# Road Tax ?



## themariners (Mar 11, 2007)

Hi,

Just a curious question to anybody, we have just got our new motorhome and the tax disc says 196.00.

I know that 12 months road tax was in with the deal, but i thought because it is euro 4 emissions it would only be 115.00. does anybody know the answer.

Thanks.

Sue


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## 106916 (Sep 8, 2007)

*Re: ROAD TAX ?*



themariners said:


> Hi,
> 
> Just a curious question to anybody, we have just got our new motorhome and the tax disc says 196.00.
> 
> ...


I think Euro4 relates to particulate and other pollutants rather than CO2 emissions. CO2 emissions is what the cost of the disc is based on. Euro 4 is only taken into account when calculating company car tax on company cars, not private vehicles. I may be talking doo doo so please correct me anyone.
Vidura


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*weight a minute*

£196! thats an odd figure.

As far as I am aware, your MH should be classed as a PLG (Private Light Goods) or PHG (Private heavy goods vehicle) depending on the weight.

I think without checking these are in the following 4 Prices

£165
£175
£195
£FREE If it is a Classic

Hope this helps?

Trev.

PS: Ours is a 4.6 ton, classed as Private Heavy Goods and we pay £165 as it recenlty went down.


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## GerryD (Sep 20, 2007)

The odd amount is possibly because it is 12 months and part of a month. You can now tax a vehicle before the start of the month provided there are less than 14 days before the start of the month.
Motorhomes are not taxed as cars, they are a separate tax class. Cannot understand why a vehicle rated at over 3500kg is less tax than one under 3500kg.


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## 103618 (Mar 27, 2007)

Hi All

We have a Eura mobil 680 on a o4 plate fitted with a fiat 2.8 jtd engine, 4.5 tonne Tag axle and we pay £165, I'm told by an accountant that this is because its a tag axle, and as such it reduces the wear and tear on the road making it cheaper to tax, in the same way that an artic trailer with 3 axles is cheaper to tax than a tag axle,(if this info is incorrect don't shoot me i'm only saying what i've been told)
Doesn't make much sence to me, tag axle more drag lower MPG more emmissions should be dearer', not that i'm complaining, That said our current motor home being an A class rather than the coach built with over cab bed 3.5 tonne fiat 2.8 jtd van is more economical at 27 mpg compared to 20.7 from the old girl, so it's proberbly is lower on emmisions and so should therefore be cheaper to tax
In conclusion maybe the tax system is deliberatly complicated to keep white collar workers in a job, who in turn buy vechicles which they have to tax to keep the merry go round going round.

Graham


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## chapter (May 1, 2005)

my road tax is due at the end of the nov 07 and its £180 for the year or £99 for six months for a 2l td 3.2t sundance
chapter


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## gm6vxb (Nov 3, 2007)

Have a look at http://www.dvla.gov.uk/vehicles.aspx 
Information is in there somewhere.

Martin.


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## HarleyDave (Jul 1, 2007)

*Re: weight a minute*



teemyob said:


> £196! thats an odd figure.


Er hmmm - actually er teamyob - I, er, think you will find that 196 is erm, actually an *even* number

You were waiting for that respose - weren't you? Huh Huh?

Cheers

Dave


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

Blisters said:


> ...4.5 tonne Tag axle and we pay £165, I'm told by an accountant that this is because its a tag axle


Nope. It's because it's a Private HGV taxation class, which provides a flat-rate £165 for vehicles of any weight which qualify for this purpose.

Dougie.


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## zulurita (May 9, 2005)

My new mh has a tax disc which was obtained by the dealer and I'm sure it said £215 for a 4.05 ton 2.3 litre multijet 130!

Am I being robbed??


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

zulurita said:


> My new mh has a tax disc which was obtained by the dealer and I'm sure it said £215 for a 4.05 ton 2.3 litre multijet 130!Am I being robbed??


What's the taxation class on your V5?

Dougie.


