# Gas attacks - again!



## javea

Even the Costa Blanca News are at it now, article in this week's edition:-

"People staying at the Villa Sol campsite in Benidorm have reported a wave of robberies from caravans over the past week.

The latest incident was on Tuesday night when at least six caravans were targeted.

Although unconfirmed,it is believed the thieves have used gas to knockout occupants before committing the robberies."

Perhaps more likely that the occupants had enjoyed a little vino?

Mike


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## averhamdave

However they managed it, it is a worry for those of us heading that way soon.

I've been thinking that the desperate unemployment situation coupled with poor social support the unemployed receive will be leading to a steep rise in crime this winter.

We are off to Camping La Torretta again after Christmas for a long stay but we are a 3 vehicle convoy and I do think La Torretta is slightly less exposed than Villa Sol. Oh well


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## rosalan

Anyone who doubts the efficacy of a gas attack, has not slept with my brother-in-law!


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## rayrecrok

Hi.

Gas attack a load of loblox.. But!.

What about touring the countries that are having difficulties how safe are we from the populous who are really down on their uppers, and is the likelihood of being turned over greater especially if wild camping..

I will be going on a year long jaunt come next August which will be taking in most of the iffy countries and I am sure they will be deeper in recession by then, and the one that worries me most is we plan to overwinter in Greece, a mixture of wild camping and sites, then ferry to Italy.. All of these countries I have never been to in any shape or form.

We will finish in Spain, Portugal and France then home to the UK in July 2014 these last countries I am reasonably happy with as I have been on numerous occasions and do know safe places to stay, it's the rest that is the unknown quantity.. Hmm.

ray.


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## rayrecrok

rosalan said:


> Anyone who doubts the efficacy of a gas attack, has not slept with my brother-in-law!


You sleep with your brother in law 8O 8O 8O ..

ray.


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## patzx12

What about gas detectors are they any good?


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## rayrecrok

patzx12 said:


> What about gas detectors are they any good?


Hi.

Smoke and carbon monoxide alarms absolutely.. As a warning for gas attack, you do know it's not real don't you, done to death just like A Frames..

You have more chance of a mars space ship coming down and abducting you, experimenting on you and planting a minute bug in your brain to help you conquer the world..

There will be some one on here that's been abducted just watch :lol: :lol: :lol:

ray.


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## aikidomo

patzx12 said:


> What about gas detectors are they any good?


Please dont go there..................... gas detectors I mean


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## aikidomo

rayrecrok said:


> patzx12 said:
> 
> 
> 
> What about gas detectors are they any good?
> 
> 
> 
> Hi.
> 
> Smoke and carbon monoxide alarms absolutely.. As a warning for gas attack, you do know it's not real don't you, done to death just like A Frames..
> 
> You have more chance of a mars space ship coming down and abducting you, experimenting on you and planting a minute bug in your brain to help you conquer the world..
> 
> There will be some one on here that's been abducted just watch :lol: :lol: :lol:
> 
> ray.
Click to expand...

Excuse me Ray but.............................look here






And not one mention of a gas attack :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## KeithChesterfield

Spain seems plagued by gas attacks - even on the Football pitch -----


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## AndrewandShirley

Here at Villasol atm and it was both caravans and m/hs that were targeted. 

How they managed to get in and rob the people whilst they were asleep, still remains an unsolved question. 

Stole mainly small items like jewellery and money it appears.


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## BrianJP

Here we go again its a shame the moderators dont remove spurious threads like these.
There are numerous claims elsewhere on here from persons who say they were robbed during the night and slept through the event.
There is no mention of being gassed though so maybe they just slept heavily,had to much to drink , did'nt have dogs or were deaf.
It really is a load of rubbish when you study how gassing would have to be achieved.
Just take sensible precautions (many people dont bother with anything to do with security) and you will be ok.
To give the impression that it is usual for gangs to be roaming about in some countries looking for motorhomes , caravans and other travellers to rob is wrong and unfair on majority of law abiding persons in those countries.
Truth is you stand just as much chance of being robbed here in the UK !


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## loddy

You people need to get out into the real world and start taking it seriously, it's all very well blaming it on ass gas, vino and deafness but I have in my extensive travels met 2 couples and a truck driver who have been robbed and are unable to explain their slight hangovers , 1 had a feisty dog and that slept well. My brother had his side window removed from a RV in Spain and never heard a thing and he don't drink or fart.
So wake up , I have never reported any of these on this forum in fear of the urine taking police.
I believe they use CTC

Loddy


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## moblee

I'm giving up Motorhoming it's Too Dangerous :!: :twisted:


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## Kev1

Ray I wasn't abducted.!!!!!!

However my wife is a totally different thing.
I think she went off to Venus

and here on Mars
she is seen as an outsider.

Help please


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## barryd

BrianJP said:


> Here we go again its a shame the moderators dont remove spurious threads like these.
> There are numerous claims elsewhere on here from persons who say they were robbed during the night and slept through the event.
> There is no mention of being gassed though so maybe they just slept heavily,had to much to drink , did'nt have dogs or were deaf.
> It really is a load of rubbish when you study how gassing would have to be achieved.
> Just take sensible precautions (many people dont bother with anything to do with security) and you will be ok.
> To give the impression that it is usual for gangs to be roaming about in some countries looking for motorhomes , caravans and other travellers to rob is wrong and unfair on majority of law abiding persons in those countries.
> Truth is you stand just as much chance of being robbed here in the UK !


Actually statistically you DO stand more chance of being robbed, broke into or suffering a violent attack in the UK than all of the countries mentioned in this thread. I cant remember where I read that recently but the UK is way up there now as a dodgy place to be!

I think the OP was simply make us aware of a spate of robberies in a place some of us may be heading. I don't think he for a minute believed the gas thing and anyway its always good that these threads do appear as it has hopefully informed and assured at least one new member that it is indeed as Ray so nicely put it. Bollox!

Ray. Don Madge did a thread on here recently about Greece. I think there was an increase in petty crime but I certainly wouldn't worry. Ive travelled all over Greece (not in the motorhome) and I would rank it as one of the friendliest safest countries Ive been to.

There is always the chance you will be broken into anywhere. I do believe however that this is a slim chance. I believe even more that the actual chances of being broken into while in the van are even slimmer. Anywhere.


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## peribro

BrianJP said:


> Here we go again its a shame the moderators dont remove spurious threads like these.


"spu·ri·ous/ËˆspyoÍ�orÄ"É™s/Adjective:	Not being what it purports to be; false or fake: "spurious claims"."

Just because you don't like what you hear doesn't make it false or fake. A bit like the BBC bosses and others who decided that young girls were making spurious claims about various Top of the Pops DJ's.


