# First motorhome = Hymer - that's easy, but which model??



## jemshome

This is my first post and I'm a complete newbie ... 

My wife and I live in NW Scotland and we are early retirees. A move to France in 2 to 3yrs with our two medium large dogs is on the agenda. Swop the rain for the sun! We need the motorhome to explore region and houses of interest. Every 8 weeks at home we do our 'big shop' in Inverness - using the MH rather than a hotel would be a further benefit. Also -15 deg C is not unknown in our Glen with sub-zero for up to 10 days.

The search started 2 weeks ago and we quickly decided to go for a Hymer - if for no other reason that it has taken me so long to just begin to understand the model numbers - I couldn't bear to think it was all in vain. The inherent Hymer build quality came in second, but some way back. 

The dogs are obedient, but also very attentive. A large Gordon and English Setter around your feet when you are trying to cook etc. is a recipe for a disaster. So I've come up with the idea of using a portion of the garage to accommodate the dogs at such times. We would prefer a fixed bed although accept that this reduces the lounge space. So the current idea is to select a model with garage and fixed double berth or twin singles above. 

Given our preference of an A class vehicle, we are considering (most favoured first) S630, B514, S660, S680 & B644. New/almost new 522 & 572 vans are also being considered as an alternative. Our upper limit is £35,000. 

Length is a consideration - where we live requires 8ml on a very narrow single track with 1 in 4 up and 1 in 4 down. On the descent there is a small bridge on a 3/4 hairpin. The alternative is 10ml+ along a private forest road often with deep potholes. 

Now the questions ... 

A scan of what's on offer shows that access into rear bed, via ladder, plain steps, oblique steps or steps and drawer combinations varies with model and age. 

Qu. 1. On which, if any of these models, would it be feasible to create an access for the dogs from garage to cab and has anyone out there tried this approach? 

Qu. 2 can you remove the table when not in use on any of these models?

Qu. 3 is there anywhere I can get a plan of the various layouts with internal dimensions?

It will take 6hrs to drive to nearest dealer with significant Hymer experience south of the border. 

Qu. 4. Any recommendations of helpful dealers/agents in the Highlands? - I assume main agents will deal with the either Fiat or Merc chassis without a problem, but I have read about bad experiences regarding bodies and fittings. 

Any other relevant comments appreciated.

Thanks in anticipation.


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## 96511

You will find some Hymer layouts and history here, if it helps..
http://www.dmiuk.com/


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## 94055

Hi 
I would second that

Also see our own

>>Here<<

Steve


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## 106916

Perthshire Caravans near Perth have some used Hymers usually. If buying from a dealer I would haggle hard, especially at this time of year when stock probably isn't moving. You should get a big saving buying private but of course be careful and do all the right checks. A visit to a dealer should let you see some actual vans and note their prices even if you don't buy from there. We bought our Hymer on ebay and that is a good place to look too.
good hunting & good luck.
Vidura


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## carolgavin

jemshome said:


> This is my first post and I'm a complete newbie ...
> 
> My wife and I live in NW Scotland and we are early retirees. A move to France in 2 to 3yrs with our two medium large dogs is on the agenda. Swop the rain for the sun! We need the motorhome to explore region and houses of interest. Every 8 weeks at home we do our 'big shop' in Inverness - using the MH rather than a hotel would be a further benefit. Also -15 deg C is not unknown in our Glen with sub-zero for up to 10 days.
> 
> The search started 2 weeks ago and we quickly decided to go for a Hymer - if for no other reason that it has taken me so long to just begin to understand the model numbers - I couldn't bear to think it was all in vain. The inherent Hymer build quality came in second, but some way back.
> 
> The dogs are obedient, but also very attentive. A large Gordon and English Setter around your feet when you are trying to cook etc. is a recipe for a disaster. So I've come up with the idea of using a portion of the garage to accommodate the dogs at such times. We would prefer a fixed bed although accept that this reduces the lounge space. So the current idea is to select a model with garage and fixed double berth or twin singles above.
> 
> Given our preference of an A class vehicle, we are considering (most favoured first) S630, B514, S660, S680 & B644. New/almost new 522 & 572 vans are also being considered as an alternative. Our upper limit is £35,000.
> 
> Length is a consideration - where we live requires 8ml on a very narrow single track with 1 in 4 up and 1 in 4 down. On the descent there is a small bridge on a 3/4 hairpin. The alternative is 10ml+ along a private forest road often with deep potholes.
> 
> Now the questions ...
> 
> A scan of what's on offer shows that access into rear bed, via ladder, plain steps, oblique steps or steps and drawer combinations varies with model and age.
> 
> Qu. 1. On which, if any of these models, would it be feasible to create an access for the dogs from garage to cab and has anyone out there tried this approach?
> 
> Qu. 2 can you remove the table when not in use on any of these models?
> 
> Qu. 3 is there anywhere I can get a plan of the various layouts with internal dimensions?
> 
> It will take 6hrs to drive to nearest dealer with significant Hymer experience south of the border.
> 
> Qu. 4. Any recommendations of helpful dealers/agents in the Highlands? - I assume main agents will deal with the either Fiat or Merc chassis without a problem, but I have read about bad experiences regarding bodies and fittings.
> 
> Any other relevant comments appreciated.
> 
> Thanks in anticipation.


