# Why are Auto Trail body panels construcrted so badly!



## oldmokey

Why so many problems see these two links below in Auto Trail section.

*Be warned check and check again before you buy and Auto Trail. *

"To all MotorHome owners Stress Fractures in Autotrail Roof"

"Crack in side of the van - Resovled satisfactorily."


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## SaddleTramp

I don't think it is JUST Autotrail.

If you look at ANY manufacturer with the quantity of unit's sold that Autotrail has you will find complaints of various types.


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## Zebedee

I vaguely recall something about AutoTrail having had problems with whoever did their GRP layups for them.

I think the problems lasted only for a short time before they gave their suppliers the sack, and things are OK again now.

Note the phrase "_I think_!". If I have maligned anyone it is unintentional.

Dave


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## rayrecrok

Hi.

Maybe it is all motor homes now the trend has gone over to full fibreglass body shells instead of the old coach built aluminium ones.

Its progress! :roll: allegedly..


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## Annsman

I've had my Cheyenne for two years now and it performs exactly as I think it should. It even goes backwards with out complaint! I've done 15,500 miles in it all over Europe and the UK and apart from some problems early doors, that have appeared on this website on other makes forums, that were repaired/replaced without a quibble by my dealer and Autotrail, it's been a joy to own.

The two bodywork related failures it's had were the result of outside influences, i.e another vehicle and a low stone wall.

So as far as I'm concerned, as the man said as he fell off the empire state building between the roof and first floor, "So far, so good!"


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## SpeedyDux

Having made chairs and car body parts from fibreglass in the dim distant past, my recollection is that in order to make them strong enough to last, they ended up a lot heavier than you might expect. It must be a design challenge to achieve a durable roof cap or luton moulding in GRP while at the same time keeping the weight as low as possible. 


SD


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## DTPCHEMICALS

The cracks in our gelcoat mainly appeard over winter. Only on the rear panel
05 Cheyenne. After warrenty had expired. No one wanted to know.


Dave p


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## teal

SpeedyDux said:


> Having made chairs and car body parts from fibreglass in the dim distant past, my recollection is that in order to make them strong enough to last, they ended up a lot heavier than you might expect. It must be a design challenge to achieve a durable roof cap or luton moulding in GRP while at the same time keeping the weight as low as possible.
> 
> SD


I will second your remarks as our Cheyenne rear panel is so thin you can see light through it and have many cracks.


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## stewartwebr

rayrecrok said:


> Hi.
> 
> Maybe it is all motor homes now the trend has gone over to full fibreglass body shells instead of the old coach built aluminium ones.
> 
> Its progress! :roll: allegedly..


I certainly prefer the progress with the fibreglass. I have owned a number that have been constructed this way, and went "back" to aluminium when I bought my last van which was a Swift Voyager. In my opinion it was nightmare. I had a few dings appear that I had no idea where they came from and I am very carefull with my van. The construction was the sole reason I did not replace my van with another Swift. I would not have another aluminium side motorhome.

Stewart


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## tviall

*Re: Why are Auto Trail body panels construcrted so BADLY!*



oldmokey said:


> Why so many problems see these two links below in Auto Trail section.
> 
> *Be warned check and check again before you buy and Auto Trail. *
> 
> "To all MotorHome owners Stress Fractures in Autotrail Roof"
> 
> "Crack in side of the van - Resovled satisfactorily."


I know that you have issues with your van as I once did (reference crack in side of van) but you will also note if you read the whole of my thread that Autotrail were very accomodating and helpful. They repaired my van without any question and I am fully satisfied with everything they did.

I can understand your frustration and are looking at ways to fully resolve your problem but I afraid that you cannot use my experience as a weapon in your arsenal. I am a fully satisfied customer of Autotrail.

Now, I'm not saying that the vans are perfect but every make of van can have problems. Indeed, almost every caravan I ever owned (I have had 3 over a 7 year period) all had cracks in the GRP as did the Rapido I had. I have just resigned myself to the fact that occasionally the GRP will crack but these can be repaired quite easily. The bottom line for me is that the after care I have experienced from Autotrail has been good and I wouldn't hesitate to buy another one.

Tony


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## lufc

our cheyenne is still under warranty but AT say the cracks in the rear skirt are due to stones being thrown up from rear wheel, warranty does not cover this, not does insurance, bad design from AT is the real cause, longer mudflaps or a board in front of the rear skirts would have prevented this.

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopict-84173-.html


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## sallytrafic

If at a show you get a chance look at the quality of the GRP on a little Romahome and compare it with the manufacturers who do not have the advantage of a maritime background/skill set.


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## Carl_n_Flo

Unfortunately GRP, when laid up to marine spec, is relatively heavy when compared to the spec used on our motorhomes.

Way back, when Autoseeper first produced the SV100 monocoque coachbuilt on the Bedford, the vehicles were much smaller than today, did not have so many interior fittings and generally carried less (no sat tv, microwaves, huge on board tanks, power systems etc). They could get away with a thicker lay-up (necessary for the structural stability of the van).

Other than the modern Autosleeper equivalent to this model, you dont see any larger versions built in the same manner because of weight.

Today, when a manufacturer uses GRP (on the whole), by necessity it has to balance the thickness (and therefore weight) of the GRP against the overall weight of the finished vehicle.