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## jedi

Motorhome Gas Attacks - A Professional Opinion. Statement by the The Royal College of Anaesthetists is shown below. Have a read and judge for yourself.

A statement from The Royal College of Anaesthetists about Motorhome owners being gassed then robbed.* 

Despite the increasing numbers of reports of people being gassed in motor-homes or commercial trucks in France, and the warning put out by the Foreign Office for travellers to be aware of this danger, this College remains of the view that this is a myth. It is the view of the College that it would not be possible to render someone unconscious by blowing ether, chloroform or any of the currently used volatile anaesthetic agents, through the window of a motor-home without their knowledge, even if they were sleeping at the time. Ether is an extremely pungent agent and a relatively weak anaesthetic by modern standards and has a very irritant affect on the air passages, causing coughing and sometimes vomiting. It takes some time to reach unconsciousness, even if given by direct application to the face on a cloth, and the concentration needed by some sort of spray administered directly into a room would be enormous. The smell hangs around for days and would be obvious to anyone the next day. Even the more powerful modern volatile agents would need to be delivered in tankerloads of carrier gas or by a large compressor. Potential agents, such as the one used by the Russians in the Moscow siege are few in number and difficult to obtain. Moreover, these drugs would be too expensive for the average thief to use. The other important point to remember is that general anaesthetics are potentially very dangerous, which is why they are only administered in the UK by doctors who have undergone many years of postgraduate training in the subject and who remain with the unconscious patient throughout the anaesthetic. Unsupervised patients are likely to die from obstruction of the airway by their tongues falling back. In the Moscow seige approximately 20% of the people died, many probably from airway obstruction directly related to the agent used. If there was a totally safe, odourless, potent, cheap anaesthetic agent available to thieves for this purpose it is likely the medical profession would know about it and be investigating its use in anaesthetic practice.

Decide for youself.

Jed*


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## pippin

If it happens in Spain it is a GAZ attack, not gas!


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## tonyt

barryd said:


> .............................................. I believe even more that the actual chances of being broken into while in the van are even slimmer. Anywhere.


What's always puzzled me is that all these reported attacks only seem to be made on vehicles that are not alarmed - how do the robbers know which are alarmed and which are not.

And - do people really sleep in caravans and motorhomes without alarms (unless they have a dog)?


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## loddy

Oil on troubled water Barry
Why don't people just acknowledge it happens and stop making light of it.

More chance of getting to Mars I know but it does happen. just stay safe and in numbers with plenty of outside light

Loddy


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## bognormike

well, here we go again! No doubt people have been robbed, but using narcotic gas? where's the evidence?


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## teensvan

Hi.

We are on another large site in Benidorm and did hear of this attack.

Most of our friends do not belive this could be gassing.

In 7 years of fulltiming and using 100s of aires over 80 stellplatz and dozens we have never met anyone who has been gassed.

The only place we have had anything stolen from the outside of the van has been the *UK* and the only place the van did get broken into was the *UK*

Need I say more.

steve & ann. ----------- teensvan


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## BrianJP

jedi said:


> Motorhome Gas Attacks - A Professional Opinion. Statement by the The Royal College of Anaesthetists is shown below. Have a read and judge for yourself.
> 
> A statement from The Royal College of Anaesthetists about Motorhome owners being gassed then robbed.*
> 
> Despite the increasing numbers of reports of people being gassed in motor-homes or commercial trucks in France, and the warning put out by the Foreign Office for travellers to be aware of this danger, this College remains of the view that this is a myth. It is the view of the College that it would not be possible to render someone unconscious by blowing ether, chloroform or any of the currently used volatile anaesthetic agents, through the window of a motor-home without their knowledge, even if they were sleeping at the time. Ether is an extremely pungent agent and a relatively weak anaesthetic by modern standards and has a very irritant affect on the air passages, causing coughing and sometimes vomiting. It takes some time to reach unconsciousness, even if given by direct application to the face on a cloth, and the concentration needed by some sort of spray administered directly into a room would be enormous. The smell hangs around for days and would be obvious to anyone the next day. Even the more powerful modern volatile agents would need to be delivered in tankerloads of carrier gas or by a large compressor. Potential agents, such as the one used by the Russians in the Moscow siege are few in number and difficult to obtain. Moreover, these drugs would be too expensive for the average thief to use. The other important point to remember is that general anaesthetics are potentially very dangerous, which is why they are only administered in the UK by doctors who have undergone many years of postgraduate training in the subject and who remain with the unconscious patient throughout the anaesthetic. Unsupervised patients are likely to die from obstruction of the airway by their tongues falling back. In the Moscow seige approximately 20% of the people died, many probably from airway obstruction directly related to the agent used. If there was a totally safe, odourless, potent, cheap anaesthetic agent available to thieves for this purpose it is likely the medical profession would know about it and be investigating its use in anaesthetic practice.
> 
> Decide for youself.
> 
> Jed*


*

Thankyou for this I knew I had seen this before.
The point here is Loddy we are in the real world not a James Bond Fantasy one.I also travel extensively across Europe .
The low life chancers who would try to break into Motorhomes/caravans do not have access to sophisticated anaesthetics and are not foreign government agents with undetectable cutting edge gasses to inflict upon innocent tourists to steal their few valuables.
That is why gassing is unbelievable.
As someone once requested on a previous thread here on this subject. Lets hearf from someone firsthand who has been gassed and has proof of this. I await with bated breath.*


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## javea

barryd said:


> BrianJP said:
> 
> 
> 
> I think the OP was simply make us aware of a spate of robberies in a place some of us may be heading. I don't think he for a minute believed the gas thing and anyway its always good that these threads do appear as it has hopefully informed and assured at least one new member that it is indeed as Ray so nicely put it. Bollox!
> 
> .
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks Barry exactly right, although I must admit I was amused to see 'gas attacks' mentioned in an English language paper in Spain and I posted it more in jocqular mode.
> 
> I have done two return trips a year to Spain for many years now, I wild camp and have never had cause for concern, and will continue to do so, returning in a few days, without any qualms.
> 
> Have had a house here since 1986 and I don't really see any difference in crimes committed by the Spanish in current times. Admittedly the influx of Rumanians has affected the overall crime figures but I understand that their presence is dwindling now the Spanish economy is in, as they say here , 'le crisis'. I still feel safer here than in the UK.
> 
> Advice set out previously in this thread is sensible: flashing alarm led's, fit Milenco window alarms which will wake you from a deep sleep, and shock the thief, if the window is forced, and if you don't feel comfortable, move on.
> 
> Mike
Click to expand...


