# Motorhome weight



## faceache (Feb 19, 2009)

Hope someone can give me some advice please. 
We are going on our first trip abroad this year in our 1999 Hymer 544 to Germany for two weeks. Should I be worried about being weighed somewhere and maybe get into trouble because of being overweight. I realise that I can find out my weight and answer my own question, but as it's only 2 adults a young girl and a small dog going and we are not taking bikes etc. (maybe some wine on the way back) would I be likely to be over the limit? 
Thanks to anyone who can help.


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## goldi (Feb 4, 2009)

Afternoon folks ,


Its always best to find out what the van weighs for your own peace of mind. The last thing you want is to pulled over by the cops when going on holiday .



norm


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

faceache said:


> Hope someone can give me some advice please.
> We are going on our first trip abroad this year in our 1999 Hymer 544 to Germany for two weeks. Should I be worried about being weighed somewhere and maybe get into trouble because of being overweight. I realise that I can find out my weight and answer my own question, but as it's only 2 adults a young girl and a small dog going and we are not taking bikes etc. (maybe some wine on the way back) would I be likely to be over the limit?
> Thanks to anyone who can help.


What is the GVW of the MH and do you know it's out of the factory weight?

Your chances of being pulled in for a weight chaeck are slim but possible. Whether you should be worried depends on you - your the only one who knows if you have used up your load allowance. Have you for example added a wind out awning or second battery?
For peace of mind visit a weigh bridge in your normal running setup.


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## trevorf (May 16, 2005)

Hi, To answer your question we need to know the maximum weight rating of your chassis and the unladen weight.
The max weight ratings can be found on a plate somewhere on your van (maybe under the bonnet) Likely to be 3500kg 3850kg or 4000kg
The unladen weight will be stated in the original sales brochure of your van if you still have it.
The only sure way to check is to visit a weigh bridge and have it checked.

I have never been stopped and weighed in my 6 visits to the continent but I have heard of some that have.



Trevor


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## Vennwood (Feb 4, 2007)

1. You are unlikely to be stopped but that isn't a guarantee.
2. There are hundreds of weigh bridges around the country - look at your local council web site.
3. It only costs you around a £5 (less if you live in the Notts area)


In reality in my opinion, the vast majority of our colleagues are running around overweight in blissful ignorance. My own experience was I had a Dethleffs i8750, tag axle and I thought I had only a few bits added. A couple of extra batteries, BBQ, two bikes, genny and aircon but found I was 472KGS over weight - I had to sell the thing and get something else. We now have almost 1500kgs payload and yet seem to run around with only 2/300kgs to spare

One golden rule - NEVER go by the sales brochure when working out payload - that is always shown in the best light with absolutely nothing added. No awning, no auto box, aircon, etc. etc. The only answer is to weigh it and then work it out from there.


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## faceache (Feb 19, 2009)

Wow what interesting answers. I think I was heading towards being one of the oblivious overweighters one of you mentioned. 
I truly had no idea of my gross weight limit but will now find out. 
I will load her up as if ready to go and drive onto the scales - now fully prepared for whatever it reads. At least I will know if I can bring back one or a hundred bottles of wine or worse still none at all.
This has put a whole new perspective on the way things are, and my understanding of them. Thanks for all your help so far.


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## tonyt (May 25, 2005)

Don't forget, it's not only about driving within the legal/design limit of your vehicle, it's also about "Could I stop quickly enough in an emergency with all that excess weight behind me (and the kids)?"


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## HEYFIELD (May 1, 2005)

Hi

I have a 1999 Hymer B564. Its plated weight is 3400kgs gross with 1750kgs on the rear axle and 1690kgs on the front.

I can comfortably stay under the gross weight but struggle with the rear axle weight.

I tend to keep as much of the heavy stuff in the van as far forward as possible and travel with empty water tanks, that way I can carry the 2 bikes.

I have spoken to Hymer in Germany and as I have twin or laminated leaf springs on the rear suspension and have 215/70 R15 tyres fitted the rear axle can be plated to 1900kgs.

I am in the process of doing that.

The gross will still be 3400kgs.


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## Mrplodd (Mar 4, 2008)

I had a B544 of 1996 vintage a few years ago. Just me and the missus. I got a bit curious one day and visited a weighbridge. 

