# Gel battery question



## merpb (May 10, 2005)

It seems that my leisure batteries may need replacing, I currently have 2 number 210 amp hour Exide Gel batteries. This is the 1st time I've had gels as all previous vans had traditional wet batteries. Are gels worth the extra cost?


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

in 8 years, We have been through so many wet cell batteries, I have lost count.

Yet we have one 7 year old http://www.eurobatt.co.uk/lucas-lslc150-12-150-12/ that just goes on and on.

Trev


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## WildThingsKev (Dec 29, 2009)

I'll tell you why I have gel batteries. We are in the alps for 2 months snowboarding and often spend 4 or 5 days with no driving, hookup or solar. Our 2 110Ah gel batteries can deliver this (when fully charged by the b2bcharger) without being wrecked as they can be dischàrged by 80% something like 500 times.

This is a fairly extreme example but nevertheless gel batteries will last at least twice as long as ordinary leisure batteries and you have that extra capacity if you need it (110Ah gel can deliver 88Ah; 110Ah standard leisure can deliver 55Ah).

How long have the current batteries lasted? (Need to be sure your charging system is optimised for gel) . You have a huge capacity and it may be that you can downsize to save money.

Kev


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## greygit (Apr 15, 2007)

WildThingsKev said:


> I'll tell you why I have gel batteries. We are in the alps for 2 months snowboarding and often spend 4 or 5 days with no driving, hookup or solar. Our 2 110Ah gel batteries can deliver this (when fully charged by the b2bcharger) without being wrecked as they can be dischàrged by 80% something like 500 times.
> 
> This is a fairly extreme example but nevertheless gel batteries will last at least twice as long as ordinary leisure batteries and you have that extra capacity if you need it (110Ah gel can deliver 88Ah; 110Ah standard leisure can deliver 55Ah).
> 
> ...


Are gel batteries any lighter?


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## listerdiesel (Aug 3, 2012)

They are all Lead-Acid batteries at the end of the day.

GEL or AGM are more sensitive to overcharging and overdischarge.

Wet batteries are more robust, subject to the quality of the battery in the first place.

Ours are 4 X 6V 225ah AGM.

Peter


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## greygit (Apr 15, 2007)

listerdiesel said:


> They are all Lead-Acid batteries at the end of the day.
> 
> GEL or AGM are more sensitive to overcharging and overdischarge.
> 
> ...


Yep I goggled it, apparently they have something added to the electrolyte but as you say they are still lead-acid batteries. Shame I was hoping they were lighter.


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## blackbirdbiker (Mar 12, 2007)

General Battery Care Procedures 

General deep cycle battery care procedures 

Reasons Why Batteries Fail 

General Difference Between Gel and Wet Batteries 
We are frequently asked "What are the differences between sealed or gel batteries and the more conventional wet, lead acid batteries. 

Below are some general differences for the consumer to consider.
GEL	WET
Requires stabilized, regulated charging system	Conventional charging system OK
1.5 to 2.3 more expensive $	Less expensive $
Maintenance free, may operate in any position	Requires maintenance (water) upright operation only
May be shipped UPS FFA approved with restrictions	Shipped common carrier only Cannot use for air travel
Float charging voltage 13.5 to 13.8	Float charging voltage 13.0 to 13.5
Cycle charging voltage 14.4 to 14.8	Cycle charging voltage 14.5 to 15.0
Does not deliver high CCA; better suited for long duration discharges	Delivers high CCA and can deliver long duration discharges
Lower capacities given dimensions	Better capacities given dimensions
Slightly less AH per pound than wet	Excellent AH per pound
Less ability to dissipate heat	Excellent ability to dissipate heat
Less readily available for warranty	More readily available for warranty
State of Charge and Sulfation 

Connect Your Batteries for Optimum Efficiency 

Just A Little Corrosion Causes Big Voltage Drops 

Don't Be Misled By Battery Ratings 

Which Deep Cycle Battery Do I Choose? 

