# SeaFrance back in business?



## mikebeaches

Workers to run SeaFrance ferries under Eurotunnel deal

SeaFrance ferry SeaFrance went into liquidation this year with the loss of 880 jobs in France and about 130 in Dover.

The assets of liquidated ferry operator SeaFrance have been awarded to Eurotunnel in a deal that will bring three ships back into operation.

Under the deal, the Channel Tunnel operator will buy three SeaFrance ferries and lease them to a workers' co-operative, restoring 560 jobs.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-18400271


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## DTPCHEMICALS

Thats good news.
Dave p


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## GEMMY

Well how long will that work, at what low rate will Eurotunnel lease the ships,will the unions kill the new company like the last, will all the perks to 'known' people be reinstated.

Thhe French know how to keep foreigners out, pity we don't reciprocate. :wink: 

tony


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## camallison

GEMMY said:


> Well how long will that work, at what low rate will Eurotunnel lease the ships,will the unions kill the new company like the last, will all the perks to 'known' people be reinstated.
> 
> Thhe French know how to keep foreigners out, pity we don't reciprocate. :wink:
> 
> tony


Workers co-operative = no strikes, because it is their firm!

Let's see if they can run it any better than when they were just pure employees. Methinks not.

Colin


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## Penquin

Well it's a way out of a mess that might have some kilometerage.....

the French Government could not do an outright subsidy but this way the workers have the chance (albeit a very small one) of running the company efficiently and free from the mutliple disputes that have beset them (and of course, which they primarily have instigated  ).

This is a way that the French Government will not disapprove of since they have a large stake in Eurotunnel and can exert influence via that route AFAIK.

The last thing they would have wanted is for the assets to go to "b****y foreigners :roll: 

Keep your fingers crossed since any competition on that route (or any other  ) is to be welcomed IMO. Eurotunnel are unlikely to reap much in the way of benefits from ownership, but their debt outstrips their ability to repay anyway.......

Dave


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## charlieivan

What berths are they going to use as DFDS has taken over the old Seafrance ones ?


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## Carl_n_Flo

Dont hold your breaths for this one folks!!!!!

DFDS and P&O will most certainly take this 'deal' to the EU competition commission in Brussels as Eurotunnel already has a 40% share of the cross-channel market.

Their acquiring the ships can only be seen as a spoiling tactic to eventually force P&O and DFDS out of business by cutting the fares to unsustainable levels.

The fact that the drain cannot cope with all the traffic on demand does not enter into it - Eurotunnel would like nothing better than to be rid of ALL the ferries in Dover.....that way they can fix the market price...............and it will be high!!!!!

They even stated as much when the tunnel opened 17 years ago: they confidently predicted that the ferries would not last 5 years as everyone would be happier using the tunnel as it would be quicker.

Quicker?????? Did you see the queues at Folkstone at the beginning of half term week??????

Eurotunnel do not give a flying ******* about the former SeaFrance workers - they are just fodder for their plan.........

Bookmark this thread and read it back in a few months time......

Carl


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## nicholsong

Carl_n_Flo said:


> Dont hold your breaths for this one folks!!!!!
> 
> DFDS and P&O will most certainly take this 'deal' to the EU competition commission in Brussels as Eurotunnel already has a 40% share of the cross-channel market.
> 
> Their acquiring the ships can only be seen as a spoiling tactic to eventually force P&O and DFDS out of business by cutting the fares to unsustainable levels.
> 
> The fact that the drain cannot cope with all the traffic on demand does not enter into it - Eurotunnel would like nothing better than to be rid of ALL the ferries in Dover.....that way they can fix the market price...............and it will be high!!!!!
> 
> They even stated as much when the tunnel opened 17 years ago: they confidently predicted that the ferries would not last 5 years as everyone would be happier using the tunnel as it would be quicker.
> 
> Quicker?????? Did you see the queues at Folkstone at the beginning of half term week??????
> 
> Carl
> 
> You may well be correct, but if Eurotunnel did get a monopoly and hiked the fares then a 'Branson' would see a business opportunity and start a new ferry company. It is not like a railway with only one track - there is an 'underground' and 'oversea', in fact several - Eurotunnel can only go to one destination.
> 
> I would be frightened to use the tunnel to France - M. Flic might arrest me on arrival for rushing lunch in only 25 mins.!:lol:
> 
> Geoff


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## bognormike

doe anybody know what's happened on this? Has it stalled? Peak season's coming up & nothing on google since the initial reports on 11th June, apart from this on 4th July
stock market wire

P&O ferries said they would fight anything like this when it was first mooted back in January.

