming that dogs are allowed, that their bus drivers were wrong, and their apologies. I now carry these letters in case of any other ill informed drivers.
> 
> So, I'm completely aware of the rules for dogs on public transport, thanks very much.
Click to expand...


----------



## ChrisandJohn

SpeedyDux, tonyt, locovan, thieawin, Jede,

Thank you for your, in my mind, totally rational explanations of your viewpoints. In order to remain rational I have given up. :roll: 


Chris


----------



## machilly

Let me throw my tuppence worth in, why are people intent on treating smelly hairy flea ridden animals as children, what will they want next, to see thier beloved dog going up the aisle dressed in white marrying a footballer, mind you might already have happened....

Lets face it Dogs tend to spray thier scent in new territory, do the toilet when the feel like it, they also cast a lot of fur/hair.
So common sense dictates that if you take them into a hygenic enviroment it would have to be cleaned more often.

Coupled to that, a lot of people are allergic to Dogs and Cats.

The other thing that totally disgusts me with some dog owners is the washing of Dog Blankets in site waching machines, or drying a blanket in a tumble dryer.

regards


----------



## HeatherChloe

thieawin said:


> National Rail Bylaws allows the train company to refuse carriage or entry to any animal.


No, that's wrong.

The train company can only refuse to carry your dog if it causes nuisance.

Dogs which are not causing nuisance are allowed on the train and you do not have to move to another carriage if some other passenger doesn't like your dog. The other passenger has to move.

When you buy a ticket to travel it gives you rights of travel and to travel with luggage and with your dog and if the train company does not carry you with your dog, then they are in breach of the conditions of carriage, rights to which buying your ticket entitled you.

This wasn't really about dogs on trains, but just so everyone knows, you can travel with your dog on a train and have a right to sit anywhere you like, so long as your dog is on a lead, and does not sit on a seat, and is not threatening to other passengers.


----------



## HeatherChloe

machilly said:


> if you take them into a hygenic enviroment it would have to be cleaned more often.


A hygenic environment?

I'd like a campsite in which the toilet block is a hygenic environment -

1. No touching the flush, door lock, or tap handle with hands just used to wipe bottoms.

2. Removal of shoes before entering the toilet block.

3. No brushing of hair in the toilet block to avoid human hair falling on the floor.

4. Compulsory use of the anti-germ handwash on entrance, like you now get in hospital wards.

5. No urinating or faeces in the toilet bowls.

6. No using of the showers by someone who is not already clean.

7. No standing at urinals or at toilet bowls - aim from a seated position only.

8. Alarms to be fitted around toilet seats which go off if a drop of something falls onto the floor due to poor aim, to identify the errant human users.

;-)


----------



## locovan

HeatherChloe said:


> machilly said:
> 
> 
> 
> if you take them into a hygenic enviroment it would have to be cleaned more often.
> 
> 
> 
> A hygenic environment?
> 
> I'd like a campsite in which the toilet block is a hygenic environment -
> 
> 1. No touching the flush, door lock, or tap handle with hands just used to wipe bottoms.
> 
> 2. Removal of shoes before entering the toilet block.
> 
> 3. No brushing of hair in the toilet block to avoid human hair falling on the floor.
> 
> 4. Compulsory use of the anti-germ handwash on entrance, like you now get in hospital wards.
> 
> 5. No urinating or faeces in the toilet bowls.
> 
> 6. No using of the showers by someone who is not already clean.
> 
> 7. No standing at urinals or at toilet bowls - aim from a seated position only.
> 
> 8. Alarms to be fitted around toilet seats which go off if a drop of something falls onto the floor due to poor aim, to identify the errant human users.
> 
> ;-)
Click to expand...

All very good comments but in your own words WHY?
and the answer is--- you dont like it. so you have to give in as most people dont like dogs in the shower's.

I have just been along to my friend who owns the campsite by me and told her of this discussion and she said "Dont talk to me about Dogs as I have had it up to here"
She has the rule no dog's off lead and she has had so many complaints because dogs run everywhere without their owners and poo everywhere.
She said she will start taking a bag to the owner and make them pick it up soon.

And no way would she have a dog in the toilet block as it would upset her campers.
She had to make rules and she gives them to her Campers on arrival and if they dont adhere to them she is so frustrated that she will have to say "off site."


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## SpeedyDux

*Geek Mode On*

Right.

