# Disappointing Motorhome build quality & aftercare



## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

I believe in fairness and although I have probably been branded as one of the Wolves and perhaps Bullies I agree it is unfair that Swift have been singled out. I still think they are part of the problem but only part and at least they seem to want to sort things out.

I think there is a serious quality problem throughout the industry and you shouldn't find this sort of thing when removing an oven, and I wouldn't expect a dealer to have found it either:

















This is only tidying up and any one working in the manufacturing of a motorhome should know better and be capable of doing a better job. Reading lots of posts on here it would seem that the natural state of motorhomers might be described as disappointed.

So considering all manufacturers and dealers can I please repost one of my contributions (and I enclose the quote from DABs which prompted it).



DABurleigh said:


> Too many UK manufacturers and dealers treat their customers like Microsoft do - just presume they are gagging for their product and let them be beta-testers gradually to iron out the bugs.
> 
> Dave


Couldn't agree more beta testers that is all we are  unless you are cynical like me and say that we are just poor alpha testers.

If the design is wrong then the *manufacturer* is responsible
If the manufacture is poor quality then the * manufacturer* is responsible
If the final QA is skimped then the the *manufacturer* is responsible
If the PDI and handover is skimped then its the *dealer's* fault

If any of the above is wrong you have to go through the *dealer*

Who'd be a dealer 

but who'd be a *buyer* :roll:


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## mikeyv (May 23, 2007)

I tend to think that the quality of the tidying up after a job, tends to go hand in hand with the quality of the job itself.


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## hblewett (Jan 28, 2008)

I agree


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

sallytrafic said:


> I believe in fairness and although I have probably been branded as one of the Wolves and perhaps Bullies I agree it is unfair that Swift have been singled out. I still think they are part of the problem but only part and at least they seem to want to sort things out.
> 
> I think there is a serious quality problem throughout the industry and you shouldn't find this sort of thing when removing an oven, and I wouldn't expect a dealer to have found it either:
> 
> ...


Top post linking in perfectly with my experiences

Next time I have to open side panels my camera will be ready

Can I be in your gang please


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## eddievanbitz (May 1, 2005)

And what van was that then Frank? :roll: Just for clarity

Eddie


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## pneumatician (May 1, 2005)

*Quality*

Sally traffic, 
I see that you also have been the victim of the current situation regarding manufacturing standards within the Caravan & Motorhome industry.
This results from the old adage "Has it got to fly" if not anything will do.
Your "fitters "? needed to gain acess to a 12mm fitting and to do this they needed a 200mm hole. My AS fitters needed acess to two 25mm fittings which required two 100mm holes. (resulted in shower tray collapse) 
In the past the pipe location would have been drawn and coordinates transferred to the panels allowing small clearance holes to be drilled.
In the same AS Van we owned I gained access to the water pump only to find all of the original pump packaging waste paper etc in the enclosure. Sadly we no longer have the skills or pride in our manufactureing ability.

Steve


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

eddievanbitz said:


> And what van was that then Frank? :roll: Just for clarity
> 
> Eddie


hmmmmmmmmmm not sure what your angle is eddie but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt  Having started this thread out of an issue of fairness it seems wrong to mention another name but these photos have already appeared on MHF so read about it in my blog here>Blog<


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## eddievanbitz (May 1, 2005)

sallytrafic said:


> I believe in fairness and although I have probably been branded as one of the Wolves and perhaps Bullies I agree it is unfair that Swift have been singled out. I still think they are part of the problem but only part and at least they seem to want to sort things out.
> 
> I think there is a serious quality problem throughout the industry and you shouldn't find this sort of thing when removing an oven, and I wouldn't expect a dealer to have found it either:
> 
> ...


Thank you for the benefit of the doubt! I understand that you didn't want to start another bun fight by naming another converter. However it "could" mislead someone to thinking that it was Swift. Hence the clarification.

