# Motor Scooter for Firsttimers



## aldershot1 (May 21, 2006)

Hi All,

We are currently considering purchasing a motorised means of transport to take the strain off our 'moving parts'. We have a Autocruise Starfire EL with a 2.2 litre lump and so accept that whatever we choose will need to be pulled along on a trailer.

Our preference would be a motor scooter but we are complete novices, hence our plea for some advice. We would like to hear other views on makes and models etc; 50cc or125cc or higher. Would also like any advice re licensing, taxing, insuring etc.

Thanks in advance

Aldershot1


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## DJP (May 9, 2005)

first the legal side
For Your Guidance ONLY 
I have a full car licence, what can I ride?
If your licence was issued before 1st February 2001, then you can ride a 50cc moped, capable of not more than 30mph. 
Strangely enough, you will not need to display L plates, and you can carry a passenger if the motorcycle has a passenger seat and rear footrests.
If you want to ride a motorcycle of over 50cc, up to 125cc, you must take Compulsory Basic Training (CBT), you must display L plates, 
and you must not carry passengers. The CBT certificate is valid for 2 years.
What if my full car licence was issued after 1st February 2001?
Then you will need to take Compulsory Basic training (CBT).
Once you have completed this course, you will be able to ride a 50cc moped without L plates, until your licence expires at age 70, 
and you will also be able to ride a motorcycle of up to 125cc with L plates (no passengers allowed) for 2 years from the date you completed the CBT course. 
I have a full car licence, do I need to do a theory test and take CBT to get a full motorcycle licence?
Yes. Everyone must take a motorcycle theory test and CBT before they can take the motorcycle practical test. 
The only exception is for someone who has already passed a Motorcycle or Moped test, and wants to upgrade to a higher power machine.
Once you ahve decided which category you fall into, you can decide on the cc of the scooter 50cc, 125cc or greater.
You may find a 50cc is all you can ride on your licence, if that is so you can carry a passenger but will find it rather slooowwww with 2 up and more so if you are of similar proportions to a rugby player!
Insurance will probably cost you around £70 to £80 a year with tax at £15 IIRC 
Have you considered a scooter rack on the towbar? Depending on your vehicle weights etc?
As far as makes go, Peugeot, Piaggio seem to be popular with lots of Chinese imports now becoming available at very good prices. Just check before buying an import from China, parts/servicing availablility, if you can get insurance and at a reasonable price. Has it been type appreoved.


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## vicdicdoc (May 14, 2005)

I bought a Honda C90 [off ebay] Its 3 speed and cruses at around 35 / 40mph . . less when its 2 up, I'm guessing that a 125cc would have more oomph, on advice I stayed away from the Chinese motorbikes coming into the country


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## DABurleigh (May 9, 2005)

Much depends on how you intend using it, and, unfortunately, how much you both weigh! If one of you, let alone both, is heavy, I'd avoid 50cc if you are to ride two-up. The minimum I'd consider is 125cc, but many do cope adequately two-up, certainly for pottering into town, with 50cc.

You don't say what price you are aiming at nor whether new. I must confess I'm a Vespa fan:
http://www.uk.vespa.com/en_UK/home.aspx
But also consider Honda offerings such as:
> Innova <
> SH125i <
If you keep the weight down you may be able to sling it on the back of your next van.

Insurance. I'm with Bennetts and recommend them:
http://www.bennetts.co.uk
As a guide a brand new Vespa 250cc fully comp European wide cover cost me under £100. (Just got back from an hour's ride on it 'cos it was a nice day!)
If you only want to insure part-year, try:
http://www.ebikeinsurance.co.uk

Dave


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## aldershot1 (May 21, 2006)

Thanks everyone for your advice it gives me a lot to think about

Aldershot1

:? :?


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## 88870 (May 10, 2005)

Currently have a Yamaha Teo 125 (swapped it for our mondeo) and it cruises around 50-60mph two up. Can't compare it to anything else as it is the only one we have every owned!

Also have a Kawasaki ZX636 though .. that goes about 160 (although never been there) :lol: 

The scooter is great for work, costs me about £8 a month in petrol, £99 a year in insurance and if I remember rightly is extremely cheap in tax (can't remember what though - £60 a year?)


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## jack01 (Jan 24, 2008)

we had a 50cc TGB which was ok but with limited umph, so at 63 years of age I decided to sit my test,
we now have a Honda SH125 I and it's fantastic. For info it weighs 120Kgs and costs £15 per year to tax it.


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## worzel (Apr 12, 2007)

I have had three scooters, but the best bike is a Honda cg125.
Its light around 115kg and I have a bike rack in Aliminun.
takes two up at speeds around 60mph.