When TOTALLY empty there was only about 30kg left on the permitted rear axle weight !!

It did have an awning, towbar and fitted LPG tank. 

I have since replaced it with an Autotrail Dakota. I have also weighed that and with just the two of us in it I am still very close to maximum on the rear axle AND I have removed the towbar (which came in at 65Kg!) 

It worries me when I see MH's of a certain age carrying motorcycles etc on rear brackets. There is no way most of them are within thier permitted axle weights. !


I feel that the makers are partly to blame by not being clearer about how close many of their products are to being at the limit when they leave the factory. 

450Kg SOUNDS a lot but if you add 2 healthy adults at 100kg each plus 100 litres of fresh water thats 300Kg of your payload gone before you start on food, bikes, clothes, BBQ, books, games, laptop, telly, DVD's, shoes, driveaway awning, awning carpet, chairs, tables, sports equipment, water in the toilet flush tank etc etc. It really is scary how it adds up !!

WHATEVER YOU DO GET YOUR MH WEIGHED IN FULL TOURING MODE. I will probably scare the bejabbers out of you just how heavy it is, ESPECIALLY on the rear axle (which is where just about every overweight vehicle fails!!)


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## Vennwood (Feb 4, 2007)

Mrplodd said:


> It worries me when I see MH's of a certain age carrying motorcycles etc on rear brackets. There is no way most of them are within thier permitted axle weights. !
> 
> I


Parked next to us last week at C&CC Sandringham was a Swift Bolero 630EW - nice outfit.

He had awning with Safari room, Chairs, BBQ etc. etc. and had a Honda motorbike on a rack at the rear. There were two people of "above average" weight

Now according to Swift web site the Bolero 630EW has a user payload of * 355kgs* (MIRO that is which includes 75kgs for driver, fuel, water and gas) - Even so they must have been several hundred kgs over weight

I've said on this site a couple times before - the dealer should provide a weight certificate as part of the handover. That would cut both ways - give the dealer protection as they had advised the customer of his available payload and the customer is forewarned as to what he has to play with.

Edit: while looking on the Swift site I also note that the Voyager 630EK has a user payload (MIRO) of 269kgs


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## eddied (May 9, 2005)

Ciao tutti, Italian motorhomers are absolutely petrified if entering/crossing Switzerland is on their route, and will go to great lengths to avoid. This because Swiss customs do frequently check any camper that looks a bit heavy on the rear. I can safely say that at least 95% of Italian motorhomers are knowingly pverweight; mainly because it's quite expensive/difficult to get a C licence. In any case overweight also carries insurance implications in case of accident.
saluti,
eddied


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## Alicat (May 31, 2010)

Phew, really glad I went for a 4t MH with 800kg payload.


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## LPDrifter (Aug 17, 2005)

faceache said:


> Hope someone can give me some advice please.
> We are going on our first trip abroad this year in our 1999 Hymer 544 to Germany for two weeks. Should I be worried about being weighed somewhere and maybe get into trouble because of being overweight. I realise that I can find out my weight and answer my own question, but as it's only 2 adults a young girl and a small dog going and we are not taking bikes etc. (maybe some wine on the way back) would I be likely to be over the limit?
> Thanks to anyone who can help.


I weighed mine. Personally I think you should weigh yours. If you
do this before you leave you can exercise some measure of control.

For example if you are overweight you may decide on leaving some
stuff at home. You may just run your MH fresh water tank half full 
and your diesel tank half to three quarter full. Run your grey water tank empty or near empty.

In practice I have never been stopped nor did I notice any motorhome
pulled over being weighed. So chances of being stopped are minimal.
I suspect that lots of MH drivers are driving over weight on the back axle and in total.

But do consider safety and legal implications. If you are overweight
it will affect the driving characteristics of your vehicle. If you were 
well over weight it could cause an accident.

I am not too sure about the insurance situation. For example if
you did unfortunately have an accident and the insurance company
got to know about it, you might find them trying to wriggle out
of paying.

All in all better to be safe.


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## windyspark (Sep 23, 2009)

I weighed my MH with one passenger, no water, diesel on reserve, no clothes or food. basically empty. It weighed 3540kg. the max permissible weight was 3500kg.
so i have had to fit air suspension and had the max weight raised to 3850kg by SV tech.

