# Pont Aven to Santander or Cap Finisterre to Bilbao ?



## Grizzly

Which do you prefer ? We've only used the Pont Aven and have had one perfect crossing and one nightmare. After that I said I'd rather walk but, doing the sums, it is cheaper to go for the Spanish ferry crossing.

If we go to Santander we will have to go on the motorway round Bilbao anyway but we do know where we would overnight if we go into Santander( Carbaceno aire) and don't know anywhere round Bilbao.

I'm looking at the sailings from Portsmouth to Bilbao that take 24 hours - as the Portsmouth to Santander ones do. 

Pros and cons please !

G


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## teemyob

Only ever crossed on Cap Finistere.

Going soon, only have one good leg at the moment. so hoping for a mill pond.

Normally, the sea does not bother us.

Quite a few stops along the coast.

Read Thiewins many posts on the subject.

When are you going?

TM


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## Grizzly

teemyob said:


> When are you going?
> 
> TM


Thanks. Will do

Mid December.

G


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## teemyob

try this

>click<


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## teemyob

With BF Discount for members

A Midweek Crossing for a 8 x 3m motorhome and 2 seats is £250

If you want a cabin, that would start at £45 more upwards.

not Bad?

Fuel and Tolls through France to Spain would cost us around £750+overnights stops if we used sites.

£295 + £250 Fuel & Toll from Manchester-Portsmouth-Santander=Costa Blanca works out cheaper.

TM


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## wug

We've only been on the Pont-Aven, but I believe it's more like a cruise ship than the CF, though some say the CF is a better sea boat. The CF has pet friendly cabins, while the PA only has kennels. The port at Bilbao isn't actually at the city but is about 12 miles north while the ship docks right in the centre of Santander. The PA has a good restaurant but the CF doesn't.

We chose to go on the PA in December to Santander but are returning by the CF from Bilbao in January as there was no other option coming back. As you say Santander is handy for Caberceno, but there are other Aires not too far from Bilbao. Vitoria-Gasteiz, for example - it's in the Camping guide.

Have a look at the website of Brittany Ferries Enthusiasts. There's quite a bit of discussion of their respective merits and the ports at: BF Enthusiasts


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## pomme1

I've not been on the PA, but we travelled to Bilbao on the CF this May.
We enjoyed the crossing, although the sea was like a millpond.

The only downside for me was the somewhat chaotic parking on the vehicle decks. CF is not a true Ro-Ro, with loading and unloading from the stern only. That of course makes it potentially more seaworthy. It also means that it's necessary to drive on up a steep ramp and then do a U-turn to your allotted spot.

That in itself is not a problem, but we ended up on the open area of deck where vehicles were parked in every conceivable direction, making unloading a protracted and somewhat chaotic experience. It also meant that by the time we got to Bilbao, the 'van had a liberal coating of sea salt. Still it was soon washed off by the torrential Spanish rain!

I don't understand the comment about no restaurant, as we had an excellent meal in a very comfortable restaurant.

Roger


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## teemyob

teemyob said:


> With BF Discount for members
> 
> A Midweek Crossing for a 8 x 3m motorhome and 2 seats is £250
> 
> If you want a cabin, that would start at £45 more upwards.
> 
> not Bad?
> 
> Fuel and Tolls through France to Spain would cost us around £750+overnights stops if we used sites.
> 
> £295 + £250 Fuel & Toll from Manchester-Portsmouth-Santander=Costa Blanca works out cheaper.
> 
> TM


I should add that as a Member, Breakfast is included if you take a cabin. So that saves you around £16. Thus making the extra cost of a cabin if you take breakfast down to around £29 upwards.


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## wug

pomme1 said:


> I don't understand the comment about no restaurant, as we had an excellent meal in a very comfortable restaurant.
> 
> Roger


Sorry, what I meant to say was that it hasn't a buffet-style restaurant. We had an excellent "eat as much as you like" buffet on the PA.

And, to add to Teemyob, you get 10% off all meals as a Travel Club member.

Of course, the one thing you can't predict is the weather. Our sailing to Santander was cancelled because of 8m waves so they took us to St Malo and we slept overnight on the PA at the port.