I know that we are not always on the same wavelenght, but we both do like things fair and square

Eddie (how could you ever have doubted :roll: :wink: )


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## TR5 (Jun 6, 2007)

Many "wrongs" are disclosed in the threads on here, and some of the manufacturers pledge to "put right" the "wrongs" that have occured.

However, these are only the "wrongs" that have revealed themselves. How many are hidden behind the facade, and may never be discovered.

When will we see the results of some of the manufaturer pledges to get things right, many years hence I fear, if ever!

We could start with dealers doing a PDI on receipt of the vehicle, and rejecting or refusing it, if in a poor condition.


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## Jezport (Jun 19, 2008)

I have been in business myself and managed large optician practices so I know how to treat customers and turn out products of a high standard. So I just cannot understand why any manufacturer should turn out a shoddy faulty product. It doesnt take a lot longer to do a job right, and it doesnt cost any more in the long term. The extra time spent before the vehicle goes out would cost a lot less than recalling it later, and you would save any embarrasing publicity.

I am not aiming this post at any one company, as I see so many products that could be made better by just a bit mor thought and care.


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## olive (Feb 5, 2008)

Has anyone got a list of the RECALLS sent out by the manufacturers/converters. I don't mean the base vehicle recalls eg the FIAT scuttle or dodgy brakepipes, but have for eg Roller Team ever sent out a recall/warning.

I ask because our 2003 model has just had a very expensive repair for damp, a fault which I know has occurred on another 2003 model, and if I had been warned could, perhaps, have saved a lot of money.

Incidentally I emailed Roller Team to show them where the water was getting in with the naive hope that they might let other owners know ... were they interested? ... don't be silly!

If, by some good fortune, I have managed to attach a piccy ... the red bit is where the rot had set in .... bigtime .... possibly for years


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## Jezport (Jun 19, 2008)

olive said:


> Has anyone got a list of the RECALLS sent out by the manufacturers/converters. I don't mean the base vehicle recalls eg the FIAT scuttle or dodgy brakepipes, but have for eg Roller Team ever sent out a recall/warning.
> 
> I ask because our 2003 model has just had a very expensive repair for damp, a fault which I know has occurred on another 2003 model, and if I had been warned could, perhaps, have saved a lot of money.
> 
> ...


Did you have a regular dmp check? If so how could it be there for years and not be noticed?

I am glad my Frankia doesnt have wood studwork, it has alloy instead.


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## olive (Feb 5, 2008)

We didn't have an annual dampcheck because we bought the MH ( our first and only ) secondhand from a non Rollerteam dealer 200 miles away from home!! a not-to-do lesson we have learned the expensive way.

However, it was damp checked a couple of years ago and the problem wasn't found. The rot was in the main timber frames which are hidden away.

Apart from the damp problem the Roller Team has now done over 37,000 miles and we are very pleased with it.

It is not the fact that it had water ingress that bothers me ... what do you expect if you bolt a wooden shed onto a lorry and drive it around Europe at 60mph .. it is the fact that Roller Team/ Trigano weren't interested!


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

eddievanbitz said:


> And what van was that then Frank? :roll: Just for clarity
> 
> Eddie


Not my piccys but it could well have been my Oakmont (Swifts)


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

eddievanbitz said:


> sallytrafic said:
> 
> 
> > I believe in fairness and although I have probably been branded as one of the Wolves and perhaps Bullies I agree it is unfair that Swift have been singled out. I still think they are part of the problem but only part and at least they seem to want to sort things out.
> ...


See my post Eddie

It could have been my Swift had I the nous to take a piccy

I'm still waiting for your views on QC regarding your Merc


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## ingram (May 12, 2005)

Jezport said:


> So I just cannot understand why any manufacturer should turn out a shoddy faulty product. It doesnt take a lot longer to do a job right, and it doesnt cost any more in the long term.


A few years ago, I was working alongside someone who's previous job was on the 'assembly line' of a 'coachbuilder'. I think they made ambulances, if nothing else, but not motorhomes as far as I know.

