# Poor customer service from Swift? (Cidersurfer)



## 127989

*Re: swirt service*



jaks said:


> I am afraid i must agree with some of the comments discussed on this particular post i went the normal recognised route of reporting my flooring problem that has reocurred i.e dealer etc.dealer sent report by e.mail no word from swift after almost two weeks then lo and behold put comment on m.h.f. then approx 3o mins later reply from Andy and phone call from Swift in the morning the point i am trying to put over is ther does not seem any consistency in their procedures .I would also like to point out i would not had even found out about my flooring problem had i not paid my tenners on hear .By the way my m/h goes back to the factory in December to have the floor done properly this time and not just down the sides as before this is not a moan just statement of what actually happened.JAKS :lol:  :lol:


Jaks
Let's see if I get a similar response. Swift have been rubbish to date at sorting my damp floor. Over two weeks to respond to e-mail is a joke!


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## SwiftGroup

Cidersurfer,

I am unsure what similar response you would like, but if you do want us to look into this, feel free to drop me a PM with your details.

Thanks,

Ash


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## 127989

Ooh, look at that. 18 minutes to respond yet it takes your customer services manager over two weeks to respond to my e-mails. I'd prefer to keep this in the public domain now Ash as Swift seem to be able to monitor websites better than build quality so I won't use the PM function. Please let Julie know that since joining MHF today, I am appalled to discover that I am not the only Swift MH owner with a rotten floor. In fact there seem to be loads on here. When will Swift face up to the fact that they have a manufacturing defect and carry out a recall rather than hiding behind sloppy customer service. Have a look here, I've just read all nine pages and felt obliged to broadly outline my recent experience...

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopic-44048.html


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## karlb

cidersurfer said:


> Ooh, look at that. 18 minutes to respond yet it takes your customer services manager over two weeks to respond to my e-mails. I'd prefer to keep this in the public domain now Ash as Swift seem to be able to monitor websites better than build quality so I won't use the PM function. Please let Julie know that since joining MHF today, I am appalled to discover that I am not the only Swift MH owner with a rotten floor. In fact there seem to be loads on here. When will Swift face up to the fact that they have a manufacturing defect and carry out a recall rather than hiding behind sloppy customer service. Have a look here, I've just read all nine pages and felt obliged to broadly outline my recent experience...
> 
> http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopic-44048.html


each to there own, but i personally would take the nice mans offer of a fix. just my opinion of course. (goes to get coat)


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## 94055

Tell

8O 

:roll:


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## SwiftGroup

Cidersufer,

No problem. I will pass your message on to our Customer Care team, however, I fear that they will not be able to identify you from your username alone.

If you do need me to help, by all means, please let me know.

Thanks,

Ash


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## 127989

Ash
Thanks for the response. Your customer care team already knows about the problems with their product and are failing to resolve them. I cannot see how further airing my grievances with your company on a public forum helps your customer services or are you just trying to work out who I am? Are there that many rotten floors that Swift cannot take an educated guess who I am? I think it just helps other MH owners and potential owners to know that the real issues of dealing with Swift customer care is not the thinly veiled easy responses immediately posted on here but a nightmare of slow responses from your customer services manager, a failure to be able to provide an effective service and a failure to recognise the requirement for recompense for lack of enjoyment due to you having to have my van back for 4 to 6 weeks!


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## bigbazza

Is this thread stuck?


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## bigbazza

Obviously not. The quick reply box dissapeared on page 3 :?


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## SwiftGroup

cidersurfer said:


> Ash
> Thanks for the response. Your customer care team already knows about the problems with their product and are failing to resolve them. I cannot see how further airing my grievances with your company on a public forum helps your customer services or are you just trying to work out who I am? Are there that many rotten floors that Swift cannot take an educated guess who I am? I think it just helps other MH owners and potential owners to know that the real issues of dealing with Swift customer care is not the thinly veiled easy responses immediately posted on here but a nightmare of slow responses from your customer services manager, a failure to be able to provide an effective service and a failure to recognise the requirement for recompense for lack of enjoyment due to you having to have my van back for 4 to 6 weeks!


Cidersurfer,

You clearly have an issue with the service you have received. Our presence on this (and other) forums are to help those that need our assistance, not to score points or advertise our products. There is no pretence or "veil" with why we participate on this forum, we are clear, the people who monitor this forum are here to offer technical assistance to our customers.

I have no desire or need to "work out" who you are, and I'm afraid our Customer Care team are busy enough, without trying to guess who every forum user is.

My suggestion of a PM was simply to save you posting your personal and private details on this open forum. You are welcome to "copy and paste" any relevant text from a PM onto the open forum, nothing we do on a forum is secret, and we have nothing to hide.

With our participation on the forums, we take the good and bad comments together, and we realise that we do sometimes get things wrong. However, we do go to lengths to put things right, where we were wrong.

My offer of help was genuine. You are welcome to use this service as you see fit, but I cannot contribute any more to this thread without hard facts.

Thanks,

Ash


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## HurricaneSmith

SwiftGroup said:


> Cidersurfer,
> 
> You clearly have an issue with the service you have received. Our presence on this (and other) forums are to help those that need our assistance, not to score points or advertise our products. There is no pretence or "veil" with why we participate on this forum, we are clear, the people who monitor this forum are here to offer technical assistance to our customers.
> 
> I have no desire or need to "work out" who you are, and I'm afraid our Customer Care team are busy enough, without trying to guess who every forum user is.
> 
> My suggestion of a PM was simply to save you posting your personal and private details on this open forum. You are welcome to "copy and paste" any relevant text from a PM onto the open forum, nothing we do on a forum is secret, and we have nothing to hide.
> 
> With our participation on the forums, we take the good and bad comments together, and we realise that we do sometimes get things wrong. However, we do go to lengths to put things right, where we were wrong.
> 
> My offer of help was genuine. You are welcome to use this service as you see fit, but I cannot contribute any more to this thread without hard facts.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Ash


A kind and well structured reply, and at a time when most people are considering a cup of tea and bed.

