# How can I charge my leisure battery without hook-up?



## cole

Hi,

I am going away soon for 4 nights wild camping. I planned on buying a honda generator but after looking at what it will run it seems a little expensive. If I wanted it to run my heating system, a tv and maybe a fridge the EU20i still wouldnt be enough apparantly. Are there any other options to charge my leisure battery without buying a generator? We will not have access to hook up for the whole trip.
We have a swift Voyager 695 if that helps....


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## DABurleigh

I'm sorry but I don't know your van. If no-one comes along who does, perhaps you would say what batteries and heating system you have, why you think you can't last 4 nights and why even a 2kW genny is apparently not man enough even if you have rejected buying one anyway.

Will you be staying put or moving the van over the 4 days?

Once these things are clear, then clear recommendations can be made for your situation.

Dave


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## barryd

You dont state what battery setup you have or if you are going to be static for 4 days. I have one 110amp battery and if its fully charged before I go then 4 days wild camping without hookup is not a problem. If you are going to drive the van for an hour or so when your away then that will top up the battery.

I did three months last summer with only the odd hookup and because we were moving every couple of days the battery stayed charged.

I think you should be ok.


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## cole

Im afraid I dont know about the heating system and battery as I just turn on the heating when i need it and let the engine charge up the leisure battery. I am not a technical lady im afraid, thats why i seek help on this forum! 
The books containing this information are in the motorhome in storage at the moment. I have tried googling it without any joy sorry. 
The reason i say the EU20i would not do the job is a man at a hire shop said for a motorhome I would need a generator of about 3500w.... My hairdryer is 2000w and im assuming things like a tv is around 250w?? So I may be wrong but wouldnt it only power my hairdryer? For nearly a grand I think i would rather not wash my hair :lol: 
We would be static for the 4 nights, only making the odd trip of a couple of miles. 
The reason I say the leisure battery wont last 4 nights is from experience of attempting this. It lasts one night tops. Does this mean maybe we should buy a new battery? If we did would it last 4 nights? We would need to run a tv, heating, fridge and charge a mobile phone? If so, can you recommend a top class leisure battery?


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## randonneur

cole said:


> Im afraid I dont know about the heating system and battery as I just turn on the heating when i need it and let the engine charge up the leisure battery. I am not a technical lady im afraid, thats why i seek help on this forum!
> The books containing this information are in the motorhome in storage at the moment. I have tried googling it without any joy sorry.
> The reason i say the EU20i would not do the job is a man at a hire shop said for a motorhome I would need a generator of about 3500w.... My hairdryer is 2000w and im assuming things like a tv is around 250w?? So I may be wrong but wouldnt it only power my hairdryer? For nearly a grand I think i would rather not wash my hair :lol:
> We would be static for the 4 nights, only making the odd trip of a couple of miles.
> The reason I say the leisure battery wont last 4 nights is from experience of attempting this. It lasts one night tops. Does this mean maybe we should buy a new battery? If we did would it last 4 nights? We would need to run a tv, heating, fridge and charge a mobile phone? If so, can you recommend a top class leisure battery?


What is it with women and hairdryers? I am a woman and I let my hair dry naturally when not on hookup and then use a gas hot brush.

We run a 15" LCD TV/DVD combo with Satellite receiver. We have used it for 5 hours plus at any one time, this is also used via a 300 watt inverter.

We turn the gas heating on when necessary.

The fridge runs on Gas with 12v ignition.

The mobile phone is charged up when travelling only unless on hookup.

We only have a 90AH battery and had no problems.

This last year we have had a solar panel fitted and during our trip to Portugal this last Winter worked well.


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## cole

I take pride in my appearance and dont feel comfortable with a big tatty head sorry!! It would take hours for my hair to dry naturally and certainly wouldnt be curling it :? Surely this is irrelevant to the problem?? We do not have an invertor fitted.

Any advice would be much appreciated minus the critism


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## DABurleigh

Cole,

As you didn't mention a hair drier in your OP I am unclear whether or not this is a requirement!

If you insist on running a 2kW hair drier for 10 mins or so a day or every other day then I still think in practice you will be on the limit of the possible with engine running AND a more substantial battery bank than you have AND and a large pure sine-wave inverter. Or a very large and heavy generator.

