# First cold night in my MH



## RichardD

Just got back from a couple of days at the CC Abbey Wood site in London and experienced our first really cold night in the van.

We were not cold as I left the heating on low as we were on EHU, but the condensation the following morning was quite a surprise!

I have yet to get a set of external insulation screens so was expecting the worst here, but was surprised that the metal surrounds of the side windows and passenger door were covered in heavy condensation. As all the external screens that I've seen only just cover the window frames I can't see this problem being reduced with them in use. 

The inside of the passenger door from the top of the step well down was also wet as was the actual footwell. 

The external surface of the inside of the storage locker on the drivers side was also wet.

I also found a couple of wet metal surfaces under the dashboard.

All the internal windows were also very heavy with water and the one in the shower/toilet in the back had caused a puddle of water on the floor.

I also found several cold areas. I've already mentioned the passenger internal step well. The under dash area is also very cold and the main habitation door step has a couple of vents which allow the cold to come through. This must be vented into the underfloor! Which begs another question. How insulated is the underfloor and does the water tanks had better insulation around them?

Has anyone used a small dehumidifier to reduce the moisture content and hopefully the amount of condensation whilst touring?

Richard


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## 113016

Richard, the external screens make all the difference. We have no window or window frame condensation and none noticeable anywhere else.
I do leave a vent, very slightly open.
We did have window condensation with internal screens, but not elsewhere.

You mention a puddle on the floor, that would concern me, are you sure it is condensation?


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## gaspode

Condensation is always a major problem with "A" class windscreens, you'll be amazed at the difference a good set of external screen covers will make. Are your cab side windows double glazed on the Rapido? If not you'll need to make sure your screen covers extend across them. Even with screen covers you'll still get some condensation on the metal frames in very cold weather.
The remainder of your condensation is probably due to lack of ventilation. Two people sleeping in a small warm enclosed space produce a lot of water vapour overnight and good ventilation is essential to get rid of it - keep the rooflights open a little.


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## BillCreer

Hi,

Your hob / stove produce a large amount of water when burning gas so don't be tempted to use them to heat the van.


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## rosalan

As already stated, the external screens are the answer. Once you eliminate the wet front screen, you are removing potential moisture from the van. As you have discovered, when a lot of humidity is generated it settles on the coldest surfaces.
When it gets really cold we also pull the front internal curtains round and close the Remis blinds. The difference is quite marked.

Alan


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## 113016

rosalan said:


> As already stated, the external screens are the answer. Once you eliminate the wet front screen, you are removing potential moisture from the van. As you have discovered, when a lot of humidity is generated it settles on the coldest surfaces.
> When it gets really cold we also pull the front internal curtains round and close the Remis blinds. The difference is quite marked.
> 
> Alan


We also close the internals. 
We leave the large roof window up about 1/4 inch and a roof vent up about the same.


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## alphadee

A dehumidifier also makes an enormous difference, but obviously only if you have EHU. When we use it, we empty between 1 and 2 pints in the morning...and no condensation . It also blows out warm air, so doubles up as a heater. On low it is quiet enough to sleep through. When we are of EHU, the screen covers do a good job.


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## teemyob

*Open*



gaspode said:


> Condensation is always a major problem with "A" class windscreens, you'll be amazed at the difference a good set of external screen covers will make. Are your cab side windows double glazed on the Rapido? If not you'll need to make sure your screen covers extend across them. Even with screen covers you'll still get some condensation on the metal frames in very cold weather.
> The remainder of your condensation is probably due to lack of ventilation. Two people sleeping in a small warm enclosed space produce a lot of water vapour overnight and good ventilation is essential to get rid of it - keep the rooflights open a little.


But you may not be able to keep the roof vents/windows vented in a gale or cyclonic winds.

Tried it on the moors last weekend.

TM


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## 1302

Silver screens are a must. Keep out the cold and extreme heat whenever either of those two factors are in evidence 

I prefer the internal ones as you never have to put then away wet.

I wipe down excess condensation every morning


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## mikkistash

I am sure i read somewhere when i was looking into buying a calor gas heater for the conservatory that for ever pint of gas burnt / used creates a pint of water in the air. We like others leave a roof vent open a crack, same at home aswell in the bedroom (single glazed but thats another tread).


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## mangolover

I'm struggling to understand why we don't have a condensation issue in our RV. We have a huge (2.5m x >1m) windscreen and don't have any insulation inside or out. 

The screen and windows will steam up briefly when we cook spuds or rice, with the door and windows closed, but absolutely no condensation overnight. We have a small oil filled radiator we keep on during the night and warm up the van with blown air heating if we're cold when we rise. We also have an 80w tube heater that takes the chill off the bedroom.

I watched a neighbour in a new Burstner 821 on the Edinburgh CC site last week, spend a long time sponge drying inside his screen, dashboard and windows one morning and wondered why it was so wet.