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## aldra

Since he had most of his bowel removed--the dog

I am getting close to it :lol: :lol: :lol:

Algra


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## KeithChesterfield

We had a Gas attack in our Motorhome while in France recently.

I blamed it on the baked beans, two cans of Lager and a bottle of cheap plonk that I'd comsumed earlier.

Despite the drizzle we sat outside until the gas cleared - she wasn't happy!

In the words of Jim Royle "Gas attacks? - My *rse!"

:wav: :wav: :wav:


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## pippin

BrianJP - probably not the best way to anticipate a gas attack -

*"with bated breath."*


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## aultymer

Loddy can you expand on your knowledge of CTC? 
What is it, how does it work, what dilution is needed to render everyone unconscious without killing some? 
Is it heavier or lighter than air. Is it flammable? 
Where can you buy it? 

I live in the real world, socialise with doctors among others, have traveled in Europe, India and Australia (but have more sense than go back to Spain) and have not met anyone who believed gassing is possible.


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## ThursdaysChild

Just you wait till it happens to an anaesthetist .


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## barryd

There are no alarms on our van, window locks, flashing lights or any real security. We frequently seek out places on our own and right now in Normandy we seem to have very little choice as everyone has buggered off.

The only thing of value in here is this laptop which is probably worth £100 on the black market as a nock off. Cant see why they would bother and there is no way anyone is getting in this van with us in it without us knowing. 

Maybe one day in some supermarket car park or while the vans left alone we may get unlucky but I don't think about it. When its hot we sleep with the windows open, bikes unlocked and stuff outside the van although Im a bit more security conscious in the UK. 

Its not worth worrying about if you ask me.


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## loddy

aultymer said:


> Loddy can you expand on your knowledge of CTC?
> What is it, how does it work, what dilution is needed to render everyone unconscious without killing some?
> Is it heavier or lighter than air. Is it flammable?
> Where can you buy it?
> 
> I live in the real world, socialise with doctors among others, have traveled in Europe, India and Australia (but have more sense than go back to Spain) and have not met anyone who believed gassing is possible.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_tetrachloride

a friend of mine was indirectly killed by the stuff, his fire extinguisher was leaking and he fell asleep at the wheel which caused a fatal accident


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## sheringham

CTC = Carbontetrachloride 

Not sure if it is still available.
In the 60s ,volatile liquid, was used as a fire extinguishant and usually found in commercial motors and coaches. Contained in a brass 2 pint cylinder with integral pump. 
Also used in the dry cleaning industry.
Quite distinctive smell that lingers even in well ventilated spaces.
Poisonous.


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## pippin

Bloody marvellous as a stain remover from our uniforms in the Merchant Navy.

I doubt a single carbon tet fire extinguisher was "virgin".

Smelt to high heaven.


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## aultymer

Have used carbon tet as a machine cleaner before it was banned. 
Don't know how anyone could fall asleep with it!! Strong smell, irritant and would make you cough or vomit long before you fell asleep!! 
You have met a lot of unlucky people Loddy.


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## pippin

I have one of those brass carbon tet fire extinguishers (sadly empty).

Polished up it will look a treat - might put it on Ebay!


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## barryd

I know some criminals are a bit dim but lets pretend to be one for a minute.

Do I go out in the small hours and rob an empty house or even a big one with people in it but all upstairs asleep, steal a car with nobody in it in a quiet place or knock off a shop full of stock. Err. No. Thats far too easy. Ill go out in me van which is full of massive gas cylinders, somehow quietly drive onto a a campsite or Aire where there are motorhomes, caravans and people all over the place, somehow fill some poor souls van with gas, still have to break in without disturbing the occupants just inches away from where I am breaking in and the other campers and maybe get away with a few euros, a crap laptop and old nokia brick phone and some cheap Spanish plonk.

Doesn't make much sense to me but then Im not a burgelar!  

They say crims take the easiest option. The only easy option would be a van parked on its own and empty, otherwise they wouldn't bother.


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## loddy

aultymer said:


> Have used carbon tet as a machine cleaner before it was banned.
> Don't know how anyone could fall asleep with it!! Strong smell, irritant and would make you cough or vomit long before you fell asleep!!
> You have met a lot of unlucky people Loddy.


Yes I have !!!!! It was the anniversary of my third wife's death yesterday and in May it will the anniversary of my 2nd wife's death, I lost a lot of my friends due to accidents or cancer, so yes lots in the real world

Loddy


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## apxc15

The Army started putting a red dye in CTC extinguishers to stop us nicking em to use as a cleaner.

Still used 'em to get the oil out of brake shoes and even clutch plates.


Pete 8)


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## grizzlyj

snipped


barryd said:


> The only easy option would be a van parked on its own and empty, otherwise they wouldn't bother.


Unless the crims are the people still in the van, ie claiming on the insurance?

The only reports that I've read of supposed gas attacks have actually stated no smell, so perhaps that was to state it wasn't something like that mentioned above? And its always a large chunk of cash thats gone missing, so they have the receipt from getting the cash out which weirdly is no longer there. How long would it take for a crim to find the stash? Would it really be left somewhere immediately accessible?

So they need to anesthetize better than the Royal College and locate cash better than a sniffer dog!? 8O :lol:


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## Scattycat

Let's not get too complacent regarding basic security though. 

There have been anumber of reports on the box and in the papers recently of older folk being robbed and beaten up for a few lowsy quid. So it's commonsense to make sure you don't put yourselves at risk and take basic precautions

But gas attacks in M/H's? you're more likely to be abducted by little green men in spacesuits.


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## apxc15

grizzlyj said:


> snipped
> 
> 
> barryd said:
> 
> 
> 
> The only easy option would be a van parked on its own and empty, otherwise they wouldn't bother.
> 
> 
> 
> Unless the crims are the people still in the van, ie claiming on the insurance?
> 
> The only reports that I've read of supposed gas attacks have actually stated no smell, so perhaps that was to state it wasn't something like that mentioned above? And its always a large chunk of cash thats gone missing, so they have the receipt from getting the cash out which weirdly is no longer there. How long would it take for a crim to find the stash? Would it really be left somewhere immediately accessible?
> 
> So they need to anesthetize better than the Royal College and locate cash better than a sniffer dog!? 8O :lol:
Click to expand...

Yes I got robbed whilst asleep in my van and yes they got loads of cash and credit/debit cards with my wallet.
No I wasn't gassed and yes these people know their way around a motor home and how to easy it is, get into them.
I had a pre 2006 fiat then and to be honest you could open the cab door locks with a lolly stick.

That was in France by the way, and no I didn't claim on my insurance.

