# Damp damp and more damp!



## BnJ

Just had our first habitation check done on our 1 yr old Tracker EKS. Loads of damp found and have had to book it in for a week to fix it.

Whats going on?

We were told by the guy who did the damp check that this is not unusual in Auto Trails, most likely due to poor workmanship, lousy sealants used at the factory, or a mixture of both.

So now they have to take it to pieces, dry the areas out, cut out the original sealants and replace them. Its obvious from postings here and what the guy at the dealership has told us that our case is not unusual so why aren't Auto trail making a better job at the factory I wonder.

Happy days.


----------



## metblue

*damp*

me too !! we had one a few years ago and god rid within 6 months worst van we had ever had,would not have one again ever !! :evil:


----------



## DTPCHEMICALS

Probably because people rant on forums instead of driving to the factory and asking to see the QC manager.

I do hope you subscribe and let us know how you get on.
Both with you damp and your adventures.

My Autotrail has been perfect. 8 years old this september.
Only warrenty claim was for replacement battery. Superb service from Brownhills
I did have a leaky Swift caravan once upon a time and a rusty Ford Prefect
Dave p


----------



## 96299

BnJ said:


> Just had our first habitation check done on our 1 yr old Tracker EKS. Loads of damp found and have had to book it in for a week to fix it.
> 
> Whats going on?
> 
> We were told by the guy who did the damp check that this is not unusual in Auto Trails, most likely due to poor workmanship, lousy sealants used at the factory, or a mixture of both.
> 
> So now they have to take it to pieces, dry the areas out, cut out the original sealants and replace them. Its obvious from postings here and what the guy at the dealership has told us that our case is not unusual so why aren't Auto trail making a better job at the factory I wonder.
> 
> Happy days.


Sorry to hear of your problems but, it's either these or swift that get loads of complaints about damp. Go figure - they both happen to be British. Nuff said.

Steve


----------



## pomme1

Steve,

I think the German owner of a brand new Carthago, who I parked my Auto-Trail next to and to whom I lent a roll of gaffer tape to stem the internal waterfall in his 'van would possibly take issue with you! As probably would a colleague of mine who has had enormous problems with N&B Flairs.

Investigation of the Carthago problem the follwing day, revealed that the kitchen window had simply not been sealed to the side wall. I'm afraid that whatever we like to think, wherever they're built, 'vans are all assembled of essentially the same components by the same level of semi-skilled labour.

Roger


----------



## lesanne

We have a 17yr old Autotrail Cheyenne 614 ,had it over 10 yrs now no probs so far ,wouldn t swap it for anything on the market these days ..regards Les..


----------



## tude

*damp*

i am parked next to a guy who used to work at swift he left a couple of years ago.he now drives a french van. he told me that swift and autotrail both have bonus scheams to make as many vans possible in a week.i dont need to say anymore do i ??


----------



## raynipper

I am always surprised that damp is not evident without a hab check.!!

It has an odour like 'wet-dog' and anything inside said cupboard would start to grow fur.

Ray.


----------



## tonka

raynipper said:


> I am always surprised that damp is not evident without a hab check.!!
> 
> It has an odour like 'wet-dog' and anything inside said cupboard would start to grow fur.
> 
> Ray.


Ray... I think in most cases, like mine for example, replace "damp" with " high mositure reading"....
As you say Damp would really stand out but when you spend £50k and get the issue after just a year. "DAMP" helps to emphasise it better.. :wink:


----------



## pomme1

Tude,

Do you really believe that French and german companies don't operate production based bonus schemes?? 

Roger :roll:


----------



## lindyloot

We have an 8yr old Cheiftain by Autotrail, no "damp" problems. The only "wet " problem we had was of our own making, when we parked it up for the winter we did not drain down the shower ( by lying it in the shower tray) when we came to use it first time out following season due to water freezing in the pipe it blew the connections from the back of he shower. There is a post relating to this and how Rich fixed it but I do not know how to put a linkup.


----------



## Landyman

Just had the first habitation check on our one year old Auto-Trail Delaware and all was well, fortunately. After reading so many sorry tales of almost new vans suffering with major problems it is always a bit of a nail biting time but I bought a cheap damp meter a couple of years ago so that I can keep an eye on things myself. The occasional check round the interior during the winter helps keep the blood pressure under control.  

Landyman.


