# Morocco with DD Feb 8th?



## mike800966

Just a quick note to see if anyone else on here is going on the trip?
Due to meet Feb 7th near Algeciras, we are presently near Cadiz enroute via Gib etc

Possible meet up?

Mike & Ann


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## smithies

Mike and Ann,


We are not on the tour, we are already here in Morocco. 8) 8) 


Im pretty sure that DD gives you the option to stay on in Morocco after he has finished the escorted bit(the ferry tickets are open-ended)....if you decide to do this and get as far as Agadir (24 kms north of Agadir on the coast road )...then pop in and have a (well deserved ) drink with us....we are on plot 834 and would love to see you.   

Jenny and Gordon....in the sun...in Agadir !!


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## smithies

Mike and Ann,


We are not on the tour, we are already here in Morocco. 8) 8) 


Im pretty sure that DD gives you the option to stay on in Morocco after he has finished the escorted bit(the ferry tickets are open-ended)....if you decide to do this and get as far as Agadir (24 kms north of Agadir on the coast road )...then pop in and have a (well deserved ) drink with us....we are on plot 834 and would love to see you.   

Jenny and Gordon....in the sun...in Agadir !!


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## mike800966

*Morocco*

Thanks very much for the information, been surprised at the silence and even imagined we were the only ones going!

Knew that wasn't the case but it was odd.

So, the nervousness has now faded, its too late to change anything and the excitement is mounting, almost as much as the first night in a new van or the first trip to france! 
S'pose it wont be long now and we, like you will be saying " Morocco, thats simple!!!

Thanks for the posting, it will be good to get away from the worst of this Spanish wet and windiness. Hopefully we wont need wellies!

Mike & Ann


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## PAT4NEIL

Hi Mike and Ann

We went to Morocco for December and part of January. We had very mixed weather.

I know DD tours had better weather on their last tour (just the luck).

We did need our wellies for the snow near Meknes and around Azrou. I think the weather will only get better.

If you can take some secondhand clothes for the children and even the adults, we were asked constantly for bon bons, alcohol, or clothes. We also took a lot of pens with us.

Have a great time


Pat and Neil


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## hmh

*Morocco*

Hi, 
We went to Morocco last Feb, it was warm and dry, only wet in the North for the first week (mid-Feb).

There is a very good site called www.lemarocencampingcar.com, if you can manage a bit of French.

Everyone now tells you not to give the kids pens, sweets etc. It encourages them to stay away from school and beg.

Second hand clothes on the other hand are much prized by everyone, you can really get rid of all those outdated garments, but they all wear long sleeves and long trousers, even the men and children.

We would occasionally give a boy herding goats some food, but he was undoubtedly herding goats near the tourist road for that reason. If we were on a different type of road, with people walking or catching buses and taxis to work, no-one took any notice of us, there was no begging at all.

We did our own catering and had no tummy trouble etc at all. Avoid green salad, but we bought lots of tomatoes, cucumbers, oranges etc, washed them all well, and were fine. The quality of the fruit and veg. is much better than in Europe in fact. Look for the Moroccan bananas, which are tiny, and much cheaper than imported ones.

In the South they sell lots of different varieties of dried dates. Bread is lovely everywhere, flat loaves, fresh every day. Cheese is almost only imported.

The meat is halal, which means the animal is bled completely, so it is very clean and nice, and kept in fridges, or covered. Another time we would take a small pressure cooker as the lambs obviously walk miles with the flocks, and need quite a lot of cooking, unless they are very tiny.

Gallon containers of bottled water are on sale everywhere, and the tap water is fine for washing, cooking etc. You can only buy alcohol in supermarkets (usually the Marjan chain), and it is dearer than in France, you might want to conceal a few 5 litre plastic containers of wine somewhere.

The supermarkets are not much cheaper than the little roadside shops, but useful for giving you an idea of prices, so you know where you stand when it comes to haggling. If you are going with an organisation like Desert Detours then a lot will be taken care of, but otherwise we found you need to tip the people at the port etc. and 1 euro or 10 dirham seemed to be about the going rate.