He told me that when ( not 'if' ) there were gaps where the body met the cab, for example, he just squirted a load of mastic in and covered it over with the floor covering. "We didn't have time to mess about" he said, "we were on piece work"..................

Harvey


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

Jezport said:


> I have been in business myself and managed large optician practices so I know how to treat customers and turn out products of a high standard. So I just cannot understand why any manufacturer should turn out a shoddy faulty product. It doesnt take a lot longer to do a job right, and it doesnt cost any more in the long term. The extra time spent before the vehicle goes out would cost a lot less than recalling it later, and you would save any embarrasing publicity.
> 
> I am not aiming this post at any one company, as I see so many products that could be made better by just a bit mor thought and care.


It's almost as easy to do it right rather than wrong assuming that you know what right is. In all my dealing with one company they seemed to have different workers all the time so perhaps it is a training issue. I was chatting with one of the manufacturers who have one of the better reputations and was (almost) offered a job! They said that there was a skills shortage amongst young people with the brightest going to college and the rest wanting to be plumbers or other jobs that are thought to be highly paid so they were looking to employ older people.


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

ingram said:


> Jezport said:
> 
> 
> > So I just cannot understand why any manufacturer should turn out a shoddy faulty product. It doesnt take a lot longer to do a job right, and it doesnt cost any more in the long term.
> ...


Speaks volumes about the UK Motor Home builders

I've never had a problem with my German cars caravans or MH's

My first UK MH Swift Oakmont has been bad news


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## Losos (Oct 28, 2009)

Jezport said:


> I have been in business myself and managed large optician practices so I know how to treat customers and turn out products of a high standard. So I just cannot understand why any manufacturer should turn out a shoddy faulty product.


I hired a van in April from a reasonably well known name in the industry, it was a brand new van and I was horrified at some of the things I found on it, it seemed pretty clear to me that no one from the factory had ever been out in it else theywould surely have found the same deficiencies that I found within a couple of days of using it, furthermore when I went back to have the heater fixed the dealer couldn't fix it, had to go the whole three weeks without the heater, mind you they did give me an extra sleeping bag :roll:


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

Wupert said:


> I
> See my post Eddie
> 
> It could have been my Swift had I the nous to take a piccy
> ...


Bump


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## gaspode (May 9, 2005)

Hi Wupert

I'm sure that Eddie will reply to your post if and when he wishes, constant harassing is more likely to dissuade him from responding.

Please also see THE FORUM RULES with respect to bumping topics.


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

Also wupert if you are going to quote please do it properly re your last post I'm sure I never said that


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## sersol (Aug 1, 2005)

I see another bun fight starting here,why not move it straight to members bar :wink: .
Now, should some one start another thread on the back of this one thanking the(if we knew who it was) converter? I don't think so.
It just goes to show that people have opposing ideas about what is acceptable and whats not.
Anyway who would normally remove the oven from a motorhome and are they gas qualified to do that (just a thought).
Gary


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

sersol said:


> clipped...Anyway who would normally remove the oven from a motorhome and are they gas qualified to do that (just a thought).
> Gary


Gary I could have shown several photographs to illustrate my point not connected with the removal of an oven but as an indication of what lies underneath but these were to hand in MHF from the blog referred to above. I could also have picked on a different van but again I would have had to search for the photos.

and yes I removed the oven and later did all the changes to the gas system but if you want to see why you'll have to read the blog and the midlife refit one I wrote afterwards. Blog 1 Blog 2


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

sallytrafic said:


> Also wupert if you are going to quote please do it properly re your last post I'm sure I never said that


Oh dear what have I managed to Screw up now


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## Vennwood (Feb 4, 2007)