The dealer had used it as a 6 berth rental van for the previous year so just be wary when you purchase, as the dealer was oblivious to the problem. 
To be fair they did contribute to the cost of the upgrade


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## peribro (Sep 6, 2009)

LPDrifter said:


> faceache said:
> 
> 
> > I am not too sure about the insurance situation. For example if
> ...


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## grizzlyj (Oct 14, 2008)

Some comments suggest that if insurance etc found out you knew you were over weight it would be an issue.

You are responsible for what you are driving, so you are required to know. You will be fined and maybe points if stopped per weight offence, ie front axle, rear axle, train, total etc 3 points for each I think.

You may read you are "allowed" 10% if stopped. The only way in which you have an allowance is if you are 10% over or less you will be allowed to remove that 10% overloading and continue with your journey having been fined/points etc. Obviously if this is a service station on a motorway where VOSA have set up, or the other end of the country from your house, shame eh?! More than 10% and that vehicle will be put on a lorry, a cost I doubt you will be insured against! I've no idea what they do then!

Australia and the US have had police led campaigns aimed at educating campervan drivers about payload due to an increasing number of accidents I believe from blowouts from overloading. The comment regarding Italians avoiding Switzerland highlights two other countries well aware of the potential problem, so maybe the UK police will cotton on soon enough?

Any accident has the potential do be investigated by the police, and if you're found to have been overladen that won't make your position much easier.

Having talked to several manufacturers at shows, asking about 3500kg gross campers with six seat belts and berths, you kind of get a shrug, they still sell them, but its you driving it overladen. IMHO one of them needs sueing bigtime for selling something that is so clearly not fit for purpose. Maybe the rest would start designing something more useable then?

Finding out you have zero payload as I did is not funny, and has cost me a lot over and above what I'd budgeted for. Unfortunately I didn't even consider it being close to its gross weight, since its based on a small truck and the camper construction doesn't look like it would weigh much. I thought I had loads to spare, and it took a while for the position I'd put myself, and what I needed to do to fix it, to sink in, after randomly coming across a weighbridge and feeling curious. Buying via a dealer but actually from the previous private owner who's moved to France somewhere doesn't give much scope for comeback.

If someone posted here saying they'd been hit by a young uninsured driver I'm sure many would have sympathy and condemn the other party. Yet how many here would ask their insurance companies if they will still payout if their vehicle was overladen (just a little bit, honest) just to be sure?!


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## goldi (Feb 4, 2009)

Morning folks,

And do nt forget weigh in motion technology might be coming to aroad near you.




norm


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

goldi said:


> Morning folks,
> 
> And do nt forget weigh in motion technology might be coming to aroad near you.
> 
> ...


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## teal (Feb 23, 2009)

Some years ago we were pulled in by police and another service to a weighbridge along with many others.First our front wheels had to just pull on the m/c then full weight and also inspect all over chassis by another guy. Result was that we were just over weight and told the fine would be £2000 , however for some reason they gave a written warning order instead so i do weigh ours regular.


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## tonka (Apr 24, 2006)

nicholsong said:


> goldi said:
> 
> 
> > Morning folks,
> ...


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## blaine (May 1, 2005)

We have a Hobby Alkoven based on a Fiat Ducato plated originally at 3.4. My husband has had an obsession with the loaded weight when he realised that so many people do not have a clue of what they weigh and how much they can carry. We have upgraded through SV Tech to 3.65 [max on our Alko chassis without modification] My husband has removed any fittings we don't use eg top spare bunk, wind up system for my bunk etc. 
As someone said in an earlier post it is not just about being legal but failing to stop in an emergency. 
We believe many of the police forces throughout Europe are now weighing as a matter of course post accident, you can imagine what happens with your insurance if your overweight.
As we spend many months of the year travelling we really don't want to take any chances.


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

We were stopped at the border and weighed in Swizerland last year. They didnt believe that a 7.5 metre van with a motorbike on the back was under 3.5 tons. It was a tense moment as we were full of fuel and water and I had just filled the entire luton cab with cheap beer from Lidl in Germany! I knew we were about on the limit when we were weighed at home so it was likely we were over. We were there ages on the weigh bridge and eventually the guard came out with a print out. We were just under 3.5 tons and 60KG over our max weight. They simply were not bothered about us being over weight but did not believe we were under the 3.5 tons which I think involves paying a more expensive toll. Every time we crossed the swiss border we were pulled and asked about our weight. I just showed them the print out from the first border crossing weigh station and they were statisfied.