1 - "The train company can only refuse to carry your dog if it causes nuisance. "

Extract from the National Rail Conditions of Carriage:

"*CONDITIONS OF CARRIAGE FOR LUGGAGE, ARTICLES, ANIMALS AND CYCLES*

46. Accompanied luggage, articles and animals

You may take small items of luggage, small articles and some animals with you in passenger accommodation without charge subject to the terms, conditions and restrictions set out in Appendix B. You must not place luggage or other articles on seats required for passengers. Animals are not allowed on seats in any circumstances.

49. Restrictions

Any Train Company may (notwithstanding the terms set out in Conditions 46 to 48 and Appendix B) refuse to accept an item of luggage, an article, an animal or a cycle *if, in the opinion of its staff*:

(a) it may cause injury, inconvenience or a nuisance or it may cause damage to property;
(b) there is not enough room for it;
(c) the loading or unloading may cause delay to trains; or
(d) it is not carried or packaged in a suitable manner.

Any Train Company's staff may refuse to accept an item of luggage, an article, an animal or a cycle even if it has been conveyed by train in the past. This Condition applies from the start of your journey and also if you need to change trains. Other terms, conditions and restrictions are set out in Appendix B."

So, it depends on the opinion of Rail staff and they have a discretion to refuse to allow you to bring your dog on the train.

2 - "Dogs which are not causing nuisance are allowed on the train and you do not have to move to another carriage if some other passenger doesn't like your dog. The other passenger has to move."

"*APPENDIX B*
ADDITIONAL CONDITIONS FOR LUGGAGE, ARTICLES, ANIMALS AND CYCLES

Animals

11. You may take dogs and small animals with you into the passenger accommodation of trains. Animals, with the exception of blind or deaf persons' assistance dogs at the discretion of the steward, may not be taken into buffet or restaurant cars. Animals are not generally allowed in sleeper compartments, however dogs may be conveyed in sleeper cabins with the permission of the Train Company. You should apply for such permission at least 48 hours before you travel.

15. An animal may be conveyed in a train's luggage van, if one is available. A dog should be muzzled and its lead securely fastened as directed by Train Company staff. Baskets and pet carriers must be secure. Dogs and any baskets or pet carriers must be clearly
labelled with your name, address and destination station. Staff will not hand over animals until you have proved ownership.

16. Dogs must be kept on a lead throughout your journey; other animals must not be taken out of their baskets or pet carriers. *If your dog or other animal causes a nuisance or inconvenience to other passengers you may be asked to remove it from a train or
railway premises by the Train Company or Rail Service Company staff.*" (my emphasis)

SD :roll:


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## Jodi1

I'm a dog owner

I cannot see any possible reason why I should want to take my dogs with me to the toilet block. When they need the loo I take them to the dog walk :lol: 

Seriously. Even if I was on my own, I would leave them in the van. If it was that hot I wouldn't be using the campsite facilities as there are perfectly adequate facilities in the m/h. My dogs are that .... dogs. They are not my children and are content to be left by themselves. I have taught them to be so, and before anyone says, they are very happy dogs, but they do know their place.


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## foll-de-roll

HeatherChloe 




I think you have a sever dose of "Anthropomorphism". 



It can be treated 



Andy


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## Rapide561

*Dogs on seats*

You may have read this story before....

Oscar (dog) and I were travelling from Peterborough on Doncaster in first class. Oscar was on a seat, I was on a seat and the train was deemed as "full and standing" - meaning passengers were stood.

The conductor working for what was at the time GNER asked me to ask Oscar to sit on the floor. I advised the conductor he would have to ask Oscar himself. The guard stomped off a quoted a load of gobble-de-**** about dogs on seats. I advised him that, and I quote from the byelaws "a dog may occupy a seat providing the seat is not soiled and is not required by a paying passenger". The seat was covered with a clean bath towel. The conductor stated that the seat was required.....

....I added, "but if the dog holds a ticket for a minimum of £5 or half the adult fare the dog may occupy the seat"

Conductor retreats.

Trolley passes through first class and I obtain a coffee and Oscar had a bottle of mineral water.

Central Trains operated a service from Liverpool to Norwich and this service often had first class seating. Oscar always occupied a seat between Sheffield and Peterborough and no one batted an eyelid.

Oscar also travelled in first class on a seat in Italy - again no fuss what so ever.

Here he is sat on the seat on the way to Venice.