Mike.


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## elbino (May 9, 2005)

We have a Keeway Partner 110cc. Cruises about 40mph with 2 up, not twist n go but pre-select clutchless and seldom needs filling up. Weighs 96Kg and fits in the garage of our Autotrail Cheyenne 696g very nicely.
Bought new from a family run business in felixstowe -Alford Bros-last year for £800 and very pleased with it


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## pneumatician (May 1, 2005)

*Scooters*

We have had I chinese Jincheng for two years now. Copy of a Honda Cub but 110cc. Runs well no problems so far all I have done is change the oil and adjust Chain and Tyre Pressures.
It Goes inside the boot of our Van. Cruises at about 45 two up.
Main advantage was it was very cheap £600 new from our local Honda Dealer who I have dealt with for years. If it packs up Honda main spares fit and if its written off its no great loss. As ridden by Prince Phillip aparently. Not that I would use that as a particular reccomendation.

Steve


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## kijana (May 1, 2005)

Hi Steve

What model is yours? And what weight?

I'm interested in getting a little bike. I know people say the new breed of Chinese imports are dodgy, but am interested to hear of others' experience. They seem to do a good range of small, lightweight bikes.


TIA

Bruce


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## fatbast (Dec 5, 2007)

i've got a yamaha mate small wheel and a suzuki choi nori (it's tiny). ideal for the garage along with the ktm 300exc enduro bike!...pics:


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## 102731 (Jan 30, 2007)

There is, obviously, a number of things to consider:
1 Weight- That's yours, not the 'bike! - The havier the load the more power needed. However I have seen pictures from Asia of a Honda C90 carrying the pilot and two pig carcasses! In Asia they're regularly used for family transport, Mum, Dad and a couple of kids.
2 Road condition - Whilst a scooter may seem attractive, especially those with loads of storage capacity, the extreme number of pot holes on "B" roads in the UK, and the dubious quality of back roads in Europe mean that the small wheels of a scooter will drop down one resulting in you and passenger emulating circus acrobats!
3 Chinese imports - Very attractive price wise, and at least one of the bigger manufacturers makes for Piaggio, But consider spares and repairs and dealer availability when you're in the back of beyond and break down.

My choice would be the Honda Innova, the successor to the long running Cub family. Good load carrying capacity,large diameter wheels, excellent dealer coverage all over the World, good resale prices, longevity
In this case definitely use your head, whatever you choose.


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## pneumatician (May 1, 2005)

Bruce,

Our bike is a Jincheng Ranger but I believe it could have this name 
specifically for Chell Motorcycles of Stafford he imports them direct. It 
is basically a tarted up Honda Cub with the bore increased from 90cc to 
108cc. The reason we got ours for £600 was because I have had other bikes from Cyril and it was a pre-registered still in the crate. I believe the correct list is about £900. Weight is about 105lbs. It poodles along at about 45 two up and we are no light weights 25 st total.
If you have a garage I may be able to give you some tips on how I fit mine in. 
If you are putting one on the back be very carefull with your weight 
calculations and weights quoted for racks. With our last van they quoted 50lb @ £850 for the rack and I managed to make one that came out at 27lb @ £160 by combining Al and steel with dozens of lightening holes. After all this I still cocked up the calcs and overloaded the rear axle by 110Kg. Did 4000 miles over the Alps without noticing tho!
You need to be wary about some sellers as they leave it to you to get it 
registered which can be painfull lengthy and costly and a self assembly job. Having ridden motorbikes since I was 16 upto 1200cc we find this a fun alternative transport when in sunnier climes. Cannot bring ourselves to ride in shorts and sandals tho!!
The Innova is much better but three times the price I paid and if you dont like it your losses will be so much greater. 

My real delight would be as seen in France last year a Motorhome towing a Microlight and Transalp. Lucky beggar. ( but he had devilish on site parking problems)

Steve


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## wobby (May 1, 2005)

We have a Yamaha 100 cc 2 stroke scooter goes OK but hate the noise it makes. I read a very good article I think in the MMM that highly recommended
the Honda 125 4 stroke water cooled scooter (you may remember the police noddy bikes? No.) I am rather inclined to change mine as I always feel bad about disturbing people on site with my current bike. 

Wobby


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## claypigeon (May 9, 2005)

Hi i'm afraid with a joint total weight of 33 stone i have had to go for a Honda Deauville 650 plus trailer and tow bar over 4 grand (i should have stuck with pedal cycles) but the Honda is great fun.

Dave

Ps i forgot to mention 2 helmets 2 waterproof coats, trousers, gloves another £800


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## kijana (May 1, 2005)

Hi Steve

Thanks for that info. 