Any news from Carl& flo or anybody else? 8)

I would have thought that if the current line up of P&O, DFDS (with 2 ships on the Dover - Calais route as well as Dunkerque), and Tunnel operates the main summer season without too many prtoblems with capacity, then bringing in 3 extra ships would be complete financial folly. They might provide employment for a while, but who would pay? :?


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## Carl_n_Flo

Good morning all,

The ex-SeaFrance ships have been sold to Eurotunnel (except Molliere - which was owned by the banks) and they are on their way to Dunkerque for dry-docking and refurbishment.

Eurotunnel are going to lease the ships to the ex-SeaFrance employees through their 'SCOP' (co-operative) and the operation is to be run by a former Director of Britanny Ferries.

They are hoping to have a Dover - Calais service operating by September.

They have no chance of starting earlier as the ships need extensive work, they need to recruit and train staff, and they still need to start their marketing.......

In the meantime, the OFT (Office of Fair Trading) has invited 'comments' on the deal to enable them to investigate the whole sorry episode with a view to a ruling, and both P&O and DFDS have made representations to the EU Commission.

Meanwhile at Dover, the former SeaFrance check-in booths have been taken over by DFDS.

Opinion - I think the SCOP/Eurotunnel will now carry on to effect a start-up in September, and will operate regardless of any EU/OFT rulings as any decision here will be contested in the French courts..........

Carl


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## bognormike

Thanks Carl - good to hear from you.

MY opinion is it must bring in to question the sanity of the Eurotunnel board, spending money on what promises to be a white elephant. Surely any "new" ships on the crossing can only reduce the possibility of Eurotunnel making a profit on its core operation due to losing traffic to the sea crossings. And P&O / DFDS will surely argue to the EU competition commission that the new company will be subsidised by Eurotunnel with the intention of wiping out one of them.

madness.... :x


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## Carl_n_Flo

I am sure there is more behind the scenes.....

The Board of Eurotunnel is French, the train operators are SNCF, SeaFrance was a subsidiary of SNCF, Hollande wants full employment at any cost..........

I wouldnt be surprised if the Board of Eurotunnel was 'leaned on' to take on the wreckage by polititians.............even the Powers that run the port of Boulougne are dangling a juicy carrot to attract an operator.....

This soap opera has a long way to go yet.....


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## Agilityman

I don't think you need to question the sanity of the euro tunnel board. Their actions make sound sense. Any business wants as big a slice of the action as possible. There are many of us above Watford who prefer the Ferry to the tunnel, just to get a rest from driving and something to eat and drink in comfort. The tunnel will never attract 100% of all channel traffic.


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## DTPCHEMICALS

tunnel prices increased when SF ceased operating.
Ticket prices vary day to day. Supply and demand I supose.
Just checked the price of my forthcomming trip on Eurotunnel.
Out is £183
Return is £85.
Total is £268.

P&O by comparison is 
out £75
return £63
Total £138.

Quite a difference.

I paid for tunnel in June and it was £75 out 
and £76 return. 

A total of £151.

Used Tesco vouchers so it was really free. 

Another fleet crossing the channel can only be good for the consumer at the end of the day. Not everyone wants to use the tunnel.
Dave p


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## Stanner

bognormike said:


> Thanks Carl - good to hear from you.
> 
> MY opinion is it must bring in to question the sanity of the Eurotunnel board, spending money on what promises to be a white elephant. Surely any "new" ships on the crossing can only reduce the possibility of Eurotunnel making a profit on its core operation due to losing traffic to the sea crossings. And P&O / DFDS will surely argue to the EU competition commission that the new company will be subsidised by Eurotunnel with the intention of wiping out one of them.
> 
> madness.... :x


Or they want somewhere to send their customers if/when the tunnel has problems. They already have a booking system set up that can surely handle ferry reservations as well as tunnel ones so perhaps not as mad as it looks. Especially if they sailed from Folkestone to Boulogne instead of Dover to Calais.

They could even connect the trains again via (re-opened) Folkestone Harbour and Boulogne Maritime as well, which would give Eurostar a second option in the event of problems.

