# blue badge



## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

i did not want to hijack the other thread on this topic but i have a question,
i can see the reasons for a blue badge because of the need for easier access for the people who are physically less able, but why should the parking be free?


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## Telbell (May 1, 2005)

> but why should the parking be free?


Not around here it ain't

Depends on the local authority. I presume some are more generous than others- or more trapped for cash depending on your point of view


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## autostratus (May 9, 2005)

karlb said:


> i did not want to hijack the other thread on this topic but i have a question,
> i can see the reasons for a blue badge because of the need for easier access for the people who are physically less able, but why should the parking be free?


One reason may be that the local authority may prefer to give a blue badge holder a free car parking space rather than push someone on disability benefits into parking free on double yellow lines to the possible detriment of other traffic.


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

autostratus said:


> karlb said:
> 
> 
> > i did not want to hijack the other thread on this topic but i have a question,
> ...


people on other benefits have to pay so why not disability benefit?


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## Sonesta (May 10, 2005)

Not all people who are issued with blue badges are on invalidity or mobility benefits etc. 

I have recently been issued with a blue badge and very appreciative of it I am too - but I can assure you, that I am NOT in receipt of one single penny from anyone or anybody! :? My husband and I still work and we ask for nothing from no-one! Not that there is any shame in being in receipt of benefits and for those that are entitled to them and have worked hard all their life, I say jolly good luck to them but the myth that all badge holders are benefit claimers, is totally untrue!  

As for parking for FREE - that's very nice when it is applicable but again this is NOT always the case and for me personally, it's not about parking for nothing that truly benefits me, it's more about the convenience and advantages of parking close to where I need to be! If you have a mobility problem, then car parking location, location, location is the main advantage of holding a blue badge!

Sue


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## backaxle (Nov 6, 2006)

Blue badges are issued to people with mobility problems i.e. cannot walk very far without severe dicomfort.Therefore they are forced to use a car etc. to get around and the car is their lifeline.Other people on a car park prosumably have the option of walking or driving to the shops and car park, or of parking further away.To charge a blue badge holder is like charging them because they are disabled and have no choice.
Backaxle.


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

backaxle said:


> Blue badges are issued to people with mobility problems i.e. cannot walk very far without severe dicomfort.Therefore they are forced to use a car etc. to get around and the car is their lifeline.Other people on a car park prosumably have the option of walking or driving to the shops and car park, or of parking further away.To charge a blue badge holder is like charging them because they are disabled and have no choice.
> Backaxle.


i agree in part, but surely if the council charge for parking they charge because the person is in a car not because they are disabled, also the lifeline point is very weak there are many fully fit people who would class there car as a lifeline.
the point im trying to make is. Yes there is a valid point for blue badges,but imo if parking charges apply they should apply to ALL.


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## ShinyFiat (Jun 2, 2009)

most blue badge holders i see parking in disabled spaces dont seem to have any walking disibility to me, also are they entitled to park in mother/baby spaces if there are no disabled spaces left?


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## ChrisandJohn (Feb 3, 2008)

karlb said:


> i did not want to hijack the other thread on this topic but i have a question,
> i can see the reasons for a blue badge because of the need for easier access for the people who are physically less able, but why should the parking be free?


There are situations where, if you can't walk far, you would have to park in several different places rather than park in one place and walk to the others. Over time this could mean paying a lot more for your parking.

When I used to take my Dad into our local town I would have to do this. It didn't make any financial difference to us because only one of the parking spots had to be paid for, and that was only 30p for an hour. If, however, I'd had to pay that 30p several times, on several days a week, it would have made a significant difference.

Chris


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## backaxle (Nov 6, 2006)

Karlb
Perhaps we should ALL have a blue badge then?in your world.
Shinyfiat.
I think you are talking about supermarkets where parking is free anyway.


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## ChrisandJohn (Feb 3, 2008)

ShinyFiat said:


> most blue badge holders i see parking in disabled spaces dont seem to have any walking disibility to me


How can you judge from a casual glance what disability a person has and how it is affecting them?

For a brief time between diagnosis and death from pancreatic cancer, my son-in-law, age 32 and apparently fit, had a disabled badge. He sometimes used to get stick from people nearby when he used it presumably as he didn't look like the stereotype of a disabled person.

Chris


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## lalala (Aug 13, 2009)

I have a broken leg but cannot get a blue badge to enable easier access to places for me. Lots of people are in a similar temporarily disabled position and really need this benefit of more accessible parking, yet for us this is simply not available. I would have thought that a temporary two or three month badge would not be too difficult to provide. It's the access that is important not that parking might be free. I just can't walk far on crutches so will end up probably not going out much!
I have at times seen all occupants of a car displaying a blue badge just walking to or from it quite normally, perhaps the criteria for getting a badge should be re-assessed.
lala


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## ShinyFiat (Jun 2, 2009)

lala, that was all i intended to get across

chris, i didnt mean to offend or hurt anyone, apologies


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

backaxle said:


> Karlb
> Perhaps we should ALL have a blue badge then?in your world.
> Shinyfiat.
> I think you are talking about supermarkets where parking is free anyway.


where parking charges apply i think everybody should pay, with the blue badge holders getting the best/easy access places.


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

ShinyFiat said:


> most blue badge holders i see parking in disabled spaces dont seem to have any walking disibility to me, also are they entitled to park in mother/baby spaces if there are no disabled spaces left?


You cannot see at a glance what the reason is so that is not a reasonable assumption.

No they should not park in spaces for other designated users e.g. mother and child (but the same works in reverse).

The use of the blue badges are controlled and infringement of the correct use can carry a heavy fine - much more than a normal parking ticket (£400+) and results in removal of the privilege to use it. It is NOT a right.

Sadly we often see people park in such designated spaces without displaying the blue badge - that will lead to questions.

Free parking only happens in some areas, extended time for the same fees in others and no concessions in others (e.g. Central London where the scheme does not operate).

Temporary disability is not covered - I spent 9 months in a wheelchair followed by a year on crutches but was not deemed eligible!  I would agree that this is an area that needs re-examining but would be open to even more abuse.

Hope that helps clarify the use of these aids.

Dave


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## Mrplodd (Mar 4, 2008)

I am with Karlb on this one !!


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## tonyt (May 25, 2005)

Mrplodd said:


> I am with Karlb on this one !!


Me too.


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## Stanner (Aug 17, 2006)

ShinyFiat said:


> most blue badge holders i see parking in disabled spaces dont seem to have any walking disibility to me, also are they entitled to park in mother/baby spaces if there are no disabled spaces left?


Parent and child spaces have no legal standing whatsoever. They are simply intended to allow extra space to get screaming brats in and out of ever larger and more enveloping child seats.

I've never understood why so many BMW's, Jag's, Audi's and Merc's need free parking either.



> You cannot see at a glance what the reason is so that is not a reasonable assumption.


But surely the "disability" should be sufficient to exclude the ability to sprint across the road to a cash point?


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## Sonesta (May 10, 2005)

Ooh dear ............... so many sceptics! :roll: Let's just hope that those that scoff and complain about those that have been issued with them - don't ever end up needing a blue badge themselves is all I can say!  

