# Hymer 660



## wub

Hi we had a VW wesfalia camper T4 that we bought from germany, which was very good, but we out grew it and sold last year. 

We have 4 children and have looked at all sorts of larger motor homes and have fallen for a hymer 660, preferably merc based, because of the 6 berth and layout we like, rear lounge \ double bed, middle table and chairs \ double bed and double bed over the drivers seat. 

Due to our budget we are looking from 5K to about 12K. (1980 to 92 ish?) We don't mind old, in fact probably prefer it, as long as its sound. 

We have seen a 1989 660 s class, in germany that seemed to have the layout we liked, rear lounge \ double bed, middle table and chairs \ double bed and double bed over the drivers seat. How ever when i asked the german owner, he said his 660 s class is only built for 2? I thought that 660 meant it was a 6 berth? Does anybody now the models of these up to about 92 from 81, its getting a bit confusing. This 660 s class looked perfect, but unless out german \ english has got crossed wires, its only a 2 berth? 

Anybody have any experience of the 410 merc petrol merc engine? Auto (i prefere)or manual? and do i have to worry about rotten chassis?


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## Westkirby01

As you can see by our avatar we have a 670 1990. 

The dropdown bed in the cab area sleeps 2. 
The rear lounge converts to a large double. 
The dinette converts to a slim double.
So, 6 berth. 
There are only two of us, so it's a 2 berth as far as we are concerned.

670 means = 6.7 metres. The 0 means it is a Mercedes base/engine. If it ended in a 4 it would mean it is a non mercedes engine.

The body never rots, It's made of plastic. The chassis and parts are like any car. Need looking after. They repair easily.
Ours has a roof that curves, some have a square edge. If square, may suffer from water ingress. Get a damp meter and check the walls.

The engine, ours is a merc 2.9 diesel automatic, 24.7mpg average over 9 years. Petrol I believe gives better.

Comment made about seat belts. Get them put in.

PM me if you want to converse


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## HEYFIELD

The problem you would probably have with an older camper is the lack of 3 point seat belts for the children


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## hymerbeliever

Have a look on mobile.de if you havent done so already.

http://suchen.mobile.de/fahrzeuge/search.html?scopeId=MH&lang=en

you can limit by price and specify the number of beds/bunks.


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## Chalkie1

Hi we have just imported a 1989 Hymer s660 from Holland this weekend and its fantastic! 6 berth , two dinnets and overcab bed. 2.9 Merc Auto Please see my recent posts on Importing From Holland. Ask me anything!!!


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## Westkirby01

Hi Chalkie1

Will we see you at the Northern Motorhome show in July? Would love to see what you have done by then.
Regards


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## Chalkie1

yeah maybe, have yet to get back in the scene, its been 14 yrs since we had a caravan and went touring all over Europe. Buying a derelict house has taken over time and money.

I see you have a s670, can you tell me what the tyre presures should be. And also mine has Very large fuel tank, generator, gas bottles and fridge all on one side, this has made me list slightly to the right, is this normal or is she just tired?


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## Westkirby01

Chalkie1 said:


> I see you have a s670, can you tell me what the tyre presures should be. And also mine has Very large fuel tank, generator, gas bottles and fridge all on one side, this has made me list slightly to the right, is this normal or is she just tired?


I have tyre pressure at a whopping 60.

My fuel tank is 65 litre, wish I had a larger one.

Yes I lean to the right. Appears normal.

We don't have a generator, but use solar.

Have put a concertina door (£14.00 from Argos) to close off view of wash basin when sitting at rear table.

Centre seat was 'L', same as rear. Made it into a dinnette. (can't use it as it's now the dog's bed)

The lighting was useless, it originally had only 3. Have put in another 7 including the new LED strips, yellow, as white is not good for reading from.

Replaced 2 burner hob with 4 burner.

Small shelves at rear either side in bed at rear.

Always carry an oil fired heater for 12v use.

I have kept a log of every fuel fill, date and location since 1980.

Motorhomes are brill.