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## Melly (Jul 5, 2007)

GerryD said:


> The odd amount is possibly because it is 12 months and part of a month. You can now tax a vehicle before the start of the month provided there are less than 14 days before the start of the month.


I can't see this info on their website. As we come back in the middle of a month and will put the car on SORN while away it would be handy to do this.


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## zulurita (May 9, 2005)

Private Heavy Goods (motorcaravan)


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

zulurita said:


> Private Heavy Goods (motorcaravan)


See >> road tax rates for P-HGV << (bottom of the page).

It's currently a flat-rate £165 with no weight bands, and has been so for a very long time. I'd contact my local DVLA office.

Dougie.


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## zulurita (May 9, 2005)

Thanks, I had just been onto DVLA web site and seen PHGV was £165 I think the dealer has probably told them the wrong thing.

Panic over!! Just been out to see the tax disc and it is £165  But I do remember seeing £215 somewhere when given the paper work at time of collection, I thought at the time thats gone up a lot. So where £215 came from I've no idea.


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## passionwagon (Nov 13, 2005)

zulurita said:


> Thanks, I had just been onto DVLA web site and seen PHGV was £165 I think the dealer has probably told them the wrong thing.
> 
> Panic over!! Just been out to see the tax disc and it is £165  But I do remember seeing £215 somewhere when given the paper work at time of collection, I thought at the time thats gone up a lot. So where £215 came from I've no idea.


 8O The other £50 is the initial registration fee. :wink:


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

zulurita said:


> een out to see the tax disc and it is £165


lol - it was something to do on a rainy afternoon. 

As passionwagon says, it'll be the registration fee on top.

Dougie.


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## themariners (Mar 11, 2007)

Hi Zulurita,

I see that you have a Autotrail Cheyenne and if you only paid 165 for a brand new motorhome and i have a Autotrail Tracker EKS how has the dealer put a 196 tax disc on our new motorhome, i think i would like to know the answer.

Sue


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

themariners said:


> how has the dealer put a 196 tax disc on our new motorhome, i think i would like to know the answer


I doubt zulurita could speak for your dealer, but it may be that your van is less then 3,500 kg in weight. The Private HGV applies only to vehicles over this weight.

Dougie.


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## themariners (Mar 11, 2007)

Hi everybody.

Thanks for all your comments,i have today contacted the dealer and now waiting for a reply from them.

Just to point out, our van is 3,500 kg and we have paid a seperate £50 registration fee already.

Thanks again.

SUE


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## fdhadi (May 9, 2005)

Thanks teemyob for the taxation classes.

It seems our Burstner A747 was licensed as a PLG so been paying to much road tax. The correct class should be PHGV ie: over 3.5t.
I now need to contact our local DVLA office at Preston to get it changed. I wonder if they will refund the overpayments :evil: from the last 3yrs, though i think this is more a fault of the supplying dealer.

Might be a good idea to check your taxation class on your V5C.


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

fdhadi said:


> I wonder if they will refund the overpayments from the last 3yrs


I'd put money on it that they won't.



fdhadi said:


> Might be a good idea to check your taxation class on your V5C.


Good advice. Annoying for you without a doubt, but presumably you were only paying a PLG rate of around £175 instead of £165?

Dougie.


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## UncleNorm (May 1, 2005)

*Road Tax*

Hello fellow motorhomers.

Don't you just hate playing a game for which no-one knows the rules and when the experts are asked, they don't know the rules either! :roll:

Last Tuesday, our dealer posted to DVLA Beverley all the paperwork that was needed to register and tax our new Adria 650, GVW 3500kg. The new documents should have been returned within 48-72 hours so that we could pick-up last Saturday.

Saturday came, nothing in the dealer's post so big disappointment. The same on Monday! A lady at the DVLA searched, phoned back, and finally declared that the documents had not been received! Great! :evil:

Adria was asked to supply another set of documents which arrived yesterday. (Still nothing from DVLA Beverley.)