Sue


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

Now where have I seen this debate recently karb :wink: 

Not all councils allow free parking and even some that do, it does not apply in all car parks. We paid yesterday simply for the convenience and my wife has a blue badge. I could have parked elsewhere free but it would have been further from where we wanted to be. Yes I could afford to pay and very often have to but it is as autstratus says if you don't want to pay, go and park on the yellow lines as long as it is not causing an obstruction.

The real answer, in my view, is don't issue blue badges willy nilly and only allow those vehicles which are VED exempt to park on yellow lines and free in allocated spaces.

peedee


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

Stanner said:


> I've never understood why so many BMW's, Jag's, Audi's and Merc's need free parking either.


You forgot Volvos and the Chelsea chariots 

peedee


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## Chausson (Oct 17, 2006)

Hi
To all those that scoff at people with blue badges and love to have a pop at them. I was going to comment on your issues but decided against it, least to say the majority of holders are genuine and need the badge. You will see able body people and mother with child use the disabled spaces simply as it's closer to the shop and I have been told by a woman using the space to f=== off you old fart.
In Wales pregnant women will soon be having their own parking spaces now you tell me what that is all about??????? and leave disabled people alone.

Ron


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## backaxle (Nov 6, 2006)

Well !This is really the season of good will to ALL men


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## Stanner (Aug 17, 2006)

Chausson said:


> Hi
> To all those that scoff at people with blue badges and love to have a pop at them. I was going to comment on your issues but decided against it, least to say the majority of holders are genuine and need the badge. You will see able body people and mother with child use the disabled spaces simply as it's closer to the shop and I have been told by a woman using the space to f=== off you old fart.
> In Wales pregnant women will soon be having their own parking spaces now you tell me what that is all about??????? and leave disabled people alone.
> 
> Ron


Unfortunately a lot of the (ab)use of Blue Badges attracts scoffing, track suited BMW drivers who can sprint across busy roads to cash machines/off licences/newsagents etc. and in particular around here badge holders who are able to park on the double yellow lines either side of a dangerous junction walk over 800yds into town, shop in the market for two hours and then miraculously carry 2 or 3 heavy bags of shopping back to their car.
Also a lot of Blue Badges seem to be permanently & conveniently left on the dash even when the badge holder isn't within miles of the car or the car is left parked on yellow lines/in a disabled bay with the badge holder sitting in the car whilst the rest of the (apparently perfectly fit) occupants go off shopping.

My very disabled 89yrs old Mum has a Blue badge BUT it stays in her shopping bag until such time as it is needed for her use and her use alone.

The use of too many others does not appear to be subject to the same degree of diligence.

I know not all Badge holders are cheats but a large number most definitely are and anybody who doesn't accept that is severely delusional.


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## ChrisandJohn (Feb 3, 2008)

Stanner said:


> I know not all Badge holders are cheats but a large number most definitely are and anybody who doesn't accept that is severely delusional.


Of course there are always cheats, in this and in other situations. I just think you have to be careful making assumptions about who they are, based only on observations and stereotyped ideas.

Chris


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## Sonesta (May 10, 2005)

As Chris quite rightly states there are and always will be cheats to be found and sadly, in every walk of life from vicars to politicians, you will find such people!

Personally, being a blue badge holder myself, who greatly appreciates the advantages it allows me, I find myself getting somewhat annoyed at some of the slurs and opinions that some people hold towards those who have been quite rightly issued with one. They are not just given to anyone, you have to have a recogniseble medical condition and all applications are closely scrutinised and checked before a decision is granted. 

It is opinions like some of those expressed in this thread, that can very often lead to the genuine and deserving applicants feeling extremely reluctant to apply for what they are entitled to and some people's pride and dignity can quite understandably feel threatened by the stereotypical views shown by the ignorance and intolerance of those that in all fairness, should know better.

Sue


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## dawnwynne (Nov 14, 2009)

I think it comes down to choice. We have a choice to either use our vehicles or not. Walk or drive. If we drive we pay. 

However, those that legitmately need blue badges do not have that choice. Simple as that. And instead of being upset that they 'might' get free and/or better parking spots than the rest of us only makes me realise how lucky I am and long may it last!


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

There is one other category of entitled blue badge holder that you have overlooked in the various criticisms that have been levelled on this thread;

Institutions that look after disabled people (who would be entitled to a blue badge themselves) are allowed to hold a badge so that they can use it with all of the residents.

We have a daughter who has held a blue badge since she was 11 years old, she falls over frequently and has a condition that severely limits how far she walks as she fatigues abnormally. The unit that she lives in holds such a badge as do many others in similar positions.

We have used her badge *with her* simply to park as close as possible to reduce the risk of her falling and injuring herself. But she looks perfectly normal when she gets out of the car and walks OK for about 25m before starting to have problems.

So any of those who commented earlier would assume that she is OK and is using the badge fraudulently. Only if they followed her for more than about 25m would they begin to realise that she has problems.

It is easy to make assumptions and criticise all and sundry, I am sure that there is abuse of the system, but do not think it is anything like as high as others suggest.

Zero rated VED is only available to those in receipt of mobility benefit (as it used to be called) - it is now the Mobility Component of the Disabled Living Allowance and is simply one part of a package designed to reduce the problems associated with having a disability.

Sadly many people have a disability that does not attract such support for various reasons - these people are then handicapped by the attitude that is shown by some people to them. The blue badge is one comparatively cheap form of support that is given to such people.

If you suspect a blue badge is being abused you may report it to a police officer or a parking attendant who have the authority to check that the holder is the one using it (as evidenced by the picture on the reverse side of the badge) - if abuse is discovered then action IS taken. Use that system rather than just complaining on here. That would be for the benefit of all of us, holders or not IMO.

Dave


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## Texas (May 9, 2005)

*Blue badge abuse*

In our local Library/social services car park, the 4 disabled spaces are often abused by the able-bodied council/social services staff that administer to the needs of the disabled.


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## brockley (Mar 6, 2009)

I can see both sides of the debate. There can't be many of us who haven't been affected by disability somewhere along the way and I'm sure that any assistance for those among us with disabilities is greatly appreciated. We don't have blue badges in the Isle of Man but there is a similar type of badge scheme and the way traffic has increased here over the years, parking has now become an issue. What I can't get my head round is the way some of these reserved parking spaces seem to have the wrong markings, they should have "Lourdes" in big white letters next to them because I can testify to having seen a few miracles.


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## backaxle (Nov 6, 2006)

Lets take it a step further and ask why do OAP get free bus passes?Why give consessions to anyone?Some people on here think that all people on benefits should get the same treatment.ie.free parking etc.Do you really think that if you charge disabled people for parking and OAPs bus fares it will make life better for you?and by the way you don't have to be on benefits to have a blue badge,in fact you can have one if you are working,plus they are not free,there is a fee so the parking is not for free.

