# Hymer roadholding question



## Warper

Hi, all.

I had a holiday in a rented Mercedes-based 1990s Hymer A-Class last year. Lovely van to live in but I wasn't happy with the handling on corners and roundabouts. I've driven a number of commercial vehicles (Luton vans, Transits etc). This was the first time that I've been worried that something would tip over on a roundabout. My wife didn't drive it (over her 3.5t limit) but she has also driven large vans and she didn't feel safe in it either. 

I discovered later that the rear left tyre was a bit soft. But reinflating it didn't make much difference. 

So, question: was I unlucky or is it a characteristic? I'm looking at buying a 1990s van. It's a choice between a coachbuilt or the classic Hymermobil. But I'm a bit worried about the driving experience so I thought I'd ask if anyone else has ever had this problem.

Thanks,

Warps


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## bognormike

Was it correctly loaded? It could have been overweight. 

Air suspension helps greatly to stop rolling and makes the MH more stable.


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## 747

Sounds more like your other 3 tyres were over inflated .... and possibly overweight.


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## rayrecrok

Hey up..

How fast were you trying to go round the roundabout.. I don't recognise your sensation of tipping over while driving a Hymer..

Go too fast round a corner or such, all the pots and pans would go flying :lol: :lol: :lol: 

It's a technique driving motor homes that has to be mastered, it's called "slow down", this technique works for all motor homes :wink: 

ray.


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## Wizzo

I suppose it could have been any number of things or combination of things, broken or worn springs, shock absorbers, under inflated tyres, just badly loaded or overloaded.

I see no reason why a 1990's van of any make should handle that badly that you feel its going to roll over providing of course it is in proper order.

I used to own a 1997 Autohomes Wanderer, based on a Peugeot Boxer, which handled beautifully.

JohnW


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## veevee

You don't write which model and was it twin rear wheel?

Think you also have to bear in mind the age of the MH, you can't expect modern handling from such an old vehicle. 

I went from a 2002 to a 2006 to a 2013 Ducato works van all with the largest engine. Although there were a few similarities they are in reality like chalk and cheese, and that's over only an 11 years design span.

Saying that I drive a 1992 Hymer S670 for holidays and journeys, so much slower but that's what I want in my leisure time.

About to fit air suspension but not to corner faster, just to make the handling more predictable especially in France where they now have a craze for the most roundabouts per km, just to make life easier on the sharp right - left turns.

When we first got our S670 and understanding that the suspension design although very robust was very old fashioned, I replaced all 6 tyres with the best I could buy and experimented with tyre pressure, all the changes made improvements.

Hope this helps


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## TheNomad

1990's?

I've had two.

It'll almost certainly be suffering from soggy bottom syndrome: the rear leaf springs have spent their entire lives trying to cope with virtually the max load permissible, 3.5 tonnes. All day. Every day. Without respite.
They were actually designed only to support that weight as a rare maximum. Most of the time it was intended as a white van design to be carrying either a lot less load, or no load at all, so maybe running at 2.5 tonnes weight.

Add to that the much longer rear overhang weight , which accentuates a 'fishtail' action to any tight cornering, and a lot of weight carried high in lockers'on roof etc, and Bingo - you've got a very 'roly poly' vehicle.

3 main, and relatively easy, solutions: fit new leaf springs. Fit air-ride spring assisters. Fit coil-spring assisters ( such as from Grayston engineering).


I fitted Grayston assisters to both my 1990's motorhomes, and the ride difference was instant, and brilliant. Dead easy to self-fit.
From memory the cost, for the heavy duty twin-coils per side, was about 300 quid, but it was a few years ago now. Price now maybe 400 quid?


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## Warper

Thanks for all these quick answers. Amazing. 

It was an S580 - a single rear wheel model. We were lightly loaded and I was going around the roundabouts quite slowly. I was quite aware that it wasn't mine, so I was being cautious. I've driven a well loaded 7.5 tonner during a house move and it felt a lot more stable than the Hymer. The sensation was that it was going to fall over - not that the rear would lose traction. I reckon what some of you are saying about worn suspension would be about right. Whatever I buy, I'll put a bit aside for repairs and upgrades. Any 15-20 year old van will probably need something done to it. 

Thanks to you all - you're a great bunch! 

Cheers,
W


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## ob1

It's a Mercedes characteristic I'm afraid. Our 2014, 3500kg, Auto-Sleeper is exactly the same with amazing amounts of sway. Other characteristics are poor straight line steering and poor handling in anything over a breeze. Mercedes are now advertising the latest Sprinter has 'side wind assistance' or something similar, which tends to prove the point.

The Ducato chassis wins hands down in terms of handling and ride but if you like bouncy castles chose the Merc.

Ron


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## captainking

We have a S700 Merc D410 chassis its quite a big beast so I take my time around bends and roundabouts plus I normally have a MX5 and trailer on the back with a big box of tools.

I don't think its a good idea going round on two wheels, all the stuff ends up like being an a washing machine!