Very well done Ash.....Keep up the good work.

Kind regards,
John


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## 127989

Ash
You are very intuitive for realising that I have a problem with your customer service and I thank you again for responding so promptly. Unfortunately you have just demonstrated again that when faced with problems in the public domain Swift are seen to act promptly. This was the basis of my original post, that Swift are quick to respond when faced with the problem of being accused of poor customer service on a public forum but are incredibly difficult to deal with via the normal traditional channels which aren't seen by the wider public. Is this thread not about Swift customer service?

I'm already aware that you Customer Care team are busy enough, trying to get through on the telephone has never worked for me despite numerous attempts. Maybe there aren't enough of them to respond to the levels of complaints that Swift are encountering?

I'm not going to post my details on a forum, you already have them all. Why can't Swift respond to them when they are not on a public forum but are in the form of personal e-mails?

Your customer services manager has constantly displayed a lack of care to the issues I have raised, response times are tardy at best. When I send an e-mail on a Sunday and she responds saying she needs to check a few things and will get back to me by close of play on Wednesday, I didn't expect her to mean a fortnight Wednesday. She still chose to ignore the content of my previous correspondence when she did eventually respond.

Your participation on the forum is welcomed. I am new here and can see that Swift has offered valuable advice on numerous occasion, but this thread is entitled "Poor customer service from Swift" and I have a genuine case of that.

Your answers are very good. Considering the last letter I received from your customer services manager was unhelpful, poorly structured, difficult to understand and late maybe you could replace her!


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## 127989

> ...we have nothing to hide.


Okay, this is very straightforward.

How many Sundance floors have you had to repair since 2005?

How many are left to do?


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## JohnsCrossMotorHomes

Cidersurfer,

We have never had a problem with Swift where rectification of floors is required and reported to them by us,

We liase with Swift and the customer as to a mutually agreeable date for the van to be collected from us and returned to the factory.

Frankly it is the dealers responsibility to sort these arrangements out not for you or others who don't even own a Swift product to slag Swift off in these forums or to try and cause controversy.

Peter


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## Sonesta

Cidersurfer, I am in no position to comment on your personal dealings with Swift as obviously that is between you and them but you have seen fit to join the forum and discuss your individual case quite openly so I hope you do not mind me giving my opinion?

I think if what you tell is correct, then obviously one can understand your disappointment with the response you have received from Swift to date but from the reply you have received on here from Ash, I would say you should be feeling a lot happier now. Yes you can argue all day long if that suits you to do so but surely getting your problems rectified satisfactorily is the most important factor and if Ash has offered to take your case up then it sounds to me like you have finally got the result you wanted?

I personally do not own a Swift vehicle we have an Auto Trail - but our previous vehicle was a Swift Kontiki 645 and to be fair even though we had a few warranty issues in the beginning, the problems we encountered were not with Swift themselves but more the dealers that we bought the vehicle from. The dealers after sales service was appalling to say the least but once we decided to get Swift involved, any issues we had were quickly and promptly dealt with and I truly cannot praise Swift customer services enough for the trouble they went to on our behalf. The only reason we did not buy another Swift was certainly not because we were dissatisfied with the manufacturer or the quality of build but more because the Auto Trail Cheyenne had the particular layout we were looking for.

I do understand your frustrations and I am not saying you are unjustified in feeling cross but give Ash a chance to resolve the issues you have and try not to be too critical of the fact that you have had to vent your feelings on this forum before you got a satisfactory response from Swift - they are only human at the end of the day and maybe just maybe the person you spoke to on the telephone at Swift was not so competent as his/her job as Ash appears to be? At least Swift do read and reply to posts on MHF and that to me speaks volumes!

Good luck and I hope you get things sorted.  

Sue


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## Telbell

> Tell
> 
> Shocked
> 
> Rolling Eyes


Steve: ....."

"Q.E.D." :wink:

(Rubbish last night...but 3points :lol: :lol: )


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## Pusser

We do have to be careful of losing good companies that are on here voluntarily to help, answer issues because there is a danger that one day they will ask themselves, "What's the bloody point".

I think it only fair once you have had a rightful moan that if the hand of help is offered, to take it willingly otherwise there is little point in moaning.


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## nukeadmin

> if the hand of help is offered, to take it willingly otherwise there is little point in moaning.


exactly

We have quite a few companies here on MHF that brave the public so to speak and openly assist where they can, remembering that Swift as a manufacturer don't ordinarily deal direct with the public and would normally deal i suspect via their dealer chain they are offering above and beyond what other motorhome manufacturers appear to offer, we have other manufacturers here on MHF that hide behind aliases, and in big business who is to say that all the mhf members we are seeing reports from are actually swift customers and not actually competitors trying to leverage Swifts openess to their own advantages


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## Invicta

"who is to say that all the mhf members we are seeing reports from are actually swift customers and not actually competitors trying to leverage Swifts openess to their own advantages"

Very good point Nukeadmin, in my naivety I hadn't thought of that one but can see that it could be a possibility!


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## Pusser

Invicta said:


> a possibility!


...Certainty in this day and age.


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## Sonesta

nukeadmin said:


> exactly
> We have quite a few companies here on MHF that brave the public so to speak and openly assist where they can, remembering that Swift as a manufacturer don't ordinarily deal direct with the public and would normally deal i suspect via their dealer chain they are offering above and beyond what other motorhome manufacturers appear to offer, we have other manufacturers here on MHF that hide behind aliases, and in big business who is to say that all the mhf members we are seeing reports from are actually swift customers and not actually competitors trying to leverage Swifts openess to their own advantages


I totally agree Nuke and it often puzzles me how "new" members join up and immediately enter the forum with all guns blazing!!!! I often find myself wondering if they are indeed rival competitors or people who simply have a grudge and many a time I have read a post and thought this one smells decidely "fishy" to me!