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## teemyob

wug said:


> pomme1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I don't understand the comment about no restaurant, as we had an excellent meal in a very comfortable restaurant.
> 
> Roger
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry, what I meant to say was that it hasn't a buffet-style restaurant. We had an excellent "eat as much as you like" buffet on the PA.
> 
> And, to add to Teemyob, you get 10% off all meals as a Travel Club member.
> 
> Of course, the one thing you can't predict is the weather. Our sailing to Santander was cancelled because of 8m waves so they took us to St Malo and we slept overnight on the PA at the port.
Click to expand...

And long overdue, you can pre-book tables in the restaurant on most Spanish Crossings.


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## MikeCo

Having used both ships over the last 3 years there is no way that I would use the Crap Finistre again. Yes there are dog friendly cabins but unless you pay to eat in the expensive restaurant you have to go on deck to find some fast food.
The Pont Aven is far better but have decided not to use this either as I don't fancy another rough crossing. You can park overnight on the Docks at Bilbao
According to my calculations it's around £200 cheaper to do Dover Calais and drive down. We will set off on Boxing Day and will be at la Manga on the 30 Dec. and returning on the May 3.

Mike


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## Grizzly

MikeCo said:


> According to my calculations it's around £200 cheaper to do Dover Calais and drive down. We will set off on Boxing Day and will be at la Manga on the 30 Dec. and returning on the May 3.
> 
> Mike


Interesting Mike. I put this thread up about a week ago:

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopicp-1453968-.html#1453968

and was surprised how little difference there was.

We've now booked- CF to Bilbao- and are keeping fingers crossed for a calm crossing. This time, if it is not, we'll both take pills ! We did not do so last time as we were worried that they might cause problems next day when we had to drive off the boat. I'm not really looking forward to it: last time was so awful that I vowed I'd rather walk than go for a repeat.

G


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## MikeCo

Grizzly said:


> MikeCo said:
> 
> 
> 
> According to my calculations it's around £200 cheaper to do Dover Calais and drive down. We will set off on Boxing Day and will be at la Manga on the 30 Dec. and returning on the May 3.
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting Mike. I put this thread up about a week ago:
> 
> http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopicp-1453968-.html#1453968
> 
> and was surprised how little difference there was.
> 
> We've now booked- CF to Bilbao- and are keeping fingers crossed for a calm crossing. This time, if it is not, we'll both take pills ! We did not do so last time as we were worried that they might cause problems next day when we had to drive off the boat. I'm not really looking forward to it: last time was so awful that I vowed I'd rather walk than go for a repeat.
> 
> G
Click to expand...

We were lucky last December and coming back in March we had smooth crossings so we will quit while we are ahead. To be fair we were towing a caravan but this year it will be the PVC and a trailer and will be getting around 35mpg .which will help.
As I mentioned previously you can stay on the docks overnight at Bilbao but the site at Burgos is about 2 hours away if you have the time.

Mike


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## Grizzly

Thanks Mike. We've got the coordinates of a new aire not too far from the port at Bilbao and will probably try that for the first night. It's got EHUs too (advertised anyway!) which we might need if cold as we will have spent the night before sailing on Portsmouth dockside. I try to have several fall-back stops in case the ferry is delayed and docks after dark or we are too exhausted to go further than we have to. It might turn out to be Bilbao port.

Where are you aiming for ? I'm havering about booking somewhere for over Christmas. The only time we have done this before it was so crowded that it became stressful finding a pitch in coastal Spain.

G


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## MikeCo

Grizzly said:


> Thanks Mike. We've got the coordinates of a new aire not too far from the port at Bilbao and will probably try that for the first night. It's got EHUs too (advertised anyway!) which we might need if cold as we will have spent the night before sailing on Portsmouth dockside. I try to have several fall-back stops in case the ferry is delayed and docks after dark or we are too exhausted to go further than we have to. It might turn out to be Bilbao port.
> 
> Where are you aiming for ? I'm havering about booking somewhere for over Christmas. The only time we have done this before it was so crowded that it became stressful finding a pitch in coastal Spain.
> 
> G


This will be our 8th year in Spain during winter and after moving around a bit for the first couple of years we have decided that we are quite happy on the Camping Club rally at La Manga which we have booked from Dec 30 to April 4. After that we have booked Kiko Park through the Caravan club mainly because it is over Easter and some of the sites not only get busy but also put the rates up quite a lot.
La Manga is not for everyone but as it's dark early and gets quite cold at night it's handy to be where there is something to do.