REgards


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## jonandjules

Try http://www.friendlyhippo.co.uk/hymerdirect/ or at the moment there are a couple on ebay. One of them looks fabulous but is a bit more cash. Just been haing a longer read of the two on ebay - they both look really interesting. One of them is well within your budget at 6.5k.
Good luck!


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## Chalkie1

Westkirby can you help i just went out to check tyre size and there is no aspect ratio only says 185/14c?????


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## Chalkie1

Hi Wub 
going back to your origional post. I have been looking for retro fit 3 point seatbelts for my Hymer and have found a place in Plymouth that make and fit the frames. Will get back to you with Name and price.


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## Westkirby01

Hi Chalkie1

Been out to 'Lucy' but it's dark and cold, torch battery dying. One of th tyres has 820 written on it, but will look in the light of morning. I got them for £46 each from a local dealer.

Regards


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## wub

Thanks for that guys, lots to think about.

Chalkie1 where did you find your one from holland, was Modil.de? or another sales site, i'd be very interested to know.

Anyone know what sort of cruising speed you would get from a 81 660, with Merc 410 manual?


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## johnthompson

Hi WUB

I have the same 410D 5 speed manual powering a 1992 Hymer S700.

Engine 2874cc Diesel. (Not Turbo)
5 speed manual gear box 
Consumption 12–14 litres/100km (17 to 20MPG)
Length 7.21m (23 feet 8 inches) Height 2.81m (9ft 3inches) Width 2.22m (7ft 3½ inches)
Wheelbase 3.700m 
Un-laden Weight	3380kg (3.73 ton) (@ 30/10/09)
Gross Weight 4600kg (5.075 ton) (Actual Loaded 24/05/10 4300kg)
Max Load Front Axle 1700kg (Actual Loaded 24/05/10 1540kg)
Max Load Rear Axle	3200kg (Actual Loaded 24/05/10 2840kg)
Load 1220Kg (1.35 ton)
Max Trailer Weight 1300Kg (1.433 ton)
Max Train Weight 5900Kg (6.5 ton)

The S denotes it has the one piece fibreglass moulded roof. That is the one with rounded corners. B designation has an angled roof made up of jointed pieces. The S700 can sleep 5 but only has belts for 3. The other seat is a side bench seat, over the fresh water tank, where it is not recommended to have belts fitted.

The 700 comes as a fixed rear bed with a boot space under it or as a rear lounge with a reduced boot to allow for the foot well in the lounge.

I can cruse comfortably towing a Smart on a trailer at 60mph. It will do over 70+ when wound up solo. This is not a fast getaway machine it takes time to build up momentum. Fuel consumption is between 16 and 19mpg. It can do higher on flat continental motorway cruise where I have had the odd 25 mpg out of it. It is dead slow climbing hills if you loose momentum, but it will plod on for mile after mile without any overheating problems.


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## johnthompson

Chalkie1 said:


> Westkirby can you help i just went out to check tyre size and there is no aspect ratio only says 185/14c?????


Mine are 185R14C


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## Chalkie1

Hi Wub

All i did when i was searching was go on Google and put in Hymer s660 and 660s on images and when i saw a picture i followed it to its website. Mine was a private add in a dutch mag. In fact it appeared in 3 different mags.

I have searched Mobile De which will lead you to dealers main web sites as well as private adds.

I have to say they are very slow! We were in fits af laughfter on our way home through Devon when on one hill we were down to 23mph.

But generally you can cruise at 50 -60mph. On our 550mile return journey we got 26mpg at 50mph and 23mpg at 60mph. We did get to 70mph when making a run for the next hill. We think its ok now we have gotten used to it. It is really comfortable and has the charactoristics of a jelly mould.

We think we got a good deal as ours has an lpg tank as well as bottles, a long range fuel tank, solar panels linked to two huge liesure batteries,a generator with 150hrs on it, air con which doubles as a heater as well as gas central heating and two dinnets which is rare in Euope as they tend to prefer fixed bed at the rear. 

Just need to mot it now. Insurance was £295 and europe breakdown £80. 

I am struggling with swapping the fog light over to offside, it has one in light cluster on nearside but blank on offside but with blank wire in place, so i swapped bulb contacts over and put connector on blank wire and nothing! need that for the mot..........