I have gone on rather more than I meant to! However, we were so hungry for this sort of info before we went!

Have fun, it is a lovely place!

Helen


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## hilldweller

*Re: Morocco*



mike800966 said:


> Thanks very much for the information, been surprised at the silence and even imagined we were the only ones going!Mike & Ann


We cancelled - I got to thinking about the weather driving down and moved to April. I must say I'm pleased I did at the moment.


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## PAT4NEIL

I think everyones experience in Morocco is different, it is a very personal thing and depends where you go.

We travelled a vary varied path and were amazed at the different scenery.

Unfortunately we did see a lot of begging, and not necessarily on the most tourist routes.

I would also say that the meat was not that great, and although I have had halal meat before, we didnt see much refrigeration and the meat was not always covered, most of the time it was just hanging up. Luckily not many flies about because of the time of the year we travelled.

I also agree about not just giving for the sake of giving. A lot of time we gave to the children to and from school, as they tended to walk miles with their satchels on their back.

We were asked by men quite a lot for alcohol, which we never gave, for a muslim country they do seem to have a problem on the quite.

We did take a lot of frozen meat, and some tinned food, but like Helen I would say the fruit and veg was much better than ours.

I think the fact that you are going on an escorted tour you will be just fine, and you also will have fellow travellers to share your experience. When we went further off the track we were the only motorhome sometimes, or the ocassional french or german motorhomer for company.

Have a great time, I wish it was us going again.

Regards Pat and Neil


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## asprn

mike800966 said:


> Due to meet Feb 7th near Algeciras, we are presently near Cadiz enroute via Gib etc


Have a great trip, and please update us (with pics) when you return. We're booked with Ray for Feb 2011, not long after I retire - WOO HOO.

I'll now spend the rest of today dreaming.



Dougie.


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## Detourer

Hi Mike and Ann
_"Just a quick note to see if anyone else on here is going on the trip?"_
Yes, you are not alone. In fact the tour is fully booked. Some of the others are down here already!
As many members as MHF has it in fact accounts for only a small number of our clients although there are [I think] a couple on your tour.

Hi Jenny and Gordon
Yes we include open end return tickets for the tour. Some solo's should be aware that return tickets that were sold by you know who near Algerciras Lidl do in fact have a short return date when bar-code scanned.

Hi Pat and Neil
Yes we had great weather on the last 2008 tour. I fact I can't remember any rain on any of last years trips.......but we do use all the knowledge and contacts we have to divert if needed. On the just finished Jan tour we had some spectacular weather, including a sandstorm at the dunes and were the first to cross the Tizzi n Tichka Pass, after it had been closed for 3 days, by falling in behind the snow ploughs and blowers. But again no rain and mostly bright and sunny.

Hi Dougie and Brian
Look forward to meeting you in the future.............

And of course Chris and Annie [ceejayt]
Many thanks for the kind comments..........We do try very hard. And the emailed pictures were great. I am sure many on here would be interested if you post the link.

Ray


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## Les-Wonderers

Morocco is a great and very safe country to visit with a motorhome but our mistake was going with Desert Detours. This company may have been good in the past when they took very small group but not now as most of us on the tour felt that Desert Detours did not live up to their promises. We paid Desert Detours 1,940 Euros per couple but calculate that if we had done the same tour on our own it would have cost each couple together less then 270 Euros for the same items paid for by Desert Detours. 

VirariousBooks.co.uk publish a great book “Camping Morocco” that provides practically all the information required for touring Morocco, certainly better then that given by Desert Detours. Over 150,000 motorhomes go to Morocco each year, mainly French but a considerable number from the UK travelling independently. You do not need to go with an organised tour; Moroccan people are friendly and very helpful with plenty of policemen about to ask directions if required.

