# HGV licence for motorhomers?!?



## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Just read in the NotW that the EC is looking at proposals to make motorhomers take HGV driving tests.

Apparently the Caravan Club isn't too happy about it, unsurprisingly.

Anyone have any more gen on this? Couldn't have come at a worse time, really - going to pick up our first 'van a week Friday!


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

I agree that people should take some kind of extended test, but perhaps not the full Class C licence.

As it stands at the moment, it's just a question of whether the max gross weight is over 7.5 tonnes. I've not heard anything about this new law.


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## RogP (May 1, 2005)

I read this in my local paper last night. The article I saw also indicated tuggers as well as Motorhomes were included. 

Some Euro MP is pushing for ammendments or will oppose completely.

I kind of agree that some form of additonal training should be undertaken as being new to driving vehicles of this size I could benefit greatly from some expert advice on my driving capabilities. 

(now there's a business opertunity for someone!!!!!!!)


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## 90459 (May 1, 2005)

Many years ago I was a PSV driver and the training I had then was useful when I started driving a MH but to suggest HGV's is crazy - they should concentrate their energies on raising the standard of driving for everyone if they really want to improve conditions on the roads.

Sounds like another way of making money for someone.

Billyo


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

I completely agree that training would be useful but to suggest a whole new licence is required is simply preposterous.

I'd love to engage in some mh specific education package, and I _think_ the Caravan Club offer some, but it's pricey.

Whatever next, eh? Ordering our greengrocers to supply their wares in kilogrammes?! :wink:


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## 88742 (May 9, 2005)

Have to agree with the majority here, some extra training would be a good idea. I've always been in favour of some sort of intermediate qualification between a car licence and a HGV, the extent of vehicles that your entitled to drive on a car licence can be quite a challenge for some drivers without experience, for example a large 4x4 & tandem wheeled caravan/horsebox/coach (Non passenger) can all be driven by a driver with only a years experience.

I know Iknow :roll: , I’ve just upset everyone who take their horsey’s for a weekend drive, but hey, that’s what forums are for.

Ian


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

The Road Traffic (New Drivers) Act 1995 came into force on 1/1/97 and anyone who has passed a standard car test since then cannot drive a vehicle above 3,500 kgs, or tow a combination with a train weight above this. So someone who passed their test last year is not allowed to tow a horsebox (unladen or laden) wth a 4x4 unless they have taken a further test called the B + E test. It also affects some caravan & 4 x 4 or very large car combinations.
Re motorhomes it means that anyone passing their test in the last 7 years cannot legally drive a motorhome over 3,500 kgs unless they have passed the additional Class C1 test for medium sized goods vehicles.
Persons who passed their tests before 1/1/97 were given licenses entitling them to drive vehicles up to 7,500 kgs & retain what are commonly called (by the DVLA & DSA) "grandfather rights" to the entitlement.
It is likely that if further changes are made the principle of Grandfather rights will remain so drivers currently holding licences will not have their entitlements withdrawn.  
Hope this clarifies the issue a bit.


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## 88742 (May 9, 2005)

Hi Twooks,

I used to (HGV1 & PSV), not any more. 
Behind a desk now.

Ian


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## 88742 (May 9, 2005)

No pilots licence, if you saw how many aircraft I can get through on 'flight sim' you'd not want me to be your pilot :wink:


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

There are no plans to make any material changes to the uk car driving test until at least 2007. These changes relate to 'enviromental' issues and emerging technologies such as ABS etc.

It is possible that the projected driving time, currently 37 minutes (I know, don't ask it is complicated, maybe another day I will explain) will increase by 5 minutes. This is mainly dependent on the current recruitment of examiners to reduce the average waiting times. Then the standard 7 tests a day can be reduced to 6 tests a day and still maintain an average waiting time of around 6 weeks (currently about 4 months in London and surrounding areas). The increase in test fee to around £50 will then be more palatable.

The motorcycle test will see some changes later this year to comply with EU legislation. Basically some additional manouvers and a high speed avoidance test (at about 50kph/30mph).

In theory a person can pass a driving test in the morning and then go and tow a caravan along a motorway later that day without any further training other than the restrictions already mentioned.

Fortunately I believe Motorcaravanners to be a sensible lot who eithier take some training or stay within their capabilities.

So the moral of the story is don't believe everything you read in the newspapers, but you knew that already. Apologies to any journo's out there.......


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## hbspc (May 1, 2005)

*Common sense and road etiquette and Education*

I was on the m1 to dublin in my motorhome to a rally at easter when i was overtaken at 70mph by caravan's being towed by 4x4s and other big cars they i am ashamed to admit were from the same club.
Do they know the traffic law act in the UK and Northern Ireland and Southern Ireland.

To me it seems that the age old Caravanners Code has been forgotten as the masses rush to by these items and people forget the golden rules.
I spent one night at our rally site and decided that if i wanted to be sorrounded by music systems and lager louts with no insurance or tax discs and 5 brats and motorised scooters i would be better of at the costa del sol. We left the next morning, me the wife and our 3 year old daughter and went waterford, where the city masses had gathered in tens of thousand with their domestic 2k or 3kwatt kettles where they brought down the local power grid and the back up generator went on fire.

We then quietly sat back and watched our 240v col tv set (small one)
with fully 240v system and watched coranation street while the masses ran round in utter confusion and blamed the site owner for only providing 10amps which meant nothing to the idiots.

