# Autotrail Apache Mercedes 208D - Any quick performance tips?



## Southmoor

We have owned our 1992 Autotrail Apache Mercedes 208D for the last 2 years. It is our first Motorhome and we love it to bits! However, performance is poor due to having no turbo and cant justify over £2000 to fit one. 5th gear is a waste of time, and it loses power on any uphill incline or if you drive into a head wind. I assume this normal for this 2.3 diesel engine. Any advice to 'streamline' the van or increase its output would be greatly appreciated! We do plan on keeping this for a few more years as it is in excellent condition for its age and has only done 45,000 miles but don't want to spend lots on it as we will never recoup this money when sold on.

Thanks in advance!


----------



## JeanLuc

I rather think you are stuck with 78 BHP. However, the consolation is that the engine is so well built, and so under-stressed, they have been known to run for 1/2 million miles or more. Certainly that engine is known to outlive the van bodies it pulled.
Probably a case of 'tortoise beating hare' (eventually) in your case I suspect.

Philip


----------



## macone48

If you check-out your local diesel specialist, they could "tweak" your injector pump to give up a few more BHP, possibly at the expense of some mpg!!!

Your engine, as already commented upon, is in no way "stressed" so a little more oumph wouldn't go amiss, IMVHO.

Trev


----------



## Antonia

*Ummphf*

Greetings,

We too have an Autotrail Apache merc, but the 207d, 1885.
These go on for ever, slowly 
We do like to potter all over europe at a nice slow speed tho, taking in the views, no rush. If I were you I would leave her be.

Regards

Antonia


----------



## Wizzo

*Re: Autotrail Apache Mercedes 208D - Any quick performance t*



Southmoor said:


> We have owned our 1992 Autotrail Apache Mercedes 208D for the last 2 years. It is our first Motorhome and we love it to bits! However, performance is poor due to having no turbo and cant justify over £2000 to fit one. 5th gear is a waste of time, and it loses power on any uphill incline or if you drive into a head wind. I assume this normal for this 2.3 diesel engine. Any advice to 'streamline' the van or increase its output would be greatly appreciated! We do plan on keeping this for a few more years as it is in excellent condition for its age and has only done 45,000 miles but don't want to spend lots on it as we will never recoup this money when sold on.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


I sympathise. I have a 1.9 non turbo which has I believe a similar power output. One thing to check is that you are getting full throttle travel. Have someone press the accelarator pedal all the way down whilst you check at the business end if there's any slack left to take up.

I have just done this to mine and I was surprised at how much spare travel there was left! It has made some difference in that it doesn't seem to run out of steam quite so quickly but I still have to test it on a long run.

JohnW


----------



## Southmoor

Thanks for all the quick replies!

I agree with all the comments. As I mentioned...we love it to bits!

The lack of power is just so frustrating. 

For example, the embarassment when I start to overtake a HGV....I hit a slight incline or a slight headwind (which you cant see coming) and I then fail to complete the overtaking manouver and have to pull back in behind the lorry.

I will look into the accelerator tip...thanks.

Anyone else with a similar van have the same problem with 5th gear? As soon as I put it in 5th, I start to loose speed unless going downhill and with the wind behind me....it just seems to labour. I cant get enough revs to sustain that gear at all!

Thanks again, I appreciate any tips.


----------



## JeanLuc

Here are a couple of specialists you might talk to. I have no knowledge of them, but their websites look interesting.

http://www.dieselbob.co.uk/index.asp

http://www.uniteddiesel.co.uk/index.php

Philip


----------



## Antonia

*ummmphf*

One further tip I can advise is to make sure that your fuel filters are CLEAN.
We did find that the van had great difficulty with hills and loss of power. If the fuel filter, ours has two, are not clean there will be a considerably reduced performance. Ads a result I now change them anually.
Its a simple job to change them, you should be able to do it yourself, i did.

If you need any advice on how to do it please ask and I shall type out the instructions.

regards

Antonia


----------



## Southmoor

We have found a fantastic local garage who did the MH's MOT and will have its first service (since we have owned it) with them before we are off on our travels this year. 

Do you think it would it be included as part of general annual service?

If not, do you think it would be costly to be done as extra while it is in the garage?

I am quite handy and will try anything so I might take you up on that offer....thanks!


----------



## Antonia

*Fuel filter*

Sure southmoor, not a problem.

