# EHU should be pay by meter ?



## ramblingon (Jul 15, 2009)

Just a thought wouldn't it be a fairer system if the hook up's were on a pay as you go meter, I wouldn't mind paying for what I use but some camp site charges are steep £35 a pitch with EHU, last year I watched someone go off for the day and left the heater in the awning on, this can't be sensible use of energy, just putting the price of a pitch up for everyone else. What do they do in Europe?


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## DTPCHEMICALS (Jul 24, 2006)

Ah well if you only paid for what you use, who would pay for the infrastructure of putting in the EHU in the first place.

The site operators have to make a profit out of the service provided or they may as well not bother.

I do agree that pricing is a bit of an issue on some sites.


Dave p


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## txe4man (Apr 7, 2009)

i think meters have been discussed before and apparently they are costly to install, and also cause delay when leaving a site whilst you wait for your meter to be read.
i have seen a simple solution used on several french sites where the offer different prices depending on how many amps you want to draw, then give you a circuit breaker rated accordingly, you just plug it in and if you try to use more it trips. when you leave you just take it back to reception when you pay.


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## bognormike (May 10, 2005)

DTPCHEMICALS said:


> Ah well if you only paid for what you use, who would pay for the infrastructure of putting in the EHU in the first place.
> 
> The site operators have to make a profit out of the service provided or they may as well not bother.
> 
> ...


That's the reason the CC & CCC have flat charges (CC is included, CCC "service" pitch addition), if they had to charge the electricity "as used" they cannot (apparently :roll: ) make a profit on it to cover the cost of the installation.

I've come across all sorts of things on the continent - separately metered, inclusive (with no amp specified), and various amps ratings. And yes, if you only had 6amps you could only use it for approx 1.3kw of appliances (6x220v), so it would stop the use of big heaters and microwaves etc.


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## Jented (Jan 12, 2010)

Hi.
We were charged on a meter at a site some years ago, in Austria,the Dutch couiple next to us told us about ACSI, where the electric is included in the price!,lesson learned,we joined ACSI through Vacarious Books, and have never looked back.
This is one way to avoid big electric bills,and enjoy all the other benefits of the ACSI Camping group,hope this helps.
 Jented.


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## ramblingon (Jul 15, 2009)

Placing a standing charge for the use of the meter as well as actual electricity used would be perfectly acceptable, it is unreasonable to expect those that use a little to supplement those that use a lot, the meter is the way to go if saving energy is paramount any thing that encourages misuse has no future.


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## JeanLuc (Jan 13, 2007)

Rarely use a hookup, but when we do, I'd rather have a meter, or a coin in the slot system as used on many German Stellplatz. Normally, I only want to recharge the batteries.

Philip


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## ThursdaysChild (Aug 2, 2008)

This has been discussed before, and it emerged that there is something in our stupid electricity regulations that precludes anything which might be construed as re-selling electricity. Hence the way in which sites have to dress up their charges as rental of hookup equipment or make no charge but include it in the pitch rental.
Most smart operators know how much electricity is typically used by a standard outfit and can set rental prices high enough to cover their actual cost of supply plus installation and maintenance of the kit.
Stupid arrangement, no doubt dreamed up to protect the energy giants.


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## Glandwr (Jun 12, 2006)

ThursdaysChild said:


> This has been discussed before, and it emerged that there is something in our stupid electricity regulations that precludes anything which might be construed as re-selling electricity. Hence the way in which sites have to dress up their charges as rental of hookup equipment or make no charge but include it in the pitch rental.
> Most smart operators know how much electricity is typically used by a standard outfit and can set rental prices high enough to cover their actual cost of supply plus installation and maintenance of the kit.
> Stupid arrangement, no doubt dreamed up to protect the energy giants.


I can see no problem with sites selling tokens for a certain value of electricity. Corner shops in poorer areas do it all the time. A small access or standing charge would then provide a return for them. The "can't do" argument is a smoke screen. They are happy to charge everyone the rate that the profligate should pay.

Dick


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## Traveller_HA5_3DOM (May 9, 2005)

ThursdaysChild said:


> This has been discussed before, and it emerged that there is something in our stupid electricity regulations that precludes anything which might be construed as re-selling electricity. Hence the way in which sites have to dress up their charges as rental of hookup equipment or make no charge but include it in the pitch rental.
> Most smart operators know how much electricity is typically used by a standard outfit and can set rental prices high enough to cover their actual cost of supply plus installation and maintenance of the kit.
> Stupid arrangement, no doubt dreamed up to protect the energy giants.