MH&Tourer service engineer


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## hbspc (May 1, 2005)

*4x4 and bc*

I personally see what a big 44 can do to a tourer without the appropraite absorbtion blocks.,
Recentley sold twin axle came back with all furniture and fittings broken away from walls, asked what was he doing he replied towing with a 4x4 without any blocks after he had pulled out of the yard in a car with the tourer in tow.
Insurance failed to pay for any damage and we would not repair any damage as he was asked at the time what would be the towing vehicle,


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## 88915 (May 10, 2005)

*licences*

going back to the orignal posting, as the report was from one of Mr Murdoch's "newspapers" I would take it with a pinch of salt. Don't let a good story get in the way of the truth.


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## 88838 (May 9, 2005)

*Re: licences*



bognormike said:


> going back to the orignal posting, as the report was from one of Mr Murdoch's "newspapers" I would take it with a pinch of salt. Don't let a good story get in the way of the truth.


I agree - most of [all of ! ] Murdoch's stuff :twisted: should be taken with a pinch of salt. 
In this case I thought Caz's posting covered the facts and presumably Murdoch's mob have added considerable spin and exaggeration

8)


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## 91027 (May 1, 2005)

Having the seen the remains of a caravan being lifted and strapped to two recovery vehicles on the M1 I would most certainly recommend an extended or specialised training in driving with one in tow. Cars were not designed as towing vehicles, my artic tractor unit was. You'll never see me tow a caravan either with a car or my tractor unit! Horses for courses. Motorhomes well thats different, can't wait to take delivery of mine.


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Now then, how many artics have I seen jacknifed, how many corner posts have I seen taken out by artic drivers not realising their length on cornering, how many trailers have I seen jump the curb, how many artics have I seen dump their load, how many artic trailers have I had to lift out with a forklift when they were stuck in the yard, and oh yes that’s with specialist training.

I wonder if Ducatos were intended for conversion to coachbuilts

Anyway, welcome to the forum, we are a friendly lot, oh yes we are, really.

Ken S.
A tugger for thirty six years.


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

KenS said:


> Now then, how many artics have I seen jacknifed, how many corner posts have I seen taken out by artic drivers not realising their length on cornering, how many trailers have I seen jump the curb, how many artics have I seen dump their load, how many artic trailers have I had to lift out with a forklift when they were stuck in the yard, and oh yes that's with specialist training.


Well said ken..

how often are you stuck behind two cowboys, one trying to overtake the other, one doing 56mph, the other doing 57mph for mile on end with a massive queue behind .. very professional indeed

Jim 
( a tugger for 24 years without accident )


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## autostratus (May 9, 2005)

> how often are you stuck behind two cowboys, one trying to overtake the other, one doing 56mph, the other doing 57mph for mile on end with a massive queue behind .. very professional indeed
> 
> Jim
> ( a tugger for 24 years without accident )


Were you also on the M42 northbound above the A5 junction as I was on Friday last about 3.30pm?
You must have been there to describe that. I didn't see you.
Nearly up to the Burton/Measham junction before the overtaking lorry got past.


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## 88838 (May 9, 2005)

I know it's annoying when that happens, and some of the time it is down to selfish behaviour; but . . . . . . .
I used to do a lot of hitching in my misspent youth, and it's a lot harder for lorries to adust their speed fractionally, thus slowing down to let faster traffic thro first can end up with the lorry being stuck for a disproportionate amount of time at a slower speed - and their time is strictly rationed - ours isn't. and how many times have you also seen artics stuck behind auntie mabel and uncle fred taking the car for a stroll in the middle lane!
Simple answer, put freight back on rails [or even canals!].

having said that I do like the German method which serves to segregate traffic into lanes in busy periods, and effectively separates cars n trucks.

8)


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## 89335 (May 20, 2005)

> having said that I do like the German method which serves to segregate traffic into lanes in busy periods, and effectively separates cars n trucks.


I like the sound of that


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Please don't label all artic drivers as cowboys, its the same in any profession, for every cowboy giving you bad press, theres an awful lot of hardworking and thoroughly proffesional people doing their job as it should be done. As Twooks said, drivers work to a tight schedule and are subject to strict laws and time limits when driving, its a difficult job at the best of times.

The transport industry is the lifeblood of the country, we would grind to a halt without it. Putting freight back on the rails or canals, do you think thats really feasible in this country?

Jumps of soapbox and refills wineglass!

pete.


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

peejay
I agree with you artic drivers are no different than any other driver Including tuggers, that was the point I was making.

Any way we all knowthat artics are easier to handle than a car and trailer, easier than a drawbar trailer or a pole trailer, and as for reversing, you can park them on a sixpence.

Respect for all drivers(providing there not in my way) :evil: 

Ken S.


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Just out of interest Ken, have you got a HGV Licence?

pete.


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

PeeJay

No. I drove all types commercial, plant and private until the law changed then decided it did not warrant spending large sums of money to obtain the new licence as my life was going in other directions, from then on all road work with HGV was left to the professionals, I confined myself to off road.

I think I may be correct in thinking that you have, if so, I can't help thinking you will agree with my earlier comments.

Ken S.


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Ken wrote;



> No. I drove all types commercial, plant and private until the law changed then decided it did not warrant spending large sums of money to obtain the new licence as my life was going in other directions, from then on all road work with HGV was left to the professionals, I confined myself to off road.