Personally, I think Swift are to be commended for how they conduct themselves on this forum and I take my hat off to them.

Let's face it, most people from what I've observed, who've had problems which consequently have been resolved by Swift on this forum, have been well satsified with the outcome and with how Swift have conducted themselves. Surely to goodness, providing Swift respond positively, then what really is the problem? Personally, I just can't see the point in harping on when they offer to put things right - and I would at least give them the chance to deliver what they promise! However, I guess some folk must just be harder to please than others?

Sue


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## clodhopper2006

How very plausible. I read this thread and couldn't for the life of me work out why Cidersurfer would'nt take the help that was being offered to him/her. Wouldn't even PM Ash with the details. 
I hadn't thought of competitors etc but it's the only plausible explaination for me as to how Cidersurfer has posted.


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## Briarose

OR it could be that other guy back again..........can't remember his name but he did that demonstration was it outside Alan Kerrs or something like that, was on MHF and also put a video on you tube, something to do with a babys seat etc and bed slats ? anyone remember ?


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## 94055

Briarose said:


> OR it could be that other guy back again..........can't remember his name but he did that demonstration was it outside Alan Kerrs or something like that, was on MHF and also put a video on you tube, something to do with a babys seat etc and bed slats ? anyone remember ?


Yes i remember,

He received satisfaction from Swift, I met him about a month ago.


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## Briarose

SandJ said:


> Briarose said:
> 
> 
> 
> OR it could be that other guy back again..........can't remember his name but he did that demonstration was it outside Alan Kerrs or something like that, was on MHF and also put a video on you tube, something to do with a babys seat etc and bed slats ? anyone remember ?
> 
> 
> 
> Yes i remember,
> 
> He received satisfaction from Swift, I met him about a month ago.
Click to expand...

OOhhh 8O


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## Penquin

> "Sonesta"
> I often find myself wondering if they are indeed rival competitors or people who simply have a grudge and many a time I have read a post and thought this one smells decidely "fishy" to me!
> Sue


If you have any suspicions about what is being said may I remind you about the reporting button at the top right hand side. This is used for offensive, racist and libellous comments that need to be highlighted.

If you are suspicious it is worth letting the Moderators know so that it can be checked. If your suspicions are well founded action will be taken and if not then no harm has been done.

Using the report button does alert the Mods and brings any such posts to our attention - it is not easy for every thread to be checked, so the support of the members is very gratefully received.

Dave


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## Sonesta

Penquin said:


> If you have any suspicions about what is being said may I remind you about the reporting button at the top right hand side. This is used for offensive, racist and libellous comments that need to be highlighted.
> 
> If you are suspicious it is worth letting the Moderators know so that it can be checked. If your suspicions are well founded action will be taken and if not then no harm has been done.
> 
> Using the report button does alert the Mods and brings any such posts to our attention - it is not easy for every thread to be checked, so the support of the members is very gratefully received.
> 
> Dave


Hi Dave,

I wasn't aware of this little button before you bought it to my attention so if ever I see any posts that I think the moderators ought to be notified about, I will have my finger poised and ready to press! :lol:

Thanks for letting me know and I promise not to abuse this facility! :wink:

Sue


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## 127989

I'm awfully sorry, I think I must have strayed into unknown territory, I thought this was a thread entiltled 'Poor service from Swift' where the OP has had issues contacting Swift by more traditional means. I re-iterate that this is the same problem I have. Talk abouth thread drift...

I can assure you that I am a private individual not some fool from another company trying underhand tactics to upset a competitior. 

I'll leave you with one last question that maybe the collective can answer for me. Here is an outline;
I own a Swift motorhome, I am the second owner of it. The van cost nearly £30,000 not 12 months ago and during it's first service in my hands in July of this year, my dealer (not the selling dealer) discovered during the habitation check that the floor is defective. It is still within the Swift warranty period. They have offered to stand by their product and have it back at the factory for 4-6 weeks during which time I will not have a motorhome. So, through no fault of my own I must empty my motorhome of all belongings and soft furnishings and gas, etc, store all of these, drive it 70miles to and from my nearest Swift dealer, relinquish the use of my motorhome for 4-6 weeks (the duration they cannot confirm) and suffer loss of enjoyment of my motorhome for that period. Do you honestly believe that I am not entitled to some kind of recompense?


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## Pusser

cidersurfer said:


> I'll leave you with one last question that maybe the collective can answer for me. Here is an outline;
> Do you honestly believe that I am not entitled to some kind of recompense?


Absolutely. I would however consider the dealer that sold it too you a crook as he must have known about the issue, not to mention even the previous owner.
Best of luck sorting it out.


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## Invicta

I would have wanted to know why the first owner had got rid of it so quickly.

I had two new Volvo cars within a matter of 6 weeks some years ago. Due to an RTA I found after purchasing the first Volvo that had a manual gearbox that I needed an automatic. I part x changed the first through the same company and was not surprised when the salesman asked me, as the registered owner of the manual car, if I would explain to the prospective purchaser of it the reason I had only had it for 6 weeks. I said of course I would which I later did and everyone was happy!


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## 94055

cidersurfer said:


> I'm awfully sorry, I think I must have strayed into unknown territory, I thought this was a thread entiltled 'Poor service from Swift' where the OP has had issues contacting Swift by more traditional means. I re-iterate that this is the same problem I have. Talk abouth thread drift...
> 
> I can assure you that I am a private individual not some fool from another company trying underhand tactics to upset a competitior.
> 
> I'll leave you with one last question that maybe the collective can answer for me. Here is an outline;
> I own a Swift motorhome, I am the second owner of it. The van cost nearly £30,000 not 12 months ago and during it's first service in my hands in July of this year, my dealer (not the selling dealer) discovered during the habitation check that the floor is defective. It is still within the Swift warranty period. They have offered to stand by their product and have it back at the factory for 4-6 weeks during which time I will not have a motorhome. So, through no fault of my own I must empty my motorhome of all belongings and soft furnishings and gas, etc, store all of these, drive it 70miles to and from my nearest Swift dealer, relinquish the use of my motorhome for 4-6 weeks (the duration they cannot confirm) and suffer loss of enjoyment of my motorhome for that period. Do you honestly believe that I am not entitled to some kind of recompense?