Because I am incredibly impatient and impetuous, I offered to act as courier and deliver the registration/taxation documents myself, in person, by hand...

The reception at Beverley was very good. Alison checked all the paper work. That was fine except... WAIT FOR IT ... the dealer's cheque only allowed for £175 tax and £50 first registration fee. Another £5 was needed because the tax would be £180. I handed over half my pocket money to cover the short-fall.

Just to finish this chapter (sorry Chapter!) I left MY phone number with the DVLA. When the documents have been processed, I will go and collect them myself, as our postal service right now is appalling. But that's another issue.

So far, only one person has mentioned £180 in this thread. I wonder what it will be next year! :roll:


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

*Re: Road Tax*



UncleNorm said:


> Saturday came, nothing in the dealer's post so big disappointment. The same on Monday..


Maybe it's turned up in HMRC on Alistair Darling's desk. :wink:

Dougie.


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## fdhadi (May 9, 2005)

Have to agree Dougie, but the mh is almost 4yrs old so totals to around £50 in overpayments.
Better in my pocket than theirs :wink: !


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## silverlocks (Jun 28, 2007)

Government Vehicle Tax Explained Click


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*PHGV*

Hello All,

If it helps I have checked our Tax Discs and the rate on our MH has been £165 p.a. scince it was registred in 2002. I orignaly thought it had been £195 at some point. I may have been getting confused with my T5 Van.

>3500kGt @ £165 p.a.
Qpod's are charges at PLG!

So I may well have shot myself in the foot now, given the growing numbers of MHF members and the fact that this can be read by anyone (including Qpod owners). The DOT/DVLA may well be getting a larger than average postbag.

Awaits.......

Trev.


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## dbh1961 (Apr 13, 2007)

The heavier motorhomes are cheaper for now, until someone realises the loophole they've created.

Mr Brown and his merry men will notice the number of vehicles being taxed in this class (private Heavy Goods) is increasing, and they will then start to investigate, and put the price up.

Mine is over 3.5t, and I would openly acknowledge that I'm enjoying the cheap tax while it lasts, with no expectation of it continuing.

In my experience, dealers haven't yet woken up to this. We bought a 4.5t Hobby a few years ago, with a tag axle, and 6 seatbelts. B*o*nhills registered it as the base vehicle: PLG, 2 axles, 2 seats. When I pointed this out, they understood the axles and seats, but claimed no knowledge of the PLG vs PHG. They thought all up to 7.5 tonne were PLG, and said they'd never had anyone else query this.

I know dealers often quote the "we've never had that problem before", but maybe they hadn't (given the earlier post saying his was 4 years old)

It was alarming at the time, because we had sent our V5 to the DVLA, with the corrections marked on it. They returned it with a letter, saying "do not use this vehicle on a public road, until it is taxed correctly"

So, if anyone has a 3.5t - 7.5t MH, check the log book and/or tax disc.


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

*Re: Road Tax*

I sometimes wonder if anyone actually thinks through what's put on a (DVLA) website:-

*Engine Size*
Not over 1549
Over 1549

"Not over" should read "Up to". 1549 isn't catered for. :twisted:

Dougie.


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## dbh1961 (Apr 13, 2007)

*Re: Road Tax*



asprn said:


> I sometimes wonder if anyone actually thinks through what's put on a (DVLA) website:-
> 
> *Engine Size*
> Not over 1549
> ...


1549 is in the first category, 1549 is "not over 1549"


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

*Re: Road Tax*



dbh1961 said:


> 1549 is in the first category, 1549 is "not over 1549"


<sigh> I suppose it is. I've recently seen "under xxx" and "over xxx" and got annoyed at the inaccuracies, so I concede I read the above whilst a little grumpy. 

Dougie.


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## UncleNorm (May 1, 2005)

*Road Tax*

Good evening Night Owls!

Further to my epistle yesterday, I received a phone call from DVLA Beverley at lunchtime today. My first registration documents and £180 tax disc were available for collection. Very efficient service seeing as I did not deliver the application until 3.00pm Tuesday.