Russell


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## tonyt

An interesting story Russell but it's done little to enhance the image of responsible dog owners for me.

I trust the dog was sitting on a rug of some sort and not directly on the passenger seat?


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## Zuma

*Re: Dogs on seats*



Rapide561 said:


> You may have read this story before....
> 
> Oscar (dog) and I were travelling from Peterborough on Doncaster in first class. Oscar was on a seat, I was on a seat and the train was deemed as "full and standing" - meaning passengers were stood.
> 
> The conductor working for what was at the time GNER asked me to ask Oscar to sit on the floor. I advised the conductor he would have to ask Oscar himself. The guard stomped off a quoted a load of gobble-de-**** about dogs on seats. I advised him that, and I quote from the byelaws "a dog may occupy a seat providing the seat is not soiled and is not required by a paying passenger". The seat was covered with a clean bath towel. The conductor stated that the seat was required.....
> 
> ....I added, "but if the dog holds a ticket for a minimum of £5 or half the adult fare the dog may occupy the seat"
> 
> Conductor retreats.
> 
> Trolley passes through first class and I obtain a coffee and Oscar had a bottle of mineral water.
> 
> Central Trains operated a service from Liverpool to Norwich and this service often had first class seating. Oscar always occupied a seat between Sheffield and Peterborough and no one batted an eyelid.
> 
> Oscar also travelled in first class on a seat in Italy - again no fuss what so ever.
> 
> Here he is sat on the seat on the way to Venice.
> 
> Russell


If you care to read the rules, you will see that under no circumstances are animals allowed on seats (National Rail Conditions of Carriage).

I have owned dogs most of my life, they have never owned me, the only place they are allowed to sleep is on the dog shelf, where they belong 8O


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## HurricaneSmith

There's none so deaf as those that will not hear.

:lol:


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## Rapide561

*Dogs*

Given that Oscar passed away 3 1/2 years ago, it is quite possible the rules were amended. I worked on board trains as a conductor 2000 - 2002, and I was s**t hot on rules, regs, excess fares etc etc. I can remember excessing a man who had a box with him - the box contained six ducks and from memory the maximum number of animals allowed per passenger was four.

Back to the campsite rules though, we are so far off topic (loving it), I will ask my favourite question about the colour of the curtains on board the Stena Navigator!

Oscar was always sat on a towel.

Having worked on trains, I have seen humans urinate, and worse in seats, destroy toilets and so on. One even through a bench - yes a bench - through a train window whilst the train was standing at a station. I have never seen a dog do that. I had the British Transport Police attend my trains on a few occasions, always the behaviour of the two legged ones, ranging from fare evasion to theft from the buffet so an assault on board. Some may recall a murder on the train in the Lake District. No dog involved there either.

Russell


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## 1302

Jodi1 said:


> I'm a dog owner
> 
> I cannot see any possible reason why I should want to take my dogs with me to the toilet block. When they need the loo I take them to the dog walk :lol:
> 
> Seriously. Even if I was on my own, I would leave them in the van. If it was that hot I wouldn't be using the campsite facilities as there are perfectly adequate facilities in the m/h. My dogs are that .... dogs. They are not my children and are content to be left by themselves. I have taught them to be so, and before anyone says, they are very happy dogs, but they do know their place.


Thank God for that - I was brginning to think all dog owners were nuts


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## 1302

*Re: Dogs on seats*



Rapide561 said:


> Oscar (dog) and I were travelling from Peterborough on Doncaster in first class. Oscar was on a seat, I was on a seat and the train was deemed as "full and standing" - meaning passengers were stood.
> 
> The conductor working for what was at the time GNER asked me to ask Oscar to sit on the floor. I advised the conductor he would have to ask Oscar himself. The guard stomped off a quoted a load of gobble-de-**** about dogs on seats. I advised him that, and I quote from the byelaws
> 
> Russell


So, let me get this right - you refused to give the sea t a dog was sitting in up for a person??


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## Rapide561

*Seat*

Yes that is quite correct. Oscar had a first class ticket and therefore was entitled to occupy the seat "providing the seat was not soiled" or "was required by a passenger". The seat was required by a passenger but as Oscar had a ticket worth "£5 or half the adult fare (which ever is greater)" he remained on the seat.