Why anybody wants to go via Dover is beyond me.


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## greygit

DTPCHEMICALS said:


> tunnel prices increased when SF ceased operating.
> Ticket prices vary day to day. Supply and demand I supose.
> Just checked the price of my forthcomming trip on Eurotunnel.
> Out is £183
> Return is £85.
> Total is £268.
> 
> P&O by comparison is
> out £75
> return £63
> Total £138.
> 
> Quite a difference.
> 
> I paid for tunnel in June and it was £75 out
> and £76 return.
> 
> A total of £151.
> 
> Used Tesco vouchers so it was really free.
> 
> Another fleet crossing the channel can only be good for the consumer at the end of the day. Not everyone wants to use the tunnel.
> Dave p


"Used Tesco vouchers so it was really free."

I can't imagine Tesco giving anything away!
Gary :wink:


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## teal

Today got e-mail from Sea France £22 each way for car.


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## bognormike

teal said:


> Today got e-mail from Sea France £22 each way for car.


really? when? where from & to? :?


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## DTPCHEMICALS

greygit said:


> DTPCHEMICALS said:
> 
> 
> 
> tunnel prices increased when SF ceased operating.
> Ticket prices vary day to day. Supply and demand I supose.
> Just checked the price of my forthcomming trip on Eurotunnel.
> Out is £183
> Return is £85.
> Total is £268.
> 
> P&O by comparison is
> out £75
> return £63
> Total £138.
> 
> Quite a difference.
> 
> I paid for tunnel in June and it was £75 out
> and £76 return.
> 
> A total of £151.
> 
> Used Tesco vouchers so it was really free.
> 
> Another fleet crossing the channel can only be good for the consumer at the end of the day. Not everyone wants to use the tunnel.
> Dave p
> 
> 
> 
> "Used Tesco vouchers so it was really free."
> 
> I can't imagine Tesco giving anything away!
> Gary :wink:
Click to expand...

Gary i do not shop at tesco :lol: :lol:

Dave p


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## moblee

I hope seafrance succeed as it might keep the prices down :!:

MY comparisons, .. I've used the Dover/calais ferry (About) 50/60 times in my life, & Eurotunnel *once*.

My preference Eurotunnel 8O But the same destination for about 40/50 quid less on the Ferries usually.

I'm not poor just tight :lol:


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## Carl_n_Flo

The problem is, is that there is _over_-capacity on the ferries at the moment.

When SeaFrance ceased sailing, P&O and DFDS between them easily soaked up the traffic with no delays - and that was before DFDS started their Calais service.

If/when EurotunnelSCOP Ferries (or whatever they will be called) start sailing, there really will not be the traffic to feed them.

If they start under-cutting P&O/DFDS just to get custom, then there will be a serious price war on the channel. Some might think that will be good for us as customers but think again. It costs serious money to operate a ferry service. Crossings for peanuts cannot sustain a good service. We will end up with the most basic service possible - a virtual Eurotunnel carriage above the waves if you like - or an Easyjet or Ryanair type service where you pay even to go for a pee!!!!

This will be unsustainable in the long, or even medium, term.

EurotunnelSCOP have said they are opening a Dover - Calais service...not Folkestone - Boulougne.....with the _unstated_ intention of doing either P&O (unlikely) or DFDS (possibly) severe harm.

I state that DFDS are more vulnerable on this route as they do not have suitable tonnage whereas P&O have the new Spirits purpose built for the route. And the Deal Seaways (Barfleur) will be going back to Britanny Ferries come the autumn.

This whole venture is doomed to fail in my book - I cannot see DFDS backing off (they have considerable financial muscle behind the scenes), P&O have the ships and clientelle.

The economic situation for ferries is not good at the moment - even Britanny Ferries are cutting back on their routes and services come the autumn - and this will not just be seasonal: they cannot make them pay, other than the Spanish routes.

As of today, the Berlioz and the Rodin are headed for Dunkerque for refurbishment.....................

At least Eurotunnel can sell them as 'fresh and running' ships of they get cold feet!!!!!!

Carl


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## DTPCHEMICALS

The master plan must be to steal trade from the other channel operations irrespective of cost. It may work . Will they recover previous S F customers. Whatever happens for the sake of the employed i wish the project success. They may even do Telco deals.
Dave p


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## jonegood

By my recent experience DFDS are already going a bit 'ryanair'

I went to change my return crossing from a Friday to a thursday and it cost £42, this is only £5 less than booking a completely new crossing with them.