The tax disc is a beautifully presented affair with £180 silver printed on it. I asked the clerk where this figure came from. She looked at a list near her desk and declared, "It's been that amount since March of this year."

In hope, I asked why the various websites do not mention £180 for any of the vehicle groups, except for those vehicles of "over 1549cc" which were registered before March 2001.

I'll only spend so much time arguing about a fiver! Tomorrow, the reg plates will be on, then I can start worrying about something else!

Good night!

Chapter: I have sent a PM.


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## dbh1961 (Apr 13, 2007)

This is confusing. Only a fiver, as you say, but it would be nice to be able to understand it.

It could be a part month. Is your disc to the end of December 08 or November 08?

If it's just a straight 12 months, then it seems they're including it in the "old" car category TC11. That can still apply to a new vehicle, if it doesn't have an official CO2 figure.

However, I'd have thought the base vehicle would have a CO2 figure, so you'd be in a category based on emissions.

Failing that, wouldn't category TC39 catch it? (again £175 though, not £180)

So, what can you do?

1) Don't worry, and just see what happens next year, it's only a fiver.
2) Check the expiry date (Dec 08 would mean all OK).
3) Check what tax category your disc (and V5 log book) state, then ask others what theirs' state (I'm not much help here, as mine's heavier).


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## 2kias (Sep 18, 2006)

Melly said:


> GerryD said:
> 
> 
> > The odd amount is possibly because it is 12 months and part of a month. You can now tax a vehicle before the start of the month provided there are less than 14 days before the start of the month.
> ...


Melly
You are right. It is not on the website as it is wrong. You can only apply after the 15th of the month but only for a complete 6 months or 12 months following the end of the current month. There is no half costs for part of a month.


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## refuel (Nov 20, 2005)

An interesting thread. I thought I would try and clarify things with the DVLA so sent their Customer Relations department an email on the 21st November as follows:

"Dear Mr Broom, I write to see if you can explain the logic behind an apparent discrepancy in Road Tax costs. I have a year 2000 Hymer Motorhome weighing 3.5 tons (or less) and classed as a Private (Light Goods) vehicle of over 1549 cc. I recently paid for a year's road tax on-line at a cost of £180. However I note that if my vehicle had been over 3.5 tons I would, presumably, be taxed under the heading of a Private (Heavy Goods) vehicle exceeding 3500kg (revenue weight). The cost for a year's tax would be £165, £15 less than I am presently paying. It seems wrong to me that it is cheaper to tax a Motorhome that is heavier than 3500kgs than it is to tax one that is lighter than 3500kgs. Could I ask for the logical explanation behind this please - assuming there is one of course. Yours faithfully"

I received a prompt reply (credit where it is due) as follows:

"Thank you for your email addressed to Mr Broom, I have been asked to reply on his behalf..
I can confirm you are correct in your calculations regarding the weight of the motorhome and respective costs of vehicle excise duty (VED).
However, I should explain rates of VED are set by the Chancellor, I can therefore only suggest you make your enquiry to his office. 
I trust my reply proves helpful.
Regards"

Feeling a little peeved about being directed elsewhere I replied on the same day as follows:

"Dear Mr ..........
Many thanks for your reply. I do feel however, that although rates of tax are set by the Chancellor those administering tax collection perhaps have a duty to point out any anomalies to his office when they are brought to their attention rather than, in effect, passing that task to the individual taxpayers, especially when it affects a considerable number of them.
Can I please ask if you would therefore be good enough to confirm (via return email) that you and/or your department have no responsibility to query the levels of tax set by the Chancellor when they appear to be unfair?
If this is actually the case then perhaps you could also suggest an address (preferably e-mail) in the Chancellor's office to whom I, and other motorhome owners, could address this matter.
Thank you in advance"

All this occurred on the 21st November. So far to date (28th November) I have received no reply.