No, I don't agree with your comments as a whole, a lot of people judge HGV drivers when they haven't got the licence, but cannot accurately comment because they haven't 'done the job' as for your observations regarding easier handling and reversing i'm afraid i have to differ as well. As you commented in the quote 'leave it to the profesionals' as i do with people in other professions.

happy travels, whatever you drive.

pete.


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

peejay

Slow down a bit, if you look at my first posting, you have to agree my comments were justified if somewhat tongue in cheek, after all “HGVdriver” saw a caravan that had been involved in an RTA and assumed the caravan driver to be at fault, that may be, but it could also have been hit by an artic, and that obviously did not enter his mind.

I also stand by my statement that artics are easier to reverse than most other trailers I can think of, due to their length and the fact that the wheels are placed invariably at the extremes rear, also that the fifth wheel is normally over the rear wheel of the Prime Mover, not to the rear of it, as in most towing situations thus making another pivot point, try reversing a four ft trailer or a drawbar trailer sometime and see which is easier.

Did I say I had not “done the job”? Not That I am aware of, I can assure you I drove my first artic before you could even think of it.

As for not holding an HGV licence precluding me from being able to judge the drivers, does that also apply to the Police and legal profession.

If your own sense of pride is hurt and turns you blind to the truth then so be it, but don’t try and take it out on other people having a little bit of light hearted banter on the forum.

And finally I do respect all good drivers and riders, male or female of all types of vehicles, professional or not.

Ken S.


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Ken. S.

Blimey, we've got off on the wrong foot haven't we!

Some observations;

1. 'slow down a bit' - can't go fast in the first place 'cos we're govened to 56 mph.(light hearted banter here).

2. Take your point about 'hgv driver' and agree.

3. I've reversed artics, drawbars, caravans etc and believe that reversing a 25ft trailer into a tight spot is harder than a drawbar. Only my personal opinion as yours is.

4. Been driving hgv for over 20 years and still hold the licence so feel qualified to comment.

5. My own sense of pride is not hurt, i just felt i needed to stick up for all the (profesional) hgv drivers that get such a bad press.

6. I don't think i'm taking it out on other people as you say, just expressing my opinion.

Here's wishing you well,

perhaps we should have a reversing contest! (bet i'll win).

pete.


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Ok peejay 
I'll hold you to that contest, after i've fed you a few pints.!!

Happy motoring
Ken S.


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## 88838 (May 9, 2005)

this thread is getting really exciting innit???

 

8)


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

twooks said:


> this thread is getting really exciting innit???
> 
> 
> 
> 8)


Wow ..better than TV ..lol..

seriously, there are only two kinds of drivers.
Good and Bad and they drive everything from mopeds to artics.

better not start on the women drivers .. 8O

Jim ...happy motoring


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Is that kind woman drivers we see with supermarket trollies?

Ken S.


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

How could I resist it 

Ken S. 
duck and dive for cover.Gone


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## 88838 (May 9, 2005)

KenS said:


> Is that kind woman drivers we see with supermarket trollies?
> 
> Ken S.


at least we have an excuse - how many cars do you know of with 4 wheels pointing in different directions 

8)


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Ok,Ok, another point to you, I'm getting fed up you gaining all the points.

Ken


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## Bazbro (May 9, 2005)

After the exciting chat (steady, Guys, we're all friends here!), back to Stormywether's point and the subsequent points. How about considering what the Institute of Advanced Motorists (IAM) has to offer?

I recommend, no, URGE you all to consider joining and supporting this non-profit making organisation that is dedicated to raising the standard of driving for all ordinary motorists. Look here:

http://www.iam.org.uk/

The 'secrets' of Police Advanced Driving are explained, you're coached in using these principles in your everyday driving, and are given the opportunity to pass an Advanced Test at the end of it. It doesn't cost a bomb, membership of the Institute can give you cheaper insurance, your driving WILL improve and you WILL be a safer driver as a result. Many of the instructors and all examiners are Class 1 Advanced Police drivers, so for a paltry sum you can tap into expert tuition and eventually be a better driver.

Try it.

Please.

Barry


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## 89411 (May 22, 2005)

The fact is that women are safer drivers than men thus cheaper insurance :lol: 

the main problem with all drivers is aggresion and impatience - if we all calmed down took our time and were a bit more considerate the roads would be a lot safer place :wink:


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

I think that’s a good idea Barry, last time I enquired about it was told I did not qualify because of a recent (at that time) conviction for speeding, doing 117 over Askers at 6 in the morning with the sun behind me, didn’t see I was being tagged, lost licence for 3 months, £300.00 fine, and with legal fees it worked out a fortune, plus I had to employ a driver for 3 months to take me to various meetings. Still it was my own fault no one else to blame and it taught me a lesson.

Now at my age it’s not worth bothering.

Ken S.


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## 88838 (May 9, 2005)

117 ?? what in??? not a shopping trolley I think ????  


8)


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Now then Ken,

Can you reverse as quick as you go forwards?

pete.


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

peejay 
only in a Dingo.

Ken S.


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Go on then,

Whats a dingo :?:


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## Bazbro (May 9, 2005)

Think again, Ken. If "there's life in the old dog" then you could pick up a technique or two that could prove to be a lifesaver, particularly as we get older. 

One aspect of the course is driving within your own capabilities, and as we get older our capabilities inevitably diminish (experience then takes over as our only saviour!) Understanding the limits of our capabilities is a real eye-opener.

Have another go. Go on. Go on. Go on. Aw, go on!