Mike


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## wug

Grizzly said:


> We've got the coordinates of a new aire not too far from the port at Bilbao
> G


If it's the one on the hill above Bilbao at 15 euros I believe it's only open during the summer.


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## teemyob

MikeCo said:


> Grizzly said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> MikeCo said:
> 
> 
> 
> According to my calculations it's around £200 cheaper to do Dover Calais and drive down. We will set off on Boxing Day and will be at la Manga on the 30 Dec. and returning on the May 3.
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
> Interesting Mike. I put this thread up about a week ago:
> 
> http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopicp-1453968-.html#1453968
> 
> and was surprised how little difference there was.
> 
> We've now booked- CF to Bilbao- and are keeping fingers crossed for a calm crossing. This time, if it is not, we'll both take pills ! We did not do so last time as we were worried that they might cause problems next day when we had to drive off the boat. I'm not really looking forward to it: last time was so awful that I vowed I'd rather walk than go for a repeat.
> 
> G
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> We were lucky last December and coming back in March we had smooth crossings so we will quit while we are ahead. To be fair we were towing a caravan but this year it will be the PVC and a trailer and will be getting around 35mpg .which will help.
> As I mentioned previously you can stay on the docks overnight at Bilbao but the site at Burgos is about 2 hours away if you have the time.
> 
> Mike
Click to expand...

35mpg towing Mike!

Owners are reporting late twenties solo.

?

TM


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## Telbell

Does the Pont Aven always go from Santander and the Finistere always from Bilbao? (Looking particularly at the Spain to UK route)

I've been on the BF site and can't find any indication of which ship travels which route

THanks


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## Grizzly

Telbell said:


> Does the Pont Aven always go from Santander and the Finistere always from Bilbao? (Looking particularly at the Spain to UK route)
> 
> I've been on the BF site and can't find any indication of which ship travels which route
> 
> THanks


We thought we'd only been on the Pont Aven but, checking my booking records it turns out that we were on the Cap Finistere from Portsmouth to Santander on 4th January 2011. I thought we didn't recognise anything last time we went in August 2012- when we were definitely on the Pont Aven. I put it down to the fact that the weather in August was so ghastly we spent most of our time in the cabin.

The Cap Finistere, on a flat calm crossing, was very good. We ate in the restaurant and thoroughly enjoyed it. We ate in the Pont Aven self-service place last time and it was fine.

G


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## Grizzly

wug said:


> Grizzly said:
> 
> 
> 
> We've got the coordinates of a new aire not too far from the port at Bilbao
> G
> 
> 
> 
> If it's the one on the hill above Bilbao at 15 euros I believe it's only open during the summer.
Click to expand...

Thanks ! I'd not noticed that.

******** Plan B then.

I also found this- re Santander- but don't know if it is the same opening dates. Nothing to say so.

_Two creations that will interest all lovers of the Iberian Peninsula, as both major tourist cities are to be equipped with specific infrastructure?
The new Spain

First question, the city of Bilbao opens ample parking 72 places camper, 31 of calleKobetamendi (GPS: 43 ° 15 '? 34 N / 2 ° 57' 47 W?). Access A-8 motorway (exit Balmaseda) then direction-Altamira Alto Kastexana). The site, open from April 20 to October 17, 2011 (7 h 30 to 22 h 30), will pay a hosting service being provided. Price: 15? per camper per day (maximum 3 days), regardless of the number of persons per vehicle. Very good point, this price includes access to services - electrical connection, water, gray and black water drain? and the site is served by? Bibobus? Mintegitxueta line 58? Atxuri. What calmly consider visiting the city and the famous Guggenheim Museum (pictured).

Second point of interest with Santander which also opens its reception area and services calle Caesar Llamazares (GPS: 43 ° 26 '40 N / 3 ° 50 12 W??) in front of a bus and tram again ideal to discover the city. Fifteen locations, drain point gray and black water, tourist information office? all for free (48 h maximum).