Costs paid by Desert Detours – Ferry 134 Euros (return Algeciras / Ceuta for motorhome & two adults); Campsites 93 Euros (all those used are in the “Camping Morocco” book and cost taken from that book, yes campsites are cheap in Morocco but not of a great standard); Meals about 37 Euros per couple (Ray provided 3 meals, one in Merzouga that was reasonable; a paella cooked by Francisco with little ingredients for the 40+ persons apart from rice; and a piece offering meal at Essouira, I had a piece of dried up fish); Guardians max of 2 Euros (campsites in Morocco include guardians); Museums fees - zero (as Ray did not include any in our tour). Total cost 266 Euros yet we paid Desert Detours 1940 Euros. All the restaurants we were taken to by Ray were all very expensive by Moroccan standards; we often pay less in France and Spain. 

The tour that we were taken on was the ‘Classic Moroccan Tour’ which can be found detailed in many travel books on Morocco and the internet.

Ray’s had two Europeans assistants, Steve and Francisco, but both were without previous touring experience of Morocco and of motorhomes leaving us totally dependant on Hammid as Ray himself spoke only English. 

Regarding Ray we found him to have a quick tamper and at times he was very unpleasant to quite a number on our tour. Even Debbie Ray’s wife had warned Francisco of Ray’s temper before leaving on the trip. One client of Desert Detours had to cancel his trip with our tour after paying the deposit due to his wife being diagnosed with terminal cancer but Ray refused to reimburse him his deposit. 

Ray included horror stories at each of his daily briefings which we felt were included to justify our reason for travelling with him, strange how many 1000’s of others tour Morocco independently without incidents. A number of independent British motorhome travellers we met during our tour said that they had had zero problems interring Morocco or during their travels. Ray appeared to care more for his dog, which went on the tour, then his clients. All these views on Desert Detours were talked about between us and even his assistants during the tour. When the tour departed Essouira and headed back to Spain one of our group was left stranded in Essouira due to a mechanical breakdown.

Anyway had a great holiday but should not have gone with Desert Detours.

Beware – Desert Detours are also using this site to post anonymous great reviews about themselves. IP address location being in the Malaga area of Spain, home of Debbie and Ray.


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## nukeadmin

> Beware - Desert Detours are also using this site to post anonymous great reviews about themselves. IP address location being in the Malaga area of Spain, home of Debbie and Ray.


I assure you if this were the case the mods or I would have noted it, its a fairly harsh statement to make, what evidence do you have of that as only myself and the mods can see IP addresses ?

As for the remainder of above, as with all escorted tours it is always cheaper to do it by yourself, but then if anything does go wrong and you are miles away from anyone and with no mobile signal coverage then that extra fee might then seem justified 

I have met Ray on a few occasions and so can speak with experience, he never seemed a man of temper to me, his love for arab culture is apparent and he has been doing the tour business for years and has a depth of experience that not many have


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## asprn

Les-Wonderers said:


> Even Debbie Ray's wife had warned Francisco of Ray's temper before leaving on the trip


You just can't go wrong with hearsay, can you. :roll: Please.



Les-Wonderers said:


> One client of Desert Detours had to cancel his trip with our tour after paying the deposit due to his wife being diagnosed with terminal cancer but Ray refused to reimburse him his deposit


And again. Or have you spoken directly to this person, and that's what he told you? I doubt it, given their having to cancel and presumably not turning up. So it can only ever be, "I UNDERSTAND THAT one client of Desert Detours had to cancel his trip ......" which of course reduces your point to further unsubstantiated hearsay.



Les-Wonderers said:


> When the tour departed Essouira and headed back to Spain one of our group was left stranded in Essouira due to a mechanical breakdown


And what were you told in the 50-odd page FAQ sheet, and undoubtedly during the tour as well? That everyone is free to travel back with Ray, or make their own way back, or stay on. You seem to imply that the person concerned was knowingly left stranded with a broken-down motorhome. That's quite a serious matter. Is that what you are saying?



Les-Wonderers said:


> Beware - Desert Detours are also using this site to post anonymous great reviews about themselves. IP address location being in the Malaga area of Spain, home of Debbie and Ray.


