# Autotrail Safety Power Cut Off



## SineadandTony (Jul 22, 2009)

We have recently purchased a 08 reg Arapaho. The only major issue we have found thus far is that as soon as you turn on the ignition all the power (lighting, 12V power etc) is switched off by "System Disabled Engine Started". While I understand that this is a standard safety feature I just wondered if there is a way to bypass this feature. . . it can be quiet difficult to keep kids entertained while driving if they cant watch a DVD or play a computer game.

Any information would be greatly appreciated


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## CliveMott (Mar 10, 2008)

Interestingly many European vans don,t have this interlock. Autotrail (amongst others in the UK) have been fitting this interlock at least as far back as 1997 when we bought our Scout. It was a nuisance then.
The logic is that if the leisure electrics are disconnected from the vehicle electrics while driving then there is no way any problems (EMC for example) within the leisure circuits can influence the base vehicle electrics.
But when I disconnected and provided a by-pass for the "habitation" relay the next problem was that the fluid level sensors in the tanks which were now working would operate when the brakes were applied or one cornered setting off the alarm for a full grey water tank. So I had to use the contacts of the habitation relay to turn OFF the alarm. Then it was OK.

But I could not possibly advise you to do the same!


C.


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

From my research it appears as if it is a requirement for registration as an approved vehicle for the National Caravan Council.

http://tinyurl.com/yhahppf

The NCC sets the standards which all UK manufacturers have to comply with for approval. It far exceeds the regulatory requirements as is explained on the website.

http://www.nationalcaravan.co.uk/home/index.asp

Vehicles built outside the UK do not have to comply with NCC guidelines but only the regulatory ones.

Similar guidelines apply to caravans and one can understand the restrictions of no 12v in the rear of a towed caravan but they seem a little illogical for a motorhome which MAY have approved passenger seats in the rear, without even being able to have a light on.

I also wonder how devices such as the Truma Secumotion regulator which allows the use of gas heating while underway, would, or even could, work if there is no 12v to the boiler.......

It is worth a read of the NCC details but I can offer no other suggestion.

Dave


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

A recent thread regarding the same topic.

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopict-78490-.html


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## geordie01 (Apr 20, 2006)

i fitted an inverter wired to the the lesuire battery to allow use of 240 volt items when we are driving


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## Chascass (May 10, 2007)

I agree it is annoying not to have this option, but if asked when would I use it I would be hard pressed to think of a occasion, I think it's a case of if it's possible I want it.

Charlie


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## CliveMott (Mar 10, 2008)

Try driving up the motorway at night with the wife taking a comfort break in the little room whilst en route. No light and it won,t flush? And why not? Its commonplace on coaches and passengers are advised of the "facility" when they get on a long distance coach. Then on coaches there is frequently the drinks making facility which is used en route. Biscuits if you are lucky.
None of these activities involve the driver in anything other than maintaining smooth progress. So what's the difference?


Or

"Can you go and get my slippers, I need to get these boots off!

Or

Children get bored so want to play with some game on the table in the rear. Seat belted yes but in the dark no.

Airport link coaches even provide free on-board WiFi so perhaps the passengers want to use the dongle and get on-line.

So draw parallels with that allowed and commonplace with long distance coach travel and the restrictions imposed by self appointed trade but non legal bodies look overbearing.

C.


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## Chascass (May 10, 2007)

Yes Clive I can see a big advantage of lights etc if you have children on board, that is why I spoke of my personal requirements balanced against changing something that is contrary to the regulations.

Charlie


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## SineadandTony (Jul 22, 2009)

*autotrail safety power cut off*

Thanks for all the replies. Just had a look at the other thread

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopict-78490-.html

Unfortunately there isn't any simple solution on there either although Mr Plodd says that you only have to disconnect one wire . . . but he doesn't know which one and David32 says he is getting the feature disconnected at a cost of £150
Seems a lot to pay for disconnecting one wire!!!!!