----------



## chiefwigwam

Landyman said:


> Just had the first habitation check on our one year old Auto-Trail Delaware and all was well, fortunately. After reading so many sorry tales of almost new vans suffering with major problems it is always a bit of a nail biting time but I bought a cheap damp meter a couple of years ago so that I can keep an eye on things myself. The occasional check round the interior during the winter helps keep the blood pressure under control.
> 
> Landyman.


I wouldn't take that as gospel, we just had hab check carried out on our 2011 autotrail and all was well , I was footering about today in the locker under the bed and would you believe it? Spongy wall, took the trim off and the locker door, nothing serious, I would assume the hinges are letting in water, think il do it myself, what do we pay these guys for I wonder?


----------



## Valian

pomme1 said:


> Steve,
> 
> I think the German owner of a brand new Carthago, who I parked my Auto-Trail next to and to whom I lent a roll of gaffer tape to stem the internal waterfall in his 'van would possibly take issue with you! As probably would a colleague of mine who has had enormous problems with N&B Flairs.
> 
> Investigation of the Carthago problem the follwing day, revealed that the kitchen window had simply not been sealed to the side wall. I'm afraid that whatever we like to think, wherever they're built, 'vans are all assembled of essentially the same components by the same level of semi-skilled labour.
> 
> Roger


Hi
Comparing our 6 yrs experience with our last vehicle, a Chausson, with our current one, I have to say I'd find it very hard to agree with you. Our current vehicle is better put together than any motorhome I've ever seen....you're right that some of the components are common to many manufacturers, but the idea that all are assembled to the same standard is not the case, in my opinion.

Ian


----------



## Webby1

*Damp Problems*

Well we feel Adria have a good build reputation and have not had any damp problems so far.................touch wood.....oh it's damp!!!

My observation from these forums is that GB manufacturers don't seem to do so well.....................we do remember that word "manufacturing" don't we.

In the meantime anyone recommend a good damp meter and where in the van and how to use it.


----------



## dolcefarniente

Maplin damp meter - forget the part number as it's in my van at storage. Probe and expect to see 10% if in order. Seems agreed that 18% or more needs checking - My much used Autotrail 10% all over so far.


----------



## dolcefarniente

I reckon if you Google damp problems preceded by any make of van you'll have no problem finding unfortunate owners. I guess folks who are happy with their van just don't bother saying so.


----------



## Jezport

A lot of damp is just seasonal from not being used and will dry out if aired out.


----------



## Evs54

BnJ said:


> Just had our first habitation check done on our 1 yr old Tracker EKS. Loads of damp found and have had to book it in for a week to fix it.
> 
> On our 3rd Autotrail no damp . If you had any serious damp you would have found it yourself before habitation check .Gas heating gives off damp , opened windows during damp weather gives off damp ,and many other factors .During winter lay up I use an electric fan heater helps circulate the air keeps everything nice and dry damp free .Could be they are just looking for work ? .


----------



## erneboy

*Re: damp*



metblue said:


> me too !! we had one a few years ago and god rid within 6 months worst van we had ever had,would not have one again ever !! :evil:


+1.


----------



## Charisma

With the new 10 year Damp Warranties now being offered, perhaps the dealers are being told to be more concientious in their damp testing to catch any problems early.

After all, if serious damp is found a few years into the warranty, the manufacturer is likely to look at who did the damp tests before paying out for repairs.

The Autotrail locker doors leaking do seem to be a design fault though, and ours now appear to be fixed OK after resealing the frame, the rubber seal, and the door rivets.


----------



## BnJ

Evs54 said:


> On our 3rd Autotrail no damp . If you had any serious damp you would have found it yourself before habitation check .Gas heating gives off damp , opened windows during damp weather gives off damp ,and many other factors .During winter lay up I use an electric fan heater helps circulate the air keeps everything nice and dry damp free .Could be they are just looking for work ? .


We also have run an electric fan heater (drier air than a gas heater) and also a dehumidifier when the weather was cold and damp The vehicle is parked in our drive and we monitor the temp and humidity inside it by a sensor which transmits the info to the house. And still damp meter readings of 50% plus were found in the walls we were told. What more could we have done I wonder. As for dealers looking for work, well who knows. I do have confidence (hopefully not misplaced) that the guy who showed us the problem will fix it. He said he has done many of these and has been surprised at how little sealant was used during the build on the vehicles he has repaired He also says that each vehicle he has repaired has never had a problem again as he takes the time to do it slowly and right. Fingers crossed eh?


