# Help getting into italy



## r6demon

I have just seen a thread about £250 worth of tolls to get too Italy and I am suddenly getting a bit scared.

You may have seen my honeymoon thread - but the plan is to get into Italy asap so we can spend our 3 weeks touring the north \ mid part.

We planned to drive from Calais straight to Clairvaux-les-lacs for a 2 night stay then drive straight into Italy - Milan - Garda - Venice but I am now worried we are goingto get hammered on the tolls!

I did not fancy driving MILES around to avoid the tolls but do not want to spend hundreds on them.

PLUS I still have no idea on how to get into Italy from France!!

HELP!!!


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## r6demon

Ps dont have any phobia of tunnels etc ...... (yet)

Is it worth missing off the claivaux les lac and making ANOTHER change to our route??

How long does the luxemborg route take??

really starting to think I have bitten off more than I can chew with this trip


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## philjohn

Hi,
If you look at a map of Europe Follow the Toll Free Motorway down through Belgium down to Luxembourg, Head for Basel in Switzerland, pay therir Tax at the Border 40 SF if I remember right their motorways are then free, to Gotthard Tunnel (also free) then I am afraid its pay up time into Italy, but nowhere near £250!!!!

Its a nice run and the scenery down through Switzerland is superb, plenty of Aires on route, enjoy!

PhilJ


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## hmh

Have you checked out viaMichelin?

Put in your route (direct, quickest or whatever) and they will come up with driving time, cost of fuel and total for Tolls. Your £250 seems decidedly over the top but not much of your route is in France so I have no facts. But tunnels can cost dear and we usually go via Col de Larche into Italy to avoid them (but our starting point is a great deal further South than you!).

David.


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## cronkle

r6demon said:


> Ps dont have any phobia of tunnels etc ...... (yet)
> 
> Is it worth missing off the claivaux les lac and making ANOTHER change to our route??
> 
> How long does the luxemborg route take??
> 
> really starting to think I have bitten off more than I can chew with this trip


If it was me trying to get to northern Italy as quickly as possible and avoiding as much toll payment as I could I would be doing the Brussells, Luxembourg, Basle, St Gottard route. The Swiss vignette should be the only 'toll'. Two steady days driving should get you well into Italy.

Hope that helps


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## eddied

*Tolls to Italy*

:roll: well I don't know where they got the €/£250 in tolls from, but I don't think I've ever paid that much even including the Channel crossing!
Of course the 'classic' toll free route is the best in my opinion cost wise - few tolls and cheap fuel fill up in Luxembourg.
Another good toll free way is Reims - Col du Bonhomme or Col du Bussang to hit Switzerland and Gothard at Basel.
Another route I did years ago but have not done lately is Mont Cenis pass via Modane - Lanslebourg on the N6. You could also use the Frejus tunnel on this route.
Getting into Italy from further south e.g. Colle della Maddelena is going to involve a bit more in tolls, but does that matter all that much? You are on honeymoon, push the boat out.
saluti,
eddied


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## Rapide561

*Toll free*

Toll free to Lake Garda is basically....

Calais - Ostend - Brussels - Luxembourg - Metz - Nancy - Colline de Bussang - Basle (Switzerland) - Lucerne - St Gotthard - Chiasso and then into Italy. Tolls from the Swiss/Italian border to Lake Garda are about £14.00. You can avoid this too if you read my route in the Italy forum pages.

Russell


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## r6demon

*All change AGAIN!!*

Hi All,

After looking at the various routes I have decided that it is foolish to go to clairvaux les lacs as its miles out of the way and will cost quite a bit extra on tolls.

I assumed (and you know what they say about that) that down through france would be the quickest way but it seems via michelin et all have a different idea!

Sooo......

The question is (for) now.. if we are going to get a late ferry on sunday (1600 ish as we will then miss the traffic on the monday) we will need somewhere to get our heads down on the other side.

I would imagine that we would want to do a couple of hours driving (2 maybe?) from the ferry and then stop at an Aire or something?

I am not massively fussed on using some of the tolls on this route as it looks to be around 40E so we will just get south asap on the quickest route possible.

thoughts please.

Finally feel as if we have planned something (at last!!!!!!)


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## hmh

*Help getting into Italy*

Just a quickie.

If you can possibly do the French part on a Sunday, there are no lorries on the roads then, they are banned, which makes the toll-free roads in particular much less of a hassle. (Bank Holidays likewise.)

