# How many % of breakdowns are due to manufactuers?



## maddie (Jan 4, 2006)

Hi,I just wondered How many % of breakdowns are due to manufactures? or what % was due to say Trauma,dometec etc,things breaking down.(assuming they have been fitted correctly)Perhaps Swiftgroup keep figures? as to how many warranty claims are made or for poorly screwed together or actual -say -fridge breakdown etc.If figues are kept then say 20% are due to dometec etc,then no matter whose m/h is made by then you know to expect that amount of failure,if this makes sense?ie if say both swift and hymer both used the same fridge etc, a % of breakdowns would be down to dometec and a % down to swift or hymer?Not asking for cab breakdowns as everybody has favs vw,merc,fiat etc.
terry


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## dawnraider (Apr 2, 2006)

Terry, I think I understand where you are coming from, but not sure the manufacturer of the motorhomes will have that information. By this I mean if for instance I had a failure with a Thetford Fridge on my Auto Trail bought from a non local dealer ( which I have done ). I would bypass Auto Trail and the dealer and get a local Thetford agent to look at it for me. It would then be treated as a warranty item.


regards Ken


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## GerryD (Sep 20, 2007)

I cannot answer for Motorhomes but I can tell you that in domestic electrical equipment, on average over 80% of faults reported are either no fault found or user error. I would expect similar figures in Motorhomes. Biggest cause of no fault found or user error is a failure to read the manual before use.


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## rowley (May 14, 2005)

Maddie, perhaps this ought to be under a different heading. Seeing that it has Swift as a title many people with other makes may not look. So far everything on my Twin has been ok.


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## maddie (Jan 4, 2006)

Hi dawnraider & GerryD yes I can understand this but would think most people would go back to supplying dealer who then would charge Swift? and /or say dometec? just wondered?I have no doubt Swift would have figures as to how much they paid out to dealers,but none of my buissness as to how much :lol: just % of breakdown not attributed to maker?WE may find out as to which is more reliable Trauma or Waco say ?or do they use because of reliability or price?I suspose you could go onto alsorts of percieved quality /reliability
terry


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## maddie (Jan 4, 2006)

Hi rowley,I put it here as I know that swift & jcm both moniter the site so that I may get a reply,Both of these are the ONLY manufacturer / dealer brave/proliffic enough to post on here.I would bet a pound to a penny that the failure figures will be down next year at Swift.I cannot see hymer passing these on :lol: or any other
terry


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## pippin (Nov 15, 2007)

I agree with GerryD.

In my time as a TV repairer I would have been very rich indeed if I could have charged for every visit where it was 
"set OK, customer faulty"!!!!

Motorhomes are similarly complicated so dealers/manufacturers must spend an awful lot of time(=money) on non-faults.

Slighlty drifting off-topic but some manufacturers do make things difficult for the customer.

For example on our Hymer Transit MK7 base, the aircon comes on automatically when the ventilation controls are set to clear the windscreen.

Dealers must rue the day that Ford thought of that clever idea because they have been inundated with reported "faults" by people who have not read the manual which clearly states that the aircon comes on when windscreen is selected.

Take the Trumatic 6002EH system. 

In the manual the small pictures of the two controls and the text are confusing to the extreme. As are the marking on the actual knobs.

Why oh why did they use the same flame symbol on the power selector and the function selector to denote different things!

On the power selector knob the flame symbol denotes, quite logically, gas operation.

On the function selector knob the same flame symbol is used to denote hot air heating, which can be powered either from electricity or gas or both! Totally illogical.

I wonder how much time and money has been wasted by dealers in explaining the operation or advising that it is not faulty, due to confusion.

I have doctored the pictures (from the web) with boxes of text to make it clear, printed it out and pasted it up by the controls.

If anyone would like a copy of the .doc with the piccies of the Trumatic controls then PM me your email address.

The point of this little aside is that it is very often difficult to determine which "faults" are actually faults.