There is no substitute for understanding the rudimentaries of power and energy! 

Dave


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## cole

Any chance of a translation??


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## DABurleigh

Of course, though it would be helpful to know which bit(s)


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## erneboy

Buy an extra leisure battery a travel hair dryer an inverter which will run it and a 1 kw generator. I think this will work for you.

As DAB said the correct way to do this is add up your power demands and set that against your ability to recharge the batteries, Alan.


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## cole

As you may have gathered, I know absolutely nothing about this topic! That is why I am asking the questions... It is not a case of insisting on using a hairdryer, it is a case of having too. I have very long hair and really do not see another option except for being a greasy headed dirtbag, which again is not an an option.
The question I am asking is :

If i buy a new leisure battery and a charger, should it last 4 nights powering the items i have mentioned?

Also, how would i stop the battery going flat and keep a steady charge when it is at the storage for sometimes upto 2 months without use?

A non-technical answer would benefit  I thought this was supposed to be a friendly forum? :wink:


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## gnscloz

hi cole,
there are several experts on here concerning electricty (not me tho  ) but they need basic information how many leisure batteries and size is vital, i assume you have a inverter for hairdrier? without this basic information any advice is a mere guess,


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## cole

Hiya,
Thanks for your reply.... I have no invertor sorry and I have just twigged that I wouldnt be able to plug a 240v one in anyway with a generator. I could try and find a 12v hairdryer which im sure would be a lot less wattage. I just wanted to know if there is something wrong with my leisure battery maybe as it has been left to go flat on a number of occasions? I would rather buy and new leisure battery and charge than spend nearly a grand on a generator.


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## erneboy

erneboy said:


> Buy an extra leisure battery a travel hair dryer an inverter which will run it and a 1 kw generator. I think this will work for you.
> 
> As DAB said the correct way to do this is add up your power demands and set that against your ability to recharge the batteries, Alan.


I do not think any one was being unfriendly, but what you are asking is a slightly technical question. If you are not technically minded you will need professional help to install whatever equipment you buy to solve your problem, they will also be able to do any calculations for you.

My suggestion, quoted above will almost certainly solve your problem. You should not need to buy a charger as your van should have one built in, Alan.

Edit: Crossed posts with you. A 12v hairdryer is next to useless, a travel one will use less power than your domestic one. You can use an inverter to run this dryer from your leisure battery but you will then need to replace the power you have used, so that means mains, solar (no use in winter) or generator.


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## DTPCHEMICALS

Ditch the hairdrier please.

Lady p as well as all the other ladies i have seen on site like to take pride in their appearance.

Dry with towel and use gas curlers as sugested earlier.

We have done 4 days on one liesure battery with no problems.

Alteranativley book into a hotel :lol: :lol: :lol: 

DAve p


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## gnscloz

cole said:


> Hiya,
> Thanks for your reply.... I have no invertor sorry and I have just twigged that I wouldnt be able to plug a 240v one in anyway with a generator. I could try and find a 12v hairdryer which im sure would be a lot less wattage. I just wanted to know if there is something wrong with my leisure battery maybe as it has been left to go flat on a number of occasions? I would rather buy and new leisure battery and charge than spend nearly a grand on a generator.


hi for definite get the largest new leisure battery that will fit, a second one would be massive help, use as much gas as possible, the 12 volt hairdrier will potentially be your thirstiest item, are you going to be stationery for the entire 4 days?


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## peedee

erneboy said:


> Buy an extra leisure battery a travel hair dryer an inverter which will run it and a 1 kw generator. I think this will work for you.


Cole you are asking technical questions which logically require technical answers 

erneboy has given you the answers if you wish to run a hair dryer. Running devices which consume 2 to 3Kw of power like electric kettles and hairdryers designed for use in the home is really not practical in a motorhome. Sooner or later there will be occasions when even on site hook ups cannot deliver the power you require. Best buy yourself the low power equivalent usually found in travel devices. My wife's hairdryer and our kettle are 900watts each.

Back to battery life. 4 days is about the norm on a good battery if you manage your power. This does not include running electric heating, or even low power hairdryers and kettles. Hairdryers and electric kettles really need a generator and it is normal for heating to only operate from 240volt mains.