You're quite good at seemingly posting balanced accounts which of course you're perfectly entitled to do. I'm booked on a tour so I'm always interested to hear others' experiences; if you think the tour is not worth the money, then just say so, but slipping in nasty little rumours and innuendos which of course you can never substantiate, leaves me with the opinion that you've undermined your apparently-balanced account to the extent that I think you're an articulate but rather bitter sort, and I never like that combination.

For your interest (possibly), I was in the Malaga area recently for four weeks and returned at the weekend. I posted a few things from there on the Shoot-Detours-Up thread in response to some mindless comments, so it could have been me. I know at least two other members who also contributed that thread who were also in the area at the time of posting. So how about engaging your brain a little bit and produce some evidence before jumping to convenient conclusions to back up your accusations (and anyway, you can't see posters' IP addresses)?

Dougie.

*FOOTNOTE:-* How about providing your name? I see this is your first post, so taking up your own point about spoof members, how about showing your bona-fides a bit more?


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## mota-oma

[quote="nukeadmin

I have met Ray on a few occasions and so can speak with experience, he never seemed a man of temper to me, his love for arab culture is apparent and he has been doing the tour business for years and has a depth of experience that not many have[/quote]....................................................'

But have you been on a trip to experience this first hand Nuke ?


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## nukeadmin

Nope never been on a tour, just giving my 1st hand impression of him


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## asprn

mota-oma said:


> But have you been on a trip to experience this first hand Nuke ?


Have you?

Nuke's met Ray. He liked him. I've met Ray. I liked him. The OP has met Ray. He apparently did not. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and to express it. What they're not entitled to do is make unsubstantiated and cheap allegations against someone with whom they have not had a good experience. I take no issue with the OP's opinions about his experiences on the tour - he's entitled to give them. I take issue with his use of hearsay ("She told me that he said that he'd heard it say that....") which is simply rumour and malicious implication. I'll say it again. How is the OP able to make his assertions about Ray using spoof posts to promote his business, based on similar IP addresses? They're not visible except to the site admin and mods.

Don't fall for the innuendo. If there is to be a discussions about the OP's opinions, let them be about his experiences, and not the other cr*p.

Dougie.


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## mota-oma

[quote="asprn .... Have you? [/quote]
Dougie.[/quote]

Yes, I have, thanks.

Mary


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## asprn

Thanks for that - that means you're qualified to take part in the discussion. Putting aside the crud, what's your opinion?

Dougie.


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## asprn

As a matter of interest, I've recalled a previous similar thread being started by someone who felt they had an axe to grind against Ray.

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopicp-337217.html#337217

At least I'm consistent in my responses. :roll: (and to be fair to the person concerned, so is he  )

Dougie.


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## mota-oma

Dougie, 

I also replied in that post and think that I put my point over to all concerned. 

I also feel that I was very fair and therefore do not have any further comment to make.

Mary


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## asprn

mota-oma said:


> I also replied in that post and think that I put my point over to all concerned


Hi Mary,
I would agree with that.



mota-oma said:


> I also feel that I was very fair and therefore do not have any further comment to make


There was still an apparent implication in your "Have you met him" question to Dave above, which could/can be taken to be a comment.

Dougie.


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## olley

Hi I booked and paid a deposit for a trip with DD in 08, I had to cancel near to the set off date, Its a non-refundable deposit, (what part of non-refundable didn't the people understand?) so I expected to lose it, but DD offered to hold my deposit until I was able to go at a later time.

Olley


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## asprn

olley said:


> Hi I booked and paid a deposit for a trip with DD in 08,


So did our friends whose van broke down on Christmas Eve in Genoa just before sailing to Morocco to start their trip. The van took 8 days to have a new gearbox fitted, so they cancelled. They've re-booked for next year with no loss of deposit, despite the T&Cs saying otherwise.

I'm seriously bored with this now. It's just yet another stirrer-thread, so I'll not give it any more oxygen.

As someone used to say.....

<click>


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## kennyboy

Dougie, so glad that you have decided to "be seriously bored with this" :!: 

Ken


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## mota-oma

[quote........................There was still an apparent implication in your "Have you met him" question to Dave above, which could/can be taken to be a comment.