I recently went out to the manufacturers of our MH to have a problem fixed - nothing to do with quality but fit for purpose maybe. I just turned up at the door, went to the customer services desk and was fitted in within a couple of hours. Many of my fellow MH owners were sat there waiting for work done and most said they were there for routine servicing etc.
Why don't UK manufacturers have a service centre so that concerned customers can book in their MH's and get the "experts" to fix it? This is nothing to do with dealers abilities as they didn't build the thing and mostly have to pick up the pieces. With 41,000 members its disappointing that MHF members don't exert more power or influence on manufacturers

I remember many years ago an irate and frustrated customer taking his car to a UK manufacturer and dumping it on the head office main entrance. I wonder why MH owners who have made a major outlay of £20/30/50/60,0000 don't do the same. (If memory serves me correctly I think he set fire to it)

I'm sure that if UK manufacturers accepted more responsibility for their workmanship maybe a couple of things would happen.

1. They would more readily understand the frustrations their customers had and hopefully modify/improve their working practices.
2. The customer satisfaction levels would be much higher.

We build and have very innovative MH's here in UK but very often it is ruined by poor quality - just my oppinion..


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## b16duv (Feb 14, 2006)

Vennwood said:


> I recently went out to the manufacturers of our MH to have a problem fixed - nothing to do with quality but fit for purpose maybe. I just turned up at the door, went to the customer services desk and was fitted in within a couple of hours. Many of my fellow MH owners were sat there waiting for work done and most said they were there for routine servicing etc.
> Why don't UK manufacturers have a service centre so that concerned customers can book in their MH's and get the "experts" to fix it? This is nothing to do with dealers abilities as they didn't build the thing and mostly have to pick up the pieces. With 41,000 members its disappointing that MHF members don't exert more power or influence on manufacturers
> 
> I remember many years ago an irate and frustrated customer taking his car to a UK manufacturer and dumping it on the head office main entrance. I wonder why MH owners who have made a major outlay of £20/30/50/60,0000 don't do the same. (If memory serves me correctly I think he set fire to it)
> ...


I concur with Pete's comments about service from that manufacturer.

On a lighter note, I remember a newspaper story about a local guy who returned his faulty Frontera to the vauxhall dealer from whom it was purchased - through the showroom window. He was admonished by the Judge!

David


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## Rapide561 (Oct 1, 2005)

*Motorhomes*

Hi

I often read some caravan forums and so on and note that there does not SEEM to be as much negativity about caravans as there SOMETIMES is about motorhomes. A top of the range British motorhome could be bought for about £65,000.00, and a top of the range twin axle British caravan would cost about £22,000. Could it be that the motorhomer has paid more and has higher expections? A lead in motorhome, such as the Compass I had, cost at the time about £25000, whilst a lead in, brand new caravan would have been about £10,000 at the time. Would my expections have been any less because I paid less for a caravan?

Also, motorhomers have to deal with two components - the chassis and the converter. Does this add to motorhomers woes?

From my observations on campsites, caravans seem to out number motorhomes by about 3 to 1, so statistically, should we see three times as many negative references to caravans as motorhomes?

In terms of quality, where does quality end, and at what point in time? My 14 month old Truma boiler was replaced last week - does that mean it was not quality? I do not know, but I will add that it was the heating/electrical element that had conked, but the Truma factory replaced the boiler as it was a quicker job and minimised me hanging about. My kettle cost £8 in ASDA and is going strong after 15 months - is that quality? Finally, my Vectra, bought as a used car at 8 months old, has marched on like a trooper, totally fault free. Is that quality? If it broke down tomorrow, does the quality cease? For the want of a better phrase, the car gets some hammer.

I am making reference to no manufacturer or supplier here, but raise a few points for discussion.

Russell

Edit - I have added the word British purely as a comparison for the market place. I have no idea what a top of the range Italian or German van might cost.