I think the EEC regulations were drawn up to protect the rights of Students living in Bed Sits and alike. They were being charged extortionate rates by their landlords. It seems like the CC and the C&CC both got the wind up and realised they were retailing their hook ups at far more than they were paying for it. This is what was made illegal so they changed to making the plots inclusive of electric.
Interestingly the campsite owners on the continent never bothered and carried on doing what they had always done and still do.


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## rasa (Feb 12, 2011)

There is at least one CL in the UK with EHU meters...

They were fitted as some (read many) people abuse the EHU, especially in winter.. We have all seen it, 2kw fan heaters running in awnings etc and also because some don't want to pay for power the don't need/want. 
'
On checking in, you buy a card, £2, £5 or £10 .. this 'charges' the meter.... on departure any unused credit is refunded. You can of course buy more credit if required.

Broadly speaking, provided the owner is not making a profit from reselling it is perfectly legal. This is the same type of meters are used by landlords letting out single rooms.

OFGEM rules: http://www.ofgem.gov.uk/Consumers/Documents1/11782-resaleupdateoct05.pdf

This is by far the most equitable method for owners to charge for power..


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## jiwawa (Jun 22, 2007)

rasa said:


> Broadly speaking, provided the owner is not making a profit from reselling it is perfectly legal.
> 
> ....
> 
> This is by far the most equitable method for owners to charge for power..


But surely the owner has to make a profit of some kind for the upkeep of the electrical installation?


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## Glandwr (Jun 12, 2006)

JWW said:


> But surely the owner has to make a profit of some kind for the upkeep of the electrical installation?


A flat standing charge with consumption at cost on top?

Dick


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## rasa (Feb 12, 2011)

JWW said:


> But surely the owner has to make a profit of some kind for the upkeep of the electrical installation?


Upkeep is minimal, but any cost comes out of the site fees which also pay for the running costs of the site .. eg.. grass cutting, water/sewage rates, business rates, pitch maintenance etc etc.


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## Rapide561 (Oct 1, 2005)

*EHU*

Many overseas sites charge for electric based on usage. I do no mind providing I am not being ripped off. For example, if electric costs them 10 cents per KWH, then that is what I want to pay.

I will add, in the winter, I estimate my van uses about £5 worth of electric per day, whilst in the summer, somewhere in the region of £1 per day. I have calculated this having stayed on sites with meters on the pitches, but, stangely, no additional charges made.

Pay for what you use would prevent those who go out leaving heating on full pelt etc.

Russell


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## johnthompson (Jul 29, 2010)

ramblingon said:


> Just a thought wouldn't it be a fairer system if the hook up's were on a pay as you go meter, I wouldn't mind paying for what I use but some camp site charges are steep £35 a pitch with EHU, last year I watched someone go off for the day and left the heater in the awning on, this can't be sensible use of energy, just putting the price of a pitch up for everyone else. What do they do in Europe?


A friend of mine with a CL put meters in a year gone August. He had observed the above wasteful use and his electric bill had gone sky high.

The meters cost £15 pounds each and slots into the bus bar like the trip which is incorporated in it. He sells cards of £1, £5 and £10 value. He charges 14p/Kwh which is not expensive. As a result he has been able to keep his pitch charge down.

While I was there last summer a van came on site and used £5 of electricity overnight. My usage was just over £1 per day. It turned out this person ran everything on electricity and had the attitude that he paid for the site so should be able to use what he wanted. When he found out what he was using he had to go out and get a gas bottle as he didn't carry one.

I am happy to use metered points.

I am on a site in Spain at present that allows 2.3Kwh per day in the fee all other use is charged at 50 cents per Kwh. We average 7 Kwh per day at present Full timing. Other site I have heard of in Spain charge between 30 and 50 cents per Kwh.

John


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## Bryandh (Oct 6, 2010)

Jented said:


> Hi.
> We were charged on a meter at a site some years ago, in Austria,the Dutch couiple next to us told us about ACSI, where the electric is included in the price!,lesson learned,we joined ACSI through Vacarious Books, and have never looked back.
> This is one way to avoid big electric bills,and enjoy all the other benefits of the ACSI Camping group,hope this helps.
> Jented.