Dougie.[/quote]

Dougie,

Just feel I must reply to the above quote...........'Have you met him'.

This was NOT my question - my question was asking if Dave (Nuke) had been on a DD trip. Dave answered this question for me.

This is just to keep the facts correct.

Mary


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## TinaGlenn

We went on a DD trip in April 2008 and had a great time, we had some rather interesting people on our trip and never once did we see any sign of a temper in Ray, despite a few other people on our tour voicing an opinion or three.
In fact we had such a good time we are getting ready to go on another tour with Ray next month.

Yes it is a lot of money to pay out, but for us it is worth it as we wouldn't be brave enough to go so far off the beaten track and explore on our own. We also enjoyed the company of travelling in a group and meeting some great people. 

Everyone has the choice to do things how they want, some tour with groups and some on their own.

I seem to remember another post very similar to this a couple of months before we went away last time. Another first post by someone who never posted anything again. It's sad when people hide behind a forum to voice a grudge annonymously


Tina
Busy getting ready for her nice DD trip :wink:


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## AndrewandShirley

Just to add our two penny worth.

Late last year with just days to go, we broke down en route to meet up with a tour. We advised Ray and Debbie that the fault with our van was terminal and we would not be able to attend. Instead we made a very slow trip back to England.

They were nothing but helpful. We offered of course to pay the balance in full but they offered instead to transfer us to another tour. This we gladly accepted.

Aboard our new van we are now looking forward to thanking them in person for their kind helpfulness and are now looking forward to enjoying the tour.


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## navman

There does appear to be a few posts that pop up now and again having a pop at Ray and Debbie.... Often relatively new members too.

As one who has been on one DD’s trips I would like to add my two penny worth. We found Ray and Debbie to be great hosts and the knowledge that Ray in particular has for Morocco is superb. I never once saw or heard of him losing his temper. His sense of humour was very similar to mine ï�Š. We enjoyed their company. 

Both Ray and Debbie always had time for all the tour members, including my partners two girls ( 6 and 8 at the time), who took to them both very quickly. Often the girls would be found sat at the camp site with Ray or Debbie just talking and laughing. 

As has been said it would be cheaper to travel around Morocco on your own but I doubt you would have as much fun as our group did.

I guess the litmus test is ‘would we, having been with DD already, go with them again. The answer is quite definitely yes. Not because I want my hand holding all the time (I am quite used to sorting other people’s problems out so have little worry about sorting my own out) but because we think the tour fits our needs and Ray is our kind of bloke with our kind of sense of humour.


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## AutoMax

I actually don't care about the cost, reached a point in my life (possibly too early) that life is more important than wealth. I am going on the wedding tour and I feel privlaged to be going on what to us will be a once in a lifetime, unique event.
I also have never met Ray or Debbie but from the email correspondence I have had with them they both appear friendly, humorous and helpful.
I am sure that we will have a great time and leave the tour making new friends and having some great experiences. 
Some time you just have to put your trust in someone on the balance of the evidence presented and the evidence is heavily weighed in their favour.

Bob and Sal

SHADO 1


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## ceejayt

Well, I have a post earlier on this thread - about a year ago now, saying what a fantastic time we had on our DD trip. I guess every trip is different and tours have lots of shall we say 'different' characters on them. Ray and Debbiie were great and we also had to cancel initially because one of our daughters decided to give birth when we would have been away. There was no hesitation from Ray and Debbie in transferring our deposit to another tour. Ray also arranged secure storage for our motorhome in Spain and we went out with him and Debbie a couple of times near their home.
I have no doubt that 'what you see is what you get' with Ray - he calls a spade a spade but he has a great sense of humour. If you don't realise you could do it cheaper by doing it yourself then you are being crass. Look at the cost of the GB Privileges tours. Many people will take the tour just because they want to be with other people, not because they are too scared to go on their own - sometimes it's nice to make new friends and get outside of your personal bubble. These people have to make a living which includes the upkeep on expensive vehicles. Personally, I really like Ray and Debbie and don't like to see people having a one off pop at them in a public forum. I see nothing which could not have been said to their faces without involving who knows how many people in what should be a client customer conversation.