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## refuel (Nov 20, 2005)

With reference to my post above I've Just received a reply fom the DVLA as follows:
Quote...
Thank you for your email.
I have passed a copy of your correspondence to officials at Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs for consideration and they have asked that I send you the following information.
Decisions on the rates of vehicle excise duty (VED) are taken by Treasury Ministers, as are decisions on how best to structure the tax classes within VED. As you have explained, your motorhome falls within the Private/Light Goods (PLG) class of VED, whereas heavier vehicles would fall within the private HGV class. In setting such tax classes the challenge for Government is to do so in a way that is both robust and concurrent with other regulatory and legislative requirements.
As you have observed, a 3,500kg revenue weight has been placed on the PLG class. This serves to segregate cars and vans from other heavier vehicles, and is tied to agreed EU wide vehicle design and certification regulations which have of course been brought into UK law. As such, putting the boundary between the PLG tax class and other tax classes at 3,500kg achieves commonality across the statute book, and therefore consistency.
As you will I hope appreciate, in setting rates, Treasury Ministers have to take-in a wide range of factors. Since reforming the structure of HGV rates in 2001, decisions have been taken by Treasury Ministers to freeze rates in these particular tax classes. Hence, it is acknowledged that a £15 difference exists between the rate you have paid, and that which would be due on a heavier motorhome. This is one of a range of factors that will be taken into account when the Treasury Ministers contemplate future rates decisions, although you should be aware that the Chancellor of the Exchequer has already announced the PLG class rates for 2008-2009 and 2009-2010 at £185 and £190 respectively for vehicles over 1549cc."
Any further enquiries should be directed to HM Treasury.
Regards
Unquote....

I have emailed back as follows:
Quote:
Dear Mr ........
Many thanks for the reply by HMRC - I do hope my details have not been recorded onto a database there (just a small joke).
Seriously, I do appreciate you passing the query on. However I am less impressed by the reply, which I think can be shortened to mean "Yes, we agree there is an unfair £15 difference. But hard luck; unfortunately for you, the HGV rates were frozen in 2001 and PLG rates were not. Hence we have already put them (the PLG rates) up for the next two years. So it looks like you will be paying £20 more than HGV rates next year and £25 more the year after. But we will think about your problem when we next make decisions".
Whoopee!
But thank you once again. Perhaps my next move should be an email to my MP. Worth consideration I think.
Yours faithfully
Unquote

Thought those with motorhomes under revenue weight of 3500 kg might be interested to know they will be paying £20 more than larger motorhomes next year and £25 more the year after! :?


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## aultymer (Jun 20, 2006)

As the owner of a MH over 3.5 tonne I suppose I will have you to thank when it's tax is increased to bring it into line with 3.5T toys. I hope you were not under the impression that you would get a reduction in your tax!! rather than forcing up everyone else's.
Bah humbug, Merry Xmas


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

refuel said:


> Thought those with motorhomes under revenue weight of 3500 kg might be interested to know they will be paying £20 more than larger motorhomes next year and £25 more the year after


What did you hope to achieve by raising this with HMG? Did you really think you would persuade them to reduce your tax? As aultymer has rightly said, if any notice is taken of this, it will undoubtedly be to raise the PHGV rates.

Thanks. 8O

Dougie.


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## refuel (Nov 20, 2005)

Oh Dear 8O I seem to have hit a raw nerve. It would seem it's all right if you are the beneficiary of a governmental mistake but not if you are the victim.
I fail to see, just because I have a motorhome of less than 3500 Kgs, why I should pay an extra £15 to subsidise those with larger motorhomes. I thought that was clear as crystal!
In answer to the question what did I hope to achieve, I hoped to clarify why I was paying £15 more in VED than a motorhome of over 3500 Kgs. I think I have achieved that aim. If there is unfairness in the way VED is applied then, in my opinion, that unfairness should be highlighted and, if possible, rectified.  
Sorry if that annoys the "big boys" but us small tadpoles have as much right to our opinion as you do. 