Barry


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## 89411 (May 22, 2005)

hope it wasn't the motorhome and if it was - how on earth do you get it to go that fast 8O


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Peejay
Sorry, showing my age again, it's an old army scout car, can go as fast in reverse (handy at times!!!) as it can forwards, long long long outdated now.

Barry 
Can you see me an Advanced driving course in my M/H, i'ts my everyday vehicle, the old banger is parked in the drive and not been used for over a year now.

Ken


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Hey, do you realise this thread has now gone to 4 pages

Ken


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## Bazbro (May 9, 2005)

Ken, mate, it doesn't matter whether it's a m/home or a moped. The IAM will welcome your interest whatever you drive. 

I hope it's the old banger that's been on the drive for a year and not the m/home?

And didn't the Dingo have four-wheeled-steering?

We're probably onto FIVE pages now!

Barry


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

No Barry, definitely the old banger in the drive not M/H, and yes 4 wheel steering, as was I think the Humber scout.

That just reminded me of when I replaced the front drive axle on a yank Loadermobile forklift with a rear dodge axle by accident, ended up with 4 reverse gears and 1 forward.

Still to old to take the test
Ken


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## 91154 (May 1, 2005)

Hello from Jakit, as a way of introducing ourselves and having read the comments about proposed HGV lic. for M/Homes, the following is what I was told last Oct. when having our van checked at a VOSA station.
HGV Lic. is on the cards, vehicles 3,500kg and over, speed to be held at 80km an hour, governors to be fitted at owners expense and probably tachometers to follow. All of the above to be in place within 2yrs and of course comes from Bruxelles. The basic framework is apparently in place and just requires to go through European Parliament. I thought the chap was winding us up but he said not. Our Government will no doubt apply these regs. without objection though it was interesting whilst in Italy recently that EEC regs only apply if they are not an inconvenience. But that's another story.[/img]


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## autostratus (May 9, 2005)

Hi Jakit and welcome.

Lets hope that the proposed new rules wil apply to OVER 3500kg as that will leave a large group under and not subject to the changes.
Just to be safe, I think maybe we'll have ours downgraded to max of 3499kg 

Mighty glad we didn't opt for a 4500 max when we bought our last mh.


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## 90765 (May 1, 2005)

*Loved this one!!!!*

God this was exciting! bit of professional pride creeping in between tuggers and/or men, bit of feminist pride ,bit of conciliation, bit of off thread to lighten the load!
Got it sussed!!! here we go, single , separated female parent off on 12 month jaunt around the newly enlarged Europe with 2 small children ( cheap insurance -main female driver) reunites with separated husband to enlist his driving expertise and ( now highly prized qualification of ) recent mid life crisis HGV Licence (plenty of experience no accidents and not allowed to drink at wild camping spots!)

Can't wait till August 1st! Must be the perfect M/H combination!
Alex


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Almost forgot, follow up to previous posting, the Humber scout car was NOT 4 wheel steering.

Ken


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

*licence*

 hi, talking of licences,i have off and on for year's rode sml motorcycles upto 125cc on my car licence with l plate's.
any way i thought i would get another one, only to be told that i would now be required to take a certificate of basic training £75,easy test if you have ridden before.
right so i have took the test only to be told that i will be required to take it every two year's or take the main test.
so i decided to go for direct accses as it wasn't much dearer than the 125 test and if i changed my mind i would have to do it again for a larger bike. 
the realy stupid thing is to take the test you also have to do the theory test as well,so you have been driving for thirty year'sand you haven't grasped the theory yet? :wink: if i rember right that test was about £50 too.once you have passed this you are licenced to ride any bike you want,so you can go from a 125 to honda fire bladeave speed 165 mph stright away,i dont know about you but i think that's daft.
if saftey is the question how does that work then.i guess most of this is fund raising myself.
pete


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

*Re: licence*



camperpete said:


> the realy stupid thing is to take the test you also have to do the theory test as well,so you have been driving for thirty year'sand you haven't grasped the theory yet? :wink: if i rember right that test was about £50 too...........i guess most of this is fund raising myself.
> pete


Hi Pete, Taking a theory test after thirties years expierience can be a real problem for people who don't keep themselves upto date. Every week I meet people who have lost their licence and have been ordered to take another driving test. For some they have had to have several attempts at the Theory Test (was £18 now about £21 with the new Hazard Perception element). Then their driving has not changed in that time and several are a real danger to the public and themselves.

I know that when I took my original motorbike test at 17 and a half, mini roundabouts were unthought of and even filter lights were a novelty. How often do you see people at roundabouts with no idea of what to do?

Driving today is a skill not a birthright as some would believe! :wink:


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Hear hear Maverick. I guess we're in the same profession.


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## 88797 (May 9, 2005)

Didnt the Dingo have an angled seat so you could look over your shoulder easier whiles driving backwards?


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

*hi*

hi maveric,yes i understand what your saying i drive all day and really see some mindboggleing thing's and you know the type of person ,never been in an accident but seen some in their mirrow's the point being though i could take a cbt without taking the theory test and ride for two years but not for direct access size of machine should not make a diffrence as a dangerous driver/rider is still dangerous.
pete


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Things are far from perfect. Back in my day (cue music) I did a few turns round the block on my 100cc Suzuki, passed and then I could ride anything.

Similarly I haven't riden a motorbike regularly for about 8 years now but there is nothing stopping me from getting a 1300cc super bike! Apart from common sense really.