I am beginning to think that TOM of BROWNHILLS is correct when he says that MHF is just a club of GRUMPY old men :evil: 
There, I have had my say so HAPPY NEW YEAR (to some of you)

Backaxle :lol:


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

Blue badge griping will soon equal juddering,and gassing. :roll: 

tony


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## Stanner (Aug 17, 2006)

Sonesta said:


> As Chris quite rightly states there are and always will be cheats to be found and sadly, in every walk of life from vicars to politicians, you will find such people!
> 
> Personally, being a blue badge holder myself, who greatly appreciates the advantages it allows me, I find myself getting somewhat annoyed at some of the slurs and opinions that some people hold towards those who have been quite rightly issued with one. They are not just given to anyone, you have to have a recogniseble medical condition and all applications are closely scrutinised and checked before a decision is granted.
> 
> ...


You all miss the point - it's not who they are issued to to - as I said my mother has (and needs) one but it is ONLY used by her - that is clearly not always the case with some other badges.

I quite accept not everybody who uses one is a cheat and I thought I had made that clear - BUT - abuse does take place and it isn't some isolated aberration.

If it was all sweetness and light with everybody observing the rules this.. 


> ""Two thirds of councils tell us abuse of the scheme is a major issue - and that around 1 in every 200 Badges in circulation are reported as stolen each year. And with forged or stolen Badges reportedly being sold on the black market for up to £1,500 a time, it is time to get tough and stop Blue Badge abuse and vehicle crime. Alongside this we need to make sure that everyone who needs a Badge receives one, and that is why I have today announced that we will be extending the scope of the scheme.""


 would not need to be said. 
Here http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Nl1/Newsroom/DG_172392

Or are two thirds of councils making it up?

Neither would cases like these 
http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/transport/article3241387.ece 
http://www.tamesideadvertiser.co.uk/news/s/1099418_fined_for_blue_badge_abuse 
get regularly reported in the press.

It is even a subject of debate on the Scope forum 
http://www.scope.org.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=685

It is widely held (not least by Local and Central Government) that there is widespread abuse and surely it is not too much to expect "for people with severe mobility problems" to mean that such people actually have "severe mobility problems" i.e. not be able to sprint across busy roads or not be able to walk long distances carrying heavy bags of shopping - both instances where I have allowed an "assumption" based on observation to cloud my judgement.

Nonetheless I can't do either and I don't think I would qualify for a badge


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## backaxle (Nov 6, 2006)

Stanner,there is massive abuse of the system,but that does not mean we should charge the disabled to park,this is how the topic started,should an ex serviceman with no legs pay to park outside a shop?No,but some would have it that way.
Abuse is probably higher on the other side of the argument ;I take my grandaughter to Tae Kwon Do lessons at a nearby gym where the disabled parking is close to the door,these bays are always filled by super fit young women and men having a work out or running around the track,yet they are too idle to walk a few yards from their cars,but force disabled people to struggle in pain to walk from the overflow car park.
Abuse is also experienced (of the verbal kind) if you complain.

Backaxle.


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

backaxle said:


> Stanner,there is massive abuse of the system,but that does not mean we should charge the disabled to park,this is how the topic started,should an ex serviceman with no legs pay to park outside a shop?No,but some would have it that way.
> Abuse is probably higher on the other side of the argument ;I take my grandaughter to Tae Kwon Do lessons at a nearby gym where the disabled parking is close to the door,these bays are always filled by super fit young women and men having a work out or running around the track,yet they are too idle to walk a few yards from their cars,but force disabled people to struggle in pain to walk from the overflow car park.
> Abuse is also experienced (of the verbal kind) if you complain.
> 
> Backaxle.


you are quoting an extreme example to make a point, on the other hand should a banker with a bad leg who quite rightly has a blue badge but he also earns 100k a year should he get free parking??
i dont get why you think being disabled entitles someone to free parking,
convenient parking yes free no.


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## backaxle (Nov 6, 2006)

karlb said:


> backaxle said:
> 
> 
> > Stanner,there is massive abuse of the system,but that does not mean we should charge the disabled to park,this is how the topic started,should an ex serviceman with no legs pay to park outside a shop?No,but some would have it that way.
> ...


This could go on for ever;
Should the soldier have one leg or two
Should the above banker get a bus pass?
Should the queen get a pension?
The point I am making is that we have this system and to take it away would benefit no one, just burden the disabled further.Everybody else would still pay(except perhaps a few green eyed monsters)

Regards Backaxle


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## ChrisandJohn (Feb 3, 2008)

karlb said:


> backaxle said:
> 
> 
> > Stanner,there is massive abuse of the system,but that does not mean we should charge the disabled to park,this is how the topic started,should an ex serviceman with no legs pay to park outside a shop?No,but some would have it that way.
> ...


I think it has been pointed out that a blue badge would not normally entitle it's holder to free parking. In some circumstances organisations running car parks or parking schemes feel it is appropriate to offer free parking. They probably lose little revenue by doing so. If they were to try to distinguish between parkers on grounds of income it would cost them a fortune. We have to accept that the system is not perfect, no system that has to deal with broad categories of people will ever be perfectly fair.

Chris


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## Sonesta (May 10, 2005)

Parking FREE for the disabled is few and far between and most of the time, blue badge holders pay like everybody else! 

As I've said before, the benefit to the user of a blue badge has nothing to do with getting something for FREE - it's mainly being able to park in designated bays that are conveniently located and when you have a mobility problem, that privilege is very much appreciated.

What's with all the animosity towards blue badge holders anyway and why does the thoughts that some local authorities allow FREE parking for the disabled bug some of you so much? Just be grateful that you don't need such mobility aid and assistance!

Sue


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## bigfoot (May 16, 2005)

Generally free parking for blue badge holder is only for those with nil VED discs. A friend of mine's daughter has cystic fybrosis,she doesn't drive,but is elligible for a blue badge. The comments from some ignorant members of the community are appalling. She has good and bad days,like we do,but her bad days are horrendous. There are also many eligibility criteria for issueing of a blue badge,a lot of which are not visible to the casual observer. My main gripes are parking in designated bays and misuse of badges. Also some holders who park on double yellows because their clock allows them 3 hours,but hold up the traffic flow. Yet they could park around the corner and be as close to the shop they wanted.


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## Stanner (Aug 17, 2006)

Yes you are right the debate did start about whether it should just be convenient or both convenient AND free. I never caused the veering off it was the leave ANYBODY with a blue badge alone brigade that did that all I did was point out that not everybody with a blue badge either needs it ( the abuse angle) or needs free parking (the "why should it be free for everybody" angle started by the OP.

My point has simply been that not everyone who "USES" a blue badge has the right to do so and not everybody who uses a blue badge needs to have free parking - the OP's point (not mine!).

The real argument should be universal benefits? or means tested benefits?

Which?
Personally I'm in favour of universal benefits with clawback via taxation if applicable (on basis of income).
That way everybody would get all the benefits they are entitled to without having to jump through all the means testing hoops that dissuade many of the truly deserving from claiming their rights - it would then be clawed back from those who are sufficiently well off not to require the help, by way of taxation.
The saving in admin cost would not be inconsiderable either as the means testing system is both costly and very inefficient.