Pete 8)


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## rosalan

This thread starts out trying to voice a serious crime and perhaps we should take the complainant more seriously, not that I believe the 'gas' syndrome. So what other possibilities are there?
1) What about a 'Date rape' drug? That would have to include everyone including the pets. However in India, such things as (don't laugh) "The Biscuit Gangs" roam the railways. They offer drugged biscuits and then steal peoples property... possible but unlikely here.
2) They left the van unlocked and had not noticed the theft earlier. Possible
3) The 'Victims' were into an insurance scam... possible.
4) They had a very good time in a pub and were followed. Sleeping very deeply they noticed nothing... Possible

If so many people (always second hand information here) have suffered 'Gas' attacks, perhaps.... just perhaps there is an element of truth in the outcome. However there may be some alternative answer to explain their violation and theft that did not disturb them. I also note that usually only small items were taken. Oh well! I like a good detective novel.
Alan


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## 113016

Scattycat said:


> Let's not get too complacent regarding basic security though.
> 
> There have been anumber of reports on the box and in the papers recently of older folk being robbed and beaten up for a few lowsy quid. So it's commonsense to make sure you don't put yourselves at risk and take basic precautions
> 
> But gas attacks in M/H's? you're more likely to be abducted by little green men in spacesuits.


Reports I am receiving from truckers is that the new breed of robbers from eastern countries are a nasty lot and think nothing of physical harm  
Regarding the second paragraph, the earth was once presumed flat :?


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## goldi

Morning all, 

I do,nt think that we appreciate the skill and lifelong training that these people have, I could understand easily how the depth of sleep after a drop too much booze and possibly esystart which is ether squited through the door seals to help an even deeper sleep.I have met a man who was burgled while he slept in his caravan not so far from Barcelona and he knew nothing about it the morning. The image of spain is that it is crime ridden place but I have read recently that the stats do not back this up.
I do however think that UK has more of a crime problem.

norm


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## tonyt

Grath said:


> ...........................Regarding the second paragraph, the earth was once presumed flat :?


Now I must pick you up on that! You use the word "was" as if it's no longer considered a possibility.

I've researched this subject thoroughly and can tell you that the earth is flat but has no edges as was once believed - it has a central "drain" off the coast of Bermuda. Down this drain goes ships, planes, pensions, taxes, charity donations, common sense, gas attackers, motorhomers heeding their sat navs, morals, sense of duty, honour, pride, parental responsibility and lots more. Unfortunately, those things and people who ought to go down the drain seem slither away.

Well, it is the weekend and time to ramble.


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## rayrecrok

tonyt said:


> Grath said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...........................Regarding the second paragraph, the earth was once presumed flat :?
> 
> 
> 
> Now I must pick you up on that! You use the word "was" as if it's no longer considered a possibility.
> 
> I've researched this subject thoroughly and can tell you that the earth is flat but has no edges as was once believed - it has a central "drain" off the coast of Bermuda. Down this drain goes ships, planes, pensions, taxes, charity donations, common sense, gas attackers, motorhomers heeding their sat navs, morals, sense of duty, honour, pride, parental responsibility and lots more. Unfortunately, those things and people who ought to go down the drain seem slither away.
> 
> Well, it is the weekend and time to ramble.
Click to expand...

Hi.

Or the expression "Plain sailing" assumes the earth is flat for navigation purposes, and it does work for a radius of a couple of hundred miles as you can draw a straight line on a chart of a flat earth, while a curved projection has to have a curved line unless it forms part of a great circle.. All this was solved by the Mercator Projection which alters the scale of the chart so you can draw a straight line on a flattened out sphere, making Greenland on a Mercator Projection larger than Australia..

How it works is imagine a Map of the world or portion of it painted on a light bulb, turn on the light bulb and the resulting picture is transmitted on to a white sheet suspended above it that is the image that Mercator figured out and it is used to this day.

ray.


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## tonyt

rayrecrok said:


> Hi.................................
> 
> ray.


Now about that signature of yours!! When you're the Top Man, you can do what you like without having to justify it.

I'm working on a plan - a Poll - "Do you agree that MHF members aged between 65 and 68 should get free membership backdated to 2005?"

I'm looking for a quick 40/60 victory


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## kenny

*gas robers*

if you keep the robbers out you will not get gassed a few years ago it was found to be the airasol sprays what you get to start diesel engines what as ether in when you come you breath it in you are out for the count , when they open the door the spray the dog and then its easy kenny


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## aldra

They would have to be pretty dam quick

If they opened our door they would have teeth fastened round them

anyway they would not get as far as opening the door without him going ballistic

We lock the door for the safety of the burglar :lol: :lol: :lol:

Aldra


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## damar1

Well i have got to put my bit in we were gassed and robbed, the so called experts say it can not hapen ( well they must be right )but we have a gas alarm fitted and we feel a lot safer. Gassing does happen .


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## pippin

damar1

So sorry that it happened to you.

Can we please have all the details of the event so that we may learn from your unfortunate incident.


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## bognormike

damar1 said:


> Well i have got to put my bit in we were gassed and robbed, the so called experts say it can not hapen ( well they must be right )but we have a gas alarm fitted and we feel a lot safer. Gassing does happen .


Sorry to hear about your misfortune, and as I said early on in this thread, we want some details. What happened, and what convinces you that you were "gassed"? Did the police check for, and categorically state that the robbers used something to knock you out?


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## olley

The proof that gassing doesn't happen is the lack of dead bodies.

Ian


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## damar1

Yes the police were very good , and said it happens a lot in there area not only on vans but Lorry's to get the computers. We were parked in a service area near Barcelona after traveling ad out 90 miles that day. had a meal with 1 glass of wine checked all doors locked and windows. I can remember the light changing it must have bee when they moved the curtains to get into the back, we woke in the morning and said that was a good night for a service area not even woke up by a fridge lorry. Nothing gave us reason to think we had been robbed until we got to the tolls and we had no money, every thing was put back in exactly the same place. This happened 5 Years ago and it was an old van, but it still happens how many people bother to go and see if all is ok if an alarm goes of. last time i spoke about this on here i was told by some so called experts it can not happen and that we must be old and senile we have been m/h for 40 years yes we are retired but are not stupid


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## nicholsong

Ray

'Or the expression "Plain sailing" assumes the earth is flat'.

If the earth were flat wouldn't that make it 'Plane' sailing? :

Another (silly) thought is a line on a GPS plotter a 'Great Circle' or 'Rhumb Line'?