Re keeping your battery charged whilst in storage, if there isn't a hook up your only alternative is to fit a solar panel.

peedee


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## bigfoot

There are certain decisions which have to be made if you wish to camp 'off grid'. Is the tv neccessary,if wildcamping isn't the view a better picture picture? 
Practical living needs compromises, managable clothing that doesn't need ironing. Easy to manage hair and good bedding or sleeping bags to eliminate or minimise the need for heating.
Why not use a dry shampoo for your hair. A good substitute is plain talcum poweder brushed through th ehair and then a wipe with a cloth dampened with cologne-simples!


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## tokkalosh

When I first had my current Motorhome the tv used to drain the leisure battery after just a couple of hours. 
I bought a new leisure battery, size 110 I think and it has been much better.
I would use gas for the fridge and heating, assuming this is possible.


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## DABurleigh

Cole,

Err, I don't see anyone being anything other than friendly and helpful! I can appreciate these things are bewildering but as with most things a little knowledge and understanding goes a long way.

But, taking things one at a time. OK, the hair drier is absolutely key to the appropriate solution. It dominates everything. Which is why we needed to be clear about that, as you didn't mention it in your first post as the things you NEEDED to power. 

If you have just your 2kW hairdrier, then that entails you getting a bigger genny than any other motorhomer I know (I said it was key!). Period. Non-negotiable.

I would recommend nothing more than a 1kW hairdrier, and if you have long hair as you do, you need to use it for longer than many. I still believe you are in genny territory here. Clearly a 2kW genny will do fine. A Honda EU10i (as I have) will not - it only powers 0.9kW continuously. 

Coming down to a travel hairdrier at 600W, then allowing your hair to dry a little first, a genny is not required. But a sine-wave inverter is, and if you use it for too long, you will need to run the engine.

And more generally, for wildcamping, you will not get by with less than a couple of decent capacity batteries, say 2 of 110Ah capacity. 

I hope this helps.

Dave


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## cole

Thanks Alan.
I realise i would have to get somebody to carry out replacing the battery etc. I would never attempt to do it myself. I am not familiar with invertors either sorry  I have tried to find out what type of battery it is but cant..it is the standard factory fitted one from swift so isnt anything special.
Nobody has actually answered the questions i am asking which dont need a technical response...such as :

Because my leisure battery has not been fully charged and has been left to go flat could that be why it is only lasting one night?

If i buy a good quality leisure battery 230ah and some sort of intelligent charger would this last for several nights? 

I was wondering if anybody that wild camps for more than a couple of nights knew thats all... and if they did successfully, i could buy the same equipment and do the same. 
If nobody knows the answer then fine...no response would be required. I have posted asking if anybody has the information on the swift voyager heating system and leisure battery but as yet no replies  
Hopefully one of the technical members will be able to offer me some simple advice  

Thanks in advance!


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## cole

Thanks Dave... 

How about if when i use a 12v hairdryer I run the engine on the motorhome... would that help?


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## DABurleigh

Don't waste time with a 12V hairdrier. If you went away motorhoming happy, I can't think of anything more likely to ruin it!

Stick with 600W to 1000W. But you will need a pure sine-wave inverter to create "mains" electricity from your batteries to run it.

Dave


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## peedee

If it is a new Swift Voyager they are fitted with dual fuel Truma combi boilers. You would logically run this on gas if you were not on hookup.
As regards the battery fitted, I can only guess based on what most suppliers would deliver and that would be an 85APH one. If this is correct get another similar battery fitted to give you 160APH.

peedee


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## cole

Would the pure sine inverter be fitted to the leisure battery?


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## erneboy

Cole, we live in our van and often have no mains hook up for days on end.

We watch telly and satellite (12 volt) do all the normal things. Mrs. Eb does use a travel hair dryer (via an inverter) but only every few days and only for a short time. We use gas for all cooking and kettle boiling and our heating runs on diesel.

We have 2 110 ah leisure batteries a 100w solar panel (and plans for at least one more) and for generating power we use a fuel cell (a quiet but expensive way of generating power). We can go for as long as we like with this set up. 

As to why your battery goes flat, I do not know, you should have it tested. For charging, when on mains, your van should have an adequate charger built in, Alan.

Inverter connected to battery, yes.