My head is still telling me that the Innova-type bike is what I should go for, but my heart says get an XL125 baby crosser for fun in the sun!

I was interested to see you haven't had any real problems with the bike. I would only expect to do a tiny mileage annually, so would hope that the cheapo Chinese imported bikes would perform ok for this modest requirement. And as you say, they are much cheaper than the originals. . .

I note your comments on weight. I am considering making a mounting which would permit an 'elevated tow'. The front wheel locates in a shoe mounted on the back of the van, so just the back wheel of the bike runs on the road. This should add negligable weight to the van back axle, though doubtless opens up a whole new can of worms of the 'A-frames are illegal, no they're not' type discussion!

As ever, some slight inconvenience with this system when manoevring, but would allow most of the m/h payload to be used for useful things like Rioja, books, and the LaFumas. . .

As to the airbourne entertainment, I've seen a few guys out here in Spain who fly powered paragliders. These have the advantage of being very light, and packing up to a rucksack size, plus small powerpack.

Now, where did I put my group D licence? I know I had one back in the 80's. . .

Cheers

Bruce


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## 111398 (Apr 16, 2008)

fatbast said:


> i've got a suzuki choi nori (it's tiny). ideal for the garage along with the ktm 300exc enduro bike!...pics:


Where did you buy your Choi Nori? In Ireland? The UK? Elsewhere?

Please let me know as I am interested in getting one.

Thanks!
matt


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## teemyob (Nov 22, 2005)

*INfo*



DJP said:


> first the legal side
> For Your Guidance ONLY
> I have a full car licence, what can I ride?
> If your licence was issued before 1st February 2001, then you can ride a 50cc moped, capable of not more than 30mph.
> ...


Hello DJP,

How are things?

Very informative reply, do you or does anyone know how the law stands in France?.

Trev.


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## pelicanpete (Apr 28, 2007)

I concur with the posters who recommend the Honda Innova 125. I carry a late 2007 one in my garage and have been very happy with it.

It's certainly powerful enough to carry me (14+st) and my wife who is average weight (won't - daren't! - say more than that  ) at speeds of up to 55 mph or me, alone, at an indicated 60 mph.

Equipped with the top-box and a couple of rucksacks, you can tote quite a lot of food from the super-mercado shopping trip.

It's fairly lightweight - the brochure says 99 kgs - but add fuel, oil, topbox, etc it's nearer 110 kgs. I like the electric start and kick-start as a back up.

The clutchless gear change is a bit quirky but you get use to that. Would prefer a twist-and-go but it's not an option on the Innova.

They're made in Thailand where they are ubiquitous transport for the masses. Surprisingly, they are not well known on the continent which rather surprised me. Wherever I parked it on my recent trip through Fr. Sp and Port., it created a great deal of interest!!


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## 111398 (Apr 16, 2008)

The Innova are popular in London as replacements to the Honda Cub for pizza delivery.


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## fatbast (Dec 5, 2007)

msephton said:


> fatbast said:
> 
> 
> > i've got a suzuki choi nori (it's tiny). ideal for the garage along with the ktm 300exc enduro bike!...pics:
> ...


got it in ireland, from a dealer who imports jap bikes direct. he only brought one in as a curiousity though! i think you can buy a korean version in the uk now, as i saw one tested in mcn last year...very slow but ideal for a m/h on site: quiet/tiny/ 4 stroke engine.,


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## bobandjane (Dec 29, 2007)

Hi Aldershot1 . I see your post came up again!


If you are still thinking about it. As you said Trailer how about a QUAD you can ride them on a car licence. Something else to think about! 

Good Luck. Bob.


:blob: :blob:


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## 107558 (Oct 10, 2007)

Chinese bikes are designed to do what the Japanese bikes did in the 60/70s, namely built to a price and get market share. I have one - a Dayang DY200

The build quality is at best OK but I would recommend that you go over the whole machine:
1). Check the tightness all non engine nuts and bolts.
2). Any ordinary nuts (not the locking variety) may benefit from a locking washer or locking nut.
3). Oil all the cables
4). Keep it clean as it will rust
5). Use mineral oil not synthetic as the engines require mineral oil.
6). The first service should be done at about 150 followed by one at 500 and another at 1000 (miles/kilometres) as the amount of swarfe created is worrying.

Parts are now quite easy to get hold of more info on the Chinese bike forum.