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

*Re: Motorhomes*



Rapide561 said:


> Hi
> 
> I often read some caravan forums and so on and note that there does not SEEM to be as much negativity about caravans as there SOMETIMES is about motorhomes. A top of the range British motorhome could be bought for about £65,000.00, and a top of the range twin axle British caravan would cost about £22,000. Could it be that the motorhomer has paid more and has higher expections? A lead in motorhome, such as the Compass I had, cost at the time about £25000, whilst a lead in, brand new caravan would have been about £10,000 at the time. Would my expections have been any less because I paid less for a caravan?
> 
> ...


A lot more this year purely down to the strength of the Euro.


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## Jezport (Jun 19, 2008)

*Re: Motorhomes*



Rapide561 said:


> Hi
> 
> I often read some caravan forums and so on and note that there does not SEEM to be as much negativity about caravans as there SOMETIMES is about motorhomes. A top of the range British motorhome could be bought for about £65,000.00, and a top of the range twin axle British caravan would cost about £22,000. Could it be that the motorhomer has paid more and has higher expections? A lead in motorhome, such as the Compass I had, cost at the time about £25000, whilst a lead in, brand new caravan would have been about £10,000 at the time. Would my expections have been any less because I paid less for a caravan?
> 
> ...


Or maybe caravanners are unable to admit that their van is rubbish as it would cause them embarrassment at the volvo polishers club.


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## RichardnGill (Aug 31, 2006)

Some very interesting points there Russell.

I got a new Golf TDI in 2005 this had 3 new fly wheels fitted in the first 9 months. From then on it was ok until earlier this year when I sold it with over 120,000 miles on it.

I now have VW Passat TDI new in May this year, it just been in for its first service and to get some warranty work done and the parts are on back order.

So to me it seems as though most things new can often give problems in the first year and then settle down.

Most say buy German for quality, but in my case I have had 4 new VW cars in the last few years and each one has had its problems. 

I had a new work Transit in 2002, this did over 160,000 with out fault, I bought a Motorhome on a Transit and this had 4 faults before it did 2,000 miles.

At the moment I have 3 Vauxhall vans on leas for work and they are just over 12 months old, no problems at all with these.


I dont think it matters what you buy some are ok and some arnt, it is a simple as that.


Richard...


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

RichardnGill said:


> Some very interesting points there Russell.
> 
> I got a new Golf TDI in 2005 this had 3 new fly wheels fitted in the first 9 months. From then on it was ok until earlier this year when I sold it with over 120,000 miles on it.
> 
> ...


We have Toyota 4x4's working in very severe conditions they put our previous Land Rovers in the shade

Toyota = Unbelievable reliability

If only our MH builders would buy in Toyota base vehicles


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## Rapide561 (Oct 1, 2005)

*Vauxhall*

I think another factor regarding "issues" faced by the customer relates to the warranty.

My Corsa for example had a bit of a technical cock up in Italy, almost three years ago. The work was done at an Italian GM Opel franchised dealer without cost to me.

We read on many an occasion on this forum - and other forums (in fact what is the plural for forum?) - about how dealers will not undertake warranty work unless that dealer supplied the unit. From my investigations, Salop Leisure, Discover and of course Johns Cross will undertake warranty work on units supplied elsewhere. Perhaps this situation should be the "norm" rather than the exception. There may of course be more dealers who will undertake warranty work when they are not the supplier of the unit, and I make this point in order to avoid any offence to any dealers who maybe perusing the forum.

Interestingly, my motorhome has a Fiat chassis and as such I can visit any Fiat dealer for warranty work, conditional of course that the dealer can physically accomodate the vehicle. Again, I had a technical blip in Italy last year, and the IVECO dealership in Italy was friendly and helful and at nil cost.

Anyway, I could waffle on for ages, but my G and T is getting warm!

Russell


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## eddievanbitz (May 1, 2005)

Wupert said:


> We have Toyota 4x4's working in very severe conditions they put our previous Land Rovers in the shade
> 
> Toyota = Unbelievable reliability
> 
> If only our MH builders would buy in Toyota base vehicles


Yet I had three Amazons and had problems with all of them! The last scrubbed tyres for a past time and the suspension would go up and down at will.