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## grizzlyj (Oct 14, 2008)

Following Tonkas helpful link and exploring I found the following which I'll copy all of so maybe more people would read it? I also apologise for in my previous post saying you are "allowed" 10%, this says you are only allowed 5% which you could then redistribute. Where else you put your scooter on the backrack I'm not sure! 
"
Overloading of Vehicles

Introduction

Overloading a vehicle isn't difficult, and it's not always the case that drivers are aware of the fact that their vehicles are as such. However, it is an offence under the Road Traffic Act and carries a maximum penalty of up to £5,000 per offence, which could be as a result of overloading in connection with an axle (or axles), the gross vehicle weight or the train weight of the vehicle. 
For operators and drivers of PCV's, be under no illusion, although you may have the correct number of passengers on your vehicle, there are also instances where your bus or coach can equally fall within the bounds of being overloaded.

Overloading - Your Defence 
Overloading and the problems created by doing so 
Preventing overloading 
Further Reading

Overloading - Your Defence

If your vehicle is stopped at a routine checkpoint and found to be overloaded, it will depend on the severity of the amount the vehicle is overloaded by. Anything less than 5% will be treated as a minor overload, the driver will be cautioned and it maybe that he/she will be allowed to proceed, or he/she will will be requested to have the excess load removed. 
If the overload is serious, the vehicle will have to have the excess load removed and the driver and operator will be prosecuted.

In some instances the overload may only be on an axle, but the gross vehicle weight is not exceeded. In cases like this, the driver will be expected to re-positioon his/her load to comply with the axle weights of the vehicle, although it will likely be noted by the enforcement officer and it's likely that the offence will be included on the operators OCRS (Operator Compliance Risk Score).

There are two statutory defences regarding the overloading of vehicles, which are that it must be shown that:

The vehicle was proceeding to the nearest available weighbridge to be weighed, or was proceeding from the weighbridge to the nearest suitable offloading point, or, 
That the vehicle was loaded to within its legal limits and the weight (either gross, train or individual axle) had increased in transit by no more than 5% and nothing had been added to the vehicle since it was first loaded. 
It must be remembered that overloading convictions can affect the decision of the Traffic Commissioner to suspend, revoke or renew a driver's vocational licence. If an operator and/or his driver is convicted of overloading, details of that conviction must be notified to the Traffic Commissioner or Traffic Area Office within 28 days of the offence being committed.

Overloading convictions may be taken into account by the Traffic Commissioner who may decide to take action against the Licence holder. It should be remembered that when applying for an Operators Licence the authorities must be satisfied that the applicant has made acceptable arrangements to avoid overloading as per the undertakings on the form GV79 when initially applying.

If a vehicle has been overloaded, the driver and operator maybe charged with the offence of using a vehicle in a dangerous condition, as the vehicle would no longer comply with certain parts of the Construction and Use Regulations 1986.

Overloading and the problems created by doing so

Overloading causes problems and likely consequences other than the obvious injury or potential loss of life to the driver, loading/unloading staff, other road users or the general public. The resultant problems caused through overloading any vehicle are:

significantly impair the driver's ability to brake and steer correctly. 
causes excessive wear and damage to roads, bridges, and pavements etc 
undue strain on tyres with the risk of tyre failure 
causes the vehicle to be wholly unstable, especially on corners or at roundabouts 
they are consequently unfair competition for other hauliers 
the vehicle may become uninsured as the act of overloading is illegal 
Overloading is not only a problem for larger goods vehicles, it is equally a problem smaller vehicles, such as vans, cars and passenger carrying vehicles.

The additional problems of overloading will hit the bottom line of all operators, as overloaded vehicles if stopped:

will not be able to continue their journey until the overload problem is rectified 
money and manpower in having the excess load removed

Preventing overloading

Overloading a vehicle, whether a goods vehicle, Passenger Service Vehicle (PSV), or car, is illegal. Preventing your vehicle(s) being overloaded isn't difficult and procedures should be put in place as a policy of best practice. 
Companies need to have a "safety culture" in place which ensures that drivers understand weight legislation and immediately report any concerns that a vehicle is illegally overloaded to their manager. Their manager should investigate all concerns immediately to prevent overloading.