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## pneumatician (May 1, 2005)

*Chinese Bikes*

We have had a Jincheng for a couple of years now. So far it has performed well. Nothing has broken, gone rusty or had to be replaced.
I agree with the previous mail regarding fasteners and lubrication. Ours is a Honda Cub replica so spares are no problem. Treat it as you would a Road Rocket, Norton Commando or Velocette and it will give reasonable service.

Steve


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## pneumatician (May 1, 2005)

*Scooters*

Followed your lead JQ.

Interesting that Peugeot Scooters will be made in China.
My last Suzuki was made in Mexico quality was certainly no better than my Chinese bike, the speedo lasted one week in fact worse.

Steve


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## bobandjane (Dec 29, 2007)

Re pneumatician 

Treat it as you would a Road Rocket, Norton Commando or Velocette and it will give reasonable service. 
Nice one Steve.
That brings back old memories carry loads of tools and a drip tray! 
And dont thrash it.
Happy Days. Bob.


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## suffolkian (Jul 25, 2007)

Hi. We took the considerable risk and bought a brand new chinese Sukida 125 off a dealer on ebay, as we knew it would only be doing a relatively small mileage. We checked and studied his feedback before taking the plunge.

The end result is that by playing the ebay game, we secured the bike for £215.00, plus £100 delivery including topbox! so for that amount we were prepared to take the risk. As described the bike arrived still in its crate and needed completing, i.e. front wheel, handlebars etc. We did not feel competent enough to do this work as it involved huge safety aspects such as brakes and electrics, so we got in contact with our local bike mechanics attached to the local cbt training centre. They were brilliant and completed the build together with PDI'ing the bike with a full road test for £185.00. In turn they said they were sceptical about chinese bikes but were surprised at the overall quality of this new bike. It has electric remote start, immobiliser, topbox etc and runs extremely well with two of the larger figure on board (Actually we look like the teletubbies on tour!! :roll: but with matching 'go faster stripe' jackets and helmets) Another reason for buying this bike is the overall weight prior to oils, fuel etc. is a mere 102kg making it ideal for the back of our m/h. The scooter arrived with all the paperwork needed to simply take it to the DVLA office with our insurance to register it on an 08 plate.

With regards to the extra's. Again why pay a fortune. We bought BSA recommended helmets x 2, padded safety bike jackets x 2, scooter cover, plus a brake disc lock for around £300.

Therefore in short, for a total of £800 - we have everything we need fully kitted out with a brand new bike. We have tried the bike several times now and are extremely pleased with our purchase. It runs extremely well cruising around 50 on the level even with us teletubbies on board  and spares should they be needed are now readily available.

Hope this helps.

Ian & Steve


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## chrisgreen (Jan 13, 2008)

scooter,s a topic i know lot and lot's about.

i own and tune scooter's.
the best value on the market ot the moment is the Chinese ones. 90%of them use the same engine 139qmb 50 cc ,ride on a car license no L plates,cheap 120mpg.
but and there is always a but they are slow out of the box,need a few pound's spent on them to get them to go a bit better,most come with a 76# main jet this needs replacing for a 85# main jet gives you a little more power,a freeflow air filter also helps but not realy worth the money for the power gain.
variator clutch rollers x6 a pound each, need changing standard out the box are about 9 grams change them for 5.6 grams this help's the scooter to accelerate faster,needed when you are in traffic.
part are easy to get hold of,and cheap.

my new scooter will do about 50 mph(checked on tomtom) all day with me on it 17 stone. elephant rideing a mouse my wife calles it
do not believe the speedo as they can say you are going 15/20 mph more than you realy are? i buy new and tune, then sell after a year to the kids at no loss as they climb over each other to buy my scooters,fast see.
there is a few other thing's i can do to them but thats my secret.
i also own and ride kawasaki zz1100 top speed 190 tuned.
2 italjet scooters a 50cc lc and a 125 lc which i will never sell-- both fast.
and im 50 years old,just sort of a hobby for me.
i just like getting the best out of scooters???


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## pneumatician (May 1, 2005)

*Scooters & Bikes*

Ah! the nostalgia of my old (new at the time) bikes ! When you left home for a long trip ( 100m plus) with pockets full of spark plugs, toolbox containing split link, link and a half and half a link plus link extractor just in case the chain breaks. Spare cables pre-routed to all controls. Real adventures.
I have had Velo primary chains break ! Rocket rear chains used to part frequently! BSA Main bearing Failure, Velo valve stem snapped, Throttle cables always fray and and break usually when accelerating out of islands. 
Then came the Japanese no fun at all just carry enough money for fuel and coffee. Most of my modern bikes have been BMW's. The only new bike to break in recent years was a Hinckley Triumph (twice) swapped it for another BMW.
Appologies for rambling on , nothing about scooters.

Steve

Steve


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