True, but limited to, on average, 4kw per day after which additional usage is charged at whichever rate the owner chooses to apply...generally between 40-50p per kw. We are at present at Playa las Dunas in Cadiz and the charge (ACSI Site) is about 4 euros per day.


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## ramblingon (Jul 15, 2009)

It makes you wonder just how many tons of carbon are wasted due to the fact we have no meters it is a ridiculous situation where we have camp sites with recycling and super heated awnings the one does not assuage the other just because people feel they have paid for it already. 

If I knew the name of the energy minister I'd contact him about this.

I think the CC and CCC should show a lead in this matter they know the truth their policy contributes directly to global warming, the longer it continues the more embarrassed they should be when they do put it right.


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## eddievanbitz (May 1, 2005)

ramblingon said:


> It makes you wonder just how many tons of carbon are wasted due to the fact we have no meters it is a ridiculous situation where we have camp sites with recycling and super heated awnings the one does not assuage the other just because people feel they have paid for it already.
> 
> If I knew the name of the energy minister I'd contact him about this.
> 
> I think the CC and CCC should show a lead in this matter they know the truth their policy contributes directly to global warming, the longer it continues the more embarrassed they should be when they do put it right.


So make some one else responsible for the fact that it is us, the campers that are being irresponsible using the fan heaters in the awnings?

I like the plan! :roll:

The solution really is this. If you want to save the planet be responsible and use less power.

If you don't like paying for electric in the price of a pitch, go to sites that don't have electric hook up or sites that have metered hook up.

You won't find many though as it is in reality a nuisance. if you have coin meters, they will be broken into or dodgy coins will be inserted.

Then you have the arguements, when people simply flatly refuse to believe that they could have used so much. We get it now when people keep over loading their supply and blowing their trip and blaming our equipment "I'm missing Corrie" because of this :lol:

Add to this the fights over the fact that people come back and find out that some scroat has unplugged their van and plugged their (scroats) van in " I didn't think that you would mind"

Hassle for the guests and the wardens when some one wants to leave early in the morning and a meter has to be read before the guest can leave, as opposed to leaving when it suits...

Nope, been through most of the arguements and we will like the majority of campsite in the UK not be changing for the forseeable future.

Eddie


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## Caggsie (Aug 19, 2008)

On the stellplatz we've been on, the site owner has a locked hook up unit, that takes umpteen cables. On arriving, you find the owner. Who unlocks cupboard put in your cable takes a reading with you there, records it and then locks up the cupboard. On departure you do the same, find the owner get your cable back and pay. No one seems to get in a frenzy about finding the person and it works. On average it was about 2 euro. Ok it was scorching and didn't use too much telly but the fan and fridge were going at a rate of knots and on 24/7. I like that system


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## ramblingon (Jul 15, 2009)

eddievanbitz said:


> So make some one else responsible for the fact that it is us, the campers that are being irresponsible using the fan heaters in the awnings?
> 
> I like the plan! :roll:
> 
> ...


 Not at all sure what you are trying to say there Eddie, apart from" I NEED A HOLIDAY" -I don't think you can have followed the logic of the thread, the card system would appear to be the solution, no coins involved, the "us" you refer to is in fact "them" the wasters that cost the rest.

Where are you? I promise not to trouble you as me thinks you doth protest too much! :lol: and I'd hate to be resented so, is it time for a career change do you think? :? 8) :lol:


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## JeanLuc (Jan 13, 2007)

All valid points made by Eddie, but it makes me very sad to have to admit that.
What is wrong with this society that we presume the worst will happen, and undoubtedly it does, when by comparison, one can plug into a coin meter in a stellplatz, in the corner of a public car park, and the collected motorhomers simply respect each other and the site's property.
I'm sure problems do occur, but in using aires and stellplatz, I have been struck by the general sense of decency and respect for others. Not a completely unblemished record I hasten to add; we were kept awake by rowdy Dutchmen in two vans (at midnight and again at 4 am) on one aire in France, but generally the experience has been entirely decent.

We have to persevere and show that by far the majority of British motorhomers are decent, sensible people. The 'bad apples' cannot be allowed to make site owners think twice about providing new, improved or modified services.

Philip


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*metre*

Yes, we should. Far fairer.

