# Bespoke pvc conversion?



## coppo (May 27, 2009)

Off tomorrow to look at a converter who will build to our exact spec, want to look around, ask questions, get a feel for the place.

We are looking at an Iveco LWB, high roof, twin rear wheel 3 litre, fully winterised, double floor bespoke conversion. It would be used van obviously.

Double heated floor containing all water pipes, fresh and waste tanks, dump valves.
Rear transverse bed with storage for 2 bikes beneath.

Spray on closed cell foam throughout.
x2 6 volt traction batteries, B2B charger or alternator to battery charger. No solar.

Wall and door to totally isolate cab area for winter camping.

That's the basic theme although I have loads more jotted down, I wonder how feasible this would be?

Any thoughts on the latest technology, ideas, brainwaves etc that could be incorporated.

What's the latest thinking, have I missed any new ideas, must haves or have nots.:grin2:

Sliding door a weak point for draughts?

Was thinking of having as few roof windows as possible, to limit leaks and damage from storms, which we get plenty of, being over 1100 above sea level high up on the moors in Teesdale.

Give me some more to think about please.

The main downside is re-sale value on a conversion such as this, hence the used van idea.

Paul.


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## rowley (May 14, 2005)

I would definitely use solar if I was going to be sometimes without hook up.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Solar and more LB power too Paul.

If I was up to it and had the space I'd be looking at a used 7.5t refrigerated (insulated) box van to convert, I have the plans too, but I dropped it due to lack of space.


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

Paul

Sounds as though you have a good plan. Glad to hear you are moving toward a new MH.

Re B2B/A2B versus Solar, I think it depends on how long one is static. We never stay static for more than 3 days due to time restraints and we have been fine with just B2B for last 5 years. Mybe you had one before, but if not you will be surprised how a 20-30min run will bang in the amps. Even if static a few mins. running the engine will keep you going for a day or two.

Please tell us the result of the visit to the converter. Good luck.

Geoff


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Paul,

Might be a bit small for you but you used to be able to buy old grp cabins from BT, would make an easy ish conversion on a rwd chassis cab, not neccesarily a Transit....

http://forums.motorhomefacts.com/287921-post.html#349347

http://forums.motorhomefacts.com/19-introductions/33536-british-telecom-van-converted-motorhome.html

Pete


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## Lesleykh (Apr 13, 2009)

Sounds interesting. We have a Devon PVC and our weak areas in winter are definitely those pipes under the van, but outside. We did a year in ours and colder weather got us from Poland down to southern Greece, but snow only really in the north of Greece, so we didn't do too bad. Rob has lived away from home in it through a couple of winters and has to keep 10L of water inside the van in case of frozen pipes, but the he has always cycled to work and showered there.

In retrospect we should have sorted ours out so that we had a refillable gas system and we should have had solar panels. 

We have a transverse bed, but it's only OK if you're under 6ft. We couldn't fit a bike under ours.

That big sliding door is always going to be a problem. I have seen vans where another door has been fitted into it, but we just open and close ours quickly. It's never really been a big problem to be honest. Rain getting in is worse than the cold. In fact, the main problem it causes me is that it potentially lets in lots of bugs in the summer, so I made a big net curtain to go across it, which velcros on above the door and has ties at the sides where there's plastic panels.

I wouldn't want to lose our cab area as we travel with 2 big dogs and need that space. When Rob uses the van on his own in the UK (often works away on contracts) I made him a heavy velvet curtain which velcros right across on our ceiling and goes down to the floor. He says this makes a big difference for him, and keeps the heat in from the oil filled electric radiator.

Do update up, with pictures, once it all gets going.

Lesley


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

There was a chap on Ebay until about a year ago selling full rear panels for the Ducato vans, he later put the whole kit up for sale, dunno what happened after that I've searched a few times for other doing a build but never found it/him/them.


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## coppo (May 27, 2009)

I have just got back, thanks for the suggestions everyone.

Re, solar, we have had a B2B and managed great.

Kev, more battery power? with x2 6 volt traction batteries, they are wonderful. We had 2 Rolls Surrette 6 volts and transferred them over to the next motorhome, they were that good.

Pete, thanks for the link I will have a look.

Rowley, still not convinced about solar for our usage.

Geoff, agree with you after having a B2B.

Lesley, I know about pipes underneath, we have had to use a hair dryer in the past, its a bugger isn't it, vowed never again to get something not fully winterised.

The issue is firstly that he gave me a quote for the conversion cost(after I gave him exactly what we were after spec wise) about 13 months ago before the house extension got in the way. This has now gone up by £8000, he says its the exchange rate. All the equipment is uk sourced I know for fact, so that's rubbish and was a big disappointment.

He also said for me to try and find a Mercedes Vario van as he rates them as the best. Another issue was that he is fully booked now until the winter so it would be next year before it was ready.

It would be far cheaper to just buy a used A class, such as Hymer or Arto, but we would have a quality conversion exactly what we want.

Still dithering on what to do now after being so keen on arrival. They build you exactly what you want, but by lord you get charged for it.

Caroline says, basically, what we want we can't afford. Same position as millions of others then.