I will also add I was so annoyed at the manner in which I was spoken to, I complained and received a part refund. Equally, as mentioned, we never had issue with "Central Trains". Equally, Jenny travelled on a seat on a Grand Central service without issue.

Just spotted my first post on the subject of dogs on seats did not make it clear he had a ticket. Refer to my answer to the guard when I said "but if the dog holds a ticket for a minimum of £5 or half the adult fare the dog may occupy the seat" - Oscar had a ticket and therefore a seat. When out and about etc, I never argue etc unless I am in the right. Furthermore, a ticket does not guarantee a seat for anyone, unless a seat reservation is held. The ticket is your contract to get you from A to B.

An episode of "Open all Hours" showed Arkwright providing a chair for a dog to sit on as it spent a lot of money in the shop.

I will also add I even saw dogs checking in for a flight at Milan Bergamo Airport!

Jenny of course was also pampered in her time and here she is at the Hilton Hotel - yes on the bed! Well done Hilton. They realise dogs have spending power.

There are places where I will not take a dog and others where I will. Here are some examples.

When upgrading my motorhome from the Compass, I wanted to be sure both Jenny and Oscar could jump the extra height from the outside to inside due to the higher floor level. Most dealers would not allow the test to be done, but Lowdhams Huddersfield were happy to let the dog in the van providing I had a towel or something. Imagine how disasterous it would have been to have bought a motorhome that the dog could not get into. (There was a thread about this recently with an elderly dog getting into and out of a van.)

MFI Barnsley - there was no dog policy in place as far as I am aware, no sign on the door and Oscar spent a lot of time in store when ordering our new bathroom, two sofas and other bits.

Pubs - various allow dogs in the bar.

McDonalds - yes - no sign on the door to state no dogs, so in he went.

Greggs - strict no dog policy, so I gave my money to a member of the public in Worksop who bought the items for me. As I would be in breach of Greggs' policies, then I am not out to be awkward and cause grief.

Shops in France, Italy - never any issues at all, even restaurants.

House of Fraser - "no dogs" policy but the staff wanted to meet the dogs. During my regular visits, the staff got to know that my dogs slept on the bed, on Dorma bedding and were hoping this would make a feature in a store magazine featuring "Dorma" bedding. (see pic).

As many of you know, Oscar passed away 3 1/2 years ago and Jenny just a few weeks ago. It is "easy" travelling without a dog, go where you want and when you want, but people like myself and Heather (posting above), realise that when you take on a dog, particularly a rescue, it is just as challenging as a child. I would not leave a child unattended - refer to Portuguese case a few years ago - and treat a dog with the same respect.

Trips are planned differently, stops for tinkles etc. I am very much a doggy person and to read on the net about "dog needs new home - new boyfriend does not like dog" is pathetic. I am not anti non dog owners. I will also add that I still carry poop bags in my pocket and I am happy to tell dog owners off who are not responsible.

Now back to the 26 rules....

Russell


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## Rapide561

*Dogs on seats*

I knew dogs were allowed on seats.....

Quote from the T's and C's

Passengers may take with them, free of charge and subject to conditions below, dogs, cats and other small animals (maximum two per passenger) provided they do not endanger or inconvenience passengers or staff.
Dogs must be kept on a lead at all times unless contained in a basket.
Dogs without leads, cats, birds and small animals must be carried in an enclosed basket, cage or pet carrier. It must be rigid and not open (to prevent escape) and the animal able to stand and lie down in comfort.
*Animals and containers must not occupy seats, otherwise a charge will be made.*
Animals are not allowed in restaurant cars except for blind persons' guide dogs or deaf persons' assistance dogs, which may be allowed into the restaurant car at the Steward's discretion. However, every effort is made to serve meals at blind or deaf persons' seats within the normal seated accommodation.

Russell


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## Zuma

Well that certainly contradicts current regulations :? 

CONDITIONS OF CARRIAGE FOR LUGGAGE, ARTICLES, ANIMALS AND CYCLES
46. Accompanied luggage, articles and animals
You may take small items of luggage, small articles and some animals with you in passenger accommodation without charge subject to the terms, conditions and restrictions set out in Appendix B. You must not place luggage or other articles on seats required for passengers. Animals are not allowed on seats in any circumstances.


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## Rapide561

*Regulations*

Yes I obtained that from National Rail website this morning. Two differing views LOL - but that's why we like policies and proceedures.

Back to the 26 rules.

No camper to wonder around the campsite wearing nighties.