TM


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

I found the meters on Stellplatz lasted ages. good value but then again we dont use a load of power.

As regard re-charging electric at a profit. I had a boat on Windermere for a few years (until they decided to put a speed limit on) and the marina definately charged a mark up on EHU. Each berth was on a meter which was billed quarterly. I was always gobsmacked how much it cost.


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## eddievanbitz (May 1, 2005)

ramblingon said:


> Not at all sure what you are trying to say there Eddie, apart from" I NEED A HOLIDAY"


Simple your statement



rambligon said:


> I think the CC and CCC should show a lead in this matter they know the truth their policy contributes directly to global warming, the longer it continues the more embarrassed they should be when they do put it right


Indicates that the excessive use of electricity by campers, is the fault of the clubs and sites for not restricting/charging for it.

By your logic a glutton, in an all you can eat resturant could gorge themselves to death and then the blame fall on the shoulders of the resturant owners 8O Take some responsibility for your self!

If your worried about climate change use less of everything irrespective of whether you have paid for it or not.

Our Campsite BTW has just been awarded runner up for the Alan Rogers motorhome award.

2800 sites inspected, in thirteen countries so we were pleased to recieve the award so I think that we are doing most things right.

Eddie


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## ramblingon (Jul 15, 2009)

I congratulate you on your award, However, I do resent the inference that I am personally responsible for wasting electricity -like most small vans the only use I get on site is a small fridge and occasional kettle.

Your analogy though dramatic is not really appropriate, as any glutton will tell you overeating has unpleasant expulsion consequences, usually from both ends and the consumer is entirely aware of the damage done to his environment. Where as the absent awning warmer only receives a perceived benefit from his actions, at his fellow campers expense.

I notice you fail to acknowledge the fact that a card meter system dispels your main arguments for not progressing with a fairer method of providing customers with electricity, thus ensuring each consumer is responsible for their own usage.

I realize there is enough expense when one is trying to run a business and plenty of pressures from every side , but to dismiss something- the introduction of which is inevitable, out of hand, is short sighted and contrary to the beneficial evolution of any organisation.

Let me provide you with an other analogy. you sell me a portion of Ariel cable enough for my needs say 3 meters, next van along needs 7 meters, you pay 75pence per meter your mark up is 15pence per meter that works out at £1 per meter, so my bill should be £3. and next doors should be £7, instead you think is is fairer to cut the cost in two as that is what you did to the cable, so my bill is £5 and so is next doors! This is not fair.


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## coppo (May 27, 2009)

Yes it should, far fairer system.

The fact is, if you include it in the price, a lot of people will be irresponsible, we like sites that have separate prices, with or without, 99% of the time use CL,S without, thats what the solar does.

On a site at min. no leccy, LED lights, 12v tele, 280w of solar keeps us fine.

If leccy required they will charge us £1 per day, my kind of site 8) 

Paul.


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## Rosbotham (May 4, 2008)

ramblingon said:


> I congratulate you on your award, However, I do resent the inference that I am personally responsible for wasting electricity -like most small vans the only use I get on site is a small fridge and occasional kettle.


I don't think Eddie was having a go at you personally at all. He was merely pointing out that when we complain about people staying at sites using profligate amounts of power, we should acknowledge that we collectively are those people. For example there was a recent thread on the use of halogen heaters in awnings/canopy. Plenty of debate about price, appropriate brackets, safety, but no mention from anyone that it might be a better idea to put a jacket on or go inside rather than heat a field.

An argument for meters? Perhaps. However I don't see why I should be subject to a load of faffing about (e.g. with coins/cards the things always run out at the most inconvenient time; it is an absolute p.i.t.a. on foreign sites where you have to have the owner come out to your pitch on arrival / departure to unplug you). As an analogy, I don't always use the toilets when I go to a restaurant....that doesn't mean they should employ a coin slot to recover the costs of cleaning them just from those who do rather than building the cost into the meal pricing.

Paul


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## eddievanbitz (May 1, 2005)

Well from my perspective

I checked with our wardens, and last weekend, middle of February, Cornish Farm Touring Park was full!

Full of happy people, happy with the way the system works.

People can book in by phone, turn up, plug in and start to relax, any time day or night.

A card system is a pain in the butt in the real world, the one that the majority of us live and work.

You arrive after hours! Reception is closed, you have to wait until the office opens in the morning to get any electricity

Hang on let me think about it? 