Yes you should receive compensation, from the dealer not Swift. The dealer should have found the damp when they part exchanged and then on P.D.I. when they sold it to you. So shout about the poor service from them not Swift

No matter what product you always have some with problems,

The FACTS you have put forward on here are.........Zilch. You state poor service from Swift, when this has been followed up in the past it has been found to be the dealer.

You had a chance to have someone from Swift follow your complaint through and refused.

You quoted the following to Ash:



> Your answers are very good. Considering the last letter I received from your customer services manager was unhelpful, poorly structured, difficult to understand and late maybe you could replace her!


Well let us see this proof on the forum, then we can judge for ourselves. You can hide your private details.

I would buy a new Swift in the future and feel confident I will get a better service than any other convertor. Go and buy a Hymer and see if they are any better, they are not.


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## 127989

> Yes you should receive compensation, from the dealer not Swift. The dealer should have found the damp when they part exchanged and then on P.D.I. when they sold it to you. So shout about the poor service from them not Swift


So, enlighten me. How does that work? The problem is a known Swift manufacturing defect.


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## bognormike

cidersurfer said:


> I'm awfully sorry, I think I must have strayed into unknown territory, I thought this was a thread entiltled 'Poor service from Swift' where the OP has had issues contacting Swift by more traditional means. I re-iterate that this is the same problem I have. Talk abouth thread drift...
> 
> I can assure you that I am a private individual not some fool from another company trying underhand tactics to upset a competitior.
> 
> I'll leave you with one last question that maybe the collective can answer for me. Here is an outline;
> I own a Swift motorhome, I am the second owner of it. The van cost nearly £30,000 not 12 months ago and during it's first service in my hands in July of this year, my dealer (not the selling dealer) discovered during the habitation check that the floor is defective. It is still within the Swift warranty period. They have offered to stand by their product and have it back at the factory for 4-6 weeks during which time I will not have a motorhome. So, through no fault of my own I must empty my motorhome of all belongings and soft furnishings and gas, etc, store all of these, drive it 70miles to and from my nearest Swift dealer, relinquish the use of my motorhome for 4-6 weeks (the duration they cannot confirm) and suffer loss of enjoyment of my motorhome for that period. Do you honestly believe that I am not entitled to some kind of recompense?


Your contract is with the Dealer who sold it to you; Swift are apparently dealing with the floor problem under warranty. As has been said, any claim for compensation for the expenses incurred, and loss of use of the vehicle during the repair period should be addressed to the dealer who sold it to you.


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## 94055

cidersurfer said:


> Yes you should receive compensation, from the dealer not Swift. The dealer should have found the damp when they part exchanged and then on P.D.I. when they sold it to you. So shout about the poor service from them not Swift
> 
> 
> 
> So, enlighten me. How does that work? The problem is a known Swift manufacturing defect.
Click to expand...

If it was a known problem then guess what! * The dealer should have known about it *

You buy something and your contract is with the seller, Swift offer above and beyond what they have to offer.

First point of call is dealer, * They are who you have the gripe with, not Swift *

If you were to sue, who would you sue? (Yep, the dealer)

As to the known problem with floor, Swift may be aware of it and have offered to fix it. You have failed to liase with Ash.

*You have also failed to post the alleged evidence.* (The letter from the head of customer services. Do you not know the persons name? I do, as do some others.)
You also mentioned poorly structured and difficult to understand about the letter. What has that got to do with the complaint? I am not grammatically educated but understand the basis of a contact between seller and purchaser a lot better than you seem to do.

Beg Ash to take over your complaint and accept the timescale or go back to your dealer and * Play bloody hell with them* Do you know other Swift dealers will also help you?

I do not work for or have anything to do with Swift, except that is to say I have had customer satisfaction.

So what will it be?


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## SwiftGroup

Cidersurfer,
As we have already said unfortunately we cannot look into your case or offer any help without you first providing us with your details and chassis number to identify you.

If you want us to help please PM us or email me,

Thanks
Andy
[email protected]


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## Zebedee

You can do no more Andy!  

If he still refuses to join in a dialogue with you, I fear a lot of our old stagers will begin jumping to the obvious conclusion . . . whether it's the right one or not!! 8O :roll: :roll: 

Dave


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## 127989

SandJ said:


> cidersurfer said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes you should receive compensation, from the dealer not Swift. The dealer should have found the damp when they part exchanged and then on P.D.I. when they sold it to you. So shout about the poor service from them not Swift
> 
> 
> 
> So, enlighten me. How does that work? The problem is a known Swift manufacturing defect.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If it was a known problem then guess what! * The dealer should have known about it *
> 
> You buy something and your contract is with the seller, Swift offer above and beyond what they have to offer.
> 
> First point of call is dealer, * They are who you have the gripe with, not Swift *
> 
> If you were to sue, who would you sue? (Yep, the dealer)
> 
> As to the known problem with floor, Swift may be aware of it and have offered to fix it. You have failed to liase with Ash.
> 
> *You have also failed to post the alleged evidence.* (The letter from the head of customer services. Do you not know the persons name? I do, as do some others.)
> You also mentioned poorly structured and difficult to understand about the letter. What has that got to do with the complaint? I am not grammatically educated but understand the basis of a contact between seller and purchaser a lot better than you seem to do.
> 
> Beg Ash to take over your complaint and accept the timescale or go back to your dealer and * Play bloody hell with them* Do you know other Swift dealers will also help you?
> 
> I do not work for or have anything to do with Swift, except that is to say I have had customer satisfaction.
> 
> So what will it be?
Click to expand...