In the end Toyota addmitted that there was a fault and re-engineered the suspension

Bad QC? is anything any different? just the scale.

Would it stop me buying another? No I just accept that things can and do go wrong.

Russell: Two excellent posts BTW


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## stewartwebr (May 27, 2005)

TR5 said:


> Many "wrongs" are disclosed in the threads on here, and some of the manufacturers pledge to "put right" the "wrongs" that have occured.
> 
> However, these are only the "wrongs" that have revealed themselves. How many are hidden behind the facade, and may never be discovered.
> 
> ...


Interesting comments, I wonder if any dealer has ever rejected a vehicle at PDI stage? I doubt it, they would not risk upsetting the customer and the possible loss of a deal. Would be good to know

Stewart


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## chrisgreen (Jan 13, 2008)

We have Toyota 4x4's working in very severe conditions they put our previous Land Rovers in the shade

Toyota = Unbelievable reliability

If only our MH builders would buy in Toyota base vehicles[/quote]

i have a company toyota hilux and also a company land rover discovery,i am the quarry manager for a waste management company.
the hilux i use on the road and the landy is for use in the quarry,the landy will knock spots of the toyota every time in the quarry,the toyota is just to light on the back,no diff lock,gets sideways at the slightest bit of mud.
the landy has to tow a 2500lt diesel bowser around the quarry and does it no problem.and in weather like we have just had, it has to tow lorry's out the soft bits.
land rover are the best 4x4 in my eyes.

what do you call very severe conditions?

cheers chris


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

chrisgreen said:


> We have Toyota 4x4's working in very severe conditions they put our previous Land Rovers in the shade
> 
> Toyota = Unbelievable reliability
> 
> If only our MH builders would buy in Toyota base vehicles


i have a company toyota hilux and also a company land rover discovery,i am the quarry manager for a waste management company.
the hilux i use on the road and the landy is for use in the quarry,the landy will knock spots of the toyota every time in the quarry,the toyota is just to light on the back,no diff lock,gets sideways at the slightest bit of mud.
the landy has to tow a 2500lt diesel bowser around the quarry and does it no problem.and in weather like we have just had, it has to tow lorry's out the soft bits.
land rover are the best 4x4 in my eyes.

what do you call very severe conditions?

cheers chris[/quote]

I've got diff- locks on mine

To us severe is

Temps of -25 C 5 months of Snow and ice covered tracks and roads.

50 cms new snow daily

No indoor parking

Temps below freezing for weeks on end

Our Land Rovers Disco and Defenders were great for traction but failed the weather tests despite being fully prepped for the adverse conditions.

The maintenance costs for the LR's were also considerably more than our Toyotas


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

Hi Chris 

I dont think we are comparing like with like

I 'm not sure but I think your Toyota could be 9/10 years old

Ours all have electronic diff locks an absolute essential in our environment. 


My apologies we are now off topic and the Thread is about MH not Toyota v LR


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## bigbazza (Mar 6, 2008)

I've been in manufacture all my working life (I'm 65) and in 2 types of trade, firstly engineering and secondly electronics.
In both trades we used manufacturing prcedures to make the products and without exception we used inspection procedures to check the product during the manufacturing stages.
This worked extremely well and that's why we did it that way.
If these procedures were applied to the build of M/Hs I'm sure we would be a much more satified bunch.
Frank's pictures etc. proove that the inspection element of the procedure is completely missing.
Things did sometimes go wrong, but not many.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

I was a contractor but we applied manufacturing standards to our processes and had very few faults. I thought almost all manufacturers used some form of Quality Assurance in their processes but it seems that MH converters do not. If they do then their systems are falling down badly. It should be possible to find out if converters are registered to ISO whatever number it is these days. If they are they must be in danger of loosing their registration based on the number of faults reported here. 

We should ask to see proof of QA with external surveillance before buying their products, Alan.