Having steadily used Sea France several times a year, it was my first time with DFDS and Im not impressed with either the tactics or the boat; yes its a bit cleaner than SF but there is nowhere comfortable to sit, the boat was half empty yet the only available seats were high stools n the bar.


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## nicholsong

I have not used the DFDS Calais route but have crossed 3 times on the Dunkirk route and the vessels on that were fine, with no problem finding comfortable bench seats, but I could imagine when full one might be confined to the choice of chairs, but not stools.

Geoff


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## Carl_n_Flo

Both the DFDS vessels on the Calais run are chartered in. They were not designed for the short route.

The Norman Spirit was originally designed for Dover - Ostende and the Deal Seaways, formerly Barfleur, was designed for Poole - Cherbourg (primarily an overnight route), so both have more cabins than is necessary for Dover - Calais and therefore little other space (restaurants, shops, bars, lounges etc.).

Deal Seaways will be returned to her owners come Autumn and I think Norman Spirit will be 'rebuilt' internally over the winter to better suit the route.

DFDS need to find a more suitable vessel for Calais quickly as EurotunnelSCOPWhatever will have two dedicated vessels built for the route come the autumn.

As for DFDS charging the extra for the late change, this is quite normal and has been happening with them and P&O for some considerable time. I have always found it cheaper just to book a single crossing 'on line' when needed.

Try changing your airline or Eurotunnel ticket at short notice and see how much it will cost you then!!!!


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## nicholsong

Carl_n_flo

Thanks

I suspected that DFDS had to grab what vessels they could at short notice to fill the gap left by SF's demise.

Since you seem to follow this closely, what is the situation at Dover/Calais? Are there any spare piers? How are they allocated? Do companies get them on a long/short lease? Can they be kicked off? Can they Dover Port/Operators sell 'slots' like at Heathrow?

And now I am thinking very deviously, if a company (maybe owned by Eurotunnel) possibly instructs a vessel to have a 'technical problem' on the dock and deny another vessel docking? Has the other vessel the right to use P+O pier and delay the P+O vessel docking?

Might be a 'lucky day' for Eurotunnel?

Anyone else know the answers?

According to the answers, maybe a letter to the OFT would be appropriate.

Geoff


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## Carl_n_Flo

Hi Geoff - yes, sadly, I am a bit of a ferry enthusiast!!!

As to the question of 'slots' and berthing rights, Dover Harbour Board (DHB) do not sell slots as such, but they do make a charge each time a ferry docks.

In theory, an operator could block a berth by claiming his ship was 'tech', but it wouldnt last long as DHB would bring one of their tugs to bear and drag it over to the Eastern Arm and tie it up out of the way. The only recent case of a ship blocking a berth was that of the Nord Pas de Calais following the collapse of SeaFrance. She was on a berth solely used by her (so was not actually holding up traffic) and DHB would not let her leave until the Port Dues had been paid.

At the moment, there is actually spare berthing space at Dover (especially when the refurbishment of a couple of linkspans has been completed), so a third operator could quite easily come in and start without compromising the existing operations.

Calais, on the other hand, is a different story. Until the collapse of SF, there were only two operators: P&O with 6 ships and SF with 4. When the new operation commences, we will have P&O with 5 (the Pride of Calais will be retired), DFDS with 2 and ?? with 3. Still the same number of ships, but 3 operators instead of 2 - with 3 different timetables with likely clashes of arrival and departure. And Calais does not have the number of linkspans that Dover has!

In the past, the 10 ships operated a balanced timetable - P&O operating a kind of 'shuttle' with departures every half an hour. this fitted in well with SF's timetable of hourly departures. With half hour departures, the majority of P&O's fleet was at sea whilst the minority was in harbour.

Will there be 'argy bargy' at the ports? Not at Dover I think, but Calais? I wouldnt be surprised!!!

Whatever happens, P&O will continue with Dover - Calais following the not inconsiderable investment in two new, purpose designed, ships. The same with DFDS on Dover - Dunkerque: the ships were designed for the route. ?? will need to make a clear and unequivacable break from the 'traditions' and practices of SeaFrance if they hope to succeed (witness the current prosecutions of former SF staff for theft, extortion and bribery currently before the Calais court).