The filter can of course be ordered from a parts supplier, mine cost £9.
The in line plastic filter was only £4. These are also available on ebay for our vans.
1) Remove the engine cover from inside the cab, three clips, one each side and one in front. Manhandle the cover out of the passenger door.
2) Open the bonnet to let in light, and gain access.
2) Inside the van, looking from the gearstick into the engine on the very upper left, more under the bonnet actually, you will see a cylinder with an aluminium cast top, upon the top of this you will see a largish (10p size) nut, rather flat it is. This is in fact a bolt that you should undo. the base and sides of the cylinder is the fuel filter itself.
3)Undo the hex nut (bolt) whilst supporting the base of the filter, care, diesel will fall out a little, keep it upright.
4)Extract the bolt and the old filter will come away in your hand.
5)Reverse to replace with a new filter, gasket built into filter don't worry.
6)If you have an inline filter it will be visible in the black fuel line coming from the previous filter assembly. normally cut into the fuel line with a couple of Jubilee clips. Again remove and replace.

Next, importantly;
7)Nearer to you, again on the lower left side of the engine block, you will see, at the side of the block, a greyish plastic container. On top of this is a hex cap, that should only be finger or coin tight.
8) Unsrew this plastic hex nut ( mine has a screw slot in the top too, so you can undo it with a coin maybe), this is a little pump. When loose, you will find you can pump it up and down. THIS is the FUEL primer pump.
9)Pump the fuel primer pump a lot of times  to get the air out of the fuel system.
10)Start the engine, if it runs smoothly its sorted. if not, switch off and pump some more.
11)Once the engine runs smoothly, switch off, screw the pump hex cap back in place, coin tight.
12)Check for obvious leaks. Start engine and careful visual check for leaks again.

Close bonnet, and replace engine cover, job done.
It would take a mechanic 15-20mins max. You could do it in not much more than that. It may be worthwhile asking someone to hold the filter tho.
Hope this helps
regards

Antonia


----------



## MervsDad

We also have the same vehicle, two years older but I expect its the same. 
5th gear as you say is useless, unless your already doing 55+ in 4t and going downhill it will not pulol the van. I've also tested it, the engine doesnt have enough power to even idle in 5th on a straight....it just slows down.
A shame but as others have said the engine itself is solid and has never missed a beat.

The only problem I'm having with mine is rust, this season it seems to have just spread like wildfire and the area around the air intake above the bonnet is terrible, problem is you cant get at it!

Can I ask how long you've had it and what you paid?


----------



## Antonia

MervsDad said:


> We also have the same vehicle, two years older but I expect its the same.
> 5th gear as you say is useless, unless your already doing 55+ in 4t and going downhill it will not pulol the van. I've also tested it, the engine doesnt have enough power to even idle in 5th on a straight....it just slows down.
> A shame but as others have said the engine itself is solid and has never missed a beat.
> 
> The only problem I'm having with mine is rust, this season it seems to have just spread like wildfire and the area around the air intake above the bonnet is terrible, problem is you cant get at it!
> 
> Can I ask how long you've had it and what you paid?


Hi

I paid 5500 for mine.

By the way. these vans have a habit of bad rust around the vents, you must deal with it before it spreads to the windscreen or the wiper mounts.
I am in the process or using epoxy and glass fibre to deal with mine.
Last weekend I started by exposing the rust and grinding it away...Big holes ! then I applied rust stop and left to dry, re sanded then applied epoxy inside the vents, using a thin art brush (messy) I then glass and epoxyed inside the holes and vents. when dry I started to sand down the outside where the holes are.
This weekend I hope to sand, smooth fill and sand again before I spray paint inside the vents and out with smooth hammerite paint.

Then I shall do the other one.

I shall let you know how i get on....but I gotta save my van 

Regards

Antonia


----------



## BIGMILLIE

Hi we also have one of these vans mine seems to go bit better 
I take her to the Hamble river once a week using the M3 and M27 I stay in 5th gear all the way even up the hill after Basingstoke unless there is a force 8 head wind !! normally cruise at 55 last week I was in a rush to get back and she touched 65 mph engine done 90000 miles get about 25mpg down to 22 if in a hurry. 

I have not weighed mine but are you carrying excess weight ?


also got a bit of rust popping up will have to deal with this soon 

off to Hamble next tuesday then Swanage during half term Europe in August 

Regards Charles


----------



## peaky

we have a fiat ducato 1.9 1994 with turbo but as u say hill performance is pretty bad, reminds me of our mini when i ws a kid, hills just anticipate and give em a good run up too !!! makes it real driving for us its our first m/h so have nothing to compare with, we are having her serviced on tues she has developed a rattle n idling but goes away when u press the clutch pedal in, also a bit juddery going along, perhaps needs new air filters ?? still love her though, but would love power steering next time its hurting my shoulders !!!