[don't worry guys - Ray knows what I mean]

I know we are off-topic but not much more than the OP's quoted newspaper report is 'off reality'

Geoff


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## loddy

rayrecrok said:


> tonyt said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Grath said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...........................Regarding the second paragraph, the earth was once presumed flat :?
> 
> 
> 
> Now I must pick you up on that! You use the word "was" as if it's no longer considered a possibility.
> 
> I've researched this subject thoroughly and can tell you that the earth is flat but has no edges as was once believed - it has a central "drain" off the coast of Bermuda. Down this drain goes ships, planes, pensions, taxes, charity donations, common sense, gas attackers, motorhomers heeding their sat navs, morals, sense of duty, honour, pride, parental responsibility and lots more. Unfortunately, those things and people who ought to go down the drain seem slither away.
> 
> Well, it is the weekend and time to ramble.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Hi.
> 
> Or the expression "Plain sailing" assumes the earth is flat for navigation purposes, and it does work for a radius of a couple of hundred miles as you can draw a straight line on a chart of a flat earth, while a curved projection has to have a curved line unless it forms part of a great circle.. All this was solved by the Mercator Projection which alters the scale of the chart so you can draw a straight line on a flattened out sphere, making Greenland on a Mercator Projection larger than Australia..
> 
> How it works is imagine a Map of the world or portion of it painted on a light bulb, turn on the light bulb and the resulting picture is transmitted on to a white sheet suspended above it that is the image that Mercator figured out and it is used to this day.
> 
> ray.
Click to expand...

Yes we've all done navigation

Loddy :roll:


----------



## bognormike

damar1 said:


> Yes the police were very good , and said it happens a lot in there area not only on vans but Lorry's to get the computers. We were parked in a service area near Barcelona after traveling ad out 90 miles that day. had a meal with 1 glass of wine checked all doors locked and windows. I can remember the light changing it must have bee when they moved the curtains to get into the back, we woke in the morning and said that was a good night for a service area not even woke up by a fridge lorry. Nothing gave us reason to think we had been robbed until we got to the tolls and we had no money, every thing was put back in exactly the same place. This happened 5 Years ago and it was an old van, but it still happens how many people bother to go and see if all is ok if an alarm goes of. last time i spoke about this on here i was told by some so called experts it can not happen and that we must be old and senile we have been m/h for 40 years yes we are retired but are not stupid


with the greatest respect, damar1, yes you were robbed, but where is the evidence that you were gassed in some way?


----------



## pippin

damar1
" we woke in the morning and said that was a good night for a service area not even woke up by a fridge lorry."

No headache? 

I must find out what gas they used and tell my anaesthetist.

And, yes, I am doubting your story because I have had several general anaesthetics and each one has given me an appalling headache on coming round. 

Doubting is not the same as refuting.


----------



## BrianJP

pippin said:


> damar1
> " we woke in the morning and said that was a good night for a service area not even woke up by a fridge lorry."
> 
> No headache?
> 
> I must find out what gas they used and tell my anaesthetist.
> 
> And, yes, I am doubting your story because I have had several general anaesthetics and each one has given me an appalling headache on coming round.
> 
> Doubting is not the same as refuting.


Sorry damar1 but I also have my doubts.
If you were genuinly suspected of having been gassed by an unspecified substance I dont think the police ( even in Spain) would have allowed you to continue with your journey until you had been checked out at a hospital with toxicoligy tests etc.
Also there are lots of cases of theft similar to yours(some on this forum) where people have been robbed while they slept undisturbed ,but they have not claimed to have been gassed.


----------



## damar1

We were asked if we were ok but the time between the gassing aprox 10 o clock at night and it was 10 in the morning before we were at the police station. As you say you do not think we were gassed, perhapes you can tell me what hapenend that night then, the police seemed to be of the opinion we were gassed, but i think it was probably alians dont you, 

And bognormike would you not wake up if some one was on you bed getting you wallet out of the coubourd over your head., sorry but i think you would.

You can say what you like but i beleve we were gassed and what ever i say you will say it can not happen so i think we should put the subject to bed


----------



## BrianJP

Perhaps it was Aliens then but whoever it was one thing is evident and that is that you did not have adequate security precautions.
With a good CAT1 vehicle alarm ,window alarms and door deadlocks or additional interior locks no one is going to get into your motorhome without you knowing.Also it has been proven elsewhere that it would be almost impossible to gas the occupants of a motorhome/caravan through exterior airvents.


----------



## nicholsong

It was Dr. Who what done it! :lol: :lol: :lol: 

Look forward a few light years and see whether I am right? :wink: 

Geoff


----------



## KeithChesterfield

nicholsong - It was Dr. Who what done it!

You may be right!


----------



## pippin

The double bed in our MH is over the garage.

One of us has to sleep against the rear wall and has to climb over the other to get into and out of bed.

It is not that easy a manoeuvre.

(We do change places occasionally depending on the state of my bad back.)

Being of a certain age we need to get up in the night.

We are totally unaware when the other one does so.

One night in the small hours the gas ran out, indicated by the fridge fault LED flashing.
That also meant that the heating was off - which is what probably awakened me.

It was a freezing cold winter night so I got up, bunged some clothes on, opened the hab door, operated the electric step, opened the garage door, opened the gas locker door and clanked around with the spanner changing over the bottles.

Clumped back into the van shivering.

'Er indoors had no recollection of the event despite the fact that the gas locker is immediately under her pillow and I had twice clambered over her.

Amazing what one can sleep through, even without having had a glass or bottle of wine.

Had I gassed her? Nope!

PS - Doubting is not the same as disbelieving.


----------



## damar1

yes brian you have said it NO ONE WOULD GET INTO YOUR M/H IF YOU WERE AWAKE.


----------



## rayrecrok

pippin said:


> The double bed in our MH is over the garage.
> 
> One of us has to sleep against the rear wall and has to climb over the other to get into and out of bed.
> 
> It is not that easy a manoeuvre.
> 
> (We do change places occasionally depending on the state of my bad back.)
> 
> Being of a certain age we need to get up in the night.
> 
> We are totally unaware when the other one does so.
> 
> One night in the small hours the gas ran out, indicated by the fridge fault LED flashing.
> That also meant that the heating was off - which is what probably awakened me.
> 
> It was a freezing cold winter night so I got up, bunged some clothes on, opened the hab door, operated the electric step, opened the garage door, opened the gas locker door and clanked around with the spanner changing over the bottles.
> 
> Clumped back into the van shivering.
> 
> 'Er indoors had no recollection of the event despite the fact that the gas locker is immediately under her pillow and I had twice clambered over her.
> 
> Amazing what one can sleep through, even without having had a glass or bottle of wine.
> 
> Had I gassed her? Nope!
> 
> PS I repeat:- Doubting is not the same as refuting.


Huh! easy explained she thought you were having sex, that's why she never woke up. :lol: :lol: :lol:

ray.


----------



## pippin

The chance would be a fine thing Ray!