Nope, can't see any advantage :wink: 

Eddie


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## coppo (May 27, 2009)

eddievanbitz said:


> Well from my perspective
> 
> I checked with our wardens, and last weekend, middle of February, Cornish Farm Touring Park was full!
> 
> ...


Absolute rubbish.

You could still meter it and add the cost of introducing this onto the electric or even campsite fee. I would sooner see the standard site fee go up than see people being wasteful.

Maybe then, in the future there may be an Alan Rogers award for the site using the least electric from their hook up points. 8)

Or you could introduce a limit each day to how much people can use and explain if they exceed this they pay extra or do without, that would get em thinking.

Paul.


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## eddievanbitz (May 1, 2005)

coppo said:


> eddievanbitz said:
> 
> 
> > Well from my perspective
> ...


Absolute fact!

I have used sites, researched sites, spent hundreds of thousands of pounds of my own money building a site which is popular all year round. I would welcome other facts from other campsite owners, until then I take all advice offered as what it is: simply an opinion!

Meters are inconvenient to our guests, and frankly it is commercial suicide to limit power to our guests in a "big Brother" way In the main people go camping to get away from it all, not to be lectured about saving the planet.

Please feel free to go onto sites that meter and monitor everything you do, that is free choice, the same free choice to be sat warm in winter

Eddie


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## ramblingon (Jul 15, 2009)

Eddie no suggestion of limiting power has been made just making those that use/waste it pay for it, as has been said before when they realise what it costs they don't waste it. 

It would be interesting to know the figures of camping ground electricity usage before and after electric hook up was paid for by the individual consumer.


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## Mrplodd (Mar 4, 2008)

I find it very strange that (some) people feel they should have unlimited access to electricity when on site. Do they have "unlimited" i.e. a fixed rate per day, for the stuff at home ?? Of course not, they pay for what they have used, so why should you have such a facility when you are on a campsite ??? Would they leave a patio heater switched on in thier own garden when going out for the day? Dont think so do you??

I used a site just outside Copenhagen a couple of years ago. All of the EHU points were metered (and switched on and off) centrally. Part of your (pre-paid) site fee was to cover electricity consumption, the cost of which was clearly displayed on all the EHU posts.

At the end of your stay IF you wanted you could get a refund on any "leccy money" not used. 

It seemed a pretty sensible system to me with few drawbacks, you have paid "up front" and could get a refund if you had not "used up" all of your pre-payment. If you are planning on leaving at a time the reception is closed then there are two choices. Unplug when you CAN get access to reception OR not bother about getting a refund and just leave!!!

I am in favour of it being metered/restricted etc. That way those who use the least pay the least and do not subsidise the "Sod it, I've paid for electricity so I am going to use as much as I can" brigade.


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## jedi (Nov 22, 2007)

ramblingon said:


> Just a thought wouldn't it be a fairer system if the hook up's were on a pay as you go meter. quote]
> 
> Not had time to read the whole thread but sure pay-as you go is fairer. I have used it many times on German Stellplatze - it makes you think more about usage for one thing ( the green card!). No need to queue at reception if meters are used as in some houses.
> 
> ...


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## jedi (Nov 22, 2007)

Wow!  Just read the rest of this thread. Definitely one campsite I won't be visiting ( if I knew where it was ).


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## eddievanbitz (May 1, 2005)

jedi said:


> Wow!  Just read the rest of this thread. Definitely one campsite I won't be visiting ( if I knew where it was ).


Which one?

By the way we are also forgetting that if the site is 1st class, includes EHU and the charges are very reasonable that this also has to be a factor.

How much do we reduce the pitch for grass cutting? "I had a gravelled hardstanding and didn't use the grass" How much do we reduce the pictch fee for not using the washing up water, How much do we reduce the pitch fee "as we didn't dump"! Overnight security lights? "Don't need 'em didn't go out"! Toilet block? Showers? family room? Water points?

Seriously the list is endless and goes on and on. This is the reason that most sites have a flat fee and your allowed to use all of the sites benefits, what ever time you arrive or wish to depart.

By the way, Jedi, if your comment was aimed at us, we will live 
:lol:

However, you would miss out on an internationally recognised site, ideal for motorhomes that only charges £14 a night and we have a specially green policy in that if you don't want to use too much electricty we don't make you and we ban electric heaters in awnings! :wink:

Eddie


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## Rosbotham (May 4, 2008)

I wouldn't say I'm in _favour _of unmetered. I just believe it's the only realistic option that works in the current regulatory environment.