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## sallytrafic (Jan 17, 2006)

QA stds such as ISO9000 are a way of ensuring standardisation but IMHO having worked in that environment its almost better instead of that sort of QA to have ownership of standards right down at the coal face, Workers that are proud of their product and who provide peer pressure to their co-workers are the best sort of QC there is. By engendering that sort of spirit you can find the QA inspections become a simple percentage check instead of the sign off each part of the work procedures that are otherwise necessary to produce the perfection that the designer presumably hoped for.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Frank, my company was first registered to BS5750 then ISOEN9002 and it was operated all the way through the company, it has to be a culture thing. It simply does not work unless everybody understands fully and joins in. We had regular training sessions with all staff (in small groups so we could see who understood and who needed more help) Procedures were improved with the help of all staff when things went wrong. It is not difficult if all those involved care about their work and that is easily achieved by giving them ownership (I hate that word but it serves well) of the process and a huge pride in what they do, coupled with a full understanding and the ability to discuss the whys and wherefores. 

I thought all companies using QA would approach it in this manner, although I have had dealings with many employers who did not understand, most notably some government departments. 

Applied as I describe it, how could it fail to improve standards, Alan.


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## rowley (May 14, 2005)

ISO 9002 does not guarantee an improvement in quality although it does provide traceability.


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## bigbazza (Mar 6, 2008)

I have worked using all the standards you describe and also some very stringent military one's. They all have a cost involved and I think this is what perhaps stop's some manufacturer's from using them.
At my current firm (about 20 strong) we didn't go down the official route as it wasn't required, but we have a procedure whereby everything is checked by someone who wasn't involved in producing the product.
This could be an electronic system or software or usually both.
This works extremely well as we have a thorough investigation if something fails and there's no hiding if you were involved.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Bigbazza, you are right about costs but they are soon saved and then some because you greatly reduce wastage and time spent on fault rectification. Mine was a small company and so it was easy to get everybody involved. Even those who had previously displayed little interest in their work took an interest because they developed a professional pride in what they did. 

Our mission statement was dead simple, every one understood it. "Get it right first time", now that attitude should improve the quality of anything, Alan.


Edit: Rowley I did not see your reply before posting the above, when we did it it certinly did include inspection and testing, it may have changed since. I have been out of it for two years.


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

erneboy said:


> Bigbazza, you are right about costs but they are soon saved and then some because you greatly reduce wastage and time spent on fault rectification. Mine was a small company and so it was easy to get everybody involved. Even those who had previously displayed little interest in their work took an interest because they developed a professional pride in what they did.
> 
> Our mission statement was dead simple, every one understood it. "Get it right first time", now that attitude should improve the quality of anything, Alan.
> 
> Edit: Rowley I did not see your reply before posting the above, when we did it it certinly did include inspection and testing, it may have changed since. I have been out of it for two years.


Guys some very good info and discussion on this thread

Having worked on Aircraft in my younger days you had to get it right first time.


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## Vennwood (Feb 4, 2007)

My brother-in-law worked for years as a forklift truck driver until he was made redundant. He finally got a job working at Swifts on assembling Bessaccar motorhomes. Great for him as it pays the mortgage but in all fairness he's not in any way qualified in carpentry or even related skills. He tells some horrendous stories - he said to me - Pete don't ever buy a Bessaccar

As Wupert says in the Aircraft industry you do it once - you don't get a second chance.


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## neilbes (Oct 16, 2006)

Vennwood

hope you have your hard hat ready :lol:


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

Vennwood said:


> My brother-in-law worked for years as a forklift truck driver until he was made redundant. He finally got a job working at Swifts on assembling Bessaccar motorhomes. Great for him as it pays the mortgage but in all fairness he's not in any way qualified in carpentry or even related skills. He tells some horrendous stories - he said to me - Pete don't ever buy a Bessaccar
> 
> As Wupert says in the Aircraft industry you do it once - you don't get a second chance.


You are a brave warrior


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