13/05/2011 9:53_

G


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## Telbell

Thanks. Seems liked they "chop and change" then and it's a matter of chance which ship you get on a particular route


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## caulkhead

Telbell said:


> Thanks. Seems liked they "chop and change" then and it's a matter of chance which ship you get on a particular route


If you look at the timetable on the BF website you can see which ship is operating on any given route on any given day. Of course, in winter things can change if the weather intervenes but nevertheless you can at least plan to be on the ship of your choice.

Caulkhead


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## wug

That's right. They put the initials of the ship in the timetable where more than one of them is doing the route, otherwise its at the top rhs. Also, one (or more) ships in the fleet go into dock during the winter months for refits etc. Probably the Spain route isn't so busy during the winter to the PA is on the St Malo route a lot of the time during December/January.


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## thieawin

we have used both PA and CF.

The facilities such as self service on the PA are superior, but the |CF restaurant is very good and not unduly pricey

The cabins are better on PA apart from the pet issue

If you arrive at Santander now the exit from the port no longer lands you in the centre but takes you via the port onto the motorway to Bilbao.

You don't have to navigate the hectic traffic on the Bilbao inner ring either anymore as the outer ring opened a year ago and you go through 4 tunnels at modest toll and avoid all the traffic and end up heading south on the AP68

If the weather is bad both ships can be "rough" but surprisingly there are few cancellations or delays and very few "bad" crossings


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## teemyob

We have travelled on Biscay many times.

On P&O's Pride of Bilbao and Cap Finistère. But never on Pont Aven.

Only had two fairly rough crossings. None Bad.

On it next week!

TM


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## MikeCo

35mpg towing Mike!

Owners are reporting late twenties solo.

?

TM[/quote]

When I did my own conversion last year I bought a new Peugeot Boxer and according to the on board info I'm getting 38/39 mpg depending how fast I go.
I'm only towing a 750kg unbraked trailer so I'm hoping that a steady run down through France will see me getting 35 or so.

With regards to the Pont Aven, in previous years it has stopped doing the Portsmouth/Santander trip at the end of November and starts again sometime in March leaving the Crap Finistre as the only choice from December to end of February.

Mike


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## teemyob

MikeCo said:


> 35mpg towing Mike!
> 
> Owners are reporting late twenties solo.
> 
> ?
> 
> TM


When I did my own conversion last year I bought a new Peugeot Boxer and according to the on board info I'm getting 38/39 mpg depending how fast I go.
I'm only towing a 750kg unbraked trailer so I'm hoping that a steady run down through France will see me getting 35 or so.

With regards to the Pont Aven, in previous years it has stopped doing the Portsmouth/Santander trip at the end of November and starts again sometime in March leaving the Crap Finistre as the only choice from December to end of February.

Mike[/quote]

My first VW T5 could do lots of miles to the gallon. We brimmed tanks and it easily managed 35mpg.

The replacement T5, same spec almost, struggled to do 25.

Very strange,

TM.


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## teemyob

Wednesdays crossing on CF was very calm.

Very enjoyable crossing.

Food was excellent too.

TM


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## Grizzly

teemyob said:


> Wednesdays crossing on CF was very calm.
> 
> Very enjoyable crossing.
> 
> Food was excellent too.
> 
> TM


Thanks for this TM. I'm glad it went well. Did you eat in the restaurant or the other places ?

Enjoy your travels and hope the sun shines on you.

G


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## wug

We ate in the Pont-Aven restaurant and had the buffet - eat as much as you like - and thought it was very good. 10% off for Travel Club Members.

There are sample menus on the BF website: Pont-Aven Dining; PA Buffet Menu; Cap Finistere Dining; CF A la carte Menu

G.