Putting a policy of best practice in place may seem an obvious solution, but it isn't always undertaken. It is all very well considering that your drivers and warehouse staff should know what is safe to load, but for the majority of general hauliers, their drivers will be loading from manufacturers or warehouse distributors etc. 
Problems can occur when loading at customers premises where (through human error) the weight of the consignment note is incorrect. Equally so, it maybe the case that a client (or agent) merely wants the whole consignment to be loaded and doesn't consider the weight implications that may follow. 
Whatever the case, a policy of vigilance must be foremost at all times.

Drivers/Operators of PCV's should also be mindful of the problems of overloading. An example of this could be a Coach operator undertaking excursions to the continent of Europe where the following items could bring about a possible overloading situation:

Skiing Equipment 
Excess and overly heavy luggage 
Excessive amounts of duty free beer or wine on the return journey 
Example of the problem 
VOSA employees, trading standards officers, and police officers carry out random checks at the roadside to enforce overloading regulations. Between April 2002 and March 2003 more than 57,500 vehicles were stopped and weighed by VOSA. The results were as follows:

Vehicle Type Vehicles weighed Vehicles found to be overloaded and prohibited %age of vehicles prohibited 
Heavy Goods Vehicles 50,223 3,770 7.51% 
Passenger Carrying Vehicles 297 16 5.39% 
Light Goods Vehicles 7,006 1,466 20.92%

"

Where it says the vehicle would have started its journey correctly laden, but gained weight during the journey and became overladen I would think would be due to rain or snow?

From http://www.transportsfriend.org/road/loads/over.html

There are further reading links at the bottom of the webpage.


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

Wow! Good job im not overloaded then and I DO have a motorbike on the back.

I think I got lucky with our van as it has a good payload and can easily take a motorbike / scooter on the back. One things for sure when I eventually change it this will be the primary consideration above all else. It has to have enough payload to take a bike or Im not interested and no salesman in the land will convince me of a stated payload until ive driven the prospective van to a weighbridge and weighed it myself before handing over any money.


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## PAT4NEIL (Jul 21, 2007)

Well we have weighed our vehicle when we first got it and we had tons of payload, but it wasnt fully loaded.

We added a tow ball, then a scooter rack, and then a scooter. 

Just before we left to go to Greece this year, fully loaded with too much stuff, I had the great idea of going to the weighbridge to put my mind at rest. 

The result being we were just over weight well 100 kg, we have a large payload, but the scooter and rack etc did add a lot.
We were going later that day and had to have a massive repack. 
Mainly food, lot of tins, some spare motorcycling clothes.
We carry 225 litres of water so we dumped one tank (100 lites, 100kg for the journeys).

At no time were our axles over weight, luckily for us the rear axle has a massive allowance, I think of the top of my head 3200kg, and twin wheels.

The morale of the story is dont keep putting things in for the just in case, try to travel a bit lighter (not something I am good at), and do take it to a weighbridge, just to be sure that youre not too overloaded.

Pat


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## gibb (Dec 25, 2007)

Hi all this is all a bit scary does anybody know what payload i have with a hymer 754 tag thanks
Gibb


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

We carry the same amount of stuff for two weeks as we would for two months. Anything thats not used on three trips gets binned and it kind of works. The van is less cluttered and its amazing how much stuff weighs when you add it up.


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## grizzlyj (Oct 14, 2008)

When we first realised how overweight we were we filtered stuff out on three seperate occasions, and in total got rid of I think 350kg overall (not enough). 

But having got rid of those bits and then carried on travelling (since we were in France at the time slowly heading back) we never realised we needed any of the things we had got rid of. 

Nice yes, needed no.


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## gibb (Dec 25, 2007)

Hi all on the plate on my hymer it as got 3 rows of numbers 

4500 kg
5200 kg
1/1850 kg
2/1500 kg
3/1500 kg
i take it that 1 is the front axle and 2 and 3 will be the rear axles does any one no what the other numbers relate to is it that i have a pay load of 700 kg's hope you can help thanks
Gibb


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## rayc (Jun 3, 2008)

gibb said:


> Hi all on the plate on my hymer it as got 3 rows of numbers
> 
> 4500 kg
> 5200 kg
> ...