----------



## sweetie

damar1 said:


> We were asked if we were ok but the time between the gassing aprox 10 o clock at night and it was 10 in the morning before we were at the police station. As you say you do not think we were gassed, perhapes you can tell me what hapenend that night then, the police seemed to be of the opinion we were gassed, but i think it was probably alians dont you,
> 
> And bognormike would you not wake up if some one was on you bed getting you wallet out of the coubourd over your head., sorry but i think you would.
> 
> You can say what you like but i beleve we were gassed and what ever i say you will say it can not happen so i think we should put the subject to bed


So you where gassed and you know the approximate time! Did they leave the time they visited. As Victor Meldrew once said I dont believe it.

My wife gets up usually twice in the night to visit little room never here her at home or motorhome. And that is without me having a drink.


----------



## Enock

As a retired H&S bod, whom due to health issues, isn't really in a position to defend himself from a physical attack  

I've done my risk assessment and decided that the few thousand quid I'd be spending travelling down to, and stopping at Benicassim, for the next 3 months or so isn't going to happen...


----------



## barryd

Ah! Sadly this is my biggest
Fear about posts like this. Although many of us try and reasure others that your safe moiorhoming clearly some of us end rattled and afraid to go and enjoy the freedom that our wonderful hobby offers us.

Please, please please reconsider. Europe is very very safe. Go away and have fun. You only live once and what we need to appreciate is that out of the thousands of vans that tootle freely around Europe, only the odd one or two have a problem and almost never while you are in the van. You have more chance of getting broken onto in your house than in your Motorhome. So go away, sleep easy and enjoy your life of freedom! : D


----------



## grizzlyj

Having squirted a fair few cans worth of ether in close proximity to me for its flamable effects I'm amazed to hear it could be used to knock someone out! I think I would have noticed, before lighting it  8O


----------



## raynipper

barryd said:


> Ah! Sadly this is my biggest
> Fear about posts like this. Although many of us try and reasure others that your safe moiorhoming clearly some of us end rattled and afraid to go and enjoy the freedom that our wonderful hobby offers us.
> 
> Please, please please reconsider. Europe is very very safe. Go away and have fun. You only live once and what we need to appreciate is that out of the thousands of vans that tootle freely around Europe, only the odd one or two have a problem and almost never while you are in the van. You have more chance of getting broken onto in your house than in your Motorhome. So go away, sleep easy and enjoy your life of freedom! : D


Quite right Barry....................................................except Spain.. :twisted:

Ray.


----------



## Enock

I still plan on using the van..... Just not in Spain....

The wife and I have been discussing our plans for a good few weeks now, and we're sorry to say, that we decided Spain just isn't worth the risk...

It's a shame, as we were their in Feb, and March, and quite enjoyed it....

But even traveling home in March, we had other Brits wanting to travel with us due to the safety in numbers thing....

I love motorhoming, but I don't want spend time looking over my shoulder, or feeling vulnerable.... So Spain's out for now anyway...


----------



## rayrecrok

Hi.

Threats from the poor buggers in certain parts of the continent with them having no income for weeks or months is a reality.. But to try and convince us that anybody has been gassed in any shape or form while in their van and robbed is insulting our intelligence..

I could go along with some one befriending them and doping their drink then robbing them is feasible, but gassing, your having a laugh mate :roll: .

ray.


----------



## rayrecrok

Enock said:


> I still plan on using the van..... Just not in Spain....
> 
> The wife and I have been discussing our plans for a good few weeks now, and we're sorry to say, that we decided Spain just isn't worth the risk...
> 
> It's a shame, as we were their in Feb, and March, and quite enjoyed it....
> 
> But even traveling home in March, we had other Brits wanting to travel with us due to the safety in numbers thing....
> 
> I love motorhoming, but I don't want spend time looking over my shoulder, or feeling vulnerable.... So Spain's out for now anyway...


Hi.

Well that shows different strokes for different folks.. We feel the safest in Spain than any other country and we wild camp all the time there. Portugal is another place I feel safe but we are on a cheap campsite for two months.

ray.


----------



## bognormike

Sorry Enock, but to exclude the whole of Spain just because of reports of incidents in one small part of a very big country is frankly irrational. You might as well say I'm not going to Dover to catch a ferry because it means going round that horrible place called London where there is so much crime, or even refuse to get on a ferry because one sank may years ago.


----------



## damar1

As my last coment on this subject and i know many will say good, befor this hapend to us i was the same as many of you and took notice of the experts , and took the michaele out of people who said they had been gassed. Untill some one can come up with a seseble answer, and tell me how it happend and dis prove what we are saying, to the point when the police say you are mad i will still say it happens. But as many of you have said dont let things like this put you of m/hing it is a great thing to do and we still spend about 5 monthes of the year travelingand never think of it now.


----------



## Enock

That's fine.... You may feel its irrational..... I feel it's not worth the risk...
I just don't want to be driving through Spain looking over my shoulder, wondering what that car that's getting a bit close is up to, or should we stop here for a break or not....

Just not my idea of how I wan't to enjoy my van...

If I were 35, built like an outhouse, and able to defend myself, maybe I'd have a different view...
The reality is though, I've had a pretty rough time of it, and although I hate to admit it, I feel weak and vulnerable.. And I'd stand out as an easy target...


----------



## KeithChesterfield

The wife and I taking every precaution before retiring to our Motorhome bed during our European holiday.

Sweet dreams!


----------



## nicholsong

A 'Threesome' might be difficult :lol: :lol:


----------



## rayrecrok

Enock said:


> That's fine.... You may feel its irrational..... I feel it's not worth the risk...
> I just don't want to be driving through Spain looking over my shoulder, wondering what that car that's getting a bit close is up to, or should we stop here for a break or not....
> 
> Just not my idea of how I wan't to enjoy my van...
> 
> If I were 35, built like an outhouse, and able to defend myself, maybe I'd have a different view...
> The reality is though, I've had a pretty rough time of it, and although I hate to admit it, I feel weak and vulnerable.. And I'd stand out as an easy target...


Hi.
You tell me who is kicking sand in your face and I will come round and thump them for you. :wink:

ray.


----------



## 04HBG

Whoever discovers a gas that can put you to sleep in a van and leave no trace will be onto a fortune.

From my own experience of accidentally letting off some easy start, which i believe is ether based, i know that it leaves a hell of a smell for days in a confined space.

Halon which has been mentioned is now a banned toxic substance, once used in fire extinguishers and excellent for use on any engine fire which was contained within an engine bay as it replaced the oxygen and killed it instantly, so any use of that in a motorhome would certainly kill the occupants.

Having once met a couple who were robbed and thought they had been gassed initialy but on reflection had realised that they had been drinking with another English couple the night before and that their drinks had almost certainly been spiked, that couple had left the site very early long before the robbed couple had woken never to be seen again.