This is obviously not a complaint, but I'm very curious to know why we don't share this problem. What's different about our setup?

mango


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## 113016

I think, it is all about ventilation :!:


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## alshymer

*Condensation*

I agree that ventilation is important, but personally I wouldn't have silver screens again.
Maybe I am fortunate that my Hymer has an electric window blind, set back from the screen some 10 inches and this has made such a difference over my previous A class Hymer.
I do have water in the drivers footwell and this must be condensation- it always goes to the coldest point and this must be it!
Also I need to keep the garage aired each morning.
The best top I can give for condensation is again the Karcher Window Vac. Use it after showering and cooking and in the mornings on the front screens. At least it takes the water away rather than sending it somewhere else!
Regards
Alshymer


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## 113016

*Correction*

CORRECTION

I have just been out to our van, which is parked up on EHU with an oil heater running all night. All of the opening vents were closed but Hymer do fit two permanent open roof vents which obviously were doing their job.
The external screens are up and the internal blinds are drawn closed.
I opened them and there is NO condensation on any windows and none on the frames  
The CORRECTION is due to very light condensation on the passenger door well step. I had noticed this before, but as we had recently wet cleaned this step, I wrongly concluded it had not dried properly due to the cold weather. I later dried it with a hair dryer, but it has come back, so yes I do have very slight condensation, but absolutely nothing to concern me.
Had the van been occupied, we would have ventilated a little more to compensate for the heavy breathing :lol:


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## minkymoo

*Damp in camper*

Hi, regards the damp you are having, we have a 986f and do have a cold area under dash but apart from condensation on windows no problem with damp.
We have found over several years and four campers that you need heat and ventilation to keep the damp at bay in particular when you are cooking,
and at this time of the year when you prepare your meal the tendency is to shut everything up to keep snug and of course this prevents ventilation. One answer is to eat a little earlier in the day if thats possible
Hope thats of some help 
Minkymoo


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## Spacerunner

*Re: Correction*



Grath said:


> CORRECTION
> 
> I have just been out to our van, which is parked up on EHU with an oil heater running all night. All of the opening vents were closed but Hymer do fit two permanent open roof vents which obviously were doing their job.
> The external screens are up and the internal blinds are drawn closed.
> I opened them and there is NO condensation on any windows and none on the frames
> The CORRECTION is due to very light condensation on the passenger door well step. I had noticed this before, but as we had recently wet cleaned this step, I wrongly concluded it had not dried properly due to the cold weather. I later dried it with a hair dryer, but it has come back, so yes I do have very slight condensation, but absolutely nothing to concern me.
> Had the van been occupied, we would have ventilated a little more to compensate for the heavy breathing :lol:


Of course you didn't get condensation, the van was empty :roll: .

You can leave all the blinds, insulating screen and windows open/closed, but unless there is a source of warm moisture (breath, cooking etc) there will be no or very minimal excess water to condense.


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## 113016

*Re: Correction*



Spacerunner said:


> Grath said:
> 
> 
> 
> CORRECTION
> 
> I have just been out to our van, which is parked up on EHU with an oil heater running all night. All of the opening vents were closed but Hymer do fit two permanent open roof vents which obviously were doing their job.
> The external screens are up and the internal blinds are drawn closed.
> I opened them and there is NO condensation on any windows and none on the frames
> The CORRECTION is due to very light condensation on the passenger door well step. I had noticed this before, but as we had recently wet cleaned this step, I wrongly concluded it had not dried properly due to the cold weather. I later dried it with a hair dryer, but it has come back, so yes I do have very slight condensation, but absolutely nothing to concern me.
> Had the van been occupied, we would have ventilated a little more to compensate for the heavy breathing :lol:
> 
> 
> 
> Of course you didn't get condensation, the van was empty :roll: .
> 
> You can leave all the blinds, insulating screen and windows open/closed, but unless there is a source of warm moisture (breath, cooking etc) there will be no or very minimal excess water to condense.
Click to expand...

That was why I mentioned that the van was empty :lol: 
So why do people bang on about heating the van at home causes condensation


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## Spacerunner

*Re: Correction*



Grath said:


> That was why I mentioned that the van was empty :lol:
> So why do people bang on about heating the van at home causes condensation


What they say is that warm air holds more moisture. Which, IMO, is fine. The more moisture held in suspension the less condenses out on cold surfaces, which you wont have because the van is heated.
More importantly, soft furnishings are warmed so will not attract invisible condensation.


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## rosalan

Regarding anyone who believes that an internal silver screen is as good as an external screen; sorry I have to disagree.
An Internal screen is very good at preventing excess heat from the sun turning your van into a greenhouse. I know, we used them for years.
Uncle Norm gave me a short lecture on why the less attractive external screen was better, in spite of being a nuisance to put away when wet, looking unattractive when fitted and costing more. I trusted him and reluctantly on this occasion bought a second-hand screen.
There can be little doubt that once used, its effectiveness becomes obvious. No condensation being just one of the advantages. It also keeps out the cold (and the heat) and with the drop down front, allows you to still have an all-round view during the day.
If you do buy one however, check how it is attached to the van, some are more fiddly than others. My present one has Velcro up most of the seams allowing greater flexibility in how you use it.
Next customer please....