Caz, we are indeed in the same profession, you teach, I test. Some days, like today, I wonder what people are thinking when they come along for test. 7 tests a day and some are just not even close! When you think that the average test route is only about 12 miles driving for no more than about 40 minutes!

I'm sure that when we change to the 6 test day (it is on the way) there will be uproar, it will add a mile or two and 4 or 5 minutes at most! We shall see.

Re-testing every ten years? It will happen, only a matter of time. My guess is about 2008/10.

Anyway, I'm not having a go, just provoking a bit of thought for the old brain cells.

Drive safely, statistically Motorhomers are a pretty safe bunch, so don't have nightmares...........


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

What never ceases to amaze me Maverick is the number of pupils who can drive very well with me but either adopt a different style or go to pieces on their test & completely fluff it, making it look as if I have taught them incorrectly! And on the other hand I have had a few who I felt were borderline but have driven nearly perfectly on the day & sailed through first time.

As they say there's nowt as queer as folk.

Regarding the re-testing of drivers, the problem is that many drivers can drive well when they want to & could "turn it on" for an hour or so but as soon as they pass they will revert to type. I have seen this with a few banned drivers who I have helped to get through a re-test & then see them out on the roads again.


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Caz said:


> What never ceases to amaze me Maverick is the number of pupils who can drive very well with me but either adopt a different style or go to pieces on their test & completely fluff it, making it look as if I have taught them incorrectly! And on the other hand I have had a few who I felt were borderline but have driven nearly perfectly on the day & sailed through first time.
> 
> As they say there's nowt as queer as folk.


Indeed Caz, when I was an instructor I tended to find that there were times when the pupil was a bit 'scrappy' beforehand and that would focus the mind a bit and they would concentrate and do well. On the other hand a super drive before the test can lead to over confidence and stupid mistakes.

I can remember a couple of times I've sat in the back and thought "Who's driving, not the person I taught???" as they would do things completely to the contrary of what the've been told.

There are times when I see candidates with certain instructors who have an excellent reputation and bring up a good standard. Then the candidate does something different and you know that's not what the've been taught.

Only yesterday I had a guy who stopped at every junction, handbrake neutral etc. tottally regardless of what was going on. At the debrief "Oh, my dad told me to do that last night!", poor instructors eyes raised to the sky!!

I do feel for you guys sometimes and I don't miss it one bit. All the evenings and weekends off, sick pay, civil service pension, no worries if they don't turn up, holiday pay, no feeling guilty if you don't work a bank holiday, etc. etc.   

Be careful out there........ 8)


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## 88870 (May 10, 2005)

hmmm, fluffing driving tests .... i did that (touched the kerb on a reverse park round a car) but the rest was fine (only 2 minor faults)

I can drive really well and my lessons now are basically just an excuse for a drive now to keep my hand in! But taking tests make me ill ... all kinds of tests - not just driving tests ... I feel sick, get a cold sweat on and physically shake!! 8O 

Mind you, i only failed once (so far) - a year ago, got the next one in 3 weeks. (took me that long to pluck up the courage again!) One of the problems is that i like to know where i am going in advance and i now know that it is not a good idea to ask the examiner this in transit! 

Wish me luck (i know, i know, its not luck its ability :roll: )

Leigh 

NB, i know i have left it a little late to learn to drive but i've never needed to before - always lived in town!


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Good luck Leigh, Think of it as someone taking you to see a friend or something that you don't where it is and so just follow the directions. Eventually you will realise you are on your way back to the test centre and have a rough idea where you are going.

Most of us, unfortunately not all, are quite prepared to have a bit of a chat if it helps. Probably not a good idea to start a conversation as you are reversing around a corner!

You can usually start a chat about work/studies, holidays, hobbies and of course the weather. If you think you've blown it, don't give up, the examiner will usually assess your faults over the whole drive and if it turns out just to be the one thing your instructor will know what to work on.

Some things are of course more serious than others and even if it's blatant keep trying. You are right that it is about ability but realistically a bit of luck is involved. We can go days without seeing a pedestrian so much as near a crossing and then some poor soul has to stop at everyone.

I've seen lovely drives spoilt in the last few minutes when panic sets in as a ambulance/fire engine comes screaming down the road with blues and twos!

Once again good luck, try to relax, we don't bite honest! :wink:


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## 88870 (May 10, 2005)

Thanks for the advice Maverick .. I will let you know how I do .. fingers crossed, tucks four leaf clover into back pocket and hangs rabbits foot from the rear view mirror 8) (yuck - maybe not the rabbits foot)

You are right about the chatting thing, I drive lovely when having a conversation - as i do with my instructor - it is second nature then.

However, my examiner looked like a Brigadier General - stiff back, stiff upper lip, medals on chest of blazer when visiting the supermarket type of chap - i kid you not - and he was used to giving orders, not idol chit chat! I withered under the enslaught! :-#

Leigh 

[NB - nothing against Brigadier General type characters - in case any are members! - just don't like being chauffering them round town in silence! :laughing7: ]


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Wurz said:


> my examiner looked like a Brigadier General - stiff back, stiff upper lip, medals on chest of blazer when visiting the supermarket type of chap - i kid you not - and he was used to giving orders, not idol chit chat! I withered under the enslaught!


I know the sort you mean their are a few still around! We are trying to break the mould a bit. We are eithier Dinosaurs or Dolphins. You got a Dinosaur and I think I'm supposed to be a Dolphin..........

 :duckie: :wav:


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## 88870 (May 10, 2005)

I'd be happy transporting a dolphin .. they are nice, intelligent beings with personality .... fingers crossed for a dolphin!!

