# Crazy world we live in.



## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

The 'killer' of George Floyd has been given 22.5 years jail in the states. While two thugs in UK are given 3 and 4 years for killing a man in UK?

https://www.aol.co.uk/news/killers-jailed-senseless-attack-launched-142346216.html

One could argue Floyd was being apprehended while the thugs in UK were just killers looking for a victim.

Ray.


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

I think the high profile of the case may have had something to do with the length of sentence Ray 

Sandra


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Yes courts generally do frown upon members of the police force killing innocent people. Such indiscretions do tend to be rather high profile.


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## Webby1 (Mar 11, 2012)

Really no need for the quotation marks Ray.........well unless you are wanting to make a point about something.

He definitely killed him.....whether it was murder is a different question

One could argue that Floyd was being apprehended.............again if one wanted to make a point.
I would argue that we should hold armed and trained public servants to a much higher standard of behaviour and any punishment should match that.

It was a high profile case and one could argue that the sentence was to placate the BLM movement ..........if one wanted to make a point. 
But I think it was a correct sentence for the crime.
I don't know what that sentence amounts to in reality in the US. Do you know what is their usual sentencing policy for a killing?

So whatabout the 2 thugs killing a man in UK.......disgraceful sentencing.
I think it should certainly have been higher,although it was apparently only 1 punch.
But then some might argue that a higher sentence for killing an Asian gentleman was also to "placate BLM"

If UK courts are delivering pathetic sentencing that is an issue on it's own and not comparable to what happens in US.
Again...........unless one want to make a point about something.


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

Well there is High profile and high profile 

Why would stating that be making a point other than what it is ?

There have been several high profile cases firmly in the public domain 

The killing of George Floyd reverberated throughout the western world , are we claiming it didn’t?

The profile of any case affects the sentencing as well as other things 

There isnt really any comparison between manslaughter by a single punch and the death of George Floyd and it would be difficult to claim a murder charge if there is no proof of intent to murder 

I think the thugs were looking for a victim, but not necessarily to murder him 

The American system of justice is different than ours ,you only have to look at death row to confirm that 

Sandra


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

I don't think the ethnicity or colour of the victim should make a difference ALL lives matter, and yes authoritative people should receive higher sentences for any crimes they commit.


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## Webby1 (Mar 11, 2012)

Pudsey_Bear said:


> I don't think the ethnicity or colour of the victim should make a difference ALL lives matter, and yes authoritative people should receive higher sentences for any crimes they commit.


Absolutely agree with you......................I suspect the sentence was rightly connected to his role as a guardian and upholder of the law,although some may want imply that it was high because of the colour of the victims skin.

We don't know the sentencing system in US, but as Sandra so rightly says it seems to be a lot stricter judging by the people on death row.................but do they regularly serve all their sentence in US.I don't know, so I don't speculate

As Sandra rightly says "The killing of George Floyd reverberated throughout the western world , are we claiming it didn't?"
I'm not sure who would want to claim that it didn't.

As Sandra rightly says "There isn't really any comparison between manslaughter by a single punch and the death of George Floyd " That's why I wondered what was the purpose of the OP

I don't think either case constituted murder............but someone certainly died.


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

I wasn't trying to make any points just relating the vast difference in sentencing for taking a life. 

Ray.


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## Webby1 (Mar 11, 2012)

But Ray I ask you to consider why you called the policeman "the killer" in quotations................he killed George Floyd surely no doubt or quotation about that.

You said "One could argue Floyd was being apprehended while the thugs in UK were just killers looking for a victim"

The implication is he had some justification of apprehending a criminal................... but I actually think that makes his crime worse. 
He was a highly trained, armed and supported police officer.

Although the UK guys were undoubtedly racist thugs it is reported that they just punched the guy once. 
As Sandra rightly says not necessarily to murder him.

I actually think Derek Chauvin was also a racist thug and have no problems with his sentence.


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

We can delve into all sorts of implications we can only assume because we just don't know. OK the court found him 'guilty'. Yes more parenthesis indicating it just might be questionable. i.e. personally imho the guilty of murder decision might be convenient but questionable.
As you can come to the assumed conclusion the cop was a 'racist thug'. 

Ray.