Put a coat on for goodness sake.

Russell


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## DABurleigh

Gold hoop ear-rings greater than 2" diameter are banned, along with leopard pattern dressing gowns.


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## sallytrafic

I would like to see the rule that they have on the Metro in Amsterdam invoked on campsites . 

It bans dangerous or annoying foods "The consumption of food and drinks that could cause nuisance or damage is prohibited", presumably the stuff they sell on their stations is exempt but a few months or so ago a woman was fined €60 for eating a croissant.


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## thieawin

You have to read the National Conditios of carriage in the light of the By Laws

The Conditions are contractual, the By Laws are criminal and over ride.

NB some train companies have their own conditions and again they are only applicable to the extent they do ot infringe the By Laws

The By Laws say a train company can refuse to carry a dog, or other animal, full stop

The Conditions say that if they decide to carry one then these are the applicable terms

For breaking the Conditions you cannot be prosecuted just asked to get off or move

For breaching the by laws you can be prosecuted and fined

The effect of the interplay is that if I object to the presence of an animal the conductor or another member of staff must arrange to move the animal and its owner from my carriage. to go to another carriage or the luggage van.


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## goldi

Hello,

I would ban inconsiderate people and my decision would be absolute. Oh and I might ban clothes.



norm


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## suedew

DABurleigh said:


> Gold hoop ear-rings greater than 2" diameter are banned, along with leopard pattern dressing gowns.


Oh Dave, can do without the hoop earrings, always think they are missing a parrot, but now i'll need to get another fleece dressing gown :lol: :lol: 
Admit to having bought it to see the look on John's face though, and it was mega cheap.
Dolores, how are you enjoying the thread? wonder if you expected this when you first posted :roll: 
Sue


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## 1302

*Re: Regulations*



Rapide561 said:


> Back to the 26 rules.


Not yet.

I cannot believe that ANYONE would refuse a seat to a fellow passenger on a train - the dog would suffer no harm sat on the floor.

That has to be the most inconsiderate act I have witnessed in ages.

But then it confirms 'some' of my opinions about those that seem to think their dog is more important than anything else in the world.

I dont have a dog - wouldnt rule it out if our property and lifestyle was a little more 'dog-orientated' I get along with dogs where they pop up. I could never fuss over it in the manner that some here seem to :roll:

I'm done with the dogs - nighties on campsites should be banned (unless there on a lady being chased around the m/h and not strolling to the lavvy)


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## 1302

thieawin said:


> You have to read the National Conditios of carriage in the light of the By Laws
> 
> The Conditions are contractual, the By Laws are criminal and over ride.
> 
> NB some train companies have their own conditions and again they are only applicable to the extent they do ot infringe the By Laws
> 
> The By Laws say a train company can refuse to carry a dog, or other animal, full stop
> 
> The Conditions say that if they decide to carry one then these are the applicable terms
> 
> For breaking the Conditions you cannot be prosecuted just asked to get off or move
> 
> For breaching the by laws you can be prosecuted and fined
> 
> The effect of the interplay is that if I object to the presence of an animal the conductor or another member of staff must arrange to move the animal and its owner from my carriage. to go to another carriage or the luggage van.


Rule or not - a dog occupying a seat over a fare paying passenger (of the human variety) is deplorable ...


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## Delores

Well... it seems I came to the right place to ask about rules...have to say I'm not a massive fan of them myself but it takes all sorts to make the world go around.

So what if I put my cat on it's lead and took it into the shower block...?


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## sallytrafic

Delores said:


> Well... it seems I came to the right place to ask about rules...have to say I'm not a massive fan of them myself but it takes all sorts to make the world go around.
> 
> So what if I put my cat on it's lead and took it into the shower block...?


On the basis of what has already been said by others on this thread - hanging would be too good for you.


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## CaGreg

Ahh but sure don't we all know that cats are clean creatures!!

(Stir, stir.)    :roll: :roll: 

Ca


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## billym

Quote delores.............................
".............Well... it seems I came to the right place to ask about rules...have to say I'm not a massive fan of them myself but it takes all sorts to make the world go around................."


I am trying to imagine a campsite ( in the normal sense ) with no rules.
.............I can't.

Are you an anarchist ? What have you got against rules ? It is ludicrous to think a business could survive without rules and regulations, terms and conditions etc.