Paul.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Surely the B2B is to take charge out of the LB for the VB, the LBs receiving a charge elsewhere, and if the other way round i'd not want to risk a flat VB, so I'm a bit confused, and I get the 2 x 6v, for a given ah, they are better but like the yanks say, there is no substitute for cubes, I'd have solar of at least 100w and 300plus ah for wild camping, which is what we do, unless of course you only use the lights, in which case 85ah would be adequate.


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## coppo (May 27, 2009)

No Kev, the B2B bangs loads in the LB,s but ensures the VB is also taken care of.

Paul.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

coppo said:


> No Kev, the B2B bangs loads in the LB,s but ensures the VB is also taken care of.
> 
> Paul.


Where does it draw it from then Paul, I'm a bit confused.


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## coppo (May 27, 2009)

From the alternator Kev.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

coppo said:


> From the alternator Kev.


 So you run the engine to charge up the batteries, Hmm, seems an expensive and not very environmentally good solution, okay if you drive a lot, but we sometimes stop for a few days and with the radio, TV and PVR & heater etc, I'd be flat, even with 375ah of LB to go at, I've fitted solar to every van so far, with a MPPT controller (PWM on the first one) always good to go.


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## coppo (May 27, 2009)

Yes you have to run the engine but it bangs loads in, in winter its great after a shortish drive, as solar is next to useless in winter, even with mppt. You always arrive with full batteries at your next stop, as opposed to the useless split charge system they all fit as standard.

No messing with the roof so no chance of having one badly fitted, trunking all over the roof.

Someone fitted one for us many years ago and they stuck the whole lot direct to the roof with sikaflex and no air gap whatsoever.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

coppo said:


> Yes you have to run the engine but it bangs loads in, in winter its great after a shortish drive, as solar is next to useless in winter, even with mppt. You always arrive with full batteries at your next stop, as opposed to the useless split charge system they all fit as standard.
> 
> No messing with the roof so no chance of having one badly fitted, trunking all over the roof.
> 
> Someone fitted one for us many years ago and they stuck the whole lot direct to the roof with sikaflex and no air gap whatsoever.


You could always get that BarryD to fit it for you, I think he did his own on Hank.


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## barryd (May 9, 2008)

I have not read your thread Paul but a complete idiot short person with a pointy hat and a big white beard who used to be a member on here and his user name is the same as a big airplane told me to tell you to look up Derwent Leisure Services. I have googled this and it brings up nothing. I suggest you ignore this post or join Motorhome Fruitcakes, seek out this "Gnome" Type character and give him a good kicking.


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## coppo (May 27, 2009)

barryd said:


> I have not read your thread Paul but a complete idiot short person with a pointy hat and a big white beard who used to be a member on here and his user name is the same as a big airplane told me to tell you to look up Derwent Leisure Services. I have googled this and it brings up nothing. I suggest you ignore this post or join Motorhome Fruitcakes, seek out this "Gnome" Type character and give him a good kicking.


That would be 747 then Barry:wink2:

I have been to Derwent Leisure about 18 months ago, they do nothing different to the hundreds of other pvc converters around, usual run of the mill stuff, poor insulation, not winterised, I wasn't impressed really. 747 told me about them at the time whilst he still a member here. They are right next to the Elddis factory in Consett.

Its a shame 747 left, can you persuade him to come back?

Paul.


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

coppo said:


> No Kev, the B2B bangs loads in the LB,s but ensures the VB is also taken care of.
> 
> Paul.


Paul is right. It is a bit confusing to call it battery-battery, as the charging source is the Alternator, which ensures the VB is back up to charge before banging in much more to the LB than would be achieved when the high charge of the LB would cause the regulator to reduce the alternator output. Sterling now call later ones an Alternator-Battery, which Paul wrote as an alternative abbreviation in his OP.

There is no discharge from one battery to another.

Geoff


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## listerdiesel (Aug 3, 2012)

coppo said:


> Yes you have to run the engine but it bangs loads in, in winter its great after a shortish drive, as solar is next to useless in winter, even with mppt. You always arrive with full batteries at your next stop, as opposed to the useless split charge system they all fit as standard.
> 
> No messing with the roof so no chance of having one badly fitted, trunking all over the roof.
> 
> Someone fitted one for us many years ago and they stuck the whole lot direct to the roof with sikaflex and no air gap whatsoever.


It's like the famed 'Curate's Egg', good in parts.

"You always arrive with full batteries at your next stop" - assuming that what you have taken out of the battery is replaced by the alternator. There's no hard and fast guarantee of that, unless you are moving daily and having a reasonable drive distance before your next stop. If you need to stop for days at a time, it may not work out.

"No messing with the roof so no chance of having one badly fitted, trunking all over the roof."

Surely that's up to you to control? An Iveco LWB hi-roof will have nearly as much rood area as our Vario, and we managed to make a tidy job of it. This is the trailer roof, the Mercedes is almost identical but I haven't got a shot of the finished and cabled assembly:



















Solar still gives some output in winter, our son's 200W installation was putting 2.5A in the other morning, Not a huge amount but over a day it more than made up for the previous night's usage.