Finally I'm not against the disabled (my father was severely disabled for 20 odd years and my mother is now so as well after caring for my father for so long) nor against the blue badge scheme just very unhappy with the level of it's abuse.

Also, sorry but if I see someone park on double yellows stick a blue badge in the window and sprint across 2 lanes of traffic I will continue to make assumptions based on that observation, I expect severely reduced mobility to mean just that.


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## Autoquest (May 16, 2007)

Perhaps some of the problem is that there are sometimes way to many disabled parking spaces allocated in a given car park (our local B&Q is ridiculous) so everyone parks at the back of beyond and runs out of spaces whilst there are acres of 'reserved' (and empty) space for blue badge holders?

Similar situation in some CC sites - I have turned up to a full site at five o'clock and can't level on the last pitch from hell when there is a perfectly level, empty and apparently unreserved pitch left but can you use it for one night? can you hell, 'What happens if a disabled person turns up?' I'm quoted..

Our local beauty spot had parking space for five cars - now the handrails have gone in and the yellow lines and the signposts, there is now one ginormous disabled spot and parking for two others.

Is it any wonder that some people have no option sometimes but park incorrectly? Perhaps a better system would be to fill up from the back giving priority to spots at the front for the disabled but as the all fill up - When their gone their gone... and yes, everyone should pay (including the congestion charge)


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## sweetie (Nov 28, 2005)

My late father used to have a blue badge & motability car. He had calipers on both legs and needed a stick but he would not park on yellow lines as he reckoned they had been put there for a reason. But felt parking should be paid for.

I think the blue badge is a good idea because it helps many people! BUT they should pay for parking as the rest of us have to if using car parking.

I think they have to pay for parking where we live in cromer as the disabled bays in car park are usually empty but the road 30m away is usually full, 

Slightly off topic but it always makes me laugh when you go to a county show or large show and the disabled parking is right by the main entrance to the show ! Yet they are just going to walk around a show covering 10's of acres. 

Steve


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## Invicta (Feb 9, 2006)

quote="Penquin"] 
Institutions that look after disabled people (who would be entitled to a blue badge themselves) are allowed to hold a badge so that they can use it with all of the residents.

If you suspect a blue badge is being abused you may report it to a police officer or a parking attendant who have the authority to check that the holder is the one using it (as evidenced by the picture on the reverse side of the badge) - if abuse is discovered then action IS taken. Use that system rather than just complaining on here. That would be for the benefit of all of us, holders or not IMO.

Dave[/quote]

Kent County Council has now quite rightly IMO stopped issuing blue badges to charities involved with disabled people and to residential homes. Blue badges in Kent are now only issued to named people. This is a good policy as I have seen the drivers of minibuses and MPvs belonging charities and residential homes displaying a blue badge parking in disabled bays when there were no disabled people being carried in the vehicles.

There is no uniformity in the UK regarding the issuing of blue badges. For example I know of a blue badge holder in Northern Ireland who has no problem with her mobility. She was issued with one on the strength that she has a bladder problem and having a blue badge allows her to park nearer to a toilet (she says).

There needs to be far more checking of blue badges to stop illegal use. I have written elsewhere on this site that I had attended a meeting of the Kent Parking Managers' Forum a couple of years ago where I was told that council parking attendants were fearful of asking to see the photographs on blue badges when it was felt that misuse was occuring. This was because they had experiences of both verbal and physical abuse shown towards them when wanting to check that the person in the vehicle was the same person as the photo displayed on the blue badge.

I am a blue badge holder myself. I am unable to use the free public transport that as a person in receipt of the state retirement pension is entitled to so I do not feel guilty about getting three hours free parking where it is available.

I do feel guilty using disabled parking bays in supermarket car parks when I am using my electric mobility scooter as I can access the entrance as easily as an ambulant shopper however it is very difficult to load and unload my scooter in a non disabled bay as these are not usually as spacious as a disabled bay. This is a similar situation to Parent and Toddler parking.

I agree that there should be short term availability of blue badges for people for example with temporary mobility problems, ie broken lower limbs or awaiting hip replacements. An organisation to which I belong (Mobilise) is campaigning for this.

The blue badge of a diseased person in Kent now has to be handed over to the registrar at the time of registering the death. This has only happened since my husband died in 2005. Then one was expected to sent the badge back by post. Does this happen in other parts of the UK?

While many blue badge holders have road tax exempted vehicles others do not so. The reason being that they can only be used by or for the disabled person. If there is only one vehicle in the family this would mean for example that it should not be used for any other purpose such as the spouse / partner using the car to get to and from work.

This is another area in which there is abuse. I know of a couple where the car that has been provided by Motability is road tax exempted yet the disabled family member is hardly ever in it. The wife uses it for all her social activities. Just before Christmas a member of my family wanted to borrow my car which is tax exempted to collect a picture that was too large to fit in theirs. The only way they could use it for this purpose was for me to go with them. Even then one could argue that it was not a legitimate use of my car as the picture was not for me. They hired a van to solve the problem.

There is abuse in everything these days, not just in blue badge use. Benefit fraud, tax and VAT evasion, just to name the more common. We have all done something even if it was just bringing home a paper clip from the office. A quotation worth remembering here I believe is;

"He that is without sin among you, let him cast the first stone"


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## backaxle (Nov 6, 2006)

What a sad society we live in when we spend new years day trying to justify getting a few extra pence,for parking ,out of the chronically sick and disabled.


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## lalala (Aug 13, 2009)

> I agree that there should be short term availability of blue badges for people for example with temporary mobility problems, ie broken lower limbs or awaiting hip replacements. An organisation to which I belong (Mobilise) is campaigning for this.


Invicta

Thanks for this Invicta, I shall look up the organisation on the net
lala


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

Stanner said:


> Also, sorry but if I see someone park on double yellows stick a blue badge in the window and sprint across 2 lanes of traffic I will continue to make assumptions based on that observation, I expect severely reduced mobility to mean just that.


If you see that then please take note of the registration number, the time and location and the details that are shown and report it as a potential abuse of the system.

Please do not just ignore such things - genuine users do not object to being checked up on, abusers would quickly get the message and this might reduce the abuse. 8O

The scheme is essential for many people but it does come with restrictions as to how and where it can be used; that includes causing an obstruction is not permitted, neither is parking in places designated for other users such as residents. :?

The current fee for a blue badge issue by Devon County Council is £2 - not exactly a vast amount to many with a reasonable income but for some people who are on benefits it may be a considerable amount. 

Please do not just "knock" the scheme but get involved by passing on concerns about potential abuse to the relevant authorities. That would help everyone without risk of personal attack or abuse to you. Avoid direct confrontation - it is not worth it! :lol:


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

backaxle said:


> What a sad society we live in when we spend new years day trying to justify getting a few extra pence,for parking ,out of the chronically sick and disabled.