I must say that that whilst the information is helpful you are starting to annoy me. Calm down dear and stop being so confrontational. You are wise. I still have a genuine problem with Swift customer service and they already know the details. Publishing my correspondence here will not change that. The biggest problem is the lack of detailed response in a timeous fashion and ignoring the content of my previous communication whilst composing their replies. That was the content of my original post here.

And stop being foolish, of course I know the persons name, who do you think signs the letters? You are assuming things that have no basis in fact and you will not be receiving those facts on here.

I just fail to understand why I get 2 offers of assistance from Swift on a public forum and not in the privacy of normal communications.

It appears that I have another problem now too, in how to deal with the original dealer. Would the fact that their warranty may have expired affect things?


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## 94055

You can take a horse to water, but..........................


End of my input

:roll:


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## bognormike

cidersurfer said:


> SandJ said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cidersurfer said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes you should receive compensation, from the dealer not Swift. The dealer should have found the damp when they part exchanged and then on P.D.I. when they sold it to you. So shout about the poor service from them not Swift
> 
> 
> 
> So, enlighten me. How does that work? The problem is a known Swift manufacturing defect.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If it was a known problem then guess what! * The dealer should have known about it *
> 
> You buy something and your contract is with the seller, Swift offer above and beyond what they have to offer.
> 
> First point of call is dealer, * They are who you have the gripe with, not Swift *
> 
> If you were to sue, who would you sue? (Yep, the dealer)
> 
> As to the known problem with floor, Swift may be aware of it and have offered to fix it. You have failed to liase with Ash.
> 
> *You have also failed to post the alleged evidence.* (The letter from the head of customer services. Do you not know the persons name? I do, as do some others.)
> You also mentioned poorly structured and difficult to understand about the letter. What has that got to do with the complaint? I am not grammatically educated but understand the basis of a contact between seller and purchaser a lot better than you seem to do.
> 
> Beg Ash to take over your complaint and accept the timescale or go back to your dealer and * Play bloody hell with them* Do you know other Swift dealers will also help you?
> 
> I do not work for or have anything to do with Swift, except that is to say I have had customer satisfaction.
> 
> So what will it be?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I must say that that whilst the information is helpful you are starting to annoy me. Calm down dear and stop being so confrontational. You are wise. I still have a genuine problem with Swift customer service and they already know the details. Publishing my correspondence here will not change that. The biggest problem is the lack of detailed response in a timeous fashion and ignoring the content of my previous communication whilst composing their replies. That was the content of my original post here.
> 
> And stop being foolish, of course I know the persons name, who do you think signs the letters? You are assuming things that have no basis in fact and you will not be receiving those facts on here.
> 
> I just fail to understand why I get 2 offers of assistance from Swift on a public forum and not in the privacy of normal communications.
> 
> It appears that I have another problem now too, in how to deal with the original dealer. Would the fact that their warranty may have expired affect things?
Click to expand...

Hi there

well, you keep drip feeding us with information, now the warranty may have expired from the dealers.  Why don't you just contact swift as they have suggested? You have been given loads of information from members on here, and Swift are willing to get your problem sorted. Maybe it's time to get talking?? :?:

And please take note of the forum rules, especially in relation to other members:-

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/forums-rules.html#9

I and the rest of the mods have various sanctions also listed in the rules - please do not give us reason to use them.

Bognormike - for mods team


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## JohnsCrossMotorHomes

cidersurfer said:


> It appears that I have another problem now too, in how to deal with the original dealer. Would the fact that their warranty *may *have expired affect things?


Oh dear you are off on another sidetrack, don't you know how long the dealers warranty is, you bought the van or so you say.

Ever heard of the Sale of Goods Act?

Now put up or shut up.

Peter


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## 127989

bognormike said:


> cidersurfer said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> SandJ said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> cidersurfer said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes you should receive compensation, from the dealer not Swift. The dealer should have found the damp when they part exchanged and then on P.D.I. when they sold it to you. So shout about the poor service from them not Swift
> 
> 
> 
> So, enlighten me. How does that work? The problem is a known Swift manufacturing defect.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> If it was a known problem then guess what! * The dealer should have known about it *
> 
> You buy something and your contract is with the seller, Swift offer above and beyond what they have to offer.
> 
> First point of call is dealer, * They are who you have the gripe with, not Swift *
> 
> If you were to sue, who would you sue? (Yep, the dealer)
> 
> As to the known problem with floor, Swift may be aware of it and have offered to fix it. You have failed to liase with Ash.
> 
> *You have also failed to post the alleged evidence.* (The letter from the head of customer services. Do you not know the persons name? I do, as do some others.)
> You also mentioned poorly structured and difficult to understand about the letter. What has that got to do with the complaint? I am not grammatically educated but understand the basis of a contact between seller and purchaser a lot better than you seem to do.
> 
> Beg Ash to take over your complaint and accept the timescale or go back to your dealer and * Play bloody hell with them* Do you know other Swift dealers will also help you?
> 
> I do not work for or have anything to do with Swift, except that is to say I have had customer satisfaction.
> 
> So what will it be?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> I must say that that whilst the information is helpful you are starting to annoy me. Calm down dear and stop being so confrontational. You are wise. I still have a genuine problem with Swift customer service and they already know the details. Publishing my correspondence here will not change that. The biggest problem is the lack of detailed response in a timeous fashion and ignoring the content of my previous communication whilst composing their replies. That was the content of my original post here.
> 
> And stop being foolish, of course I know the persons name, who do you think signs the letters? You are assuming things that have no basis in fact and you will not be receiving those facts on here.
> 
> I just fail to understand why I get 2 offers of assistance from Swift on a public forum and not in the privacy of normal communications.
> 
> It appears that I have another problem now too, in how to deal with the original dealer. Would the fact that their warranty may have expired affect things?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hi there
> 
> well, you keep drip feeding us with information, now the warranty may have expired from the dealers.  Why don't you just contact swift as they have suggested? You have been given loads of information from members on here, and Swift are willing to get your problem sorted. Maybe it's time to get talking?? :?:
> 
> And please take note of the forum rules, especially in relation to other members:-
> 
> http://www.motorhomefacts.com/forums-rules.html#9
> 
> I and the rest of the mods have various sanctions also listed in the rules - please do not give us reason to use them.
> 
> Bognormike - for mods team
Click to expand...