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## Webby1 (Mar 11, 2012)

Ray he was guilty..............he killed him................not in quotations.
Whether it was murder might be up for discussion.But apparently under Minnesota law

" third-degree murder is defined as causing another's death without intent to kill, but "evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life". So he was guilty of murder as defined. Why would you consider it to be "convenient" oh I see that pesky BLM

As to a racist thug........he had 18 previous complaints against him...........read up on his back story. And who was it "convenient" for

I still wonder what point it is that you are trying to make.........I feel there is still a BLM objection here.

You know where I stand.............spit it out man............what do you want to say..........what strikes you as so crazy.

Don't run away saying there is a group picking on you and there's no point carrying on..............it's just me, genuinely trying to understand exactly what it is you want to say about this issue.


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

There are questions that remain unanswered, at least in my mind 

Did Chauvin intend to kill, was it murder or manslaughter ?

Was Chauvin a racist thug or are we assuming that because Floyd was black, and there is an assumption that all cops are racist 

Did Chauvin act alone ? what about his colleagues that were present at the scene? Could they not intervene did they think they were witnessing a murder, if so were they not accomplices 

Would 22 yrs be normal for manslaughter?

Did the public outcry and the very public demonstrations of the BLM riots and demonstrations affect the length of sentence or the the fact a sentence passed was for murder rather than manslaughter 

Would a lesser sentence have lead to public demonstrations and unrest?

We won’t know without understanding the American judicial system or seeing a transcript of the trial 

Sandra


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## Webby1 (Mar 11, 2012)

aldra said:


> We won't know without understanding the American judicial system or seeing a transcript of the trial
> 
> Sandra


That's why I would never have thought to make any comment...............................but come on spit it out what do you think should have happened...............Oh me first

Well the guy killed him......no need for quotation marks
I agree manslaughter might have been appropriate.......but murder seems to have lesser level in USA
I say the word racist thug........based on his behaviour that night and previous complaints against him.

Would 22 years be appropriate for manslaughter be appropriate.............I don't know so I don't comment

What is it about the case that makes you and Ray want to make your comments.....................has justice been done..................is the guy innocent................what is it you want to say............... or is it just that pesky BLM idea again


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

Why would it be that Webby

If I thought that I would have said so , you don’t need to be guessing , and I used no quotation marks 

I imagine you know more about it as I don’t know anything more than that Loyd was killed that night, his killer was sentenced to 22 yrs for murder 

You are quick to say you don’t comment,but read your own replies and you do comment as much as anyone 

Has justice been done? I don’t know and if you are to be believed neither do you 

Who is suggesting that he’s innocent ?

You jump from the sublime to the ridiculous 

No one is suggesting he is innocent , no one is suggesting he should not be punished 

If he murdered in cold blood then a life sentence is appropriate 

Being racist does not in itself carry the life penalty although many may feel it should , so I’m not sure where the fact you think he is racist is actually relevant 

He is being sentenced for killing someone, that someone could have been black or white, he could have been black or white , should the fact that he was white and the guy he killed was black influence the sentence ?

If not, then race and colour is not relevant , the fact he killed another person is 

Did he set out to intentionally kill him, it’s murder , if not, then it’s manslaughter 

But of course I am neither judge nor jury , but I do think I’d be naive not to consider that the wide spread public demonstrations and riots against the police following Lloyds death had no bearing on the sentence given 

I don’t know if it’s intentional but you do seem to think you have the right to express your opinion and by poorly veiled suggestions , the right to decide if other opinions should be expressed 

Sandra 





And if so why?


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Webby1 said:


> Ray he was guilty..............he killed him................not in quotations.
> Whether it was murder might be up for discussion.But apparently under Minnesota law
> 
> " third-degree murder is defined as causing another's death without intent to kill, but "evincing a depraved mind, without regard for human life". So he was guilty of murder as defined. Why would you consider it to be "convenient" oh I see that pesky BLM
> ...


Like the Guildford four. 'Guilty' but .......................... ? And many other 'unsafe' decisions.
You go on about BLM all you like but sorry I have had enough of that merry-go round and got off when I was only given one option.
How many other policemen have had complaints levied against them right or wrong?

Ray.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

aldra said:


> Why would it be that Webby
> 
> If I thought that I would have said so , you don't need to be guessing , and I used no quotation marks
> 
> ...