Helen


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## eddied

If you decide on the Luxembourg route, then from Calais an easy drive to an aire just over the border into Belgium at first Belgian motorway exit (Tournai), or good municipal at Mons a bit further along.
saluti,
eddied


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## ned

*route to italy*

Hi guys,

Watching this thread with interest. We are anticipating going to northern Italy at the beginning of September. As a retired chalk manipulator I get a great kick from emailing folks that have just gone back to work with sunny pictures by the pool. I do agree with everyone about the non payment/toll route as we use this to get to GERARDEMER for skiing in JANUARY and I can believe that toll roads through france can get to 250euros, there and back. Keep the info coming as I am still unclear as to a) the actual cost of the vignette and b) as my van is 3850kg will there be a surcharge on top of the vignette for the extra loading.

Keep em waxed............... Ned


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## r6demon

eddied said:


> If you decide on the Luxembourg route, then from Calais an easy drive to an aire just over the border into Belgium at first Belgian motorway exit (Tournai), or good municipal at Mons a bit further along.
> saluti,
> eddied


Using both google maps and via michelin, this is the route it suggests:

Do you say much money or add much time going via lux?


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## eddied

*Quickest route to Italy*

 Ciao, quite honestly it's probably 6 of one and haf a dozen of the other. The route you show will involve some tolls on the A4 if I remember rightly. This Google/Michelin route is a 'not thinking out of the box' one. You can save about 20% on a fuel tank fill up in Luxembourg, and not pay any tolls until you get to the Metz - Strasbourg stretch.
saluti,
eddied


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## Rapide561

*Italy*

The route shown on the mpa on the A26 will cost you some money in tolls. Go via Belgium and Luxembourg. My route via Ostend is "better" than via Lille and Mons as the road surface is better. The route is three miles longer.

Diesel in Luxembourg is 0.78 euro per litre today - thats another incentive.

Free route again - Calais - Dunkerque - Ostend - Brussels - Luxmbourg - Metz. (Free up to there.)

Option 1.....free of charges - Nancy, Charmes, Epinal, Thann, Basle (Swiss border)

Option 2 - Metz, Chateau Salins, Phalsbourg, A4 for one junction (costs 1.10 Euro) to Saverne, then Molsheim, Obernai, Colmar and Basle. The one junction on the motorway is a by pass to the town of Saverne.

Option 3 - Metz, A4 to Strasbourg and then toll free on the N83 and A35 to Colmar and Basle.

From Basle - using a Swiss toll pass - Basle - Lucerne - St Gotthard - Chiasso - Milano etc.

You can go totally toll free as I have done, read these links.

Russell

Toll free Italy to the UK

Uk to Italy

Forgot to say, going via Luxembourg as opposed to via Reims will add about 7 miles and 10 minutes to your journey. If the route via Belgium was an issue, I would not use it. I have been to Italy a total of 82 times, 7 times by motorhome, once by car, once by air and 73 occasions by high speed coach! Even with a coach the Luxembourg route is not a problem.


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## r6demon

I guess I was trying to say that I dont mind paying tolls if it makes the route quicker, but if you are paying tolls and only saving 10 mins then its not worthwhile.

Am off to run the suggested routes through via michelin.will post up the maps (might help someone else in future  ) If you could proof check them that would be great.

Am then off to se IF THEY HAVE FIXED MY MH YET!!!!!!!!£$^£%^"%^£$%!!! just over a week and a half and no MH does not look good!

.......................and breath!!


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## rupert1

If, as you say, you do not mind tolls then the quickest way into northern Italy is via the Mont Blanc tunnel. 580 miles from Calais, autoroute all the way.


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## r6demon

Right, MH is fixed just awaiting delivery on friday!

Lets run these maps!


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## r6demon

first go - calais to milan

10hrs 22 £50 tolls 682 miles -


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## Rapide561

*Tolls*

Hi

Your toll price of £50 is way too low for this route. I estimate about £75 including the Swiss toll pass.

The route is ideal and is easy peasy. The route via Luxembourg is cheaper, gives cheaper fuel and is not complicated at all.

Keep em coming.

Russell


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## r6demon

*Re: Tolls*



Rapide561 said:


> Hi
> 
> Your toll price of £50 is way too low for this route. I estimate about £75 including the Swiss toll pass. Russell


really? that was according to via michelin including the swiss toll?!
next route coming up


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## r6demon

Calais - Dunkerque - Ostend - Brussels - Luxmbourg - Metz. (Free up to there.) 