Interesting times ahead!!!


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## nicholsong

Carl

Thank you for your very full and informative response.

All very interesting.

Please do not apologise for being knowledgeable - we need people like you.

Of course there is no chance that Calais Port authorities would favour a company run by a French union is there? Just to put P+O and DFDS out of business?

I did not know about the court cases about fiddling and fraud. I wonder if those personnel have applied for jobs?

I think I will stick to DFDS on Dunkirk - it is the right direction for Poland!

Thanks again, Geoff


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## grizzlyj

HI

Thank you Carl'n'Flo for much interest 

What is a "linkspan"?

I sailed Dover Calais last Wednesday with P&O, and back yesterday. The (I think) Rodin was sitting looking rusty in Calais on the way out, but was steaming, waiting, at about 2pm yesterday.

On the way out there were what seemed like hundreds of charity cyclists as well as quite a few coaches of school kids on board so the facilities were clogged. On the way back back there were about 20 coaches of school kids, as well as a 100% full car deck! Although all well behaved, this was the fullest ferry I've ever been on!

I very much enjoy any ferry journey, and have only been there and back in the tunnel once which was hugely delayed and slow both ways. Fast actual crossing but no other good points. 

But if increased competition means each ferry runs as full as these last trips have been it will no longer be a relaxing and enjoyable beginning and end to a journey, leaving the lesser of two evils  

Plymouth, Poole, Harwich etc may become favourites in the future.

Jason


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## thieawin

the hinged roadway from shore to ship that raises and lowers to allow embarkation and disembarkation at different states of the tide is a link span

They can be operated hydraulically, by a system of pulleys or be floating


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## harveystc

Hi,Thank you all for the info,very interesting but remember when staff are self employed workers co -op they will work harder to make it pay,also as previous comment the dfds boats are not built to the standards of sea france,food is iffy,shops are not good and comfort is second class,after many trips per year on sea france i can tell the difference,p and o is always sixty pounds dearer for me and is always full of buses and school trips,i think they must have a contract with schools,so i cannot see the problem with another company starting up,i wish them luck and perhaps we will get back to normal and not have substandard boats with substandard facilities,or be ripped off by p and o,as far as the tunnel goes again its not cheap and not every one likes tunnels,please keep the info coming.regards harvey. :lol:


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## Carl_n_Flo

Hi Harvey,

Re your comments about DFDS having sub-standard boats:
The two vessels currently on the Dover - Calais run are, as I said earlier, just temporary to get the service up and running quickly. There are not too many vessels available at such short notice that can be used on this service (they need to 'fit' the berths properly and have 2 level loading and unloading facilities).

If DFDS didnt set up the service when they did, we would all be paying considerably more for our crossings as P&O would have had a monopoly on the route and could almost charge what they liked!

The three DFDS vessels on the Dover - Dunkerque run were purpose built for that service, and therefore will not be pulled across to Calais.

The new venture will be using the former SF vessels Rodin and Berlioz for passenger work and these were built specifically for the Calais run.

Much like the Pride of Dover and the Pride of Calais: these two were designed and built purely to run Dover - Calais, which is why the Pride of Dover has been laid up in Tilbury for the last 18 months as no-one wants to buy a 30 year old vessel and spend a small fortune converting her.


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## nicholsong

Carl

Thanks for that info re the DFDS (Calais) ferries, which seems to confirm what I 'guessed'

I hope potential customers will take that 'on board' (sorry horrible pun1) and not judge the company on its short-term measure.

I am a bit surprised about your comment that they have 'to fit' the berths. From that I assume there is no agreed standard for berths for RO-RO.

Can you imagine if HGV traction units and trailers were not compatible!

Carl, thanks and keep us informed.

Geoff


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## Carl_n_Flo

Hi Geoff,

About the 'fit' of the berths: No, there is no standard for this, other than the Channel ports of Dover, Folkestone, Ramsgate, Calais, Ostende, Dunkerque and Boulougne. These all have 2 level simultaneous loading and discharge, but only Calais and Dover have the foot passenger facility.