First thing is campsite owners cannot apply rates which are loaded with an overhead to cover the cost of providing the infrastructure. Therefore I've never wired up a campsite, but allowing for maintenance I'd be reasonably confident that the fixed costs that inherently need to be recovered from the pitch rental would be far higher than some are giving credit for.

It would be useful if those who abuse the situation could be motivated to moderate their use of electricity. However, I've not yet read any idea on this thread that would penalise them without being a pain in the proverbial for me.

On CLs & CSs, I quite often arrive and pitch up when the owner isn't around, so anything that involves picking up some kind of token or card, or taking a meter reading wouldn't work.

On club sites, I can't remember the last time I left at a time when the office was open. Also, if you did the maths on doing a meter reading based on e.g. £10/hr pay for the staff and 5-10 minutes to go to/from pitch to get it, the cost of collection becomes a large proportion of the money collected.

The idea that they should move to a card system and if you leave out of hours, tough either (a) manage without electricity or (b) take a card and forfeit the unused doesn't stack up for me either. For (a), I end up paying for an infrastructure I can't use, for (b) well if I've been charged for N units I will make a point of using them out of sheer bloody mindedness.

The only concrete metric we've got is C&CC, where it's £3.55/night for a club service pitch. That may include hardstanding and EHU, but let's take the worst case and it's EHU only. I'd wager a good 2 quid of that will be for the infrastructure, the remainder usage. If there were meters, you might be able to shave your usage charge down to paying 80-90p per night. Is it _really_ worth the hassle of getting the law changed and causing substantial infrastructure costs for a 80p/night saving?


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## tonyt (May 25, 2005)

I know of at least one CS that uses coin operated meters - seemed to work quite well when I last used it. Although I can't remember how long a pound lasted, I don't recall it being expensive.

What I object to is being asked to pay a pitch fee which includes a hook up charge when I now don't use electricity. But it's simple - I just camp elsewhere!


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## Rosbotham (May 4, 2008)

....and if you pitch where there's no EHU, that's the market operating which is just fine. But just take a look at how full CLs with EHU and hardstanding are, compared to those without. Site owners don't install the EHU for the good of their health.


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## eddievanbitz (May 1, 2005)

tonyt said:


> I know of at least one CS that uses coin operated meters - seemed to work quite well when I last used it. Although I can't remember how long a pound lasted, I don't recall it being expensive


This gives us the problem of security and our guests the problems of ensuring that they have loads of change when they arrive! (before anyone suggests tokens, where does a guest get a token from when the arrive after hours?)



tonyt said:


> What I object to is being asked to pay a pitch fee which includes a hook up charge when I now don't use electricity. But it's simple - I just camp elsewhere!


 :lol:

Absolutely No campsite can be everything to ever person. I don't go to big sites that have Butlins style burger bars and sing along enterainment, suggesting that they change their pricing structure to suit me.

I simply go to sites that offer the facilities (or lack of them) that suits me.

Eddie


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## jedi (Nov 22, 2007)

eddievanbitz said:


> I simply go to sites that offer the facilities (or lack of them) that suits me.
> Eddie


Good point. I do just that when I can, often abroad where they are more likely to allow for the fact that I am a single traveller. I'm sure you run a great site and £14.00 is very reasonable for UK.

Just a thought, though, I've been looking at investing in a solar panel. Quite expensive and would like to be less reliant on EHU.

I dropped out of CC because they gave me no choice. C & CC have non-serviced pitches.

I take some of your points on the problems with meters. In this country they would probably be a target for low-life. Iwould just like to be able to choose whether to have EHU or not.

Jed

PS Am I banned from your site?


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## eddievanbitz (May 1, 2005)

jedi said:


> PS Am I banned from your site?


 :lol: Of course not! Why would you be :wink:


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## teal (Feb 23, 2009)

Some years ago we had a Bessacar 645 which had the Electrolux air conditioning . We arrived at this German campsite in Bavaria and the weather was really hot, so on went the fans and with the cooking /waterheating that evening it was great. When we moved off to pay for the site the receptionist could not believe how much we had used, i did not think it would be on the meter.


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