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## peribro

DABurleigh said:


> Don't waste time with a 12V hairdrier. If you went away motorhoming happy, I can't think of anything more likely to ruin it!
> 
> Stick with 600W to 1000W. But you will need a pure sine-wave inverter to create "mains" electricity from your batteries to run it.
> 
> Dave


Dave

Does it have to be a pure sine-wave inverter? I had been thinking about getting a 1000W quasi inverter to enable my wife to use a 700W hairdryer from time to time.


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## DABurleigh

No, but it might!

See the MHF inverter FAQ here:
http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopicp-450452.html#450452

A hairdrier is simply an electric motor, which is an inductive load. With a given modified sine-wave inverter and given hairdrier, things may work perfectly. Then again they may not if unlucky!

Dave


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## barryd

If your battery is only lasting one night then I would say its on its way out. Take it to your local MH service dealer and get the biggest one that will fit. Should easily last 4 days. I would avoid getting an invertor at all costs though and try and find some other way of sorting your hair out!


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## CaGreg

Hi,
I know that you say that using a hairdryer is a no-negotiation issue but I just thought I would stick my oar in here and allow you to read another perspective.
I am a lady of the female variety with very thick curly hair. I am also a dedicated, hardcore wildcamper (with a very small 68AH battery . . in my van I hasten to add.) 
I wonder how you would feel about washing the hair the morning of the trip and when it is dried, putting a plait in it and leaving it like that til the end of the trip, given that it is only for four days. That way there would be no 'caravan hair' look going on at all. That is what I did when I had my hair longer than it is now.
Believe me, the amazing freedom that wildcamping offers more than makes up for a bit of compromise on the hair front and I am not one for neglecting appearances at any stage. 

We camp 'off grid' virtually all of the time, but don't run a TV either. We never miss it, it's amazing how differently ones perspective is, in a beautiful place with a good book, just one more moonlit walk, or a quiet drink in a nearby pub. The only stars we need are the ones in the sky.
Anyway, ignore all of the above and tell me to mind my own and all that.
From a newly minted 50year old Irish girlie!!
Ca


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## Zebedee

erneboy said:


> As to why your battery goes flat, I do not know, you should have it tested. Alan.


Hi Alan

You must have missed this in a previous post. :wink:



cole said:


> Because my leisure battery has not been fully charged and has been left to go flat could that be why it is only lasting one night?


Answer = "Yes". Leisure batteries must never be fully discharged since it is one of the best ways to ruin them completely. 8O

Cole - I really think you would be better off asking if anyone knows a reliable technician in your area, since I don't think you will ever get sorted on here. Without wishing to sound unkind, answers to technical questions can be simplified only so far, and I think your knowledge and understanding is a long way below that level. A certain basic knowledge is required in order even to ask the right questions, as has been mentioned already on this thread.

Nothing wrong with not knowing about these things of course, but wise men (and women! :wink: :lol: ) recognise their own limitations and know when to take the problem to an expert. :wink:

Don't take this as an unfriendly comment either please. It is only meant to help, and save you a lot of frustration and possibly some very expensive mistakes. 

Dave


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## randonneur

cole said:


> I take pride in my appearance and dont feel comfortable with a big tatty head sorry!! It would take hours for my hair to dry naturally and certainly wouldnt be curling it :? Surely this is irrelevant to the problem?? We do not have an invertor fitted.
> 
> Any advice would be much appreciated minus the critism


I also take pride in my appearance and don't have a big tatty head and don't have curly hair, just because I use a hot brush doesn't mean it has to be curly.

I think you ought to be looking at how much power each of your items take and then look for something to give you the power you want. You seem to have gone off on a tangent before looking into the situation properly.

I cannot see that you TV would take 250w unless it is a very old one. Our big old Goodmans TV (15 years old) only takes 75w when on.


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## cole

Thank you BarryD... A simple answer to a simple question.

I do think that zebedee is being rude and offensive however. I think it is perfectly acceptable for a women that has an office job to not understand batteries and generators! Sexist pig comes to mind!! a joke of course as it is all non-offensive and ever so friendly on here! 

But some very helpful posts off some people! So thank you.
I usually solve my technical problems on the forum so didnt realise things had changed so much. Chill out peeps, it's just a question!

I think i will invest in an expensive 230ah battery and a charger which hopefully is a simple solution...