My goodness, you are quite right. You don't know much about it. So little in fact that you don't even know the name of the victim.


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

I doubt nit picking actually helps Alan. We can all make mistakes in spelling or expressing ourselves as I'm sure I have at times. Basically I would tend to agree with Sandra here in general. But somehow in some threads that just won't do.

Ray.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Nit picking Ray.

We are talking here about the highest profile killing that's taken place recently in the US and possibly the whole world and you think that expecting people who are offering views on it to to know the name of the victim is nit picking. I see.

And I do of course respect your right to think so. But I disagree entirely. It would be impossible, in my view to have followed the case sufficently to garner knowledge to allow comment on it without having discovered the name of the victim.


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

Agreed Alan it's as you say the highest profile killing that's taken place recently in the US. 
But this is a very small insignificant forum where a few members try to keep up and express their personal and sometimes not always in depth points of view.
Picking on some minor error is pointless in the extreme. We all make minor spelling and or grammatical errors that hardly change the content.

Yes nit picking.

Ray.


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

My contention is that not knowing the name quite obviously reflects the overall level of knowledge. You can't have an interest in a topic without knowing the basic details, in my opinion.


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

For goodness sake Alan you really are scraping the barrel

It was a spelling mistake or predictive text I failed to notice, if you’d read my other posts ,which I’m sure you did you will know that I am quite aware of his name

But you of course are welcome to exercise your acute feelings of superiority as you so often do, I guess it’s a need in your case, but you have no veto over who can have an interest in any topic or the direction of that interest 

Do you have anything of interest to say on the topic or are you just there as a self imposed nit picker 

How many nits can a nit picker pick if…………:nerd:

Sandra

…


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

Self imposed nit picker. Very good. 

May I respectfully suggest, this time definately nit picking, that you check what self imposed means?


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

Have you forgotten your atrocious spelling on some of your posts Earnyboy?

Of course you blame the small keyboard on the phone

Some might think you should check before you post:wink2:

Do I know what self imposed means?

Well let me think what it means in your superior view of yourself as a poster, no one is requesting or even acknowledging your sense of superiority 

It often stems from feelings of inadequacy I’ve heard :wink2:

Sandra


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

My smelling is probabally addiequate.


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

Yep so is most peoples spelling who post on MHF 

If it can be understood it’s fine, it’s not a spelling test 

Sandra


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## erneboy (Feb 8, 2007)

I agree entirely.


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## aldra (Jul 2, 2009)

We agree earnyboy, don’t get hung up on the spelling my I pad chooses it and I can’t be bothered messing with it 

Don’t let it go to your head that we agree 

It’s most definitely fleeting 

In fact it’s probably already flit >:wink2:

Sandra


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

More crazy judgements by the courts. Whats up with UK courts?

Drunk driver who ploughed into mother and daughter gives middle finger after walking free from court
Yahoo News UK
8 August 2021, 5:58 pm
Scott Roe
Scott Roe, 39, stuck his middle finger up after walking free from court for drink driving. (SWNS)
This was the reaction of a drunk driver who walked free from court despite leaving a mother and daughter with devastating injuries after hitting them head-on in a horror crash. 

Scott Roe, 39, ploughed into another car in his Mercedes CLA220 after he "got bored" of following a car that was sticking to the 30mph speed limit in July last year. 

He walked away unhurt from the crash but left 39-year-old Kelly Merridew her daughter Chelsea Sidwell, 19, seriously injured.

The mother and daughter were trapped in the wreckage of the crash in Bedworth, Warwickshire, for two hours while emergency crews tried to free them.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Liz got a call from the husband of one of her friends yesterday, his wife, and son had been run into in a car park by some old bloke who forgot how to drive a car, they are both in hospital with serious but not life threatening injuries, broken leg, ribs etc, the problem is her son is getting g married up in Stirling on the 28th, so it may have to be cancelled yet again, on top of that she has health problems I'd not wish on anybody, some people really do not get any luck.


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## patp (Apr 30, 2007)

American judge are, I believe, voted in to office. Could this have something to do with the severity of the sentence? It makes one wonder if we would not have a better justice system if a lenient judge lost his job at the next election? Or would it lead to trial by media?


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