----------



## Landyman

On our previous van, a Swift, the dealer reported damp in a side locker and got a local company to quote for drying out the walls with industrial dehumidifiers then resealing. They sent the details to Swift to get authorisation to carry out the repairs under warranty but forgot to notify us when they got the authorisation.
The locker was used to store hoses among other things and there was a little water left in the hose which hadn't helped. After a few weeks of warm dry weather the locker was dry as a bone again without any intervention.
The 'problem' never reappeared.  

Landyman.


----------



## Jezport

A lot of damp is just seasonal from not being used and will dry out if aired out.


----------



## DTPCHEMICALS

Jezport said:


> A lot of damp is just seasonal from not being used and will dry out if aired out.


This appears to be correct. Last week I removed the breathable cover which has been on our MH since early October. Last week I checked all round door frame window frames etc and came up with readings between 0 and in one spot 15%.
Today I have checked again and all the readings are 0 to less than5%.

Dave p


----------



## HyFy

*Amazingly damp agent...*

Hi

I've just given up with the agent from whom I bought my new Auto-Trail last year. I just wish they could be a bit more enthusiastic about turning the sow's ear they sold me with much enthusiasm into more of a silk purse.

I will be pursuing Auto-Trail on Monday but as they have been shadowing the emails I don't expect too much. I have had many warranty issues some of which they have sorted by wholesale replacement of modules/units/equipment. Why is the vehicle so much rubbish? I don't want all you continental vehicle owners coming the cr.. I used to live in France and owned one such "continental vehicle..."

It costs me £180 for each delivery/collection of the vehicle and that doesn't include the hours spent emptying and re-loading the vehicle and of course the time spent for two of us driving to and from the dealers.

But the damp issue in this thread was the one thing that confirmed to me that my dealer was useless if not devious/if not downright...

Last summer we reported to them that the waste pipe on the basin in the washroom had come adrift because the idiot who had fixed it at the factory originally had put too much strain on the pipe and with a little vibration of road use it had pulled off the "u-trap". Quite how long it had been dumping waste water and waste tank freshener into the flooring we can't be certain but we had to spend ages in France soaking it up from the surface and carpets as far forward as the galley.

The pipe work was corrected but the possible damp was not checked until the first habitation check. We had not smelled any damp and had been in high temperature areas during the interim.

We were therefore surprised to be told after the "Hab Check" that there was damp at 30% between the washroom and the galley - "probably due to a leaking galley tap" that we had also reported. (No- that was leaking into the galley sink...)

As there were a load of other warranty issues, they suggested that they sort the 30% damp problem later when they could have the van for a week. They had the van for a week but when I asked what they had done about the damp, there was a hurried check with the "Technician" who had obviously not read the work sheet. "But 30% is not a problem". "We have checked it again and can't find any damp..." etc etc. Exit customer with steam rising out of his head threatening "Trading Standards" as I went.

Why do we put up with this sort of service?

I watch threads on this forum about things not working on Auto-Trails that I have had fixed by thumping the reception desk. But at £180 each round trip, I have now given up. The law says that you have to give the dealer/manufacturer "reasonable opportunity to rectify things". If they fail to do so you are entitled to take the vehicle to an independent repairer and charge the bill to the dealer/manufacturer. If they don't pay up it's a simple small claim's jobby in the county court. You can't take a Nissan Micra to a Jensen repairer. It has to be appropriate but I suspect to threaten the issue will be enough - and no I won't be accepting another Auto-Trail dealer! I have a very good independent motorhome garage locally and I will be contacting them on Monday as well! An Auto-Trail factory technician would be a start but judging by the build quality, I'm not sure of their qualifications either.

I suspect my complaint is industry wide with a few exceptions. Why can't those exceptions be down here in the South West?

I will update the readership as to the damp issue in due course (or should that be in "damp course"...)

HyFy


----------



## 100127

With all the kerfuffle on this thread, I have a slight trepidation about picking up my Tracker on the 7th.   I hope all is well 8) 8)

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopic-139940.html. 
I hope the OP can tell us what the problems are, so maybe we can assist.


----------



## Landyman

You will be fine....don't worry.
We love our Auto-Trail and have had some great trips during the last 12 months.
Sure, there are some minor niggles that have been or will be attended to by our dealer but they have all been little irritations more than anything.

Just enjoy!

Landyman.


----------



## HyFy

*Good for you Landyman*

We are not all so lucky


----------



## millwalllion

It all seems to be luck of the draw to me!