Big thicko signing out


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## GEMMY

Where's your other half in all this. Why isn't he climbing under the van. How come he put diesel in your water tank. Doesn't he know what an inverter is.Why be so antagonistic. :roll: 

tony


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## pat62

sort of related to this topic ! I was out in the van last night hooked up etc And I had the internal trumo blower heater going,fridge on, few lights on and a 15 in lcd tv plugged in, then mains tripped when trying to boil a kettle (kettle bought from camping shop)

then after watching a film for two hours it suddenly tripped again for no reason as we hadnt tried to switch anything extra on , 

Is this normal ?


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## sweetie

cole said:


> Thank you BarryD... A simple answer to a simple question.
> 
> I do think that zebedee is being rude and offensive however. I think it is perfectly acceptable for a women that has an office job to not understand batteries and generators! Sexist pig comes to mind!! a joke of course as it is all non-offensive and ever so friendly on here!
> 
> But some very helpful posts off some people! So thank you.
> I usually solve my technical problems on the forum so didnt realise things had changed so much. Chill out peeps, it's just a question!
> 
> I think i will invest in an expensive 230ah battery and a charger which hopefully is a simple solution...
> 
> Big thicko signing out


If you read some of your answers people have put to your questions! And then your replys. I think it is you being rude and offensive. 

Steve


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## karlb

cole said:


> Thank you BarryD... A simple answer to a simple question.
> 
> I do think that zebedee is being rude and offensive however. I think it is perfectly acceptable for a women that has an office job to not understand batteries and generators! Sexist pig comes to mind!! a joke of course as it is all non-offensive and ever so friendly on here!
> 
> But some very helpful posts off some people! So thank you.
> I usually solve my technical problems on the forum so didnt realise things had changed so much. Chill out peeps, it's just a question!
> 
> I think i will invest in an expensive 230ah battery and a charger which hopefully is a simple solution...
> 
> Big thicko signing out


before doing anything get this fixed here then take the advice given.

karlb


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## GEMMY

Hey karlb, thats one hell of a chip, you don't get many of those to the pound. :lol: 

tony


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## geraldandannie

cole said:


> I think i will invest in an expensive 230ah battery and a charger which hopefully is a simple solution...


But how are you going to dry your hair (which is the thing which is giving the biggest 'problem' finding electricity)? Where are you going to get 240V ac from? Not without an inverter or a generator.

Please ignore the less-than-helpful, stupid remarks from our resident unfunny members.

Gerald


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## GEMMY

In your view. :roll: 

tony

Gerald read the op history :roll:


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## Biglol

Perhaps a hair dryer that isn't so powerful would be the answer, it would take longer to dry your hair that's all


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## artona

Cole - you have not been getting unhelpful answers, you have been getting requests for more info before the answers can be given.

Try to list all items electrical you might be using. List the model number of the hair dryer and any info regarding power consumption for example.

Have a look at the battery you have and post any info relating to it including amphours, type and if possible age.

stew


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## sallytrafic

Hi Cole

This FAQ (Or member's guide) may help, as it uses the example of a hairdrier to illustrate the points made.

>Guide<


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## sander4709

Maybe a haircut is the answer.


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## Grizzly

Hi Cole....somewhere I'm sure I read about a hairdryer that works by diverting hot air off the blown air heating system. That might fit the bill though it would not have the "oomph" of a commercial one. 

Have you got access to a 240v socket where you leave your van between trips ? You are right in thinking that letting your battery go flat- even once- shortens its life. If you can plug it in when you are not using the van and set the internal charging unit to keeping your leisure battery topped up then you should be OK. I think in your circumstances I'd take the battery to a trustworthy garage and let them check it. A new battery might be your first priority.

G

Edit: I have fond memories of my mother, on a Broads hire boat holiday, drying her hair by kneeling down and sticking her head in the gas oven ! Not recommended ! We thought she'd decided it was all too much for her....


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## peaky

as with all things , keep it simple !!! we dont have the luxury of hook up anytime, (unless i can squeeze the van onto the drive occasionally )and wildcamp all the time., we have 2 95ah batteries and a solar panel, dont know the wattage, but we have camped for several nights, tv and lights only at night led lights that is, and the rest runs on gas,thank goodness for the sun as this keeps our batteries constantly topped up and we have only hooked up via the house mains once in 9 months of owning the van, where to empty the toilet after 3 days became our priority !!! just adapt to each situation there s always a way round things !!!