Welcome to motorhomefacts and great to see another english setter owner, we have one as well a gemsett dog!! Have a look at the company reports before visiting a dealer as some of them have been getting a bit of a bashing at present notably Perthshire. 
There should some websites that give you the layout but probably not the dimensions. Also don't know about your english setter but mine goes nuts when he is not with you and barks his head off (even if we are in kitchen and he is comfy in living room) and you know how persistant they can be!!!
One other piece of advice is to part with a tenner and join motorhomefacts, you will recoup the benefits with the various discounts (insurance especially) in no time and will also have unlimited posts in which to ask many questions. Good luck in your search!!


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## Rapide561

*Hymers*

Hi

You may also wish to have a word with Hambilton Engineering at Preston. This firm can make modifications such as fitting ovens, removing bits and pieces etc.

http://www.friendlyhippo.co.uk/hymerdirect/

Hope this helps.

With the temperatures you mention, I would look at the double floor models.

The link to Deepcar Motorhomes will prove useful - as does the "history section" on their website.

Russell


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## jemshome

carolgavin said:


> Welcome to motorhomefacts and great to see another english setter owner, we have one as well a gemsett dog!! Have a look at the company reports before visiting a dealer as some of them have been getting a bit of a bashing at present notably Perthshire.
> There should some websites that give you the layout but probably not the dimensions. Also don't know about your english setter but mine goes nuts when he is not with you and barks his head off (even if we are in kitchen and he is comfy in living room) and you know how persistant they can be!!!
> One other piece of advice is to part with a tenner and join motorhomefacts, you will recoup the benefits with the various discounts (insurance especially) in no time and will also have unlimited posts in which to ask many questions. Good luck in your search!!


The boss 'Sleddalebeck' Gordon (Murphy) keeps 'Upperwood' English (Jasper) under control, but while Murphy's away the barks begin ... Our presence seems to matter less! Pictures attached.


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## carolgavin

Well aren't they handsome here (hopefully) is one of the lovely Neo, great to see you have subscribed you will never regret it only problem is it is highly addictive!!!! He was going to a show the day pic was taken hence his cleanliness and lovely trim!!


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## davesport

You've obviously done a bit of research. My only experience is of my 644 with fixed rear bed & garage which I bought this year but I'll help with what I can.



> Qu. 1. On which, if any of these models, would it be feasible to create an access for the dogs from garage to cab and has anyone out there tried this approach?


The dividing wall between the habitation & the garage on mine has a central panel which could either be removed or have door cut into it to allow the dogs access to the garage area. I would rate this as an easy modification that you could carry out yourself.



> Qu. 2 can you remove the table when not in use on any of these models?


The table in mine is easily removable. The single support leg folds away & then the table is tilted upwards & the support channel disengages from the wall. Take care when doing this not to damage the surface.



> Qu. 3 is there anywhere I can get a plan of the various layouts with internal dimensions?


I think that the Deepcar site in one of the previous replies has this info.



> Qu. 4. Any recommendations of helpful dealers/agents in the Highlands? - I assume main agents will deal with the either Fiat or Merc chassis without a problem, but I have read about bad experiences regarding bodies and fittings.


I bought from Brownhills near Blackpool earlier this year. I bought a 2006 model & spent an afternoon haggling over the spec & the price which was already reduced. Iv had no problems so far with BH's & have phoned the depot in Newcastle on several occasions for technical help. They have been very helpful & I cant fault them.......so far. I've got no experience of dealers in the Highlands.