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## norm1955

*Hymer 660-700s*

Hi All, I am another fairly new Hymer owner (18 months) We have a 1988 s700, with all the bells & whistles..... replaced/checked nearly everything inc fitting solar panel & rear air suspension, What a difference.
Done a 5k trip last summer across europe.

If I can help anybody where to get parts or advice please ask.

Regards

Norman

P.S just replaced 2 of the 3 wind up plastic roof vents (I got the part number from Hymer factory visit last summer)


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## Chalkie1

Yes! Norman.... skylights I have three in various states of being broken.
Where can i get some from and how much are they. Do you know what size they are as i've seen various one on Ebay that look similar but are all different sizes from £20 new

Also as i said in earlier post i have a list to the right about an inch down due to geny,large fual tank, fridge and gas bottles all on that side, is this same on yours or is my suspension old and tired?

Have you had any dealings with the plastic trim on bodywork?

Do you have Underslung LPG Tank?

So many questions...

Chalkie


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## Chalkie1

Just found website for fitting 3point seatbelts to motorhomes

[url=http://www.camperconversions.com/new-products


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## wub

Thanks Johnthompson.

Hey chalkie1 thanks for that as well, i'll do the same, like your lateral thinking there!.


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## wub

Hi again after pursuing a fiat 644 1991 in germany, to no avail, i've just spotted a 660 merc 1991. all looks good, says its got a 2.9L turbo diesel manual, about 90K miles. Anybody have any experience in these engines? I must admit i didn't think they did the 2.9 turbo in a 91, i thought the largest was a 2.5? I presume being a mercedes engine it has plenty of life, but anything to look out for when i go and view? do the turbos give any trouble? Also whats the 5 speed manual box like? 

Chalkie1 what engine is in yours as you said it was pretty slow?


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## Chalkie1

*Hymer 660s*

Hi there just tell u that i've just seen a 660s 1990 on ebay £12k or offers 88k miles...looks good!

Mines a 1989 2.9 merc auto. It is very nice to drive at lower speeds ie up to 45mph then u start to push it up to 60 which is a bit loud and your looking for another gear! Hit a hill and i have gone down to 23mph in a 60 zone. Think auto is way to go for me as it's a big vehicle and not having to change gear is a dream. These are not turbo but if you search the threads you will find there is a place used to be TB Turbos who will turbo it for £2.5k ish then apparently they don't notice the hills. I wont bother i'll just relax a take it easy. The engine is very strong, mines done 42k and i get about 25mpg. 
i'm in process of re upholstering and carpeting mine at the mo..These also come with various options, depends what you want it for...
Chalkie


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## Chalkie1

*660s*

Sorry just seen you said it is turbo, well if thats true you can see what it would cost for you to do!


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## smokeycat

hi we used to have a 644 it had end u shape lounge converts in to double bed and middle diner also double bed and of course the drop down double bed.also the diner normally has four seat belts fitted.you can get them cheaper than a s class too.....hope you get what you need.....kind regards ken


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## wub

*found one*

Hi all,

Thanks for all your help, it helped clarify what exactly we needed \ wanted so when one came up, i snapped it up, its now sat in my drive.

I bought that one that was ebay a few days ago 1990 s660 2.9 turbo intercooled, retro fitted i think. All seems good, just the little list of things to do now, like work out how to use it all, get the genie connected up, fix a few broken bits and pieces etc

BUT, chalkie1 you are right, man are they slow! Well its not so much the slow'ness, just the engine revs you are doing at 60mph. You feel as if you just want to slip it up one more gear and crise at 60 without screaming the heart out of the poor engine. What also seems strange is the redundancy of first gear, the person i bought it off said he never uses it, just pull away in 2nd, so if thats the case, it seems to me that the diff ratio \ gearing is all wrong? But i've only driven it down the motorway and not up through the alps, so perhaps you need 1st gear, any experience anyone?

There seems to be a few threads on the internet about this on these 410 merc's, but no answers? I've about suggested larger rear wheels, diff changes etc

Has anyone \ does anyone have the answer or tried any of these and have any details?

Apart from that, very please with the van so far, even though she's over 20 years old, she's in remarkable condition, just goes to show the build quality of these hymers.