Keep the criticisms coming if you want. Members will make their own judgements I'm sure and any comments will keep the subject at the top of the Forum posts  Happy Christmas!


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

refuel said:


> It would seem it's all right if you are the beneficiary of a governmental mistake but not if you are the victim


Isn't that called Human Nature? I consider myself quite responsible, but would admit to stopping short of asking HMG to put my road tax up so you can sleep with a more comfortable sense of equality.....and I bet you the VED difference that you'd do the same. Or am I unfairly misjudging the extent of your honour?



refuel said:


> I fail to see, just because I have a motorhome of less than 3500 Kgs, why I should pay an extra £15 to subsidise those with larger motorhomes


I quite agree, but my question was, "What did you hope to achieve by raising it?".



refuel said:


> If there is unfairness in the way VED is applied then, in my opinion, that unfairness should be highlighted and, if possible, rectified


That's clear now - "rectified" has nothing to do with helping your own situation, but everything to do with detrimentally affecting other people's. Lots of people do that, but I just think it's important that we all recognise that that's the aim of your exercise here.



refuel said:


> Sorry if that annoys the "big boys" but us small tadpoles have as much right to our opinion as you do


If I was rude, I'd say you were suffering from a certain syndrome which affects the likes of Ronnie Corbett. I actually share your opinion, but knowing that you have no hope of changing your own rate of VED for the better, but instead, taking deliberate steps to ensure parity by deliberately and adversely affecting fellow motorhomers, is what I call mean-spirited. I've not seen that on here before to this extent.



refuel said:


> Keep the criticisms coming if you want


No thanks.

Dougie.


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## Wizzo (Dec 3, 2007)

It's not only motorhomes that are subject to such anomaly. It's cheaper to tax a small 4 wheel car than a motorcycle of similar engine size, yet the car will cause more wear and tear and use more fuel!

JohnW


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## refuel (Nov 20, 2005)

Dear me Dougie - you do seem to be getting het-up :roll:

In answer to your comments:

_Isn't that called Human Nature? I consider myself quite responsible, but would admit to stopping short of asking HMG to put my road tax up so you can sleep with a more comfortable sense of equality.....and I bet you the VED difference that you'd do the same. Or am I unfairly misjudging the extent of your honour? _
I don't think I have asked anyone to put any road tax up - have I? :?

_ quite agree, but my question was, "What did you hope to achieve by raising it?". _
I refer you to my previous post - Quote: In answer to the question what did I hope to achieve, I hoped to clarify why I was paying £15 more in VED than a motorhome of over 3500 Kgs

_That's clear now - "rectified" has nothing to do with helping your own situation, but everything to do with detrimentally affecting other people's. Lots of people do that, but I just think it's important that we all recognise that that's the aim of your exercise here. _
I very much resent the assumption you make. I have never set out to detrimentally affect other people's situation and that was never the aim of the exercise. This is a conclusion you have - erroneously -made.

_If I was rude, I'd say you were suffering from a certain syndrome which affects the likes of Ronnie Corbett. I actually share your opinion, but knowing that you have no hope of changing your own rate of VED for the better, but instead, taking deliberate steps to ensure parity by deliberately and adversely affecting fellow motorhomers, is what I call mean-spirited. I've not seen that on here before to this extent._
I consider you ARE being rude and I thought there were rules on this website about making personal attacks on members viz:

No personal attacks against other members of the forums.
No Abusive attacks against other members of the forums.

I have in no way taken deliberate steps to ensure parity by deliberately and adversely affecting fellow motorhomers and I am NOT mean spirited. And, unless you can substantiate your claims, I believe you owe me an apology!

Perhaps the moderators ought to keep a gentle eye on this thread :?


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

refuel said:


> Dear me Dougie - you do seem to be getting het-up


Not at all. I only ever respond at the same level at others' posts, which often is direct. Never mistake directness for rudeness, which is what I think you've done.