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## asprn

mota-oma said:


> This was NOT my question - my question was asking if Dave (Nuke) had been on a DD trip


You're quite right, and I'm happy to acknowledge my error. My apologies.



kennyboy said:


> Dougie, so glad that you have decided to "be seriously bored with this" :!:


I'm sure you are. I can quite understand why you won't want people to be reminded of your previous attacks on Ray:-

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopicp-335953.html#335953
http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopicp-336378.html#336378

Just for you, here's my specially-adapted song (to the tune of the Londonderry Air):-

*Oh Kennyboy, the gripes, the gripes are calling
From thread to thread, your bitter views shine bright;
The topic's gone, and all the readers dying
'Tis us, 'tis us that's wrong and you are right.

But come ye back when facts have been presented
Or when the thread has hushed and gone away;
'Tis then your special vitriol's resented
Oh Kennyboy, oh Kennyboy, you bore me so.*

Dougie. x


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## Sonesta

We toured Morocco independently in Nov/Dec 2005 and during the lead up to our trip I posted many topics on the forum with various queries and questions relating to travelling around Morocco. Ray (Detourer) was so helpful and responded both on the forum and through private messages and the length he went to in order to advise and assist us was very much appreciated by both my husband and myself. In fact, Ray was taking a group over around the same time as we were due to travel over and he kindly invited us to meet up with him and his group so that we could make the crossing with them! He offered to sort out all the paperwork for us at the border and as we were towing our Smart car across with us too, Ray felt the crossing procedure may be somewhat confusing for us. 

We decided to take up Ray's kind offer of help and we met up with Ray and his tour group in a large restaurant car park near Algeciras and stopped there over night with them all. We enjoyed a wonderful evening in the restaurant with everyone and it was very exciting sitting there chatting with likeminded people about theirs and our proposed travels and plans. We found Ray to be an incredibly witty and fantastic character and he was one of those people you meet in life who you just immediately warm towards and like! The following day we tagged on to the group to catch the ferry across to Morocco with them all. 

Once off the ferry we followed them to the border and oh how glad we had Ray to turn to! The Moroccan border control seemed utter chaos to us and I think we would have been quite intimidated by all the mayhem and confusion had we had to sort it all out for ourselves. Ray took our documents etc and kindly did all the talking and my husband just followed him like a lost sheep! I tell you, we will be eternally grateful to Ray for taking the time to help us out like he did, especially when he had enough on his plate looking after his own group. Once through the border control we followed Ray and his group to their first night stopover and again, we were invited to join them all for a evening meal in the restaurant adjacent to the spot where we were parked up for the night. As it was the end of Ramadam, the restaurant threw a special celebration meal and oh what an incredible banquet it turned out to be - and despite not being part of the tour group we were both made very welcome. The next morning we travelled a short distance with Ray and his group before we parted to go off on our independent travels around Morocco and as we bid Ray farewell, we both had a lump in our throats at having to say our goodbyes to an incredibly lovely and charming guy! 

Ray did not have to put himself out like he did to help us and there was no monetary gain for him in doing so and the Ray we met was one of the characters in life that you always remember with warmth and affection. He offered us tips and advice that no guide book could ever offer and he and his Moroccan assistant bent over backwards to suggest routes and places of interest we should visit during our trip and they even gave us their mobile numbers in case we ever needed their help for any reason. 

Personally, I cannot praise Ray enough and when someone joins a forum and their first post is to specifically bad mouth a company or an individual, then I'm sorry but I cannot help feeling somewhat suspicious! 

Sue


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## kennyboy

Dougie Dougie, who is talking vitriol now?   
That was definitively nasty and venomous  

I am very sorry that we did not enjoy our trip with Ray the second time we went. And yes we were very fed up at the time and felt we should let people know. Obviously it was a very big mistake.
In view of all the pms that I have had concerning DD we are not the only ones but I was one of the very few idiots brave enough to say it on the forum.
Ray has a very loyal fan base, good for him, he must be very glad to have you in his camp!!!
Please don't spend too much time feeling mad about me it is not good for your health.