Can you please tell me what I have done wrong moderator.

And I never said there was a warranty from the dealer, you have assumed that...


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## CPW2007

Contradictory terms??


cidersurfer said:


> It appears that I have another problem now too, in how to deal with the original dealer. Would the fact that their warranty may have expired affect things?


*Cidersurfer then later posted* "And I never said there was a warranty from the dealer, you have assumed that..."

I have been following this thread with some interest and my sympathy goes out to the OP who just asked a simple question, got a reply and now sees his thread rambling on because someone seems to have an axe to grind as opposed to acting on many of the well meaning advice already given. ](*,) ](*,) Makes me want to throw up or watch Strictly Come Prancing :evil: :evil:

Regards

Chris


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## GerryD

Cidersurfer,
Let's forget about warranties and who said what or who did not say what.
You have a genuine offer from Swift to correct the defect with your motorhome. That may inconvenience you for a few weeks, but if it were done off season the inconvenience would be minimised. Better to have that than to see your motorhome depreciate because you couldn't accept the olive branch that has been offered.
As has been said, Swift are under no legal obligation to intervene, but they are prepared to go beyond their responsibilities to assist you.
So, quite simply, put up or shut up. Either send the pm to Andy at Swift providing the necessary information to enable him to identify you, or do the other thing and not get the vehicle repaired and complain to people who are already sick of your unjustified failure to respond.
Gerry


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## Chudders

My sympathy also with the OP who posted a comment and got a reply. Cant quite work out whether the subsequent complainant is genuine or an Internet Troll. Certainly had the effect of stirring things up.
As an outsider Swift,s response does seem entirely reasonable. No I do not have a Swift and nothing to do with the company. Not many companies are prepared to respond on an open forum. I am considering a new motorhome and may now consider a Bessacar from the Swift group although I had not previously. 
Dave


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## peejay

cidersurfer said:


> I just fail to understand why I get 2 offers of assistance from Swift on a public forum and not in the privacy of normal communications.


With due respect and in a nutshell - does it really matter as long as you get it fixed? - take up the offer from Swift and get it sorted. If Swift don't sort it to your satisfaction then by all means come back and have a winge on here, but at least give them a chance first.

End of - in my humble opinion.

Pete


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## geraldandannie

Chudders said:


> I am considering a new motorhome and may now consider a Bessacar from the Swift group although I had not previously.
> Dave


I would be careful when thinking about buying a van from a company which _seems_ to have so many reliability / QC issues, and which _seems_ to have a customer relations department with _varying_ performance in communications.

Many people seem to laud Swift for the fact they're on here, and visible. And jolly good it is too. My manufacturer is not on here, as far as I know. There again, I have had no need to bother them (or my dealer) with any warranty / reliability issues either.

The general consensus seems to be that it's great that Swift are prepared to fix a severe damp problem (which has been reported on here on a number of previous occasions), and that losing the use of your motorhome for 4-6 weeks is not a big issue. Am I the only one who is concerned that this damp problem is there in the first place? Why does it take 4-6 weeks to fix it anyway?

As yet, we don't seem to have had an answer to one of the main questions of this thread - why do people join MHF to be able to get a response from Swift when other avenues (via the dealer conduit and direct communication) seem to have failed? The cynic in me wonders whether it's something to do with visibility.

Gerald


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## JohnsCrossMotorHomes

Hi Gerald,

We have no problems conversing with Swift so why has this person's dealer alledgedly had, if he had a dealer in the first place.

In our experience 4 - 6 weeks is not the norm.

As to Swift having so many reliability and QC problems, that is utter rubbish, we are talking about one model, the pre X250 Sundance and no other. Any other problems with bought in supplies are common to most UK motorhomes as most converters fit them.

All these statements are made by the poster, Swift have openly offered in open forum to sort the problem.

We have only the posters allegations and personally I am of the opinion that it is a total wind up unless proven otherwise which this person has repeatedly declined to do and just continues to prevaricate.

Peter


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## GerryD

Gerald,
I think you are being overcritical of Swift. They do possibly have the highest level of complaints on here, but that is possibly because they sell more Motorhomes in the UK than any other manufacturer. It is similar to the Ducato issues, the other chassis manufacturers have just as many problems, but as they sell less we do not get to hear about them.
One of the biggest problems with the retail side of the industry is the poor after sales service from many dealers. Unfortunately this is rife in the leisure industry and doesn't seem to be getting any better.
Personally I believe that many of the manufacturers are starting to see the light and are now prepared to talk directly to the end customers. The main reason for that is that they are tired of seeing their name on Forums like this because the dealer has failed to act on what often starts out as a minor after sales issue.
We learn from our mistakes, but unfortunately there will always be a high proportion of customers who are drawn in by the bright lights of the bigger operators. After all we do it in all of our purchasing decisions, we still use the major supermarkets rather than the small local store (yes, and the same goes for electrical retailers), but we then complain about the service.
We as a nation need to start to respect our customers and realise that they need support throughout the life of their product irrespective of the retail value.
Gerry


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## Briarose

> Many people seem to laud Swift for the fact they're on here, and visible. And jolly good it is too. My manufacturer is not on here, as far as I know. There again, I have had no need to bother them (or my dealer) with any warranty / reliability issues either.


 But if your manufacturer was on here :wink: we would all know of any problems that your particular brand of MH might have develop etc which can only be a bonus IMHO I think all MHS seem to have niggles etc and from what I hear and when I speak to folk, Swift are not unique in this,...........but at least any potential problems can be aired and discussed.