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## Chalkie1

*Hymer 660s*

Great to see you got what you wanted, i thought that one dissapeared off ebay a bit quick! Yep slow they are and mines non turbo auto!
I also have a long list of jobs... i am re carpeting this weekend, then i'm going to re upholster the whole lot, outside is solid and just had it mot'd. Got a dicky sender on the fuel tank and guages on water and waste not working. What jobs you got to do?
Chalkie


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## wub

Yep well it seemed a fairly good price for one in the uk and with the turbo, and the layout i wanted, i took it. 

When i went to collect it got even better, the guy threw everything in , a secondary awning room,, all the bbq's, Marogrill, wind breaks , chocks, plates , tv, microwave, pot pans, kettle, tables, chairs, motorbike rack, even some loose change, so ready to go! And it had a roof mounted electrolux aircon unit, so all in all very happy. 

What are you recarpeting with, special stuff or regular house carpet? I'm going to do mine as its looking very tired, maybe sound proofing as well. 

I ordered some small interior parts from hymeruk on ebay and he very kindly emailed the english version of the vehicle instruction manual, free of charge, which i thought was good. But it seems the rear table which i am unfortunatly missing is no longer available, so if anybody out ther

Anyway thanks again for the help, and good luck with the carpeting


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## Chalkie1

*Hymer 660s*

Sounds ideal getting everything thrown in. I'm using regular carpet, browny biege fleck with foam back. It went in really well and was even easy to shape around the cab. I also made some extra mats which i'll get bound, same with dashboard mat. 98% finnished that job, took me a day. Soon onto re upholstery. Will post picture tonight if you want to see...
What jobs have you got to do?
Chalkie


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## Chalkie1

*Hymer 660s*

Could you email me that instruction manual i'll pm my email address?


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## funkyronster

*Hi S660 and S700 fans*

I've been on here for a while but don't post much.

Just thought I would let you know about my 93 Hymer S700 that has done 300,000k ...... a third of a million!!

And it has been hammered, I used to trail a 2 ton boat, and then a half ton motorbike trailer. Now it has a rack on the back with a small trials bike, despite the overhang.

It has been turbo'd and intercooled, and is still on the original Garret turbo. It has had a new head, and a new oil pump. Other problems with brake balancing. I am on my second set of rear springs....but we have done a lot of miles on the worst roads you have ever seen in Ukraine and in the Sahara desert.

These vans are the best vans in the world, as long as you treat them well. Mine has been severely mistreated (in the name of adventure)....it has been on its side in a ditch, and front wheels over a cliff, Italian Job style...barely a scratch.

The front end is the weak point, especially if you have the front drop down bed and use it for storage like I used to. After a bad summer on bad roads I noticed the front end was shaking loose. I have just replaced the wooden dash board with a custom made sheet steel one, and beefed up the entire front. Then added double insulation under and over. It is more quiet now than at any time!

Oil change every 10k kms - and the best synthetic oil you can buy, no exceptions. She purs with pleasure after an oil change.

The old style Merc chassis is the best in history, all those old Merc 207 308 410 and 508's have gone from our roads and are in Africa. Holland and Germany are the places to buy.

Big solar panels on top, and 300kgs of 2v fork lift truck cells in the boot give me 500Ah of power for 2 laptops and a kick as sound system.

The front bed was chucked out last year, and new shelves fitted all round - it transforms the cabin, like building an extension!! If you really don't need that front bed - rip it out!

Yes she's a bit light at the front end, but nothing to ever scare me.

You simply would not believe where I have had this van.....Denmark to Sahara, Ireland to the Black sea and beyond. Next trip China and India overland. I've spent the last few years breaking my heart about getting rid for a proper overland safari truck, but she will go wherever a 5 ton delivery truck will go, and I don't want to drive through dunes and up mountains......so i'm keeping her for ever, till one of us dies.

Best money i ever spent....everything still works, all the Truma, on my second fridge.....boy I have had heartache with fridges! But I am now an expert.