In fact, fancy coming to test me Maverick .... ? I promise not to crash, run any lights, get in the way of any ambulances etc! 8O 

Leigh


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Relax, Leigh, even in the 6 years I've been teaching the nasty Brigadier types have gone & we have some really lovely examiners now.

"I do feel for you guys sometimes and I don't miss it one bit. All the evenings and weekends off, sick pay, civil service pension, no worries if they don't turn up, holiday pay, no feeling guilty if you don't work a bank holiday, etc. etc. "

OK! Don't rub it in!

Just for the record I don't do evenings, weekends or Bank Holidays & I've got a good sickness scheme but I would love to be able to take a fortnight's holiday - daren't take more than a week at a time in case my customers all go elsewhere & because the month's cash flow would suffer too much.


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## 91494 (May 1, 2005)

*HGV licence for motorhomes.*

I was told that to drive a large motorhome over 7 tone GVW would require an HGV C (used to be class 2) this assumesi it is not articulated which requires C1 I think thius was the original class 1. I could be wrong perhaps someone could elaborate?

rgards

Dave and Lynne


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Caz said:


> The Road Traffic (New Drivers) Act 1995 came into force on 1/1/97 and anyone who has passed a standard car test since then cannot drive a vehicle above 3,500 kgs, or tow a combination with a train weight above this. So someone who passed their test last year is not allowed to tow a horsebox (unladen or laden) wth a 4x4 unless they have taken a further test called the B + E test. It also affects some caravan & 4 x 4 or very large car combinations.
> Re motorhomes it means that anyone passing their test in the last 7 years cannot legally drive a motorhome over 3,500 kgs unless they have passed the additional Class C1 test for medium sized goods vehicles.
> Persons who passed their tests before 1/1/97 were given licenses entitling them to drive vehicles up to 7,500 kgs & retain what are commonly called (by the DVLA & DSA) "grandfather rights" to the entitlement.
> It is likely that if further changes are made the principle of Grandfather rights will remain so drivers currently holding licences will not have their entitlements withdrawn.
> Hope this clarifies the issue a bit.


Caz pretty much sums it up on the first page. Basically you are now looking at a C class of test. C+E with a trailer. Chatting to one of my colleauges the other day at an LGV (Large Goods Vehicle) as appossed to HGV (Heavy Goods Vehicle) Test Centre. The biggest change they have seen, especially away from cities is women driving horse boxes. A lot of them, the horse boxes, still come in at around the 7 ton mark which would have been within limits previously.

I'm sure I could have put that better but I'm in a rush to go and 'plug the van in' and prepare for our early morning departure to..........er not sure, but that's the beauty eh!

:wav:

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## Motorhomersimpson (May 9, 2005)

My 17-year-old daughter obviously had a dolphin on her test on Wednesday; he was talkative, talking about her school, exams ECT.

She passed first time with 6 minors, she said it seemed like no time at all before they were back at the test centre, the examiner or Instructor mentioned that he felt my daughter was a very competent driver and did not need the full 40 mins.

I think that the old school examiners are now mostly a thing of the past, and so it should be in my opinion, there is no benefit at all from the examiner being a `to quote wurz` a `Brigadier type`.

Although I took my car test over thirty years ago, in the last ten years I have taken another two, one an HGV1 (I use old terms) and the other a motorbike, both I past first time.

Remembering my car test (took 2 attempts) the examiners were in those days’ very serious people, I can remember friends saying `oh you do not want to get so and so, he’s a miserable git`.

The recent tests were totally different, (okay on a bike it’s difficult to make conversation) but the examiners were very polite and I felt helpful, made me relax very early on in the tests.

Maverick, you’re obviously a dolphin; reading through your posts, keep up the good work.

Cas, you have a job that can be extremely satisfying on one hand, and frustrating on the other.

Wurz, you’ll do fine, try to relax, it’s not as if you are going into strange territory is it, good luck.

I only came on to tell you my daughter passed her test and got carried away, she had lessons from a driving school, and also a lot from me, she was very easy to teach, always listened, and at her age it’s like a sponge, they can absorb so much info.

Homer


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## zulurita (May 9, 2005)

I hope those of us who have been driving a motorhome for a few years will not have to take a HGV test although when I first started some sort of training would have been welcome. My licence allows me to drive up to 7.5 tons and I drive a 3.85 tons motorhome now. :!:


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## 88870 (May 10, 2005)

MotorHomerSimpson said:


> Wurz, you'll do fine, try to relax, it's not as if you are going into strange territory is it, good luck.


Cheers MotorHomer, appreciate it! Congrats to your daughter, now she can ferry you about so you can assist with the collecting of the silver lining from wineboxes ...(from one of the other posts) go for it 8O

Leigh


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## Motorhomersimpson (May 9, 2005)

:dontknow: 

Homer the confused :?


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## 88870 (May 10, 2005)

MotorHomerSimpson said:


> :dontknow:
> 
> Homer the confused :?


*
To explain! *... you can drink lots more vino coz you don't have to drive ... 

Your daughter come pick you up after you have been out partying!!

Leigh 8)


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## 89122 (May 14, 2005)

Seem to have lost the thread here, I thought it was HGV licence for motorhomers?!?*
Eddie :?: :?: :?: *


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## 88870 (May 10, 2005)

oops  sorry, got carried away! ok .. so back to thread now .. 