As for choosing between Mark or Fiat base vehicles. Have you ever opened a can of worms  You will get all sorts of opinions, both emotive & based on practical experience & a bit of prejudice. Merc is perceived as a premium brand, whilst Fiat isn't. Im inclined to think that Merc owners are less inclined to let on when they've had a problem & it's dead easy to give Fiat a slagging. What doesn't help is the way the water ingress problem on the 2007 models is being handled.

I was willing to buy either. It made no difference to me what badge was on the steering wheel as long as the base vehicle was reliable. I bought a 644 on a Fiat 2.8 JTd base & I'm very happy with it. I don't know of any fundamental issues that have surfaced with this model. You pays your money etc.

The best money I spent was the tenner it costs to join this forum. Help & advice are usually close to hand.

Good luck, Dave.


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## Steptoe

jemshome said:


> Length is a consideration - where we live requires 8ml on a very narrow single track with 1 in 4 up and 1 in 4 down. On the descent there is a small bridge on a 3/4 hairpin. The alternative is 10ml+ along a private forest road often with deep potholes.


Leaving out the layout considerations, this would concern me 8O

I know you can only get bespoke 4WD motorhomes, so I guess this is out of the question but I wonder if you should be looking at a RWD chassis. I went up Porlock Hill (also 1 in 4) in my FWD Fiat this year and it is not an experience I want to repeat, luckily I was on my own so fairly unladen, but I was really concerned that I would lose traction as I went up.


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## jemshome

Many thanks for all replies this far.

 Obviously liked the pic of the master of the house!

Practical advice of last two posts particularly useful.

644 is a goer - thanks to the simple conversion.

40 love to Fiat

Fiat FWD Merc RWD

40 all 

Spoke to a dealer, yesterday, who suggested door from habitation to garage would not be simple due to pipework - can anyone confirm?

Any info on performance of various Merc/Fiat engines appreciated, reliability, model changes, auto vs manual etc.

Play ...


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## pippin

Our VAN522 has the brilliant pullout steps (with built-in storage) for access to the bed. 
The unit actually projects back into the garage and I am sure could be easily removed to allow the dogs to access the garage.

You have to remember that you would need to leave a sizeable area of the garage clear for the dogs to move around in and thereby lose valuable storage space.

Remember too that the central heating boiler is in the garage.

We have been very pleased with our VAN522, it is on the Transit cab that has a dash-mounted gear lever.

The longer VAN572 has a larger garage as the beds are fore-aft rather than athwartships as in the 522. The habitation area is identical.

Ther Hymer website gives good pictures and diagrams. If you dig deeper there is even more info in the German language sites.


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## davesport

In my 644 there is a small double corner step to make access to the fixed bed easier. There is a heating conduit within the lower step. Above this & almost the full width of the corridor is the wooden partition between the garage & the habitation. Inside the garage there are two vertical aluminium uprights supporting the dead weight of the bed & its occupants. I could easily make a large dog sized aperture in this area. This could either be fitted with a dog flap or a more professional finish could be achieved with the help of some joinery work.

I dont have access to my van at the moment. However I can state categorically that in my van there is room to make access for a dog into the garage. The reason I'm so sure is that I thought about putting a hatch in there myself to enable me to get stuff out of the garage without going outside.

Best thing to do is have a look for yourself when you go to view.

Just reading the post above this one. My Truma heater is in the wardrobe & the garage floorspace is clear.

Regards dave.


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## framptoncottrell

Hambilton Engineering has a very good reputation for professional, bespoke modifications to Hymer motorhomes. You can find them on

http://www.friendlyhippo.co.uk/hymerdirect/

If you click on 'Modifications' you can see examples of commissioned alterations in customers' vans.

Dr (musical, not medical) Roy


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## jemshome

*Sorted model preference - I think?*

Have taken advice from the responses above and having spoken to helpful dealers (Deepcar, Hyman UK, Edgehill - all helpful Lee at latter particularly so)

I have short-listed models un order of preference they are:

630 - rwd ~6.4m 
514 - fwd ~6.4m 
660 - rwd ~6.85m 
644 - fwd ~6.85m 
680 - rwd ~7.4m

From responses on the forum it appears that there would be no problems making an access through to the garage on 644.

However I have be told that the bottom step on the 630 covers contains pipework and heater - however it sounds as if I could leave the lower step in place to cover these items and still have room for an access hatch for the dogs.

Qu. Can anyone confirm this for the 630 or any other of the above models?

It has also been suggested that post 2001 models have engines that have performance and fuel consumption - i.e. 2.7cdi or 2.8jtd.