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## geraldandannie

JohnsCrossMotorHomes said:


> We have no problems conversing with Swift so why has this person's dealer alledgedly had, if he had a dealer in the first place. In our experience 4 - 6 weeks is not the norm. As to Swift having so many reliability and QC problems, that is utter rubbish, we are talking about one model, the pre X250 Sundance and no other.


Hi Peter

Thanks for that.



GerryD said:


> We as a nation need to start to respect our customers and realise that they need support throughout the life of their product irrespective of the retail value.


Absolutely, Gerry. But it irks when products with an extremely high price ticket (e.g. a motorhome costing £30,000 upwards) seems to experience quality problems which could be fixed by using longer screws, thicker bed supports or frame, wood instead of glue or tiny plastic supports. The list is huge, and not restricted to one manufacturer. I do wonder whether it's the attitude of the people on the shop floor. People don't seem to have the interest in the product (or maybe are not empowered to point out defects).



Briarose said:


> But if your manufacturer was on here we would all know of any problems that your particular brand of MH might have develop


I don't think so. The forums would be full of "has anyone had any problems with ..." or "has anyone had problems with communication with ..."

I will admit that Swift probably sell more motorhomes than any other make, and therefore the proportion of 'issues' could be the same, but just more prevalent due to the greater numbers.

What irritates is lack of attention to detail. Mind you, I was looking (just for the sake of research, you understand :wink: ) at a £90,000 F*ankia at Shepton which had a wooden edging strip peeling off. The salesman was in the van, and held it up with his hand. "That's a bit of a shame", I said. "It came like that from Germany", he said. I don't know if it's true or not, but it doesn't bode well for the eventual owner.

I like openness and transparency. The problem with some of the issues aired on here is that they're intercepted with a "PM or email me with your details, and we'll sort it out", and quite often that's the last we hear of it. The presumption is that the problem is fixed, but us avid forum watchers rarely find out.

I still like the look of the Swift low profile tags though :?

Gerald


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## Jezport

As a non-Swift owner, I have no loyalty either way and can see this issue from both sides.

Cider Surfer is obviously upset that he has a MH with a major problem. As stated earlier his contract which is covered by the sales of goods act is with the seller, as the goods were not fit for purpose. I can understand why he has gone straight to the manufacturer and it probably be the easiest way to get things sorted.

I always believe that even if a company cannot sort things immediatly they should call the customer back when agreed and keep in regular communication with them, sometimes this doesn't happen maybe due to poor staff training or just by mistake.

From what I see Swift do learn and act on what they see and hear on the forums, this is a great way to act and ensures that any customers problems are dealt with. I have read a post where Swift have washed thier hands of a problem, which is both good for the customer and the reputation of Swift.

I really understand how dissapointed and angry Cydersurfer is, but I think that now is the time to accept the offer that has been made by Swift. 

As already said many awill not deal directly with a customer and certainly do not reply via forums on the net, so Swift seem to offer a service that is quite unique. Maybe their customer service dept staff do need to look at how they deal with people, maybe not I cannot comment as I have not dealt with them.

I hope that Cydersurfer gets his van sorted Swiftly


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## teljoy

There are some people in this world who just like causing arguments and love to wind others up. Unfortunately it seems that Cydersurfer has managed to do this. I guess he has no interest in Swift or indeed if he owns a motorhome. He just loves controversy. Just close the thread and see what happens. If he replies I personnally will not respond.

Terry


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## Zebedee

This is a Moderator Announcement.

Aside from any other consideration, it is quite unfair on Coxie (_who was the OP of the original topic_) to have his thread so comprehensively hi-jacked, making it almost impossible for him to continue his dialogue with Swift should he wish to do so.

The thread has therefore been split at the point where Cidersurfer interjected his first post, and the two threads have been renamed to include the usernames of the respective "OP's" in order to avoid further confusion.

Coxie's original thread may be accessed  >> here <<

Zebedee
Moderating Team


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## JohnsCrossMotorHomes

cidersurfer said:


> I own a Swift motorhome, I am the second owner of it. The van cost *nearly £30,000 not 12 months ago*


One does wonder as the pre X250 Sundances were only £30k list price brand new. Seems rather expensive for an old cab.

The X250 cabs were £32k list price brand new, I leave you to draw your own conclusions.

Peter


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## ingram

JohnsCrossMotorHomes said:


> cidersurfer said:
> 
> 
> 
> I own a Swift motorhome, I am the second owner of it. The van cost *nearly £30,000 not 12 months ago*
> 
> 
> 
> One does wonder as the pre X250 Sundances were only £30k list price brand new. Seems rather expensive for an old cab.
> 
> The X250 cabs were £32k list price brand new, I leave you to draw your own conclusions.
> 
> Peter
Click to expand...

That Swift products hold their prices well? ...... awaiting flack! 

Harvey


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## Penquin

ingram said:


> That Swift products hold their prices well? ...... awaiting flack!
> 
> Harvey


If that is so that must be because there are not enough of them around to satisfy consumer demand - hence the price will stay high. 

If there were too many of them, or it was generally believed they were unreliable or prone to faults, then the price would drop rapidly and continually.  

As the owner of a Swift I must say that I am very satisfied with the vehicle and the excellent service that we have received from Swift when we have needed to be in touch with them.  

I do not believe our experience is unique either..... 

Dave


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## tony50

*Poor customer service swift*

When we ran our business we said to the customer an old saying " If you ever have a problem tell us not your mates in the pub " . You have had a excellant reply to your problem from Swift .I suggest as many others have said politely ,close the matter!


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## Nauplia

*Poor Customer service from Swift*

Really interesting thread. Wish I had started to read it in about an hours time. Would have been much more interesting than the dancing programme.

Oh yes, I have one of these pre juddergate Swift Sundance thingies and it has been and is continuing to be excellent. Thank you Swift - excellent value for money.


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## Coxie

As the OP of the first Swift Poor Customer Service thread, I am quite relieved to see the two threads have now been split. Thank you moderators.