EXTREME!!! whats wrong with you chronically sick!!
it is indeed a sad society when people try to stifle debate with inappropriate extreme examples just to make a point :roll:


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## bigtwin (May 24, 2008)

EXTREME!!! whats wrong with you chronically sick!!
it is indeed a sad society when people try to stifle debate with inappropriate extreme examples just to make a point :roll:[/quote]

I'd have thought that the response from an earlier poster who rightly outlined that people who have mobility problems have NO CHOICE about how they travel to undertake everyday chores. Consequently they incur costs that those with no impairment do not.

Does this point not adequately address your original question?


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## backaxle (Nov 6, 2006)

karlb said:


> backaxle said:
> 
> 
> > What a sad society we live in when we spend new years day trying to justify getting a few extra pence,for parking ,out of the chronically sick and disabled.
> ...


EXTREME!! Are you so ignorant you do not know what chronicically sick means!
It is what the majority of Blue Badge holders are!
I just hope you never experience it and then find yourself on the end of abuse for needing a Blue Badge.
Believe me if you had Rheumatoid Arthritis(which is a chronic illness) you would see this whole debate from a more extreme,as you put it, angle too :!: :!:


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## Zozzer (Aug 13, 2006)

backaxle said:


> karlb said:
> 
> 
> > backaxle said:
> ...


Some people simply don't understand and don't want to know what a disability is. All they see is somebody else getting something they are not, it is nothing more than petty jealousy. They close there minds to the years of pain and suffering that people go through.

I'm disabled, with osteo arithritus, COPD, that's Chronic Obstructive Pulmonary Disease for those who don't know as well as diabetese. So until the law changes or some one nails the lid down on my box, I'll take everything that I am entitled to.

Free Parking, Free Dartford Crossing, Free M6Toll.

Perhaps I should put all these perks up on Ebay in exhange for a body transplant.


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## peribro (Sep 6, 2009)

Zozzer said:


> backaxle said:
> 
> 
> > karlb said:
> ...


I can understand the argument in favour of free parking on the basis that people who are unfortunate enough to be disabled do not have the option of walking to the shops etc etc but how does this logic apply to the Dartford Crossing and M6 toll?


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## backaxle (Nov 6, 2006)

peribro said:


> Zozzer said:
> 
> 
> > backaxle said:
> ...


I wasn't aware that Dartford tunnel and the M6 toll were free to BB holders.I always pay at Dartford and avoid the M6 toll.I have been informed that Tolls are reduced in France on production of a BB(maybe they are more enlightened)but I never use it there either.Maybe the logic is that BB holders have no choice but to use a car as transport and should not be charged because of that.
Has I have pointed out before giving something for free does not cost anybody else more.It just frustrates the jealous.

Kind Regards.
Backaxle


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## ShinyFiat (Jun 2, 2009)

why should bb holders get free passage on the Dartford Tunnel or the M6 Toll for that matter, disabled or not, you are using the road just the same as anyone else. i dont agree with this.

i fully understand that most of bb holders really need and rely on them for better standard of life, however more often than not, the people i see making use of these are fat overweight people who, if they maybe tried eating a little less and got up of their fat arses then they wouldnt need them and they might even be fit to go and do a days work


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## autostratus (May 9, 2005)

peribro said:


> Zozzer said:
> 
> 
> > backaxle said:
> ...


Unless it has recently changed:
*Dartford - Thurrock River Crossing (River Thames)*
People who are exempt from vehicle excise duty (Road tax) can cross for free.


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## backaxle (Nov 6, 2006)

ShinyFiat said:


> why should bb holders get free passage on the Dartford Tunnel or the M6 Toll for that matter, disabled or not, you are using the road just the same as anyone else. i dont agree with this.
> 
> i fully understand that most of bb holders really need and rely on them for better standard of life, however more often than not, the people i see making use of these are fat overweight people who, if they maybe tried eating a little less and got up of their fat arses then they wouldnt need them and they might even be fit to go and do a days work


As I said it upsets the jealous and makes them nasty twisted and offensive :evil:

Backaxle.
(neither fat ,fat arsed or workshy)


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## ShinyFiat (Jun 2, 2009)

backaxle, if you would read the post properly you will see that i say that most bb holders are genuine and rely on these.
read the post properly before you start popping at others comments


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## Chausson (Oct 17, 2006)

ShinyFiat said:


> why should bb holders get free passage on the Dartford Tunnel or the M6 Toll for that matter, disabled or not, you are using the road just the same as anyone else. i dont agree with this.
> 
> i fully understand that most of bb holders really need and rely on them for better standard of life, however more often than not, the people i see making use of these are fat overweight people who, if they maybe tried eating a little less and got up of their fat arses then they wouldnt need them and they might even be fit to go and do a days work


Can I just say M6 toll is NOT free to BB holders you have to pay I think it's 15pounds for one years passage so if you use it once it's expensive.
The other point is that YOU are getting very personal and there is no need to be so insulting.
I would ask the MODS to stop this thread please.

Ron


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## autostratus (May 9, 2005)

peribro said:


> Zozzer said:
> 
> 
> > backaxle said:
> ...


*M6 Toll (North of Birmingham*
Those eligible must apply in advance for an M6 Toll Mobility Pass for their nominated vehicle. No other evidence of disability will be accepted.

Those in receipt of the higher rate mobility component of the Disability Living Allowance and those exempt from vehicle excise duty (road tax) should apply to Midland Expressway limited.

Etc. Etc


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## ShinyFiat (Jun 2, 2009)

Ron

explain very personal to me please


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

backaxle said:


> peribro said:
> 
> 
> > Zozzer said:
> ...


giving something for free does not cost anybody else more?
if nobody paid for anything what services and roads/hospitals would there be for the chronically sick?
in your earlier posts you called me ignorant! :roll:

kind regards
karlb


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## Chausson (Oct 17, 2006)

ShinyFiat said:


> Ron
> 
> explain very personal to me please


FAT

By the way I am not.


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## backaxle (Nov 6, 2006)

karlb said:


> backaxle said:
> 
> 
> > peribro said:
> ...


So you pay more to park (the original thread)because a BB holder gets it free :?: and has been said," not all parking is free for BB holders."


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## ShinyFiat (Jun 2, 2009)

Ron

I did not call you FAT, i feel like we are all back in the playground here.

read the post, or put your glasses on ,


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

backaxle said:


> karlb said:
> 
> 
> > backaxle said:
> ...


everything has a cost and so my understanding is the more that pay the less cost the individual has to pay for that service. is this not true?

@backaxel thanked in error


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## Stanner (Aug 17, 2006)

In some areas (Tendring District amongst others so I am told) free bus passes are costing EVERYBODY (inc. the free bus pass holders) their bus services, as there are too few paying passengers to run the service.


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## backaxle (Nov 6, 2006)

ShinyFiat said:


> Ron
> 
> I did not call you FAT, i feel like we are all back in the playground here.
> 
> read the post, or put your glasses on ,


You brought it down to playground level when you started calling the BB holders of N.Ireland fatarsed and workshy :lol: 
Backaxle .
(I agree this is getting too personal so I am leaving this chitchat forum and getting involved with the big boys in the members bar)


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## Chausson (Oct 17, 2006)

ShinyFiat said:


> Ron
> 
> I did not call you FAT, i feel like we are all back in the playground here.
> 
> read the post, or put your glasses on ,


I did not say you called me fat. But people that are OBESE take exception to your manner, SOME obese people cannot help their weight problem regardless of what you may think and say, it's the same attitude that started this small minded thread off, some need to get off their high horse and thank god that they are fit and not obese just think it CAN happen to you what would your attitude be then I wonder.