Qu. Any advice regarding engines pre and post 2001 (i.e. 2.7cdi & 2.8jtd vs their earlier equivalents)?

In all probability I will be faced with a purchasing '00s of miles from where we live. Not ideal, but inevitable. Some dealers offer what they describe as a flexible warranty that should be valid at any VAT registered dealer/garage. I believe one dealer mentioned a warranty by MBG?

Qu - anyone experience of these type of warranties?

I am a member of the RAC, but I have never made use of the RAC inspection.

Qu - has anyone used RAC inspections on a Motorhome, prior to purchase and successfully had any defects identified corrected prior to purchase?

I wondered whether it would be possible to get the dealer to accept that if any 'fixable' faults were identified - they would be fixed to the RAC's satisfaction i.e. dealer pay for the re-inspection! If they have done a good job what have they to lose - they have everything to gain - a motorhome sold!

Qu - optimism my middle name?

Thanks in anticipation.


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## citroennut

hi jemshome,

i have a starline 680 basically the 644 on the merc chassis which is 7.2m. as per davesport - _'Im inclined to think that Merc owners are less inclined to let on when they've had a problem & it's dead easy to give Fiat a slagging.'_ possibly true but in 3yrs ownership nothing has gone wrong  
it has a low bed which lifts on gas struts but a door could also be cut as there are no pipes in the way. 
again as davesport says, the table takes 10s to remove. 
perhshire caravans -weeelll, look for posts concerning same, one quite recently, go to look, but to buy?? 
i'm quite happy driving down single track roads, i will reverse but only if layby closer to me otherwise, well i'm usually bigger than them, - so!!. 
i have always preferred rwd but i do make exceptions but only if car has hydraulic suspension :lol: :lol: 
what have you read concerning bodies and fittings as on the road there are no rattles or squeaks?.
630 and 514 i would have thought would be quite tight for space
any more questions fire away.
cheers
simon


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## takeaflight

Were to start, well Edgehill Lee or dad Paul great service and straight talking, also I think they may be able to source a van for you, if they don't have what you require in stock.

I would go LHD. We are on our third Hymer to date, currently a B700 on a Merc.
However our first was our favourite, a B694g 2.8TD with a B664 on a 2.8JTD being the one in between.

For spec's http://www.hymer.com/de/index.php?kategorie=100105 
follow that link through and you can download data from 1980.


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## jemshome

*Brilliant link ...*

Many thanks for this link - so many pictures and layouts of all the models of interest.

German is not my forte but I'm sure with a bit of study and relative who is fluent, I shall be able to answer many questions.

Thanks again.


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## eddied

*Hymer website*

 buon giorno,
N.B. that on the Hymer website on many of the pages - especially used vehicles (gebraucht)- you have the option of choosing English as the display language.
saluti,
eddied


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## aultymer

> Im inclined to think that Merc owners are less inclined to let on when they've had a problem & it's dead easy to give Fiat a slagging.


Now that is a real bit of lateral thinking!! or is it just convoluted thinking?

Could just be that Merc owners have fewer problems than Fiat owners.

I was beginning to think this was the Fiat owners private problem Forum for a time there.


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## cabby

Have just looked at the hymer site, but unless I missed it there is no island bed model.


cabby


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## jemshome

cabby said:


> Have just looked at the hymer site, but unless I missed it there is no island bed model.
> 
> cabby


Cabby - somewhat confused island bed model is not a requirement. Looking at the models that have fixed beds over a garage.

There are island bed models - I believe the current model is a 698 which can be found in the 2008 Integrated Model pdf.


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## citroennut

aultymer said:


> Im inclined to think that Merc owners are less inclined to let on when they've had a problem & it's dead easy to give Fiat a slagging.
> 
> 
> 
> Now that is a real bit of lateral thinking!! or is it just convoluted thinking?
> 
> Could just be that Merc owners have fewer problems than Fiat owners.
> 
> I was beginning to think this was the Fiat owners private problem Forum for a time there.
Click to expand...

to a certain extent probably very true. but on the whole i think this only applies to big white boxes, as for the car side the level of reliability is woefully lacking. this is a fact i am more than able to comment on and usually do - loudly. car has fault, garage agrees there is a fault but the computer says no fault, where do you start?

simon


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## takeaflight

Heres a B694 for sale.
Nothing to do with me !

http://www.motorcaravans-motorhomes.co.uk/Stock List/V reg Hymer 694G.htm


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