We are on our 3rd Autotrail with very few problems and nothing at all major (he says touching a girt big tree!  ).

Before we moved to Autotrail we had extended ourselves and purchased a Burstner Aviano - the biggest pig in a poke ever! :evil: 

Never again was uttered many times, and due to the adverse sterling to Euro ratio along with Burstner pricing policies in general but mainly our experience we have never been tempted back!

My point - major problems can happen with any brand - happy days!


----------



## Jezport

My Frankia is a 2005 model so can't be classed as latest spec. Yet the walls are a sandwich of GRP solid insulating foam and a decorative inner skin. The joists are alloy of some sort and the outer floor is what looks like a sandwich of GRP or metal I'm not sure, solid foam insulation and a top layer of thin ply and lino.

So theoretically there's nor a lot to rot. What is the construction of the Autotrails likeccompared to the Frankia?


----------



## joedenise

Can someone explain how electric heating is better than gas because the gas must heat an exchanger to get the blown air heating working so none of the moisture should get blown into the van.

Joe


----------



## safariboy

joedenise said:


> Can someone explain how electric heating is better than gas because the gas must heat an exchanger to get the blown air heating working so none of the moisture should get blown into the van.
> 
> Joe


I think that you are quite correct. With an open gas fire of course it will make the air damp but with the usual balanced flue how can it?


----------



## wp1234

BnJ said:


> Just had our first habitation check done on our 1 yr old Tracker EKS. Loads of damp found and have had to book it in for a week to fix
> 
> Happy days.


Going for my habitation check on my 1 yr old Dakota , can you tell me where you found the damp issues ... Where do I need to check ??

Thank you


----------



## tonka

wp1234 said:


> BnJ said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just had our first habitation check done on our 1 yr old Tracker EKS. Loads of damp found and have had to book it in for a week to fix
> 
> Happy days.
> 
> 
> 
> Going for my habitation check on my 1 yr old Dakota , can you tell me where you found the damp issues ... Where do I need to check ??
> 
> Thank you
Click to expand...

Ref my van.
On my Apache 700 it was on one corner of the rear Heki roof skylight, this ran down a channel in the roof and gave damp around the chinmey flue in the Wardrobe.. Also the offside wall, especially by the dinnette area rear of the drivers seat.
The van has been back to Autotrail in January where they re-sealed the the Heki and mentioned about the channel in the roof. 
I collected it back yesterday and they have removed all side skirts on the offside and re-sealed the joint between the floor and wall..
Fingers crossed, guess we wont know until next hab check..


----------



## drcotts

wp1234 said:


> BnJ said:
> 
> 
> 
> Just had our first habitation check done on our 1 yr old Tracker EKS. Loads of damp found and have had to book it in for a week to fix
> 
> Happy days.
> 
> 
> 
> Going for my habitation check on my 1 yr old Dakota , can you tell me where you found the damp issues ... Where do I need to check ??
> 
> Thank you
Click to expand...

The bloke doing the hab check will check to a defined check plan if he is caravan council approved so you dont need to tell him.

If you want to keep a regular check this is what i do.

if doing it yourself get a meter that can be calibrated and draw a plan of your van

Check around the corners where the roof meets the walls and where the roof meets the floor

Then check at each corner of the windows and along the botton edge of same

Likewise with any external locker doors

Check round the edges of any roof lights

Divide the roof in half (in your mind not with a jigsaw) and take a reading every 50cm along the mid line

then divide the lenth of the roof into 4 and check along the 3 lines as above.

Log the readings on the plan and keep for next time so you can compare them. Any great increases should be investigated. Your more likely to get damp round lockers and roof light than sealed edges (though sealed edges are still possible)

This only takes 20-30 mins one or twice a year.

Phill


----------



## path

We had a similar experience as you with our new Swift caravan.During th first year we were backwards and forwards to th dealers, 40 mile round trip,with numerous faults. At its first service 65% damp was found under a window.To us that was the final straw. We took legal advice(from a relative who was a solicitor) and asked for a replacement van.Initially the answer was no from the dealers and Swift. We persisted and when we asked for the name and address of the person to whom we could send all legal documents as we intended to pursue this through the courts we were offered a replacement van.
We felt as you probably do that we had paid a lot of money for something that was not fit for the purpose it was intended.


----------



## stepps110

Where do you get a meter to do your own checks? I have only seen the domestic ones with pins but I dont want to leave holes in my van walls.


----------