Leigh


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

\/ :thumbleft: :hello1: :headbang: :toothy7: :wav:

:iroc: :iroc:

Well Done Leigh

Another woman at the wheel of a motorhome! :wink:


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## 89146 (May 15, 2005)

*HGV License for motorhomers?*

Yes, and there are plenty of female HGV license holders out there too so we will be ready for it if it comes in =D>


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## 89170 (May 15, 2005)

Trust you passed your test then Leigh!

Well Done


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## Bazbro (May 9, 2005)

Forgive me, but maybe this is a good time to repeat my earlier post (for those new, or who missed the first):

How about considering what the Institute of Advanced Motorists (IAM) has to offer?

I recommend, no, URGE you all to consider joining and supporting this non-profit making organisation that is dedicated to raising the standard of driving for all ordinary motorists. Look here:

http://www.iam.org.uk/

The 'secrets' of Police Advanced Driving are explained, you're coached in using these principles in your everyday driving, and are given the opportunity to pass an Advanced Test at the end of it. It doesn't cost a bomb, membership of the Institute can give you cheaper insurance, your driving WILL improve and you WILL be a safer driver as a result. Many of the instructors and all examiners are Class 1 Advanced Police drivers, so for a paltry sum you can tap into expert tuition and eventually be a better driver.

Try it.

Please.

Barry


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## Anonymous (Nov 10, 2000)

Can only support what Barry says. When it comes down to it the benefits of the knowledge gained far outway the costs which are hardly anything!

:iroc:


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## 88870 (May 10, 2005)

Maverick said:


> \/ :thumbleft: :hello1: :headbang: :toothy7: :wav:
> 
> :iroc: :iroc:
> 
> ...


Hi Mav!

Sorry to take so long to get back to you, I was moving house :lol: and I had to switch off my Broadband connection.  But I am round me Mams house now and hogging the PC! 8)

Thanks for the congrats Mav & Sweepy... I was jumping around and doing a little jig on the day I passed but then came back down to earth when I realised that I had a choice of driving a 1971 beetle that is a little stuck in its ways or the beemer (better halfs pride and joy!) .... mmm choices !

Settled for the beemer, at least the brakes are consistent and it has power steering. Not got used to the width yet though .... I learnt in a diesel Corsa! That said, Phil hasn't sworn at me yet or shut his eyes and prayed  must be doing something right 8)

oooo, and just to let you know BarryandSue, I am going to be doing a further course with my driving instructor - country lanes and motorways etc ... then may consider the advanced driving bit after I have done the extra test to be able to drive a van over 3.5 tons ... phew, gonna get expensive this one!

Leigh


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## Bazbro (May 9, 2005)

Well done, Leigh! Let us know how you get on.

(And the I.A.M. isn't expensive - just £85. See here http://www.iam.org.uk/Aboutus/join.php )

Barry


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## Motorhomersimpson (May 9, 2005)

Well done Leigh,

Got over your nerves then, very excited I should imagine.  

Now you really start to learn to drive, just enjoy yourself and it will all become second nature, again congrats, safe driving. :lol: 

Homer


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## Dopeyngrumpy (May 13, 2005)

I'm going to come over sounding all retrospective but...

Rant on

Has it occurred to anyone else as this thread has (entertainingly) meandered around the topic just how fixated as a nation we are on rules. Does nobody else remember being 8/9 up in a parents mini traveller going to a swimming pool? - not once but every week? Or sitting in the back of an HA van with half a dozen mates and enough beer to sink a sizeable cross channel ferry off to the coast for a weekend? No concerns or worries about payload there! and guess what - Nobody died and no damage was done.

And before anyone starts with that's all very well but what if? Life cannot be run by what if... Bees cannot fly.... it is an aerodynamic impossibility and probably over their plated limit.. so if a what if merchant points this out to the bees - no more honey!

I don't condone complete disregard for the rules but what on earth happened to free will and at your own risk - life is about choices and chances - I choose to get out of bed and at a stroke reduce my risk of dropping dead in bed, I choose to cross a road <gasp> not always at a designated crossing <oh no!>

Rant off

Sorry got to use the soapbox somewhere - Understand your limitations and then seek how far you can exceed them!

Time to reach for the nomex

David


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## jimplim (Apr 29, 2008)

I have just turned into the 70th year I have been driving my current mh now for five years.I have now had to reapply for a licence cat 1 & d1 to be able to drive it. The mh is 3.75 t which is just over 3.5t limit for an ordinary b 1 licence. How absurd is thet. At a cost of a hundred quid for the pleasure of the doc's signature.


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## SamAhab (Aug 23, 2011)

Is this a record? The last post before jimplim's post of yesterday was made nearly 8 years ago, in 2004


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## raynipper (Aug 4, 2008)

1984....................... !!!!!!

Ray.


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## Penquin (Oct 15, 2007)

There are always questions about why "old threads" suddenly get resurrected but in this case I suspect it is simply as he felt it was appropriate and perhaps (shock, horror 8O ) used the search facility  to find threads linked to HGV licensing......... 

I would be very surprised if there is any more complex reason than that, jimplim is a perfectly respectable member and has been for several years, although he may not post many things this seems a perfectly responsible post.  

Now if it was a non-subscriber, making his first post then I am sure Nuke would be checking whether the origins of it were in Mumbai or Beijing - spammers seem to adore those particular cities for some reason. :? :roll: 

But it is always good to see new information from members - he is facing something which all of us will get to eventually and fore-warned is fore-armed.

