# Propane vs Butane



## 105928 (Jul 17, 2007)

We have just acquired a caravan English in design that we will be living in for months whilst hopefully a house is built in Limousin France.
At the moment it has a Calor(butane) gas bottle supplying the various thingys. Now as the Limousin is prone to having heavy frosts I wanted to change the bottle when it runs out for a Propane one as Propane gasses done to minus 40 degrees. (I am told) I'm almost sure this isn't as long as I use the same regulator and buy an English to French bottle adapter (Male English to female French) that it isn't a problem can any boffin out there say whether I'm right or right! 
Just as a thought my Eura Mobile mobile home uses Prpoane and has most of the same equipment as the Butane supplied van ie Truma heating, Electrolux fridge etc


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## Scotjimland (May 23, 2005)

Not sure if I understand your question correctly, are you asking if you can use a UK butane regulator with an adaptor on a French bottle ? 
If so, the answer is no, butane and propane work at different pressures, buy a French bottle with the correct regulator.. 

If not, sorry if I misunderstood.


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## Boff (May 10, 2005)

Hi Trap1,

as you intend to use the caravan in France, I would strongly recommend to replace the UK Calor regulators (and maybe also the pigtails) by French ones, so that you have no problems with gas supply in Limousin. (Keep in mind that during strong frost one bottle might be emptied in less than a week.)

It is correct that butane does not evaporate anymore at temperatures below -0.5 degrees C. A temperature that can due to evaporative cooling even be undercut at somewhat higher ambient temperatures. Propane's boiling point is at -42 degrees C, so here even the hardest Limousin winter should not pose any problem. Except:

Should you consider using self-refillable bottles, then be aware that the "LPG" (called "GPL" in France) sold for automotive purposes is usually a mixture of propane and butane, so if you refill your bottles several times during extended frost periods the butane will gradually "clog" your bottles.



ScotJimland said:


> ...butane and propane work at different pressures...


That is not entirely correct.

While propane and butane _in the bottle_ have indeed different vapour pressures (8 vs 2 bar), the pressure in the MH's gas system is determined by the regulator and not by the vapour pressure. So, _theoretically_ it is no problem to use either of them via the same regulator. However, due to safety concerns (dedicated butane bottles could burst if accidentally filled with propane), the valves are different.

Best Regards,
Gerhard


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## 105928 (Jul 17, 2007)

Yes you understood me and I think thats the answer I wanted.
As the regulator is a standard caravan regulator sorry the van is a long way away so I cannot look to see what the reg pressure is but I believe its 28 mB, what pressure regulator do I need for Propane?


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## 105928 (Jul 17, 2007)

Thanks Gerhard what will be the mB rating of the regulator have to be 37mB? And what is a 'pigtail'?


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## 96299 (Sep 15, 2005)

I know this is off topic,but I just gotta say......What an avatar mate. :toothy7: :toothy7:

steve


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## Scotjimland (May 23, 2005)

Boff said:


> ScotJimland said:
> 
> 
> > ...butane and propane work at different pressures...
> ...


I was refering to the old system with bottle regulators which is what I thought the original question was about.. it wasn't very clear hence my opening remark.. "_Not sure if I understand your question correctly, are you asking if you can use a UK butane regulator with an adaptor on a French bottle ? _"

Until September 2003, the two gases required different regulators; butane being regulated to 28mbar and propane to 37mbar. However, the new EN1949 Standard makes travelling within the European union much simpler and safer. 
Since September 2003 all gas cylinders and appliances are regulated to one pressure - 30mbar. A single regulator suits both propane and butane and is permanently fitted to the caravan/motorhome, and classed as part of the gas system. The EU Standard allows for either bulkhead or bottle mounted regulators, both at 30mbar. 
Convention within the UK caravan industry is to use a bulkhead mounted regulator; however, some continental built caravans may be imported with cylinder mounted ones. A high-pressure supply pipe from the cylinder is available to connect to all the cylinders that are used throughout Europe.

Jim


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## 105928 (Jul 17, 2007)

Jim the van is a 1988 with a Butane bottle fitted with a 28mB regulator.
I want to fit a Propane bottle to stop the gas supply freezing in low temps.
So go hrom there. Do I need to change the regulator?


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## gaspode (May 9, 2005)

Hi Trap1

Your best course of action would be to buy a wall-mounted 30mb (very close to the pressure your appliances are set for) regulator. Then also buy a "pigtail" (short length of pipe that connects the bottle to the regulator) which fits to a UK propane bottle. Also buy an additional pigtail for French propane bottles. That way when you go to France you just swap bottles and pigtails. Due to problems with blocked pigtails recently you may be well advised to buy stainless steel pigtails (available only from Gaslow).

Probably the most popular supplier is Gaslow:
http://www.gaslow.co.uk/
But many other companies also supply similar parts.


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## 105928 (Jul 17, 2007)

Hi gaspode as we live in France I think I'll take your advice and buy a French Propane 30mB regulator


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## Wupert (Aug 6, 2007)

Trap1 said:


> Jim the van is a 1988 with a Butane bottle fitted with a 28mB regulator.
> I want to fit a Propane bottle to stop the gas supply freezing in low temps.
> So go hrom there. Do I need to change the regulator?


Yes it would be wise.


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## gaspode (May 9, 2005)

Trap1 said:


> Hi gaspode as we live in France I think I'll take your advice and buy a French Propane 30mB regulator


The French wall mounted 30mb regulator will be identical to the UK one, just the pigtails will be different. You may be able to get a bottle mounted 30mb regulator in France (definitely in Germany) but it won't be any use in the UK.


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