Option 1.....free of charges - Nancy, Charmes, Epinal, Thann, Basle 

Basle - Lucerne - St Gotthard - Chiasso - Milano

worked out as 697miles 12hr 30min

2 hrs longer so far 'mas o menos'


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## r6demon

The actual map can be seen <here>calais to milan custom route 1


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## r6demon

Option 2 - Metz, Chateau Salins, Phalsbourg, A4 for one junction (costs 1.10 Euro) to Saverne, then Molsheim, Obernai, Colmar and Basle. The one junction on the motorway is a by pass to the town of Saverne.

678 miles 12.30 hrs

the map can be found here: option 2


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## Rapide561

*Mileages*

Hi

Your custom routes are good but ignore the mileages. For example, you PASS BY Brussels, you do not go into it. That is where you are losing time.

The tolls on ViaMichelin - is that for a car?

Motorhome is more expensive than a car at the tolls.

Russell

Your compromise is then...

Calais - Ostend - Brussels - Luxemourg - Metz - Strasbourg (tolls Me-St), Mulhouse and then as per plan to Basle and further.


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## Rapide561

*Routes*

Try the routes again with less options...

Calais to Milan via ARLON and CHATEAU SALINS ETC

Calais to Milan via Arlon and Bussang

Arlon is on the toll free road via Belgium. It is a mile or two from the motorway. Obviously you do not go to Arlon, you pass the motorway exit, thus your actual mileage is less than the map calculator will show.

Russell


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## r6demon

Option 3 - Metz, A4 to Strasbourg and then toll free on the N83 and A35 to Colmar and Basle

I THINK! Not sure on this one!! think I might have gone wrong round brussels

694 miles 10.55

map is here: option 3


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## Rapide561

*Mileage*

Sorry forgot to say...

Select to run via Molsheim and Obernai and that chops 20 miles off! Going via Strasbourg is three sides of a square from the motorway at Saverne. Zoom in on the map - you will see what I mean.

Russell


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## Rapide561

*Route*

Option 3 around the Brussels ring road is perfect.

Russell

You can miss Brussels if you go Calais - Dunkerque - Lille - Tournai - Mons etc etc but you have to travel on the A25 motorway in France - a road surface resembling a camel's back.


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## spence

I will be leaving Lumbres (Northern France) and then down to Lake Garda.

If I head over to Lille I will have the "camel back" to deal with or is there a better route to get over to Luxembourg, metz etc

spence


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## spence

I have had a look on Michelin and via Lens adds 4min and £3.


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## Rapide561

*A25*

The un even road surface on the A25 starts at around junction 9 and contuniues to Lille. It is not very pleasant in a motorhome and has worsened in recent years.

Russell


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## r6demon

is it worth cutting around Metz on the Autoroute on the A4?? I assume that is a toll road? I guess it depends on the traffic??

full route around metz

**edited to add link


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## r6demon

or through Metz

have also edited the bit around strasbourg thank you Russel!

full route through Metz


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## Rapide561

*Route*

Hi

You do not need to go into Metz. By pass it on the A4.

When I use the route Calais - Ostend - Brussels - Luxembourg - Metz - Chateau Salins - Phalsbourg - A4 - Saverne - Molsheim - tc, I do not go into the town centres - these are simply signs as seen from the motorway. It really is that straight forward.

Russell


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## r6demon

By Jove, you dont mean to say........ I have FINALLY sorted the route???????????????

WOO HOOOOO!!!!

Thank you ALL for your help!

I just need to find a rest stop 3 hrs from calais on the route now!!


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## r6demon

eddied said:


> If you decide on the Luxembourg route, then from Calais an easy drive to an aire just over the border into Belgium at first Belgian motorway exit (Tournai), or good municipal at Mons a bit further along.
> saluti,
> eddied


Eddied, just noticed this, but even using the Lux route we would not be going anywhere near here?

I think looking at the rough timings that somewhere south of Brussels might be a good place to stop on the first night?? 
Or is that a bit ambitious?? 
We are catching the 1645 ferry on the sunday night and it would be good to make some progress as the roads will be lightier on a sunday?


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## Grizzly

Italy put up their road tolls on the 1st May but even so £250 seems excessive.

Someone commented earlier that lorries are banned on Sundays and this is what we have always understood. This holiday however ( ended yesterday) we noticed two things: there were still lorries on the road after noon on Saturday and all over Sunday and far more lorries on the national roads in France than usual as, presumably, they are all avoiding the toll roads.

As to en route places to have a rest; fear not. French roads have masses of aires and picnic places and there is seldom a stretch longer than 20km where there is not somewhere interesting or pleasant to stop. ( Note however that wherever you stop there is always somewhere infinitely nicer just round the next bend)

G


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## Rapide561

*Tolls*

Three hours from Calais will see you somewhere between Brussels and Arlon.

Russell


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