# Trigano Tribute Winter Insulation or Lack Of



## 105062

After spending some cold nights in the Tribby I tried to find out why it cooled down so quick and took so long to heat up, a rise of 8 deg c in 1 hour when it was freezing out ! Some nights the diesel heater struggled to keep the inside above 10 deg C when only 2 deg c outside.

I e-mailed Trigano to see if I could get the Insulation factor for the MH as I could not find it in any of the documentation but so far I have had no reply, does anyone know what it might be ? I understand that all MH's built after 1999 are suppose to publish one, or is it voluntary? Anyway the following pics may give a clue to what that rating may be...*a big fat 0*

Side walls - I peered behind the cover and took a pic.. Nothing
side door 1 bit of polystyrene
Rear Doors -a couple of small random bits of polystyrene

I could not see anything in the roof either but I only looked at the edges.

Unfortunately the walls and roof will be imposable to insulate as so much would need dismantling but I have filled the doors with B&Q insulation!


----------



## fridgeman

hi 650, i,am thinking the roof is fine as i removed the areil fitted by the dealer to neaten up the siliconing as it was rough, as far as i could see it has about 75mm of polystyrene up there. best thing to do apart from take the obvious panels off and fill them with whatever [i,am going to use rockwool] is to get hold of a infared thermometer and go round the van when the heaters upto temperature,this should show the hot/cold spots up.

going to do mine soon. :?


----------



## pepandspice

I would have thought that the manufacturers were responsible for fitting adequate insulation to these vehicles, not the customers who have paid thousands of pounds for them. What is the world coming to?

Dawn.


----------



## 105062

Hi Fridgeman, Do hope you are correct about the roof, I would luv to see the results of your thermal camera as I do not have access to one :roll: 

PepandSpice, Yep I agree but what can you do ? if you have followed my other posts you will see that my Tribute has needed taking to bits and rebuilding in many areas by me ! If I asked my dealer to fit insulation he would laugh at me ( or shout as he has done in the past 8O )I refused to take it back from my dealer, Danum Leisure, once as they would not sort some of the problems, brand new 1st July 07 8O but it would still be sat in their yard if I had not given in as they have my hard earned cash so it was no skin off their nose :evil: 

Many Tribute owners will be blissfully unaware of what problems lurk behind and under the units. Those that have taken panels off have found the same problems I have had, those that have not will not be worried.

The plus side is I do quite enjoy taking the Tribby to bits and putting it back the way it suites me, and I know it is right at the end of the day. :roll: I do normal post my findings as there are a few members "tinkering" with their Tribbies!


----------



## fridgeman

not a camera 650 a,thermometer, very handy tool for all sorts of purposes. keep an eye on fleebay .£25 ish would sound okay as there only about £50 new now.

same old same old with theese vans,still very cheap for what you get,if your half handy i think its quite enjoyable doing theese bits in my own little sadistic way. i would sooner be doing it this way spending pence than by a new IH or similar and loosing thousands each year.

if diesel and site fees go up much more they will only be sat on the drive most of the year anyway 8O


----------



## sallytrafic

Another non technical way put some heat in your van when cold weather is expected overnight (any day soon) and in the morning see the warm spots against the frost or even dew. Look about an hour after dawn for best result. Take photos.


----------



## pepandspice

Tribute_650 said:


> Hi Fridgeman, Do hope you are correct about the roof, I would luv to see the results of your thermal camera as I do not have access to one :roll:
> 
> PepandSpice, Yep I agree but what can you do ? if you have followed my other posts you will see that my Tribute has needed taking to bits and rebuilding in many areas by me ! If I asked my dealer to fit insulation he would laugh at me ( or shout as he has done in the past 8O )I refused to take it back from my dealer, Danum Leisure, once as they would not sort some of the problems, brand new 1st July 07 8O but it would still be sat in their yard if I had not given in as they have my hard earned cash so it was no skin off their nose :evil:
> 
> Many Tribute owners will be blissfully unaware of what problems lurk behind and under the units. Those that have taken panels off have found the same problems I have had, those that have not will not be worried.
> 
> The plus side is I do quite enjoy taking the Tribby to bits and putting it back the way it suites me, and I know it is right at the end of the day. :roll: I do normal post my findings as there are a few members "tinkering" with their Tribbies!


Hi Tribute 650, I think you should send those pictures to Autotrail and ask them for their comments, also you could send them to MMM, MCM, Which Motorcaravan and Practical Motorhome and ask for their advice re insulation.

Dawn.


----------



## weaver

We have an 05 'old' Tribute and have just been away in it for a few days. Beautifully cosy with the heater on, in fact we have never turned the heater up very far, even though we use the van all the year round. When the wind is high, it can be a bit draughty, mainly because of the vent in the door. Can't believe that the new version is so much worse! Consider myself lucky we bought when we did.

Best of luck with your insulation. Do other people with the new van have the same problem? Hope you get it sorted.

Louise


----------



## 105062

Hi Louise, Would be interested to know how much more insulation was on the earlier Tributes, do you think you could whip off a door cover and post a pic please?
Cheers
Paul


----------



## weaver

Sorry, we are not handy with the van, and leave everything to the experts. We did, however, see the rear door with the window when we were having a cycle rack fitted, and it certainly had a lot more insulation than yours. As far as we can remember, the section below the window (I think that was 1 main area, not 4 like yours, but can't be sure) had insulation in the hollow area, with a chunk cut out for the handle. I always assume the walls and roof have insulation in them, as they are bouncy when touched, but maybe I am wrong. 

I asked John what he felt about it, and he agrees with me that your van sounds so different from ours, we cannot believe it! Have a feeling that that the advertising must mention insulation, and that you could go to trading standards about this. as your van is misrepresented. It looks a bit as if they ran out of insulation materials but didn't want to wait to sell it. Why else should there be insulation in only 1 of the sections of the door? Hope you get it sorted!