For those reasons i will never be convinced about gassing

RD


----------



## Enock

rayrecrok said:


> Enock said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's fine.... You may feel its irrational..... I feel it's not worth the risk...
> I just don't want to be driving through Spain looking over my shoulder, wondering what that car that's getting a bit close is up to, or should we stop here for a break or not....
> 
> Just not my idea of how I wan't to enjoy my van...
> 
> If I were 35, built like an outhouse, and able to defend myself, maybe I'd have a different view...
> The reality is though, I've had a pretty rough time of it, and although I hate to admit it, I feel weak and vulnerable.. And I'd stand out as an easy target...
> 
> 
> 
> Hi.
> You tell me who is kicking sand in your face and I will come round and thump them for you. :wink:
> 
> ray.
Click to expand...

Cheers Ray..... That'd help

Just to be clear, I'm not in the least bit worried about a so called gas attack... It's more about being burgled whilst away from the van, or worse still, some sort of physical attack or mugging....

Unfortunatly, running away, or standing my ground, isn't really an option at the moment..... And I have little doubt that I'd prove a very easy target for anyone with a will to take my possessions...

It's just the way it is


----------



## rayrecrok

Enock said:


> rayrecrok said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Enock said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's fine.... You may feel its irrational..... I feel it's not worth the risk...
> I just don't want to be driving through Spain looking over my shoulder, wondering what that car that's getting a bit close is up to, or should we stop here for a break or not....
> 
> Just not my idea of how I wan't to enjoy my van...
> 
> If I were 35, built like an outhouse, and able to defend myself, maybe I'd have a different view...
> The reality is though, I've had a pretty rough time of it, and although I hate to admit it, I feel weak and vulnerable.. And I'd stand out as an easy target...
> 
> 
> 
> Hi.
> You tell me who is kicking sand in your face and I will come round and thump them for you. :wink:
> 
> ray.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Cheers Ray..... That'd help
> 
> Just to be clear, I'm not in the least bit worried about a so called gas attack... It's more about being burgled whilst away from the van, or worse still, some sort of physical attack or mugging....
> 
> Unfortunatly, running away, or standing my ground, isn't really an option at the moment..... And I have little doubt that I'd prove a very easy target for anyone with a will to take my possessions...
> 
> It's just the way it is
Click to expand...

He He.

It does help being a good foot bigger and 4 stone heavier than the average Spaniard :lol: :lol: :lol:

ray.


----------



## sweetie

Enock said:


> rayrecrok said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Enock said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's fine.... You may feel its irrational..... I feel it's not worth the risk...
> I just don't want to be driving through Spain looking over my shoulder, wondering what that car that's getting a bit close is up to, or should we stop here for a break or not....
> 
> Just not my idea of how I wan't to enjoy my van...
> 
> If I were 35, built like an outhouse, and able to defend myself, maybe I'd have a different view...
> The reality is though, I've had a pretty rough time of it, and although I hate to admit it, I feel weak and vulnerable.. And I'd stand out as an easy target...
> 
> 
> 
> Hi.
> You tell me who is kicking sand in your face and I will come round and thump them for you. :wink:
> 
> ray.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Cheers Ray..... That'd help
> 
> Just to be clear, I'm not in the least bit worried about a so called gas attack... It's more about being burgled whilst away from the van, or worse still, some sort of physical attack or mugging....
> 
> Unfortunatly, running away, or standing my ground, isn't really an option at the moment..... And I have little doubt that I'd prove a very easy target for anyone with a will to take my possessions...
> 
> It's just the way it is
Click to expand...

So are vehicles exempt from being burgled in UK And there are no physical attacks or muggings.


----------



## loddy

rayrecrok said:


> Enock said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rayrecrok said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Enock said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's fine.... You may feel its irrational..... I feel it's not worth the risk...
> I just don't want to be driving through Spain looking over my shoulder, wondering what that car that's getting a bit close is up to, or should we stop here for a break or not....
> 
> Just not my idea of how I wan't to enjoy my van...
> 
> If I were 35, built like an outhouse, and able to defend myself, maybe I'd have a different view...
> The reality is though, I've had a pretty rough time of it, and although I hate to admit it, I feel weak and vulnerable.. And I'd stand out as an easy target...
> 
> 
> 
> Hi.
> You tell me who is kicking sand in your face and I will come round and thump them for you. :wink:
> 
> ray.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Cheers Ray..... That'd help
> 
> Just to be clear, I'm not in the least bit worried about a so called gas attack... It's more about being burgled whilst away from the van, or worse still, some sort of physical attack or mugging....
> 
> Unfortunatly, running away, or standing my ground, isn't really an option at the moment..... And I have little doubt that I'd prove a very easy target for anyone with a will to take my possessions...
> 
> It's just the way it is
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> He He.
> 
> It does help being a good foot bigger and 4 stone heavier than the average Spaniard :lol: :lol: :lol:
> 
> It's north Aficans
> 
> ray.
Click to expand...

It's North Africans


----------



## aultymer

Loddy,
Unless North Africans have become small,wiry and white, 2 of our attackers in Barcelona were NOT African.


----------



## Enock

sweetie said:


> Enock said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> rayrecrok said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Enock said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's fine.... You may feel its irrational..... I feel it's not worth the risk...
> I just don't want to be driving through Spain looking over my shoulder, wondering what that car that's getting a bit close is up to, or should we stop here for a break or not....
> 
> Just not my idea of how I wan't to enjoy my van...
> 
> If I were 35, built like an outhouse, and able to defend myself, maybe I'd have a different view...
> The reality is though, I've had a pretty rough time of it, and although I hate to admit it, I feel weak and vulnerable.. And I'd stand out as an easy target...
> 
> 
> 
> Hi.
> You tell me who is kicking sand in your face and I will come round and thump them for you. :wink:
> 
> ray.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Cheers Ray..... That'd help
> 
> Just to be clear, I'm not in the least bit worried about a so called gas attack... It's more about being burgled whilst away from the van, or worse still, some sort of physical attack or mugging....
> 
> Unfortunatly, running away, or standing my ground, isn't really an option at the moment..... And I have little doubt that I'd prove a very easy target for anyone with a will to take my possessions...
> 
> It's just the way it is
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> So are vehicles exempt from being burgled in UK And there are no physical attacks or muggings.
Click to expand...

Well an obtuse question deserves an obtuse reply..... Lets put it this way, when travelling around the UK, I don't feel vulnerable and I dont feel that I have to be on the constant look out..

Sometimes you know..... It's more about the perceived threat, than the actual threat


----------



## rosalan

aultymer said:


> Loddy,
> Unless North Africans have become small,wiry and white, 2 of our attackers in Barcelona were NOT African.