Daily Amphere-Hour Consumption For Your RV 

Safety Tips on Charging Batteries 

Determining When A Battery is Fully Charged 

Why Are My Batteries Discharged 

What is the difference between series battery connections and parallel battery connections and how do they increase battery capacity and voltage? 

Jump start procedures 

Preparing your batteries for winter 

Advantages and Disadvantages of using two 12 volt batteries connected in parallel or two 6 volt batteries connected in series. 

Testing the battery


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

What happens to the cab battery when the leisure batteries are GEL and the on board charger and solar regulators are set to GEL. Is the normal cab battery ok with the GEL charging regime? Is the vehicle alternator ok with charging the GEL batteries?


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## rosalan (Aug 24, 2009)

Gel batteries may last longer but they cost a lot more.
Upside down they are at their best as they do not spill... I do not wish to be upside down.
If you replace Gel with wet batteries, depending on you electrical control unit, you may need to switch over to wet batteries. On my van it is a small switch on my Electrobloc ... click and its done.

Alan


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

I believe that Motorhomes manufactured in Germany, with the battery inside the hab area, have to by German law have either Gel or AGM batteries. The reason is less or zero battery acid fumes.
Hymer fit a mix of Gel and AGM. I think you will find, these types don't need venting, where by Wet batteries do.
Gel and AGM use the same charge setting!


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## HarryTheHymer (May 1, 2005)

I've had Gel batteries which lasted 10 years and are probably still going strong - sold the van 2 years ago. 

Currently have AGM but they don't seem to hold their charge as well as the Gel.

AGM and Gel are good if the batteries are located in a confined space as they don't require venting.

Wet batteries require venting and are generally much cheaper. Also you can top them up if needs be and check the specific gravity - providing you can get to them easily.

So, it all depends on where the batteries are located and if it's possible to vent them, should you go down the wet battery route.


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

> Grath said:
> 
> 
> > I believe that Motorhomes manufactured in Germany, with the battery inside the hab area, have to by German law have either Gel or AGM batteries. The reason is less or zero battery acid fumes.
> ...


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## BillCreer (Jan 23, 2010)

Hi,
I don't think gel batteries are worth the extra cost. I you use the Bosch / Varta "silver" batteries they have most of the advantages of gel (plus a few extra) at a lower price and weight.
As Peter says they are all Lead/ Acid and as such are all capable of "gassing" if abused or a fault occurs so don't assume that they won't vent.

This is still he best source of battery info that I have come across.
http://www.atlanticmotorhomeservices.co.uk/battery-technology.php

I have replaced my gel batteries with Varta "silver".


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

rayc said:


> > Grath said:
> >
> >
> > > I believe that Motorhomes manufactured in Germany, with the battery inside the hab area, have to by German law have either Gel or AGM batteries. The reason is less or zero battery acid fumes.
> ...


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## shingi (Apr 18, 2008)

Just seconding the line by "Grath" in that GEL batteries do not need to be vented, whereas wet batteries particularly adjacent to any sleeping area could be a hazard. Check with the experts before changing from GEL to wet would be my advice. Mick.


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## 113016 (Jun 5, 2008)

Grath said:


> rayc said:
> 
> 
> > > Grath said:
> ...


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## Boff (May 10, 2005)

Grath said:


> I believe that Motorhomes manufactured in Germany, with the battery inside the hab area, have to by German law have either Gel or AGM batteries.


No!

A wet battery can be used as well, even inside the hab area, provided that a venting hose leading to the outside is connected to the battery.

All leisure type wet batteries come with a port to connect a venting pipe.

Best Regards,
Gerhard


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## BillCreer (Jan 23, 2010)

shingi said:


> Just seconding the line by "Grath" in that GEL batteries do not need to be vented, whereas wet batteries particularly adjacent to any sleeping area could be a hazard. Check with the experts before changing from GEL to wet would be my advice. Mick.


There are no significant poisonous gases produced by lead acid batteries as it is only oxygen and hydrogen. The danger is therefore from sparks causing the gas to explode.