To update you on our situation: I emailed Andy Spacey with a PM containing the details of our latest issues. As a result I did receive a call from the Customer Services Manager, and we now have arrangements in place for our van to be returned to the factory. So even if Andy's action was to send an internal memo to Customer Services nudging them to contact me, their participation on this Forum is certainly welcomed by me.

However, I do share Cidersurfer's frustration that Swift are able to respond so quickly in the public domain, but are not able to pay such close attention to their customers via personal communications.

If all these comments are being monitored by Swift, then let's hope that all our feedback is being noted and that Quality Control and Customer Service is improved as a result.


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## SwiftGroup

Coxie, 
We are hear and we are listening,
Thanks
Andy


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## Guest

geraldandannie said:


> Chudders said:
> 
> 
> 
> 1,Am I the only one who is concerned that this damp problem is there in the first place? 2,Why does it take 4-6 weeks to fix it anyway?
> Gerald
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1. Clearly not.
> 2. If you had been on one of several MHF's visits to the Swift Factory, you might have an idea of the difficulty in replacing the floor of a motohome. On a production line, fitting the floor is a very different prospect to refitting one off-line.
Click to expand...


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## ovalball

I own a swift motorhome,bought it new 12 months ago.Yes,I have had problems with it,far more than i would have liked.However,after previously owning touring caravans for many years,I did expect it wasn't going to be without faults.Weather this attitude is the right one after spending over £40000,you decide.
Now the point of this ramble is this.Without the support of the Swift personnel who monitor this forum I am convinced that many of the problems which I have had would not have been rectified as quickly as they have.I have often found that the dealer blames Swifts,Swift blames the dealer and the customer gets stuck in the middle,sometimes waiting many weeks for problems to get sorted.Like I say the support on here is excellent,but waiting for swift customer care to get back to you or returning a call is another matter.My next van will probably be a Swift.I like the style and the layouts suit me.If only they could get the customer care right to Joe Public(not just members of forums)everyone would be even happier


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## Sonesta

What a nice, fair and positive post ovalball and I can see the point you are making entirely.  

Hopefully, Swift will take on board all of what you say and as well as providing the excellent service that they clearly do on this forum, they will adopt the same approach with their customer care team at head office! If they can achieve the same excellent feedback from their customers as they do from the happy customers who have benefited from their response to members who post on here, then I think they will have succeeded where so many others have failed!

All the best.

Sue


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## gizmo26

*SWIFT - Never ever again!*

We bought a new Bessacarr E410 in March 2008. Within two weeks of taking delivery and the first time it was washed, we found several small areas of pitted 'rust' on the offside of the habitation panel.
Reported to Marquis who wanted to view it and then a few weeks later, another trip back to Preston so Swift could examine it. They spent about 10 minutes trying to rub the marks away with a rubbing compound. Then stated it was not SWIFT's fault but was contamination in the manufacture of the aluminium panels.
July 2008 - representative of the metal manufacturers attended our home and after 5 minutes and a cup of tea, stated emphatically it was not a manufacturing problem but probably due to the vehicle having been stored (pre-delivery) where some hot-metal grinding had bee taking place and iron filings had burned into the paintwork. "Swift will contact you shortly".
After further chasing up, the next correspondence was Feb 2009 (11 months since purchase) when Marquis said the matter had been overlooked.
March 2009 - Swift asked for photographs of the relevant areas which were sent to them by email and hard copy.
April 2009 - Swift asking for photographs again!
24 June 2009 Another trip to Marquis at Preston for another SWIFT Rep to view the problem. By now further areas of rust showing through on offside.
Finally agreed that vehicle would be taken back to SWIFT at Hull for offside re-spray and that vehicle will be returned 'as new'.
In the interim, I had to pay £170.00 for a Habitation check only to be told that there was a problem with the electrics showing a constant 47 amp drain / waste water gauge constantly showing full / and water ingress in under-bed locker and toilet cassette locker.
SWIFT say this will all be remedied at Hull.
Seems wrong that you have to pay £170.00 for a check which tells you there are warranty issues on the vehicle!
Arrangements finally made for the vehicle to go to Preston for last Monday so it could be collected by SWIFT. They need it for a month!! We have plans to use the vehicle in November and guess what? Up until this morning (Friday) the vehicle was still sitting at Preston although I am told it has now been collected.
I have never experienced such poor aftercare service from any company for anything else I have ever bought. Once these problems are resolved and the vehicle made 'as new' as promised, I think we will be looking around, but our next MH will certainly not be a SWIFT!!


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## GerryD

In April 2002 we bought a Swift Suntor 590RS from Brownhills at the Peterborough show. On delivery everything was working correctly and nothing was broken. Handover was good and we could not fault the van at all.
However, on the way to the NEC show in February 2003, we could hear a buffeting in the roof at speeds in excess of 50mph. It sounded as though the roof was coming off. We reported this to Brownhills at the show and were introduced to Swifts Technical Director. He initially told us that we would need to take the van to Brownhills for the roof to be assessed and that it may have to go to Swifts factory. During the following week we had a phone call from Brownhills to tell us that Swift had been in contact and would now arrange for the van to go to the factory without assessment by Brownhills.
It was agreed that I could deliver the van to our local Swift caravan dealer (1 mile away) rather than face the 200 mile return journey to Newark and that the van would be returned to the caravan dealer. I was told that it would take 28 days. 28days later the van was returned with a new roof. The van was fully valeted and a couple of minor issues that had been spotted at the factory were also rectified.
Was I happy? Absolutely
Would I buy another Swift? Yes, tomorrow, if only they did a layout to suit us.
And all of this without the benefit of MHF.
Gerry


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## gizmo26

If the van is returned on time and to the standard that has been promised I will be the first to hold my hands up and praise Swift, but their record to date has done nothing to instil confidence or give any reason to recommend them. We wait and see!
Peter


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