Ken


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## asprn

kennyboy said:


> Dougie Dougie, who is talking vitriol now?
> That was definitively nasty and venomous


I thought it was poetic.

Truthfully, I'm not in his camp at all. I'm always interested - genuinely - in other people's experiences and opinions, including when they don't concur with mine. Given that I'm shelling out a decent wedge of my hard-earned on the trip, I'm all ears when it comes to others' accounts who've been there. What IMHO disqualifies accounts such as the one the OP has posted, is when they descend into something else. And as I've said several times, hearsay and unsubstantiated accusations simply devalue what's being said rather than constructive - including negative - comments, which if put accurately, will always interest me (and I daresay many others). I'm not defending Ray Smith. I'm challenging pointless and petty frills.

And I'm not mad at all.  Leastways, not in the way you meant it.

Dougie.


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## navman

And Dougie, you will be a little more sane next year once retired from the Job mate.....


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## Sonesta

Hi Kenny,

I do not think it is that Ray has a very loyal fan base but more that people speak as they find! Obviously, those who have met him or have been on one of his Moroccan tours and found both himself and the Tour that they've paid for, to be a positive experience, are not then going to post a negative post on the forum. They will understandably submit a post that shows Ray or his Tour in a positive and favourable light. By the same token; anyone who has reason to complain or be disappointed with Ray or DD will feel inclined to tell a totally different story and of course that too, providing it is based on fact and their actual personal experience, is just as valid and fair.

I am sorry your experience of DD wasn't a satisfied one and I hope that despite your obvious disapointment, you still found Morocco a fascinating country? We loved our trip and returned full of wonderful memories of our adventures and we yearn to return but unfortunately, our 2 little dogs mean a trip to Morocco is not possible unless we put them into Spanish kennels, which rightly or wrongly, we are reluctant to do!

Sue


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## asprn

navman said:


> And Dougie, you will be a little more sane next year once retired from the Job mate.....


Oh, it's a lot sooner than that. 

Dougie.


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## navman

asprn said:


> navman said:
> 
> 
> 
> And Dougie, you will be a little more sane next year once retired from the Job mate.....
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, it's a lot sooner than that.
> 
> Dougie.
Click to expand...

Good man... 

There is, as I am sure you are aware, life after the Job


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## asprn

navman said:


> There is, as I am sure you are aware, life after the Job


Even if there's not, it'll still be better. :lol:


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## Forestboy

We went to Morocco with DD a few years ago and had a fantastic trip and wouldn't hesitate to travel with them again. We spent a couple of days with Ray & Debbie went out with them and even went to dinner at their home and they were charming and generous hosts. We traveled in a 36ft American Rv which didn't worry Ray one bit he just dealt with any issues. He did everything that was asked of him he even took my wife and a friend into a street that made hand made garments and negotiated for them as the locals refused to deal with women, mind you the amount they spent I wish he hadn't.

We are not the type who need nurse-maiding as we have traveled extensively on 4 continents and 40 plus countries We travel on our own using motorhomes and motorbikes but sometimes like too share experiences with others and meet like minded people so occasionally travel with a group. Our trip with DD was one of these occasions and was a fantastic experience. As for cost it always seems expensive if nothing goes wrong and of course you can do it cheaper on your own but if that's what you want why book with DD in the first place.


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## Sonesta

Strange how the original poster has not made any further posts isn't it and it certainly makes question his motives and sincerity?
Call me suspicious minded but he/she could be from a rival Escorted Tour Company hoping to bring bad publicity to DD or even someone with a grudge for some reason? I apologise for jumping to such an alarming conclusion but when a new member posts and then seems to disappear into cyper space it does make you wonder?

Sue


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## asprn

Sonesta said:


> Call me suspicious


Why - you.... you.... suspicious thing, you...... 



Sonesta said:


> I apologise for jumping to such an alarming conclusion


I should jolly well think so. My alarm has never been so alarmed. 8O

Dougie.