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## presto

Went on the pont avon last year have travelled many times through the bay of biskay never been sick.We booked a special cabin double bed all the extras it was the wife's birthday,had a good meal when we boarded in the pleasant resturant.We went to our cabin and in a moderate sea we were soo sick.We have travelled on many ferries (living in Ireland we need to)but we have never had such an experience.Perhaps it was because our expensive cabin was on the bow of the ship looking over the open car deck (our motorhome was there)it was a different motion as it hit the waves I don't know but never again.Presto


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## thieawin

mmmm, presto, you must have been away with the fairies, or very sick, travelling on a boat that doesn't exist, on a sea that doesn't exist and seeing your motorhome on an open car deck that doesn't exist

Neither the PA (Pont *Aven*)or the CF (Cap Finistere) have open car decks at the front end (bow)

The expensive cabins on the PA are at the back (stern) and do not look out over the stern deck but to the side and have balconies

I'm as sure as I can be that its only the CF that has exposed car deck at the back (stern)

The expensive cabins on the CF are at the front (bow) but don't have a view of open car deck

Finally its the Bay of *Biscay*

I know, I'm a geek, nerd, OCD and pedant.


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## presto

Yea a geek


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## Telbell

presto said:


> Yea a geek


So- could it have been the "CF" then??


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## Bica

We have used both routes several times in the past and would always choose the PA over the CF and Santander over Bilbao. As you are right in the heart of the town rather than in a commercial port with just one small bar/cafe. Looking at the BF timetable it looks like PA will be going right through the winter this year (refit excluded) on the Santander - Portsmouth route.


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## wug

Pont-Aven is on the Spanish route until mid December then onto the St Malo Route till around 26th January then refit for most of February in Gdansk and back on the Santandar sailings end of Feb.


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## thieawin

Telbell said:


> presto said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yea a geek
> 
> 
> 
> So- could it have been the "CF" then??
Click to expand...

Apart from the fact that the double cabins on the CF are at the front and the exposed car deck is at the back


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## gloworm

wug said:


> Pont-Aven is on the Spanish route until mid December then onto the St Malo Route till around 26th January then refit for most of February in Gdansk and back on the Santandar sailings end of Feb.


Hope not we booked on Pont-Aven 10th Jan for Santander


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## wug

gloworm said:


> wug said:
> 
> 
> 
> Pont-Aven is on the Spanish route until mid December then onto the St Malo Route till around 26th January then refit for most of February in Gdansk and back on the Santandar sailings end of Feb.
> 
> 
> 
> Hope not we booked on Pont-Aven 10th Jan for Santander
Click to expand...

Just double-checked the timetable, and I hope this isn't going to come as a shock, but it's the Cap Finistere on that date. BF Timetable
Graham


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## Darloboy

It is the Cap Finistere as we too are booked on the Jan 10th sailing.

Where is there to stop (a site or aire) near Santander? Arriving at 17.30 and probably not being disembarked until at least 18.30 means there will be little time to travel far.

Any suggestions?

Thanks in advance


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## Grizzly

Darloboy said:


> It is the Cap Finistere as we too are booked on the Jan 10th sailing.
> 
> Where is there to stop (a site or aire) near Santander?  Arriving at 17.30 and probably not being disembarked until at least 18.30 means there will be little time to travel far.
> 
> Any suggestions?
> 
> Thanks in advance


Two nice places and we have used both when coming off the Santander ferry.

There is a smashing aire at Cabarceno; about 30 minutes from the port, beside a lake and, best of all, beside the National Park at Cabarceno and full of elephants, buffalo etc which you have a great view of. There is a full borne there

N43.35802/W3.81959

http://www.turismocantabria.es/es/que-ver-en-parque-de-cabarceno/65#alojamientos

The aire is free- you don't have to pay to go into the park unless you choose. You can see the big animals clearly enough !

If you look at the area on Google maps then you see the marked out area which is the actual borne. That is slightly sloping so most people park on the big area nearby, alongside the lake.

The second is the campsite at Santillana del Mar. This is open all year round, I think is ACSI rates but we did not pay at all, and is a short walk from a gorgeous little medieval village. Again, a short drive from Santander. Nice friendly campsite; we went in early January and were parked on the road as the grass pitches were wet. restaurant there too.

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/modules.php?name=Campsites&op=display_results&csid=10902

Both are in MHF database and the former is in All The Aires Spain

G

Edit to add links


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## Darloboy

Thanks Grizzly

Look like just what we need


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