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## ShinyFiat (Jun 2, 2009)

lets be friends Ron, eh

its a forum where you are supposed to be fit to air your opinion, not all will agree with it. Why post on any subject if you cannot receive comments/public opinion in return?


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

Chausson said:


> ShinyFiat said:
> 
> 
> > Ron
> ...


small minded?
please read original question, i agree with the blue badge scheme but i ask again why should it be free? from your last comment your horse appears quite large to me :wink:


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## Chausson (Oct 17, 2006)

I have no axe to grind or little green men on my shoulder.

Think I shall now stop responding on this thread and join backaxle.


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## Chausson (Oct 17, 2006)

ShinyFiat said:


> lets be friends Ron, eh
> 
> its a forum where you are supposed to be fit to air your opinion, not all will agree with it. Why post on any subject if you cannot receive comments/public opinion in return?


I don't hold a grudge and everyone is entitled to their opinion but, above all lets keep it FRIENDLY.

Ron


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

karlb said:


> i agree with the blue badge scheme but i ask again why should it be free?


and has been pointed out it is not always free. I will twist it round the other way. Would you like the additional expenses most disabled have to incur in their daily lives. Yup they get some assitance but it no where near meets the cost of trying to lead as normal a life as possible and no benefits don't cover it either.

I won't bore you with examples but I do speak from 28 years of paying the bills. I had an above average income and have been one of the more fortunate in that respect. The vast majority have been/are not so fortunate and need every bit of help they can get just to exist.

peedee


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

peedee said:


> karlb said:
> 
> 
> > i agree with the blue badge scheme but i ask again why should it be free?
> ...


i totally agree with you,but that same money argument can/is used by the family man bringing up children on the minimum wage.
i have no axe to grind or green men on my shoulder , but a vehicle for anybody imo is a luxury and as such all costs of that luxury should be down to the user.
people disabled or otherwise say they NEED a car, other people NEED to drink and smoke where is the line drawn? (off topic now  )

karlb


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## peedee (May 10, 2005)

I see it was lost on you karlb  

Anyone else watching Elvis on BBC 2?

peedee


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## bigtwin (May 24, 2008)

karlb,

Dialogue requires that participants take time to recognise and absorb the messages from other participants as well as expounding (repeatedly, in your case) one's own views.

Why should they not pay? I would refer you to my post at 9.39pm yesterday (page 5), and to similar responses by other posters, for a legitimate answer to the question.

In the light of this, your persistent re-stating of your question does you(r reputation) no favours.

Now would be a good time for you to thank all posters for their contributions and to bow out graciously.


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

bigtwin said:


> karlb,
> 
> Dialogue requires that participants take time to recognise and absorb the messages from other participants as well as expounding (repeatedly, in your case) one's own views.
> 
> ...


i really dont think ive been un-gracious, and thanks for thinking about my reputation, as anybody answered the question? i really dont think so, plenty of people have stated there opinions, as for you telling me to bow out......how very strange :roll:


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

Strange or not I think it's a good idea. 8) 

tony


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## tonyt (May 25, 2005)

peedee said:


> Anyone else watching Elvis on BBC 2?
> 
> peedee


What a great songster


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## bigtwin (May 24, 2008)

You can lead a horse to water but, you know, sometimes they just don't want to drink.

Like others before me, I too will now bow out of this 'discussion'. Any other course of action would be futile.


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

GEMMY said:


> Strange or not I think it's a good idea. 8)
> 
> tony


come on now make your mind up !

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopicp-763955.html#763955

or do you want to say when a thread should be pulled


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## GEMMY (Jun 19, 2006)

Thread,person, I don't care it's farcical 8O 

tony


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## MrsW (Feb 8, 2009)

ShinyFiat said:


> i fully understand that most of bb holders really need and rely on them for better standard of life, however more often than not, the people i see making use of these are fat overweight people who, if they maybe tried eating a little less and got up of their fat arses then they wouldnt need them and they might even be fit to go and do a days work


I am neither overweight, nor sitting "on my fat arse" and am fortunate enough that despite my disability (psoriatic arthritis affecting most of my joints) I am gainfully employed. I am no longer able to work on the wards as a nurse as I am too disabled, but I work giving advice to those who ask for it. I would be unable to do this if I did not have a car as I cannot walk the 2.5 miles to and from the bus or walk from the bus stop at the other end to my office. I need to be able to park close enough to work to get into the office on my splinted leg. On those grounds I qualify for a Blue Badge.

I eat less than 1200 calories per day (not sure how many fewer you would like me to eat) and my weight has no bearing on my disability. My disability does significantly affect my ability to use public transport and much of my Disability Living Allowance is spent paying for the help I need to carry out the day-to-day tasks I can no longer manage unaided. I would love to be able to manage independently and HATE being reliant on others, but that is the way life has dealt my cards. Feel free to begrudge me my parking permit if you must, but please do not suggest I am greedy or idle. I am neither!


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

karlb said:


> i have no axe to grind or green men on my shoulder , but a vehicle for anybody imo is a luxury and as such all costs of that luxury should be down to the user.
> people disabled or otherwise say they NEED a car, other people NEED to drink and smoke where is the line drawn? (off topic now  )
> karlb


To most of us with a reasonable level of mobility a car may well be deemed a luxury, to a disabled person the provision of such a vehicle is a necessity not a luxury. It gives the disabled at least some of the mobility that the able-bodied take for granted.

As far as I understand it, if you apply for benefits then *smoking* is taken into consideration as it is regarded as a necessity. In a similar way the provision of dog food is also taken into account since a dog may well provide the thermal protection that someone who is homeless needs.

Would you consider that animal a luxury for that person?

I am not in the position of being in receipt of any benefits so cannot guarantee the accuracy of the above statement, but am aware from first-hand experience how the ability to park close to the required destination may well make the difference for that person between being able to live, virtually unsupported in the community, as compared with having to be treated as a patient in some sort of residential unit at much greater cost.

Surely within a 21st century in a civilised community the ability to support others to reach a higher quality of life is an inherent value? If it is not then we are at the top of a slippery slope where disabled members of that community will be isolated and removed from that society - to the detriment of us all. Many disabled people have a vast amount to offer, they can only do that if they can actually get there! The BB scheme may well be instrumental in that.

The knocking of, and abuse towards, the BB users that has been apparent on this thread saddens me considerably, surely one of the prime functions of MHF is the exchange of ideas and *help,* not knocking 7 bells out of each other via the keyboard.

Dave


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## dawnwynne (Nov 14, 2009)

Penquin said:


> karlb said:
> 
> 
> > i have no axe to grind or green men on my shoulder , but a vehicle for anybody imo is a luxury and as such all costs of that luxury should be down to the user.
> ...