Additionally, only the Channel ports have adjustable twin height linkspans (term explained in earlier post - thanks!). Other ports either only have a single level or the ship carries its own linkspan on the stern (to lower onto a fixed quay). This was the case with the Deal Seaways - when she was Barfleur operating out of Poole, she had her own stern and bow linkspans. These were removed and seperate steel structures added to her bow and stern prior to taking up her duties at Dover.


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## nicholsong

Carl

You are a 'mine' of information - probably wrong analogy for ferries.

I love watching ferries in Greece, especially big ones going into little ports on small Greek islands- UNTIL they put the power on when leaving and strain my yacht's (double) mooring lines to the max. Then I have another Metaxa and go back to bed.

In Greece ferries are the lifeblood for the islands, and in many islands in the winter are the event of the week.

Carl, do you track ferries worldwide or just Europe?

Geoff


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## Carl_n_Flo

Hi Geoff,

On the whole, worldwide....but in detail just the European scene.

The Greek ferry industry is in something of a crisis at the moment due to the country's parlous financial state. They have some quite aged vessels, but the companies cannot raise the finance to renew them. And with the Greek Government reducing or removing subsidies, their finances are at rock bottom!

In the past, the Greek ferry companies relied on buying in second-hand tonnage - mostly ex Channel ships - but since the Greek Government put an upper age limit on their ferries of 26 years, that option isnt open to them anymore.

With the demise of GA Ferries a few years ago, many ex-Channel ships went to the scrapyard - some were nearly 50 years old!

With regard to the new start-up in Calais, I am given to understand that they will operate under the name _'MyFerry'_ (!) - appropriate seeing as the ships will be operated by a workers co-operative. Both the Rodin and the Berlioz are now in Dunkerque receiving much needed refits. The Nord Pas de Calais will open the service at the end of August - but I imagine that she will only be used for freight.

No website or booking engine yet though.......

More news when I can find it!!!!


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## Carl_n_Flo

From the Le Monde website (Google translation, slightly amended)

_*SeaFrance ships, renamed "My Ferry Link", will return to sea in August*The Monde.fr with AFP |07/14/2012 at 20h22 • Updated 07/14/2012 at 8:23 p.m.

The boats of the ferry company SeaFrance, put into liquidation in January, since redeemed by Eurotunnel, the sea will resume in August under the name "My Ferry Link " , said Saturday, July 14 the director of the new operating company, confirming information of Paris .
The three ships of the company arrived Wednesday at Dunkirk (Northern) for a technical refit. "They should be able to sail again around mid-August depending on maintenance time " , said Jean-Michel Giguet , the Director the new company operating ships, established cooperative working (SCOP) and outcome of former employees of SeaFrance.

The new company will operate under the name "My Ferry Link" , added M. Giguet, explaining have chosen a British-sounding name "simply because the majority of the clientele Channel traffic is from Great Britain" . However, the new company logo will be blue, white and red, "referring to the French flag" .

GOAL: 8% MARKET SHARE

"It was logical to have a new name, since this is a brand new company with new leadership, new ambitions and new quality of service " , said a spokesman of Eurotunnel. The new company wants to put forward a quality "french touch" with such a quality restaurant and numerous bars on board. "He will by no means make the low cost " , provided a source familiar with the matter.

"My Ferry Link" is a target of around 8% market share with its three boats while SeaFrance draw 18% with double vessels. The crossing between France and Britain should cost "averaging around 50-55 euros" , said M. Giguet. The "Berlioz"and "Rodin" , which will transport passengers, will make four complete rotations per day, while the "Nord Pas-de-Calais" , for freight, will make three.
On recruitment, "nearly 120 people have been hired" , said the new director. The aim is always to reach about 520 employees in France and 70 in the UK, with priority hiring of former staff SeaFrance, he said._

Carl

PS I note that the websites www.myferrylink.com, www.myferrylink.fr, and www.myferrylink.co.uk are all 'under construction

_Info gained from 'Ferries of Northern Europe' Group._


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## Zebedee

Good news Carl - I think, and thanks for the update. 

Can't help a bit of cynicism creeping in though. :roll:

The new company will operate under the name "My Ferry Link" , added M. Giguet, explaining have chosen a British-sounding name "_*simply because the majority of the clientele Channel traffic is from Great Britain*_"

Does that explain why the frequent SeaFrance strikes always targetted British holiday dates??

Dave


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## nicholsong

"However, the new company logo will be blue, white and red, "referring to the French flag" .