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## DABurleigh

And your thick mop of long hair dries quickly as you soak up the rays having breakfast outside all year round where you are! Bet you don't even know what a 2kW hairdrier is! 

Dave


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## Sideways86

I suggest the batteries are getting hammered with the hairdryer etc because one night doesnt seem that long. we have a swift voyager and we used leisure battery only at newbury last year and managed three nights normal demand no problem.

you just have to be sparing with the demands on the system I guess


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## peaky

err sorry DAburleigh, indeed i dont know what a hair dryer is, and yes wash hair and yorkshire terriers at the same time totally dry in 5 mins !!! 
we have had a calima for the best part of the week, looks like mist but its sand, not good if u have asthma.
All those in spain should come here, lovely weather, i have never seen condensation in the van i love camping out here the windgets a bit much at times but seriously brilliant places never far from a desserted beach, more should come and visit !!!
temp in shade at 5pm 28 degrees.......


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## DABurleigh

Yup. Was there in December 
http://picasaweb.google.com/DABurleigh/TenerifeShare#


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## peaky

brilliant !!!! spread the word.... ooops i hijacking the thread sorry !!!!!


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## CaGreg

Another issue with wildcamping is water usage. We can easily do four days with a tank of water and three five litres bottles, but if long hair has to be washed, (more than once?) it will use up the water very quickly. I know how much rinsing it takes for my own hair. 

Just a thought and not meant to be pouring spanners onto water works (to mix a few metaphors)!!


Ca


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## TheBoombas

It does seem that your current battery is past it's best? sitting uncharged for that amount of time will know doubt have made it next to useless IMHO. I'm thinking you have more than one issue here. firstly you will need to get some new batteries two 120amp IMHO are better than one 240amp. then to power your dryer you will need an invertor (pure sine round 2000 watts would be fine, with a lower powered travel dryer that is)

Now the next issue is putting the power back into the batteries, once you have drained it using the dryer ect.
You don't need a large expensive genny just to charge the batteries! so a reasonble quite 1K genny for a few hundered pounds will do nicely.

Now the other problem you have is that you must keep those new batteries charged whilst its in storage, or you will be back to square one again. and as you have no 240v supply whilst in storage then you are going to have to have either solar panels or a wind generator fitted. and of course either of these will also help in keeping the batteries topped whilst your wild camping.

I hope this helps

Boomba


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## geraldandannie

TheBoombas said:


> I hope this helps


So do I, because it nicely sums up the exact situation. I hope she's still around to read this.

Gerald


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## cole

Hi everyone, 

I feel like ive been missing out reading all these comments, some more helpful than others :wink: I guess some people have too much time on their hands!

Im afraid the focus on the hairdryer distracted from the actual problem partly because I didn't explain myself properly for which I apologise.

Our new storage facilty does have a hook-up so if we do buy a couple of new batteries we can leave it plugged in. However, the man that runs the storage does have a tendancy to unplug to save on his electric which may cause a problem!? 

I am struggling to find out the wattage of each item we need to run as I can't get through to swift and my local dealer told me to call them. I wondered if anybody new the average say for the Truma heating system, fridge etc...Just a rough idea. 

I am going away on Thursday and wont have time to get the new battery fitted. I am going to buy not the Honda generator as it is very expensive at £660 but I have seen a similar one 64db, same size etc for £300 which will be a good test to see how useful it is. My plan is to charge the leisure battery at the storage as much as possible before we go and use the generator to charge it when it gets low. Try and find a hairdrier under 1000w and then i can enjoy the tranquility and nature of The lake District and still look glamorous :lol: 

When we get back from our trip book it in at Brownhills for a battery change & possibly one of those intelligent chargers.

Just for the record though.... I will rough it to a certain level but there is a cut off point.  Thanks for all of the helpful comments!!


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## Grizzly

cole said:


> I wondered if anybody new the average say for the Truma heating system, fridge etc.
> !!


As ever the estimable Frank has this which will help:

Amperage questions

Get out your calculator, look on your appliance for the metal plate which gives you all the power rating information and you can then work it out.

The Truma UK website is a mine of information as well.

www.trumauk.co.uk

G


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