----------



## BIGMILLIE

Forgot about no power steering wondered why my arms look like Popeyes :lol:


----------



## peaky

not good on a woman though eh ????


----------



## MervsDad

Antonia,

Nice (in the best possible way) to know you also have rust issues simular to mine. Got a few questions I hope may help us both out..

What pressures are your tyres at?
Are the leaf springs at the back realy flat..almost inverted? Mine are, I'm sure they're over stressed. I contacted a firm in the midlands who make heavy duty springs and quoted me £250 or £200 if I could buy two sets...
My stabalisers at the back took a bashing prior to us buying Merv (our name for the van, I know its sad) and the bumbers...not very good to say the least. I checked recently and the lower skin at the back is rotten, I'd check yours unless you already have.
The boiler in mine is a Paloma, I didnt drain the actual heat exchanger this winter. The damage it caused has cost a pretty penny to rectify, boiler was burst..almost prized open, water filter split down the centre and 3 pipes ruptured. Sad thing is theres a sticker on the boiler in RED WRITING reminding you to drain in cold weather....annoying!!!

This year I intend to get ontop of the rust issues, unfortunatly the rust on the vent has already spread to the windscreen seal, not sure how i'll do it yet. 
The problem is that the inside layout is sooo comfy and relativly clean that we bought in without realy too much attention to the body work. 

Would be nice to know if you've replaced any of the interior blinds, mine look ok but the springs have worn meaning its a pain in the backside to close them.

Anyway, war and peace over!!!


----------



## BIGMILLIE

Hi bit more info for you

tyre pressures run mine at 60 psi

re blinds mine had same problem took em all off (pig of a job) and cleaned and rewound springs all work ok now

re rear springs we have fitted spring assistors from Grayston got them on Ebay for a few quid these entail a extra spring which fits onto existing springs easy job

regards Charles


----------



## rogerandveronica

I agree regarding ensuring that the fuel filter(s) are clear and that throttle action on the injector pump goes full angle, but also the air filter should be checked. I had a 308 van which had been stored under some trees and dead leaves had been sucked into the air filter housing. It went much better after the filter housing was cleared and the filter cleaned.

rogerandveronica


----------



## Antonia

Hi Mervsdad

Yep the rust is a real problem, today I have filled and sanded over the glass fibre on the port side vent. Ready to paint tomorrow.
Ground out all the rust on the Sarboard vent today also, rust all around to the window seal and 'nearly' to the wiper. I have cleaned it all up, rust stopped it and epoxied the lot, tomorrow I shall glassfibre inside the vent and out. Rub down in the week, fill and paint at the weekend. Off to the new forrest at 1/2 term.

My rear springs are very low, not quite flat and not inverted but, the back is quite low. Sounds to me like you need new ones if they are inverted. Too, we have just had 'Bessy' ( yep another silly name )  
Replated via SvTech up to 3100Kg. For this we had to have the front springs replaced with those of a heavy duty, Springs and U bolts £450.
having them put on £100. Replating fee to SvTech £235. DVLA free, Job done. As for your tyre pressures, depends on the tyre, ours have just been upped for replating.

I have a PDF that will help, I shall attempt to up load it. Nope wont let me. What are your tyre numbers and the load on your rear. For an axle load off about 1700Kg should be 57psi for the tyres I used to have, check your numbers! They are written on the tyre sides.

The blinds on mine are ok so dont know about that.
What do you mean by the rear skin?

BTW, before you buy 2 sets of springs to get them cheap. Have your van weighed to see it you need to up plate the van, is yours still 2800Kg? cos its not enough. My van was over weight unloaded withy me in it. Mad panic that caused last year I can tell you. If yours needs up plating you may wish to contact SvTech first before you spend money on springs.

Regards

Antonia


----------



## Southmoor

> Can I ask how long you've had it and what you paid?


We have had it 2 years...just starting our 3rd summer.

We paid £6000. Fantastic condition with only 45k on the clock.

Only problem we have had is fading decals / transfers around the cab. Nightmare finding someone to colour match with the rest of the MH. Got that done for £125. Now looks smart.

We have also had it re carpeted due to a swirly green carpet that looked dated.

The rust we have experienced is only around the front grill area. Just going to keep on top of that with hammerite smooth. Its not that visible from the front, just if you get close and look down inside the grill area.

Although 1992 H reg, I want to run it as long as possible...at least another 5 years. More if possible as we aren't that bothered about image and owning an old vehicle. While ever it is viable to keep running, we will spend no more than £500 to keep it on the road each year.

Do you think £500 per year is economical or dead money?


----------