Sure you could have thicker and more 'stable' GRP components, but you would have to sacrifice some of your payload to achieve it.

Its a fine balancing act.............

Our AT GRP panels flex quite surprisingly - specifically the large rear panel and the roof panel - however, other than a small 'star' crack in the gel coat at the lower extremity of the 'goal post' by the drivers door (caused by a stone thrown up from front wheel....with mudflap fitted) there are no defects. Both these large panels are only fixed to the structure of the van via 'hard points' along the edges to allow for thermal movement.

Autotrail have always responded to our queries for help and clarification. Maybe we are fortunate not to have had to deal with them on warranty issues....we dont know.

We are very pleased with our van - it suits us to the ground - and so far so good..........

Carl & Flo


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## oldmokey

Hi Tvial
Your quote below
"I can understand your frustration and are looking at ways to fully resolve your problem but I afraid that you cannot use my experience as a weapon in your arsenal. I am a fully satisfied customer of Autotrail." 

I am surprised you are fully satisfied with AT they have been making the Chieftain for many years but still come out with serious faults like yours and your problem was far worse than mine. 

Your experience of customer service with AT was good, mine was bad, but my question was asking "Why do we get these problems in the first place? it was only the fault I was using as a weapon. (your words not mine) 
My fault could have been put right if I contributed £160 + vat even though still un warranty, but why should I, would you have paid up.


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## coppo

Carl_n_Flo said:


> Unfortunately GRP, when laid up to marine spec, is relatively heavy when compared to the spec used on our motorhomes.
> 
> Way back, when Autoseeper first produced the SV100 monocoque coachbuilt on the Bedford, the vehicles were much smaller than today, did not have so many interior fittings and generally carried less (no sat tv, microwaves, huge on board tanks, power systems etc). They could get away with a thicker lay-up (necessary for the structural stability of the van).
> 
> Other than the modern Autosleeper equivalent to this model, you dont see any larger versions built in the same manner because of weight.
> 
> Today, when a manufacturer uses GRP (on the whole), by necessity it has to balance the thickness (and therefore weight) of the GRP against the overall weight of the finished vehicle.
> 
> Sure you could have thicker and more 'stable' GRP components, but you would have to sacrifice some of your payload to achieve it.
> 
> Its a fine balancing act.............
> 
> Our AT GRP panels flex quite surprisingly - specifically the large rear panel and the roof panel - however, other than a small 'star' crack in the gel coat at the lower extremity of the 'goal post' by the drivers door (caused by a stone thrown up from front wheel....with mudflap fitted) there are no defects. Both these large panels are only fixed to the structure of the van via 'hard points' along the edges to allow for thermal movement.
> 
> Autotrail have always responded to our queries for help and clarification. Maybe we are fortunate not to have had to deal with them on warranty issues....we dont know.
> 
> We are very pleased with our van - it suits us to the ground - and so far so good..........
> 
> Carl & Flo


The main thing you want though from a motorhome is surely excellent general construction and longevity, everyone wants a good payload but to sacrifice this for paper thin, weak construction is surely not the way forward.

Paul.


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## transitional

All the talk of grp not being strong enough means I have to comment. I raced sidecar outfits for 27 years and always made my own fairings. If it is laid up carefully by hand and rolled after each coat with strips of woven roving put in it is far stronger and a greater tensile strength weight for weight than steel or aluminium.
I have moved a spinning sidecar outfit out of my way at speed (no where else to go and he was leading) and still won the race with the fairing in one piece. Yes it did crack the gelcoat though.


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## johnnybiker

I have owned three motorhomes and my current 18 month old Autotrail Cherokee is by far the poorest in terms of quality particularly the roof where I have had two leaks in the first 18 months of ownership and now have stress cracks in the gel coating. I put in a warranty claim through Brownhills for the stress cracks and got the following response from them

_have had a response from MB&G with reference to your claim and they have informed me that they have rejected your claim for the cracks as they do not deem the cracks as structural, if you wish to discuss this further than their telephone number is 0191 2590647

I would have expected this sort of response if I had bought a £20 model motorhome but not on something that cost in excess of £50k. It doesn't say much about customer service or aftercare from either Brownhills, Autotrail or MB&G the warranty insurers, none of them seem to want to take responsibility for a defective and poorly made and designed product.

Won't be buying another Autotrail._


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## erneboy

I moved away from buying Autotrails a few years ago because our one year old Mohican (2007 model) was leaking in three places through the roof and letting water up inside the rear panel and delaminating the finish in the rear wall of the bathroom. There were other problems but those were the major ones, Alan.


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## jedi

I've had leaks tackled 3 times in my present Autotrail. The roof being the main culprit where the grp meets the aluminium. Water pools along the join and last year poured down the inside walls. 
On the first occasion the dealer, in Dereham, 'repaired' the leak in about an hour by digging out some old sealant and squeezing in new (enough said) on the warranty.

This year I took the van to a caravan service business. They removed the offending strip and resealed the joint properly. I've learned to avoid motorhome dealers for repairs after a string of bad experiences and high prices.

I happened to see an exact same version of my van last month - same model, same year, same layout, same upholstery and SAME water ingress damage in same locations.

Buyer beware!

Jed


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