If you don't like the rules don't go. No one is likely to worry too much.


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## Delores

billym said:


> Quote delores.............................
> ".............Well... it seems I came to the right place to ask about rules...have to say I'm not a massive fan of them myself but it takes all sorts to make the world go around................."
> 
> I am trying to imagine a campsite ( in the normal sense ) with no rules.
> .............I can't.
> 
> Are you an anarchist ? What have you got against rules ? It is ludicrous to think a business could survive without rules and regulations, terms and conditions etc.
> 
> If you don't like the rules don't go. No one is likely to worry too much.


 :lol: :lol:

Have you voted in the Miserable Old Git Pole...? Ooops! Poll! (Pesky wine!) 

 :lol:


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## billym

No I haven't. There is not a place to vote for ..........I am only a miserable old git when Britains got Talent is on............


Anyway how about an answer to my questions ?


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## Delores

And for the record - I'm not anti rules per se... but God himself only managed to come up with 10 of them, trust us lot to over complicate it all! 

1.You shall have no other gods before me.

2.You shall not make for yourself any carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate me, but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

3.You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain, for the Lord will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.

4.Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your manservant, nor your maidservant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

5.Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.

6.You shall not murder.

7.You shall not commit adultery.

8.You shall not steal.

9.You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

10.You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.”

See - no mention of dogs in the shower block!


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## Delores

billym said:


> No I haven't. There is not a place to vote for ..........I am only a miserable old git when Britains got Talent is on............
> 
> Anyway how about an answer to my questions ?


Oooohhh - is there a rule that I have to answer?


----------



## billym

Delores said:


> billym said:
> 
> 
> 
> No I haven't. There is not a place to vote for ..........I am only a miserable old git when Britains got Talent is on............
> 
> Anyway how about an answer to my questions ?
> 
> 
> 
> Oooohhh - is there a rule that I have to answer?
Click to expand...

No. Sort of defeats the object though.


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## Delores

Defeats the object of what exactly?


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## HurricaneSmith

*Re: Regulations*

[quote="J99Dub]............nighties on campsites should be banned........[/quote]

You may jest, but Tesco did just that, banning nighties in St Mellons Store:-

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/8484116.stm

No mention of dogs in the bogs though..... :lol:


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## 1302

*Re: Regulations*



HurricaneSmith said:


> [quote="J99Dub].
> No mention of dogs in the bogs though..... :lol:


This thread 
Dogs in Bogs
No brains on trains...


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## roamingsue

Barking mad!

Delores, sadly I think the reason for the rules has been illustrated by the dafter section of the dog fraternity. Sadly their own mistaken management of their dogs often borders unintentionally on the cruel, resulting in maladjusted animals. Dogs are not people/children.


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## 1302

roamingsue said:


> Dogs are not people/children.


Some need to address that - especially when they think their dog should:

Occupy a seat on a train
Go to the shower with them
or be allowed to pounce up to a frightened child whilst its owner says "he wont harm you he a softie"


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## Jede

After 20 yrs working for Royal Mail both as a postman and manager, the only time I believed a dog was not going to bite me or my staff was when it stood up on it's hind legs & said " today I'm not going to bite you postie " despite what owners said.

I'm not a dog hater, having had two labs for thirteen years. But when some people come on sites believing dogs have the same rights as people I really wonder where the world is going.

John


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## HeatherChloe

Lovely weekend away

After all the talk about dogs in the loos, I realised that public toilets on campsites really are not hygenic at all - I checked out the ones I went to, and felt there was much too much in the of human detritis that could be caught - people with germs on their hands, spilling their things on the floor, leaving toilet paper strewn.

Listening wisely to some of the people here, I realised that this would be a dreadful risk for my sweetie. 

So I spent the weekend using my own nice clean toilet and my own nice clean shower in th evan, and kept my dog away from picking up any nasties from the other campers. 

She is home and well and very clean and healthy, thanks for asking. ;-) 

Oh, and we went out for the day on the train too, leaving the van at the site. Luckily there was no one there who "objected" and who knew of any bylaws which supposedly superseded the well publicised and government agreed National Conditions of Carriage. The guard gave her a lovely cuddle and she didn't take anyone's seat. 

Hope you all had nice weekends too.


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## billym

Delores said:


> Defeats the object of what exactly?


Posting on a forum like this. Giving a point of view and seemingly not being happy when someone has an alternative one.


----------