I am going to contact my local dealer tomorrow and get him to put me in touch with his Auto-Electrician. I will report back with any further information as soon as I get it

Tony. (Sinead's Husband)


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## skiboycey (May 21, 2009)

I sent this reply earlier to a PM from Sinead. I've put it here for anybody else interested...

______________________

Hi

I posted a fair few photos of the modification on the forum a while ago. It is on a separate thread - this one...

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopict-69333-.html

This gives nice clear instructions for what is a very simple job. The unit looks very much like it was actually designed to run with the habitation electrics permanently on and that they've actually modified it to shut them off with the engine running.

I put the switch on my unit as sometimes it's useful to shut the electrics off automatically so that the lights go out when you start the engine. In any case you can have it both ways with my re-design. The switch doesn't affect the charging of the leisure batteries at all. It merely runs the permanent 12volt supply to the switched circuits thus defeating the cut-off system. The switched and permanent supplies are actually the same thing it's just the switched one has a relay cutting it off when the engine's started.

The modification is not perfect. For example you have to go and switch the unit back on again each time you stop the engine as it defaults to 'off' when the engine is started and some things still don't work as I couldn't be bothered to re-wire them as all I really wanted was to be able to sit with the lights on if battery charging from the engine and to not have to re-boot the satellite system if moving the van a few feet. This all works fine but, for example, the power to the ignition on the cooker still goes out meaning you can't have a cuppa unless you have a box of matches to light it! This would be an easy re-wire but I was happy with it how I got it for what I wanted to do.

When adding an inverter you'll find that the 240volt and 12volt sides of the system are completely separated. If you want to run an inverter it would be very easy to have a two way switch diverting all the onboard 240volt wiring to either the inverter or the mains input so you could use the exisiting plugs and 240volt lights running from the inverter if you wanted to. As I converted everything in my van to 12volts including satellite system, phone chargers and even my laptop I didn't need to do this. It's an easy job if you're practical, though.

Have a look at the other post and let me know if you need any more info...

Good luck, cheers, Mark


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

CliveMott said:


> Try driving up the motorway at night with the wife taking a comfort break in the little room whilst en route. No light and it won,t flush? And why not? Its commonplace on coaches and passengers are advised of the "facility" when they get on a long distance coach. Then on coaches there is frequently the drinks making facility which is used en route. Biscuits if you are lucky.
> None of these activities involve the driver in anything other than maintaining smooth progress. So what's the difference?
> 
> Or
> ...


Thanks for that Clive, I agree, we do get up and go for a comfort break etc., although not making a cup of tea.

I just wondered what seatbelt law would say about someone leaving a belted seat to do so. I always assumed coaches had different laws applied to them, last time I was on one it had no seat belts. Any idea, Alan.


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## CliveMott (Mar 10, 2008)

I believe that seat belts on coaches now are mandatory, as is the wearing of them. There may be a let out for old coaches though.

I don,t think that the habitation relay requirement in the UK is law either, just something that UK local manufacturers groups have agreed as a simple way of ensuring EMC compliance.

No doubt someone will come up with the statute number and make me look like a plonker!

C.


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## Mrplodd (Mar 4, 2008)

The law requires you to wear a seat belt "when seated" in a coach. 

How else are you going to get to the onboard toilet ???


Now I have the slightly older Sagent PSU 2007 (I think thats right) and I have seen somewhere that it is merely a case of having to remove a single wire from the back of the control panel to disable this function.

Can someone please advise me on here (or PM me??) 

On the strict understanding that it is for "information only" of course :wink:


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Mr. Plodd said, 

"The law requires you to wear a seat belt "when seated" in a coach. 

How else are you going to get to the onboard toilet ???" 

Is it safe to assume that this would also apply in a motorhome, not that it happens often but it has happened and I wondered what the position was. Thanks, Alan.


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## neilbes (Oct 16, 2006)

Why not run a 12volt extension lead from the cab?

like this


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