Thankfully the gist of the thread, about yet more Euro-impositions seems not to have born fruit, long may it last......... :evil: 

There are however many differences between the scheme as regards driving vehicles over 3.5tonne in Europe c/w Britain, some of which would benefit many MHF members - such as the approval for insulin dependent diabetics to be allowed to drive such vehicles - as it is elsewhere in Europe...... The UK Government is "considering the implications of such a change" and has been for a considerable time....  

Dave (just trying to be helpful)


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## acctutor (Oct 3, 2009)

*Iam*

Hi

Barryand Sue - I hope the IAM has improved over the years - back in the 70's I started to attend the course.

When the instructor told us that no matter what exit you want from the roundabout, you always stay in the left hand lane (even if it is the last exit) so that you are in the correct lane at the exit (against all commonsense and the Highway code), I walked out and never went back.

Instead I attended the Police Advisory Driving course, which was run by active policer drivers and included a morning session on the skid pan, and a trip up the A12 in a fast patrol car - woo hoo.

I can still do the police driving commentary (but not for more than about 5 mins)

Keep safe

Bill & Patsy


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## ThursdaysChild (Aug 2, 2008)

I was taught to stick to the island until you wanted to leave the roundabout, signalling left prior to leaving. That also saw me through the IAM Test in 1962.
Then some silly B invented dual carriageways, with multiple lane entry and exit from roundabouts. This confused everyone, so they rebuilt the roundabouts with multiple lanes all round, which led to a dozen different theories about how to negotiate a roundabout. The MofT, police, IAM, AA, RAC, BSM plus indy instructors all helped stir the pot over many years.
Take a deckchair, sit at a roundabout and prepared to be horrified at the near misses. 
All the theories are still in use, and all at the same time !
Fortunately, though, other road users treat MH's with the utmost circumspection. I wonder why ?


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## SamAhab (Aug 23, 2011)

PenQuin: Me thinks you have a tendency to over-moderate. :x


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## GROUNDHOG (Mar 7, 2006)

So my new motorhome arrives tomorrow, weight 3880 kgs. Our Son who spends all day every day off road driving tractors and large machinery as well as driving his Land Rover Defender and a Transit Luton on the road, cannot legally drive it.

My Sister In Law who is now over 60 years old passed her test when she was 20 and has never driven since, not even ridden a bike and she can drive it quite legally!

The law is an Ass.


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## jimplim (Apr 29, 2008)

Hi Its jim plim again this must be a record for me twice in a week . Im not much of a chatter box but I do like to read and browse thro the topics regulary i do agree that the Law is sometimes a bit difficult to comprehend For all its short falls Isuppose the bottom line is (where do you draw the line) I would of thought there should be provision for cases like mine ,I have tried to explain to the powers above that I dont want to drive a BUS or A SEVEN TON TRUCK Just get in my MH and enjoy my hard earned retirement. It falls on deaf ears though. JP


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## grizzlyj (Oct 14, 2008)

But many campers are bigger than a 7 ton truck?!?!

One solution would be to buy a camper with a lower gross weight, or, if you are always running under the limit get your current camper downgraded to less than 3500kg?

I agree training to drive a bigger vehicle is a very good idea, as is including biker awareness, and everyone having a reasonably regular refresher whatever they drive/ride. But inventing an entirely new test for campers? I don't see whats wrong with class C or C1 one as appropriate personally.


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## CliveMott (Mar 10, 2008)

I had an HGV class 1 or whatever they call it today, but when I passed 65 and considered that I was unlikely to require it any more especially considering the cost of the medical I let it lapse. Was this a mistake I wonder? Present van is 6.4 tonne.

C.


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## 100127 (Jul 20, 2006)

You are fine Clive. You can drive up to 7.5 ton if you passed your car test before 1997, I think. I to have a class 1 and a PCV, and reach 65 this year but are letting them both go on the premiss, do I still want to drive an artic or a coach anymore. Also have done the IAM in both.
I will still have the badges on the front of my MH and Car.

bob


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

Clive, 

I don't know how close you are to 70, but don't forget that you will need to retain category C1 for you MH, which will require a medical and form D4. They will accept it 4 months before the expiry date and I suggest you do it then because DVLA are slow and if there are any further questions back to thee doctor or further tests required that period can easily be eaten up.


Geoff


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## DTPCHEMICALS (Jul 24, 2006)

GROUNDHOG said:


> So my new motorhome arrives tomorrow, weight 3880 kgs. Our Son who spends all day every day off road driving tractors and large machinery as well as driving his Land Rover Defender and a Transit Luton on the road, cannot legally drive it.
> 
> My Sister In Law who is now over 60 years old passed her test when she was 20 and has never driven since, not even ridden a bike and she can drive it quite legally!
> 
> The law is an Ass.


We specifically purchased a mh at 3500kg so that son in law could drive it. 
The law is only an Ass when we do not agree with it.

Dave p


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## jimplim (Apr 29, 2008)

Grizzlyj wrote (but many campers are bigger that a ten ton truck) 
I agtree , but mine isnt its 3075kg which is just over the limit and requires the C&D catorgories,The point I was majking was I have been driving it around the world for seven years now because I have reached the magic 70 I have got to go thro an expensive medical examination .Which I have done Which enables me to drive a 7.5 t lorry or a passenger vechicle ETC Which is not what I want to do .Why is'nt there a catergory For vechicles such as a medium sized Mh like mine







Today is like yesterday I'l do it tomorrow. jp?


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