If I could wish for one thing it would be to get rid of this furry roof lining, it's impossible to clean and looks a mess, but other than that she looks like an old Pullman carriage, with purple velvet curtains and gold trim (custom made dirt cheap in Morocco), a statue of buddah and indian tapestries....ok we are a bit hippy!!

Not trying to brag, just want to tell the world that 85-95 old style S series Hymers ARE THE BEST! And I've seen thousands of vans all over the world.

It has been the best thing I have ever bought, and I have had all the toys over the years.

I know every nut bolt and panel, anybody got any problems I'm your man.

And a big shout to Deepcar......they have been brilliant.

Stay cool and keep on truckin.......

Funkyronster
Casablanca, Morocco (probably the best motorhome place to go in our world on normal insurance - cheap fuel, cheap everything, great mechanics, lovely people and safe as houses)

Photos and stories and stuff www.funkyronster.blogspot.com


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## Chalkie1

*Hymer 660s*

wow! your a good advert for hymer. We have fallen in love with ours too and hope to cover many miles, ours only has 72000kms on at the moment!! Only problem left to sort is that we are listing to one side as we have Gene, fridge,long range 120ltr fuel tank and two gas bottles all on the right. Thinking of Air Bags on back to help out the leaf springs, But at £550 will have to wait a while.
Thanks for the your testimony to the strength of the old Hymers! Might have to get ours Turbo'd some time.....


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## funkyronster

yeah you either live with it, or fix it. It depends on your character. on the one hand, the van chassis is designed for unequal loads....its a fact of commercial life!

But some of us are perfectionists, and the reality is that the Hymer is actually quite a handsome retro style sort of vehicle...it has curved retro lines almost like a German Airstream!

It annoyed the hell out of me, even though there's a solid reason for it. There were many layout variants back in those days, and some of them are heavier on one side than the other.

The cheque book way is airrides, but it is expensive. I have had new rear springs fitted, but only because they were broken (do check for broken leafs) and each time I noticed that the van was sitting more level again. If you were clever you could beef up the rear spring on one side, but almost as expensive as airides in the uk...but possible in Morocco or Turkey, where they will custom make you a spring in an afternoon for about 100 quid.

I eventually solved the problem after my under chassis lpg tank was totalled after a tyre blowout while I was overtaking a Moroccan truck down a mountain pass! I had to ditch it and go back to bottles, but it changed the dynamic of the whole truck, and she has been almost level ever since.

But the easy way is airbags, although they also become "just one more thing to maintain and go wrong!!

The choice is yours!


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## funkyronster

Another radical solution would be to use ballast!! Unlike most other 3.5 ton vans, you are plated at 4.6, so have plenty of leeway. You could probably hide 100k or more of iron or lead in the boot on the opposite side. The engine wouldn't notice, although it's not one for purists.

But what you could do is install more batteries! If you are going to be spending a lot of time away, and if you enjoy your tv and laptop, then you will soon find that a single 120ah leisure battery, under the drivers seat will not be enough.

So source some really heavy batteries, either 12 x 2v commercial cells, like mine, or just big heavy 12v tractor batteries in parallel......and shift your battery installation into the boot/garage, right on the opposite side. Think about shifting your jenny too, and get in the habit of loading up the light side in anyway you can.

Water and fuel are about a kilo a litre.....you can work out the benefit of whatever you propose in advance.

If you are mechanical, you could also consider beefing up the leaf spring on the low side, as it is already suffering more than its twin.....in fact why not just swap the leaf springs? That would be a neat idea, with nothing lost by trying. 

In Turkey 4 teenagers had my rear springs off in 20 minutes using nothing more than a bottle jack, hammers and crowbars! I watched in horror, but they knew their stuff. You could do it with axle stands and really tough tools. Once the springs are off, you can separate the leafs, and compare the curvature of each one, and then re-assemble putting all the strongest leafs on the heavy side. 

Do get underneath with plenty of light and check every leaf for breaks, and every retaining u bolt....you may already have a break on the heavy side.

There are specialist firms and mechanics around who could help - agricultural equipment workshops out in the country can be good. And as usual, google is your mate.....


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## wub

Why do you use 12 x 2volt cells, are they lighter \ hold more power?