4500kg is the MGW and 5200kg is the Maximum Train Weight. The 5200kg has nothing to do with your payload, it is the maximum weight that the vehicle and towed load can be.
The payload is 4500kg minus the unladen weight. The manufacturer should specify the Unladen Weight which is now normally refered to as the Mass In Running Order [MIRO]. This should allow an allowance for the driver, fuel, gas etc. In any event it is unreliable so the best thing is a trip to the weighbridge in running order, including passengers, pets etc.


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## gibb (Dec 25, 2007)

Ok thanks looks like a trip to a weighbridge then its a bit scary when you think of all the add ons 
aircon
towbar 
2/80 watt panels
bike rack + 2 bikes
gas tank sat dish
canopy
just rang a truck firm localy and they have said they would weigh it for free so thats a bonus


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## goldi (Feb 4, 2009)

Afternoon folks,


Hey gibb, let us know how you go on coz we,re a nosey lot.




norm


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## macone48 (Mar 14, 2006)

gibb said:


> Ok thanks looks like a trip to a weighbridge then its a bit scary when you think of all the add ons
> aircon
> towbar
> 2/80 watt panels
> ...


That a very small Train weight, 700Kg above your max all up weight.

You have a towbar, what do you normally tow, anything ??

We are nosey !!

Trev


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## TDG (May 26, 2009)

It's amazing how little understanding there is about motorhome weights and the associated implications  
It seems to me a poor reflection on the activity as a whole but has probably got into this position because the authorities/ legislation concentrate on commercial activities before leisure ones. 
It's good that weight and tyre threads on MHF are raising the profile but I wonder whether manufactures and dealers should be doing a whole lot more :?: 
But then I guess that they would think pointing out that their new £50k van only has a useful payload of 250Kg might not help the sale :roll: 
There again, how many motorhomers realise how easily 250Kg mounts up :?: :roll:


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## gibb (Dec 25, 2007)

Hi all well i took it to be weighed with half a tank of water and half a tank of fuel and all our normal stuff included and it weighed 4120 kg so i should be fine only got clothes and food for the two of us to load then 3 and a half weeks touring round france leaving tonight can't wait :roll:


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## Spacerunner (Mar 18, 2006)

Had my motorhome weighed just two days ago before setting off for touring in UK.
I filled up all gas, water and diesel tanks and had three bags of just purchased shopping on board. All the usual tables, chairs and small driveaway awning.

I knew that I was going to be close or just overweight but the purpose of the excercise was seeing by just how much.

The van (3500)was just 180 kgs over weight so I was reasonably satisfied that with a bit of thought I could easily remain legal in future.

The strange thing was that both axle weights were well within their weights. Front was 1700 out of 1850 and rear was 1950 out of 2000, and the total did not add up to the two axle weights.


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## Noel (May 1, 2005)

[quote..... and the total did not add up to the two axle weights.[/quote]

It's never, ever _supposed_ to! Added together they would put you over your MAM; you have this to give you flexibility in your weight _distribution_ and to reflect the different loading strength of your axles, ie you can load _either_ axle to its maximum but never _both_ to their maximum.


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## Biglol (Jul 16, 2007)

Can I thank everyone for their input on this thread, it has been very interesting reading. I bought my first M/H this year and one of the first things I did was to get "Myrtle" weighed with full tanks etc etc. I was very pleased with the result, but it is peace of mind more than anything. 

It was the first thing I checked when looking at M/H's, how much weight I could add. I was surprised to find many m/h's that had very little spare. 

I'm off now looking for another interesting thread, shouldn't take long knowing this website


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## Noel (May 1, 2005)

Biglol said:


> I'm off now looking for another interesting thread, shouldn't take long knowing this website


Try searching on "A-frames" :!: :wink:


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## Biglol (Jul 16, 2007)

Noel said:


> Biglol said:
> 
> 
> > I'm off now looking for another interesting thread, shouldn't take long knowing this website
> ...


Thanks Noel, "Myrtle" is only small, and I have nothing to tow. (but I could if I wanted too)


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