The only problem I can see with modern gel and maintenance free batteries is that they might develop a fault which puts them into a mode where they boil. To stop the casings exploding all types of these batteries are vented which is why you can't mount gel batteries upside down.


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## listerdiesel (Aug 3, 2012)

Charger voltage settings differ between wet, GEL and AGM, but not by an enormous amount.

We set our train chargers to 28.50V for GEL and 29.60V for WET batteries, and that seems to run pretty generally across the board, even the 110V batteries have the same difference in proportion.

The problem is accentuated by continuous charging, where the battery becomes fully charged and excess charge current is turned into gas at the plates, and there is no more charge acceptance with a fully charged battery.

Wet batteries gas, sealed batteries of all types will recombine the gases at the plates to a degree, but they cannot recombine excessive charging and will pop the vents to relieve the pressure built up inside the casing.

Sealed batteries are safer generally than wet types by virtue of there being no free electrolyte (This assumes a true sealed VRLA battery and not a wet battery with sealed filler caps) 

A bad battery looked after will last longer than a good battery that is abused. It is in the hands of the owner, he/she has to check that voltages are correct on their battery charger(s) and their solar controller(s)

Peter


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## merpb (May 10, 2005)

Thanks everyone but espescially listerdiesel. all of the general advice is appreciated but listerdiesel settled it for me because although I'm not a bad owner, I'm not the most diligent where maintanance is concerned. So Gels it is.


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## VanFlair (Nov 21, 2009)

BillCreer said:


> Hi,
> I don't think gel batteries are worth the extra cost. I you use the Bosch / Varta "silver" batteries they have most of the advantages of gel (plus a few extra) at a lower price and weight.
> As Peter says they are all Lead/ Acid and as such are all capable of "gassing" if abused or a fault occurs so don't assume that they won't vent.
> 
> ...


I dont think Varta recommend their Silver batteries for leisure use so not sure about this myself. But if you can get the life out of them OK.


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## listerdiesel (Aug 3, 2012)

VanFlair said:


> I dont think Varta recommend their Silver batteries for leisure use so not sure about this myself. But if you can get the life out of them OK.


The trouble is, how do you define 'Leisure Use' ??

If you took a cross-section of all the caravans, motorhomes, marine etc etc I doubt you'd find a big commonality between them.

Same as MHF, if you ran a Poll checking on fittings and fixtures, number of lights, TV, Audio, inverters etc etc they would all be different.

A battery is a battery, an electrical storage device that works on electro-chemical reaction.

How long it lasts is entirely up to how it is treated.

Peter


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## Glandwr (Jun 12, 2006)

I like tha idea of a battery that can regularly be discharged by 80% without damage but wonder at the practicalities.

Our van goes into alarm mode once battery voltage falls below 12v and switches off all together at about 11.7v to protect the batteries. There is a s/w for gel/wet on the electrobloc that would charge charging voltage. 

I know that gels were factory fitted and changed later. Question - do you think that if I invested in gels the alarm and s/w off threshold voltages would be reduced to take atvantage of the much deeper safe discharge? If not I can't see the point.

What would be the voltage anyway across a gel that was 80% discharged?

Dick


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## WildThingsKev (Dec 29, 2009)

There are loads of "state of charge" by voltage charts if you do a search and some vary a lot. On the whole I think that your alarm set at 12.0v for gel batteries would be just about right for an 80% depth of discharge. I don't allow mine below 12.1v ( to allow a little margin) although the manufacturer (Victron) says they will take 200 x 100% discharges!! I'm not going to test that on mine.

Kev


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## Boff (May 10, 2005)

> There are loads of "state of charge" by voltage charts if you do a search and some vary a lot.


The problem with all of these is that they only apply if the battery has been left without any charge or discharge for at least 12, better 24 hours.

Best Regards,
Gerhard


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## dave200 (Feb 2, 2015)

You cannot used unsealed lead-acid batteries inside a motorhome because the released hydrogen may explode. Sealed batteries are still liquid inside and may spill in case of even a minor accident. Gel batteries are better but hard to find for more than 50 amp hours. You will need some electricity, but the trick is to reduce dependence.


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