Captain


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## trek

OB1 do you really have :-
"poor straight line steering and poor handling in anything over a breeze"


doesn't sound right to me , my Sprinter drives as though on rails on the road but it does suffer badly with swaying if I drive over potholes on fields, so I fitted air suspension from Marcle Leisure that I only inflate to drive off road & as soon as I am back on tarmac I default the airbags to their minimum pressure again

I put the swaying when driving over rough terrain to be due to the suspension (springs & shock absorbers) being inboard - i.e much closer towards the centre of the vehicle than a Ducato especially as I have twin rear wheels and the ducato wheel base is wider than the sprinters combine this with the tall body and high centre of gravity 

On the road its fine even at 70mph


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## ob1

Yes Trek, I do have both these traits on my vehicle, as do others that I have tried thinking that there was something wrong with mine. As I mentioned Mercedes now fit Crosswind Assist (I looked it up!) - why? My previous tall bodied Frankia on a Ducato never suffered from crosswinds at anything like the level that the Merc does. The first thing I noticed when swapping over to the Merc was the never ending steering correction needed to hold a straight line. You get used to it of course but I wouldn't say it gives relaxed driving. Reading similar reports I just but the problem down to the fact that the Merc has a narrow track compared to the Fiat, to narrow in my opinion.

I think the reason that you don't have the same problems is probably due to the twin wheels on your vehicle. Our old Burstner 747 had tag axles and that also handled like a train on rails. 

Ron


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## trek

MB are introducing this Cross Wind Assist for cars as well as their sprinter range

Crosswind Assist

though this wouldn't be a cure to your problem OB1 would it ?

as you suggest that your steering is wandering all the time in anything over a breeze ?

I seem to remember an old story with the Burstner T695 motohome on the older Sprinter 315 chassis 
I heard that some people found the handling poor especially over taking lorries at speed ?

can't remember now if it may have been the long rear over hang of the Burstner body or the weight distribution


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## Warper

@ob1 - yes, that's exactly the phrase: "amazing amounts of sway". I used to have a 2CV which acted the same except that you can't make a 2CV fall over unless you're insane and they cling on like limpets. The Merc was like that but with none of the positives. 

Okay. Sevel vans, here I come. Easier to park, anyway.


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## BillCreer

Yes if you go from a modern car, that does not roll, to a Citroen 2CV you first impression is that it s going to fall over at the first corner but within a week you are throwing it into corners at ridiculous speeds .
I found it the same with motorhomes but I'm now quite happy to push mine into corners confidant that it will slide pretty much like a car.


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## Mrplodd

Hymers of that sort of age did tend to be rather tall with a very high centre of gravity, that coupled with a narrow track does tend to make them "wobbly boxes" 

As far as the soggy springs argument is concerned, if the springs have gone flat then they will have LESS travel available so the ride should, surely, actually be BETTER because the spring is not going to flex very much at all before it comes into the bump stops and cannot move any more??? Just a theory that seems to make sense to me!


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## tony50

Mr Plodd is correct and different makes of motor homes have different heights of centre of gravity and don't forget if you put heavy loads around top hatches this will increase the instability , but, in saying that Mercs did have slight instability ,but we have had a 2007 &2009 A class Rapido's and the single rear wheel drive I thought was good and the twin rear wheel one was excellent knowing about mercs as had been in Motor trade I was expecting instability but they seemed ok on these year models, drive them knowing all Motor homes like cars require user to be careful.

Tony A.


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## trek

Hi Warper 

just curious to know why you say Seval vans are easier to park ?:-

"Okay. Sevel vans, here I come. Easier to park, anyway."

being FWD I would have thought the turning circle would be larger than a RWD which is the only thing I could think of ??

anyway my personal choice would be RWD always before a FWD camper so Sprinter then Iveco long before a Sevel & if I had to go FWD then it would be a Renault not Sevel 
( speaking from my personal experiences with campers - had two Ducato's, one Iveco & one Sprinter in my time plus a couple of VW's)


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## Warper

Hi again.

When I said "easy to park" a Sevel van, I mean that Hymers like the Hymer Camp are physically smaller than the A-Class models. Chances are I will be parking this on the road. I need a van that's compact but bigger than a VW. 

I am surprised that Mercedes vans are viewed poorly by some people here. If they're good enough for John McClane in Die Hard 5, they should be good enough for the rest of us. 

W


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## trek

ob1

does your Sprinter base vehicle have anti roll / stabiliser bars front and rear ?


I don't know if these are fitted as standard ?


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## vicdicdoc

My 1997 Fiat Ducato based Hymer has air assist on the rear - it stops all the rolling . . Mind you I drive through roundabouts quite slowly - more due to other unpredictable drivers who think they're formula 1 experts, but the air assist certainly does improve the handling.


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## ob1

trek said:


> ob1
> 
> does your Sprinter base vehicle have anti roll / stabiliser bars front and rear ? I don't know if these are fitted as standard ?


No idea Trek, but it's only a year old and bog standard, as were others tried.

Ron


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## aldra

We found with our A class Hymer a tendency to roll from side to side

The wheels on the hymer tend to be set further in and the body sides further out

On our present motorhome the wheels are wider spaced and it feels great to drive

It's to do with build, I'm sure there is a technical term but albert isn't here to tell me
:lol: :lol:  

Aldra


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## trek

may be worth climbing underneath and looking , if you don't have any then these could probably be retrofitted easily and make all the difference ?

any garage should be able to do this or a suspension specialist like VB suspension

vbairsuspension MB sprinter ant roll bar

i would expect them to have been fitted but you never know maybe it is a option when they order the chassis from MB


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## trek

the MB Sprinter price list shows options for anti roll bars when ordering a new Sprinter


this mentions option CF4 or CF5 I assume these to be the anti roll / stabiliser bars ?


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