Well said....couldn't agree more.


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## Mrs_Zozzer (Jun 7, 2009)

Chausson said:


> ShinyFiat said:
> 
> 
> > why should bb holders get free passage on the Dartford Tunnel or the M6 Toll for that matter, disabled or not, you are using the road just the same as anyone else. i dont agree with this.
> ...


You may find it's £15 every THREE YEARS


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## patnles (Oct 26, 2006)

One of the reasons that I believe B/B holders should have free parking is that it's quite possible, that they could take much longer to do their shopping than an able bodied person. Also some may not be mobile enough to do all their shopping in one visit. They would then have to pay twice or three times to do the shopping that an able bodied person could do in 1 quick visit. Would that be fair?
You could have a scale of fees such as say, 10% off for 1 leg 20% for no legs etc :wink: but I can see difficulties arising when people have both legs but have other severe disabilities or chronis ilnesses. :wink: What would be a fair discount for defective lungs or heart? See the problem? 
karlb, I feel sure that you have no idea of the *extra* costs, not to mention time and effort that disabled people can incurr just to live a "normal" life.
You need to be disabled, or live with some-one who is, to realise the difficulties and costs. Just go and have a look at the products in your local mobility shop and clock the prices. 
Lesley
PS> I am not disabled but have spent my working life looking after the sick and disabled and know that it's not a cheap option.


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## trevd01 (Oct 26, 2007)

No mods around tonight?

This section: "Any posts about anything related to Motorhoming that doesn't fit in any other sections."


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

patnles said:


> One of the reasons that I believe B/B holders should have free parking is that it's quite possible, that they could take much longer to do their shopping than an able bodied person. Also some may not be mobile enough to do all their shopping in one visit. They would then have to pay twice or three times to do the shopping that an able bodied person could do in 1 quick visit. Would that be fair?
> You could have a scale of fees such as say, 10% off for 1 leg 20% for no legs etc :wink: but I can see difficulties arising when people have both legs but have other severe disabilities or chronis ilnesses. :wink: What would be a fair discount for defective lungs or heart? See the problem?
> karlb, I feel sure that you have no idea of the *extra* costs, not to mention time and effort that disabled people can incurr just to live a "normal" life.
> You need to be disabled, or live with some-one who is, to realise the difficulties and costs. Just go and have a look at the products in your local mobility shop and clock the prices.
> ...


please dont assume things about people you dont know
my brother-in-law had a blue badge for the last 7 months of his life and left 3 children under 4 years old at the time, (he also parked free!) it is not the badge scheme i asked the question about i have said earlier anybody with a disabilty should get the most convenient places,should they get that place free imo no. 
there is only a finite pot of money for services and when people for example get refused drugs because of the cost that is a disgrace asking people to pay to park there car is not.

regards
karlb


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## Mrs_Zozzer (Jun 7, 2009)

Maybe the goverment should do away with all the freebies people get and that includes the £250 heating allowance that some over 65's get whilst they are sunning themselves on some Spanish Campsite and dont use it for what it is inteneded for, lets face it you don't hear about that being moaned about on here, so let people with disablity Badges have there free space and parking what harm is it doing to others.


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

karlb said:


> there is only a finite pot of money for services and when people for example get refused drugs because of the cost that is a disgrace asking people to pay to park there car is not.
> regards
> karlb


To the best of my (limited) knowledge the cost of drugs and the refusal to supply is primarily due to the decision of NICE - the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence;

http://www.nice.org.uk/

they have made decisions about not being able to supply drugs due to the costs involved which are then acted upon by the individual PCT's (Primary Care Trusts) for the area in which the person lives.

The BB Scheme is operated by the County Councils on behalf of the Government;

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/DisabledPeople/MotoringAndTransport/DG_4001061

the two are totally separate as regards finance from the car parking fees collected and there is no link at all. The BB Scheme also operates throughout Europe so any decision made in the UK has to reflect European Laws as well.

I think you are totally confused as regards how the scheme operates.

Dave


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

@penguin

im not totally confused at all, if money comes from local/central/European government it has ultimately come from the same place ie the the taxpayer.
how it gets spent i do agree thats when the bull**** starts!!


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## locovan (Oct 17, 2007)

My main use of the Blue Badge is for Hospital appointments which I have just added up and it is a total of 29 since May I also have the fuel costs of these appointments to Pay and I have to travel to Margate sometimes which is a 70 mile round trip and Kent and Canterbury which is 28 mile round trip Then my Operation was in Guys in London which we went by Train and Ray visited me there at a cost of £16.00 return per visit.
The cost of my illness is rising all the time so dont begrudge me 3hours free parking you can have my Blue Badge willingly in exchange for your healthy lungs. :wink:


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## clianthus (Jul 8, 2006)

Well said Mavis, I totally agree. 

Until it happens to them folks don't realise how much being ill can cost, so they have that worry on top of the worry about the illness, usually with less income as well due to being off sick.


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## MrsW (Feb 8, 2009)

I have already explained that my psoriatic arthritis has left me with a mobility problem and splinted joints which make my walking difficult. I did not mention the mass of medication I need to take as well. Today it has been 22 tablets so far plus an antibiotic cream 3 times today. My condition does not provide me with an exemption certificate for prescription charges. So, I need to pay for 9 different prescriptions each month out of my income. Because of some of the medication I take to slow the progression of the arthritis I have a compromised immune system, so that puts me at greater risk when I travel by public transport as well as having an impossible walk to get to the bus. And yet there are people on this forum who begrudge me my 3 hours free parking. 

Any offers to swap my medical condition for your mobility?........

I doubt it!


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

karlb said:


> im not totally confused at all, if money comes from local/central/European government it has ultimately come from the same place ie the the taxpayer.
> how it gets spent i do agree thats when the bull**** starts!!


In which case I am surprised that you have not starting attacking a MUCH larger use of the same taxpayers money - there are many examples around where tremendous sums are spent; MP's expenses, European expenses, Social Security benefits, free prescriptions for some of the chronic sick, free treatment for non-life threatening conditions and so on (yes I admit this is going way {offtopic} and I have extrapolated a little).

Stopping the very small expenditure on the whole BB scheme and charging full parking fees for all disabled drivers would make virtually no difference to the amount of tax we all pay - probably less than 20p per year.

If you check Hansard you will find the following extract about the cost to the individual;

http://www.parliament.the-stationery-office.co.uk/pa/cm200708/cmhansrd/cm081027/text/81027w0001.htm

it is not possible to find an estimate as to the value to the individuals as regards the ability to exist.

Stop knocking the BB scheme and find another target, this thread has run it's full life in my opinion. It is patently clear that you have made up your mind and are not willing to think of the consequences of curtailing the scheme for the individuals concerned.