Louise


----------



## sallytrafic

sallytrafic said:


> Another non technical way put some heat in your van when cold weather is expected overnight (any day soon) and in the morning see the warm spots against the frost or even dew. Look about an hour after dawn for best result. Take photos.


So here is the answer for my van.

There is a 500W oil heater inside which was switched on last night. I didn't fit the silverscreens nor pull the curtains Most of the van was covered in frost this morning . The bits that weren't reveal where heat was leaking out. See photo

Area A is interesting I recently fitted an aerial socket and cut a 2" circular hole in the back of an open shelf to give access to bring the cable through In this small area there was no insulation but when I did the same photo last year there was frost so I assume that the dead air in that area last year gave enough insulation but this year the 2" hole let enough heat out. guess I'll be sealing up the access before we go away for new year.

BTW what you feel as cold in the van isn't cold coming from outside but heat leaving from inside. Its only heat that moves, cold doesn't eg in a freezer its heat leaving the food that cools it down warming the freezer walls not cold arriving from the freezer walls.


----------



## 105062

Nice one Frank, Well done I like that simple but effective method. I have spent today fitting rock wool following Fridgemans post and removed the polystyrene sheets I had fitted which I found difficult to get into "box" sections as around the doors. I used a rod and pushed the rock wool in. 12 metres of 150mm just in the rear and side doors! Plus it is not flammable unlike the polystyrene. Will await a good frost and do the "Frank test".


----------



## DABurleigh

A great tip from Frank.

People often "have a go" at the more expensive panel vans, being puzzled that you don't seem to get as much for your money. Well, insulation is one such hidden aspect. Indeed, in September's Practical Motorhome live-in test of a panel van, it acknowledges in only its 3rd paragraph:

"then there’s the issue of winterisation: unlike coachbuilt manufacturers who can inject as much Styrofoam as they like between plywood panels, van converters need to pack enough insulation into a narrow space to prevent the steel body leeching heat from the vehicle’s interior." Later on the test acknowledges Murvi's "fully insulated roof, walls and floor." 

On a couple of nights when it has hit a measured -11 deg C, I have enjoyed a cosy temperature differential of 30 deg C.

There is no great surprise. In a competitive market, by and large you get what you pay for, but you have to decide up front what is important and unimportant for your use. Some converters choose to build down to a price to obtain market share and profit. Nothing wrong with that at all, other than some customers' unrealistic expectations.

Dave


----------



## sallytrafic

BTW whatever the magazines says don't stuff insulation in too tight otherwise you loose some advantage of the still air trapped. Some materials have a lower 'R' (or higher 'U') factor if they are compressed. Air on its own is pretty good except it has to be still. Temperature differences in air that can move creates convective currents which transmit the heat.


----------



## 105062

Daburleigh's quote "_Some converters choose to build down to a price to obtain market share and profit. Nothing wrong with that at all, other than some customers' unrealistic expectations. _"

No, its not the customers faulty for expecting £50 worth of insulation and 1/2 hours work (when the vans empty) that certainly does not justify the lack of insulation... nor the £10 000 price difference on the Murvi Morello for that matter.... Now thats UNREALISTIC 8O


----------



## sallytrafic

Sorry don't agree with you the morello is a superb van almost wish I had bought one and would have done if it was on a Renault chassis


----------



## 105062

I am not disputing that but it is not worth £10 000 more than the Tribute because it has £50 worth of insulation nor does it justify the Tribute for not having it.... We are going off topic now but There needs to be a pile of justification to warrant £10k and when I was looking around the dealer just said that well used phrase " You pay for what you get" but could not be more specific, so If they can not justify it who can, its a bit like the Kings clothes...but that has nothing to do with the fact Trigano are a set of bodgers! ( to be polite)


----------



## sallytrafic

Well first of all they employ proper trained people and have to pay them proper wages. I know I was offered a job there (he may have been joking but I did ask around anyway though I didn't want a job). Wages have to be a big part of conversion costs.

Secondly they seem to have thought through their design carefully so it has slowly evolved. 

Thirdly just about (and I have some few reservations) they fit the best kit.


----------



## 105062

Maybe you should get a Job with Trigano Frank and sort them out, its the "hapeth of tar" syndrome, 
anyways we digress, can be put right if you are that way inclined, and by the dropping off of posts this month many may just store their pride and joys away till warmer days. :wink:


----------



## DABurleigh

"by the dropping off of posts this month many may just store their pride and joys away till warmer days."

Yes, was chatting with gaspode last night about things going quiet. It seemed like a ghost town for an end-November Saturday evening.

Anyways, we've had a great day out in the van. Shopping in West Quays at Southampton as they opened while parked 10 mins away in Mayflower Park at the water's edge for 60p per 2 hours, then a walk at Calshot (where I saw an amazing amphibious RIB do its thing - must Google), tea, cake & papers. The water was a millpond and it was a lovely sunset. Managed to avoid the worst of the motorway closure coming home.

Dave


----------



## oldenstar

Appreciate that we are well off topic here, but as a Devon dweller I was naturally interested in Murvi (only a few miles away), but was put off by price, as in my estimate of value for money, but also by the ambience of the vans.
I simply could not live with most of the upholstry designs/colours which I saw.
Of course it is a good job we don't all have the same tastes (what a dull world that would be), and I don't doubt their quality, but having owned a 2007 Tribute for some 8000 miles I STILL think that they are really good value for money.
Personally I have been warm enough, on some pretty chilly nights, and did not expect a Panel Van to be overly insulated.
I will have higher hopes for my new Mooveo as it is coachbuilt.


----------