Maybe when he does an interview for a British newspaper it will be "....referring to the Union Flag"

Geoff


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## Carl_n_Flo

Logo of new ferry company........as in the French press last week.


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## bognormike

I think it's bizarre that they are considering starting up at the end of the main holiday season, when most people will have already booked or even travelled. I can only think that they will be attempting to grab a big slice of the frieght trade. Cash-flow wise it's going to need a big investment to keep the service running over the off-season, even after the initial fitting out. 

I might be inclined to book a crossing at short notice in the autumn, and would probably get a decent price, but certainly wouldn't try anything until the ships are actually out there & sailing. 

BUT predatory pricing will only bring complaints & referrals to EU competition authorities from P&O and DFDS / LD. It would need to be shown that Eurotunnel are not cross-subsidising as a means of knocking out the competition. And I would be concerned that they have written off loads of debts and shareholders investments over the years and are barely covering costs now, so how do they propose to fund all this? Interesting......


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## nicholsong

Mike

I had some of the same thoughts - especially about cashflow.

But then I thought again and this came out:-

If they are able to cover overheads from freight traffic that will see them through the winter.

They will be a 'up-and-running' company with marketing when booking season starts at Christmas

For the winter they can run on staff for 1 cafe/restaurant and delay further recruitment until Easter - old SeaFrance staff will not need much training.

So maybe starting in Sept. is not completely stupid, especially if backed by Eurotunnel finance.

Cross-subsidy? particularly on borrowing costs? very difficult to prove!

Geoff


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## Ian_n_Suzy

Hi Carl & Flo,

Just a quickie to say thanks for sharing your wealth of information / knowledge on this subject with us. I have just read the full thread and found it most interesting.

CHEERS


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## GEMMY

Latest:

http://www.connexionfrance.com/SeaFrance-Myferrylink-ferry-Channel-14004-view-article.html

tony


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## mikebeaches

GEMMY said:


> Latest:
> http://www.connexionfrance.com/SeaFrance-Myferrylink-ferry-Channel-14004-view-article.html
> tony


Thanks for posting the info, I'd been watching to see when the website would go live but obviously missed it.

Just checked price of a return from Dover to Calais for our 6m van and 2 passengers going out 4 September and back on 24 September - £87.50 (for the hell of it, I also checked to see what an 8m van would cost - same).

Anyway, not a bad price, but only 50p less than I could travel on P&O at the moment, so need to make a decision which operator to use shortly.


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## listerdiesel

There was an item on the BBC the other day, possibly last week, we both watched on the website, showed the new ship's logo etc.

Most of our travels tend to be via Harwich, but should we go that channel route we would use the ferries as the Discovery has LPG fuel which is not allowed through the tunnel.

The BBC presenter said that it was a bit of a bad time for a start-up but didn't make clear who the ultimate owner of the company was, so that has been made clear by the posts on here.

Stena Line and Brittany Ferries are the ones we have used the most, Brittany to Santander and Stena to Hook of Holland, both above reproach on quality and pricing, although Britanny are getting expensive for us on the Plymouth-Santander route.

Peter


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## DTPCHEMICALS

http://www.porttechnology.org/news/my_ferry_link_launches_new_dover_calais_service/

Dave p


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## bognormike

here's the web site

http://www.myferrylink.com/


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## bognormike

just looked for early September and they are asking £43.75 for most crossings, (6.5m van), or £10 extra for an amendable fare, plus £8 to get on & off first. May be worth a short notice crossing, but I still think it's a stupid time to start up :roll: :lol:


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## DTPCHEMICALS

If the service is reduced to less crossings it gives the staff time to bed in for next years rush. 8) 
It also proves to would be passengers that the company is in operation.
Even if the winter service justs breaks even they are there as an alternative.
Competition is good for the consumer.

Dave p


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## bognormike

DTPCHEMICALS said:


> If the service is reduced to less crossings it gives the staff time to bed in for next years rush. 8)
> It also proves to would be passengers that the company is in operation.
> Even if the winter service justs breaks even they are there as an alternative.
> Competition is good for the consumer.
> 
> Dave p


a good point about them actually being there and in business, but I doubt very much that they would be able to break even in the autumn / winter period. Competition is fine if it's a level paying field, and they are not being subsidised from Eurotunnel (who barely make a profit any way!).


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