We have two installations working, plus our son's, and we are building another trailer which will have the same installation as the others.

It may not be to everyone's choice, but I find solar to be more reliable, certainly going by the regular postings about failed B2B systems I see.

Peter


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

nicholsong said:


> Paul is right. It is a bit confusing to call it battery-battery, as the charging source is the Alternator, which ensures the VB is back up to charge before banging in much more to the LB than would be achieved when the high charge of the LB would cause the regulator to reduce the alternator output. Sterling now call later ones an Alternator-Battery, which Paul wrote as an alternative abbreviation in his OP.
> 
> There is no discharge from one battery to another.
> 
> Geoff


Ah, I see the light, I think I had one in the Bessie we had last year, but with not fitting one myself or looking into it, I was unsure, the name as you say confuses it a bit, I suppose my using the Clive Mott link method sort of does the same thing but for 50p though.


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

Kev_n_Liz said:


> Ah, I see the light, I think I had one in the Bessie we had last year, but with not fitting one myself or looking into it, I was unsure, the name as you say confuses it a bit, I suppose my using the Clive Mott link method sort of does the same thing but for 50p though.


Kev

Clive Mott's method only connects the two sets of batteries so that whatever is charging one can cross-charge the other, with the ability to separate them when not needed by removing the fuse. His method is useful if either the MH charger on EHU does not charge the VB and/or one wants to charge the VB using the solar. More sophisticated chargers can do both of those things.

It does not give increased alternator output as a B2B/A2B does, by utilising sensors which feed signals back to the controller, which then demands a higher output from the alternator. It also incorporates temperature sensors to avoid overcooking the batteries. There is a very good description on Sterling's website.

Geoff

Geoff


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

It is less than perfect, but I'm not using it other than to maintain the VB at home, I don't think we've had a van where it receives a charge from EHU, so either it gets a top up from the solar panel or the mains, I usually fit an LED switch in line so I get a reminder that it's connected and remove the fuse before it blows, not had a van long enough since the self build to bother though.


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## nicholsong (May 26, 2009)

Kev_n_Liz said:


> It is less than perfect, but I'm not using it other than to maintain the VB at home, I don't think we've had a van where it receives a charge from EHU, so either it gets a top up from the solar panel or the mains, I usually fit an LED switch in line so I get a reminder that it's connected and remove the fuse before it blows, not had a van long enough since the self build to bother though.


Our MH is on EHU at home and the Schaudt charger charges both LB and VB - it shows on the voltmeters, so I am not imagining it.:wink2:


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Sorry, I must have confused you Geoff, I'm talking about my vans, your "posh"  one and probably other "posh" ones will do these tricks, and maybe even mine in the past, I'm just not aware of it so made my own arrangements for VB top ups.

Ah me confused it seems, just re-read your last, :roll: going senile again.


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## peejay (May 10, 2005)

Our van battery and leisure batteries are both charged when on mains hook up but the solars only charge the leisure batteries when off grid.

I have a Vanbitz Battery Master fitted which diverts power from the LB's to the VB when it detects the VB is getting low (drain from alarm etc).

A fit and forget item and works well for us (as long as the solars are putting power in).

http://www.vanbitz.com/product/battery-master/

We used to have a B2B which worked well but it was removed a while back (A long story and nothing to do with the efficiency of the B2B which I shan't bore you with here :smile: )

Pete


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## Jezport (Jun 19, 2008)

I very nearly did as you are proposing, but in the end went for a globecar campscout revolution.

Reasons I didnt do what you propose.

Poor resale value
Impossible to find a good LWB Extra high Iveco Used with aircon, central remote locking etc
Time involved, as I needed to sell my van to get cash to buy new one
The actual cost when you work it all out and take into consideration the extra devaluation.
No cab blinds available for Iveco.

Then I found the globecar campscout revolution which is the LWB Extra High Top at a good price with all the spec I wanted plus more at the right price, right time brsnd new and in my favorite colour/


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Jezport said:


> I very nearly did as you are proposing, but in the end went for a globecar campscout revolution.
> 
> Reasons I didnt do what you propose.
> 
> ...


Do you still have your Cougar?


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## Jezport (Jun 19, 2008)

No, it was getting old and the poor MPG made it expensive as an everyday driver. Still miss it though.


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

What you got now then?


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## Jezport (Jun 19, 2008)

2.2diesel Jag X Type


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## Pudsey_Bear (Sep 25, 2008)

Good choice, didn't Clarkson give them a really good review too.


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## Jezport (Jun 19, 2008)

I bought it because I always liked the look of the XJ but didnt want a car as big. The X type has the classic Jaguar look and with the Mondeo / Transit 2.2 engine tweaked by Jaguar it is nippy and if Im carefull I can see over 50 MPG on the motorway. Its the manual non DPF so gets better fuel economy, and 10 extra BHP. I bought an auto DPF jag after the cougar but the DPF started playing up after a few weeks, so I got the dealer to take it back, Its a shame as I love autos. They dont do the auto in a non DPF. I dont change cars often, had the Cougar 12 years, and the Jag 4 years already.


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