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

maddie said:


> Hi,I just wondered How many % of breakdowns are due to manufactures? or what % was due to say Trauma,dometec etc,things breaking down.(assuming they have been fitted correctly)Perhaps Swiftgroup keep figures? as to how many warranty claims are made or for poorly screwed together or actual -say -fridge breakdown etc.If figues are kept then say 20% are due to dometec etc,then no matter whose m/h is made by then you know to expect that amount of failure,if this makes sense?ie if say both swift and hymer both used the same fridge etc, a % of breakdowns would be down to dometec and a % down to swift or hymer?Not asking for cab breakdowns as everybody has favs vw,merc,fiat etc.
> terry


Terry, will come back on this one I need to do a bit of investigating.Peter


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## maddie (Jan 4, 2006)

Hi Peter thanks
BTW did you ever get any joy from Bostick re gunge around locker doors as I have missed reply
terry


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## maddie (Jan 4, 2006)

pippin said:


> I agree with GerryD.
> 
> In my time as a TV repairer I would have been very rich indeed if I could have charged for every visit where it was
> "set OK, customer faulty"!!!!
> ...


Hi perhaps JCM may like to answer this one ? DO THEY NOT SHOW people how to work things on handover?and yes I have no doubt people get excited and forget most of what is said :lol: 
terry


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## mariner01 (Feb 24, 2007)

*New Van Problems*

It is unfortunate that several complaints have been received by owners of new vans. This has caused some of our members to leave our Club because they have changed manufacturers. 
Some complaints are genuine whilst others are due to non compliance by dealers, ie not passing on correct information or doing the PDI properly. 
The manufacturer stance is see your dealer first and then if no satisfaction is gained go to the manufacturer. 
If the manufacturer has appointed a dealer to act on their behalf, there should be some form of quality control in place to ensure that the dealer performs according to the terms of the manufacturer/dealer agreement (contract?). 
One particular dealer's name (who shall be nameless) seems to pop up time and time again when complaints are received. Is the manufacturer doing something about this? 
There is no doubt that it does not help to rush back to the dealer like a bull in a china shop as justified as it may seem to the new owner. However, motorhomes are not cheap and many are purchased by those in retirement. The manufacturers and dealers alike should respect the fact that we are all ambassadors for the particular van we buy and should therefore provide us with the best after sales service. 
There is supposed to be a quality control procedure before any van leaves a factory and the dealer should also be doing his bit. Unfortunately this apparently appears to be lacking in many cases. WHY? 
I am writing this because I am concerned that many of our new and valuable members are leaving because their treasured van is apparently not fit for purpose. 
Best regards to everyone for 2008. Let's hope it is a better one for all concerned in the motorhoming world. 8)


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

maddie said:


> Hi Peter thanks
> BTW did you ever get any joy from Bostick re gunge around locker doors as I have missed reply
> terry


It was down to us for the most part we just did not clean off the excess in production however I will re ask the question on Monday.Peter.


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## maddie (Jan 4, 2006)

*Re: New Van Problems*



mariner01 said:


> It is unfortunate that several complaints have been received by owners of new vans. This has caused some of our members to leave our Club because they have changed manufacturers.
> Some complaints are genuine whilst others are due to non compliance by dealers, ie not passing on correct information or doing the PDI properly.
> The manufacturer stance is see your dealer first and then if no satisfaction is gained go to the manufacturer.
> If the manufacturer has appointed a dealer to act on their behalf, there should be some form of quality control in place to ensure that the dealer performs according to the terms of the manufacturer/dealer agreement (contract?).
> ...


Hi what club are you refering to please?and/or a little background?
terry


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## SwiftGroup (Jun 27, 2007)

maddie said:


> Hi,I just wondered How many % of breakdowns are due to manufactures? or what % was due to say Trauma,dometec etc,things breaking down.(assuming they have been fitted correctly)Perhaps Swiftgroup keep figures? as to how many warranty claims are made or for poorly screwed together or actual -say -fridge breakdown etc.If figues are kept then say 20% are due to dometec etc,then no matter whose m/h is made by then you know to expect that amount of failure,if this makes sense?ie if say both swift and hymer both used the same fridge etc, a % of breakdowns would be down to dometec and a % down to swift or hymer?Not asking for cab breakdowns as everybody has favs vw,merc,fiat etc.
> terry


My view on this is that in general we all use the same bits but it is how we screw them together that counts! I've got to admit that the Germans in general do it better BUT I know that we are catching up fast and talking to Importers the Germans are not without their faults and when they go wrong they can be woefully slow to react.It seems to take too long for us to find out there is a component fault because the dealer/customer contacts the component supplier and bypasses us,so there is some way togo and we have to ensure buying a motorhome is a pleasure.MHF members can and are playing a part and although JCM and our selves are the only participants you can be sure there are many more Dealers/Manufacturers reading the site.


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