You've said that you never set out to detrimentally affect other people's situation and that was never the aim of the exercise. If that's your position, then I accept it - let's move on then from the intention to the effect. You appear not to have thought through the potential consequences to other PHGV motorhomers by raising the disparity with HMG. That's my opinion based on what I've read.

To reiterate - you've confused directness with rudeness. I did make an attack, but not on you - only on what you've posted, which I'm quite entitled to make as it's a public forum, and I feel strongly about it. Let me clarify. I consider the actions of anyone who raises an issue of VED disparity with the Government with no hope of having their own VED reduced, AND who knows - or ought to know - that the only action taken (if any) will be to increase the apparently-unfairly-low PHGV VED, to be mean-spirited. If you find that insulting, you don't need to - it's an expression of opinion about what I've read here, not on you as a person. Substantiation isn't needed with opinions - clarification is often helpful though, hence the above.



refuel said:


> Perhaps the moderators ought to keep a gentle eye on this thread:?


I'm sure the moderators will do what moderators always do. 

Dougie.


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## sweetie (Nov 28, 2005)

Just think refuel if you was to buy a motorhome over 3.5t you could save £15 VED
Our new solano on 4T chassis was taxed for 1year and 1 week cost £171

Steve


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## refuel (Nov 20, 2005)

Dougie

_Never mistake directness for rudeness, which is what I think you've done._
So perhaps you could clarify the difference for me? if someone says "If I was rude......." that says very strongly that what comes next is going to be rude - and it was. Obviously we will have to agree to differ. 

_I did make an attack, but not on you - only on what you've posted_
Again I fail to see the difference. If you attack what I say then you are attacking me, as what I say is obviously "me" if written in a forum.

_ consider the actions of anyone who raises an issue of VED disparity with the Government with no hope of having their own VED reduced, AND who knows - or ought to know - that the only action taken (if any) will be to increase the apparently-unfairly-low PHGV VED, to be mean-spirited. If you find that insulting, you don't need to - it's an expression of opinion about what I've read here, not on you as a person_
With all due respect, your opinions are mistaken - and you would do better clarifying exactly what someone means when they post rather than launching an unwarranted attack, whether you feel it is on the post itself or the individual.

I reiterate for the last time. I have never set out to reduce my tax - or to increase the tax on PHGVs. I wished to clarify why I was being charged £15 less than a motorhome over 3500kg revenue weight. I posted the results on this forum for those interested. If you wish to object to that then obviously that is your right. But it is not your right to launch an unwarranted personal attack on me, or my posts (if you think there is a difference).

We are obviously not going to agree on this. I am not going to repeat myself further or enter into more fruitless argument. You have obviously made your mind up about me (or perhaps I should say "my posts" by your personal definition) and I have, in turn, made my mind up about you (or should I say your posts?)

I suggest we call it quits.


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## asprn (Feb 10, 2006)

refuel said:


> Obviously we will have to agree to differ


Indeed.



refuel said:


> If you attack what I say then you are attacking me, as what I say is obviously "me" if written in a forum


Our Parliamentary system says otherwise.



refuel said:


> With all due respect, your opinions are mistaken


In your opinion. 



refuel said:


> If you wish to object to that then obviously that is your right


Indeed.



refuel said:


> But it is not your right to launch an unwarranted personal attack on me..


Indeed.



refuel said:


> ... or my posts (if you think there is a difference)


If I post, you can attack what I say if you feel strongly enough about it. If you post, I believe I can do likewise.



refuel said:


> We are obviously not going to agree on this


Indeed.



refuel said:


> You have obviously made your mind up about me


I have no real opinion about you, as I know nothing about you.



refuel said:


> .... (or perhaps I should say "my posts" by your personal definition)


Indeed.



refuel said:


> and I have, in turn, made my mind up about you (or should I say your posts?)


Indeed.



refuel said:


> I suggest we call it quits.


Indeed.

G'night. 

Dougie.


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