(You're such a sweetie  )


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## kennyboy

It could also be that whoever posted got scared by the less than friendly answers he got  
that might have deterred him from becoming a member.
But I am sure that most people will be saying "good riddance" to troublesome posters.

Ken


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## Sonesta

Hi Kennyboy, 

I think if the poster is genuine he/she will speak out as I certainly didn't get the impression after reading their first post, that they are the type of person who is afraid to speak their mind and tell people exactly what is bothering them! In fact I would say he/she came across as being more than capable of defending themselves and fighting their own corner! 

I think most members on MHF welcome new members and if they have an axe to grind for any reason, then I am sure most members would sympathise with most peoples position, even if their own experiences of the same matter is not a negative one! I know I do and even if I do not share their opinions or outlook, I always try to look at a situation from all sides and ask myself how I would feel if the boot were on the other foot? But when a new member posts their first post, has a good old chew, then fails to respond to any replies, I personally cannot help but detect something very slightly fishy! I hope I'm proved wrong as I prefer to think the world is full of nice people but something just doesn't add up to me!

All the best.

Sue


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## hmh

*Posting re Morocco with DD*

We ran organised holidays for 25 years in France. When someone's trip goes pear-shaped for whatever reason, they look for someone to blame - the nearest person is your tour organiser/leader. It is so easy to diss, isn't it? But it feels very unfair when you have done your job well for years and someone puts the boot in.

Fortunately in this case pretty well everyone else on this Forum has praised DD to the skies. Everyone is human, maybe they weren't perfect on this occasion, but the weight of opinion would seem to be largely that they are a good and reliable outfit.

Over the years we had, as an example, clients whose ferry at Newhaven got tied up with its tow-rope, so was 6 hours late, they then tried to sleep on the station platform in Paris, were kicked off in the early hours of the morning, paid for a hotel there anyway, arrived in the rain, their tent leaked and their son's sleeping bag got wet at the toe, their relationship was new and not standing up to the strain - they wanted a full refund from us and , from memory, £1500 compensation for the leaky tent . . .

Another couple skidded into a rock wall in torrential rain and wrote off their car, as they arrived in a small French town at the start of a walking holiday. They had to pile all their holiday gear in a heap in the hotel's garage, the wife was quite frankly in shock. The weather was obviously far from ideal, which never helps. They fell out with the hotel chef who gave them a lift when he moved their suitcases the following morning - he was an awkward cuss himself, as it happens, but they wrote to the tour operator about it for years, and took him to court . . .

It does give you a few stories to dine out on, as you see . . .

Helen


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## Zebedee

Moderator Note.

I have just kicked Les Wonderers off this topic for blatant abuse of the forum.

He/she has copied exactly the same inflammatory post in four different forums at once in a blatant and concerted attack on Desert Detours. (The duplicates have been removed.)

This will not be tolerated, and the Admin Staff will be discussing what further action may be deemed appropriate.

Zebedee
Moderating Team


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## asprn

Nice one Dave. Once again, malice overplays its hand. Sign up for your five free posts, don your Anonymity helmet, spray spurious allegations which are as watertight as a colander, and run.

I'm sure you'll have compared IPs in view of the today's latest and greatest. :roll:

Dougie.


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## asprn

*EDITED - previous request removed*

Forget it.  All sorted, thanks.

Dougie.


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## Sgt411

In view of the positive comments on these posts my wife and I have booked DD for the February 2011 tour. I must say that all my dealings with Ray and, in particular, Debbie, have been very friendly and constructive. The icing on the cake is the £38 return fare with Norfolk Lines. Looking forward to meeting Dougie.

Keith


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## asprn

Sgt411 said:


> The icing on the cake is the £38 return fare with Norfolk Lines. Looking forward to meeting Dougie.


Surely you mean, "The icing on the cake is meeting Dougie. Looking forward to the £38 return fare with Norfolk Lines."

Dougie.


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## Sgt411

Of course ! Sorry Dougie :roll: 

Keith


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