Albinos!


----------



## aultymer

> Albinos!


What do you have against people from Albino?
Should your post be reported as racist? non PC, or just plain colourist? :wink:


----------



## Enock

Just like to add, that my decision not to go to Spain isn't based on reports of gas attacks, or anything else on this forum...

But instead based on actual incidents, as told to me by fellow travellers..
Remember, not everyone does the Internet...

I spent much of the summer in Beaune, and obviously spoke with other motorhomers, travelling through..

1st couple from Basschurch in Shropshire.... Forced to stop just outside Barcelona, by what they initially thought was a police car..... Quick reactions by the owner, meant they escaped the situation, by driving away.... But quite shaken up, as they had spotted that one of the bad guys had a gun..

2nd...a couple from Essex, had everything stolen, passports, cash, cards, and jewellry, parked in a rest area when a young girl tricked her way into the van, by asking for directions.... Once in, she managed to open the hab door, and her burley acclomplesses made short work of clearing anything of value

3rd... A couple from Dorset... Left van unattended, and came back to find it stripped bare.... Access had been gained by smashing the roof skylight...

4th my sister went to Madrid....within 2 hours of arrival, hotel door kicked in, iPod, clothing, phone etc all gone

5th my next door neighbour went to Valencia to watch the Moto GP....
Whilst visiting the cathedral, bag snatched, money, tickets, and other personal items gone..


----------



## SilverMachine

Villasol wasn't a gas attack. That's histeria and a good headline.

We had 18 nts at Villasol leaving on the 12th Nov. 

On Fri 9th Nov, we went out with friends to watch Skyfall at the Cinema and stayed out late. The following morning we found that someone had tried to 'screwdriver' the locks on the driver and habitation doors.

Site reception conformed that they were already contacting the Police because several others had reported similar attempts.

One victim had gone to bed, leaving a door unlocked, and a wallet was stolen from a pair of trousers that had been left lying on the front seat. 

No Gas...... just complacency and an opportunist crime.

If we had been Free Camping (like a dozen other vans parked for days behind the Levante Hospital) then we would have kept blinds closed, set the alarm and when we were out, we would have left a light and the radio on. As it was, we became too cosy on the site and just closed the blinds.

Fortunately, the Hymer locks defeated the thief. They still work fine but 2 barrels need changing as you can see they have been 'messed with'.

We weren't suprised when we didn't rec've any contact from the Police. They had told Reception that anyone wanting to report a crime should go to the Police Station. Reception didn't pass this on.

I could get a little narked about Police going around in 3's having car's towed away but not doing the harder things like visiting 3 or 4 crime scenes....... but there is no point. 

We've enjoyed several stay's at Villasol, but they don't help themselves. There's no CCTV (that we can see). You can wander in and (more suspiciously in the early hours) out without challenge day and night..... We weren't challenged when we came back to the van at 3.45am ( I'd forgotten there were two 3.45's in a day). The night staff don't give you a second look. We have been challenged on other sites.

You need to keep all this in perspective. We've travelled three continents over 5+ years, knocking up 57k miles. This petty attempt on our van is the most serious incident in all that time. We are always wary when circumventing Barcelona and Madrid but nothing (touch wood) has happened to us there, despite staying on the Aire/Lorry Park in Barce' 4 times. 

Fear of something happening is a far bigger enemy to your travels than any reality.

The events that night on Vilasol will have circulated around the Benidorm Campsite fraternity like wild fire.... striking fear into dozens of elderly/vulnerable people. 

No one was gassed. 

It should be a wake up call for Villasol.... but sadly I don't think it will change things one jot. 

It was a wakeup call for us not to drop your guard when staying on some campsites.

Barry


----------



## 113016

I have travelled extensively over Spain during my trucking days and I can honestly tell you there are many worse places, including some here in the UK.
Obviously some tourist destinations can be targeted by the opportunists, similarly truckers were targeted in known parking areas.
There are many more and nicer areas to Spain than just the costalotas :lol: Give the Atlantic coast a try, you just might be pleasantly surprised.
And as for the Spanish people?generally, I would struggle to meet any nicer people Obviously there are exceptions!
You must remember, that the criminal element will target tourist areas in any country, as they consider holiday makers to be easy pickings and off their guard.
I think at the moment with so much unemployment, we must take precautions in many countries but we must not hide away
 
We are British you know  :lol: :lol:


----------



## javea

I am beginning to wish that I had not started this thread!

It was meant as a lighthearted dig at the local paper who had jumped on the 'gas attack bandwagon' and I certainly didn't want to discourage anyone from coming to Spain. 

Since 1986 I have had houses here which are unoccupied for about 8 months each year, I have never had any security issues in that period.
I have toured extensively throughout Spain in a motorhome and again have not experienced any security problems. In fact, the only time someone tried to screwdriver a door was in France.

Whatever your interests you should be able to indulge them.

So, don't be put off by this one isolated incident in the middle of a busy resort, come and enjoy!  

Mike


----------



## nicholsong

Would it be true to say that most of the incidents of crime reported have occurred along the southern littoral of Spain?

And how about Portugal?

Geoff


----------



## 113016

nicholsong said:


> Would it be true to say that most of the incidents of crime reported have occurred along the southern littoral of Spain?
> 
> And how about Portugal?
> 
> Geoff


I think that most of the reported M/H crime in Spain is along the Med Costa coast, but that is not really surprising as most M/Hs will be there.
Mind you, I would be wary around Bilbao and Irun. I usually like to get past Santandare.
Portugal has it's hot spots, usually the big Cities.


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## Zebedee

I'm very impressed by the social awareness of the scrotes who do the gassing.

Without exception, in every single gas attack that has ever been reported, they have taken their rubbish home with them.

Not one empty gas container has ever been found! :roll: Dashed public spirited of them I say.

Dave

P.S. Those who insist (_ad infinitum_ :roll: ) that gassing is a reality and think carbon tetrachloride, ether, quick start etc. could be used, should really believe the experts.

But maybe they deliberately avoid reading the statement from the Royal College of Anaesthetists because it totally refutes and undermines their claims . . . and (_as Bognormike has indicated_) *none of the "victims" has yet been able to provide a single shred of concrete, verifiable evidence!!*


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## Enock

javea said:


> I am beginning to wish that I had not started this thread!
> 
> It was meant as a lighthearted dig at the local paper who had jumped on the 'gas attack bandwagon' and I certainly didn't want to discourage anyone from coming to Spain.
> 
> Mike


Your thread hasn't discouraged me from visiting Spain....

I'd already made my mind up earlier in the year, that I wouldn't return


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