Alan


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## 113016

rosalan said:


> Regarding anyone who believes that an internal silver screen is as good as an external screen; sorry I have to disagree.
> An Internal screen is very good at preventing excess heat from the sun turning your van into a greenhouse. I know, we used them for years.
> Uncle Norm gave me a short lecture on why the less attractive external screen was better, in spite of being a nuisance to put away when wet, looking unattractive when fitted and costing more. I trusted him and reluctantly on this occasion bought a second-hand screen.
> There can be little doubt that once used, its effectiveness becomes obvious. No condensation being just one of the advantages. It also keeps out the cold (and the heat) and with the drop down front, allows you to still have an all-round view during the day.
> If you do buy one however, check how it is attached to the van, some are more fiddly than others. My present one has Velcro up most of the seams allowing greater flexibility in how you use it.
> Next customer please....
> 
> Alan


I agree with Rosalan, external screens are by far the best.

I believe Richard had some externals but had a fitting problem.
It is on two other threads and he is in the process of sorting out.


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## IanA

Don't forget to move the heater vent to the recirculating position - this reduces the cold air coming in which leads to the condensation in the cab.


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## RichardD

Just to clarify some points raised.

1. My wife hadn't cooked on the evening in question.
2. Puddle on the floor was dripping out of the corner of the plastic window surround where it was collecting after running down the window.
3. Checked the outside/underside of the passenger footwell and it has no insulation over it, just the out of mould GRP. Insulation would make a tremendous difference here.
4. We always shut the dashboard air vents and turn the heater to internal recirculation.
5. See my new thread about external screens

Richard


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## 1302

We had a chilly night last night!










Whilst it was warm in the motorhome we had ice between the internally fitted silverscreen and the windscreen!!

Point noted about the recirc knob


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## billym

Quote RichardD


1. My wife hadn't cooked on the evening in question. 

.......... I thought that was quite funny.

We spent 10 yrs with 4 of us living in an RV. We nearly always stayed on sites with electric and in cooler weather always used a full sized dehumidifier. Even then, when really cold, the interior lockers would get condensation so we had to leave all the locker/wardrobe doors open which was a pain but better than wet stuff.


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## Crindle

*Re: Condensation*

The best tip I can give for condensation is again the Karcher Window Vac. Use it after showering and cooking and in the mornings on the front screens. At least it takes the water away rather than sending it somewhere else!
Regards
Alshymer[/quote]

Hi all.......just returned from a short tour enduring some very low overnight temps. Dealing with internal condensation first thing am on the windscreen is a breeze with the Karcher vac. wouldn't leave home without it........Crindle. 
PS See Here: Here


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## aikidoamigo

Tea towel... Quick wipe in the morning... Save 50 quid??


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## ttcharlie

rosalan said:


> Regarding anyone who believes that an internal silver screen is as good as an external screen; sorry I have to disagree.
> An Internal screen is very good at preventing excess heat from the sun turning your van into a greenhouse. I know, we used them for years.
> Uncle Norm gave me a short lecture on why the less attractive external screen was better, in spite of being a nuisance to put away when wet, looking unattractive when fitted and costing more. I trusted him and reluctantly on this occasion bought a second-hand screen.
> There can be little doubt that once used, its effectiveness becomes obvious. No condensation being just one of the advantages. It also keeps out the cold (and the heat) and with the drop down front, allows you to still have an all-round view during the day.
> If you do buy one however, check how it is attached to the van, some are more fiddly than others. My present one has Velcro up most of the seams allowing greater flexibility in how you use it.
> Next customer please....
> 
> Alan


Thanks, I'll have to get some.

Ooh, wait there....... :lol:


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## 1302

rosalan said:


> Regarding anyone who believes that an internal silver screen is as good as an external screen; sorry I have to disagree.


ALthough I still use the internal screens I agree with you... :wink: 
BUT - I really dont want to have to store wet external screens in the van (we have no garage)

Whilst away this weekend I halved the amount of condensation by firmly placing a pillow over the wifes face for ten minutes :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## 113016

When ours are wet, they either go upright resting in a bucket in the garage, or they go into the shower compartment


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## teal

Whilst our Mobilvetta is only 18ft long I went into have a dekko to see how it was and discovered damp mould on couple of seats, Took them indoors and put in our humidifier which following morning had over a pint of water in it and rest of cushions did not have a reading. I then bought and left in there a 80watt tube heater which done nothing , so sent that back, now waiting for a 500 watt oilheater to try that out.


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## WildThingsKev

1302 said:


> rosalan said:
> 
> 
> 
> Regarding anyone who believes that an internal silver screen is as good as an external screen; sorry I have to disagree.
> 
> 
> 
> ALthough I still use the internal screens I agree with you... :wink:
> BUT - I really dont want to have to store wet external screens in the van (we have no garage)
> 
> Whilst away this weekend I halved the amount of condensation by firmly placing a pillow over the wifes face for ten minutes :lol: :lol: :lol:
Click to expand...

We use Kantop screens which are available for VWs, not as insulated as some but very compact when folded, light and easy to drip/wipe dry quickly. I use an additional sheet of foam under when skiing. Also excellent sun screens.

Kev


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