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## johnthompson

*Re: found one*



wub said:


> Hi all,
> 
> BUT, chalkie1 you are right, man are they slow! Well its not so much the slow'ness, just the engine revs you are doing at 60mph. You feel as if you just want to slip it up one more gear and crise at 60 without screaming the heart out of the poor engine. What also seems strange is the redundancy of first gear, the person i bought it off said he never uses it, just pull away in 2nd, so if thats the case, it seems to me that the diff ratio \ gearing is all wrong? But i've only driven it down the motorway and not up through the alps, so perhaps you need 1st gear, any experience anyone?
> 
> There seems to be a few threads on the internet about this on these 410 merc's, but no answers? I've about suggested larger rear wheels, diff changes etc
> 
> Has anyone \ does anyone have the answer or tried any of these and have any details?


We have the 410D 5 speed manual Hymer S700. Non Turbo and loaded to well over 4 tons. We have done 40,000k in this vehicle. The vehicle has done almost 200,000ks

When this vehicle is fully loaded and towing a trailer with a car, it does need first gear to pull away. On steep climbs such as over the Pyrenees she crawls but does not overheat. First gear also help to get a faster get away on road junctions.

Yes in the main, 2nd is OK for pulling away, but there are times when the gearing is needed.

Someone mentioned TB Turbos in Preston. They went into liquidation a while ago.

This is a truck not a light van. It is designed to be hammered and they have been known to do 1 million ks on an engine hauling loads all over Europe.


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## Westkirby01

Has anyone altered the wheel size from 14 1/2 to 16. I read somehwere that a member was considering. Is this viable, did/does this increase mpg. What about the hub caps, can new ones be purchased as the front are different from the rear?

Regards


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## wub

yes i've just done it, just back from first trip, 6 hours driving, all works a treat, criseing speed to rpm much better, speedo now reads correctly ( very odd!) and much bettre moles per gallen. I'll write a full post on how and what in a few days.


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## Chalkie1

*Bigger Wheels*

can't wait to here about this, think my hymers going to explode at 60mph!


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## goggsey

I have a older and mean older Hymer 660 on a Merc chassis 1977, and it passes the MOT every time on chassis and running gear, its 6 berth over cab and rear fitted double bed, and one double in the middle where the table converts to, i have had her for 6 years now and i have been all over europe with her, and Italy for a month in aug with my g/son, so if you get one you should have no problems, if you do the services, i do oil and filters every 4000 mls. just normal running cost, 
I found a Merc parts place that deals only in Merces vans and car, in Oldham, first class service from them, and a fitting service as well,

http://www.prestigeallparts.co.uk/


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## wub

Bit overdue but just a quick update on my snail. In these previous messages, I have been going on about how slow my Turdoed merc hymer 660's was. I tried everything, from service, replacement filters, tank cleaning, larger wheels, override gearbox etc. etc. all of which made great improvements, but I still felt something was up. 

So I tracked down C and A autos of Lancaster, who is run by one of the guys from the now closed J B turbo's who originally installed these on the hymers. 

I felt the only way to nail this was to take the long trip up from Bath and let him take a look. He spent all day trying to find the fault as he agreed after taking on 'the test hill', that is was very under powered for a turbo'd one. 

The fuel pump came off the intercooler, the waste gate, numerous other things and still nothing seemed wrong. I had to leave it with him in the end and a week later, I got a call saying come and get it was all fixed. 

It turned out to be a very simple but elusive problem. Basically, it was a combination of worn linkage from the pedal to the pump and a rubber stop under the pedal that had 'Grown' as old rubber can. This basically meant the pump not opening up fully under full throttle, virtually the same as not having a turbo. 

Easy fix, throw the rubber accelerator stop away and wow what a difference. I can now see what all the other turbo hymers owners were raving about. 

So a big thank you to the guys at C and M auto services Lancaster, who refused to give up and found the fault, simple as it may have been. And when it came to the bill, is was very reasonable, and they had only charged me a couple of hours, not the 8 to 10 hours I know they worked on it. These guys really know all there is to know about these turbo conversions and regularly work on all manner of motorhomes and I wouldn’t hesitate to recommend them.


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