Dave


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## bigbazza (Mar 6, 2008)

I think your banging your head on this one Dave


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## sweetie (Nov 28, 2005)

MrsW said:


> I have already explained that my psoriatic arthritis has left me with a mobility problem and splinted joints which make my walking difficult. I did not mention the mass of medication I need to take as well. Today it has been 22 tablets so far plus an antibiotic cream 3 times today. My condition does not provide me with an exemption certificate for prescription charges. So, I need to pay for 9 different prescriptions each month out of my income. Because of some of the medication I take to slow the progression of the arthritis I have a compromised immune system, so that puts me at greater risk when I travel by public transport as well as having an impossible walk to get to the bus. And yet there are people on this forum who begrudge me my 3 hours free parking.
> 
> Any offers to swap my medical condition for your mobility?........
> 
> I doubt it!


You may not be entitled to exemption certificate for prescription but you can get a pre payment certificate for £104.00 per 12 months which works out to £8.66 per month instead of paying for 9 different prescriptions costing £7.20 each =£64.80 per month.

I had one from the age of 50 because of the amount of tablets I took but of course you do not pay after 60.

Steve


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## patnles (Oct 26, 2006)

karlb said:


> Snipped:
> 
> please dont assume things about people you dont know
> my brother-in-law had a blue badge for the last 7 months of his life and left 3 children under 4 years old at the time, (he also parked free!) it is not the badge scheme i asked the question about i have said earlier anybody with a disabilty should get the most convenient places,should they get that place free imo no.
> ...


I'm sorry to hear about your BIL. That is very sad. 
It does not mean that you are aware of any financial burdens that being disabled can lead to, especially when the illness and disability is long term. 
I made no mention of the badge scheme per se but only the reasons why I believe, that qualifying B/B holders should not have to pay for parking, which is what you asked. 
Just to clarify and answer your question again, in a nutshell. B/B holders should not have to pay for parking, because their disability may mean that they have to shop more often or take longer to do their shopping, they would then end up paying more to shop than you or I. Of course that would not apply to all who hold the B/B but it could mean the more disabled you are the more you pay. That would be discrimination.

Lesley


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## julie798 (Jun 13, 2007)

*bb*

I think people are confusing the cowboy users of the BB and the genuine ones, unfortunately I do think it is a well abused thing, sad for the genuine users, the minority as usual spoilit for the majority, it is very easy to see both sides of the argument, with valid comments on both sides.


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

*Re: bb*



julie798 said:


> I think people are confusing the cowboy users of the BB and the genuine ones, unfortunately I do think it is a well abused thing, sad for the genuine users, the minority as usual spoilit for the majority, it is very easy to see both sides of the argument, with valid comments on both sides.


thank you for that i will now leave this topic to save bigbazza hurting his head.

regards karlb


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

My suggestion would be to go along with what karlb has suggested and leave the thread- I think leave it for a while so that members can post final comments and then close it before we end up re-inventing the wheel again and again.

I hope that this course of action will meet with the approval of those actively involved. I would think about closing it then unless there are major objections at about 11.00pm.

Thank you to one and all for participating in what it must be said has been a lively exchange of views.

Dave


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## locovan (Oct 17, 2007)

*Re: bb*



julie798 said:


> I think people are confusing the cowboy users of the BB and the genuine ones, unfortunately I do think it is a well abused thing, sad for the genuine users, the minority as usual spoilit for the majority, it is very easy to see both sides of the argument, with valid comments on both sides.


Can I just add here that I wonder just how much it is abused.
Only when I applied it wasn't given without an assestment or a Doctors report -- as with out that I couldn't get a BB.
So most are genuine.
What people might see getting out of a car is an able bodied person as I have looked and seen that Blue Badges are not always on show therefore they should not be parked in the space.
I have seen this at Tesco's many times this is where the system is abused -- by the able bodied not the disabled.


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## Rainbow-Chasers (Sep 2, 2008)

Some councils offer free parking as those who have difficulty using machines can park. This is rare to have these concessions nowadays as most councils do charge, the benefit being, that they can park nearer the exit areas.

The main benefit is to be able to park roadside, near your destination - don't forget many cannot walk far, if at all, and gradients that an able bodied person will not even notice become a major Hurdle!

Yes, it is open to abuse, as are parent and child parking both all parked vehicles, disabled or not, children or not. It is not a licence to park anywhere and do what you like for free.

I am sure many would like the option to pay for their parking if they could be fully able again. In fact, many would pay for theirs and yours if you could take their disability from them!


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## patnles (Oct 26, 2006)

Penquin said:


> My suggestion would be to go along with what karlb has suggested and leave the thread- I think leave it for a while so that members can post final comments and then close it before we end up re-inventing the wheel again and again.
> 
> I hope that this course of action will meet with the approval of those actively involved. I would think about closing it then unless there are major objections at about 11.00pm.
> 
> ...


Thankyou, that's probably for the best but it would be nice if karlb could reply to the people who did give answers to his original question and what his thoughts are on the financial implications of being disabled and should they be considered when discussing the rights and wrongs of free parking for disabled? 
I don't think we'll get an answer though :roll:


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## CliffyP (Dec 19, 2008)

patnles said:


> Penquin said:
> 
> 
> > My suggestion would be to go along with what karlb has suggested and leave the thread- I think leave it for a while so that members can post final comments and then close it before we end up re-inventing the wheel again and again.
> ...


One of the problems is that being disabled does not mean being able to pay, without going over old ground, there are a lot of poor and old people who are not classed a disabled who struggle to keep cars on the road and and pay for parking. The biggest problem for those who do not benefit from a blue badge is when they see someone who can clearly afford to pay to park getting away with it whilst they have to pay. The system is very unbalanced, and those that receive think they are entitled to it and those that dont think its very unfair.


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## MrsW (Feb 8, 2009)

CliffyP said:


> patnles said:
> 
> 
> > Penquin said:
> ...


So what does someone look like "who can clearly afford to pay to park..."?


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## karlb (Feb 22, 2009)

patnles said:


> Penquin said:
> 
> 
> > My suggestion would be to go along with what karlb has suggested and leave the thread- I think leave it for a while so that members can post final comments and then close it before we end up re-inventing the wheel again and again.
> ...


im sorry if i didnt make my views clear i thought i did earlier, however as my final point the bb badge i agree with for ease of parking, the finacial implications of parking i dont accept as there are many families and individuals who struggle financially and they still have to pay parking, please dont make out im advocating an extra tax on disabled people!! i am talking about parking charges.
is a blue badge holder more worthy of free parking than a working single parent struggling on top up benefits?
you decide

regards karlb


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## CliffyP (Dec 19, 2008)

MrsW said:


> CliffyP said:
> 
> 
> > patnles said:
> ...


Well if they have a 20k/30k/40k/50k motorhome, an expensive car, should I go on  . Its not rocket science is it.


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## MrsW (Feb 8, 2009)

CliffyP said:


> MrsW said:
> 
> 
> > CliffyP said:
> ...


But I use my car to go shopping, not a motorhome. If I do go in the motorhome I would not take up several disabled parking spaces in order to get to the store. I park away from the entrance and struggle over or get my husband to drop me off at the door and then park. However, I think we are rather a long way from the original post now!


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

As explained in my post at 10.00pm I will now close this thread

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopicp-764594.html#764594

Thank you to all participants for their contributions.

Dave


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